Building a 386 DOS gaming PC with modern parts Roland MT-32
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
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I'm sad to think of how much 386 and 486 stuff I threw out in the late 90s and early 2000s. I never would have thought I would want to still have my roided up AMD 5x86 rig in the mid 2010s, but here I am.
+wysoft I still have my K6-2 and a 486DX/2 66 machines in ziploc bags in boxes somewhere. I spent most of my teen years building and upgrading those machines and I couldn't just throw away the amount of (slowly and painfully earned) money I spent on them. They're still pretty valueless these days if you want it back again.
Me too, threw out my Pentium 200 once I upgraded to the PIII-600 thinking "why would I ever want this again". And here I am looking at old PC's and trying to find them on eBay and swap meets.
scorpian007
I have a Pentium 166 machine I don't need if you're serious.
that's cool to offer.. recently I have started playing with PCem emulator, for some reason it feels so much more "real" than running games and apps in DOSbox - especially since it is a straight up machine emulator that depends on the user supplying PC and video BIOS files, it really has the authentic feel without the associated hassle of getting all of that old hardware to work.
wysoft
That's pretty much the same direction I'm going too, but some people really like having the old physical hardware itself. I'm looking to occupy less space, personally.
It's amazing what an 80386 can accomplish with the right configuration!
+The Obsolete Geek Yes. There are a TON of games you can play on a 386DX-40 :)
@@philscomputerlab did Play battedrome 3d mech Arena fighting... Still have the original Game hull
Damn that Roland sounds amazing. I had no idea what i was missing as a kid.
+mattglad Sure does! Back then they cost way too much though. Now they are affordable and that's why I got one, to catch up on the things I couldn't have as a kid.
That SoundBlaster Pro with that MT-32 sounds amazing in stereo!
Halfway through your playing wing commander i had forgotten that this was a video about a 386 build. And that AT cable, man, i had forgotten about those, but as soon as i saw the connector on the motherboard my mind immediately remembered "blacks go on center". Now i can add 386 to my list of hardware that i have to track down, but yeah, wing commander was (and still is) so amazing
Yup, blacks go together with AT :D
Wow this was posted so long ago, and I completely missed it. Well, I found it now and it was GREAT lol. Thank you for sharing your video, 🙂👍
Love your retro PC builds, you've inspired me to take some of my old pc parts from my Pentium 3 days and try and get a old machine running again. Miss my old dos and windows 95/98 games. lol
Thanks!
Good stuff here, thanks for sharing. And I like how you used the MT-32 as a monitor stand.
The first PC I had was Zenith 286, monochrome VGA, 2MB ram, soundblaster 8-bit, so I ran lower quality DOS games, but did have Wolf 3d. Mid-90's I splurged for 586-133 AWE64, and some sort of VL-B video card so I jumped over the whole 386 gaming experience. By looking at the video the 386 was quite a capable system and a blast to plat games on. Modern PC gaming is missing the magic that the retro had. Nicely done!
A 386SX at 33MHz was my first computer. That bios screen brought me so many memories and pure joy on my face. Thank you sir for that! I have to go back at my parents house and look around in the basement for that old horizontal case of mine!
+slapfish17 That's cool :)
Absolutely loved the intro and that build, I remember always wanting to that soundcard as a kid as I was stuck with the internal speaker all the way.
+Neo Xbit Thank you :D
Awesome build, definitely a rarity seeing people build "new" 386s subscribed!
"386" and "gaming PC" in one sentence :D
You even have Roland MT-32! I just watched a video about it, awesome stuff.
Interesting content, great quality, and great editing skills! Subscribed.
Thank you!
This gave me a few ideas to keep my old relic computers going with newer parts. I still have an XT, 286, and 386.
I need to build such PC for myself, for all DOS games i've never finished back in the days
Love your build video's! keep up the great work.I started building computers around the socket A (462) day so it's really cool to see some of these old machines and what they can do.
+Bruce Smith Thank you :)
Want to do a Socket A build soon, but got so many other projects in the works. So much to do, so little time...
