Before Revan left to confront the Emperor, the Jedi weren’t treating Revan with love and compassion. And the only reason he was welcomed back into the order at all was because of Bastila. So saying the purge was Revan’s fault is a lie. It was the fault of Jedi Masters like Atris and Vrook.
@@Ghost7264 I took the story canon from the Revan book, Kotor 1 lore, and Kotor 2 lore. Using lore from Swtor is an automatic failure on the academic level.
@AncestorEmpire1 I agree with you there. However, the book is tied directly to the MMO. It takes a lot of inspiration from what should have happened if KOTOR 3 ever existed, but it fundamentally fails to do The Exile justice. Revan and The Exile both play important parts in KOTOR; Revan saved the Republic from destruction at the hands of The Mandalorians and later Malak. The Exile saved the Republic from collapsing in on itself after back-to-back wars AND laid the foundation for recreating the Jedi Order (training the companions). I really liked the Revan book for what it was, and it led nicely into the MMO, but I cannot help but feel sorrow for what could have been had Bioware not gone the MMO route.
@@Ghost7264 from a business perspective, the MMO was a better idea that 7 separate games. Especially given that the game was launched around the time the Disney purchase happened.
In Revan's defense, I don't think there's any way he or anyone else could have predicted that firing the Mass Shadow Generator would have galactic scale consequences.
People die on a galactic scale all the time in Star wars. He probably dint expect it to actually wound the Force itself. Simultaneous deaths seem to impact the Force the most, its like the Force cannot process all those deaths at once. And a machine that uses the Mass Shadows can do even more damage then a DeathStar obliterating a planet
I love the interactions with GO-TO in KOTOR 2, because I think it adds a layer of nuance to the Jedi Civil War and Revan that makes a lot of sense. GO-TO implies that Revan had a larger plan in mind beyond the stereotypical “conquer the galaxy” goals of most Sith. This channel talked in a previous video about how Revan had refused to tell the Jedi Council about Vitiate’s Sith empire because of the Dark side influence he experienced at the Trayus Academy. However, why would he think the Council would listen to him regarding a secret threat when they wouldn’t listen to him regarding the obvious Mandalorian threat? It is implied that he fought the Republic and Jedi so that he could assume leadership of the Republic for a war with Vitiate’s Sith that he knew was coming. He was willing to betray everything he had just fought for for what he perceived as an even greater good. It would only make sense that such a massive threat would be first on his mind when he regained his memories, except at that time, the Republic was in shambles and he had no support and no army, so he left on his own. He also had no idea about Nihilus or the Triumvirate. So yeah, I think Revan deserves a little more grace than this.
When the first Jedi purge took place, I'm actually quite glad that Meetra Surik had already taken exile for her actions during the mandalorian wars. It's saved her life.
Highly underrated character, even from Legend fans😅 I’m amongst the rare who prefers kotor2 to kotor1 and Meetra is as interesting as Revan or Kreïa to me, not even talking how powerful she is considering she soloed the sith triumvirate in a matter of a couple of days.
@@NottherealLucifer 100% agree, I should have said : she had the potential to be as interesting as Revan but got sidelined and wasted in SWTOR… at least we can still play kotor 2 😂 beating Sion mostly with rhetoric was so memorable 👌🏻
A Jedi can disguise or fight their way through clones. But against the Malachor Sith assassins and Darth Nihilus, they might as well be kids wielding plastic toys.
"If you were to face an Ancient Sith in combat, you'd discover that we are like children playing with toys in comparison to the prowess of the Old Masters."
@@HolyknightVader999 imagine Tulak Hord's powers. He turned a siege on his home planet into the beginning of his campaign and killed thousands of Jedi. What powers did he discover? Force Demoralize? Imo, he knew obscure, yet dangerous powers like the Thought Bomb or how to use Force Fear on planetary scales. His mask could have helped there.
the only problem with tulak hord is he lived in a time before the great hyperspace war when the sith clashed with the republic for the first time so I've always wondered, how could tulak hord ever kill or even face jedi when neither the sith or jedi had yet met the other?
Despite all the scolding Revan deserves, he also deserves more praise. Because when Vitiate had him captured and imprisoned, it was Revan who delayed a Sith attack on the Republic through battling Vitiate in twisted "mind games" for some 300 years. Precious time the Jedi and Republic urgently needed to rebuild.
@@TheStupendousWave Also Legends and Canon I was wondering why were many force sensitives not recruited by the Jedi as children or younglings? Darth Bane Darth Nihilus the boy at the end of Star wars episode 7 the Last Jedi why were so many shrouded in mystery or not considered important? Please explain maybe do a video
Revan did what Talion of the Middle-Earth Shadow of Mordor/War did. He kept the True enemy at bay for a long time, but it was a losing battle anyway. I always thought about a game where u play as Revan and Meetra Surik and like in Shadow of War keep the enemy away, work your way up, form the Revanites,.... to eventually fall against Vitiate.
I think Revan deserves a LITTLE more credit. He did not know there was another faction of Sith out there in hiding. Most of his memories had come back after two years since Malak's defeat, but not all of it. Still, if he had stayed things would have probably been different. Yes he might have been able to stop the Sith Triumviate, but by the time he did Vitiate might have been ready to make his move against the Republic. By going to Dromund Kaas Revan bought time for the Republic to heal, they never would have stood a chance after just going through all those wars.
The way the games play out it makes Revan's actions were to prepare the Republic for Vitiate because he left vital infrastructure intact during the Civil War.
That was i believe Revan's ultimate goal all along as a Sith too. The republic and jedi were in no shape to fight the True Sith that was hiding out there. It was to weak. Revan wanted to defeat the republic in order to make it stronger and prepare it to fight against the greater evil. In this rare occurrence, maybe the dark side ending to KOTOR1 was maybe even the Better ending, but obviously morally wrong.
Genuine question: Did Revan KNEW about Nilus? Because if he didn't, it's not really fair to throw that one solely on his lap. If he knew about the three siths I doubt he would go hunt for the sith empire.
No, but it was his order to activate the mass shadow generator that created that wound in the force. He may not have intended to create Nihlus, but it was a consequence of his actions
Its quite possible revan know of darth sion, since he was around during exar kun and his war, it's also possible revan knew kreia was possibly slipping into walking down the path into becoming a future sith as he once asked her how best he too could leave the jedi order but it's silly to think he could of known about nihilus especially since he would not have been on his radar yet as a threat
Even if he was responsible, he was also responsible for the restoration of the Mandalorian's under Canderous Ordo/Mandalore the Preserver, who was a key figure in stopping Nihilus, with the Mandalorians being a key fighting force in the battle over Telos IV that led to Nihilus's death. Even with him leaving the Galaxy for Dromund Kaas (which was the right move as it stopped Vitiate for 300 years), he still helped clean up his own mess.
Nhilus was a product of the mass shadow generator.By that point revan had already left the galaxy afterMandalore told him about the sith in the shadows.
This being the first was by far the worst as they nearly destroyed the jedi entirely. Revan is given far too much of the blame while he does bare some it doesn't and shouldn't fall squarely on him. Plenty of others deserve to bear the blame as well.
The root of Revan is Latin revenite meaning come back/return. without Revan the Sith would never have returned, and without Revan the Jedi Order would never have returned. The Force demands Balance and Revan was its instrument.
