This was an outstanding video, which documented that HSTs are excellent defensive ammunition. While your results weren’t really surprising, HR, I greatly appreciate the thorough, accurate and entirely logical foundations for your conclusions. I also remember Paul Harrell’s (may he rest in peace) repeated admonisions against “hyper ammunition.” He found that inexpensive JHPs were often nearly as effective. With that said, my carry loads are all “hypers.”
40S&W has made a significant come back, as it's been getting a lot of good press in 2A world when comparing to 9mm, specifically in 1-shot-stop power. Lots of people have switched their EDC to .40 for this reason. Great test. I think your conversion calculations are pretty accurate. Still, for fun and your fans, denim in front and MDF between jugs 1 and 2 would be awesome to see. Remember, it would still be consistent -- as long as you do it for every test.
I really don't see it as a "comeback" as much as a round that has always performed. People always to seem to enjoy what is "fashionable", sexy, "flavor of the day" rather then what is tried and proven.
I'm VERY happy I was able to help out, I hope everyone appreciates the video. I look forward to helping in the future too. In celebration of the video I will be carrying the 40 S&W HST in my M&P40C. Tobias was very happy to hear his and mine's names mentioned in the video and I'm sure we will watch this a few times.
Excellent review of the Federal HST. Both my Kimber TLE II's in .45acp are my EDC's and have been for years with HST 230 grain JHP. I have never had any issues with this round in my 1911 and I train regularly with them. When I do my part, this ammo has been very accurate and reliable. Both my Kimber TLE II's have over 2000 rounds through them and never a hiccup. Living in the non-freedom state of CT with a 10 round magazine limit, I feel the 8+1 of the HST 230 grain has me adequately protected.
Water is a great forecaster of how a bullet will expand, for example if first jug has a blow out and not just a hole, it means that round will expand, so the trauma on first 2 jugs tells you a lot about its ability to expand, I agree with keeping your method because it contributes to the simplest way possible to know if a round has expansion capability, as brassfetcher showed in his gel tests and high speed cameras that the first 4 inches matter for most bullets since if they don't open up in first 4 inches of gel they won't open at all, so if no trauma to first jug it means it probably won't expand much in gel either and that's why water can save you the gel test if that first jug doesn't get clobbered then bullet won't do it to gel much either
With all due respect to folks who test products and then present their results, I have my own validation regarding HST. First off, I'm career LEO. Most of it patrol, some of it OIS investigator. Seen a man dropped from one hit from a 40s&w 180gr HST. The bullet entered his left side, passed through his left lung, then through his heart, then through his right lung, exited through his back...and was caught in his flannel shirt. Fully expanded. We always have a choice of Gold Dot or HST. After that day, HST and only HST for me. All the testing I'll ever need
Thank you. I think your confidence in the HST is justified. I think, however, your example is more closely related to my point about shot placement as stated near the end of the video. If the bullet used in your incident had been a plain old FMJ, and it had taken the exact same path through heart and lungs, do you think the results would have been any different?
Thank You for all the hard work and time required for putting out these videos. VERY well done! I carry Underwood and Fed HST's in all my carry pistols. In addition, I like your Remington Nylon 66 in the background. I had one just like it as a young man and fully regret selling it. One of the first 'plasic' firearms on the market-and a good one at that!
Thanks for another great video! I use Federal HST in my 9mm, .380 ACP, and .45 ACP carry handguns. I use Buffalo Bore .38 Special +P 158gr. Lead SWC-HP in my .38 Special and .357 Magnum carry revolvers. I have been very pleased with my own testing with all of them.
The Federal HST 147 grain HP is the duty ammo for my former department. All of us retirees got a box of 50 following LEOSA quals this past July. Thx for another informative video Howard.
Excellent! Very well done as always. I carry a full size M&P40 2.0 and at times I carry the 1.0 M&P40c also. I am very pleased with both. I have carried Hornady Critical Defense in the past and last year I rotated out to 165 Gold Dot. This next year I am rotating out to the 165 HST. Many thanks.
Hi HR, very informative video as always... just have an off-subject comment, I see you have maintained your weight loss for quite a long time, would love to see a follow up video of what you have been eating recently to maintain the loss. Great job!
Thanks for the video. I carry 124 grn Gold Dot +P in my 3.7 inch Tristar C100 (CZ 75 compact clone) but i have a box of 124 grn HST +P for when I swap the Gold Dot out. (Always have been a Gold Dot fan) From what I have seen in all videos, the HST does do a bit better than the Gold Dot. Not that it would make me get rid of the GDs. But i am glad I have the HST when I decide to swap out.
I have been following this from the start and have tried it out at my range. Thankyou. The only change I have found was at diferant weather and water temps I also used Very hot water and there was a large change in the results, Just wanted to let you know. I love the math it took to get to this point. Tim From Canada.
