CIG's video on their RUclips channel, Erin Roberts talks about the roadmap: Star Citizen: Reverse the Verse LIVE - Two-in-One Special ruclips.net/video/sZEMOOkB59o/видео.html
@friendlyspacedragon7250 Agreed but CIG calls the since February 2022, non existing roadmap, still a roadmap on their website and Spectrum. People are so gaslighted, they still ask for updates to the roadmap.
The guy in the interview said it: "We put in what we are pretty sure we can do." Therefore I would say, for the first time ever, the roadmap is now quite accurate.
_"what we are pretty sure we can do"_ They've had an obvious self-assessment of competency problem for the past 13 years. Literally nothing should be taken with any degree of relative confidence until AFTER they've proven they can do it at least 3 times in succession. THEN you can be sure that they're "pretty sure" they can deliver. As of now they have way too much confidence for a developer that has not once ever, on literally anything, delivered what was promised, on time. Literally nothing. It's either late or a broken mess.... *_and usually both._*
Yeah, there never was a roadmap. Even if you disregard any dares etc on what cig published as roadmaps they didnt follow them. They didnt work on stuff they said they were currently on and didnt move to the next thing either.
Becareful, we are not allowed to show or feel frustrated, the fan boys will show up and attack you. I was reported for saying that it was 'r worded' that Quantum travel wasn't worked. These people are petty losers.
I started playing SC in 2021(backed 2013), and I was honestly impressed. I started right before Orison's release, so I was under the assumption content was coming quickly. Since January 2022, basically nothing has happened. Salvage T0 if you want to count click-and-hold-LMB as gameplay.
legally they are obliged to fully inform the customers of the status of their product. they refuse to. they should be shut down or forced to sell to microsoft.
Wouldn't that be ironic if Microsoft were to, yet again, come to CRs rescue? But alas I don't think MS is ever going to touch this project even with a mile-long stick.
Microsoft is evil. No thanks. Id rather the project vanish into the vaporware ether and stay there until it's public domain.... before I support it going to microsoft.
Excuse me!? Microsoft or any other company would be profoundly stupid to buy them. CIG has created a 10-20 year backlog of sold ships that they haven't delivered. At their burn rate of cash this is somewhere near 2 Billion dollars, and while it might not be a legal debt it would DESTROY any shreds of value to say 'we aren't honoring past purchases'.
@@RN1441 Nah. If they were to buy the company, assuming it has value, they'd buy the tech and axe the game. Microsoft previously published then later discontinued an earlier Chris Roberts game, Freelancer, which is what @avon_c6199 was alluding to. A shame since it was a fine game for 2003. Kinda like X3 but only 1 ship at a time and multiplayer. By today's standards it would be considered an indie game.
For CIG, all plans are BS. The only thing that matters for them is to deliver things that we didn't ask for and aren't fun. 'Hey we didn't finish what you really wanted and so we just forgot about it. But here! This cool tedious thing that you're gonna hate - good luck and screw you'.
The only way this starts getting fixed is we all step away and show CIG it's time to nut up or shut up. Close your wallets.
5 дней назад+4
- Hello backers, here's the roadmap. - Nice. Hey, there's some stuff you haven't done. Are you following it? - Damn you, roadmap watchers! YOU, TAKE IT DOWN! - O.o
A roadmap really only made sense to track all the canned features and how basic roadmap milestones never really got realized. As a plan & progress overview it was useless, roadmaps and progress trackers are for companies who have an atleast basic understanding of timelines, deadlines and milestones😂
@@nuanil wow, seriously? Somebody from Turbulent really needs to have a word with this guy as this kind of thing reflects badly on CIG. I stopped using Spectrum years ago because of their heavy handed moderation, and I'm sure others have too.
CIG previously flushed all these entries onto their "Roadmap" to give the impression that progress was going to happen and to get everyone hyped, eventhough I would brazenly claim that they already must've been able to surmise that a lot of these items would fall off the back and... surprise surprise...they kept delaying or deleting a lot of these items several times over the years. They ultimately deleted the "pesky Roadmap" that we once used to know, when CIG probably realized that they couldn't pull this marketing bullshit on us anymore and in the process started to gaslight us for "expecting too much" from their poor poor Indie Dev Studio.
To make a roadmap for a video game, you need three things: a plan, a calendar, and developers who can give an accurate, honest assessment of how long it will likely take them to do their jobs. The plan, in turn, is comprised of a DETAILED list of to-do items and the order in which they need to be done. This informs both the developers' assessments and the overall roadmap. CIG can't make a roadmap because they don't have a plan. They have no idea how their systems work with their other systems, so they can't have a plan because a plan would expose those conflicts and cause one or more systems to change to resolve them. (Not going to post my rant about FPS vs. Medical again, anyone who has read my comments on that probably remembers it.) Instead we have conflicting systems in the game for years and years and the only changes they get make the conflicts worse, not better. This lack of a plan also means that even when developers accurately estimate how long their work will take - which is rare at CIG - there's a high chance they get pulled onto a different task instead of finishing the work they were already assigned. To use an analogy that's in the news lately, the day-to-day operation of a game studio is a lot like fighting fires. You assess what you need to do and what order it needs to happen in - in other words, you make a plan first - and then you focus on knocking out your objectives one at a time in order of importance. You don't try to put out 50% of two fires at once. You focus on putting out 100% of one fire, and once that is DONE, then you can migrate resources to the other fire. Real fire management, and real game development, is a lot more complicated than this, of course. Once you dig all the trenches you need for backburns on the first fire, for example, you can go ahead and send the picks and shovels over to start containing the second fire. But the key point is you got finished with the step of the process you were on first. You got something DONE. You didn't dig a trench only halfway around the fire and just leave it to go do something else. Instead CIG is taking the "whichever one looks the hottest at this exact moment" approach, because they have no plan. No plan means a roadmap isn't possible. I'm also not sure if they own a calendar, but that's another debate.