This is very disturbing. I went through all of this in kotor2. There's no way Raven knew what will happen. It could he's responsible for his fall and Malak's. Jedi wasn't welcome back just because of Bastila. He was hero and saviour. He deserves more understanding. I agree. First Jedi Purge is way worse than Order 66. Have a great day too😊
Hello there ! Another amazing holocron, as usual. I normally don’t have any suggestions cause I like everything you do but today I do. Could you do something on Meetra Surik ? I know there’s not a lot of lore on the character but for those who never played kotor2, it would be an amazing subject to talk about especially after that holocron !
The problem with Darth Nihilus was that Traya thought she could control him, after she got cast away by Sion and Nihilus is where she actually realized the scale of Nihilus power, she knew that Nihilus had to be stopped becouse at that point Nihilus was already far gone, not caring about sith or jedi, just to feed on his hunger which made him a galactic level threat. He had outpowered Traya and Sion by far and was already reaching his peak. Thats why Traya went out in search for the Exile since she was the only one at that time who could stop him. I wish tho she didnt, i wouldve loved to see a showdown between Nihilus and Vitiate.
Imagine surviving Darth Nihilus so just you have to deal with the Rampage-tour of Darth Malgus afterwards. The old republic era sith lords were savages!!
the first jedi purge was worse, i don't think that is even argueable. Had Sion and Nihilius not gotten egotistical and kept Traya, the Sith probably would have wiped out the jedi
The path to the dark side is often one that is not always the choice of the force user. That said, Revan's outsized power and knowledge might have kept him safe but for the repeated strife, death, and suffering he and his brethren endured over the course of those conflicts. It cannot be understated how devastating and traumatic waging war is on all. So, for me, Revan should be condemned for his actions during the Mandalorian War because he chose to commit a war crime so great that its reverberations were felt for many years after in the form of Nihilus (not sure on spelling). The lack of trust and outright hatred of Revan after his redemption is very understandable, given that he chose to pursue a selfish course of vengeance. Even if well-intended, Revan abandoned his post when needed, and he truly could have regained the trust and confidence of the Jedi if only he had stayed his hand and helped with the rebuilding. I don't think peace and harmony was in Revan. Ever. And it cost him and his order everything. Great storytelling SW!
My personal feelings on the two main points of this video, a video that was excellent btw, is firstly that Revan wasn't responsible for the 1st purge because it wasn't necessarily his responsibility to hang around and play watch dog for the order. He didn't know about the Triumvirate, though an argument could be made that he should have dismantled the cult he left on Malacor V, assuming he remembered them, however I don't think it's too clear just how much Revan remembers after he rediscovers his identity. On the other hand, I do believe that his decision to embark, alone, into the Unknown Regions was a foolish one, he knew it wasn't just an order of Sith lords who he could confront and best, he was trying to remove the head of an entire empire. Even IF he had been successful, he was one man, the remaining sith would have killed him, then replaced the Emperor and carried on. Perhaps Revan was banking on the Empire falling to infighting which is possible, but the Empire was structured to operate more cooperatively than that, it had an entire council of dark lords who all had the sense and political acumen to realize that they would need to move carefully when trying to fill a power vacuum as large as that of the Emperor. Undoubtedly there would have been a very tense period of infighting between rival lords, but the Empire was hidden from the Jedi Order and Republic, so even if things devolved into a civil war, there would have been plenty of time for the Empire to sort itself out before returning to normal. Revan would have been far better off staying with Bastila, sharing his knowledge with her, their child and any jedi with the sense to listen. The council might very well have dismissed him, after all he was hardly popular with them but just as during the events of the Mandalorian Wars, there would be members of the order who would at least hear him out. He could have paved the way for future jedi to prepare for a future confrontation with the Empire. Now as for which purge was worse, I think that both were equally terrible but in very different ways. The 2nd purge, was explosive, killing thousands of jedi simultaneously across the galaxy before hunting down the few jedi that escaped with ruthless efficiency. The 1st purge was more insidious, a slow creeping death, a cancer that spread its tendrils through out the galaxy to reach out and swallow any jedi unlucky enough to encounter it.
Imagine another series of 9 films covering this period, but done as horror/thriller stories. Super dark and completely removed from the hands of mouse... We can dream...
To be fair he probably had no idea Nihilus even existed, but was well aware that there was a hidden Sith Empire which he felt was a threat the Order and the Republic were ill equipped to confront or defend against. Secondly given what the triumvirate was capable of, and how they operated there is no guarantee that Revan's presence would have even made a difference. It took a "Jedi" who had essentially turned herself into a void of the force to stop Nihilus. Also given how even in all the legends lore relatively rare a redemption of a Sith Lord was he could very easily have been useless against Sion as well. Given the knowledge of the time we have I think it's pretty fair to say he did what he thought was best with the information he had at the time.
@TheStupendousWave Absolutely did, wow a reply from The Stupendous himself! Thanks for everything you do , it's the star wars that keeps me going in these dark time's, This Is The Way
"Is the father responsible for the actions of the son? or perhaps the grandson? It was Daruhu Naihilous (Darth Nihilous) who reduced Katarr to a lifeless husk. It was his decision to do so and it is he whom I have discovered how to seek revenge against." -- Dr. Teela Wendan, Miralukan battlefield surgeon.
If it weren’t for the fact that every new piece of Star Wars media seems to show another survivor of the purge I would say that the great purge is worse than the first purge. Mostly because it not only killed the Jedi. It made the practice of being a Jedi illegal and basically wiped the Jedi from the annals of history. it also made it next to impossible to reconstruct the Jedi to the point that at least in legends Luke has a very difficult time at the beginning trying to reform the Jedi order. Even in cannon Luke has a difficult time, but we still haven’t seen a lot of that by comparison. I hope we get a lot more media moving forward that shows Luke rebuilding the order but for now it’s still very vague.
Nobody truly had a chance against Nhilus.The only reason Meetra could fight him was because of the wound she carried in the force.whenever he tried to feed on her he found nothing there. Just a void. It meant she could end him when nobody else could. who else can stand up to a planet devouring monstrosity?
Question I always asked is how after Malachor V, did Meetra Surik and the crew of the Ebon Hawk rebuild the Jedi Order to its former, glory, if not better? Would love a Holocron diving deep into that lore please
This was a harsh time for the Republic and the Jedi(the entire galaxy really). I think they had to deal with four or five galactic wars within the span of fifty years or so and two(three if you count the Kotor 2 stuff) of them were essentially back to back. Not to mention all the crazy monsters of the force running around at the time.
I have a question for you: What ever happened to the officer that allowed the escape pod to leave the star destroyer during episode 4's opening scene? In a sense, that one decision destroyed the Empire. I suspect since Vader was around nothing good happened to him, but I am curious about that.
Maybe there were more powerful Sith around during the first Purge. But i still think Order 66 had a far more devestating effect. Like you mentioned, the Jedi during the first purge went into exile like in Order 66, but they did it with a purpose and stayed in contact. They did it in order to collect informations and opportunities to strike back. Order 66 had such an effect that many of the surviving Jedi even stopped thinking of themselves as jedi, like Ahsoka and even Obi Wan. Both events were absolutely devestating for the Jedi, but Order 66 even crushed the fighting spirit and identity part of many surviving Jedi.