Good test HR! Federal HST ammunition is what I carry every day, but with 230gr in 45 ACP. And in 10% ballistic gelatin they get an average of .78" expansion. Edit: I didn't know that you have a website Howard, I will email you ASAP!
Outstanding video HR! Ammo tests are the "bomb!"😅 Yes they can be "subjective" but you always make it as fair as practical for the average enthusiast! Thank you!!
They open up like flowers. The media put a certain negative stigma on hollow point bullets. This is good carry ammo as it reduces penetration and collateral damage so not to just pass through objects and intended targets. Thanks for another educational video.
124 gr Hst is my preferred carry round in the standard and +P version depending on what gun I’m carrying! My second choice would be Speer Gold dot! Great video!
I'm glad to see the 9mm tests . I only wish you'd done the .45ACP also . I see you have the Gen 1 S&W M&P ,looks like the stock trigger . I have the Gen 1 M&P 9c but my trigger was horrible so I replaced it with an Apex Tactical trigger and the difference was amazing .
Wilson Combat did a great deal of experimental work to validate water as a test medium as well. They needed to test thousands of rounds quickly and that much gell simply wasn't an option.
For those interested for clothing my Modern Meat Target Tests -.38 premium vs budget 2" & 3" Tomorrow morning, & coming Water Jug Tests all use "4 Layer LIGHT CLOTHING". Short Barrels, or Old School or Budget jhps clothing can definitely effect if there is any expansion so it will be nice for you viewers to be able to cross reference HrFunk, Dick Fairburn, and my testing as well as Gun Sam's Early tests. I talk with two of the foremost actual Terminal Ballistics Subject Matter Experts regularly. Now companies and RUclipsrs love to measure expansion at the extreme greatest but it really is supposed to be MIN & MAX averaged near the frontal diameter as in not at bottom of Ranger Talons etc. because of fluid tissue dynamics. FYI my main carries are 124+p HST warmer days or Gold Dots when working, and 180 HST Cold Winter Days so that should tell you something w .40 punch or .38 Hydrashok Deep in backup Snubs.
My son told me to get HSTs when I bought my first gun and I got a lot of them 124+p because I didn't find anything but +p. Btw I love watching ammo testing.
I've seen 9mm HST tested by a number of different channels, and it has always shown very good performance As a bonus, one of my local gun shops has the 50-round LEO labeled boxes of 9 mm HST for a very competitive price 😁 It's just too bad there 38 Special HST (no longer in production) wound up not performing very well, although their recently introduced to 357 load seems to
My Last post was NOT in anyway to anger you But just something I tried out to see if in fact body temp would show a diferant result. Love always your videos Please keep them coming. Tim From Canada.
I like your ammunition testing videos. I would also be interested to know what ammunition your department uses right now. Being from Western North Carolina I know our department uses Gold Dot 9mm. I would like to know what a department uses in Ohio. Please don’t listen to the people telling you to get a 3” barrel handgun and gel blocks with “4 layers of denim”. If they want to see that they can go to the other 900 channels that do that every week and watch it. I want to see your test.
What would be nice to know is how the point of impact differs between expensive HST ammo and cheap training ammo. If folks have to practice with hyper expensive ammo to know where it is going to hit, HST ammo loses its appeal, especially if it causes people to practice less. As an aside, one of the great things about .45 ACP is that the same ammo you train with is guaranteed to put a 45 caliber hole in whomever needs putting a hole into.
Agreed. Fortunately at typical handgun distances, there’s not much difference in defensive accuracy from one load to the next. For bullseye shooting, some loads will print differently than others, but at 2-7 yards on a human body, they’re all going to be pretty close to the same.
Hey H, great job on the Federal HST comparison. Have you ever thought about taking a bore sight laser putting it in the chamber and then zeroing a laser sight to the bore laser. Then target shooting with just the laser sight by pointing rather than sighting down the slide.
Just my own opinion of course, but the 9mm Federal HST 124 grain standard velocity bullet is the best their is when it comes to self defense in 9mm. Not only do I feel it is the best performer (especially in 3" barrels) it beats the high velocity version. The HV version expands slightly more but has less penetration because it expands faster. Still a great SD round, but the SV is better. I have put the HST SV 124 gr, bullet up against every popular round out there including the Speer GD and it has always come out #1.
After all the testing I've done, I am of the belief that there is very little difference in performance when it comes to premium ammunition lines from the major manufacturers. I believe the HST is about the best line of defensive ammo on the market, but other brands are not very far behind.
I don't care what anybody says, Federal HST is King universally with all self defense calibers. It is consistently the most reliable performing round pretty much no matter how you match each variant of the HST with all barrel lengths. Even putting a heavy 147 grain through a 3 inch barrel handgun you will still get some expansion everytime and it will never fail, and never have to worry about lethal over penetration. The perfect self defense round 👍
For those that asked for some kind of barrier material, I think their reasoning is that certain HP ammo plugs and fails to open not that it would change results per se. Like “bullet A plugs with denim and bullet B does not.”
