Tamaira Cordell They did far more than ask for opinion. They apologized for causing harm. Same as admitting fault. If contacted by an opposing attorney or law enforcement say nothing. The only opinion that matters is a professional who protects your interests.
@@Graeme408 they did not say definite harm... hypothetical, "IF" harmed/.... and also stated NO INTENT to harm....Negligence in this matter is moot as they owed no duty to the other party (I am not an attorney)
Of course me too i have other chanel who changed and knew right away who it was ... also maybe change to something similar sounding like No Mad Movemennt
So trademarks take a year sometimes more to process. (Without opposition) They just now filed. I have been through this with several of my own projects and clients. They just filed an application for intent to use and in no way own that registered mark yet. It will be assigned to an examining attorney in 3 months but could take more. I would retain a good attorney that specializes in this. I have one if you need. If their mark is accepted it will be published for opposition for 30 days in which case you will want to have all your ducks in a row to oppose it.
@YouSurf 2 Since you brought up the lawyer I went to her website and found this right on the sidebar... Trademark Myth #8: Anything can be trademarked Trademark Tamara Pester 26 Jul, 2019 Companies often believe they can use any word or design as a trademark. This is partially true - one could use anything for a trademark. However, it’s a myth that all trademarks get equal protection. Trademark lawyers classify marks into “strong trademarks” and “weak trademarks.” We think about protection and registration. A strong trademark is “fanciful” or “arbitrary and capricious” in connection with the particular goods or services. For example, lululemon is a made-up word with no meaning in the English dictionary. This makes it “fanciful.” Same with Starbucks. The word Apple is well-defined for those delicious crisp fruits we eat, that keep the doctor away, but it lacks meaning in connection with computers. This makes Apple a strong trademark for computer, electronic goods, and technology.
Walk away even is someone pays all legal bills it is not worth it and remember judges are corrupt here in America and will favor the traditional business.
You will not find the solution in commentaries. Because some will say, don’t worry and other will say to worry. There is only one solution, contact a lawyer and see what’s the law for this case in particularly. And if someone say “I had similar problem and I won” that doesn’t mean nothing. Because there are a lot of different ways to “patent/register” your name/brand. And that needs to be investigated by a lawyer what type of registration they have.
When I lived in the US, a company in France sent me a similar letter. They did have the name registered in the US. Because they just didn't ask nice, and attacked right off, I got a lawyer. In short, I registered the name in Australia where they hadn't, and made that our headquarters on paper. Eventually, because they started out nasty, they lost their name. If nice, I'd have gladly given it to them.
It looks like you have received some great advice from TNM community, so I would take their advise to heart and fight this one as it looks like this company started back in 2017, which is when you guys started. And please keep us posted. If worse comes to worst, we will still follow you and we’ll promote your new name. There are options and who knows? You may become bigger with a different name! I suggests: El Movimiento Nómada,” or TNM Van Life.” The point is that you are not alone and we’ll be here to help you. We love you guys! From Florida USA
Off the cuff it appears to me that Jordan & Kaylee's brand in no way competes with the plantiff's enterprise. These are not competing businesses on the face of it. The question then becomes what specific commercial categories does the plantiff's trademark include? Vanlife? Video production? World travel? I doubt it very seriously. Jordan & Kaylee - you guys need to have a competent attorney look at this for you. Said attorney needs to have your best interest in mind rather than encouraging you to fight simply to milk fees from you. The Nomadic Movement is real estate. It is solid ground. It is yours. And someone is trying to take it from you. Here are a few commercial categories that YOU should immediately have protected under the trademark "The Nomadic Movement" Van life Bus life Tiny House Minimalist Life World Travel Video Production Hiking Motocross/ Motorcycle Off-road Off-grid Organic Farming I am sure you will think of more.
Sean Craig know what he is talking about. Not yet time for a lawyer, find my comments about LLC bc they have not filed in Colorado which where you stayed they are based from www.sos.state.co.us/biz/NameCriteria.do
If this company had the name before you came on the scene, you will not win in court. When I started my business, I immediately checked to see if anyone else had claims to the name, on an international level. I'm unsure as to why you didn't do this? I'm sorry you're going through this.
Omg! This is similar to a trademark case I am in RIGHT NOW! I have a great attorney. Cease & Decist letters are just that letters. Nothing has been filed. I would suggest that you consult with a patent/trademark/intellectual property attorney asap. Generally they will look at your case and talk to you for 15-20 minutes and give you an idea of your options w/o charge. Usually a Trademark has to be filed in a specific category. You can look up the State of Colorado trademark online for free at the CO Secretary of State website. The US Patent and Trade Office is a bit more difficult... but possible if they provided the filing number. Usually they will be filed in the same category. You can have businesses with same/similar names as long as they stay in their designated lane.
RUclips channels are a business if you have income. RUclips channels need to be set up as a business. The letter you received is a normal letter to protect a trade name. One way to look at it is if you started a clothing line and named it The McDonalds, The Coke A Cola, The Walmart, etc. Even though you are not in the same type business you will receive a letter once they know about you. Change your name and trade mark your name and set up your channel as a business if you want to grow.
You've had this channel for 2 years, and now they notice. Something triggered their fear. There are some typos in the letter. A good attorneys office would not have typos. I just went on Google and searched Nomadic Movement. You came up first, they came up second, then videos of you came up third. Maybe that's why their suing. Your presence on the internet is overshadowing theirs.
@@KayRay1966 The company actually set up show after this channel, they dont have any grounds to claim copyright, the name isnt owned by the company. All they have is a pending trademark which shouldnt go through.
I'm not a lawyer so I don't know the law like a lawyer does. But for what it's worth here's what I'd do. 1. Talk to a lawyer. 2. Watch The Patent Scam on Netflix. You're not dealing with patent law to my knowledge but the documentary talks about trolls and lawsuit mills run out of the East District of TX that has become an industry unto itself. Definitely talk to a lawyer.
It looks like they've been using the trademark since 2017, which predates your use of it. If that went to court, the judge would likely rule in their favor. If I were you, I'd just rename the channel "The Nomad Movement" and call it a day. None of your fans (myself included) are going anywhere...still on the journey with you 😊💜 Be sure to do a trademark search on "The Nomad Movement" first though. UPDATE: crap....never mind about "The Nomad Movement". It's taken. Unbelievable. I'm sure you'll come up with something awesome.
My mom use to work for a company that got sued for the name they had and they won because the company was completely different from the one my mom work for and they couldn't prove harm to the business. If I was yall I would contact a lawyer
What gives legal ownership to a name-copyright or trademark? I’d certainly Google that. You can also look up “for free” in the gov trademarks & patents records as well to see if their name has been trademarked!
Regardless if the names are similar or not, surely the fact that your businesses goals are totally different means something.. isn't as if your in direct competition. Definitely sounds suspicious to me and I would definitely seek legal help to make sure this isn't someone just trying it on
@@KayRay1966 how can the other business claim its damaging there brand when theres no similarity in the business.. as far as I can tell is "the nomadic movement" comes up first on google and search that's it
I wouldn't say suspicious. I'd say the clothing company probably heard about this channel and filed to protect their business name. Its far more expensive for a business to change their name. So, I'm thinking they were more afraid this channel might file for TM before they did and then they'd be forced to lose all the money they spent on logos on their merchandise. This is a tricky one. I think this channel should file for a TM "THE Nomadic Movement" immediately. Then the business will understand nobody is trying to take their name and then this whole thing will clear up; that's what I think. This is just a cease and desist letter, not a lawsuit.
I feel so bad. I hope this wasn't our fault, but I tagged my girlfriend in a picture of their sunglasses about 2 weeks ago. She commented saying "I thought this was a RUclips couple lmao" and they responded to our comment with "lawsuit in action 😁". I didn't think much of it until I saw this video pop up in my feed. We love you guys and hope you can keep your name. We're so sorry. 🥺😥
My question is why did this company write you a letter? If they wanted to shut you down, they could have contacted YT and simply asked them to shut you down because CC etc... I don't feel they will just let this go if you change names. You are likely selling more of their product than they are. I am not impressed with their products or their website. You own this YT name, they didn't take the time to registered the YT channel name and according to them, they have been in business for 3 years before you started your YT channel. Why were they sitting on their hands for two years? If they want it, ask them to buy it from you. You created the channel, the following of many subs, and they failed to secure the name. If a website url is ripped off... guess what? They have to paid to get it back. Why would YT be any different? It was happenstance and now lawyers taste blood in the water. Why did it take them so long to contact you? All along they could have been making sales because of all the people you reach. They only have a few thousand followers in all their social media. That's nothing! Perhaps they have been calculating that some day, when you reach X number of subs... we'll drop the bomb on you. Anyway you look at this… they likely benefited by your YT channel. Smartest thing to do for both parties is WORK TOGETHER and not give those slimy lawyers a dime!! Carry their products, recommend their products in every video... only a fool would NOT work with you!