Fantastic video and project! I did most of my early gaming on a cobbled-together 386SX running at 25MHz. I got the motherboard from a local PC shop junk-bin - it was a wacky Atari mobo that used dreadfully weird "SIP" memory sticks and the whole thing never quite worked as expected... but that didn't keep me from staying up till 3am every night playing Red Baron, Ringworld, Jetfighter II, etc. Gog.com has been satisfying my nostalgia lately, but this video makes me think about putting together a hardware 386 rig again someday...
Thanks for sharing your story!
Nicest 386 I've seen
Love the intro!
+AlphaDangerDen Thank you :D
7:01 a rectangle of plastic harvested from a DVD case can make a pretty good io shield
Use plastic stand offs where their is no mounting holes instead of paper .
+Dave Kehrer Good tip, thanks.
I had to laugh when he said paper and I expected him to say a plastic stand off. xD
Where that channel was earlier? I am mad of old devices, and the videos about vintage computers are masterpieces. Thank you for your brilliant work.
Wow, thanks for the kind words :D
It's a friday night, got me an energy drink and time to watch. Sure beats going to a bar ;) I can not recommend that StarTech 5 1/4 to 3 1/2 converter enough :) I ordered 2 just in case, great for OEM PCs with only 2x 3 1/2 bays. That On-track disk tools to boot to CDROM is just awesome... i remember back in the early 90's (i was in middle school) trying to figure that out LOL
+Jason Hicks (TyrForFreedom) :D That's cool! Good to see you're having a good time.
For the stand offs that dont have holes you need to use the plastic clip type stand offs that were used back in the day. They are flat so they just support the MB and rest on the case metal and they clip into the holes on the mb.
+TheGpound Yea, I got a box of assorted standoffs now :)
Hi Phil, it would be interesting to see this thing pumped up with a 486 Cyrix upgrade chip, math co-processor and 8mb ram to see the "top level" a board like this can achieve. Love you work as always.
I noticed on an older computer I am working on, up by the push button switch on the front of the case (like on your PC in this video) there is a green grounding plug. Its like round with a hole in it, so it can be attached to something. It is OK to attach it with a screw, like anywhere on the case. I dont know why it is no longer attached in the case. But then again the case with that AT power supply and switch is over 25 years old now
A 386 was my first PC, so this is very cool. Also I feel like Korg from Thor Ragnarok is telling me how to build a PC...
The sound of that Roland is amazing!
how can you even tell through a video?
Direct capture mate.
This is the kind of videos I like from your channel. Great work Phil!
it's amazing that indi actually survived the 1990's considering all the falling down stairs and through floors he endured
great video phill, very enjoyable gameplay. a big greeting from argrntina.
u can get fixed switches for front panel and replace the reset button for turbo , switches r very cheap and u don't need to turn your hand behind the case just use the right size of switch cuz they also comes in a smaller size and it won't work and some cases u a different type of push button which has no other variant that acts as a on or off switch.. so u have to stay away from modern expensive cases!
so happy to found your chanel
Thanks heaps, means a lot!
I had the same problem with one of my projects with the board not having enough standoffs at the back so i used some rubber mounts stuck in place and it works well
I will look into that Dynamic Drive Overlay thing, it's cool that it allows you to boot from CDROM in a 386!
Great video!
I hear a lot of ppl saying that Ontrack is superior to EZ-Drive. Mostly those ppl say that for example EZ-Drive does not support FAT-32. But this is actually a wisely spread misconception -->
"EZ-Drive 9.x W fully supports Microsoft's FAT32
file system, however, the option for creating FAT32 partitions with EZ-Drive is only
available if system files that support FAT32 are detected (e.g. system files for Windows
95B or Windows 98). FAT32 partitions must also be 512 MB or greater in size. "
Really nice video again, I enjoy it!
Mix of german and australian accent? insta subscribe
+CreepyZiti Reads & Reacts Haha, nice one, Danke schön :)
It's weird, I never did get to play WC2 even though I played all the rest in the series.
And I have the game lol.
Thanks for sharing this built.
It's a pretty cool game :)
PhilsComputerLab Oh I have no doubt about it. :)
There are motherboard hooks with adhesive pads. also, why not use a switch from an old Turbo switch to swap for the original power switch? Works perfectly!