@@hrfunk I am going to test my loads again. The ones I sent pictures of, with maybe a layer of leather or some other jacket material over the first jug. Then, I’ll know exactly how my loads should work given a bad guy wears similar material! Lol I’ll let you know personally how that goes.
HR, is that a Nylon 66 I see on the wall behind you? I've got a black one that I've had for about fifty years. It's a great rifle. Light and accurate. Still works good and is accurate, after all these years. Good video on the HST ammo.
Hello HR. I was surprised that the expansion of both calibers was pretty much equal. I expected the larger 40 caliber to to end up wider than the 9 mm. I saw that Charter Arms has come out with a new Coyote model, a low recoil revolver in 380. The 380 is considered marginal for self defense ( Dick Fairburn ) I wonder if there is a loss of performance with a ported barrel and cylinder gap. If someone " happened" to have a PPK laying around it with would make an interesting video.
The reason why Law enforcement did not latch onto hst like they did gold dot, is because law enforcement criteria was based on penetrating auto body, windshield/glass/Barriers, etc speer gold dots were designed as bonded bullets, federal hst were not originally, they were designed for terminal performance in human targets, with a civilian application in mind. the gold dot predates the hst, and created under different criteria, all this dated back to FBI wound ballistic trials after 1986 miami dade shootout, penetration was the issue for them at that time. gold dot followed FBI standards protocol, hst was more of civilian self defense round in theory, and is the reason why the law enforcement market moved to speer gold dots, the latest rendition of hst is now basically a bonded bullet, but it's to late for them to catch up to gold dots now, for civilian Self Defensive market i think the hst is a better bullet, one that law enforcement should Reconsider!
H thanks for the link. I am more interested in zeroing the laser sight with a bore laser at 15 yards and then checking if it is dead zero accurate after firing.
Interesting Federal downloaded the 165gr HST over the years. I was issued this ammo in the mid 2000s and it was loaded to 1150fps…and often clocked at or above that. The reduced velocity is more in line with the original .40 FBI load…🤔
How is the 165gr getting under 1100fps in a 5-inch pistol? Doesn’t make sense. The rated velocity on Federal’s website is 1130fps. I would think that it would be far more than that in the longer barrel, but what do I know? 🤷
@ yes, later Speer would create a medium velocity 165gr GD at 1050fps for FBI. I don’t believe the 147gr +p 9mm HST is available any more…so it wouldnt surprise me if the 165gr HST was toned down a bit…the original was snappy, and as can be seen..u really cant tell the difference. 147gr 9mm was also redesigned with a double cannelure and reduced overall expansion diameter for better penetration based on real world use.
Thanks HR. Another thoughtful test and evaluation. Have you tested any 5.7 x 28 pistols or ammunition? I just purchased a Tisas 5.7 non optics ready very very cheaply.
My question Officer funk would you TRUST the HST and your Masada Tatical for Home Defense. If yes do you think 147 grain ir better than 124? Thank you so much.
How are you Mr.funk? I’m in need of some advice if you could provide it? I shoot and carry a g19 and when I shoot my thumbs are so tight against the slide, it stops the slide from locking back on the last round. I’ve tried adjust my grip and my accuracy has plummeted. How much pressure should I put on the slide using my support hand, and should I shoot how I’m most comfortable or something different? Thanks for your time
I think the best advice I can give you is to keep working on modifying your grip. If you can find an index point on the frame for your support hand thumb (maybe the take-down latch). Work on keeping your support thumb there and your shooting hand right on top of it, but not touching the slide. The "Thumbs-forward" grip has its advantages, but it also has some drawbacks, as your experience bears out,
It's a shame Federal discontinued it's 38 special HST 138 grain plus p.. it had the appearance of a wad cutter hollow point deep down inside the case. From what I understand it was not accurate out of certain 38 special handguns so they discontinued it
Your videos are usually good, the video quality here is no exception. But have got to come up to modern standards. Get some gel blocks with 4 layers of denim and borrow a 9mm with a 3" barrel.
Would you be interested in testing Magtechs affordable 9mm Luger+P+ 115GR JHP..Rated velocity of 1330 out of a 4" barrel.. You'd be the first on RUclips..
Boy you're way late to the party, Federal HST has been considered the gold standard for awhile now! I carry the 124gr. load in 9mm and the 165gr. in 40 S&W.
Just to clarify, I originally tested the HST for my department about 15 years ago. At the time I was thoroughly impressed with its performance. I retested it in this video because one of my viewers was kind enough to donate the ammo. I was not surprised by the results.