@austinm5630 If CIG cannot or doesn't want to give us a roadmap, fine. However, CIG shouldn't call a release view for the very next patch a roadmap. CIG shouldn't call a progress tracker that does not track progress a roadmap. Neither are a roadmap, this is my point. Calling them a roadmap, which CIG does on their webpage, is gaslighting.
Amazing how broken it is. Even if they don't have a roadmap, I assume they work Agile and they could publish the QBR and OKR. We should push CIG to not develop/release specifically for events and sales. I notice the same repeating patern in 4.0.1, why do they release a hotfix for SaltEMike but they do nothing for the rest of us who are in this broken 4.0 mess for a month? Are they saving 4.0.1 for the Chinese New Year, will they get to play a stable game during their holiday? Or is it for the 2024 ships re-sale, or for the new MISC Fortune? Stop this nonsense! Get people back into a stable game!
Seeing that old roadmap from 2021 is such an eye opener. I’m shocked CIG get away with promising features and selling ships. But when it comes to delivering, “roadmap watchers!!!”
I honestly wonder if the roadmap was canned on the advice of legal counsel. i.e. CIG were seemingly (in some but not all cases) using the roadmap as a tool to advertise the game. Specifically advertising "upcoming features" it had no intent or ability to provide on that or any known timeline. Thus making the game look like a tasty slice of cake when it's actually just a cardboard prop. .... OK I just got to half way through your video and you make the same argument lol.
What we have since 2022 is not a roadmap Release view for the very next patch is not a roadmap Progress tracker when a bar ends does not mean the task is finished, there is no % finished, tells nothing
The thing that always amuses me, is that the progress tracker does not track progress - it lists the plans for when things are being worked on long term. Meanwhile the roadmap tells what is the progress of the current patch. So the progress tracker is more of a roadmap than the roadmap is, while the roadmap is more of a progress tracker than the progress tracker is.
Verse project roadmap is very clear. I suggest all Citizens to keep an eye on the Verse Project. Currently in hangar module state. But roadmap by years end shoud have mercury, venus, earth and the moon
Looks more like a BS list of lies, unless it’s just a list from a group of blatantly ignorant people that has no idea of the reality of what they can actually get done. With a roadmap like you just showed us, it had over half the goals taken off? My boss wouldn’t ok a month and a half off of work and I would probably get fired.
Keep up the good work, keep pointing out all the bullshite otherwise they will just keep getting away with it. The guy left that was brought on to do the road map, who then was just moved to general community team duty’s. Unfortunately they seem unwilling to be honest about what they are actual doing each year and it doesn’t help with them wanting to hold back spoilers for citizencon.
If Chris Roberts and his brother are not in charge when they say we will have a roadmap. Then its gone. Who is calling the shots? I think the devs have gone rouge. we dont have the devs we used to have. Not all of them. dont buy ships then maybe Roberts will get serious. The devs have a responsibility to stay within a working guideline and plan. If they dont , then they should be fired. We need internal pressure in CIG to the extent there is really some self reflection and fixing.
It could be that the 'devs have gone rogue' but we can be pretty sure Chris caused that. We know from past interviews where Chris himself stated that he does things that he thinks are good but really are extremely destructive to technology development. He said that he fires or at least doesn't listen to people who (paraphrasing) "get passive aggressive when he asks for something and try to suggest other ways of doing it." If Chris knew everything and intimately understood every aspect of the technology under discussion it would be good for him to call BS on people trying to avoid doing hard work. Time has proven that Chris is extremely out of his depth and what that really means is that when he asks for something literally impossible, or a mutually exclusive set of dependencies he doesn't accept no for an answer. What is a developer to do in that case? You dutifully start working towards the impossible goal, maybe you'll find a way there but more likely you'll just go in circles since it's impossible but you want to look busy until Chris forgets why you were doing that and tells you to boil a different ocean. Given the amount of stupidly ambitious stuff that CIG has said they were doing over the years only to have them now start cutting deep into their supposedly sold scope, it really does look like Chris is totally out of his depth and has no understanding of the implications of what he's asking for so it's no wonder people under him both can't hit the stated goals but also appear to have gone rogue. As a technology project leader you have to have good people and be willing to take and trust their feedback. If you find someone BSing you, you have to deal with it, but even if someone tells you something can't be done when it can they might be trying to make it clear they don't feel confident delivering and you should help them out or reassign them.
@neonsamurai1348 I still don't think Star Citizen is a scam. However, Star Citizen is terribly managed by the people on the very top, this includes Chris.
@@Camural Considering they are paying out dividends on 'profits' to investors, from people 'donating' to fund the game, and they do not have an actual finished product. I think it qualifies as fraud/scam. Generally speaking when you donate to a project like a Kickstarter, the money is supposed to go to development/production and salaries, not investors. The idea is that you give them enough money to get a product to market, and then derive profit from that.
they are everywhere and nowhere devs all over the place doing whatever they want to do not a single specific thing and if it works it works if it doesnt they decide to just throw it away or move it from 1 update to another just so they can say they are doing something which clearly they are not just so they can fill a slide of empty promises , THEY ARE INCOMPETENT .
I don't give CIG any more money, and I highly suggest anyone getting into the game to not spend past a starter package. Either the Avenger, Nomad, or Cutlass. Just play the game, and don't support them until they start respecting their customers.
CIG: We put this thing on the roadmap aaaaaaaaaaaaand... it's gone. Players: What do you mean, I just saw it on the roadmap? CIG: Not anymore, *poof*, the roadmap is gone !
I guess if they are only putting stuff in they are sure they can do, it is maybe more accurate not having anything in the roadmap I guess. I do remember a lot of people gave the project a hard time over things not making it to the roadmap. The lack of a good roadmap is my biggest complaint about the way things are right now. Whilst I didn't expect everything to go to plan, it was interesting watching how things progressed and what was hoped to be done. Now we are kept in the dark feeling there is no plan and just a broken project, with us having to read between the lines of person A saying X and person B saying Z.
