Yeah ... DCS kind of first broke my entusiasm for hand controls for years as VR pilot ...... and then "VTOL VR" actually repaired my entusiasm as I believe that is the way to actually implement it. (Either that, or mixed reality like the viperwing guys showed here on youtube should hopefully be doable with quest3 one day)
I’d love to get rid of my mouse to click things in the cockpit… Hand tracking is clearly the best solution as it gives more immersion… thanks for the video
Flightsims without any sort of hotas dont work well as long as there is no haptic feedback for handtracking. I tried with hands or controller. VTOL works best, but its controller only. When combining hands (or controller) with a hotas, there is allways anything in the way in reallife being youre desk, the stick etc. Its not like rl where you just feel and grab the switch while looking outside. You have to look at it while trying to find the right spot. Holding stick and throttle with hands only is super sensitive and tiersome after just a view minutes. I crashed a lot because of that. Grabbing a switch on my hotas in vr is actually much easier even if I cant see it. Lots of potential, yes, but a long way to go. Besides that, it has a very low priority with devs. Dont get me wrong. I like this kind of things. Just not there yet.
Yeah I hope they get it working smoothly one day, but in the meantime, I'll continue to enjoy my PointCtrl FCUs. As an early adopter, who got one of the original batches four years ago, I still use them on every DCS session. I'll tell you... currently it's the best thing you can use in DCS for VR. So good that I'm on the list for a new set, Version 2 (which has a smaller profile). The waiting list is a year or two, which tells you two things. 1. How good they are. 2. Miles's small production team could probably use a lot more employees 😂 Manipulating controls, switches, buttons, inputting data in the MPD/DDI, UFC, Radios, opening and closing the canopy, etc is so natural and intuitive, you forget that you even have a mouse or trackball on your desktop lol. The immersion is incredible! Works via the mouse pointer, so it's compatible with any VR headset. I'm currently using the Varjo Aero, which is an amazing unit. But yeah, hand tracking that works properly would be the perfect solution and would eliminate the need to wear physical hardware on your fingers. That's the only drawback to PointCtrl.
Someday we will get full hand control. I've have been on the list to purchase PointCtrl for over a year with another year or so to go before its my turn to buy.
As an early adopter who got one of the original batches, and still use them on every DCS session, I'll tell you it's the best thing you can use for VR. So good that I'm on the list for a new set, Version 2
Can you show usplease how you set ut up???i can get rhe hand tracking all working until i load into the game itself the the hands are there but they are just suspended in thelastposition befire game started.i then have to pick controllers up and can only gain controll over the visible hands by using the controllers...??????
i think you should use you're touch controllers just like i do having vtol vr bindings in dcs cause u can feel when you touch the stick or the throttle it vibrates...
I went down a rabbit hole trying to get this working. Here's a summation of what I THINK I needed to do to get it working. * MAJOR - you need to sign your account up as a Developer in Meta/Oculus - this allows the handtracking to pass through from the headset to PCVR * Once you have signed up - you need to enable developer modes - I'm not sure if you need to do it in all 3. Headset/ Meta Phone App and Meta PC App. But I'm pretty sure you need to at the very least enable Developer features in your PC Meta App under settings/beta. * Run DCS in OpenXR mode - not through SteamVR. - I'm running my Quest in Airlink mode - haven't tried Quest link/Virtual desktop/ALVR modes yet. * In DCS - Settings>VR Enable "TRACKERS" as the hand controller method. (Not CONTROLLERS) * Make sure all the Settings>Special hand modes are disabled (Ultraleap etc) * In fact, I uninstalled my Ultraleap software in case that was conflicting. That should show your hands up as models in the Menu, then it's up to you if you want to have pointers or just be able to touch switched in game.
hoe heb je het knoppen aanraken aan het werken gekregen? heb ook de quest 3 en ik zie mn handen zoals in je video. Maar ik krijg de interactie met de knoppen niet aan het werken.
Ha Kris, bedankt voor je reactie. In opties onder VR moet je even het hokje uitvinken " only interact when having fist " of iets dergelijks. Hopelijk werkt dat!
Without any kind of physical stop points and feedback, I don't think this kind of hand tracking is well suited to trying precisely move around some virtual plane joystick as per your example case, but I think it will be great for general hand gesture stuff that people want to use in whatever "social" app and the like. It will also be fine for more course swingy based stuff like a boxing game and such. Proper controllers and sticks and the like will pretty much always be required for the rest, at least if you actually want any kind of precision and reliability and the game/app isn't just about rough gestures.