If this bullet does not open in water never use it, if you're not shooting through at least Jean then it's just for entertainment, all bullets are not the same and hardly open in real scenarios especially the heavy for caliber grain weights. 45 ACP is the worst the 185 will open like a parachute but not go deep enough in the heavies won't they should usually be $200 to $210 grains HST hydroshock deeps, Gold Dot 200 grain short barrel they work so if you need information on semi autos, apparently I'm just a keyboard warrior and I could probably have more accurate analysis . And I'm not a sniper good shooter but I'm a good nerd . HST will even open in a 147 thereby fire HST the most reliable brand across all calibers. But in 45 no-go If it opens it goes like 7 in gel.
This was an outstanding video, which documented that HSTs are excellent defensive ammunition. While your results weren’t really surprising, HR, I greatly appreciate the thorough, accurate and entirely logical foundations for your conclusions. I also remember Paul Harrell’s (may he rest in peace) repeated admonisions against “hyper ammunition.” He found that inexpensive JHPs were often nearly as effective. With that said, my carry loads are all “hypers.”
"He found that inexpensive JHPs were often nearly as effective. "
True...the biggest difference is consistency.
40S&W has made a significant come back, as it's been getting a lot of good press in 2A world when comparing to 9mm, specifically in 1-shot-stop power. Lots of people have switched their EDC to .40 for this reason.
Great test. I think your conversion calculations are pretty accurate. Still, for fun and your fans, denim in front and MDF between jugs 1 and 2 would be awesome to see. Remember, it would still be consistent -- as long as you do it for every test.
I really don't see it as a "comeback" as much as a round that has always performed. People always to seem to enjoy what is "fashionable", sexy, "flavor of the day" rather then what is tried and proven.
I'm VERY happy I was able to help out, I hope everyone appreciates the video. I look forward to helping in the future too.
In celebration of the video I will be carrying the 40 S&W HST in my M&P40C.
Tobias was very happy to hear his and mine's names mentioned in the video and I'm sure we will watch this a few times.
I'm so glad. Thanks again!
Thanks for your donation this vid was important to further validating this method to Federal's official organic gel data.
I would also like to say thank you for your help. I enjoy these presentations emencely and this one wouldn't have happened without your help...
Its awesome when a little kid gets a smile on their faces!!
It doesn't take much to get it done, yet to them, it's the whole world!
You don't even need to ask that question, HST is the king 👑 😁. Looking forward to the video!!
Excellent review of the Federal HST. Both my Kimber TLE II's in .45acp are my EDC's and have been for years with HST 230 grain JHP. I have never had any issues with this round in my 1911 and I train regularly with them. When I do my part, this ammo has been very accurate and reliable. Both my Kimber TLE II's have over 2000 rounds through them and never a hiccup. Living in the non-freedom state of CT with a 10 round magazine limit, I feel the 8+1 of the HST 230 grain has me adequately protected.
Great video Mr. Funk. HST is nearly the only thing I carry. BTW, Happy Birthday tomorrow. Semper Fi brother!
You are dedicated to your viewers without a doubt! No one else does that! Great job on calling out your viewers and all you have done
Water is a great forecaster of how a bullet will expand, for example if first jug has a blow out and not just a hole, it means that round will expand, so the trauma on first 2 jugs tells you a lot about its ability to expand, I agree with keeping your method because it contributes to the simplest way possible to know if a round has expansion capability, as brassfetcher showed in his gel tests and high speed cameras that the first 4 inches matter for most bullets since if they don't open up in first 4 inches of gel they won't open at all, so if no trauma to first jug it means it probably won't expand much in gel either and that's why water can save you the gel test if that first jug doesn't get clobbered then bullet won't do it to gel much either
We are so much smarter and aware because of youtube and content creators like HRFUNK
Thank you Frank.
And thanks HR for the ammunition reviews.
The 45acp HST will expand to over 0.8 inches. That is a larger diameter than an unexpanded 12 guage slug, which is 0.72 inches.
Thank you lan. Happy Birthday to Tobias.
Thank you Ian and Tobias. And thank you Mr. Funk for another great video!
With all due respect to folks who test products and then present their results, I have my own validation regarding HST.
First off, I'm career LEO.
Most of it patrol, some of it OIS investigator.
Seen a man dropped from one hit from a 40s&w 180gr HST.
The bullet entered his left side, passed through his left lung, then through his heart, then through his right lung, exited through his back...and was caught in his flannel shirt. Fully expanded.
We always have a choice of Gold Dot or HST. After that day, HST and only HST for me.
All the testing I'll ever need
Thank you. I think your confidence in the HST is justified. I think, however, your example is more closely related to my point about shot placement as stated near the end of the video. If the bullet used in your incident had been a plain old FMJ, and it had taken the exact same path through heart and lungs, do you think the results would have been any different?