Agree with many of the comments here. First thing, contact a lawyer. I know that sounds scary but you don’t have to spend a lot of money just to have a early conversation and find out what your options are and what you’re looking at in terms of cost. Second, also agree that you should consult a lawyer before making statements on video tape regarding this matter. You certainly haven’t hurt their business, if anything he’s probably help to track traffic to their site. My understanding is that it may come down to when you first thought of the name and what was your inspiration, and which one of you was using at the longest. They in fact may have copied the name from watching your RUclips channel. Regardless we’ve got your back, and I think all of your users will avoid purchase anything from their company, if anything they just bought them self some bad advertising.
Consider registering your company in your state as llc. If in your state your company name is not taken you can select it and is granted thou in another state a business may operate with a same name. Register your trade mark.
It happens.... However, breathe, you have loyal followers. But I would make sure the letter is legit. And you can search the name through trademark registered names .com to see if the name is registered trademark through their state and DBA (Doing Business As). to start.
Screw them. You had the name first. Don’t fall for their bull crap. They also can’t prove you’re infringing on their business. They have to prove it. And they won’t. I would get a lawyer. Don’t let them scare you off just because they have lawyer. Your name is different than theirs. Fight!
So sorry to hear this guys 😢. I went through the exact thing with my business. Whether they have a case should really depend on what class their trademark is in. I am assuming apparel. Considering your travel, worst case you may have to stop selling merch. Either way YOU MUST GET REPRESENTATION! If only to send them a letter. Good luck!
OMG, I just looked up their trademark and they just filed it. It’s not even a trademark yet and you have been using it for 2 years. There is no way they could win a case. Still, get representation!!
Disclaimer: The following is not legal advice. Guys, take a deep breath and don't stress yourselves out. You should be fine. You are not being sued let's start with that. Don't rush into changing your names and do consult with a trademark lawyer to ensure what jurisprudence and legislation applies in your case. Where I am from, it is legally acceptable to use any business name, unless it has become widely associated with another business in the same industry. For example if your business does vlogging and sells clothes, but the other Nomadic Movement is a fast food restaurant, that won't be an issue because they are both different industries.
I’ve had this happen to me with a company in the same industry that I am in. The other companies name was part of a particular coffee that I do. The question is, is there a likelihood of confusion for the consumer between the two companies?If they are in a different industry there would not be confusion. That is the basis as I understand it for them to contest the name.
It sent this on their e-commerce site: Hi, Nice product line, and good price points. I wouldn't have discovered you if is wasn't for The Nomadic Movement. You should each put a note on your pages the "Nomadic Movement and The Nomadic Movement" are not affiliated, but we appreciated each other's work." Lawyers are never good for anyone. It would be great if you would choose otherwise. Thank-you.
Do they have a copyright or a trademark? If they have a trademark, you need to change the name. Adding a "the" is not enough. In these disputes, it comes down to first use. I run an internet consulting company and I consult on issues like this.
How about nomadic movers that is close enough to your original name, and would still be found and would be different enough, but check with the patent and trade mark office through an attorney to make sure that the new name you choose is available. Definitely talk with an attorney.
Better get a lawyer son, better get a reaaaaaaaaal good one ... and take the video down, next they will be suing you for slander, especially as you have posted there web address in your description
Did you search the copyright and trademark database? It’s public record so if they do indeed have the name either copy written or trademarked it will state it, and it will also state when they were officially done. If the date they were granted trademark or copyright over the name (not date of filing, but date granted to them, can be a year+ after filing), and you guys used the name for business purposes before then, you can fight freely with the upper hand. But did you guys ever file a business license name under The nomadic Movement? If so, obtain a copy of that and any other early records of using the name to show you used it for businesses purposes first.
I thought I heard you say you sell some of their merchandise, that could be construed as trading off their name. Perhapes you can work out some kind of deal as a distributor ???
A lawyer is the best bet. When I do a search for Nomadic Movement on the copyright site, I get no results. I am in no way an expert, or lawyer, but I don't see it. That being said, talk to a lawyer. It will be well worth the money to make sure you aren't being had! I do agree with some others that it might be they are capitalizing on your success. I noticed the grammar errors from the lawyer as well and question its legitimacy. Find a lawyer!
You’re right. Something isn’t right about that letter. It’s very unprofessional. There are a lot of grammar and punctuation errors. Someone in the comments stated they know a lawyer. Check into that.
Sometimes that stuff is a scare tactic. Pretty much have a lawyer send them a letter back saying " THE" nomadic movement says go screw yourself in a lawyer professional way and they should drop it.
Start a crowdfunding page for the legal costs if it's going to take a fight - I don't mind donating and I'm sure others wouldn't mind. It seems from the evidence you've given us that this can be won and they're just bullying you so their application, which was only filed on July 26th 2019, can go through. They can't file for a trademark if somebody else is using the same name with a "The" prefix, regardless of who used it first, as they didn't have a trademark in place when you used that name, so they have no fight and are probably going to lose their registration fees. They're not even claiming it as a trademark by using (TM) until such time they can get it registered and use (R), which is daft and doesn't help their case at all.
Just a thought, after everyone gets their panties unwadded... They sell hats, sunglasses and outdoor gear and you guys wear hats, sunglasses and outdoor gear... See where I'm going here? If they are legit (and you should confirm that) you guys have a huge following. Seems to me there could easily be some common interest here. I enjoy you guys and wish you luck and if you have to change your name, won't matter to me.
As many others have said, you need to contact a lawyer ASAP. Perhaps reach out to Leonard French here on RUclips, he deals with copyright and has covered many issues like this. Honestly though it is going to boil down to who used / registered the name or trademark first. If they used it before you folks, you don't really have a legal leg to stand on and will have to settle or change.
James Brede This is a source of income for them as they travel-clearly they can’t just stop doing that and by changing their name, they might have to drop their channel (I don’t know as I don’t have my own channel and know how that works), but they’d certainly lose views which could be a major problem for them. But I guess if you had grown up yourself, you’d have thought that out before leaving such a rude and ininsightful comment.
@@youfinallyfoundwaldo1364 excuse, excuse! It doesn't matter! The should have registered there name before they started the channel! The other company had the name first. That's just the way it is! You-tube is miss informing people on how to start up a channel! Your not to bright yourself!
James Brede OMG your spelling errors lol I’m assuming you’re a kid who doesn’t understand how all this works at all. The other company just now trademarked their own name, which is different than their name. This is a common happenstance as names are being used up. Thats why trademarks and copyrights are being used and bought up. They didn’t do anything wrong until possibly recently as the other company legalized their name by either a trademark or a copyright & this was their notice and attorneys don’t send email notices, so this just seems line a way to push them out of their own name,again, which is different than theirs and their business is no threat to the hat and clothing makers.
Who knows if the company even wants to go this way, maybe their lawyer needed some more money. Anyway, however this plays out, to me it gives a bad impression about that company. I'll keep watching your adventures anyway. (Minus the yoga sessions 😉)
I’m sorry if I’m off in my thinking. I have see channels with small subscriber numbers get sponsored. Why wouldn’t they just capitalize on this and sponsor you? Realistically this number of people calling the BBB filing complaints and bad Google and Facebook reviews or the same group buying their products?
See if they want to sponsor one of your videos. There is no way an online apparel retailer can be harmed by a youtube channel about van life. They would gain zero by suing you, but if they sponsor your video they get noticed by a hundred thousand potential customers.
Contact Lenard French here on RUclips. Their trademark appears to be registration in July of 2019. If your channel is older than that then you were first. Also there is no market usurpation as long as you are not selling hats and T-shirt’s. But contact Lenard he is a real attorney.
