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Charlie I LOVE that you continue to explore and challenge your craft. First you tested and tossed out kneading. Next you proved salt doesn't kill yeast. Now you're taking on pre-heating. Thank you for bringing us along on this journey to improve the craft of bread-baking!
After watching this video, I was curious about the actual cost to run an oven and ran the numbers. Multiple internet sources suggest heating a typical oven at 450 degrees for an hour uses 2.4-3.0 kW. My electricity cost is $0.14 per kWh, so it would cost $0.34-0.42 an hour to operate the oven the full hour. And the oven would probably use less energy than that since it'll cycle on/off to maintain temp. Clearly, older inefficient ovens could draw more energy and local electricity costs will vary. I may skip preheating if it doesn't affect the outcome, but the potential cost savings is a lot less than I expected!
Videos like this are the main reason you are the best on RUclips. Not only do you give recipes and techniques, you are rather scientific about why and how. I love it!
I like the new style of video thumbnail. My most recent bread I baked in a cold oven and had the best oven spring ever; the bread was a 70% hydration boule.
I've been baking from cold since the start of the energy crisis 2 years ago and seeing other sourdough bakers on RUclips recommending that you may even get a better oven spring using this method, and I can honestly say it's the best change I've made to my bread baking since I started to make sourdough 5 years ago.
I hope you had a lot of people to eat it all. Thank you so much for making these tests. I feel that the home baking process is being turned on its head. Challenging the traditions is enlightening. No kneading, no KitchenAid, no pre-heating, no fussing. Weight and put everything in the bowl, mix well, slap it once in a while, shape and in the oven it goes for proofing and baking. BREAD FOR ALL !
I was wondering when you'll make one of your detailed videos about cold oven baking. As always, everything is wonderfully explained and captured, and I'm sure it will help many to elevate their bread baking game. This method was a game changer for me. I bake my bread, both sourdough and yeast, in a glass casserole with a lid. It doesn't only save on energy and time, but also, somehow, makes beautiful artisan-looking breads. I have to say, though, I didn't know you could use the cold oven method for sandwich bread, let alone focaccia and enriched rolls; I always wanted to try the latter, especially cinnamon rolls and babka. But, I always thought that, as they are not covered, the crust would set faster and prevent a good oven spring. Now, I can't wait to try it. Thanks for the inspiration!
4:40 "final proof took 4 hours due to cold kitchen".... Oregon here, my kitchen is often fairly cold. The OVEN LIGHT (if your oven has a light) keeps the oven a near-perfect temperature for quickly fermenting and proofing the loaves.
I hear this often, however my oven light will not stay on…..it only lasts a few minutes before automatically shutting off….its only a few years old so maybe they all do this now.
@@SunriseLAWI’m in Canada - it’s a gas oven ….lucky if I get 10 minutes with the light on…..plus it looks LED? Not even sure it would give off heat anyways. I’ve resorted to using a seed starting mat with a temp probe….works ok.
@@denaross a friend does a steam oven to proof and bulk ferment. She puts the bread in the oven and puts a vessel of boiled water in to create the warm (and moist) environment. Her loaves turn out beautifully here in frigid Utah winters.
Thanks for this!! I use the cold oven method for my cast iron sourdough. I do it because I don’t have to worry about out hot pans when I’m scoring the bread. I think you deserve to get yourself a nice oven!!!
Yeah, I've often wondered this myself, but when a far more experienced baker like yourself recommends pre-heating, we all tend to follow - until we expand our own experiences. Great comparisons and demonstration of results. Five minutes of extra cook time for most of the recipes, to achieve the same outcomes, is a significant energy saving. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge, I've learn more from your videos than I have from any other method.
I usually preheat my oven but not today! Your timing is perfect. I have a loaf that’s in its final proof before going into a Dutch oven. I will definitely try a cold oven. I live in Canada and it’s currently -13C with a windchill of -21C. Any amount saved on my electricity bill is welcome. Thank you for the video ❤ It just came out of the oven! Normally, I remove the lid after 30 minutes and bake an additional 8-10 minutes. When I lifted the lid after the initial 30 minutes, I thought it needed a little more time so I added another 10 minutes with the lid on. The loaf has risen to its usual height. Can’t wait to have a slice! FYI My oven takes 30 minutes to reach 230C /450F.
Excellent.... BTW, I have always had the last 20 - 30 minutes of proofing in the Tins or........ in the Oven as it gets up to temperature from COLD. And as you say, apart from Pizza dough etc, it works and saves resources. Win - Win. Thank you for this.
This is so exciting, thank you so much for making this video. My mom definitely used to avoid baking because of the electricity costs. This is incredible, i'll definitely try it.
Love this video - the end results are quite surprising. Thank you for taking the time to make this and share with us. With all of my baking, I wonder how much electricity costs I will save using this method? 😉
I usually preheat but only until it reaches temperature so I was surprised when you video appeared in my feed. As always I really appreciate that you don’t take things for granted and question, question, question. I’ll definitely try not preheating at all. You are really the best baker on RUclips. Thank you.
The fun thing is that darker, more rye-heavy breads baked LTLT (rúgbrauð, pumpernickel, бородинский) don't profit from preheating basically at all, so if you bake for more than one household (which is the most economic way of home baking anyway), put a batch of dark breads into the cold oven, bake white breads like baguettes and pitas (also south asian style breads meant to be baked in a clay oven) directly afterwards. The oven is already warm, and since brighter breads are less dense, you put less cold mass in (meaning you cool the oven down less). At last, do meringue and souflee style pastries, because those absolutely require to go in a hot oven :) lovely video as always!
I just wanted to say a huge THANK YOU for all of your information on bread making! Cold proofing has changed our family's life, knowing also that we can get similar benefits to sourdough bulk ferments with commercial/active dry yeast with this method. Cheers!