Still better than no man's sky
You could have used a momentary normally open pushbutton - The ATX power supply requires a momentary switch to trigger power on/off. Also, why not drill out a 5-1/4 inch blank and mount the switches there? You can even get self-illuminating turbo switches ;)
That sound!!
I swear, whoever made those old 386/486 BIOS screens was colorblind.
Phil, I know you don't often build in cases anymore, but did someone ever send you an I/O shield? AT keyboard shields are pretty hard to find, but blank shields you could drill a keyboard port (and PS/2 mouse for the few AT boards that had one next to it…)
Yes I got blank shields now :D
Dell D800 has a graphics card dedicated so it's perfect to run dos games under xp with a emm=ram syntax under config.nt to set the page frame address useful if running dos games under compatibility mode. that is my old dos machine, my first was a Packard Bell 386sx 4mb ram, second that worked great under window's me was a gateway solo 1150cl
which had only a 4mb cyrix graphics card.
Good old dos days
commodore Amiga master race 😋 hehe
I think beside the 386sx25 I used for years in the last millennium, I should also have a am386-40 w/ Cyrx FastMath 387 in the basement or somewhere ;-)
I think I even run Formula One GP 2 and X-Win on medium or so details on the 386sx25 with very little RAM. Maybe it was around 2MB or so, ... :-/
I think the first thing not running anymore was Doom or so, …
The thing with the DX 40 is that it is actually too fast for a lot of 386 era games, yet too slow for anything 3D or more demanding games. I really like the 25 MHz 386, it's a nice sweet spot.
this video brought back some good memories :) My first computer was very similar to the one you build, an AMD 386DX/40 with 4MB of ram, to which I eventually added a Sound Blaster Pro 2... And Wing Commander and Indy were some of the first games I played. Good stuff. In WC you can go through the asteroid fields by engaging the afterburner, you'll fly through it safely. I've always been curious about that 387 slot... I don't know any program which might use it.
+luckyluckydog123 I believe Falcon, a flight sim, uses the co-processor, but not much else. Later games than required it, have no hope of running on the 386 anyway.
Very well made Phil. I really enjoy watching your videos. :)
What kind of capture hardware do you use to record the monitor output for the video?
7:18 - Seems easy to find now on ebay, $3 CAD total for this one: "
For your standoffs where no holes exist, there are plastic mounting legs that you can use. Anyone who's dabbled with old tech will have a bunch of these).
+SireSquish Do you maybe have a picture of those mounting legs? I cant seem to find what you're talking about, and I'd really like to buy some.
www.pccables.com/images/STANDOFFS_MOTHERBOARD_STANDARD_MB_PLASTIC6.jpg There's an example
SireSquish Thanks!
I know this is an older video, not sure if you're keeping up with comments on these. I am curious if you've released the list of floppies you load up on your gotek? I feel this would be a useful list to work from.
Like "5 floppies I can't live without"?
It puts da mudderbord in da case. or it gets da sata cable again.
i like pentiums but this video was very entertaining. a nice case for a 386! will you be hooking up a CRT monitor to it or not worth the hassle? also what does the turbo button do, add 2Mhz? lol
+rorym1980 The turbo button toggles the machine between full speed and slow speed. It was used to slow the machine down to run old software :)
Love to have a CRT, but don't have the space I'm afraid.
Why not using the front panel power button? This is an ATX case, it should work well with your ATX-to-AT power adapter.
ATI Mach32s are good Retro graphics cards that work well in 386s.
I've written some software to keep track of the floppy's labels on a USB stick for use with the Gotek floppy emulator.
Poor MT-32, I was horrified, mine will never experience such weighting treatment :-P
Great video Phil. After formatting my CF card with Ontrack (same as in your video it reads fine on my Dos PC) but if I plug it into my Windows 10 PC to add files but it requests I format the card anywat around this? Strange as it works fine on my Dos PC.
Yea that can happen because of Ontrack. To avoid this, don't use Ontrack for at least one of your drives.