Actually, they can’t copyright a name. Second, they can only register a trademark. You aren’t infringing on their trade mark because you don’t sell hats nor do you use their trademark. I would contact a lawyer to respond officially because they might sue you thinking you wouldn’t defend yourself. You can’t trademark common words and nomadic movement is in common usage. You can trademark the image or design of those words arranged a certain way in a logo. You’re safe unless you steal their logo, LOL.
You need not apologize for anything. This sort of thing happens more frequently than you might imagine. There likely is zero real "harm" currently being experienced by the other "Nomadic Movement" entity but they are obviously aggressive in seeking to "protect" their trademark to allegedly avoid "confusion" between its business and other entities out there operating under a similar name. It is all about them operating as a moneyed business. As others have advised, you should have at least an initial consultation with an intellectual property attorney who is experienced with such matters (as most IP lawyers are...same with the firm I am associated with) and get a better idea of your options. Much good luck and hopefully this will all be in your nomadic rearview mirror soon.
PS - Based on personal experience, if you have been using the name longer than them -- and you guys show up a LOT in searches for "nomadic movement," while they do not -- and they filed for trademark afterwards, there's an excellent chance they need *your* permission to use the name. Again, GET A LAWYER.
This is just unfortunate. They seem to be a legit business. Even though their trademark was just registered, their website began in 2017 and facebook page in 2013. If you want to fight I would take down this post and contact a lawyer directly. But it will cost a lot of money up front and cause much inconvenience & interruption to your lifestyle. You said you didn't want to come back to the country and go to court. You guys are such nice loving people and not "fighters." Going through a legal battle will wear you out. If it's really important to you then you should. IMHO, you might want to consider changing name and move on. It will be inconvenient and may affect your income, but probably not as bad as choosing to fight. Continue to follow your passion and dream - I have no doubt you'll come out stronger in the end. And look into register that new name :-) Love you guys.
You cannot Trademark a disparaging word. "Nomad" is akin to the word vagrant.. Case dismissed! Seriously, consult a lawyer if you really want to keep your name alive. Good Luck.
Absolutely! This would be best scenario in the case that they wanted to just change the name and move on. The Supertones were sued by another band with the same name, they changed their name to the Orange County Suoertones and that was a wrap! Of course it would have to be J before K 😜 jus cuz, the alphabet and all.
Alright, I really suggest you contact a lawyer.. even messaging Legal Zoom or something like that. But here is the thing -- they filed a trademark and then immediately sent you this notice. That looks like they trademarked a name *they knew* was already in use. Also, there are many stipulations based on the type of business you are. Your business is *nothing like* theirs, not even similar, not the same industry, nothing. Basically in a case like this they need to prove they can be "harmed" by you having the same name. That harm usually exists if they are competing businesses. I really suggest you do not give in to this immediately.
@@abundantlyclear it comes down to use. Who has been using the name longer. They could be using the name for 3 years and to tie this up and secure an easier, legal stance, trademark then sends cease and desist. Although, if they started using the name after you and they are trying to hold on to the name...they really have no right to it. There is the 80/20 rule and the t-shirt isnt their main business....its a portion
They just recently filed this trademark on July 26, 2019, probably for the express purpose of preparing a cease and desist. I would talk to a lawyer. You can definitely demonstrate (with proof) that you were using the trademark long before they filed. I think that matters.
Yes, that matters a ton to the analysis!! If they started using the mark first, they have the rights to it. And it looks like the application they filed is related to apparel only so they really can't ask them to stop using the name in relation to this RUclips channel...I hope they get in touch with a good trademark attorney!
Trademarks don’t work like that. This isn’t the first time someone has done this. Once something is trademarked it’s locked down. If you don’t trademark yourself you run the risk of this happening
William Stru as a trademark attorney I can tell you it’s a lot more nuanced than that. There are common law rights that do matter if you’re the first to use whether you file for a federal registration or not. Your rights are limited but they are there and they will be protected by a court. The US is a first to use not first to register jurisdiction. Whether or not that’s the case here I don’t know I haven’t done the analysis they aren’t my clients. I’m just saying those are general trademark rules.
Waybackmachine their website to confirm that they have established historic precedent... using the name before you did. Yes the seo thing is a good argument from their side... all they really have to stand on legally since your name has dominant search visibility. If it were me, i would issue a press release and try to get picked up by media. You have a good story and public opinion matters. I would write back with a response like, "Do whatever you think is fair and just. We don't sell hats or sunglasses. And we've been using the name for ___ days prior to you filing for trademark. Lots of luck to you in your legal pursuits! ✌"
@@sbair8 I took a look at a whois database. They registered their domain back in 2015. What Shannon said will probably hold out for the butt munchers as Shannon has already pointed out. I was involved in a similar situation. I was served with a cease and desist order, a VERY lengthy corporate worded one too. Even though the other guys had a "registered" trademark and a very active website and where WAY bigger than me, I was able to prove that I was first to use the name, years before they did. I produced a few emails and some bank info with my company name. They ate crow, I won.
First of all, I'm not an attorney, but I've dealt with situations like this before. Copyright is not the issue, and the date they list on their website doesn't matter for this purpose. The trademark that they applied for several months ago, but was officially registered on July 26, 2019 is the issue. They've obviously been planning to do this the instant their trademark was registered. Their LLC was registered in 2014. However, trademark filings have to be very specific for a reason. I can launch a company today called Nomadic Movement and sell chocolate bars(assuming a company named Nomadic Movement isn't already doing so and trademarked the name). There's nothing to stop the hat and apparel-selling Nomadic Movement from sending me a cease and desist letter threatening me, but there's also nothing to stop me from using it as toilet paper. Trademark infringement becomes an issue when there is reasonable confusion in the marketplace. I don't see anyone looking for headwear and getting confused by two people traveling the world in a van. In the same case, I don't see anyone looking for info on traveling the world in a van and giving up because they are so confused by seeing a hat company with a similar name. The fact that they also travel the world is irrelevant when it comes to trademark infringement. In my non-legal opinion, as long as you don't sell any of the items listed in their trademark, there is no basis for you to need to change your name. If I were you, I'd call their bluff and respond, preferably through an attorney, with evidence as to how your name that you've been using since 2017 causes no conflict with their trademark. If you have the funds, I'd also file your own US trademark application for your name and purpose.(just don't list anything related to selling apparel) Don't let them bully/scare you into changing your name. If they were smart, rather than threaten you, they would arrange a sponsorship agreement. You'd make some money, and they'd sell more of their merchandise. If they really make "Quality products for quality people", then I can think of no better brand ambassadors than you guys.
Hang in there guys, love your channel and will follow regardless of the name. I love the name and understand how you feel but it’s the two of you that make the channel GREAT!
Jordan & Kaylee, This is uncle Alex . Been following you. I had a company from CA contact me a few years ago with a similar name to my business. Their business had nothing to do with what I do in my business and therefore we were not competitors. That's what makes the difference in these matters. After alerting them of this they did not pursue any litigation. I believe this is the case here. Still check with a specialist in these matters. All the best to you guys. Stop in FL sometime in your travels.
I'm not a laywer, but from my understanding this should be the case too. Two companies can have the same name, but different industries. Also, common words or phrases cant be copywrited, with I believe the exception of big company's that have been around so long their business name basically becomes a word and everyone recognizes it as so. So I dont think either company has the right to trademark 'nomadic' and 'movement'. Another point, their logo isnt similar, either business isnt trying to bounce off each other.
I don't know for sure but I do know a couple I watch changed their name and it automated switch for me so youtube may do it but I showed no interruption in my viewing. I enjoy your channel and your trips.
This has scam written all over it. First the spelling/ grammar mistakes would never come from a ligit lawyer. Second the file date. Fight it. Don't give in
grammer errors.... that is not true.... I can show many true law firm errors... BAD ones too. Even calling Treble Damages as Trouble Damages... LOL Often the law secretaries write the letters.
Definitely make sure this is legit. I am a biz owner and many, many years ago, I received a letter in the mail from a lawyer about being sued for using copyrighted pictures on my website. They were also requesting an outrageous amount of money.... long story short, I ignored all the letters that followed has I had deleted the pictures they were claiming were copyrighted. A few years passed by and we suddenly hear about this going around and being a scam. Some people got taken by sending them thousands of dollars..... Just saying all this because I want you to make sure the letter is truly legit.
If they wanted to capitalize on their success, they wouldn't have registered the name and had an attorney issue a cease and desist. In this game, it's all about how Google indices the name. This site comes up first in Google searches and that in and of itself can hamper their business monetarily and this is what this is all about.