Thank you so much for this. When I started, years ago, this is exactly what I did. Just put the dough in a cold oven. But then I started reading a book, saying "I'm not a drier, I'm a baker! -Preheat to 240° then lower to 190° when you slide in the loaf". And that's what I did, for all those years... Thanks for thinking outside of the (preheated) box!
it works with just abut any baking :) I found out as a youngster just about anything you put in the oven doesn't exactly require a preheated oven. you can just put almost anything into an oven and turn it on, you just have to bake it a little longer ;) but yes, the preheating for just a few minutes is basically what I do too. I tell ppl this and they tell me im crazy, good to get some vindication lol. thankyou again Chain :) your videos have added much needed rewarding ability and understanding to my life
WoW! I never heated my oven for the recommended 45 minutes usually put bread in when oven dinged that temperature was ready. Even sometimes turned oven off when putting bread in and put it back on after 8 - 10 minutes, but starting off cold wow. You're the man.
Great information thanks for testing it out and will really help people in warmer climates but I do most of my baking in the winter so the extra heat does not go to waste. 😅
I put such emphasis on preheating the oven that I’ll do other things whilst the oven heats up, thinking the hotter the better. And I think it as far as a pizza stone is concerned, that’s true (like you say), but I definitely overemphasise the importance of preheating the oven based on your examples today. What a cracker video to start the year! 😂🎉
In Colorado, electricity costs 2.7 times the normal rate from 3-7pm M-F, soon to be 3-9pm. I usually bake on weekends, with two large breads (1.8 Kg dough) baked back-to-back in a Dutch oven. 2.75 hours total at 475°F.
What an excellent video! I've been wondering if/when you would dive into this... I haven't preheated my oven for a cast iron pan loaf in almost 3 years! I got "Bittman Bread", a cookbook about 100% whole-wheat sourdough, and Mark Bittman advocates for proofing your loaf in the baking vessel and starting from a cold oven. I was a little shocked at first, given the hard-and-fast rule of "always preheat your oven!" in the bread-baking realm. However, I was pleasantly surprised to find that all of my loaves turned out perfectly. While I use his cold oven method, I don't proof it in the pot like he suggests, instead following a process like Charlie describes here. I live in Utah, USA, where the summers can get quite hot, so not having to preheat is a blessing when a bread lover is stuck paying for air conditioning that is the only way to make things bearable. I do put them in ever so slightly under-proofed to avoid any over-proofing during the heat-up stage. But I think this is misplaced, since all of your loaves went in when perfectly proofed and turned out fantastic. I'll be adjusting my method slightly with your trial results in mind. It is interesting that your oven only has a top heating element. Mine, and most others in the US (doesn't matter gas vs. electric) have bottom heating elements. I end up having a more cooked bottom of my loaf where yours gets more cooked on top. For other folks in the US, this is my method for the cold oven since Charlie's oven is so different from what we home cooks have: My oven claims that it gets to 450°F/232°C in under 10 minutes, so I put the loaf in the pan, score it, and put it in the cold oven right when I set the temperature. When it beeps to tell me it has reached temperature, I set my first timer for 30 minutes. This allows the oven to finish preheating with the lid on, and within those 30 minutes it reaches temperature according to my separate oven thermometer. After 30 minutes, I remove the lid, reduce the temperature to 425°F/218°C, and bake for another 15 minutes. When the 15-minute timer goes off, I take the loaf out of the pot and place it directly on the oven rack for another 5-10 minutes of baking to get the crust just right. (I'm using a high-sided cast iron Dutch oven, so this may vary if you're using a Challenger bread pan or the combo cooker like Charlie.) I use this same method with the same timings for a standard sandwich loaf!
I thought of sharing this, baked 2 days ago but put a temperature probe in the pre-heated oven & amazingly there was a drop of 60 degrees F when I opened the oven to put the bread in. It took it a while to reach again the 375 F I had set.
I remember requesting you to make a video about this a year ago! It’s great to see it finally happen! My oven usually becomes untouchably hot within 5 minutes, so I’ve always thought that 30 minutes of pre-heating is unnecessary. So, I never pre-heat my oven for more than 5-6 minutes, and I’ve never pre-heated my air fryer since it reaches the set temperature within a minute! I also have a suggestion for the title and thumbnail. As a non-native speaker, I wasn’t familiar with the term “cold oven.” I clicked on the video and was surprised to find it’s about “pre-heating vs. no pre-heating.” Since “Cold oven” is in both the title and thumbnail, changing the thumbnail text to something like “Should You Pre-Heat Your Oven?” might result in a better CTR. You could even try an A/B test with the old and new thumbnail to see which works better. Edit: Or the title can be "Should You Pre-heat Your Oven Before Baking? Save Electricity When Baking Bread" And also, this thumbnail format is really good!
Well, the cold oven is one time saving, if you are going to bake several breads occasionally. But if you bake daily, it will accumulate saved energy and it will make difference in the full cycle of the electric energy bill. Thank you for sharing this experiment and all yours presentations.
I really enjoyed this video. The energy use is one of the reasons i don't do as many Dutch oven bakes anymore. I have wondered about a light steel or aluminum pan to trap steam in place of the heavy Dutch oven. I also want to try steaming on the stovetop, then finishing with a brief broil.
I stopped preheating my oven when i read Elaine Boddy's book, The Sourdough Whisperer. I also ditched the cast iron and use an old fashioned enamel roaster. My loaves turn out great.
I do pre-heat, and in winter the pre-heating is not wasted heat - it warms my kitchen. That said, in the summer when I have my kitchen door open to let the heat out, I will definitely give the cold oven method a go. Cheers Charlie
I always make bread using the cold oven method. It works very well. For that ear bread, I use cast aluminum pan instead of cast iron (same thicknesses). It heats a lot faster.