Very nice video Phil. They are getting better and better. Thanks for your efforts in putting those together. Nice new intro btw. I have a question for you... You're living in Australia...but are you australian ? I think you come from Germany. Is my guess correct ? If yes, Commodore c64 and amiga's were pretty strong back then. Did you only stick to PC at the time, or did you use those home computers as well ?
+LFOSyncToo Thank you for the comments, much appreciated. I'm not Australian, moved to Perth in 2006. Not from Germany either though, but I did live in Munich and Frankfurt in the past, so the mystery continues :D
I did have a C64 and after that went straight to PC.
+PhilsComputerLab Ever been to Barbagallo Raceway? Great little track, loved to watch races from there and race it in racing simulations.
No I haven't I'm afraid :(
Really? this video recording by PDG-1 mic headset plungin the X-FI Titanium . this is really cool . thx bro.
+Wasu Chaiwan Only from 9:20 onwards because I use capture card.. Before that it was with the camera.
Holly shit, where on earth are you going to find a replacement Crystal that high?! I can only imagine you're looking down the custom made/order route. I don't think I've ever encountered a crystal higher than 50Mhz in the wild.
+Asaggy Noodle Really? I got these from eBay. I have 50 MHz, 66 MHz and 80 MHz crystals now.
I have a feeling I put my 386DX40 with 8Mb of RAM and and 387 co-processor in the bin in the late 1990s but I could have sold it when at University my memory is slightly vague I that respect. I kind of wish I still had it just for the novelty of it as it was the first PC I bought. I have a Pentium 166mhz which is actually a much better machine ideal for DOS and Windows 98.
What about some of OpenCores' FPGA x86 implementations, combined with some kind of ISA bus implementation? Way smaller.
+eton975 Having mucked around with the Mist FPGA computer an some cores, the technology needs more hardware programmers to get involved. Compatibility has issues, software emulation actually is more accurate / compatible, which is a shame.
The good news is that 386 hardware is still not that hard to obtain and modern parts can be used. Unlike home computers like the Amiga, they are a black hole for your wallet :D
Oooh, did I see a Roland MT-32 roll by in the opening titles?
+Shmeh Fleh In the intro? That was a SC-55. But the MT-32 is shown later in the video :)
It is not appropriate to tell you how this makes me feel... but it sure is awesome. I'm only a couple years late haha.
Nice vídeo! And nice intro as well!
Btw, I'd personally try replacing the momentary switch of the power button with a latched one, like the ones used in turbo buttons in AT cases and use that to power the PC up instead. I always enjoy seeing older stuff masquerading as a modern machine, and having to reach around the back kindda breaks the illusion for me. This way does require more effort, though, as it requires disassembling the case entirely and either soldering wires to a new switch or snatching one from a broken AT case.
Oh, and where did you get that nifty switch? I can think of a few uses for those, but I`ve never seen anything like that for sale.
+alexanrsousa I get most of these bits and pieces from eBay. As I do more videos, I tend to show different ways of doing things. In the 486 video for example I did use latching push buttons, but ended up not mounting them because I didn't want to drill holes into the case.
I've got a few other ideas, and will use them in future videos :)
So don't feel like I'm showing the "only" or "best" way, I'm just experimenting and mixing things up :D
+alexanrsousa Regarding breaking the illusion: I remember many computers including the 386-generation, where the actual power and/or reset switch was on the back of the computer!
Behold, the mighty 386-40mhz, the fastest booting x86 processor ever made.
386 and no CRT?
+Kahvikasvi Yea. No space and I like LCD monitors.
+Kahvikasvi You see old parts or modern parts ?
+PhilsComputerLab Forgive me for saying but isn't this PSU group regulated? As in these kinds of loads from an old PC would put it outside of ATX spec in voltage regulation? Sure looks group regulated with it being a low end PSU.
But that CRT glow!
The idea of this video is to use as many new parts as possible, and using an LCD instead of a CRT is definitely one of the easier parts to replace.
Nice intro! Loved it!