I would say that order 66 was far more effective than the Triumvirate Purge, mainly because in the last one, the council survived and with it, the fundamental pilars of the order. But with Order 66, the structure was cut from its roots and the jedi were left leaderless, killing the order as it was known. Until Luke founded his own Jedi Order, which had nothing to do (at least in Legends) with the old jedi order, for it didn't ban the attachments between individuals of its members, and also was taking padawans of any age.
If there were thousands writers in this era we would see the same thing as Order 66 where they keep inventing survivors. It's good they just jumped 300 years in the future.
I honestly typically like KOTOR 2: Sith Lords more than the original Knights of the Old Republic, but it really can't be overstated how much of bith these event chains hang around the neck if one Revan. So, maybe this isn't the best place to make a video request, especially since the very topic might've already been covered, if I had just bothered to read, but could we maybe get a video on what it means, in the Jedi, to use different lightsabers, like saber staves, or even two? Honestly, I've often been a fan of both, and it seems something that the Order would just restrict, seeing it as unnecessary, and kyber crystals a valuable commodity, yet among the various Jedi of this era, we see staves, paired sabers, and more, and even Cal Kestis' master, I think, used a staff, while Ahsoka wielded two lightsabers, so could you discuss what these mean, and why, when the Jediboften frowned upon it, in some cases they didn't, and especially what it could mean in a canon where the crystal chooses the Jedi, do to be chosen by two...
Well the mouse would soften the blow by making more Jedi that survived Order 66. Still though, with how many Jedi were around before order 66, those new survivors don't change the overall picture that much. Even if it does get annoying, after a while, with them just adding more and more of them rather than exploring a different era. Then The Acolyte happened and that was an utter disaster. I want more things set before the prequels, specifically pre Rule Of Two but I do not trust Disney to do so in a way that respects the franchise. I didn't even trust them for this before The Acolyte happened. If they are still doing the KotOR remake. or whatever, I don't have faith at all. I'll be happy to be proven wrong because Reven, The Exile, and Bane's stories are among my favorites in the entire Star Wars universe. I do also love how Reven basically teaches Darth Bane the Rule Of Two and kind of calls out what happened, with the 2 students working together to betray their master, as the reason why the Sith should only have 1 student. Reven's attempts to take down the Sith Empire didn't go that well, for most of it, but he was kind of right that that faction of the Sith was the bigger threat. Yeah he didn't see the triomverite coming but who knows how it would have ended if he tried to deal with his old master and the Sith Empire just dropped in. That would be a fun alternate timeline story. We do kind of have the legally district from the infinite corridor of Castlevania, introduced in Rebels, so we could see alternate timelines for elseworld stories.
I still can't believe that Disney hasn't touched this entire time period because Revans story specifically would be incredible to tell in a movie series. Thank God they haven't touched it.
The Jedi Order was very much split on the matter of Revan. If he had remained his presence would have divided the Jedi once more, not united them. Perhaps that would have been better, but striking out to face Vitiate was not an unreasonable decision, especially for one bearing the guilt and doubt that Revan did at that time.
Disneys next plot stage of Star wars should be that the Jedi rebuild with the help of Rey and others. Then, the Sith should be to surprise us with the fact that the rule of 2 was all a ruse and that the sith were in fact rebuilding their army far off in the galaxy.
Considering that Revan was not participating much with the Jedi Order and decided to seek out the Sith Empire to confront Vitiate and was captured and held and tortured directly by Vitiate maybe by his strong will he distracted Vitiate by doing so he did not use the might of the Sith Empire against The Old Republic and Jedi Order fully this is all legends of course what the canon will have to say we have to wait and see if any Movies or shows may bring more information out. Atleast the Sith Troopers name alluded To Darth Revan so Revan is Canon hopefully they will make a Movie about Revan life as Jedi, dark Jedi, Sith Lord, Redeemed Jedi, Prisoner of Vitiate, leader of the Revanchists and going to light side of Force at and of his life .
First purge was not Revans doing. It was Exar Kuns and Ulic Qel-dromas. It was their fall that led Sith like Nihilis and Sion to seek ancient Sith, who were planning that forever. Then we had Kriea, who misunderstood her former student, but herself wanted to preserve his actions.
Because it came hard on the heels of two wars that had decimated the ranks of the Jedi already. And that it was led by an all consuming zombie Sith, who devoured all before him and further decimated the Jedi ranks to that of near extinction. Before they were saved by a Jedi cut from from the force whom he couldn’t defeat.
Sending a bunch of force welders against the lord of hunger is like a all you can eat buffet you may as well ring the dinner bell and shout come and get it
@@JoeMoody-v3k yeah ikr...? She REALLY DOES taste sweet... Kinda like a sentient Cinnamon Roll... While that guy tasted more savory... Similar to a BBQ Rib... While that other one wasnt Human but looked kinda like that one fruit over on that one planet... An they sorta tasted like it too
What if the council was correct from the beginning? Yes, the Mandalorians would have conquered the republic, but Canderous in kotor 2 raises the question if that would have been the better outcome. The jedi, including Revan, paired with the mandalorians, would have been a formidable force to resist Vitiate's sith empire. If they had waited for the true threat to reveal itself, then they might have been able to fight against it properly. Revan went to war and left the galaxy in shambles by defeating the mandalorians. This we saw in Kotor 2. Just think how formidable a force the mandalorians would be aided by the jedi, especially if the jedi had discovered the star forge and been able to use it to resist the ancient sith empire as well. Revan succeeded in the end, though his rash and absolute decision making may have only made it a much more difficult route to take. A republic surrender would have saved more lives. Mandalorian rule would have strengthened a republic that was already dying a slow death before any mandalorian invasion ever occurred. Atris may have had a point when condemning the actions of Revan and his followers when she chastised Meetra Surik on Telos.
Revan caused Vitiate's plan to go as well as it ever could have. He didn't want the mandalorians to conquer the republic. He wanted to eliminate any and all resistance he could, the mandalorians included. Revan succeeded in doing just that. He destroyed the mandalorians and left the republic crippled and dying. After his return as a Sith, Revan started mending these mistakes by attempting to build an empire powerful enough to fight Vitiate. He failed a second time, however, succeeding only in bringing the republic and jedi order to the brink of collapse. Revan only managed to succeed in the end by delaying the sith empires invasion of the republic long enough for the republic to rebuild and strengthen itself. Maybe the wars he caused strengthened them by hardening the republic and preparing it for battle. That's the only argument to be made. Because Revan was otherwise responsible for countless lives lost to war and nearly crippling the republic beyond repair. His true redemption was being able to delay an assault on the galaxy he had shattered to pieces. Revan was always doing the right thing in his heart, but his actions were truly catastrophic in leading a jedi rebellion against the mandalorians.
Some say Revan is a traitor, others say he is a savior. I say... a Revan Star Wars movie directed by Dave Filoni with Keanu Reeves as Revan would FKing AMAZINGGG
If they ever make a live action movie about the old republic they need to cast Keanu Reeves as Revan. Considering how disney has done so far with star wars my hopes aren't high, if they did announce it I wouldn't get excited they'll probably ruin it.