The cold oven is also usually the warmest place in my kitchen during the winter, especially if I leave the little light bulb on, so I often proof my dough in there! I've often wondered if I could get away with simply leaving the dough in the oven, uncovering it, and turning the heat on to bake it!
An exciting discovery Charlie. And this could be a "game changer" for many. Imagine, preparing the dough the night before, placing in a cold oven straight out of the fridge the next morning! Wow,,,,
This an amazing video! Thank you for challenging the belief of pre-heating. I'm putting a sourdough on to prove tonight and I am going to try out the non pre-heated oven. If everyone takes this idea up, then it could be a step towards combating climate change!! Well done.
Seems like something that would vary a lot with oven design; How quickly it heats up and how well it retains heat. I remember an old oven that would seriously warm up the drawer underneath, and its replacement that did not. But there would be some wasted heat just from the act of opening the door regardless. This method could probably also reduce the chance of fracture if you're baking in the same container that was in the fridge, though I'm not sure how relevant that is to bread rather than marinating meat.
In cold weather it doesn't matter, but in hot weather, the less you use the stove, the better. Here in Texas, I have a stove on my screened-in porch for baking and canning in hot weather.
As always a pleasure . I have actually often wondered if I putting a loaf in as the oven heats might benefit the rise . Must go back over this and make sure I get everything right as I will definitely be doing this where feasible from now on . Thanks for all the advice
I think it's a great idea to explore, however, I doubt there will be a significant difference in the electricity savings. Running your oven longer sure consumes energy but afaik it is incomparable to the cost of getting up to temp, which you still have to do.
I use a cast iron baking steel to seal my bottom of all my breads, hence my need to preheat that cast iron. But you did not mention the other use case for a cold oven, reheating ! When I bake my bread I make enough for three weeks, and then I freeze them all. To reheat I stick one of them in a cold oven, turn the oven on at 450f, when the oven peeps to tell me it has reach my desired temp, I turn the oven off.. works a charm. Compared to my old reheating method( preheat and then bake for 15 minutes ) I have saved some 300 + minutes of electric in my reheating every three weeks. Excellent video as always … cheers from Canada
Wow! Thank you for your great recipes and tips. I tried that method with the Yorkshire pudding. Instead of pouring liquid dough into screaming hot oil I do it all cold oil, but I was putting it in a preheated oven but in cold oil in forms. Thank you again.
I have one book that recommends preheating the oven for 45 minutes. I did that once. Went back to between 10 to 15 minutes and never saw any difference in the breads. Thanks! Think I'll shorten that time by 10 to 15 minutes.
i have a crappy gas oven....i used to preheat it for 20 min...then i got a thermometer for oven and i only preheat for around 10 minutes..... i tried once baking buns in a cold oven and it worked perfectly but the buns were in the fridge over night so i took them from the fridge straight to the cold oven and i added 15 minutes to the original baking time (i read that in some website but i dont remember which website was )😅.... but now i have an air fryer ( 5.2 L with 1500 Watts) and its much better than my oven...less time and dont consume a lot of electricity ..i already baked cinnamon rolls in it they were ready in 12 minutes with only 150 celsius ...hope that help....thank you for all your videos...
i've got a Jewish deli rye sourdough in the fridge tonight - I'm going to try this our tomorrow - your recipe inspired me to prepare salt beef to go with it, definitely worth it!
Good to know! I've always tried to preheat my cast iron to decrease the chances of the bread sticking to it, but this is making me reconsider if a hot cast iron even has that sort of an effect.
Perfect timing for this video. I'm getting back into bread-baking and I've wondered about this based on recent videos. A couple factors that stood out are the vessels used and the types of ovens. For non-cast iron cookware that heat up quickly, I can see how a cold oven could be a non-factor since the heat quickly gets transferred from the pan to the dough. But what about cast-iron in electric ovens that take longer to heat up than gas ovens? It seems cold oven is more forgiving especially when it comes to maximizing oven spring in breads. Not sure how well that works for cakes or cookies.
Thanks for these valuable hints, I usually preheat my oven for 20 minutes. Or have until now. But after having complained about your oven so many times, maybe you should invest in a new one that could save energy on the long term.
Happy 2025 Charlie! Cool thumbnail btw, had to double take when I saw it! I’ve wondered about this topic before but have never tried it out. The fact that you can get solid results on a “crappy oven” definitely bodes well for most people. I’ll probably whip up a loaf or two this week so I’ll try it out and see how it goes in my setup!
Okay so I will DEFINITELY try this. I was actually wondering if I could cut down the preheating time, but I was always afraid to waste all my time and effort.
Happy New Year Charlie :) Nice welcomed new changes :) We need one very important principles of baking video. Water / Hydration and how it affects the dough when its cooked. Why a high hydration versus a lower hydration dough. Seems no one talks about this very important ingredient :) Time to show them who's boss!!!!!!!!
I think this will really depend on the oven including the size, the distance from the heating elements, and how powerful it is. I've got an anova steam oven which I use for quickly proofing doughs. It would be convenient to just change it from 115F to 400F without removing the pan for the preheat
I started you poolish whole meal/bread flower ciabatta so will try the cold oven tomorrow. Thanks! BTW. I did your babka buns from three years ago again for the Holidays and received the same raves from the family!
It worked a treat! Result is a fine crumb but light, airy and springs back well from a squeeze. I'll program future bakes to take advantage of the cold oven bake before others. Thanks for making me a more efficient baker.
I just go to temperature with no extra heating time. I also have a Breville which is fine for one small loaf or a Focaccia. It takes no time to get up to temperature.