I used to use my LeapMotion hand/finger tracking like this on the HP Reverb G2. I was sure there was an option in the settings to make the hands disappear if you touch the actual hotas controls, so there wasn't any interference. The immersion I get from using my actual hands and fingers in the plane is amazing! (you should try the startup for the P-51 with hands, it works really well) If it was more reliable, I would use it all the time. But it does jank out. And things like turn dials don't work very well at all. I imagine that Eagle Dynamics just don't have the manpower to put into this implementation as its a niche within a niche.
handtracking could be a thing, if software improves to the point where you dont accidentally flip switches, you can flip the switches you want on the first try everytime AND, if there are haptic feedback gloves that let you know you've flipped a switch without looking at it. those gloves should also not hinder normal hotas operations. then i'd say that would be amazing. otherwise i'll stick to my mouse pointer, hotas, pedals and VR to fly DCS, works well enough and i dont really mis any switches when i click
This are amazing but obviously during combat those thubs can be frustrating...so basically the best idea is to use this when u fly solo without any threat
In combat you are not suppose to move your hands away from throttle and stick. In WW2 birds that is challenging, as you don't have HOTAS designs. But with modern ones you do it that way. That is why you use real joystick and throttle/collective, and you need to learn to adapt to danger/action before it happens, so you have prepared systems ready for the combat and you can keep hands on HOTAS. If someone jumps on you, it means you already made an error and you should flee as you were not ready for it.
the hand tracking in dcs is relative to the mobules ive seen the handtracking work well in some aircraft not good in others it will only get better in time
Cockpit buttons, switches and levers work differently as in real world. The DCS hands are having currently just 1 or 2 mouse button modes, depending your wrist angle. So your finger is normally just a left mouse button, and to do right click you need to twist wrist to get right click. And that cause problems, as we are lacking mouse wheel or middle mouse button to operate any axis. As in "click and drag" or "scroll". That would require DCS hand to have a possibility for a pinching with index finger and thumb to "grab" something, like you can do in VTOL VR (grab tip of the switch, lever etc). What we are as well missing from VTOL VR, is a "magnetic fingertip" that would move slightly the pointing index finger to closest button/switch to indicate visually that if you do something, it will operate that one. And I believe ED should copy the VTOL VR cockpit interaction functionality for hand tracking. Form a L (a finger gun) sideways to track your index finger tip, and then use thumb to trigger presses or grabbing, and then use hand movement to action the manipulated object. If it is a button, it will press it. If it is switch, it will flip it to direction of movement, if it is lever/axis it will grab it and move along the axis range. As long the DCS hand would match your real hand when you are not manipulating things, it would feel natural. The DCS cockpits are requiring developers to redesign the buttons, switches and levers to be usable in VR. As right now all the buttons or switches has no input boxes properly to be usable with DCS finger. And only some switches, like one in the Apache CWM panel, has the capability detect the direction of the finger. And some, like Hornet, accepts to enter coordinates via UFC with index finger, but not with thumb. It is a mess, but mostly we need the "pinch" gesture to work that we can grab all axis levers and sliders in virtual cockpit. And that all switches operate only 1 time per 0.5-1 seconds, when we touch them with index finger, even nicer if we could use the proper direction. Or even point the label in the panel to get switch in that position!
DCS why do you fail at VR/really anything controls related so badly? Like VTOL VR hands with vuirtual desktop works fine you just can't use your thumbs for some reason.
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Yeah ... DCS kind of first broke my entusiasm for hand controls for years as VR pilot ...... and then "VTOL VR" actually repaired my entusiasm as I believe that is the way to actually implement it. (Either that, or mixed reality like the viperwing guys showed here on youtube should hopefully be doable with quest3 one day)
well thanks for not showing people how to set it up...!
i agree
Do you think hand tracking In VR has any potential?
I think that if manual tracking was implemented along with the controls it would be perfect, it would be like the valve index controls.
I’d love to get rid of my mouse to click things in the cockpit… Hand tracking is clearly the best solution as it gives more immersion… thanks for the video
Yep, just need haptic gloves for fb
@@0QualityOverQuantity yeah man I cant get it to work either and its so annying when these youtubers dont reply to their viewers.
Will this work with MSFS ?
Care to explain how did you enable it?
Go to VR settings and on the top right side it says something like “use controllers”. Click on the dropdown and click “use hand tracking”
I'm currently building a VR 'touch' panel for a piper, which from testing I find more immersive.
How did you make it work? Followed a bunch of a few months tutorials but they don't work at all with the quest 3 since some dcs update
yes please tell us quest 3 user how to.
Launch with OpenXR, and in DCS vr settings look for controllers type(optical; physical) something like that.