Nice build video! Made my day better! =)
+Necr0manceR That's great :)
I have an idea to plug a modern bluetooth mouse to serial-bluetooth adapter. Just need some research to know if it is possible. There are many bluetooth versions available
The most powerfull 386 in world! sale this item for my man !
Am I right in assuming that those Floppy to USB adapters will only work with 1.44MB floppy images as opposed to 2.88?
+WaybackTECH Yes!
I guess you can also put 486DX or SX on the bigger slot, yes or no?
Really enjoyed this video. Have you ever attempted playing MP3 songs. I'm trying now with 386 dx40 +flu but having little luck. Any programs or help you could suggest. Thanks heaps
you miss the good old prince of persia
This thing performs like a 486!
+AshtonColeman It is quite fast, but a 486SX 25 MHz is still a tiny bit faster. But back in the day, it also cost a lot more :)
+PhilsComputerLab I'm messing with a 486 right now. It was an SX 25 but I put a real DX 50 (not a DX2) in it and am running at 40mhz. I don't think this Packard Bell 410 motherboard is efficient so it feels like your 386 haha.
The 386 I'm using is probably not your average 386. It has 256 KB of cache, quite a lot for a 386, and the motherboard in general is one of the fastest ones. The graphics card is also quite decent for an ISA card.
So yea it does depend, you're right. It's once you get to the DX2 and fast Vesa Local Bus graphics cards, that the 486 just zooms away.
Power consumption?
+wdowa94 Very little compared to modern computers! It's a nice and quiet gaming machine :)
Great work but i think it would be better if you use an original Floppy Drive, but great job, Greetings from Costa RIca my friend
+Jorge Frutos Costa Rica? Nice :) Yes you can use original Floppy Drive, but I am so in love with my GOTEK. I have over 40 floppies on that USB, can't work without it. No read / write errors, no lost disks, needs no space. Lots of benefits :)
philscomputerlab Well thats true and is easy to conserve in that matter than floppys
I remember a few years ago: Was working on a build. All ready to go. I hunt for MS-DOS 6,22 disks, and the second disk hat read errors. Then the Sound Blaster disk also had read errors.
This might be because I used a "modern" floppy drive. I've read that they are built very cheap compared to the old models. Either way, I had enough, and found the GOTEK online and the rest is history :D
Nice intro
+igorbog88 Thanks :)
What happens if you use... A 100 MHz oscilator?
Why a 386 instead of a fast 486DX4-100 or Pentium1 which can play also the most demanding DOS games? The 386 is quite limited I think, not even Doom is running nicely. Otherwise very nice built.
Now install Aros os in it. And you have nice Amiga.
6:00 Nice power switch replacement extension! I want one of those. How can I get/make/build/buy that metal strip with switches? The thing is, I'd like to have about eight switches, or at least four (so I can install two of them). With this, I could build easy jumper control for an old, old machine that I use for music and other nostalgia.
+SadBunny I made that thingy with the switches myself. Just drill the holes and off you go.
How did you hook up the MT-32? Thinking about making this rig myself, wanna play some Space Quest IV. Also, where did you buy all of these parts? I am having a hard time finding them online.
+ny2j7 I used a Roland MIDI ISA card. Yes, it's not easy to find these parts. It takes some patience I'm afraid.
wind commander looks so good, i would play that for sure, and the last game seem really slow, is it suppose to look this way?
Gods? Yea it runs like that.
Gahhhh I miss my sidewinder pro :(
+Brandon Bole Great stick!
I would be out of my depth setting up that HDD info.
Hi Phil! Nice channel you have here!! Just a question: how do you connect the DVD to the IO card and get it to work?
+Ricardo Magalhães At 9:04 you can see it a little bit. The IO controller has a single IDE port. I configured the StarTech Compact Flash to IDE adapter as master and the IDE DVD-RW as slave. Then just connect them up with a standard IDE ribbon cable. The DOS CD driver then picks up the drive just fine.
+philscomputerlab Never tried that! Back then the cd drives came with a proprietary interface connecting to the sound card. I thought the IO cards couldn't handle the drives because they weren't detected by the bios. Got to try that on my old systems! thanks!