You just broke my mind. I've skipped pre-heating in the past, often because I was in a hurry or lazy. It usually worked out fine, but I just thought I got lucky. Pre-heating doesn't matter... nothing matters... we are definitely in the nihilistic, Neitzschean post-modern apocalypse...
wow amazing!!!! In reality preheating is most likely related to when baking in wood stoves or oven was the norm. So starting your fire to preheat was essential. But Im now going to start cold! hahahaha
For my cast iron pot, I always pre-heated and the cold-method definitely looks less than the pre-heated one. For sandwich breads I just preheat until the temperature is reached. I didn't see any obvious advantages to pre-heat longer as the tin and dough would are room temperature anyway. The only reason I am reluctant to try cold oven is the additional heating generated while heating up, although in my oven, I suspect it is not that significant. You also forget another reason to pre-heat the oven. When not using a cast iron pot, whilst needing to steam the oven you would obviously always preheat for a long time
I prove my dough in my oven with steam at 36C and then turn up the temperature to 210C and bake with steam. It saves time and the results are always good. It saves energy too. Thanks for all your help. You have transformed my baking.
I don't even preheat for pizza. I have an electric oven with the element on the bottom so I just crank it to high and for the people in the house who like a toasty crust: plop the pizza pan on the lowest rack right above the element. Once the dough has cooked enough to be set I slide it off the pan and onto the bare rack to get more direct heat for a minute or two. For those who like soft crust I just bake the pizza in the middle of the oven. It works well for my family's tastes and no preheating or expensive/heavy baking stone needed.
I stopped preheating my oven when baking everyday, whole grain bread some years ago. No difference at all! I do put on the grill for one minute at the end, as I love a very dark crust.
The only time I preheat my oven is when I bake cookies. Because with cookies it is a matter of minutes, so I want to start out with the correct temperature. But everything else I bake with a cold oven. And yes I bake my own bread since more than 2 decades. The first decade with an baking automat and after the 2nd broke due to intense use and I was given a kitchen machine and finally had an oven with the option of air circulation I am baking in the oven since 13 years.
I’ve only ever preheated my oven until the light goes off. I know it takes 6 minutes to get to 180C and 8 to 200 and have never seen the point in waiting any longer than that unless I’m also heating a baking vessel like a cast iron pan. If I had the right equipment/could be bothered I’d measure the temperature of this and put my loaf in once it was up to temperature.
I always start from cold oven with cast iron bread pans and lids. For me it was about minimizing the total effort and starting cold removes one extra step. I also use no knead, high hydration, low yeast, slow ferments which makes the bread making effort truly minimal. I don't think I spend more than 10-15 min total for two 1kg loafs.
I do preheat my oven but I only turn the oven on about 10 minutes before. For my pitas and other flat breads, I use my cast iron skillet on the stove top.
I rarely keep the oven running at the baking temperature before I put the bread in.. I just wait until it beeps that it’s ready..but that said I usually bake in a loaf pan not looking for big oven spring..
My mom never preheated, except for 5 -10 min maybe, so i don’t either. (Bcz we lived in Florida) I like to heat my cast iron for my buttermilk biscuits or cornbread tho … 10 min is plenty. Heat the skillet and butter / healthy saturated fat 😁
When I use my Dutch Oven to bake a round sourdough, I don't pre-heat because I don't like trying to drop my dough into a blazing hot Dutch oven. The bread seems to be the same either way. When I use my cast iron bread pan to make a high hydration sourdough where I want a crackling crust and crunchy ear, I pre-heat to prevent too much spreading and get the best crust. I think that the next time I use the cast iron bread pan I will be ignoring the instructions to pre-heat for an hour and see what happens. Thanks for these scientifically controlled experiments.
Wow! I must test this for myself. I use an oven steel for baking my sourdough bread, and I just moved to an “open oven” style of baking in order to fit 2 loaves simultaneously. If I can cut 20 minutes out of the 40-45 I always give for the steel to heat, it will be great! Will definitely come back here with my conclusions.
Ok, this worked out perfectly! I let the oven heat up with the oven steel inside for just 15 minutes instead of the usual 40. The oven is set to 250c (it reached only ~200) Placed a tray with boiling water on the bottom. I loaded 2 UNSCORED loaves, which I sprayed with water, and added an inverse oven tray on the top most part of the oven. 6 minutes in, I scored the loaves. 14 minutes more, and I removed the tray with water, and the top inverted tray. Let it get some color (20ish minutes at 230c).
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Charlie I LOVE that you continue to explore and challenge your craft. First you tested and tossed out kneading. Next you proved salt doesn't kill yeast. Now you're taking on pre-heating. Thank you for bringing us along on this journey to improve the craft of bread-baking!
Wow what a revelation! After shedding a tear seeing my gas and electricity bills yesterday, this video is just what I needed.
After watching this video, I was curious about the actual cost to run an oven and ran the numbers. Multiple internet sources suggest heating a typical oven at 450 degrees for an hour uses 2.4-3.0 kW. My electricity cost is $0.14 per kWh, so it would cost $0.34-0.42 an hour to operate the oven the full hour. And the oven would probably use less energy than that since it'll cycle on/off to maintain temp.
Clearly, older inefficient ovens could draw more energy and local electricity costs will vary. I may skip preheating if it doesn't affect the outcome, but the potential cost savings is a lot less than I expected!
Videos like this are the main reason you are the best on RUclips. Not only do you give recipes and techniques, you are rather scientific about why and how. I love it!
So simple AND so informative. Hands down, the best bread baking resource on the internet! 2000 bakes, Wow! Thanks for everything you do.
I like the new style of video thumbnail. My most recent bread I baked in a cold oven and had the best oven spring ever; the bread was a 70% hydration boule.
Cheers! :) It works surprisingly well. I can't believe I did not try it sooner.
I've been baking from cold since the start of the energy crisis 2 years ago and seeing other sourdough bakers on RUclips recommending that you may even get a better oven spring using this method, and I can honestly say it's the best change I've made to my bread baking since I started to make sourdough 5 years ago.
I hope you had a lot of people to eat it all. Thank you so much for making these tests.