This was a very well done video, thanks for your work.
My pleasure.
I too am waiting to see his review. I am callsign Coyote 43 and I carry Federal HST 147 gr.
Never had a doubt. I've been carrying them for years in 9mm in both 124gr and 147gr, and in 45acp in 230gr. Great video, as always!
Thank you!
Thank You, Sir... NE Ohioan Buckeye here, just joined. Very Informative channel.. learning all the time and looking forward to more of your reviews.
Thanks for joining and welcome aboard!
Thank You for all the hard work and time required for putting out these videos. VERY well done! I carry Underwood and Fed HST's in all my carry pistols. In addition, I like your Remington Nylon 66 in the background. I had one just like it as a young man and fully regret selling it. One of the first 'plasic' firearms on the market-and a good one at that!
Thanks! That Nylon 66 actually belongs to my wife. It will probably disappear from my wall the moment she notices it’s missing. Thanks for watching!
I learned how to shoot with a Nylon 66...😂
SEMPER FI MY BROTHER. HAPPY 249TH BIRTHDAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Excellent video. Thank you for taking the time to make it.
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for another great video!
I use Federal HST in my 9mm, .380 ACP, and .45 ACP carry handguns. I use Buffalo Bore .38 Special +P 158gr. Lead SWC-HP in my .38 Special and .357 Magnum carry revolvers.
I have been very pleased with my own testing with all of them.
Another great review and demonstration by HR. See you on Monday have a great day.
The Federal HST 147 grain HP is the duty ammo for my former department. All of us retirees got a box of 50 following LEOSA quals this past July. Thx for another informative video Howard.
My pleasure. Thanks for watching!
Exactly why my duty load is the 124gr HST. Well done sir!!
Thank you!
@@dejuan1981 mine too
@@hrfunktry out the Sig V Crown 124gr. It's a cheaper option but the results may surprise you
I tested it in my last video. Here’s a link: ruclips.net/video/ihtyrCMsQ-w/видео.htmlsi=1D8bQM-LvjxDz_wl
@hrfunk i apologize for my outburst 😅
Your videos are always good. And give good information. Thank you for all you do.
My pleasure Tim. Thanks for watching!
Excellent! Very well done as always. I carry a full size M&P40 2.0 and at times I carry the 1.0 M&P40c also. I am very pleased with both. I have carried Hornady Critical Defense in the past and last year I rotated out to 165 Gold Dot. This next year I am rotating out to the 165 HST. Many thanks.
I like how you are doing these test. Great video!
Thank you!
Hi HR, very informative video as always... just have an off-subject comment, I see you have maintained your weight loss for quite a long time, would love to see a follow up video of what you have been eating recently to maintain the loss. Great job!
Thanks. I'll consider that, but it always feel kind of awkward discussing that topic.
Thanks for the video.
I carry 124 grn Gold Dot +P in my 3.7 inch Tristar C100 (CZ 75 compact clone) but i have a box of 124 grn HST +P for when I swap the Gold Dot out. (Always have been a Gold Dot fan)
From what I have seen in all videos, the HST does do a bit better than the Gold Dot. Not that it would make me get rid of the GDs. But i am glad I have the HST when I decide to swap out.
Yes, thank you Ian and thank you Mr. Funk for an excellent video
I have been following this from the start and have tried it out at my range. Thankyou. The only change I have found was at diferant weather and water temps I also used Very hot water and there was a large change in the results, Just wanted to let you know. I love the math it took to get to this point. Tim From Canada.
Good test HR!
Federal HST ammunition is what I carry every day, but with 230gr in 45 ACP.
And in 10% ballistic gelatin they get an average of .78" expansion.
Edit: I didn't know that you have a website Howard, I will email you ASAP!
Thanks! I saw the email when I woke up this morning. I’ll respond soon.
The results surprised me. Much closer in performance. Excellent video!
That S&W .40 Compact was a nice looking gun with the trim lines and two tone earth colors. I'm a sucker for simple and too the point.
Thanks Greg!
Happy birthday HR! Another great video. Thanks for all your effort in putting them together...
My pleasure.
Outstanding video HR! Ammo tests are the "bomb!"😅 Yes they can be "subjective" but you always make it as fair as practical for the average enthusiast! Thank you!!
My pleasure. Thanks for watching Dan!
I’ve never seen HST at my local gun store. Matter of fact, his shelves were pretty bare this week for 9mm.
You should be able to order it online, but it's not cheap.
They open up like flowers. The media put a certain negative stigma on hollow point bullets. This is good carry ammo as it reduces penetration and collateral damage so not to just pass through objects and intended targets. Thanks for another educational video.
Good evening, HRFUNK and family. 💪🇺🇸💪. This was an awesome video. I love bullet ballistics.