+Ricardo Magalhães You remember correctly :) The very first CD-ROM drives did indeed come with their own IO cards. For example Mitsumi, Sony, Philips or Panasonic. Soon sound cards had these integrated, if you look at early Sound Blaster 16 cards, some have three headers for various CD-ROM brands.
Around the time when 4x CD-ROM drives came out, they were called ATAPI, you could just connect them to the standard IDE controller. This is what I'm doing, but it's a modern 48x CD 16x DVD-RW drive :D
Newer drives are much better at reading burnt discs. I burn a lot of discs from GOG games, a great source of cheap retro game. Many games come with the full installation image, just burn it onto a CD and play it on your retro DOS gaming PC.
+Ricardo Magalhães I had the very first CD-ROM from Mitsumi. It was on a rail and you pushed it in and basically the entire drive came out. Then you opened it form the top to insert a CD. It came with an IO card which had RCA audio connectors at the back I believe.
I loved that drive. But soon single speed wasn't fast enough. But it was a great time. Magazines started adding a CD, so finally I had access to demos, driver updates, games, shareware. It was a real breakthrough in an internet less era :D
+philscomputerlab It worked! :)MY 386 now has a DVD-rom drive. Man i needed 20+ years and your channel to discover this! eheheh My 1st CD-rom drive came in a bundle with the sound blaster. It was a 2x unit and was not ATAPI capable. Later I bought a 486DX2 with a 8x Philips CD-rom drive and that was conected directly to the MB controler and the bios was able to see it. I don't know why i was under the impression that the ISA IO controllers couln't handle the optical drives. :/ Duh!
I'm wondering why you didn't source an AT case and power supply for this build? I have like 5 of them just sitting around that I just haven't been able to bring myself to throwing away.
+Maxwelhse I don't trust these old power supplies to be honest. And I like the newer ATX cases also more. I know most people want a period correct machine, I'm a bit "special" in that regard :D
Thanks for the response.
I can certainly understand just having a preference for something. I'm not a regular viewer of your channel so I'm not sure of all the types of projects you do, but it might be fun to illustrate restoring an old PS (new caps, cooling fan, etc) though I never once had an AT power supply fail in about 15 years of running them 24/7. Those components likely are suspect by now.
How can i get that image ? is very good not pixelated at all!!
Great vid ... I noticed the extension slot with the 2 buttons (power and turbo), really cool thing. Can you give a ebay link or description on how to find it ?
+Vulturius RetroGamer I made that myself :)
+philscomputerlab Any building plans you wanna share?
Currently busy with the MIST and Windows 98 graphics benchmark project. Busy at work, so I'm doing one video every Thursday. Otherwise it feels like work :(
3:20 - I like hot glue for that purpose :)
Ordered a used Gravis Analog Pro joystick on eBay since the Sidewinder Precision Pro doesn't work in MS-DOS only in Windows 98SE. Would I need a TSR program for MS-DOS for the Gravis?
+WinVistaUser2 It depends. The basics of the stick should just work, but it might have extra features that require a DOS driver.
I am building a amd 386dx40 and i have Sb awe 64 isa card. Is it going to works in Dos 6.22 games (HDD 200mb / 4Mb ram)
Can you build a dos pc to run battlefield 1 using old and today's parts?
Surely if you want to create a retro dos computer you'd be better off with a pentium? I believe the pentium boards still had isa slots so you could put in those old sound cards plus a decent PCI 3D graphics card.
I have produced lots of videos of building retro computers. This one is about the 386, others are about 486, others about Pentium. Happy binge watching :)
Awesome, and yes, I will definitely be binge watching thanks to all you youtubers that put in the time and effort!
Any links/show notes for some of the products mentioned? In particular, I can't find the 5.25" bay version of the startech adapter you're using; their website shows only a 3.5".
+Jim Leonard Ah, yes, I'll explain that. The adapter is 3.5" but I put it in a 3.5" to 5.25" bay adapter: www.startech.com/au/HDD/Brackets/Bracket-for-35-Inch-Floppy-with-Bezel~BRACKETFDBK
These are readily available, not just from StarTech. If you're using a case with two 3.5" bays, then you can mount it directly though.