This is in particular an issue because if its failed planning, CIG works a lot of functions they are finally unable to deliver. And as the game progress, old abandonned development became incompatible and must be restart from scratch At least they will now have to be recoded for server meshing ... Imagine the number of 3d models, code and partial ships that are rotting on CIG servers.
Embarrassed to say I've sank over 18k USD on this game, easily my crowning achievement of bad life choices. At this point, I'm done- just freaking done. Less on learned and I didn't even get the t-shirt.
Roadmap what roadmap? They had a marketing tool that got seen through and a 'progress tracker' that was nothing but a knee jerk reaction to some bad press they got and was never intended to track anything.
The issue with monitoring the road map like you appear to be doing, could be seen as Roadmap Watching like CIG stated. If an item is on the roadmap for development it does not mean that it will be implemented in game. Due to this type of view, I completely understand that items would not be listed on a roadmap. I thought the roadmap was for development, not implementation. Am I wrong?
It should just be a giant list of features sold to people with the date of marketing. Then a list right next to it of features fully flushed out from that list with a date on the year when they plan to do a rework on it. I mean, when they finally do get a system that works and is fully flushed out.. Hopefully 2030`s is a better decade for em!
As long as people are still giving CIG money, they will never learn. Of course hiding the roadmap is futile. We know that some of the things promised for this year have been on the roadmap years ago. Zero-G push pull for example. Is any of that in the game already?
They should rename Star Citizen to Sunk Cost Fallacy. people will never stop giving CR money because they bought into a dream and don't want to admit they wasted all that money, and over a decade, on an obvious conjob from an obvious con man.
Lol love the new ship sale , please buy every ship we released in 2024 with LTI . Why do they have sales during holidays ? It's Christmas, instead of buying gifts for the family spend a grand on our crap game (you might not fly to the center of a planet on a good day) , don't pay rent during Thanksgiving, buy a persius that you will need 14 people you can't pay in real cash to install the game to fly . I can't pay my friends to even install the game .
maybe nothing they are not progress ? But I think they need more time to do the base construction. They'll push the deadlines again because of that.
5 дней назад
I would like my money back I don't want to stay in the scam. I want my money back the 890 Jump isn't the ship that was promised. I don't want to stay in community that cyberstalks you
I wouldn't be surprised if later this year they will reupload or update the roadmap again... Just of course with lot's of change's and for sure lot's of them not for the benefit of the Player base... But i wonder if CIG never heard of the fact that once you upload something into tje web with a wife spread audience, there will always be traces of evidence! Which in cig just increases the trust from tje community into their game
Roadmap?! They'll need months to get 4.x back to 3.2x levels of content and stability and (dumb) ppl think meshing 'delivered' because they can experience unplayability when the servers meet the planned target of players \o/
Don't worry 4.01 will be out this week ? with a new pointless ship and ship sales all will be saved, no problems hear please move along look at the new shiny ship over there for real money, just don't look at the broken patch
I agree with CIG to make no roadmap. If you can´t deliver promised change, then its better to say nothing :-). For my point of view the most important is to fix bugs and issues which are for long time in game. Make a stable game. Maybe therefore its neccessary to re-write the base code. This looks like, they aren´t able to do this and all others are not interest for me and therefore i don´t need an roadmap.
I uninstalled this shit show last week and won't come back again till this game ever gets done? The hell in just trying to play a game so unstable is a big waste of time. Shame, the artists kicked ass on the graphics of this game but that's basically the only good thing of the game. Maybe 2026? At this point, what difference does it make??
never cared much for the roadmap since CIG also mostly did not stick to it for the last 3-4 years, so what's even the point? I care about content drops every 3-ish months, as long as they somewhat manage that i am okay with it and tbh i am also ok with kinda having that "oh, thats coming? cool" moment instead of seeing something on the roadmap that hypes you up for months and then its not coming. Just keep quiet, work on your stuff and then bring it into the game when its ready.
@th3orist If CIG wants to remove the roadmap, fine, but don't call a release view for the very next patch only a "roadmap". Don't call a progress tracker, that does not track progress a "roadmap". And Erin should not be in front of the camera and say February 2019: _"We put into the roadmap what we are pretty damn sure we can do._ *Erin's words not my words.* This was never true, not in 2019, not in 2020, not in 2021 and since February 2022 we don't have a roadmap anymore.
@Camural maybe i became a cynic many years ago but truth to be told i never really took anything these guys said at face value. History of the game told us countless times that they are always off with their predictions and plans. And tbh since i turned that side off i have much more fun being a sc backer 👍
@Camural it was the meme with spiederman when the boss was laughing then he looks at Peter Parker and said "you're serious ?" CIG is a joke with their roadmap ^^'
@@Camural well at this moment there is still enough space, its a small station. With all of us being gaslighted the living space is running out soon. Im already there so we can be neighbours
No one has believed in the Waterfall Model for software development in decades. It has always been folly and it is extremely well documented that it is folly. We do not want multi-quarter release view back! It is useless, creates terrible code and is extremely demotivating for the development team because any large-scale project will inevitably fail those goals. Stop nagging about getting it back, because if you manage to convince CIG to do what you want you will, quite seriously, have killed the game.
@sc_cintara Maybe you should watch my video? Where did I say I want the roadmap back? Is this a chatgpt bot? I said: If CIG wants to remove the roadmap, fine, but don't call a release view for the very next patch only a "roadmap". Don't call a progress tracker, that does not track progress a "roadmap". And Erin should not be in front of the camera and say February 2019: _"We put into the roadmap what we are pretty damn sure we can do._ *Erin's words not my words.* This was never true, not in 2019, not in 2020, not in 2021 and since February 2022 we don't have a roadmap anymore.
@@Camural I am sorry, I seem to have misunderstood. All your examples of delays and moved features in the old Release View seem to have confused me. You made a video only to scold Spectrum posters for using the word "Roadmap" wrongly?