Flightsims without any sort of hotas dont work well as long as there is no haptic feedback for handtracking. I tried with hands or controller. VTOL works best, but its controller only. When combining hands (or controller) with a hotas, there is allways anything in the way in reallife being youre desk, the stick etc. Its not like rl where you just feel and grab the switch while looking outside. You have to look at it while trying to find the right spot. Holding stick and throttle with hands only is super sensitive and tiersome after just a view minutes. I crashed a lot because of that. Grabbing a switch on my hotas in vr is actually much easier even if I cant see it. Lots of potential, yes, but a long way to go. Besides that, it has a very low priority with devs. Dont get me wrong. I like this kind of things. Just not there yet.
Does it work for quest 2?
yes i think so, try it
DCS crashes on me when I try to activate hand tracking from my quest 3 in the vr tab in DCS
Yeah I hope they get it working smoothly one day, but in the meantime, I'll continue to enjoy my PointCtrl FCUs. As an early adopter, who got one of the original batches four years ago, I still use them on every DCS session. I'll tell you... currently it's the best thing you can use in DCS for VR. So good that I'm on the list for a new set, Version 2 (which has a smaller profile). The waiting list is a year or two, which tells you two things. 1. How good they are. 2. Miles's small production team could probably use a lot more employees 😂
Manipulating controls, switches, buttons, inputting data in the MPD/DDI, UFC, Radios, opening and closing the canopy, etc is so natural and intuitive, you forget that you even have a mouse or trackball on your desktop lol. The immersion is incredible! Works via the mouse pointer, so it's compatible with any VR headset. I'm currently using the Varjo Aero, which is an amazing unit. But yeah, hand tracking that works properly would be the perfect solution and would eliminate the need to wear physical hardware on your fingers. That's the only drawback to PointCtrl.
Maybe this would work better in conjunction with a program that guesses what you are trying to do.
Someday we will get full hand control. I've have been on the list to purchase PointCtrl for over a year with another year or so to go before its my turn to buy.
As an early adopter who got one of the original batches, and still use them on every DCS session, I'll tell you it's the best thing you can use for VR. So good that I'm on the list for a new set, Version 2
Can you show usplease how you set ut up???i can get rhe hand tracking all working until i load into the game itself the the hands are there but they are just suspended in thelastposition befire game started.i then have to pick controllers up and can only gain controll over the visible hands by using the controllers...??????
my hands don't show yet it does shoe the symbols when i pinch my fingers which is really annoying
i think you should use you're touch controllers just like i do having vtol vr bindings in dcs cause u can feel when you touch the stick or the throttle it vibrates...
How do you make it work in DCS?
I went down a rabbit hole trying to get this working. Here's a summation of what I THINK I needed to do to get it working.
* MAJOR - you need to sign your account up as a Developer in Meta/Oculus - this allows the handtracking to pass through from the headset to PCVR
* Once you have signed up - you need to enable developer modes - I'm not sure if you need to do it in all 3. Headset/ Meta Phone App and Meta PC App. But I'm pretty sure you need to at the very least enable Developer features in your PC Meta App under settings/beta.
* Run DCS in OpenXR mode - not through SteamVR. - I'm running my Quest in Airlink mode - haven't tried Quest link/Virtual desktop/ALVR modes yet.
* In DCS - Settings>VR Enable "TRACKERS" as the hand controller method. (Not CONTROLLERS)
* Make sure all the Settings>Special hand modes are disabled (Ultraleap etc)
* In fact, I uninstalled my Ultraleap software in case that was conflicting.
That should show your hands up as models in the Menu, then it's up to you if you want to have pointers or just be able to touch switched in game.
@@phunkaeg thank you, gotta try that!
I enjoy the hand tracking but my hands do not match were my throttle and joystick are. When I’m grabbing my stick my hand is on the planes dashboard.
Hand trackig also work without controlers ?
hoe heb je het knoppen aanraken aan het werken gekregen? heb ook de quest 3 en ik zie mn handen zoals in je video. Maar ik krijg de interactie met de knoppen niet aan het werken.
Ha Kris, bedankt voor je reactie. In opties onder VR moet je even het hokje uitvinken " only interact when having fist " of iets dergelijks. Hopelijk werkt dat!
Without any kind of physical stop points and feedback, I don't think this kind of hand tracking is well suited to trying precisely move around some virtual plane joystick as per your example case, but I think it will be great for general hand gesture stuff that people want to use in whatever "social" app and the like. It will also be fine for more course swingy based stuff like a boxing game and such. Proper controllers and sticks and the like will pretty much always be required for the rest, at least if you actually want any kind of precision and reliability and the game/app isn't just about rough gestures.
I have no idea, how to start it(
It does not work with steamVR. Oculus VR crashes on start
You did this with HTCC and oculusVR?
Or leapmotion or pointCTR?
It looks very cool though to see these precise hand/finger movements when we're so used to frozen or basic hand animations in video games
Does it works with quest 2?