Its not all Revan's fault; only about 15 %. There is a lot of blame to go around. Because of the damn Sith Emperor, if you wanted to be real picky you could go all the way back to the Daragon twins rediscovering Korriban, which allowed Naga Sadow to gain power. But the immediate historical period of the Purge begins with Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-Droma and the Great Sith War. Followed a generation later with Act 2: The Mandalorian Wars culminating at Malachor V. Act 3 would be the return/redemption of Revan, and more importantly, the return of Meetra Surik to defeat the Sith Triumvirate. And since we know from SWTOR that the Sith Emperor was behind both the Mandalorian Wars and the resulting evens that led to KOTOR 1 and SWTOR, it could be considered two separate but related purges, first of the Old Jedi Order and then 300 years later, the rebuilt Jedi Order of Surik's apprentices at The Battle of Coruscant. So from a later historical perspective you could lump those two events together. In terms of blame and damage, it probably goes Darth Nihilus Revan and Malak The Sith Emperor Exar Kun The Old Jedi Order itself - mainline leadership too hesitant to act when necessary and refusing to support or foster understanding between cliques within the order; left the groups to essentially radicalize (see the Draayists on Taris, the Revanists, and Kreia/Arren Kae and her philosophies/actions). Darth Traya / Kreia / Arren Kae - specifically her nihilism and lack of personal responsibility. Darth Sion and his Sith Assassins
I still think it's the jedi council fault. They abandoned the Republic during the Mandalorian wars forcing Revan, Malek, and Meetra to go fight a war the weren't ready for. This lead to battles like Dxun where Meetra order her men to charge a mine field. The war broke everyone who entered and what did the council do to the one person who returned they exiled her. Showing everyone who fell to the dark side what would happen if they went back. During the jedi Civil war to my knowledge none of them besides the battle master even fought in the war. they also erased Revans memories so he didnt even know why he was so afraid of the unknown area of the galaxy. So he had to leave to figure it out. They also made it so he could never have a student so everything he found out about both sides of the force was never passed on. Then when the purge happened they used other jedi as bait. So yeah the council of that time just sucked.
The first one was definitely worse in my opinion simply because of the threat it posed. The empire was bad, yes, but in the end, it was an oppressive system. Nihlus, however, was a threat to all life. If he wasn’t stopped, nothing would be left.
it's a good thing that the jedi became dissilusioned, imagine if they had faced all this destruction from fallen jedi and they didn't question jedi teachings. it would show that they learned absolutely nothing.
Honestly the Jedi Civil war killed far more Jedi than the Sith purge ever did. Revan killed tons of Jedi that didn’t turn to the dark side, and then those that did eventually were killed by him too when he converted back to the light side. Nihilus and Scion killed about a hundred Jedi, Revan took out thousands.
To much evil Darkside now in Star Wars, I just stick to the movies from Originally Star War, The Empire Strikes Back, Renturn of The Jedi, The Phantom Menance, The Attack of The Clone, and the revenge of the Sith
Revan was never truly redeemed. The Sith Emperor completed his fall to the dark side and made him his slave before the Jedi Civil War. Then the Jedi planned a trap and gave him a new identity as a solider of the republic. Pretending to not know him and retrain him as a jedi to defeat Malik. Being used by both sides for their purposes is cruel.
I would say order 66 was wise. It lead to there being only two known Jedi left with a third exiled into a far past of the galaxy and a fourth who wasn't a Jedi anymore.
I would actually prefer a multitude of TV series. There's just so much lore and history there that you can't shove it all into a few movies. TV series allow better wirld budding, character development, etc.
The more I study at this library the more I understand the force ,order 66 literally happened over night personally I believe that makes it worse ,revenge does deserve mild grace because he was corrupted by the darkside and the jedi always seem to have heads up there ass ,plus once he came to he knew to track the source of the problem
Where did all this lore come from? I'll guess it came after Disney's takeover of Lucasfilm. Ghosts? Raising the dead and taking over their bodies to fight? Feeding off the life force of an entire planet? People can write anything they want, that doesn't mean they should. "Star Wars" is NOT "X-Men."
I think that weren't Revans fault. he did a logical choise. Galaxy was destroyed by a three wars level of Clone wars. He did what he thought it was best option and, be honest, we will all do same if we were in his skin and we are moraly right. He couldn't know that he made a devestating machine called Darth Nilus in a proces. Plus, he were brain washed by dark side When he used it. True, he coused Jedi civile war, but he was feld up with a hate from last war. he didn't know what he started. And, at the end of day, He rejected place i Jedi Concuil, that brings you power. And rejectng power can do only truly good peapole. Hole his life, exept his dark side period, he whanted to protect Galaxy. But, all his hard work to protect Galaxy and then to clean trash he left after his dark side period, ment noting.
If not for revan going back looking for the treath the sith empire would have attacked, that was afther all vicious plan, but the changed his mmind once revan returned. and the jedi order and the new republic would have been doomed. they would have no chance at all of defeating the sith empire with its large armys and its thousands of forcewilders. hell even 200 years in the further the war was at best a stalemate between the two forces with the sith empire having the uper hand and that was with around 200 years of recovery for the jedi order and the republic beeing able to rebuild their forces.
Before Revan left to confront the Emperor, the Jedi weren’t treating Revan with love and compassion.
And the only reason he was welcomed back into the order at all was because of Bastila.
So saying the purge was Revan’s fault is a lie. It was the fault of Jedi Masters like Atris and Vrook.
You are thinking of the canon SWTOR took the story. Before the MMO and Revan Book, the story of Revan was meant to be little different.
@@Ghost7264 I took the story canon from the Revan book, Kotor 1 lore, and Kotor 2 lore.
Using lore from Swtor is an automatic failure on the academic level.
@AncestorEmpire1 I agree with you there. However, the book is tied directly to the MMO. It takes a lot of inspiration from what should have happened if KOTOR 3 ever existed, but it fundamentally fails to do The Exile justice. Revan and The Exile both play important parts in KOTOR; Revan saved the Republic from destruction at the hands of The Mandalorians and later Malak. The Exile saved the Republic from collapsing in on itself after back-to-back wars AND laid the foundation for recreating the Jedi Order (training the companions).
I really liked the Revan book for what it was, and it led nicely into the MMO, but I cannot help but feel sorrow for what could have been had Bioware not gone the MMO route.
@@Ghost7264 from a business perspective, the MMO was a better idea that 7 separate games. Especially given that the game was launched around the time the Disney purchase happened.
@AncestorEmpire1 Again, your thoughts parallel my own.
My boy Exar Kun the Madara Uchiha of the Star Wars universe... Wish he would have remained a Jedi...
The Jedi wished the same thing lol
Lmfao exar is not the madara of sw
Yeah. Imagine if he got revived in a similar manner just for parody sake
@@SpiffyYuh
Actually he is... He's one of the most powerful characters of Legends...
@@In-Gall_Tegidda_n_Tesemt and? Still not like my goat
In Revan's defense, I don't think there's any way he or anyone else could have predicted that firing the Mass Shadow Generator would have galactic scale consequences.
Exactly.
A machine that kills so many in an instant.. actually yes he could have predicted that...
People die on a galactic scale all the time in Star wars. He probably dint expect it to actually wound the Force itself.
Simultaneous deaths seem to impact the Force the most, its like the Force cannot process all those deaths at once.
And a machine that uses the Mass Shadows can do even more damage then a DeathStar obliterating a planet
“There’s very little information about the methods they used to nearly destroy the Jedi”. Nihilus was hungry, enough said
He’d get along well with Patrick Star
I love the interactions with GO-TO in KOTOR 2, because I think it adds a layer of nuance to the Jedi Civil War and Revan that makes a lot of sense.