@@Camural Or is it that the "Progress Tracker" is placed under the heading "Roadmap" that you want changed? Also, why don't you think the progress tracker tracks progress? It is the work schedule for the year and it shows exactly what they are working on. It is directly linked from their internal task-ticket system (Jira). If that isn't what you want, and you don't want a correctly predicting Waterfall plan for what they will achieve beyond the next quarter (which no large software project can give you), what is it you want? (I mean, apart from the game working perfectly and being done the day after they started working on it, like we all wish 😉). Are you just looking for them to change the heading under which the Progress Tracker is placed?
Where did I upvote myself? When you post a reply on Spectrum it gets an automated upvote by your "ghost". How about you go to Spectrum and try it, before accusing me of upvoting myself?
when a bunch of babys crys everyday cause they dont want or know to read before criticism this happen. Road map was a guide of intentions , as any road map , but people its been calling CiG useless and liers due to road map soo completly reasonable they have stop updating it as it was clear people now adays does not give a fuck about anything its not theyr selfish point of view. So I completly understand what they have done with the road map. I Would be piss off too , gaming community today its a toxic baby cryer.
@luampastudio62 1. Please watch your language 2. There are definitions of "roadmap", you might want to look it up. A roadmap should be honest, a roadmap should not be a marketing tool to sell more ships, a roadmap should not be a wish list. 3. Of course not every item has to make it in time, there can be unforeseen difficulties. However, if items were on the roadmap 4 years ago and are still nowhere to be seen, is this a roadmap? 4. Erin Roberts clearly stated in February 2019: "We put in what we are pretty sure we can do". This was never true, not in 2019, not in 2020, not in 2021. 5. People like you who are defending everything CIG does are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
I do not know in which world you live. In my world - financing and business development of innovative tech companies on an international level- the term „roadmap“ is pretty clear. The reasonable(!) outline of steps planned to bring a project further on. Of course everybody knows that a roadmap may be a too optimistic especially when it comes to convince investors. CIG used the roadmap heavily for marketing reasons which is ok. Marketing - especially crowdfunding- works on trust. So whatever you do in your public communication, it should somehow contribute to build up trust. Even IF you apply some weird different definitions of what a roadmap should be, the „the build up trust“-rule is still to be fulfilled. Of course delays and adjusting a roadmap is accepted. However there are some experiences when stakeholder’s patience gets exhausted and critical reaction of stakeholders will start. Good assumption is: Three major delays/changes/game changing events are acceptable…afterwards major discussions and analysis of the basic and general plans and structures start. Which may lead to the point to cancel everything and write off the status so far. Now, tell me, how many major changes (to give the whole development chaos a diplomatic description) have we seen in the last 10 years (i do not count the first three years as setting up such an organization from zero to 1000+ people is indeed an major challenge for itself). For sure far far more than three. With an regular investor/publisher CR‘s career would have been continued as usual by him getting fired. And we would have today a good game with a nice gaming experience and a solid fan base.
You are lying to yourself and trying to confuse people. Roadmap was a big fraud program to make ppl believe that something happening and make them spend more. When ppl got sick of it CIG removed roadmap, and started to tell everyone that roadmap is not roadmap, but list of wishes.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
CIG's video on their RUclips channel, Erin Roberts talks about the roadmap:
Star Citizen: Reverse the Verse LIVE - Two-in-One Special ruclips.net/video/sZEMOOkB59o/видео.html
The only accurate road map that CIG cares about is the Funding tracker.😂
And it seems they had the best december ever. Unexpected
They certainly optimized that shit long ago.
💯
@@TypicalDutchSaysHi Were they YoY on par again with funding in 2023, or did they fall short still?
Fact
Can't be wrong about the roadmap if you don't publish a roadmap. Big thinkin'.
@friendlyspacedragon7250 Agreed but CIG calls the since February 2022, non existing roadmap, still a roadmap on their website and Spectrum. People are so gaslighted, they still ask for updates to the roadmap.
The guy in the interview said it: "We put in what we are pretty sure we can do."
Therefore I would say, for the first time ever, the roadmap is now quite accurate.
_"what we are pretty sure we can do"_
They've had an obvious self-assessment of competency problem for the past 13 years. Literally nothing should be taken with any degree of relative confidence until AFTER they've proven they can do it at least 3 times in succession. THEN you can be sure that they're "pretty sure" they can deliver.
As of now they have way too much confidence for a developer that has not once ever, on literally anything, delivered what was promised, on time. Literally nothing. It's either late or a broken mess.... *_and usually both._*
made my day xD
“Roadmap watchers”? Can they ever put out a public statement about their failures without at least one little dig against backers?
No. CR hates all of us.
No.
What the fuck was this ending? Injecting a sandwich, turning on top of the vehicle. 🤣😂😂
Rule Number 1 of the Roadmap:
"We don't talk about the Roadmap".
Insert Coach Beard screaming "NO ROADMAP!"
That's why they got rid of the roadmap guy
@Clifton_Dynamite2020 Did they? Do you have any details?
@@Camuralhe was fired a few weeks ago
@@Camural Jake Acapella left CIG a month or two ago. No details on what or why he left, but he was the person that updated the "tracker"
Jake was another useless employee.
That´s when you confuse "Millestones" with "Millions". Fund-Tracker still working.
Yes this is not a roadmap anymore
CIG put things onto the old roadmap they knew couldn't be done so they could sell more ships
Yeah, there never was a roadmap.
Even if you disregard any dares etc on what cig published as roadmaps they didnt follow them. They didnt work on stuff they said they were currently on and didnt move to the next thing either.
No roadmap = game is finished. Right? Right? lol. A plan to the finish line would be nice.
Becareful, we are not allowed to show or feel frustrated, the fan boys will show up and attack you. I was reported for saying that it was 'r worded' that Quantum travel wasn't worked. These people are petty losers.