What gets me is that they waited until your channel started gaining some real success before they decided to care. Something does seem off. I hope things work out in your favor 💗.
They just filed for the trademark July 26th at the USPTO. But in the US the law favors whoever used the trademark in commerce first, not who filed first. If you really want to fight this you need to hire an attorney, as there are more considerations than just that.
Seen this happen a lot with forum owners, did a whois lookup on that domain and it's been registered since 2015. Register your name with "the" if you want a lawyer and fight, or register a new name and chalk it up to lesson learned. My name suggestion (future proof): The Real Nomadic Movement
which may show cause for getting the trademark to specifically target you and the brand you have built...not saying they are or did...but smells fishy and could be mentioned in your defence...
also make them prove their sales are worldly as they are saying in the letter...have them prove to you that a large portion of their sales go to worldwide customer base...i just checked their website and then don't even ship outside the USA pfffff so how does this affect worldwide and could be in some way affiliated with your business of travelling world wide...honestly i feel they are stretching that you both are in any way similar...and affect each other...
Trademark approval takes time and the others hold ownership to the brand name. Y’all could have filed the same trademark filing but you didn’t so I think you will lose in this battle. The courts will ask why y’all didn’t file trademark legal filing. I hate giving you bad news.
@@bentleynixonbrooklyn7887 and they were using nomadicmovementcolorado.com in late 2016 and transferred to nomadicmovement.com in early 2017, with redirects both ways in place too so likely owned both domains from at least April 2015. You can see this at archive.org. They need legal counsel but will probably lose due to precedence in commerce. (IANAL.)
Be nice if you shared that info Trademark Factory. Most of why im reading through this barrage of useless info is in hopes I can learn something from someone like you who may actually have some expertise in the subject!
You have not been Sued, YET. You were given a threat that is a call to action. I got one too that was ridiculous. Do some research to find when they started copyright date compared to when you went public. You apologized at 4:05 for doing damage to this other company, why, what when and how? This is a Civil matter which means the Judge has to side with their claim if Judge 51% probability of damage. Burden of Proof of the Damage is on them. Sounds like a Advertising opportunity for them. It is working because I live in Colorado and have never heard of them till now.
The proof is in the pudding, who had the name in "use" first dates r important with certifiable proofs before you panic you can respond with more inquiries. I believe you need to know that trademark and copyright are two distinct areas. I also believe you HAVE NOT infringed on their trademark under the laws and cases under Federal case law. Find out what states this attorney is registered to practice in and get a clear understanding in what court he intends to file in. In my opinion "only opinion you also have some protected rights under intellectual property. laws and precedents because of your present location not being in Colorado, If they do attempt to sue you You very possibly can seek an extension of any case . First eliminate your fear factor, by understanding your rights, deal with an intellectual property expert in the field of law, understand these things done right don't resolve overnight.PS. you may also think about counter suing the plaintiff if they haven't dotted all their i's and crossed their' t's .
Absolutely!! I would definitely look into countersueing and I'm sure if your attorney says that it's your name since y'all used it first!! Best of luck and would love to know what happened with this?? Or the follow up video.. God Bless y'all! 🙏🏻🤗✌
READ!! According to my research, 2 companies can have the same name(trademarked) and it is okay as long as they are operating in 2 different services. So your RUclips channel name might be able to remain the same, but your merch/website name might have to change because they trademarked the name for "headwear; namely, hats and caps; hoodies; shorts; t-shirts; tank tops; hooded sweatshirts" so, if worst comes to worst, you might only have to change your merch/website name, which wont be that bad considering most people click on the link from your videos rather than searching it up.
@@lisastierwalt2636 I have been sued and it was not a fun experience. Their response is not an admission of guilt. They are being honest as they always are in their vids. They are just laying everything out and being transparent, there is nothing wrong with that. It would however be problematic if this did escalate to court and found to be untrue about something.
I see they just filed 7-26-19 for "Nomadic Movement" you will need a good Lawyer, this falls into an area where you have been put into a trap by unscrupulous individuals. Don't put up with this ! I hope you stand up for yourselves and Lawyer up and stop them in their tracks. Any judge will see what they are up too.
TALK TO A LAWYER. Don’t rely on the internet. Don’t ask for community help, talk personally to a copyright attorney.
Why do people always say that "Do Not Rely on the internet" no shit Sherlock! They simply asked the fans for our opinion!
They're tapping into their 114k flowers who may have contact and experiences in this.. why wouldn't they tap into that. It's a scary thing.
Tamaira Cordell They did far more than ask for opinion. They apologized for causing harm. Same as admitting fault. If contacted by an opposing attorney or law enforcement say nothing. The only opinion that matters is a professional who protects your interests.
@@Graeme408 they did not say definite harm... hypothetical, "IF" harmed/.... and also stated NO INTENT to harm....Negligence in this matter is moot as they owed no duty to the other party (I am not an attorney)
The best advice....call a lawyer....God bless guys
Bummer,, If you end up changing your youtube name, I'll still be watching👍 Stay positive.
Me, too! I’ll still be watching YOU TWO!
Jimini same here
I’m a permanent fan of yours too!!!💜💜👍🏼😁
Ill watch you guys no matter the name
Of course me too i have other chanel who changed and knew right away who it was ... also maybe change to something similar sounding like No Mad Movemennt
Huh, I wonder if this litigious company is paying royalties on their storm trooper and Grateful Dead hats...I’ll bet they’re not!
👍
So trademarks take a year sometimes more to process. (Without opposition) They just now filed. I have been through this with several of my own projects and clients. They just filed an application for intent to use and in no way own that registered mark yet. It will be assigned to an examining attorney in 3 months but could take more. I would retain a good attorney that specializes in this. I have one if you need. If their mark is accepted it will be published for opposition for 30 days in which case you will want to have all your ducks in a row to oppose it.
I’m messaging you guys now, I’ll call my lawyer and see what he says. He’s a really smart guy with this stuff
@YouSurf 2 Since you brought up the lawyer I went to her website and found this right on the sidebar...
Trademark Myth #8: Anything can be trademarked
Trademark Tamara Pester 26 Jul, 2019
Companies often believe they can use any word or design as a trademark. This is partially true - one could use anything for a trademark. However, it’s a myth that all trademarks get equal protection. Trademark lawyers classify marks into “strong trademarks” and “weak trademarks.” We think about protection and registration. A strong trademark is “fanciful” or “arbitrary and capricious” in connection with the particular goods or services. For example, lululemon is a made-up word with no meaning in the English dictionary. This makes it “fanciful.” Same with Starbucks. The word Apple is well-defined for those delicious crisp fruits we eat, that keep the doctor away, but it lacks meaning in connection with computers. This makes Apple a strong trademark for computer, electronic goods, and technology.
Matt L it’s them using the nomadic movement on merch because the other company is a merchandise company.
Walk away even is someone pays all legal bills it is not worth it and remember judges are corrupt here in America and will favor the traditional business.
@@CustomPortraitArtist yes , but that other company should have filed for Copyright or TM way back when they started not last week... TOO LATE , IMHO.
@@CustomPortraitArtist But like the quote said... you can TM a branded logo or the like, but not "dictionary words".
You will not find the solution in commentaries. Because some will say, don’t worry and other will say to worry. There is only one solution, contact a lawyer and see what’s the law for this case in particularly.
And if someone say “I had similar problem and I won” that doesn’t mean nothing. Because there are a lot of different ways to “patent/register” your name/brand. And that needs to be investigated by a lawyer what type of registration they have.
When I lived in the US, a company in France sent me a similar letter. They did have the name registered in the US. Because they just didn't ask nice, and attacked right off, I got a lawyer. In short, I registered the name in Australia where they hadn't, and made that our headquarters on paper. Eventually, because they started out nasty, they lost their name. If nice, I'd have gladly given it to them.
It looks like you have received some great advice from TNM community, so I would take their advise to heart and fight this one as it looks like this company started back in 2017, which is when you guys started. And please keep us posted. If worse comes to worst, we will still follow you and we’ll promote your new name. There are options and who knows? You may become bigger with a different name! I suggests: El Movimiento Nómada,” or TNM Van Life.” The point is that you are not alone and we’ll be here to help you. We love you guys! From Florida USA
Off the cuff it appears to me that Jordan & Kaylee's brand in no way competes with the plantiff's enterprise. These are not competing businesses on the face of it. The question then becomes what specific commercial categories does the plantiff's trademark include? Vanlife? Video production? World travel? I doubt it very seriously. Jordan & Kaylee - you guys need to have a competent attorney look at this for you. Said attorney needs to have your best interest in mind rather than encouraging you to fight simply to milk fees from you. The Nomadic Movement is real estate. It is solid ground. It is yours. And someone is trying to take it from you.