Speer Gold Dot is my preferred load but HST is my only other option I will carry.
124 gr Hst is my preferred carry round in the standard and +P version depending on what gun I’m carrying! My second choice would be Speer Gold dot! Great video!
I'm glad to see the 9mm tests . I only wish you'd done the .45ACP also . I see you have the Gen 1 S&W M&P ,looks like the stock trigger . I have the Gen 1 M&P 9c but my trigger was horrible so I replaced it with an Apex Tactical trigger and the difference was amazing .
I bought 800 rnds couple months ago..! I love that little M&P.
Wilson Combat did a great deal of experimental work to validate water as a test medium as well. They needed to test thousands of rounds quickly and that much gell simply wasn't an option.
Very informative test. HST just happens to be what I use. Thanks for the video sir.
Great vid.
Definitely the ammunition i carry thanks HR😊and 40 caliber always seems available
Good stuff, HR! Thanks for sharing.
For those interested for clothing my Modern Meat Target Tests -.38 premium vs budget 2" & 3" Tomorrow morning, & coming Water Jug Tests all use "4 Layer LIGHT CLOTHING". Short Barrels, or Old School or Budget jhps clothing can definitely effect if there is any expansion so it will be nice for you viewers to be able to cross reference HrFunk, Dick Fairburn, and my testing as well as Gun Sam's Early tests. I talk with two of the foremost actual Terminal Ballistics Subject Matter Experts regularly. Now companies and RUclipsrs love to measure expansion at the extreme greatest but it really is supposed to be MIN & MAX averaged near the frontal diameter as in not at bottom of Ranger Talons etc. because of fluid tissue dynamics. FYI my main carries are 124+p HST warmer days or Gold Dots when working, and 180 HST Cold Winter Days so that should tell you something w .40 punch or .38 Hydrashok Deep in backup Snubs.
I will probably be picking up a box of Federal HST ammo for my Carry firearms!! Thanks for this concise and informative video!!!
You are most welcome.
My son told me to get HSTs when I bought my first gun and I got a lot of them 124+p because I didn't find anything but +p.
Btw I love watching ammo testing.
It appears that the longer barrel adds to the performance
Longer barrels generally add velocity. How that translates into the bullets performance depends on a number of factors.
I've seen 9mm HST tested by a number of different channels, and it has always shown very good performance
As a bonus, one of my local gun shops has the 50-round LEO labeled boxes of 9 mm HST for a very competitive price 😁
It's just too bad there 38 Special HST (no longer in production) wound up not performing very well, although their recently introduced to 357 load seems to
My Last post was NOT in anyway to anger you But just something I tried out to see if in fact body temp would show a diferant result. Love always your videos Please keep them coming. Tim From Canada.
Thanks Tim. I rarely become angry over a comment posted to a video. Thanks for watching and please continue to comment whenever you like.
I like your ammunition testing videos. I would also be interested to know what ammunition your department uses right now. Being from Western North Carolina I know our department uses Gold Dot 9mm. I would like to know what a department uses in Ohio. Please don’t listen to the people telling you to get a 3” barrel handgun and gel blocks with “4 layers of denim”. If they want to see that they can go to the other 900 channels that do that every week and watch it. I want to see your test.
Yep. I believe they are still using the Speer Gold Dot round.
What would be nice to know is how the point of impact differs between expensive HST ammo and cheap training ammo. If folks have to practice with hyper expensive ammo to know where it is going to hit, HST ammo loses its appeal, especially if it causes people to practice less. As an aside, one of the great things about .45 ACP is that the same ammo you train with is guaranteed to put a 45 caliber hole in whomever needs putting a hole into.
Agreed. Fortunately at typical handgun distances, there’s not much difference in defensive accuracy from one load to the next. For bullseye shooting, some loads will print differently than others, but at 2-7 yards on a human body, they’re all going to be pretty close to the same.
Hey H, great job on the Federal HST comparison. Have you ever thought about taking a bore sight laser putting it in the chamber and then zeroing a laser sight to the bore laser. Then target shooting with just the laser sight by pointing rather than sighting down the slide.
I produced a video along those lines a while back. Here's a link: ruclips.net/video/ES2Ns9JK6t8/видео.html
Just my own opinion of course, but the 9mm Federal HST 124 grain standard velocity bullet is the best their is when it comes to self defense in 9mm. Not only do I feel it is the best performer (especially in 3" barrels) it beats the high velocity version. The HV version expands slightly more but has less penetration because it expands faster. Still a great SD round, but the SV is better. I have put the HST SV 124 gr, bullet up against every popular round out there including the Speer GD and it has always come out #1.
Great review, thank you.
Very similar results, caught In the 3rd jug, and speed with XTP'S. However, the your HST's are superior!