At least you can still get some laughs out of messing around with Flicka! 😂 That emergency sandwich injection was great 🤣
"These people are brainwashed. What is happening, this isn't real?! There needs to be a study on this!!"
-Shroud
I started playing SC in 2021(backed 2013), and I was honestly impressed. I started right before Orison's release, so I was under the assumption content was coming quickly.
Since January 2022, basically nothing has happened. Salvage T0 if you want to count click-and-hold-LMB as gameplay.
legally they are obliged to fully inform the customers of the status of their product.
they refuse to.
they should be shut down or forced to sell to microsoft.
Wouldn't that be ironic if Microsoft were to, yet again, come to CRs rescue?
But alas I don't think MS is ever going to touch this project even with a mile-long stick.
Imagine Sony buys it and we see some of the tech in Helldivers 3 in five years.
Microsoft is evil. No thanks. Id rather the project vanish into the vaporware ether and stay there until it's public domain.... before I support it going to microsoft.
Excuse me!? Microsoft or any other company would be profoundly stupid to buy them. CIG has created a 10-20 year backlog of sold ships that they haven't delivered. At their burn rate of cash this is somewhere near 2 Billion dollars, and while it might not be a legal debt it would DESTROY any shreds of value to say 'we aren't honoring past purchases'.
@@RN1441
Nah. If they were to buy the company, assuming it has value, they'd buy the tech and axe the game. Microsoft previously published then later discontinued an earlier Chris Roberts game, Freelancer, which is what @avon_c6199 was alluding to.
A shame since it was a fine game for 2003. Kinda like X3 but only 1 ship at a time and multiplayer. By today's standards it would be considered an indie game.
For CIG, all plans are BS. The only thing that matters for them is to deliver things that we didn't ask for and aren't fun. 'Hey we didn't finish what you really wanted and so we just forgot about it. But here! This cool tedious thing that you're gonna hate - good luck and screw you'.
Or... it's a wishlist for devs... who cares about users? They'll buy ships anyway (and soon, gameplay packages, star systems...)
Roads? Where we going, we don't need no roads.
I can't believe people still give that company millions of dollars a year
The only way this starts getting fixed is we all step away and show CIG it's time to nut up or shut up. Close your wallets.
- Hello backers, here's the roadmap.
- Nice. Hey, there's some stuff you haven't done. Are you following it?
- Damn you, roadmap watchers! YOU, TAKE IT DOWN!
- O.o
A roadmap really only made sense to track all the canned features and how basic roadmap milestones never really got realized. As a plan & progress overview it was useless, roadmaps and progress trackers are for companies who have an atleast basic understanding of timelines, deadlines and milestones😂
[Deleted by Nightrider-CIG] (sorry, couldn't resist it! ;) )
@@operator9858 I got banned last month last for a week because I made a comment about how some other guy was gonna get banned for his comments.
Did you know you can't say the word "cult" on spectrum...
@@nuanil wow, seriously? Somebody from Turbulent really needs to have a word with this guy as this kind of thing reflects badly on CIG. I stopped using Spectrum years ago because of their heavy handed moderation, and I'm sure others have too.
@@SuburbanFox yup, because "i was discussing moderation."
Your laugh brigthens my day everytime! At least CIgreed is good for that...to make you and us laugh!
I've lost faith in SC. But I find your videos about it very entertaining.
The only Roadmap this game is on is when it will get cancelled.
Can you imagine believing they will catch up with the ship backlog...
CIG previously flushed all these entries onto their "Roadmap" to give the impression that progress was going to happen and to get everyone hyped, eventhough I would brazenly claim that they already must've been able to surmise that a lot of these items would fall off the back and... surprise surprise...they kept delaying or deleting a lot of these items several times over the years.
They ultimately deleted the "pesky Roadmap" that we once used to know, when CIG probably realized that they couldn't pull this marketing bullshit on us anymore and in the process started to gaslight us for "expecting too much" from their poor poor Indie Dev Studio.
The roadmap goes from Chris Robert's wife desire for a recording studio straight to your wallet.
To make a roadmap for a video game, you need three things: a plan, a calendar, and developers who can give an accurate, honest assessment of how long it will likely take them to do their jobs. The plan, in turn, is comprised of a DETAILED list of to-do items and the order in which they need to be done. This informs both the developers' assessments and the overall roadmap.
CIG can't make a roadmap because they don't have a plan. They have no idea how their systems work with their other systems, so they can't have a plan because a plan would expose those conflicts and cause one or more systems to change to resolve them. (Not going to post my rant about FPS vs. Medical again, anyone who has read my comments on that probably remembers it.) Instead we have conflicting systems in the game for years and years and the only changes they get make the conflicts worse, not better. This lack of a plan also means that even when developers accurately estimate how long their work will take - which is rare at CIG - there's a high chance they get pulled onto a different task instead of finishing the work they were already assigned.
To use an analogy that's in the news lately, the day-to-day operation of a game studio is a lot like fighting fires. You assess what you need to do and what order it needs to happen in - in other words, you make a plan first - and then you focus on knocking out your objectives one at a time in order of importance. You don't try to put out 50% of two fires at once. You focus on putting out 100% of one fire, and once that is DONE, then you can migrate resources to the other fire. Real fire management, and real game development, is a lot more complicated than this, of course. Once you dig all the trenches you need for backburns on the first fire, for example, you can go ahead and send the picks and shovels over to start containing the second fire. But the key point is you got finished with the step of the process you were on first. You got something DONE. You didn't dig a trench only halfway around the fire and just leave it to go do something else.
Instead CIG is taking the "whichever one looks the hottest at this exact moment" approach, because they have no plan. No plan means a roadmap isn't possible. I'm also not sure if they own a calendar, but that's another debate.
@austinm5630 If CIG cannot or doesn't want to give us a roadmap, fine.
However, CIG shouldn't call a release view for the very next patch a roadmap.
CIG shouldn't call a progress tracker that does not track progress a roadmap.