Here are a few commercial categories that YOU should immediately have protected under the trademark "The Nomadic Movement"
Van life
Bus life
Tiny House
Minimalist Life
World Travel
Video Production
Hiking
Motocross/ Motorcycle
Off-road
Off-grid
Organic Farming
I am sure you will think of more.
Sean Craig know what he is talking about. Not yet time for a lawyer, find my comments about LLC bc they have not filed in Colorado which where you stayed they are based from www.sos.state.co.us/biz/NameCriteria.do
If this company had the name before you came on the scene, you will not win in court. When I started my business, I immediately checked to see if anyone else had claims to the name, on an international level. I'm unsure as to why you didn't do this? I'm sorry you're going through this.
Just checked it out. They have been in business since 2014 and they have a copyright. I think you might be out of luck here.
Omg! This is similar to a trademark case I am in RIGHT NOW! I have a great attorney. Cease & Decist letters are just that letters. Nothing has been filed. I would suggest that you consult with a patent/trademark/intellectual property attorney asap. Generally they will look at your case and talk to you for 15-20 minutes and give you an idea of your options w/o charge. Usually a Trademark has to be filed in a specific category. You can look up the State of Colorado trademark online for free at the CO Secretary of State website. The US Patent and Trade Office is a bit more difficult... but possible if they provided the filing number. Usually they will be filed in the same category. You can have businesses with same/similar names as long as they stay in their designated lane.
Call an attorney
RUclips channels are a business if you have income. RUclips channels need to be set up as a business. The letter you received is a normal letter to protect a trade name. One way to look at it is if you started a clothing line and named it The McDonalds, The Coke A Cola, The Walmart, etc. Even though you are not in the same type business you will receive a letter once they know about you. Change your name and trade mark your name and set up your channel as a business if you want to grow.
You've had this channel for 2 years, and now they notice. Something triggered their fear. There are some typos in the letter. A good attorneys office would not have typos.
I just went on Google and searched Nomadic Movement. You came up first, they came up second, then videos of you came up third. Maybe that's why their suing. Your presence on the internet is overshadowing theirs.
*they're (speaking of typos) lmao
@@KayRay1966 The company actually set up show after this channel, they dont have any grounds to claim copyright, the name isnt owned by the company. All they have is a pending trademark which shouldnt go through.
I'm not a lawyer so I don't know the law like a lawyer does. But for what it's worth here's what I'd do.
1. Talk to a lawyer.
2. Watch The Patent Scam on Netflix. You're not dealing with patent law to my knowledge but the documentary talks about trolls and lawsuit mills run out of the East District of TX that has become an industry unto itself. Definitely talk to a lawyer.
It looks like they've been using the trademark since 2017, which predates your use of it. If that went to court, the judge would likely rule in their favor. If I were you, I'd just rename the channel "The Nomad Movement" and call it a day. None of your fans (myself included) are going anywhere...still on the journey with you 😊💜 Be sure to do a trademark search on "The Nomad Movement" first though.
UPDATE: crap....never mind about "The Nomad Movement". It's taken. Unbelievable. I'm sure you'll come up with something awesome.
My mom use to work for a company that got sued for the name they had and they won because the company was completely different from the one my mom work for and they couldn't prove harm to the business. If I was yall I would contact a lawyer
I know you guys by your faces on your thumbnails. Until today, I don't think I even knew the name of your channel was The Nomadic Movement.
You've already been told this enough, but get a lawyer and stop talking about this publicly.
What gives legal ownership to a name-copyright or trademark? I’d certainly Google that. You can also look up “for free” in the gov trademarks & patents records as well to see if their name has been trademarked!
Regardless if the names are similar or not, surely the fact that your businesses goals are totally different means something.. isn't as if your in direct competition. Definitely sounds suspicious to me and I would definitely seek legal help to make sure this isn't someone just trying it on
@@KayRay1966 how can the other business claim its damaging there brand when theres no similarity in the business.. as far as I can tell is "the nomadic movement" comes up first on google and search that's it
@@KayRay1966 "Try opening a clothing store called "Apple""
-They do that in China all the time. LOL.
I wouldn't say suspicious. I'd say the clothing company probably heard about this channel and filed to protect their business name. Its far more expensive for a business to change their name. So, I'm thinking they were more afraid this channel might file for TM before they did and then they'd be forced to lose all the money they spent on logos on their merchandise. This is a tricky one. I think this channel should file for a TM "THE Nomadic Movement" immediately. Then the business will understand nobody is trying to take their name and then this whole thing will clear up; that's what I think. This is just a cease and desist letter, not a lawsuit.
I feel so bad. I hope this wasn't our fault, but I tagged my girlfriend in a picture of their sunglasses about 2 weeks ago. She commented saying "I thought this was a RUclips couple lmao" and they responded to our comment with "lawsuit in action 😁". I didn't think much of it until I saw this video pop up in my feed. We love you guys and hope you can keep your name. We're so sorry. 🥺😥
My question is why did this company write you a letter? If they wanted to shut you down, they could have contacted YT and simply asked them to shut you down because CC etc... I don't feel they will just let this go if you change names. You are likely selling more of their product than they are. I am not impressed with their products or their website. You own this YT name, they didn't take the time to registered the YT channel name and according to them, they have been in business for 3 years before you started your YT channel. Why were they sitting on their hands for two years? If they want it, ask them to buy it from you. You created the channel, the following of many subs, and they failed to secure the name. If a website url is ripped off... guess what? They have to paid to get it back. Why would YT be any different? It was happenstance and now lawyers taste blood in the water. Why did it take them so long to contact you? All along they could have been making sales because of all the people you reach. They only have a few thousand followers in all their social media. That's nothing! Perhaps they have been calculating that some day, when you reach X number of subs... we'll drop the bomb on you. Anyway you look at this… they likely benefited by your YT channel. Smartest thing to do for both parties is WORK TOGETHER and not give those slimy lawyers a dime!! Carry their products, recommend their products in every video... only a fool would NOT work with you!
I really wish you would have talked to a lawyer before making this vid. Good luck with it. Sure it will work out for the best in the end. Keep strong!
I was thinking the same.
Agree with many of the comments here. First thing, contact a lawyer. I know that sounds scary but you don’t have to spend a lot of money just to have a early conversation and find out what your options are and what you’re looking at in terms of cost. Second, also agree that you should consult a lawyer before making statements on video tape regarding this matter. You certainly haven’t hurt their business, if anything he’s probably help to track traffic to their site. My understanding is that it may come down to when you first thought of the name and what was your inspiration, and which one of you was using at the longest. They in fact may have copied the name from watching your RUclips channel. Regardless we’ve got your back, and I think all of your users will avoid purchase anything from their company, if anything they just bought them self some bad advertising.
OMG, I hope this works out in your favour and it's not to traumatic for you, best of luck ❤️
Jk's Nomadic Movement, get it trademark tomorrow.
This happened to a business I know and they did get a lawyer and ended up needing to change their name.
Consider registering your company in your state as llc. If in your state your company name is not taken you can select it and is granted thou in another state a business may operate with a same name. Register your trade mark.
It happens....
However, breathe, you have loyal followers.
But I would make sure the letter is legit.
And you can search the name through trademark registered names .com
to see if the name is registered trademark through their state and DBA (Doing Business As). to start.
WE ARE The Nomadic Movement
Amen Brotha!! The Nomadic Movement foreva!! ✌️❤️👍
Won't fly
Screw them. You had the name first. Don’t fall for their bull crap. They also can’t prove you’re infringing on their business. They have to prove it. And they won’t. I would get a lawyer. Don’t let them scare you off just because they have lawyer. Your name is different than theirs. Fight!
Is Nomadic Movement we watch a registered business or just social media? They are not even operating in the USA.
So sorry to hear this guys 😢. I went through the exact thing with my business. Whether they have a case should really depend on what class their trademark is in. I am assuming apparel. Considering your travel, worst case you may have to stop selling merch. Either way YOU MUST GET REPRESENTATION! If only to send them a letter. Good luck!