GO-TO implies that Revan had a larger plan in mind beyond the stereotypical “conquer the galaxy” goals of most Sith. This channel talked in a previous video about how Revan had refused to tell the Jedi Council about Vitiate’s Sith empire because of the Dark side influence he experienced at the Trayus Academy. However, why would he think the Council would listen to him regarding a secret threat when they wouldn’t listen to him regarding the obvious Mandalorian threat? It is implied that he fought the Republic and Jedi so that he could assume leadership of the Republic for a war with Vitiate’s Sith that he knew was coming. He was willing to betray everything he had just fought for for what he perceived as an even greater good. It would only make sense that such a massive threat would be first on his mind when he regained his memories, except at that time, the Republic was in shambles and he had no support and no army, so he left on his own. He also had no idea about Nihilus or the Triumvirate.
So yeah, I think Revan deserves a little more grace than this.
When the first Jedi purge took place, I'm actually quite glad that Meetra Surik had already taken exile for her actions during the mandalorian wars. It's saved her life.
Highly underrated character, even from Legend fans😅 I’m amongst the rare who prefers kotor2 to kotor1 and Meetra is as interesting as Revan or Kreïa to me, not even talking how powerful she is considering she soloed the sith triumvirate in a matter of a couple of days.
It saved her life for, what, a few years? Then she went to fight the emperor to help Revan and died immediately. They wasted her character honestly.
@@NottherealLucifer 100% agree, I should have said : she had the potential to be as interesting as Revan but got sidelined and wasted in SWTOR… at least we can still play kotor 2 😂 beating Sion mostly with rhetoric was so memorable 👌🏻
A Jedi can disguise or fight their way through clones. But against the Malachor Sith assassins and Darth Nihilus, they might as well be kids wielding plastic toys.
"If you were to face an Ancient Sith in combat, you'd discover that we are like children playing with toys in comparison to the prowess of the Old Masters."
@@lucabestea6844 My point exactly. Add in Force drain powers made to kill Jedi, and you've got a killer combo.
@@HolyknightVader999 imagine Tulak Hord's powers. He turned a siege on his home planet into the beginning of his campaign and killed thousands of Jedi. What powers did he discover? Force Demoralize? Imo, he knew obscure, yet dangerous powers like the Thought Bomb or how to use Force Fear on planetary scales. His mask could have helped there.
@@lucabestea6844 He knows Transfer Essence, since his artifacts had that secret.
the only problem with tulak hord is he lived in a time before the great hyperspace war when the sith clashed with the republic for the first time so I've always wondered, how could tulak hord ever kill or even face jedi when neither the sith or jedi had yet met the other?
Despite all the scolding Revan deserves, he also deserves more praise. Because when Vitiate had him captured and imprisoned, it was Revan who delayed a Sith attack on the Republic through battling Vitiate in twisted "mind games" for some 300 years. Precious time the Jedi and Republic urgently needed to rebuild.
"Revan is responsible for the purge?" Oh yes indeed. Thanks so much for this video! Loved it.
You're so welcome!
@@TheStupendousWave can you do a video on the last Jedi purge ? Darth Krayt and Darth wredd
@@TheStupendousWave Also Legends and Canon I was wondering why were many force sensitives not recruited by the Jedi as children or younglings? Darth Bane Darth Nihilus the boy at the end of Star wars episode 7 the Last Jedi why were so many shrouded in mystery or not considered important? Please explain maybe do a video
@@TheStupendousWaveif Darth bane was found as a infant and trained as a Jedi that would have saved him a lot of trouble turning to the dark side
@Funoct If the company he worked for weren't such greedy, abusive bastards, _that_ would have saved the galaxy a great deal of trouble.
Revan did what Talion of the Middle-Earth Shadow of Mordor/War did. He kept the True enemy at bay for a long time, but it was a losing battle anyway.
I always thought about a game where u play as Revan and Meetra Surik and like in Shadow of War keep the enemy away, work your way up, form the Revanites,.... to eventually fall against Vitiate.
I think Revan deserves a LITTLE more credit. He did not know there was another faction of Sith out there in hiding. Most of his memories had come back after two years since Malak's defeat, but not all of it. Still, if he had stayed things would have probably been different. Yes he might have been able to stop the Sith Triumviate, but by the time he did Vitiate might have been ready to make his move against the Republic. By going to Dromund Kaas Revan bought time for the Republic to heal, they never would have stood a chance after just going through all those wars.
@Check_profile7531 Won what?
Droids, mandos, poison, grenades/mines, assassins, infighting, and esoteric force techniques, this was how the purge was done
The way the games play out it makes Revan's actions were to prepare the Republic for Vitiate because he left vital infrastructure intact during the Civil War.
That was i believe Revan's ultimate goal all along as a Sith too.
The republic and jedi were in no shape to fight the True Sith that was hiding out there. It was to weak.
Revan wanted to defeat the republic in order to make it stronger and prepare it to fight against the greater evil.
In this rare occurrence, maybe the dark side ending to KOTOR1 was maybe even the Better ending, but obviously morally wrong.
The Jedi we're not ready for the Sith empire. And Revan understood that
Your daily vids are all I look forward too
Genuine question: Did Revan KNEW about Nilus? Because if he didn't, it's not really fair to throw that one solely on his lap. If he knew about the three siths I doubt he would go hunt for the sith empire.
I significantly doubt that revan knew
No, but it was his order to activate the mass shadow generator that created that wound in the force. He may not have intended to create Nihlus, but it was a consequence of his actions
Its quite possible revan know of darth sion, since he was around during exar kun and his war, it's also possible revan knew kreia was possibly slipping into walking down the path into becoming a future sith as he once asked her how best he too could leave the jedi order but it's silly to think he could of known about nihilus especially since he would not have been on his radar yet as a threat
Even if he was responsible, he was also responsible for the restoration of the Mandalorian's under Canderous Ordo/Mandalore the Preserver, who was a key figure in stopping Nihilus, with the Mandalorians being a key fighting force in the battle over Telos IV that led to Nihilus's death.
Even with him leaving the Galaxy for Dromund Kaas (which was the right move as it stopped Vitiate for 300 years), he still helped clean up his own mess.
Nhilus was a product of the mass shadow generator.By that point revan had already left the galaxy afterMandalore told him about the sith in the shadows.
"The Jedi Order was on life support" jedi order almost got the plug pulled too
One of the best videos you’ve ever made on THE BEST video game ever made. Kotor 2. Wow ❤
This being the first was by far the worst as they nearly destroyed the jedi entirely. Revan is given far too much of the blame while he does bare some it doesn't and shouldn't fall squarely on him. Plenty of others deserve to bear the blame as well.
The root of Revan is Latin revenite meaning come back/return. without Revan the Sith would never have returned, and without Revan the Jedi Order would never have returned. The Force demands Balance and Revan was its instrument.
Spot on
Thanks for posting this video Stupendous Wave. I’m really interested in the first Jedi purge that happened three thousand years ago
I say Revan deserves more grace and understanding
This is very disturbing. I went through all of this in kotor2. There's no way Raven knew what will happen. It could he's responsible for his fall and Malak's. Jedi wasn't welcome back just because of Bastila. He was hero and saviour. He deserves more understanding. I agree. First Jedi Purge is way worse than Order 66. Have a great day too😊
Hello there ! Another amazing holocron, as usual. I normally don’t have any suggestions cause I like everything you do but today I do. Could you do something on Meetra Surik ? I know there’s not a lot of lore on the character but for those who never played kotor2, it would be an amazing subject to talk about especially after that holocron !