Neither are a roadmap, this is my point. Calling them a roadmap, which CIG does on their webpage, is gaslighting.
You cannot fail, if you have no goals.
Amazing how broken it is. Even if they don't have a roadmap, I assume they work Agile and they could publish the QBR and OKR.
We should push CIG to not develop/release specifically for events and sales.
I notice the same repeating patern in 4.0.1, why do they release a hotfix for SaltEMike but they do nothing for the rest of us who are in this broken 4.0 mess for a month?
Are they saving 4.0.1 for the Chinese New Year, will they get to play a stable game during their holiday?
Or is it for the 2024 ships re-sale, or for the new MISC Fortune? Stop this nonsense! Get people back into a stable game!
Seeing that old roadmap from 2021 is such an eye opener. I’m shocked CIG get away with promising features and selling ships. But when it comes to delivering, “roadmap watchers!!!”
I honestly wonder if the roadmap was canned on the advice of legal counsel.
i.e. CIG were seemingly (in some but not all cases) using the roadmap as a tool to advertise the game. Specifically advertising "upcoming features" it had no intent or ability to provide on that or any known timeline. Thus making the game look like a tasty slice of cake when it's actually just a cardboard prop.
.... OK I just got to half way through your video and you make the same argument lol.
What we have since 2022 is not a roadmap
Release view for the very next patch is not a roadmap
Progress tracker when a bar ends does not mean the task is finished, there is no % finished, tells nothing
The thing that always amuses me, is that the progress tracker does not track progress - it lists the plans for when things are being worked on long term. Meanwhile the roadmap tells what is the progress of the current patch.
So the progress tracker is more of a roadmap than the roadmap is, while the roadmap is more of a progress tracker than the progress tracker is.
Verse project roadmap is very clear. I suggest all Citizens to keep an eye on the Verse Project. Currently in hangar module state. But roadmap by years end shoud have mercury, venus, earth and the moon
way ahead of you bud, I've got my whole face in verse, not only my eyes. SC is a big disappointment atm for 12yrs and over 700mil.
Looks more like a BS list of lies, unless it’s just a list from a group of blatantly ignorant people that has no idea of the reality of what they can actually get done. With a roadmap like you just showed us, it had over half the goals taken off? My boss wouldn’t ok a month and a half off of work and I would probably get fired.
As I’ve said elsewhere (and I’m paraphrasing myself), Bernie Madoff would be proud of what’s happening here.
Chris Madoff, with all the money 😂
Very interesting that none of the purple items (ships) were crossed off any of those releases, or even delayed.
Keep up the good work, keep pointing out all the bullshite otherwise they will just keep getting away with it. The guy left that was brought on to do the road map, who then was just moved to general community team duty’s. Unfortunately they seem unwilling to be honest about what they are actual doing each year and it doesn’t help with them wanting to hold back spoilers for citizencon.
If Chris Roberts and his brother are not in charge when they say we will have a roadmap. Then its gone.
Who is calling the shots? I think the devs have gone rouge. we dont have the devs we used to have. Not all of them.
dont buy ships then maybe Roberts will get serious. The devs have a responsibility to stay within a working guideline and plan.
If they dont , then they should be fired. We need internal pressure in CIG to the extent there is really some self reflection and fixing.
It could be that the 'devs have gone rogue' but we can be pretty sure Chris caused that. We know from past interviews where Chris himself stated that he does things that he thinks are good but really are extremely destructive to technology development. He said that he fires or at least doesn't listen to people who (paraphrasing) "get passive aggressive when he asks for something and try to suggest other ways of doing it." If Chris knew everything and intimately understood every aspect of the technology under discussion it would be good for him to call BS on people trying to avoid doing hard work. Time has proven that Chris is extremely out of his depth and what that really means is that when he asks for something literally impossible, or a mutually exclusive set of dependencies he doesn't accept no for an answer. What is a developer to do in that case? You dutifully start working towards the impossible goal, maybe you'll find a way there but more likely you'll just go in circles since it's impossible but you want to look busy until Chris forgets why you were doing that and tells you to boil a different ocean. Given the amount of stupidly ambitious stuff that CIG has said they were doing over the years only to have them now start cutting deep into their supposedly sold scope, it really does look like Chris is totally out of his depth and has no understanding of the implications of what he's asking for so it's no wonder people under him both can't hit the stated goals but also appear to have gone rogue. As a technology project leader you have to have good people and be willing to take and trust their feedback. If you find someone BSing you, you have to deal with it, but even if someone tells you something can't be done when it can they might be trying to make it clear they don't feel confident delivering and you should help them out or reassign them.
It is getting harder and harder not to consider this game an utter fraud and scam to be honest.
@neonsamurai1348 I still don't think Star Citizen is a scam.
However, Star Citizen is terribly managed by the people on the very top, this includes Chris.
@@Camural Considering they are paying out dividends on 'profits' to investors, from people 'donating' to fund the game, and they do not have an actual finished product. I think it qualifies as fraud/scam. Generally speaking when you donate to a project like a Kickstarter, the money is supposed to go to development/production and salaries, not investors. The idea is that you give them enough money to get a product to market, and then derive profit from that.
they are everywhere and nowhere devs all over the place doing whatever they want to do not a single specific thing and if it works it works if it doesnt they decide to just throw it away or move it from 1 update to another just so they can say they are doing something which clearly they are not just so they can fill a slide of empty promises , THEY ARE INCOMPETENT .
keep up the good work brother!
I don't give CIG any more money, and I highly suggest anyone getting into the game to not spend past a starter package. Either the Avenger, Nomad, or Cutlass. Just play the game, and don't support them until they start respecting their customers.
No road maps
No ISC
No SCL
"Live" is now "PREVIEW"
CLOWN TACTICS 2025
Roadmap should be simple right now. No Bugs.
CIG: We put this thing on the roadmap aaaaaaaaaaaaand... it's gone.