OMG, I just looked up their trademark and they just filed it. It’s not even a trademark yet and you have been using it for 2 years. There is no way they could win a case. Still, get representation!!
Disclaimer: The following is not legal advice. Guys, take a deep breath and don't stress yourselves out. You should be fine. You are not being sued let's start with that. Don't rush into changing your names and do consult with a trademark lawyer to ensure what jurisprudence and legislation applies in your case. Where I am from, it is legally acceptable to use any business name, unless it has become widely associated with another business in the same industry. For example if your business does vlogging and sells clothes, but the other Nomadic Movement is a fast food restaurant, that won't be an issue because they are both different industries.
Who owned the name first? Don’t apologise, you’re re legally admitting you were wrong.
I’ve had this happen to me with a company in the same industry that I am in. The other companies name was part of a particular coffee that I do. The question is, is there a likelihood of confusion for the consumer between the two companies?If they are in a different industry there would not be confusion. That is the basis as I understand it for them to contest the name.
It sent this on their e-commerce site:
Hi,
Nice product line, and good price points. I wouldn't have discovered you if is wasn't for The Nomadic Movement.
You should each put a note on your pages the "Nomadic Movement and The Nomadic Movement" are not affiliated, but we appreciated each other's work."
Lawyers are never good for anyone. It would be great if you would choose otherwise.
Thank-you.
Do they have a copyright or a trademark? If they have a trademark, you need to change the name. Adding a "the" is not enough. In these disputes, it comes down to first use. I run an internet consulting company and I consult on issues like this.
How about nomadic movers that is close enough to your original name, and would still be found and would be different enough, but check with the patent and trade mark office through an attorney to make sure that the new name you choose is available. Definitely talk with an attorney.
Better get a lawyer son, better get a reaaaaaaaaal good one ... and take the video down, next they will be suing you for slander, especially as you have posted there web address in your description
Did you search the copyright and trademark database? It’s public record so if they do indeed have the name either copy written or trademarked it will state it, and it will also state when they were officially done. If the date they were granted trademark or copyright over the name (not date of filing, but date granted to them, can be a year+ after filing), and you guys used the name for business purposes before then, you can fight freely with the upper hand. But did you guys ever file a business license name under The nomadic Movement? If so, obtain a copy of that and any other early records of using the name to show you used it for businesses purposes first.
I thought I heard you say you sell some of their merchandise, that could be construed as trading off their name. Perhapes you can work out some kind of deal as a distributor ???
Get a lawyer dig your heels in and keep your name!!!
May be a costly futile effort. I would highly recommend a bit of homework first.
Copyright © 2017 Nomadic Movement - All Rights Reserved. Found this on their website. Now who has the earlier date in 2017? They do have a hat in one of their pictures that says nomadic movement est. 2013 so looks like it might .....
A lawyer is the best bet. When I do a search for Nomadic Movement on the copyright site, I get no results. I am in no way an expert, or lawyer, but I don't see it. That being said, talk to a lawyer. It will be well worth the money to make sure you aren't being had! I do agree with some others that it might be they are capitalizing on your success. I noticed the grammar errors from the lawyer as well and question its legitimacy. Find a lawyer!
If it’s a copyrighted name, you have no choice; you’ll have to change your name.
Get advice from a lawyer not the internet. Also, just do Kaylee & Jordan’s Nomadic Movement. Done!
You’re right. Something isn’t right about that letter. It’s very unprofessional. There are a lot of grammar and punctuation errors. Someone in the comments stated they know a lawyer. Check into that.
Sometimes that stuff is a scare tactic. Pretty much have a lawyer send them a letter back saying " THE" nomadic movement says go screw yourself in a lawyer professional way and they should drop it.
Start a crowdfunding page for the legal costs if it's going to take a fight - I don't mind donating and I'm sure others wouldn't mind. It seems from the evidence you've given us that this can be won and they're just bullying you so their application, which was only filed on July 26th 2019, can go through. They can't file for a trademark if somebody else is using the same name with a "The" prefix, regardless of who used it first, as they didn't have a trademark in place when you used that name, so they have no fight and are probably going to lose their registration fees. They're not even claiming it as a trademark by using (TM) until such time they can get it registered and use (R), which is daft and doesn't help their case at all.
I'll donate too
Just a thought, after everyone gets their panties unwadded... They sell hats, sunglasses and outdoor gear and you guys wear hats, sunglasses and outdoor gear... See where I'm going here? If they are legit (and you should confirm that) you guys have a huge following. Seems to me there could easily be some common interest here. I enjoy you guys and wish you luck and if you have to change your name, won't matter to me.
As many others have said, you need to contact a lawyer ASAP. Perhaps reach out to Leonard French here on RUclips, he deals with copyright and has covered many issues like this. Honestly though it is going to boil down to who used / registered the name or trademark first. If they used it before you folks, you don't really have a legal leg to stand on and will have to settle or change.
Well they had the name first ! Infringement! Grow up !!!
James Brede This is a source of income for them as they travel-clearly they can’t just stop doing that and by changing their name, they might have to drop their channel (I don’t know as I don’t have my own channel and know how that works), but they’d certainly lose views which could be a major problem for them. But I guess if you had grown up yourself, you’d have thought that out before leaving such a rude and ininsightful comment.
@@youfinallyfoundwaldo1364 excuse, excuse! It doesn't matter! The should have registered there name before they started the channel! The other company had the name first. That's just the way it is! You-tube is miss informing people on how to start up a channel! Your not to bright yourself!
James Brede OMG your spelling errors lol I’m assuming you’re a kid who doesn’t understand how all this works at all.
The other company just now trademarked their own name, which is different than their name. This is a common happenstance as names are being used up. Thats why trademarks and copyrights are being used and bought up. They didn’t do anything wrong until possibly recently as the other company legalized their name by either a trademark or a copyright & this was their notice and attorneys don’t send email notices, so this just seems line a way to push them out of their own name,again, which is different than theirs and their business is no threat to the hat and clothing makers.
@@youfinallyfoundwaldo1364 you are so fucking wrong little kid !!! You sound like a Democrat !!!
Who knows if the company even wants to go this way, maybe their lawyer needed some more money. Anyway, however this plays out, to me it gives a bad impression about that company. I'll keep watching your adventures anyway. (Minus the yoga sessions 😉)
I’m sorry if I’m off in my thinking.
I have see channels with small subscriber numbers get sponsored.
Why wouldn’t they just capitalize on this and sponsor you?
Realistically this number of people calling the BBB filing complaints and bad Google and Facebook reviews or the same group buying their products?
See if they want to sponsor one of your videos. There is no way an online apparel retailer can be harmed by a youtube channel about van life. They would gain zero by suing you, but if they sponsor your video they get noticed by a hundred thousand potential customers.
Contact Lenard French here on RUclips. Their trademark appears to be registration in July of 2019. If your channel is older than that then you were first. Also there is no market usurpation as long as you are not selling hats and T-shirt’s. But contact Lenard he is a real attorney.
Always google the name to see if someone already has it before going with it. This is why.
Actually, they can’t copyright a name. Second, they can only register a trademark. You aren’t infringing on their trade mark because you don’t sell hats nor do you use their trademark. I would contact a lawyer to respond officially because they might sue you thinking you wouldn’t defend yourself. You can’t trademark common words and nomadic movement is in common usage. You can trademark the image or design of those words arranged a certain way in a logo. You’re safe unless you steal their logo, LOL.
Hi , We had a boutique and we had to cheq if the name someone had the same. Our boutique was boutik Wave. I am in Canada i dont nowk what is it in US.
But i think we could have take it if it was rote The Wave. Us was Boutik Wave.
Don't take advice from someone else's lawyer. They will lie to you to get the outcome they desire. Get your own lawyer ASAP.
You need not apologize for anything. This sort of thing happens more frequently than you might imagine. There likely is zero real "harm" currently being experienced by the other "Nomadic Movement" entity but they are obviously aggressive in seeking to "protect" their trademark to allegedly avoid "confusion" between its business and other entities out there operating under a similar name. It is all about them operating as a moneyed business. As others have advised, you should have at least an initial consultation with an intellectual property attorney who is experienced with such matters (as most IP lawyers are...same with the firm I am associated with) and get a better idea of your options. Much good luck and hopefully this will all be in your nomadic rearview mirror soon.