The problem with Darth Nihilus was that Traya thought she could control him, after she got cast away by Sion and Nihilus is where she actually realized the scale of Nihilus power, she knew that Nihilus had to be stopped becouse at that point Nihilus was already far gone, not caring about sith or jedi, just to feed on his hunger which made him a galactic level threat. He had outpowered Traya and Sion by far and was already reaching his peak. Thats why Traya went out in search for the Exile since she was the only one at that time who could stop him.
I wish tho she didnt, i wouldve loved to see a showdown between Nihilus and Vitiate.
Imagine surviving Darth Nihilus so just you have to deal with the Rampage-tour of Darth Malgus afterwards. The old republic era sith lords were savages!!
Vitiate and Nihilus around at the same time? Good gosh.
the first jedi purge was worse, i don't think that is even argueable. Had Sion and Nihilius not gotten egotistical and kept Traya, the Sith probably would have wiped out the jedi
The path to the dark side is often one that is not always the choice of the force user. That said, Revan's outsized power and knowledge might have kept him safe but for the repeated strife, death, and suffering he and his brethren endured over the course of those conflicts. It cannot be understated how devastating and traumatic waging war is on all. So, for me, Revan should be condemned for his actions during the Mandalorian War because he chose to commit a war crime so great that its reverberations were felt for many years after in the form of Nihilus (not sure on spelling). The lack of trust and outright hatred of Revan after his redemption is very understandable, given that he chose to pursue a selfish course of vengeance. Even if well-intended, Revan abandoned his post when needed, and he truly could have regained the trust and confidence of the Jedi if only he had stayed his hand and helped with the rebuilding. I don't think peace and harmony was in Revan. Ever. And it cost him and his order everything. Great storytelling SW!
I'd love to here more mandalorian lore. Great video as always
This video is much more entertaining than the entire Acolyte show.
My personal feelings on the two main points of this video, a video that was excellent btw, is firstly that Revan wasn't responsible for the 1st purge because it wasn't necessarily his responsibility to hang around and play watch dog for the order. He didn't know about the Triumvirate, though an argument could be made that he should have dismantled the cult he left on Malacor V, assuming he remembered them, however I don't think it's too clear just how much Revan remembers after he rediscovers his identity. On the other hand, I do believe that his decision to embark, alone, into the Unknown Regions was a foolish one, he knew it wasn't just an order of Sith lords who he could confront and best, he was trying to remove the head of an entire empire. Even IF he had been successful, he was one man, the remaining sith would have killed him, then replaced the Emperor and carried on. Perhaps Revan was banking on the Empire falling to infighting which is possible, but the Empire was structured to operate more cooperatively than that, it had an entire council of dark lords who all had the sense and political acumen to realize that they would need to move carefully when trying to fill a power vacuum as large as that of the Emperor. Undoubtedly there would have been a very tense period of infighting between rival lords, but the Empire was hidden from the Jedi Order and Republic, so even if things devolved into a civil war, there would have been plenty of time for the Empire to sort itself out before returning to normal. Revan would have been far better off staying with Bastila, sharing his knowledge with her, their child and any jedi with the sense to listen. The council might very well have dismissed him, after all he was hardly popular with them but just as during the events of the Mandalorian Wars, there would be members of the order who would at least hear him out. He could have paved the way for future jedi to prepare for a future confrontation with the Empire. Now as for which purge was worse, I think that both were equally terrible but in very different ways. The 2nd purge, was explosive, killing thousands of jedi simultaneously across the galaxy before hunting down the few jedi that escaped with ruthless efficiency. The 1st purge was more insidious, a slow creeping death, a cancer that spread its tendrils through out the galaxy to reach out and swallow any jedi unlucky enough to encounter it.
Imagine another series of 9 films covering this period, but done as horror/thriller stories. Super dark and completely removed from the hands of mouse... We can dream...
Why did you cause a purge?
Sidious: to gain control over the antire galaxy!
Nihilus: i was hungry
To be fair he probably had no idea Nihilus even existed, but was well aware that there was a hidden Sith Empire which he felt was a threat the Order and the Republic were ill equipped to confront or defend against. Secondly given what the triumvirate was capable of, and how they operated there is no guarantee that Revan's presence would have even made a difference. It took a "Jedi" who had essentially turned herself into a void of the force to stop Nihilus. Also given how even in all the legends lore relatively rare a redemption of a Sith Lord was he could very easily have been useless against Sion as well. Given the knowledge of the time we have I think it's pretty fair to say he did what he thought was best with the information he had at the time.
Loving the channel 😊
So glad!
Hold on, I only commented I'd like you to do this content yesterday, Impressive, Most Impressive
Hope you enjoyed it!
@TheStupendousWave Absolutely did, wow a reply from The Stupendous himself! Thanks for everything you do , it's the star wars that keeps me going in these dark time's, This Is The Way
"Is the father responsible for the actions of the son? or perhaps the grandson? It was Daruhu Naihilous (Darth Nihilous) who reduced Katarr to a lifeless husk. It was his decision to do so and it is he whom I have discovered how to seek revenge against." -- Dr. Teela Wendan, Miralukan battlefield surgeon.
Revan’s like teflon. Even when he’s wrong, he’s not wrong.
Now this would have been a more than amazing story bringing to the screen.
5:14 "did not announce themselves" IIII see what you did there :)
If it weren’t for the fact that every new piece of Star Wars media seems to show another survivor of the purge I would say that the great purge is worse than the first purge. Mostly because it not only killed the Jedi. It made the practice of being a Jedi illegal and basically wiped the Jedi from the annals of history. it also made it next to impossible to reconstruct the Jedi to the point that at least in legends Luke has a very difficult time at the beginning trying to reform the Jedi order. Even in cannon Luke has a difficult time, but we still haven’t seen a lot of that by comparison. I hope we get a lot more media moving forward that shows Luke rebuilding the order but for now it’s still very vague.
This part of the lore is really interesting
The later Jedi during the Clone Wars would have had no chance against Nihilus, I adore the stories of his unquenchable thirst for power
Nobody truly had a chance against Nhilus.The only reason Meetra could fight him was because of the wound she carried in the force.whenever he tried to feed on her he found nothing there. Just a void. It meant she could end him when nobody else could.
who else can stand up to a planet devouring monstrosity?
I need to get back to my SWOTR playing. Miss that game.
Question I always asked is how after Malachor V, did Meetra Surik and the crew of the Ebon Hawk rebuild the Jedi Order to its former, glory, if not better?
Would love a Holocron diving deep into that lore please
Does the way Nihilus hunted jedi remind anybody of the Predator movie? Or is it just me
This was a harsh time for the Republic and the Jedi(the entire galaxy really). I think they had to deal with four or five galactic wars within the span of fifty years or so and two(three if you count the Kotor 2 stuff) of them were essentially back to back. Not to mention all the crazy monsters of the force running around at the time.
I have a question for you: What ever happened to the officer that allowed the escape pod to leave the star destroyer during episode 4's opening scene? In a sense, that one decision destroyed the Empire. I suspect since Vader was around nothing good happened to him, but I am curious about that.
Revan did what was necessary, even if it was drastic and the Jedi were too afraid to do anything to stop the conflict.