I feel that the home baking process is being turned on its head. Challenging the traditions is enlightening.
No kneading, no KitchenAid, no pre-heating, no fussing. Weight and put everything in the bowl, mix well, slap it once in a while, shape and in the oven it goes for proofing and baking. BREAD FOR ALL !
I was wondering when you'll make one of your detailed videos about cold oven baking. As always, everything is wonderfully explained and captured, and I'm sure it will help many to elevate their bread baking game. This method was a game changer for me. I bake my bread, both sourdough and yeast, in a glass casserole with a lid. It doesn't only save on energy and time, but also, somehow, makes beautiful artisan-looking breads. I have to say, though, I didn't know you could use the cold oven method for sandwich bread, let alone focaccia and enriched rolls; I always wanted to try the latter, especially cinnamon rolls and babka. But, I always thought that, as they are not covered, the crust would set faster and prevent a good oven spring. Now, I can't wait to try it. Thanks for the inspiration!
4:40 "final proof took 4 hours due to cold kitchen".... Oregon here, my kitchen is often fairly cold. The OVEN LIGHT (if your oven has a light) keeps the oven a near-perfect temperature for quickly fermenting and proofing the loaves.
I hear this often, however my oven light will not stay on…..it only lasts a few minutes before automatically shutting off….its only a few years old so maybe they all do this now.
@@denaross EU? They have a 30 minute shutoff from what I hear
@@SunriseLAWI’m in Canada - it’s a gas oven ….lucky if I get 10 minutes with the light on…..plus it looks LED? Not even sure it would give off heat anyways. I’ve resorted to using a seed starting mat with a temp probe….works ok.
@@denaross a friend does a steam oven to proof and bulk ferment. She puts the bread in the oven and puts a vessel of boiled water in to create the warm (and moist) environment. Her loaves turn out beautifully here in frigid Utah winters.
Thanks for this!! I use the cold oven method for my cast iron sourdough. I do it because I don’t have to worry about out hot pans when I’m scoring the bread. I think you deserve to get yourself a nice oven!!!
Yeah, I've often wondered this myself, but when a far more experienced baker like yourself recommends pre-heating, we all tend to follow - until we expand our own experiences.
Great comparisons and demonstration of results. Five minutes of extra cook time for most of the recipes, to achieve the same outcomes, is a significant energy saving.
Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge, I've learn more from your videos than I have from any other method.
I usually preheat my oven but not today! Your timing is perfect. I have a loaf that’s in its final proof before going into a Dutch oven. I will definitely try a cold oven. I live in Canada and it’s currently -13C with a windchill of -21C. Any amount saved on my electricity bill is welcome. Thank you for the video ❤
It just came out of the oven!
Normally, I remove the lid after 30 minutes and bake an additional 8-10 minutes. When I lifted the lid after the initial 30 minutes, I thought it needed a little more time so I added another 10 minutes with the lid on.
The loaf has risen to its usual height. Can’t wait to have a slice!
FYI My oven takes 30 minutes to reach 230C /450F.
😁👍
Excellent.... BTW, I have always had the last 20 - 30 minutes of proofing in the Tins or........ in the Oven as it gets up to temperature from COLD. And as you say, apart from Pizza dough etc, it works and saves resources. Win - Win. Thank you for this.
This is so exciting, thank you so much for making this video. My mom definitely used to avoid baking because of the electricity costs. This is incredible, i'll definitely try it.
Wow this is amazing information, especially with the cost of electricity these days. Thanks Charlie.
Love this video - the end results are quite surprising. Thank you for taking the time to make this and share with us. With all of my baking, I wonder how much electricity costs I will save using this method? 😉
I usually preheat but only until it reaches temperature so I was surprised when you video appeared in my feed. As always I really appreciate that you don’t take things for granted and question, question, question. I’ll definitely try not preheating at all. You are really the best baker on RUclips. Thank you.
🙏
The fun thing is that darker, more rye-heavy breads baked LTLT (rúgbrauð, pumpernickel, бородинский) don't profit from preheating basically at all, so if you bake for more than one household (which is the most economic way of home baking anyway), put a batch of dark breads into the cold oven, bake white breads like baguettes and pitas (also south asian style breads meant to be baked in a clay oven) directly afterwards. The oven is already warm, and since brighter breads are less dense, you put less cold mass in (meaning you cool the oven down less). At last, do meringue and souflee style pastries, because those absolutely require to go in a hot oven :)
lovely video as always!
I just wanted to say a huge THANK YOU for all of your information on bread making! Cold proofing has changed our family's life, knowing also that we can get similar benefits to sourdough bulk ferments with commercial/active dry yeast with this method. Cheers!
Thank you so much for this. When I started, years ago, this is exactly what I did. Just put the dough in a cold oven. But then I started reading a book, saying "I'm not a drier, I'm a baker! -Preheat to 240° then lower to 190° when you slide in the loaf". And that's what I did, for all those years... Thanks for thinking outside of the (preheated) box!
Wow, that's surprising for sure.
Thank you for going that far to get these results for us, Charlie!
it works with just abut any baking :) I found out as a youngster just about anything you put in the oven doesn't exactly require a preheated oven. you can just put almost anything into an oven and turn it on, you just have to bake it a little longer ;) but yes, the preheating for just a few minutes is basically what I do too. I tell ppl this and they tell me im crazy, good to get some vindication lol. thankyou again Chain :) your videos have added much needed rewarding ability and understanding to my life
WoW! I never heated my oven for the recommended 45 minutes usually put bread in when oven dinged that temperature was ready. Even sometimes turned oven off when putting bread in and put it back on after 8 - 10 minutes, but starting off cold wow. You're the man.