I can’t see if they have a bar number listed… If they don’t they are not real, anyone can claim to be a lawyer without a bar number listed
PS - Based on personal experience, if you have been using the name longer than them -- and you guys show up a LOT in searches for "nomadic movement," while they do not -- and they filed for trademark afterwards, there's an excellent chance they need *your* permission to use the name. Again, GET A LAWYER.
This is just unfortunate. They seem to be a legit business. Even though their trademark was just registered, their website began in 2017 and facebook page in 2013. If you want to fight I would take down this post and contact a lawyer directly. But it will cost a lot of money up front and cause much inconvenience & interruption to your lifestyle. You said you didn't want to come back to the country and go to court. You guys are such nice loving people and not "fighters." Going through a legal battle will wear you out. If it's really important to you then you should. IMHO, you might want to consider changing name and move on. It will be inconvenient and may affect your income, but probably not as bad as choosing to fight. Continue to follow your passion and dream - I have no doubt you'll come out stronger in the end. And look into register that new name :-) Love you guys.
You cannot Trademark a disparaging word.
"Nomad" is akin to the word vagrant..
Case dismissed!
Seriously, consult a lawyer if you really want to keep your name alive.
Good Luck.
maybe put your names in front of the phrase "nomadic movement" ... not legal advice, just a suggestion. "Kaylee and Jordan's Nomadic Movement"
Excellent idea.
Absolutely! This would be best scenario in the case that they wanted to just change the name and move on. The Supertones were sued by another band with the same name, they changed their name to the Orange County Suoertones and that was a wrap! Of course it would have to be J before K 😜 jus cuz, the alphabet and all.
@@VinnieVan I'd put Kaylee first cuz she runs the show !!! LOL 🤣 j/k
Agreed; simple/effective...and in many ways, more personal.
Perfect Idea
I think that email is not an official way of sending legal documents, they should be mailed with registered mail or faxed.
It’s just letter of intent. It’s not a legal document.
No matter what happens, if you have to change names we’ll still be here!!
Alright, I really suggest you contact a lawyer.. even messaging Legal Zoom or something like that. But here is the thing -- they filed a trademark and then immediately sent you this notice. That looks like they trademarked a name *they knew* was already in use. Also, there are many stipulations based on the type of business you are. Your business is *nothing like* theirs, not even similar, not the same industry, nothing. Basically in a case like this they need to prove they can be "harmed" by you having the same name. That harm usually exists if they are competing businesses. I really suggest you do not give in to this immediately.
You are spot on there. Sounds like tha mouse trying to scare the elephant, especially if the just files and then sent this cease and desist letter!
But both sell T shirts...correct?
@@abundantlyclear it comes down to use. Who has been using the name longer. They could be using the name for 3 years and to tie this up and secure an easier, legal stance, trademark then sends cease and desist. Although, if they started using the name after you and they are trying to hold on to the name...they really have no right to it. There is the 80/20 rule and the t-shirt isnt their main business....its a portion
File for your own in your own State and put the date of first use. I agree with them as well.
I think they're better off changing their name to something they can get a domain name on, then building their own website they will be promoting.
I'm not a lawyer, but I worked at a top 50 law firm for 20+ years. Forwarding your video to a copyright/trademark lawyer that I know. Good Luck!
There is none. You will and have to pay. That's the law. If u didn't check when u named the channel. That's on you.
@@alldayidreamaboutsteak551 liar looked looney it’s still the nomadic movement
They just recently filed this trademark on July 26, 2019, probably for the express purpose of preparing a cease and desist. I would talk to a lawyer. You can definitely demonstrate (with proof) that you were using the trademark long before they filed. I think that matters.
Yes, that matters a ton to the analysis!! If they started using the mark first, they have the rights to it. And it looks like the application they filed is related to apparel only so they really can't ask them to stop using the name in relation to this RUclips channel...I hope they get in touch with a good trademark attorney!
Trademarks don’t work like that. This isn’t the first time someone has done this. Once something is trademarked it’s locked down. If you don’t trademark yourself you run the risk of this happening
William Stru as a trademark attorney I can tell you it’s a lot more nuanced than that. There are common law rights that do matter if you’re the first to use whether you file for a federal registration or not. Your rights are limited but they are there and they will be protected by a court. The US is a first to use not first to register jurisdiction. Whether or not that’s the case here I don’t know I haven’t done the analysis they aren’t my clients. I’m just saying those are general trademark rules.
Waybackmachine their website to confirm that they have established historic precedent... using the name before you did. Yes the seo thing is a good argument from their side... all they really have to stand on legally since your name has dominant search visibility. If it were me, i would issue a press release and try to get picked up by media. You have a good story and public opinion matters. I would write back with a response like, "Do whatever you think is fair and just. We don't sell hats or sunglasses. And we've been using the name for ___ days prior to you filing for trademark. Lots of luck to you in your legal pursuits! ✌"
@@sbair8 I took a look at a whois database. They registered their domain back in 2015. What Shannon said will probably hold out for the butt munchers as Shannon has already pointed out. I was involved in a similar situation. I was served with a cease and desist order, a VERY lengthy corporate worded one too. Even though the other guys had a "registered" trademark and a very active website and where WAY bigger than me, I was able to prove that I was first to use the name, years before they did. I produced a few emails and some bank info with my company name. They ate crow, I won.
I just saw your video and I would suggest that you find out when they started their company they might have taken your name
thomas anders but they didn’t file for a trademark legal ownership the clothing line did. That’s the difference.
@Joshua Zimmer The copyright date at the bottom of their website says 2017?
First of all, I'm not an attorney, but I've dealt with situations like this before. Copyright is not the issue, and the date they list on their website doesn't matter for this purpose. The trademark that they applied for several months ago, but was officially registered on July 26, 2019 is the issue. They've obviously been planning to do this the instant their trademark was registered. Their LLC was registered in 2014.
However, trademark filings have to be very specific for a reason. I can launch a company today called Nomadic Movement and sell chocolate bars(assuming a company named Nomadic Movement isn't already doing so and trademarked the name). There's nothing to stop the hat and apparel-selling Nomadic Movement from sending me a cease and desist letter threatening me, but there's also nothing to stop me from using it as toilet paper.
Trademark infringement becomes an issue when there is reasonable confusion in the marketplace. I don't see anyone looking for headwear and getting confused by two people traveling the world in a van. In the same case, I don't see anyone looking for info on traveling the world in a van and giving up because they are so confused by seeing a hat company with a similar name.
The fact that they also travel the world is irrelevant when it comes to trademark infringement.
In my non-legal opinion, as long as you don't sell any of the items listed in their trademark, there is no basis for you to need to change your name. If I were you, I'd call their bluff and respond, preferably through an attorney, with evidence as to how your name that you've been using since 2017 causes no conflict with their trademark. If you have the funds, I'd also file your own US trademark application for your name and purpose.(just don't list anything related to selling apparel)
Don't let them bully/scare you into changing your name. If they were smart, rather than threaten you, they would arrange a sponsorship agreement. You'd make some money, and they'd sell more of their merchandise. If they really make "Quality products for quality people", then I can think of no better brand ambassadors than you guys.
@@lukew9036 this is a really good answer.
@@lukew9036 Good points.
You guys are making them famous. Screw it use your owe names like Trent & Ally. We’re gonna Love 💕 you any way.
Hang in there guys, love your channel and will follow regardless of the name. I love the name and understand how you feel but it’s the two of you that make the channel GREAT!
Went to their web page at bottom it says copyright @ 2017 that in itself is fraud if they only filed a few days ago!
that could mean the website is copyrighted not the actual products they sell though or the name
Thats the date of that particulary webpage. not the company.
The trademark is from 2014, the company is legitimate.
@@1bike10 , The trademark was filed on 07-29-2019 that is according to the Colorado secretary of state.
Jordan & Kaylee,
This is uncle Alex . Been following you. I had a company from CA contact me a few years ago with a similar name to my business. Their business had nothing to do with what I do in my business and therefore we were not competitors. That's what makes the difference in these matters. After alerting them of this they did not pursue any litigation. I believe this is the case here. Still check with a specialist in these matters. All the best to you guys. Stop in FL sometime in your travels.