Maybe there were more powerful Sith around during the first Purge. But i still think Order 66 had a far more devestating effect. Like you mentioned, the Jedi during the first purge went into exile like in Order 66, but they did it with a purpose and stayed in contact. They did it in order to collect informations and opportunities to strike back. Order 66 had such an effect that many of the surviving Jedi even stopped thinking of themselves as jedi, like Ahsoka and even Obi Wan. Both events were absolutely devestating for the Jedi, but Order 66 even crushed the fighting spirit and identity part of many surviving Jedi.
I would say that order 66 was far more effective than the Triumvirate Purge, mainly because in the last one, the council survived and with it, the fundamental pilars of the order. But with Order 66, the structure was cut from its roots and the jedi were left leaderless, killing the order as it was known. Until Luke founded his own Jedi Order, which had nothing to do (at least in Legends) with the old jedi order, for it didn't ban the attachments between individuals of its members, and also was taking padawans of any age.
Mitra suric needs her own movie!
Good to see the Triumvirate get the acknowledgment they deserve. Sidious couldn't get the Jedi down to one plus the exiles party who become Jedi.
If there were thousands writers in this era we would see the same thing as Order 66 where they keep inventing survivors. It's good they just jumped 300 years in the future.
I honestly typically like KOTOR 2: Sith Lords more than the original Knights of the Old Republic, but it really can't be overstated how much of bith these event chains hang around the neck if one Revan.
So, maybe this isn't the best place to make a video request, especially since the very topic might've already been covered, if I had just bothered to read, but could we maybe get a video on what it means, in the Jedi, to use different lightsabers, like saber staves, or even two? Honestly, I've often been a fan of both, and it seems something that the Order would just restrict, seeing it as unnecessary, and kyber crystals a valuable commodity, yet among the various Jedi of this era, we see staves, paired sabers, and more, and even Cal Kestis' master, I think, used a staff, while Ahsoka wielded two lightsabers, so could you discuss what these mean, and why, when the Jediboften frowned upon it, in some cases they didn't, and especially what it could mean in a canon where the crystal chooses the Jedi, do to be chosen by two...
Well the mouse would soften the blow by making more Jedi that survived Order 66. Still though, with how many Jedi were around before order 66, those new survivors don't change the overall picture that much. Even if it does get annoying, after a while, with them just adding more and more of them rather than exploring a different era. Then The Acolyte happened and that was an utter disaster. I want more things set before the prequels, specifically pre Rule Of Two but I do not trust Disney to do so in a way that respects the franchise. I didn't even trust them for this before The Acolyte happened. If they are still doing the KotOR remake. or whatever, I don't have faith at all. I'll be happy to be proven wrong because Reven, The Exile, and Bane's stories are among my favorites in the entire Star Wars universe.
I do also love how Reven basically teaches Darth Bane the Rule Of Two and kind of calls out what happened, with the 2 students working together to betray their master, as the reason why the Sith should only have 1 student.
Reven's attempts to take down the Sith Empire didn't go that well, for most of it, but he was kind of right that that faction of the Sith was the bigger threat. Yeah he didn't see the triomverite coming but who knows how it would have ended if he tried to deal with his old master and the Sith Empire just dropped in. That would be a fun alternate timeline story. We do kind of have the legally district from the infinite corridor of Castlevania, introduced in Rebels, so we could see alternate timelines for elseworld stories.
I still can't believe that Disney hasn't touched this entire time period because Revans story specifically would be incredible to tell in a movie series.
Thank God they haven't touched it.
The Jedi Order was very much split on the matter of Revan. If he had remained his presence would have divided the Jedi once more, not united them. Perhaps that would have been better, but striking out to face Vitiate was not an unreasonable decision, especially for one bearing the guilt and doubt that Revan did at that time.
Disneys next plot stage of Star wars should be that the Jedi rebuild with the help of Rey and others. Then, the Sith should be to surprise us with the fact that the rule of 2 was all a ruse and that the sith were in fact rebuilding their army far off in the galaxy.
Considering that Revan was not participating much with the Jedi Order and decided to seek out the Sith Empire to confront Vitiate and was captured and held and tortured directly by Vitiate maybe by his strong will he distracted Vitiate by doing so he did not use the might of the Sith Empire against The Old Republic and Jedi Order fully this is all legends of course what the canon will have to say we have to wait and see if any Movies or shows may bring more information out. Atleast the Sith Troopers name alluded To Darth Revan so Revan is Canon hopefully they will make a Movie about Revan life as Jedi, dark Jedi, Sith Lord, Redeemed Jedi, Prisoner of Vitiate, leader of the Revanchists and going to light side of Force at and of his life .
First purge was not Revans doing. It was Exar Kuns and Ulic Qel-dromas. It was their fall that led Sith like Nihilis and Sion to seek ancient Sith, who were planning that forever. Then we had Kriea, who misunderstood her former student, but herself wanted to preserve his actions.
Personally, I would have loved for some of this lore to have been included in Jedi Survivor. Kal could have put some of this good use.
Because it came hard on the heels of two wars that had decimated the ranks of the Jedi already. And that it was led by an all consuming zombie Sith, who devoured all before him and further decimated the Jedi ranks to that of near extinction. Before they were saved by a Jedi cut from from the force whom he couldn’t defeat.
Even worse news....the real Sith Empire was still growing and the Eternal Empire was gaining strength.
Sending a bunch of force welders against the lord of hunger is like a all you can eat buffet you may as well ring the dinner bell and shout come and get it
An bathe the Jedi sent in various food condiments too. Cuz Nihlus is gonna LITERALLY eat them alive an burp afterwards
@@robertagu5533 I wonder if each force individual tastes different each time Nihlus eats or if it all tastes the same
@@JoeMoody-v3k yeah ikr...? She REALLY DOES taste sweet... Kinda like a sentient Cinnamon Roll...
While that guy tasted more savory... Similar to a BBQ Rib... While that other one wasnt Human but looked kinda like that one fruit over on that one planet... An they sorta tasted like it too
What if the council was correct from the beginning? Yes, the Mandalorians would have conquered the republic, but Canderous in kotor 2 raises the question if that would have been the better outcome. The jedi, including Revan, paired with the mandalorians, would have been a formidable force to resist Vitiate's sith empire. If they had waited for the true threat to reveal itself, then they might have been able to fight against it properly. Revan went to war and left the galaxy in shambles by defeating the mandalorians. This we saw in Kotor 2. Just think how formidable a force the mandalorians would be aided by the jedi, especially if the jedi had discovered the star forge and been able to use it to resist the ancient sith empire as well. Revan succeeded in the end, though his rash and absolute decision making may have only made it a much more difficult route to take. A republic surrender would have saved more lives. Mandalorian rule would have strengthened a republic that was already dying a slow death before any mandalorian invasion ever occurred. Atris may have had a point when condemning the actions of Revan and his followers when she chastised Meetra Surik on Telos.
Revan caused Vitiate's plan to go as well as it ever could have. He didn't want the mandalorians to conquer the republic. He wanted to eliminate any and all resistance he could, the mandalorians included. Revan succeeded in doing just that. He destroyed the mandalorians and left the republic crippled and dying. After his return as a Sith, Revan started mending these mistakes by attempting to build an empire powerful enough to fight Vitiate. He failed a second time, however, succeeding only in bringing the republic and jedi order to the brink of collapse. Revan only managed to succeed in the end by delaying the sith empires invasion of the republic long enough for the republic to rebuild and strengthen itself. Maybe the wars he caused strengthened them by hardening the republic and preparing it for battle. That's the only argument to be made. Because Revan was otherwise responsible for countless lives lost to war and nearly crippling the republic beyond repair. His true redemption was being able to delay an assault on the galaxy he had shattered to pieces. Revan was always doing the right thing in his heart, but his actions were truly catastrophic in leading a jedi rebellion against the mandalorians.