I preheat, but only because I mostly make baguette style bread. Great video and great job
Great information thanks for testing it out and will really help people in warmer climates but I do most of my baking in the winter so the extra heat does not go to waste. 😅
I put such emphasis on preheating the oven that I’ll do other things whilst the oven heats up, thinking the hotter the better. And I think it as far as a pizza stone is concerned, that’s true (like you say), but I definitely overemphasise the importance of preheating the oven based on your examples today. What a cracker video to start the year! 😂🎉
In Colorado, electricity costs 2.7 times the normal rate from 3-7pm M-F, soon to be 3-9pm. I usually bake on weekends, with two large breads (1.8 Kg dough) baked back-to-back in a Dutch oven. 2.75 hours total at 475°F.
Thank you for this experiment/lesson! I also never questioned the direction to preheat the oven for bread baking. This is a game changer 🙂
grateful for this test. I live in New England which has some of the highest costs for electricity. I will try with my next loaf
What an excellent video! I've been wondering if/when you would dive into this... I haven't preheated my oven for a cast iron pan loaf in almost 3 years! I got "Bittman Bread", a cookbook about 100% whole-wheat sourdough, and Mark Bittman advocates for proofing your loaf in the baking vessel and starting from a cold oven. I was a little shocked at first, given the hard-and-fast rule of "always preheat your oven!" in the bread-baking realm. However, I was pleasantly surprised to find that all of my loaves turned out perfectly. While I use his cold oven method, I don't proof it in the pot like he suggests, instead following a process like Charlie describes here. I live in Utah, USA, where the summers can get quite hot, so not having to preheat is a blessing when a bread lover is stuck paying for air conditioning that is the only way to make things bearable.
I do put them in ever so slightly under-proofed to avoid any over-proofing during the heat-up stage. But I think this is misplaced, since all of your loaves went in when perfectly proofed and turned out fantastic. I'll be adjusting my method slightly with your trial results in mind.
It is interesting that your oven only has a top heating element. Mine, and most others in the US (doesn't matter gas vs. electric) have bottom heating elements. I end up having a more cooked bottom of my loaf where yours gets more cooked on top.
For other folks in the US, this is my method for the cold oven since Charlie's oven is so different from what we home cooks have: My oven claims that it gets to 450°F/232°C in under 10 minutes, so I put the loaf in the pan, score it, and put it in the cold oven right when I set the temperature.
When it beeps to tell me it has reached temperature, I set my first timer for 30 minutes. This allows the oven to finish preheating with the lid on, and within those 30 minutes it reaches temperature according to my separate oven thermometer.
After 30 minutes, I remove the lid, reduce the temperature to 425°F/218°C, and bake for another 15 minutes.
When the 15-minute timer goes off, I take the loaf out of the pot and place it directly on the oven rack for another 5-10 minutes of baking to get the crust just right. (I'm using a high-sided cast iron Dutch oven, so this may vary if you're using a Challenger bread pan or the combo cooker like Charlie.)
I use this same method with the same timings for a standard sandwich loaf!
I'm off to my kitchen right now to try this out. This is revolutionary!!!
I thought of sharing this, baked 2 days ago but put a temperature probe in the pre-heated oven & amazingly there was a drop of 60 degrees F when I opened the oven to put the bread in. It took it a while to reach again the 375 F I had set.
Thank you very much from Northern California ❤
I remember requesting you to make a video about this a year ago! It’s great to see it finally happen! My oven usually becomes untouchably hot within 5 minutes, so I’ve always thought that 30 minutes of pre-heating is unnecessary. So, I never pre-heat my oven for more than 5-6 minutes, and I’ve never pre-heated my air fryer since it reaches the set temperature within a minute!
I also have a suggestion for the title and thumbnail. As a non-native speaker, I wasn’t familiar with the term “cold oven.” I clicked on the video and was surprised to find it’s about “pre-heating vs. no pre-heating.”
Since “Cold oven” is in both the title and thumbnail, changing the thumbnail text to something like “Should You Pre-Heat Your Oven?” might result in a better CTR. You could even try an A/B test with the old and new thumbnail to see which works better.
Edit:
Or the title can be "Should You Pre-heat Your Oven Before Baking? Save Electricity When Baking Bread"
And also, this thumbnail format is really good!
Let's give that a try! Cheers :)
Great trial! Used to bake a weekly sandwich loaf in a ceramic terrine with no pre-heat
Well, the cold oven is one time saving,
if you are going to bake several breads occasionally.
But if you bake daily, it will accumulate
saved energy and it will make difference
in the full cycle of the electric energy bill.
Thank you for sharing this experiment
and all yours presentations.
Mind blown! I will be testing baking bread from cold oven for sure! Thank you!
I really enjoyed this video. The energy use is one of the reasons i don't do as many Dutch oven bakes anymore. I have wondered about a light steel or aluminum pan to trap steam in place of the heavy Dutch oven. I also want to try steaming on the stovetop, then finishing with a brief broil.
I stopped preheating my oven when i read Elaine Boddy's book, The Sourdough Whisperer. I also ditched the cast iron and use an old fashioned enamel roaster. My loaves turn out great.
I do pre-heat, and in winter the pre-heating is not wasted heat - it warms my kitchen. That said, in the summer when I have my kitchen door open to let the heat out, I will definitely give the cold oven method a go. Cheers Charlie
I always make bread using the cold oven method. It works very well. For that ear bread, I use cast aluminum pan instead of cast iron (same thicknesses). It heats a lot faster.
Thank you so much! Very interesting and informative. I'm baking tomorrow, and I'll try the cold oven method.
The cold oven is also usually the warmest place in my kitchen during the winter, especially if I leave the little light bulb on, so I often proof my dough in there! I've often wondered if I could get away with simply leaving the dough in the oven, uncovering it, and turning the heat on to bake it!