Players: What do you mean, I just saw it on the roadmap?
CIG: Not anymore, *poof*, the roadmap is gone !
I guess if they are only putting stuff in they are sure they can do, it is maybe more accurate not having anything in the roadmap I guess. I do remember a lot of people gave the project a hard time over things not making it to the roadmap. The lack of a good roadmap is my biggest complaint about the way things are right now. Whilst I didn't expect everything to go to plan, it was interesting watching how things progressed and what was hoped to be done. Now we are kept in the dark feeling there is no plan and just a broken project, with us having to read between the lines of person A saying X and person B saying Z.
What use is a map when the car is broken down on the side of the road?
The only roadmap that matters is the plans in Chris Roberts head. Players thinking CIG has a real roadmap are just fooling themselves
CIG must be an impossible environment for project managers.
I miss the times when we had a roadmap to the Squadron 42 roadmap in 2019.
This is in particular an issue because if its failed planning, CIG works a lot of functions they are finally unable to deliver. And as the game progress, old abandonned development became incompatible and must be restart from scratch At least they will now have to be recoded for server meshing ... Imagine the number of 3d models, code and partial ships that are rotting on CIG servers.
Fuck the roadmap, all I want is to be able to play again. So where is the needed hotfix for LIVE?
5:13 LMAO - feels like deliberate trolling at that point smells like everyone from this studio is now in 'taking the piss' mode zormg
To be fair. This tool means we don't see any progress much faster. That's something - not 😂😂😂😂
Embarrassed to say I've sank over 18k USD on this game, easily my crowning achievement of bad life choices. At this point, I'm done- just freaking done. Less on learned and I didn't even get the t-shirt.
I feel like they are making three games…. Clip this and come back in two years
Roadmap what roadmap? They had a marketing tool that got seen through and a 'progress tracker' that was nothing but a knee jerk reaction to some bad press they got and was never intended to track anything.
The issue with monitoring the road map like you appear to be doing, could be seen as Roadmap Watching like CIG stated. If an item is on the roadmap for development it does not mean that it will be implemented in game. Due to this type of view, I completely understand that items would not be listed on a roadmap. I thought the roadmap was for development, not implementation. Am I wrong?
No cash 'til roadmap.
Grobert is a incompetent liar, unfortunately.
no road map because they don't know what to do next XD
I notice things that make it are the things they can sell.
No need for a road map. Just wing it.
I'm pretty sure there a roadmap for new ships coming in
The roadmap was suppose to be deleted years ago...
Look at the other tab...
It should just be a giant list of features sold to people with the date of marketing. Then a list right next to it of features fully flushed out from that list with a date on the year when they plan to do a rework on it.
I mean, when they finally do get a system that works and is fully flushed out.. Hopefully 2030`s is a better decade for em!
Roadmap... all hands to SQ42!
Thats what happened in 2020 when they cut so many features from the roadmap and again in October 30th 2024 after Citizen Con
As long as people are still giving CIG money, they will never learn. Of course hiding the roadmap is futile. We know that some of the things promised for this year have been on the roadmap years ago. Zero-G push pull for example. Is any of that in the game already?
They should rename Star Citizen to Sunk Cost Fallacy.
people will never stop giving CR money because they bought into a dream and don't want to admit they wasted all that money, and over a decade, on an obvious conjob from an obvious con man.
Is the rug pull about to happen?
Yes
Oh no... The future is gone...
Stop supporting the most boring game ever made .
Lol love the new ship sale , please buy every ship we released in 2024 with LTI . Why do they have sales during holidays ? It's Christmas, instead of buying gifts for the family spend a grand on our crap game (you might not fly to the center of a planet on a good day) , don't pay rent during Thanksgiving, buy a persius that you will need 14 people you can't pay in real cash to install the game to fly . I can't pay my friends to even install the game .
maybe nothing they are not progress ? But I think they need more time to do the base construction. They'll push the deadlines again because of that.
I would like my money back I don't want to stay in the scam. I want my money back the 890 Jump isn't the ship that was promised. I don't want to stay in community that cyberstalks you
I wouldn't be surprised if later this year they will reupload or update the roadmap again... Just of course with lot's of change's and for sure lot's of them not for the benefit of the Player base...
But i wonder if CIG never heard of the fact that once you upload something into tje web with a wife spread audience, there will always be traces of evidence!
Which in cig just increases the trust from tje community into their game
Roadmap?! They'll need months to get 4.x back to 3.2x levels of content and stability and (dumb) ppl think meshing 'delivered' because they can experience unplayability when the servers meet the planned target of players \o/
Don't worry 4.01 will be out this week ? with a new pointless ship and ship sales all will be saved, no problems hear please move along look at the new shiny ship over there for real money, just don't look at the broken patch
load map... infinite loading
I wonder what are they up to? they must be planning something.
The next sale.
Only thing they seem to actually plan is a ship sale
@@RN1441 wont people get bored doing that?
That's just Jabba flapping his overfed mouth, nothing to see here folks.
I agree with CIG to make no roadmap. If you can´t deliver promised change, then its better to say nothing :-). For my point of view the most important is to fix bugs and issues which are for long time in game. Make a stable game. Maybe therefore its neccessary to re-write the base code. This looks like, they aren´t able to do this and all others are not interest for me and therefore i don´t need an roadmap.
@Alexander-z2m8m Fine, then don't call it a roadmap :)
I think they should call help to AI for coding. They have too limited skill programming this game to keep the same bugs for ages.
Scam map...
I uninstalled this shit show last week and won't come back again till this game ever gets done? The hell in just trying to play a game so unstable is a big waste of time. Shame, the artists kicked ass on the graphics of this game but that's basically the only good thing of the game. Maybe 2026? At this point, what difference does it make??
My roadmap: don't give money to scams (birth 'til death).