I'm not a laywer, but from my understanding this should be the case too. Two companies can have the same name, but different industries. Also, common words or phrases cant be copywrited, with I believe the exception of big company's that have been around so long their business name basically becomes a word and everyone recognizes it as so. So I dont think either company has the right to trademark 'nomadic' and 'movement'. Another point, their logo isnt similar, either business isnt trying to bounce off each other.
Just for future reference, you shouldn't apologize to someone who is suing you because you are admitting fault to something.
That's just who they are, sweet, loving, and peaceful. 💑✌❤
@@sararomans9626 but that lawyer don't care ☹
That was my first thought!!
yes plz this, plz take this down lol.
Same is true in all matters legal. Keep your mouth shut. Bite your tongue. NEVER ADMIT FAULT
I don't know for sure but I do know a couple I watch changed their name and it automated switch for me so youtube may do it but I showed no interruption in my viewing. I enjoy your channel and your trips.
This has scam written all over it. First the spelling/ grammar mistakes would never come from a ligit lawyer. Second the file date. Fight it. Don't give in
Steve Moor legit* lol
exactly
grammer errors.... that is not true.... I can show many true law firm errors... BAD ones too. Even calling Treble Damages as Trouble Damages... LOL
Often the law secretaries write the letters.
Definitely make sure this is legit. I am a biz owner and many, many years ago, I received a letter in the mail from a lawyer about being sued for using copyrighted pictures on my website. They were also requesting an outrageous amount of money.... long story short, I ignored all the letters that followed has I had deleted the pictures they were claiming were copyrighted. A few years passed by and we suddenly hear about this going around and being a scam. Some people got taken by sending them thousands of dollars..... Just saying all this because I want you to make sure the letter is truly legit.
Feels like maybe they're attempting to capitalize on your success.
Totally agree!
It’s copyright so it’s someone else’s intellectual property. They should have checked first. I’m not surprised this happened.
Annelise Bozmarov True... but sometimes when you start a RUclips Channel.. you just don’t know that it is going to grow that quickly....
This. Take this video down friends.
If they wanted to capitalize on their success, they wouldn't have registered the name and had an attorney issue a cease and desist. In this game, it's all about how Google indices the name. This site comes up first in Google searches and that in and of itself can hamper their business monetarily and this is what this is all about.
"El Movimiento Nomadic " Perfect
Jejeje
Contact a lawyer friends.
What gets me is that they waited until your channel started gaining some real success before they decided to care. Something does seem off. I hope things work out in your favor 💗.
Exactly
...it might have only just come to their attention
@@keltic_nomad They asked us to stop using #nomadicmovement on our instagram posts 2 years ago
They just filed for the trademark July 26th at the USPTO. But in the US the law favors whoever used the trademark in commerce first, not who filed first. If you really want to fight this you need to hire an attorney, as there are more considerations than just that.
@@NomadicMovement with that they can say that already warning you about the name and you didn´t care.
Seen this happen a lot with forum owners, did a whois lookup on that domain and it's been registered since 2015. Register your name with "the" if you want a lawyer and fight, or register a new name and chalk it up to lesson learned.
My name suggestion (future proof): The Real Nomadic Movement
Take this video down now. do not replay this video. You are being scammed hard here.
Tinch jajaja tu abuela.
What about “ The Nomad Movement “ or The Nomadic Couple “.
Exploring Nomad or “Our Nomadic Movement”
theslag1978 they’d probably still get crap because it includes “nomadic movement” which is what the company seems pissy about
Yep I the The Nomad Movement, and get the name copywritten👍
Or "Nomads On The Move" !
@@kellycarlington6996 this name came to mind for me, too. I like it, and think it fits the channel perfectly.
No matter the name we will all still support and continue to be glued to your videos 👌
I'd still love you guys even if your name was Protein Fart.
Sorry, but I own Protein Fart. Ask my wife.
Okay, first... they filed this trademark - 4 FRIGGIN DAYS AGO ... looking for a bit more info...
If that's the case they should file their own cease and desist
which may show cause for getting the trademark to specifically target you and the brand you have built...not saying they are or did...but smells fishy and could be mentioned in your defence...
also make them prove their sales are worldly as they are saying in the letter...have them prove to you that a large portion of their sales go to worldwide customer base...i just checked their website and then don't even ship outside the USA pfffff so how does this affect worldwide and could be in some way affiliated with your business of travelling world wide...honestly i feel they are stretching that you both are in any way similar...and affect each other...
Trademark approval takes time and the others hold ownership to the brand name. Y’all could have filed the same trademark filing but you didn’t so I think you will lose in this battle. The courts will ask why y’all didn’t file trademark legal filing. I hate giving you bad news.
@@bentleynixonbrooklyn7887 and they were using nomadicmovementcolorado.com in late 2016 and transferred to nomadicmovement.com in early 2017, with redirects both ways in place too so likely owned both domains from at least April 2015. You can see this at archive.org. They need legal counsel but will probably lose due to precedence in commerce. (IANAL.)
I am the founder of Trademark Factory®. I watched your video and looked at the demand letter you received. Sent you an email.
Hey no fair! We want to know what's going on!!!! :o)
Be nice if you shared that info Trademark Factory. Most of why im reading through this barrage of useless info is in hopes I can learn something from someone like you who may actually have some expertise in the subject!
You have not been Sued, YET. You were given a threat that is a call to action. I got one too that was ridiculous. Do some research to find when they started copyright date compared to when you went public. You apologized at 4:05 for doing damage to this other company, why, what when and how? This is a Civil matter which means the Judge has to side with their claim if Judge 51% probability of damage. Burden of Proof of the Damage is on them. Sounds like a Advertising opportunity for them. It is working because I live in Colorado and have never heard of them till now.
The proof is in the pudding, who had the name in "use" first dates r important with certifiable proofs before you panic you can respond with more inquiries. I believe you need to know that trademark and copyright are two distinct areas. I also believe you HAVE NOT infringed on their trademark under the laws and cases under Federal case law. Find out what states this attorney is registered to practice in and get a clear understanding in what court he intends to file in. In my opinion "only opinion you also have some protected rights under intellectual property. laws and precedents because of your present location not being in Colorado, If they do attempt to sue you You very possibly can seek an extension of any case . First eliminate your fear factor, by understanding your rights, deal with an intellectual property expert in the field of law, understand these things done right don't resolve overnight.PS. you may also think about counter suing the plaintiff if they haven't dotted all their i's and crossed their' t's .
Absolutely!! I would definitely look into countersueing and I'm sure if your attorney says that it's your name since y'all used it first!! Best of luck and would love to know what happened with this?? Or the follow up video.. God Bless y'all! 🙏🏻🤗✌
I think you should take down this video and contact a lawyer, this video might harm your case.
READ!! According to my research, 2 companies can have the same name(trademarked) and it is okay as long as they are operating in 2 different services. So your RUclips channel name might be able to remain the same, but your merch/website name might have to change because they trademarked the name for "headwear; namely, hats and caps; hoodies; shorts; t-shirts; tank tops; hooded sweatshirts" so, if worst comes to worst, you might only have to change your merch/website name, which wont be that bad considering most people click on the link from your videos rather than searching it up.
This is absolutely TRUE
WOW. Good luck! 🤞 We all will definitely be able to find you guys still though!! Stay strong 🙏
you might want to keep what your doing a secret … ie no more posts on here in public that tell us (them) what your doing :)
Just add an 's'.
As in: "The Nomadic Movements."
I will waive my legal consultation fee there...
You probably don’t want to admit to harming their business in a video, whether you did or not. Maybe take this down or re edit. Good luck.
Agree....this looks like you are admitting gulity and a slick attorney will use your words against you.
I disagree...they are being open and honest as they always are.
@@IG8282-q9h how many times have you been sued on this matter? Do you personally know anyone who has? I do and that is why I replied like I did
@@lisastierwalt2636 I have been sued and it was not a fun experience. Their response is not an admission of guilt. They are being honest as they always are in their vids. They are just laying everything out and being transparent, there is nothing wrong with that. It would however be problematic if this did escalate to court and found to be untrue about something.
Ian Gilbert “Open and honest” can be held against you in a court...not kidding.
I see they just filed 7-26-19 for "Nomadic Movement" you will need a good Lawyer, this falls into an area where you have been put into a trap by unscrupulous individuals. Don't put up with this ! I hope you stand up for yourselves and Lawyer up and stop them in their tracks. Any judge will see what they are up too.
I agree