After all the testing I've done, I am of the belief that there is very little difference in performance when it comes to premium ammunition lines from the major manufacturers. I believe the HST is about the best line of defensive ammo on the market, but other brands are not very far behind.
I don't care what anybody says, Federal HST is King universally with all self defense calibers. It is consistently the most reliable performing round pretty much no matter how you match each variant of the HST with all barrel lengths. Even putting a heavy 147 grain through a 3 inch barrel handgun you will still get some expansion everytime and it will never fail, and never have to worry about lethal over penetration. The perfect self defense round 👍
For those that asked for some kind of barrier material, I think their reasoning is that certain HP ammo plugs and fails to open not that it would change results per se. Like “bullet A plugs with denim and bullet B does not.”
I know, that's why I was encouraging people to use this test themselves for their own ammunition. They can use whatever material they like.
@@hrfunk I am going to test my loads again. The ones I sent pictures of, with maybe a layer of leather or some other jacket material over the first jug. Then, I’ll know exactly how my loads should work given a bad guy wears similar material! Lol
I’ll let you know personally how that goes.
What if your bad guy is wearing a ballerina tutu? You might be in trouble!
@ If he’s wearing a tutu, I’ll let the wife punch him instead…… 😂
@ p.s. I posted videos of my testing to this point with some pictures. They are in my Ballistic Testing Playlist. Could you see if you can see them?
HR, is that a Nylon 66 I see on the wall behind you? I've got a black one that I've had for about fifty years. It's a great rifle. Light and accurate. Still works good and is accurate, after all these years. Good video on the HST ammo.
Thanks! And yes, that’s my wife’s Nylon 66 on the wall behind me. I stole, um, I mean, I borrowed it to use as my backdrop for a while.
Five of my 9mm handguns run HST 124 gr 100%. My Hellcat jams on it.
That's what I carry in all my firearms
Hello HR. I was surprised that the expansion of both calibers was pretty much equal. I expected the larger 40 caliber to to end up wider than the 9 mm.
I saw that Charter Arms has come out with a new Coyote model, a low recoil revolver in 380. The 380 is considered marginal for self defense ( Dick Fairburn ) I wonder if there is a loss of performance with a ported barrel and cylinder gap. If someone " happened" to have a PPK laying around it with would make an interesting video.
Ha, ha! I might know where one is lying. I'll keep an eye out for some of that ammo.
The reason why Law enforcement did not latch onto hst like they did gold dot, is because law enforcement criteria was based on penetrating auto body, windshield/glass/Barriers, etc speer gold dots were designed as bonded bullets, federal hst were not originally, they were designed for terminal performance in human targets, with a civilian application in mind. the gold dot predates the hst, and created under different criteria, all this dated back to FBI wound ballistic trials after 1986 miami dade shootout, penetration was the issue for them at that time. gold dot followed FBI standards protocol, hst was more of civilian self defense round in theory, and is the reason why the law enforcement market moved to speer gold dots, the latest rendition of hst is now basically a bonded bullet, but it's to late for them to catch up to gold dots now, for civilian Self Defensive market i think the hst is a better bullet, one that law enforcement should Reconsider!
I don’t know about any other agency, but the only reason my department didn’t choose it was because it was/is so expensive.
Yes they are more expensive, i dont know why! And hst are fully sealed case mouth and primer! dont know about gold dots?!
H thanks for the link. I am more interested in zeroing the laser sight with a bore laser at 15 yards and then checking if it is dead zero accurate after firing.
Sorry, I have not tested that.
Excellent video! Can you repeat the test with drywall or wood simulating indoor wall? I always carry my ccw with Federal!
Thanks, I’ve been thinking about doing something along those lines, but I haven’t figured out just how to go about it yet.
Interesting Federal downloaded the 165gr HST over the years. I was issued this ammo in the mid 2000s and it was loaded to 1150fps…and often clocked at or above that. The reduced velocity is more in line with the original .40 FBI load…🤔
How is the 165gr getting under 1100fps in a 5-inch pistol? Doesn’t make sense. The rated velocity on Federal’s website is 1130fps. I would think that it would be far more than that in the longer barrel, but what do I know? 🤷
@ probably because Federal quietly downed it a bit….the thing is..when they do this..nobody actually notices…which tells why they probably do..
As I recall, the original .40 S&W load from Winchester featured a 180 grain JHP at 950 FPS.
@ yes, later Speer would create a medium velocity 165gr GD at 1050fps for FBI. I don’t believe the 147gr +p 9mm HST is available any more…so it wouldnt surprise me if the 165gr HST was toned down a bit…the original was snappy, and as can be seen..u really cant tell the difference. 147gr 9mm was also redesigned with a double cannelure and reduced overall expansion diameter for better penetration based on real world use.
Oh no he didn't🤣🤣🤣! I remember when Hydra-shoks were the greatest thing ever. HST and Hornady Critical Duty are my go to rounds.