An exciting discovery Charlie. And this could be a "game changer" for many. Imagine, preparing the dough the night before, placing in a cold oven straight out of the fridge the next morning! Wow,,,,
This an amazing video! Thank you for challenging the belief of pre-heating. I'm putting a sourdough on to prove tonight and I am going to try out the non pre-heated oven.
If everyone takes this idea up, then it could be a step towards combating climate change!! Well done.
Seems like something that would vary a lot with oven design; How quickly it heats up and how well it retains heat. I remember an old oven that would seriously warm up the drawer underneath, and its replacement that did not. But there would be some wasted heat just from the act of opening the door regardless.
This method could probably also reduce the chance of fracture if you're baking in the same container that was in the fridge, though I'm not sure how relevant that is to bread rather than marinating meat.
In cold weather it doesn't matter, but in hot weather, the less you use the stove, the better. Here in Texas, I have a stove on my screened-in porch for baking and canning in hot weather.
Worked nicely for a focaccia 🙏
Adopted.
As always a pleasure . I have actually often wondered if I putting a loaf in as the oven heats might benefit the rise . Must go back over this and make sure I get everything right as I will definitely be doing this where feasible from now on . Thanks for all the advice
Great video! My oven takes about 5-8 minutes to reach temperature I set it to. That's the only pre-heating I do and it works fine for me.
Thank you for your efforts, I have a loaf proofing right now I'm curious to test this with
Thanks for this and for testing it so thoroughly with different breads . I will try it in the morning as I have some dough ready then.
I think it's a great idea to explore, however, I doubt there will be a significant difference in the electricity savings. Running your oven longer sure consumes energy but afaik it is incomparable to the cost of getting up to temp, which you still have to do.
Thanks I will try it. I also bake a bunch of loaves together, to save on energy, then freeze what I won't use right away.
I use a cast iron baking steel to seal my bottom of all my breads, hence my need to preheat that cast iron. But you did not mention the other use case for a cold oven, reheating ! When I bake my bread I make enough for three weeks, and then I freeze them all. To reheat I stick one of them in a cold oven, turn the oven on at 450f, when the oven peeps to tell me it has reach my desired temp, I turn the oven off.. works a charm. Compared to my old reheating method( preheat and then bake for 15 minutes ) I have saved some 300 + minutes of electric in my reheating every three weeks. Excellent video as always … cheers from Canada
Wow! Thank you for your great recipes and tips. I tried that method with the Yorkshire pudding. Instead of pouring liquid dough into screaming hot oil I do it all cold oil, but I was putting it in a preheated oven but in cold oil in forms. Thank you again.
I must try that! Cheers.
I have one book that recommends preheating the oven for 45 minutes. I did that once. Went back to between 10 to 15 minutes and never saw any difference in the breads. Thanks! Think I'll shorten that time by 10 to 15 minutes.
Very nice experiment with awesome results!
i have a crappy gas oven....i used to preheat it for 20 min...then i got a thermometer for oven and i only preheat for around 10 minutes..... i tried once baking buns in a cold oven and it worked perfectly but the buns were in the fridge over night so i took them from the fridge straight to the cold oven and i added 15 minutes to the original baking time (i read that in some website but i dont remember which website was )😅.... but now i have an air fryer ( 5.2 L with 1500 Watts) and its much better than my oven...less time and dont consume a lot of electricity ..i already baked cinnamon rolls in it they were ready in 12 minutes with only 150 celsius ...hope that help....thank you for all your videos...
i've got a Jewish deli rye sourdough in the fridge tonight - I'm going to try this our tomorrow - your recipe inspired me to prepare salt beef to go with it, definitely worth it!
Thank you for sharing your experience!!
Good to know! I've always tried to preheat my cast iron to decrease the chances of the bread sticking to it, but this is making me reconsider if a hot cast iron even has that sort of an effect.
Perfect timing for this video. I'm getting back into bread-baking and I've wondered about this based on recent videos. A couple factors that stood out are the vessels used and the types of ovens. For non-cast iron cookware that heat up quickly, I can see how a cold oven could be a non-factor since the heat quickly gets transferred from the pan to the dough. But what about cast-iron in electric ovens that take longer to heat up than gas ovens?
It seems cold oven is more forgiving especially when it comes to maximizing oven spring in breads. Not sure how well that works for cakes or cookies.
Wow! That's fascinating. Definitely going to try this.
Well, isn't that an eye opener. 👍
Once a forgot to turn on the oven and I had to baked without pre heating the oven and it worked pretty well.
Thanks for these valuable hints, I usually preheat my oven for 20 minutes. Or have until now. But after having complained about your oven so many times, maybe you should invest in a new one that could save energy on the long term.
Happy 2025 Charlie! Cool thumbnail btw, had to double take when I saw it!
I’ve wondered about this topic before but have never tried it out. The fact that you can get solid results on a “crappy oven” definitely bodes well for most people. I’ll probably whip up a loaf or two this week so I’ll try it out and see how it goes in my setup!
Happy 2025! Cheers 😎
I will definitely switch to cold oven baking for my batards and boules. I've never tried a focaccia, but will follow your advice should I ever do so.
Okay so I will DEFINITELY try this. I was actually wondering if I could cut down the preheating time, but I was always afraid to waste all my time and effort.
Thank you!
Thank you for this input 😊
Great video, I wondered about this idea but was concerned about trying it. Maybe I should be more experimental.
Happy New Year Charlie :) Nice welcomed new changes :)
We need one very important principles of baking video.
Water / Hydration and how it affects the dough when its cooked.
Why a high hydration versus a lower hydration dough.
Seems no one talks about this very important ingredient :)
Time to show them who's boss!!!!!!!!