Does anyone know the name of the song that he plays that's all dark and brooding?
Some say Revan is a traitor, others say he is a savior. I say... a Revan Star Wars movie directed by Dave Filoni with Keanu Reeves as Revan would FKing AMAZINGGG
If they ever make a live action movie about the old republic they need to cast Keanu Reeves as Revan. Considering how disney has done so far with star wars my hopes aren't high, if they did announce it I wouldn't get excited they'll probably ruin it.
Its not all Revan's fault; only about 15 %. There is a lot of blame to go around.
Because of the damn Sith Emperor, if you wanted to be real picky you could go all the way back to the Daragon twins rediscovering Korriban, which allowed Naga Sadow to gain power.
But the immediate historical period of the Purge begins with Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-Droma and the Great Sith War. Followed a generation later with Act 2: The Mandalorian Wars culminating at Malachor V. Act 3 would be the return/redemption of Revan, and more importantly, the return of Meetra Surik to defeat the Sith Triumvirate.
And since we know from SWTOR that the Sith Emperor was behind both the Mandalorian Wars and the resulting evens that led to KOTOR 1 and SWTOR, it could be considered two separate but related purges, first of the Old Jedi Order and then 300 years later, the rebuilt Jedi Order of Surik's apprentices at The Battle of Coruscant. So from a later historical perspective you could lump those two events together.
In terms of blame and damage, it probably goes
Darth Nihilus
Revan and Malak
The Sith Emperor
Exar Kun
The Old Jedi Order itself - mainline leadership too hesitant to act when necessary and refusing to support or foster understanding between cliques within the order; left the groups to essentially radicalize (see the Draayists on Taris, the Revanists, and Kreia/Arren Kae and her philosophies/actions).
Darth Traya / Kreia / Arren Kae - specifically her nihilism and lack of personal responsibility.
Darth Sion and his Sith Assassins
I still think it's the jedi council fault. They abandoned the Republic during the Mandalorian wars forcing Revan, Malek, and Meetra to go fight a war the weren't ready for. This lead to battles like Dxun where Meetra order her men to charge a mine field. The war broke everyone who entered and what did the council do to the one person who returned they exiled her. Showing everyone who fell to the dark side what would happen if they went back. During the jedi Civil war to my knowledge none of them besides the battle master even fought in the war. they also erased Revans memories so he didnt even know why he was so afraid of the unknown area of the galaxy. So he had to leave to figure it out. They also made it so he could never have a student so everything he found out about both sides of the force was never passed on. Then when the purge happened they used other jedi as bait. So yeah the council of that time just sucked.
Should have made a show about this era instead of the acolyte
I love when Jedi Purges happen 👏🏾
& I especially love how effective Order 66 was when it was initiated.
#TeamDarkSide
Man... I wish this was all canonical....
The jedi order had no idea who was hunting them down?.. Seriously?.. They had that many enemies?.
I'm taking a shot every time he says jedi...
Where Jedi gather, Jedi die...
The first one was definitely worse in my opinion simply because of the threat it posed. The empire was bad, yes, but in the end, it was an oppressive system. Nihlus, however, was a threat to all life. If he wasn’t stopped, nothing would be left.
Your videos are incredible. I am new to Star Wars and this channel is great to gain knowledge of the old republic period
Much appreciated!
So the lore is different from the game ?
it's a good thing that the jedi became dissilusioned, imagine if they had faced all this destruction from fallen jedi and they didn't question jedi teachings. it would show that they learned absolutely nothing.
Can someone explain if and how the Jedi of the clone wars era would compare to the ancient sith like nihilus
Honestly the Jedi Civil war killed far more Jedi than the Sith purge ever did. Revan killed tons of Jedi that didn’t turn to the dark side, and then those that did eventually were killed by him too when he converted back to the light side. Nihilus and Scion killed about a hundred Jedi, Revan took out thousands.
Kotor 2 had an amazing story! I recommend everyone to play it!
Revan didn’t help but nihilius and sion hunted what remained of the Jedi to near extinction
Revan both need to be understood, and chatised. Yes, he had to do most of it, but he didn't prepare the Jedi to hold themselves in his absence.
I see Darth Nihil...... Click!!
To much evil Darkside now in Star Wars, I just stick to the movies from Originally Star War, The Empire Strikes Back, Renturn of The Jedi, The Phantom Menance, The Attack of The Clone, and the revenge of the Sith
Revan was never truly redeemed. The Sith Emperor completed his fall to the dark side and made him his slave before the Jedi Civil War. Then the Jedi planned a trap and gave him a new identity as a solider of the republic. Pretending to not know him and retrain him as a jedi to defeat Malik. Being used by both sides for their purposes is cruel.
Will the old era ever get animated 😢
I would say order 66 was wise. It lead to there being only two known Jedi left with a third exiled into a far past of the galaxy and a fourth who wasn't a Jedi anymore.
Idk if the order still had enough members to have a Jedi sanctuary/temple(dantooine) they didn't get hit as bad as order 66
Do you reckon the old republic should become movies? (After Disney fucks off first of course) Or should the old republic stay in games.
I would actually prefer a multitude of TV series. There's just so much lore and history there that you can't shove it all into a few movies. TV series allow better wirld budding, character development, etc.
They need to do a {Revan Movie} that ply (keanu reeves) to ply this role of Revan as the main characters
The more I study at this library the more I understand the force ,order 66 literally happened over night personally I believe that makes it worse ,revenge does deserve mild grace because he was corrupted by the darkside and the jedi always seem to have heads up there ass ,plus once he came to he knew to track the source of the problem
Where did all this lore come from? I'll guess it came after Disney's takeover of Lucasfilm. Ghosts? Raising the dead and taking over their bodies to fight? Feeding off the life force of an entire planet? People can write anything they want, that doesn't mean they should. "Star Wars" is NOT "X-Men."
Bruh was sucking the souls out they body😭😭😭
Honestly I’m hoping to see season 2 of the acolytes the end of 1 was very very interesting. 🤷♂️
I think that weren't Revans fault. he did a logical choise. Galaxy was destroyed by a three wars level of Clone wars. He did what he thought it was best option and, be honest, we will all do same if we were in his skin and we are moraly right. He couldn't know that he made a devestating machine called Darth Nilus in a proces. Plus, he were brain washed by dark side When he used it. True, he coused Jedi civile war, but he was feld up with a hate from last war. he didn't know what he started. And, at the end of day, He rejected place i Jedi Concuil, that brings you power. And rejectng power can do only truly good peapole.
Hole his life, exept his dark side period, he whanted to protect Galaxy. But, all his hard work to protect Galaxy and then to clean trash he left after his dark side period, ment noting.
If not for revan going back looking for the treath the sith empire would have attacked, that was afther all vicious plan, but the changed his mmind once revan returned. and the jedi order and the new republic would have been doomed. they would have no chance at all of defeating the sith empire with its large armys and its thousands of forcewilders. hell even 200 years in the further the war was at best a stalemate between the two forces with the sith empire having the uper hand and that was with around 200 years of recovery for the jedi order and the republic beeing able to rebuild their forces.