Progress is excellent.
never cared much for the roadmap since CIG also mostly did not stick to it for the last 3-4 years, so what's even the point? I care about content drops every 3-ish months, as long as they somewhat manage that i am okay with it and tbh i am also ok with kinda having that "oh, thats coming? cool" moment instead of seeing something on the roadmap that hypes you up for months and then its not coming. Just keep quiet, work on your stuff and then bring it into the game when its ready.
@th3orist If CIG wants to remove the roadmap, fine, but don't call a release view for the very next patch only a "roadmap".
Don't call a progress tracker, that does not track progress a "roadmap".
And Erin should not be in front of the camera and say February 2019: _"We put into the roadmap what we are pretty damn sure we can do._ *Erin's words not my words.*
This was never true, not in 2019, not in 2020, not in 2021 and since February 2022 we don't have a roadmap anymore.
@Camural maybe i became a cynic many years ago but truth to be told i never really took anything these guys said at face value. History of the game told us countless times that they are always off with their predictions and plans. And tbh since i turned that side off i have much more fun being a sc backer 👍
Hahahahahaha... You're serious ?
What do you mean?
@Camural it was the meme with spiederman when the boss was laughing then he looks at Peter Parker and said "you're serious ?"
CIG is a joke with their roadmap ^^'
CIG ain't serious.
@Camural what do you want to do, go to gaslight station and settle down 🤣
What do you mean?
@@Camural well at this moment there is still enough space, its a small station. With all of us being gaslighted the living space is running out soon. Im already there so we can be neighbours
No one has believed in the Waterfall Model for software development in decades. It has always been folly and it is extremely well documented that it is folly. We do not want multi-quarter release view back! It is useless, creates terrible code and is extremely demotivating for the development team because any large-scale project will inevitably fail those goals. Stop nagging about getting it back, because if you manage to convince CIG to do what you want you will, quite seriously, have killed the game.
@sc_cintara Maybe you should watch my video? Where did I say I want the roadmap back? Is this a chatgpt bot?
I said: If CIG wants to remove the roadmap, fine, but don't call a release view for the very next patch only a "roadmap".
Don't call a progress tracker, that does not track progress a "roadmap".
And Erin should not be in front of the camera and say February 2019: _"We put into the roadmap what we are pretty damn sure we can do._ *Erin's words not my words.*
This was never true, not in 2019, not in 2020, not in 2021 and since February 2022 we don't have a roadmap anymore.
@@Camural I am sorry, I seem to have misunderstood. All your examples of delays and moved features in the old Release View seem to have confused me. You made a video only to scold Spectrum posters for using the word "Roadmap" wrongly?
@@Camural Or is it that the "Progress Tracker" is placed under the heading "Roadmap" that you want changed? Also, why don't you think the progress tracker tracks progress? It is the work schedule for the year and it shows exactly what they are working on. It is directly linked from their internal task-ticket system (Jira). If that isn't what you want, and you don't want a correctly predicting Waterfall plan for what they will achieve beyond the next quarter (which no large software project can give you), what is it you want? (I mean, apart from the game working perfectly and being done the day after they started working on it, like we all wish 😉). Are you just looking for them to change the heading under which the Progress Tracker is placed?
I'm irrationally annoyed that you upvote yourself
Where did I upvote myself? When you post a reply on Spectrum it gets an automated upvote by your "ghost".
How about you go to Spectrum and try it, before accusing me of upvoting myself?
@@Camural Sorry, dumb attempt at a joke
when a bunch of babys crys everyday cause they dont want or know to read before criticism this happen.
Road map was a guide of intentions , as any road map , but people its been calling CiG useless and liers due to road map soo completly reasonable they have stop updating it as it was clear people now adays does not give a fuck about anything its not theyr selfish point of view.
So I completly understand what they have done with the road map. I Would be piss off too , gaming community today its a toxic baby cryer.
@luampastudio62
1. Please watch your language
2. There are definitions of "roadmap", you might want to look it up. A roadmap should be honest, a roadmap should not be a marketing tool to sell more ships, a roadmap should not be a wish list.
3. Of course not every item has to make it in time, there can be unforeseen difficulties. However, if items were on the roadmap 4 years ago and are still nowhere to be seen, is this a roadmap?
4. Erin Roberts clearly stated in February 2019: "We put in what we are pretty sure we can do". This was never true, not in 2019, not in 2020, not in 2021.
5. People like you who are defending everything CIG does are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
@luampastudio62 sure everyone who has valid concerns is a baby
Spotted the white knight!
I do not know in which world you live. In my world - financing and business development of innovative tech companies on an international level- the term „roadmap“ is pretty clear. The reasonable(!) outline of steps planned to bring a project further on. Of course everybody knows that a roadmap may be a too optimistic especially when it comes to convince investors.
CIG used the roadmap heavily for marketing reasons which is ok. Marketing - especially crowdfunding- works on trust. So whatever you do in your public communication, it should somehow contribute to build up trust.
Even IF you apply some weird different definitions of what a roadmap should be, the „the build up trust“-rule is still to be fulfilled.
Of course delays and adjusting a roadmap is accepted. However there are some experiences when stakeholder’s patience gets exhausted and critical reaction of stakeholders will start. Good assumption is: Three major delays/changes/game changing events are acceptable…afterwards major discussions and analysis of the basic and general plans and structures start. Which may lead to the point to cancel everything and write off the status so far.
Now, tell me, how many major changes (to give the whole development chaos a diplomatic description) have we seen in the last 10 years (i do not count the first three years as setting up such an organization from zero to 1000+ people is indeed an major challenge for itself). For sure far far more than three.
With an regular investor/publisher CR‘s career would have been continued as usual by him getting fired. And we would have today a good game with a nice gaming experience and a solid fan base.
You are lying to yourself and trying to confuse people. Roadmap was a big fraud program to make ppl believe that something happening and make them spend more. When ppl got sick of it CIG removed roadmap, and started to tell everyone that roadmap is not roadmap, but list of wishes.
It's been 13 years dude. At what point is it acceptable to demand CIG get their act together?