Happy New Year, George! 🥳
I do cover it in a way in my Baker's Percentage videos. But I guess a wider range of hydration levels could be compared :)
I think this will really depend on the oven including the size, the distance from the heating elements, and how powerful it is. I've got an anova steam oven which I use for quickly proofing doughs. It would be convenient to just change it from 115F to 400F without removing the pan for the preheat
I started you poolish whole meal/bread flower ciabatta so will try the cold oven tomorrow. Thanks! BTW. I did your babka buns from three years ago again for the Holidays and received the same raves from the family!
It worked a treat! Result is a fine crumb but light, airy and springs back well from a squeeze. I'll program future bakes to take advantage of the cold oven bake before others. Thanks for making me a more efficient baker.
I usually preheat to help judge baking time for approximate doneness.
I just go to temperature with no extra heating time. I also have a Breville which is fine for one small loaf or a Focaccia. It takes no time to get up to temperature.
Wonderful results. Saves time and energy. No more spraying the oven and all that special treatment?
For the most part 😁
For all doughs that dint have to develop a crust to prevent spreading I never preheat. The exception being very fast bakes like Biskuit
You just broke my mind. I've skipped pre-heating in the past, often because I was in a hurry or lazy. It usually worked out fine, but I just thought I got lucky. Pre-heating doesn't matter... nothing matters... we are definitely in the nihilistic, Neitzschean post-modern apocalypse...
😄
wow amazing!!!!
In reality preheating is most likely related to when baking in wood stoves or oven was the norm.
So starting your fire to preheat was essential.
But Im now going to start cold! hahahaha
For my cast iron pot, I always pre-heated and the cold-method definitely looks less than the pre-heated one. For sandwich breads I just preheat until the temperature is reached. I didn't see any obvious advantages to pre-heat longer as the tin and dough would are room temperature anyway.
The only reason I am reluctant to try cold oven is the additional heating generated while heating up, although in my oven, I suspect it is not that significant.
You also forget another reason to pre-heat the oven. When not using a cast iron pot, whilst needing to steam the oven you would obviously always preheat for a long time
I prove my dough in my oven with steam at 36C and then turn up the temperature to 210C and bake with steam. It saves time and the results are always good. It saves energy too. Thanks for all your help. You have transformed my baking.
I don't even preheat for pizza. I have an electric oven with the element on the bottom so I just crank it to high and for the people in the house who like a toasty crust: plop the pizza pan on the lowest rack right above the element. Once the dough has cooked enough to be set I slide it off the pan and onto the bare rack to get more direct heat for a minute or two. For those who like soft crust I just bake the pizza in the middle of the oven. It works well for my family's tastes and no preheating or expensive/heavy baking stone needed.
Who would have thunk it❤
Evry now and then i forget to preheat and put bread in prior to reaching temp, worked.
Thanks so much, going to try this out!
ty for ur videos, more specific videos like this are really helpfull
I stopped preheating my oven when baking everyday, whole grain bread some years ago. No difference at all! I do put on the grill for one minute at the end, as I love a very dark crust.
The only time I preheat my oven is when I bake cookies. Because with cookies it is a matter of minutes, so I want to start out with the correct temperature. But everything else I bake with a cold oven.
And yes I bake my own bread since more than 2 decades. The first decade with an baking automat and after the 2nd broke due to intense use and I was given a kitchen machine and finally had an oven with the option of air circulation I am baking in the oven since 13 years.
I’ve only ever preheated my oven until the light goes off. I know it takes 6 minutes to get to 180C and 8 to 200 and have never seen the point in waiting any longer than that unless I’m also heating a baking vessel like a cast iron pan.
If I had the right equipment/could be bothered I’d measure the temperature of this and put my loaf in once it was up to temperature.
I always start from cold oven with cast iron bread pans and lids. For me it was about minimizing the total effort and starting cold removes one extra step. I also use no knead, high hydration, low yeast, slow ferments which makes the bread making effort truly minimal. I don't think I spend more than 10-15 min total for two 1kg loafs.
I do preheat my oven but I only turn the oven on about 10 minutes before. For my pitas and other flat breads, I use my cast iron skillet on the stove top.
yes, me too - i like the thrill of pita puffung up like a puffer fish right before my eyes!
I rarely keep the oven running at the baking temperature before I put the bread in.. I just wait until it beeps that it’s ready..but that said I usually bake in a loaf pan not looking for big oven spring..
This worth a try!! Thank you
My mom never preheated, except for 5 -10 min maybe, so i don’t either. (Bcz we lived in Florida) I like to heat my cast iron for my buttermilk biscuits or cornbread tho … 10 min is plenty. Heat the skillet and butter / healthy saturated fat 😁
When I use my Dutch Oven to bake a round sourdough, I don't pre-heat because I don't like trying to drop my dough into a blazing hot Dutch oven. The bread seems to be the same either way. When I use my cast iron bread pan to make a high hydration sourdough where I want a crackling crust and crunchy ear, I pre-heat to prevent too much spreading and get the best crust. I think that the next time I use the cast iron bread pan I will be ignoring the instructions to pre-heat for an hour and see what happens. Thanks for these scientifically controlled experiments.
At this rate pretty soon you’re going to demonstrate that we don’t even need take the ingredients out of their packaging to make a perfect loaf.
😆
Wow! I must test this for myself.
I use an oven steel for baking my sourdough bread, and I just moved to an “open oven” style of baking in order to fit 2 loaves simultaneously.
If I can cut 20 minutes out of the 40-45 I always give for the steel to heat, it will be great!
Will definitely come back here with my conclusions.
Ok, this worked out perfectly!
I let the oven heat up with the oven steel inside for just 15 minutes instead of the usual 40.
The oven is set to 250c (it reached only ~200)
Placed a tray with boiling water on the bottom.
I loaded 2 UNSCORED loaves, which I sprayed with water,
and added an inverse oven tray on the top most part of the oven.
6 minutes in, I scored the loaves.
14 minutes more, and I removed the tray with water, and the top inverted tray.
Let it get some color (20ish minutes at 230c).