I used to use my LeapMotion hand/finger tracking like this on the HP Reverb G2.
I was sure there was an option in the settings to make the hands disappear if you touch the actual hotas controls, so there wasn't any interference.
The immersion I get from using my actual hands and fingers in the plane is amazing! (you should try the startup for the P-51 with hands, it works really well)
If it was more reliable, I would use it all the time. But it does jank out. And things like turn dials don't work very well at all.
I imagine that Eagle Dynamics just don't have the manpower to put into this implementation as its a niche within a niche.
handtracking could be a thing, if software improves to the point where you dont accidentally flip switches, you can flip the switches you want on the first try everytime AND, if there are haptic feedback gloves that let you know you've flipped a switch without looking at it. those gloves should also not hinder normal hotas operations. then i'd say that would be amazing. otherwise i'll stick to my mouse pointer, hotas, pedals and VR to fly DCS, works well enough and i dont really mis any switches when i click
This doesn't work. What program are you using that enables full hand tracking?
It's so annoying when someone likes my comment but no comment from them. It's as annoying when a person ask for prayers on FB.
Hello!
Does this work with other VR glasses (for example Pico 3 / 4), too?
if it has camera
Need some haptic gloves and force feedback for your arms to replace physical joysticks/steering wheels.
Man I got behind on your videos. This is an awesome video you make such great vids
This are amazing but obviously during combat those thubs can be frustrating...so basically the best idea is to use this when u fly solo without any threat
In combat you are not suppose to move your hands away from throttle and stick.
In WW2 birds that is challenging, as you don't have HOTAS designs.
But with modern ones you do it that way.
That is why you use real joystick and throttle/collective, and you need to learn to adapt to danger/action before it happens, so you have prepared systems ready for the combat and you can keep hands on HOTAS.
If someone jumps on you, it means you already made an error and you should flee as you were not ready for it.
5 years... prob still be waiting for vulkan
the hand tracking in dcs is relative to the mobules ive seen the handtracking work well in some aircraft not good in others it will only get better in time
What is that game called
This game is called DCS - Digital combat simulator
It has great potential for Italians and that's about it.
underrated comment, the amount of times I've done the salt bae to reset my view is unbelievable
VTOL VR does it well....
Better to have a set of controllers that you have use as a flight stick and throttle...
Cockpit buttons, switches and levers work differently as in real world.
The DCS hands are having currently just 1 or 2 mouse button modes, depending your wrist angle.
So your finger is normally just a left mouse button, and to do right click you need to twist wrist to get right click.
And that cause problems, as we are lacking mouse wheel or middle mouse button to operate any axis. As in "click and drag" or "scroll". That would require DCS hand to have a possibility for a pinching with index finger and thumb to "grab" something, like you can do in VTOL VR (grab tip of the switch, lever etc).
What we are as well missing from VTOL VR, is a "magnetic fingertip" that would move slightly the pointing index finger to closest button/switch to indicate visually that if you do something, it will operate that one.
And I believe ED should copy the VTOL VR cockpit interaction functionality for hand tracking. Form a L (a finger gun) sideways to track your index finger tip, and then use thumb to trigger presses or grabbing, and then use hand movement to action the manipulated object. If it is a button, it will press it. If it is switch, it will flip it to direction of movement, if it is lever/axis it will grab it and move along the axis range.
As long the DCS hand would match your real hand when you are not manipulating things, it would feel natural.
The DCS cockpits are requiring developers to redesign the buttons, switches and levers to be usable in VR.
As right now all the buttons or switches has no input boxes properly to be usable with DCS finger.
And only some switches, like one in the Apache CWM panel, has the capability detect the direction of the finger.
And some, like Hornet, accepts to enter coordinates via UFC with index finger, but not with thumb.
It is a mess, but mostly we need the "pinch" gesture to work that we can grab all axis levers and sliders in virtual cockpit.
And that all switches operate only 1 time per 0.5-1 seconds, when we touch them with index finger, even nicer if we could use the proper direction. Or even point the label in the panel to get switch in that position!
'It's hard to get it up in VR'- LMFAO!
DCS why do you fail at VR/really anything controls related so badly? Like VTOL VR hands with vuirtual desktop works fine you just can't use your thumbs for some reason.
it looks difficult to handle the instruments, how can i win in a dogfight :))
Use Virtual Desktop you will see your hand too :) ....BUT like he said far form perfect :)
I think its more to get ur placements right of ur real world devices compared to the cockpit a think thats what this is more to achieve is it not
Someone way smarter then me needs to do a video on setting this up please.
I does not work correctly, you cant even press the buttons on the mfd
Software will improve and you will be able to do all of this with just hand tracking.
Yikes if hand tracking is that good I hope dirty people don’t make vr games
Vtol vr is the future and the present.