We didn't have RUclips gel test videos to prove otherwise..Just the word of established experts usually from the LE community..
@@paulstoyek381 And a few pork carcasses as well.
Thanks HR. Another thoughtful test and evaluation. Have you tested any 5.7 x 28 pistols or ammunition? I just purchased a Tisas 5.7 non optics ready very very cheaply.
I've shot a few rounds of 5.7, but I've never done any testing like this with it. I hope you like your new Tisas!
Also, can you put a link on your webpage to a PDF of the calculation sheet? I made an Excel spreadsheet that does the math for you.
I’ll give it a try. It might take me a little while to figure out how to do it.
My question Officer funk would you TRUST the HST and your Masada Tatical for Home Defense.
If yes do you think 147 grain ir better than 124?
Thank you so much.
I would. I prefer the 124 grain load, but I certainly wouldn’t want to be shot with the 147.
Next 45 Federal HST and Barnes TAC-XPD 45?
If I can find some.
What do you think about Federal Hryda Shock?
This video should answer your question: 45 ACP Blowout! Tactical HST vs Classic HydraShok!
ruclips.net/video/yy8HFiQqek0/видео.html
HST's are gnarly! Question, are all plastic milk jugs equal? 😂
I get them all from the same place, so they are about as consistent as such a thing can be.
outstanding
Have you thought about testing 45 ACP rounds this way?
Yes. Sooner or later I’ll get around to that.
@hrfunk I'd be more than happy to send out some different ammo if that would help! Just let me know how
Thank you so much Shane. If you contact me through my website. I can give you that info. Thank you!
More scenarios, more ammo, more expensive, less is more! Keep it simple! 😅😅
How are you Mr.funk? I’m in need of some advice if you could provide it? I shoot and carry a g19 and when I shoot my thumbs are so tight against the slide, it stops the slide from locking back on the last round. I’ve tried adjust my grip and my accuracy has plummeted. How much pressure should I put on the slide using my support hand, and should I shoot how I’m most comfortable or something different? Thanks for your time
I think the best advice I can give you is to keep working on modifying your grip. If you can find an index point on the frame for your support hand thumb (maybe the take-down latch). Work on keeping your support thumb there and your shooting hand right on top of it, but not touching the slide. The "Thumbs-forward" grip has its advantages, but it also has some drawbacks, as your experience bears out,
It's a shame Federal discontinued it's 38 special HST 138 grain plus p.. it had the appearance of a wad cutter hollow point deep down inside the case. From what I understand it was not accurate out of certain 38 special handguns so they discontinued it
Maybe they will bring back an improved version in the future.
More hellcat included please....😪
Agree
My Hellcat seems to have wandered off to my Son's house.
👍👍
General Jack D. Ripper wants to know if you used fluoridated or distilled water in your tests.
It's whatever comes out of my well!
@@hrfunk Good, no commie plot here.
Hornady critical duty does well also…tools&targets does good work. 124s and 147hst n my 509 now…
Your videos are usually good, the video quality here is no exception. But have got to come up to modern standards. Get some gel blocks with 4 layers of denim and borrow a 9mm with a 3" barrel.
Thank you. As I said, however, anyone can conduct this test with any medium and intermediate barrier they wish.
Would you be interested in testing Magtechs affordable 9mm Luger+P+ 115GR JHP..Rated velocity of 1330 out of a 4" barrel.. You'd be the first on RUclips..
I would be if I knew where to find some.
@@hrfunkBerelis has them on sale now..Great price..
TOBIAS FOR PRESIDENT
Boy you're way late to the party, Federal HST has been considered the gold standard for awhile now! I carry the 124gr. load in 9mm and the 165gr. in 40 S&W.
Just to clarify, I originally tested the HST for my department about 15 years ago. At the time I was thoroughly impressed with its performance. I retested it in this video because one of my viewers was kind enough to donate the ammo. I was not surprised by the results.
@@hrfunk Got it! I always appreciate your videos by the way. And Thanks for your service!
BTW, i wish a Happy Marine Corps birthday to all of you crayon eaters. No slight intended....😂
If this bullet does not open in water never use it, if you're not shooting through at least Jean then it's just for entertainment, all bullets are not the same and hardly open in real scenarios especially the heavy for caliber grain weights. 45 ACP is the worst the 185 will open like a parachute but not go deep enough in the heavies won't they should usually be $200 to $210 grains HST hydroshock deeps, Gold Dot 200 grain short barrel they work so if you need information on semi autos, apparently I'm just a keyboard warrior and I could probably have more accurate analysis . And I'm not a sniper good shooter but I'm a good nerd . HST will even open in a 147 thereby fire HST the most reliable brand across all calibers. But in 45 no-go If it opens it goes like 7 in gel.