I like how you have patience with teaching and stay calm in your work. Flying off the handle and having no patience to teach new workers (as I have experienced as a ground worker) is discouraging to new guys and counter-productive. Cheers
If you experience an ego prick boss, walk off the job. It's easier for workers to find other jobs than it is for ego prick bosses to hire new people. Tree work doesn't have folks knocking the doors down to get hired. Bosses can make or break it. I worked for a prick for 22 years. A steel fab shop. I watched dozens of great guys come and go. My boss was hawking non stop. No talking guys, lets go guys. Wtf are we doing guys. Any sudden silence and he was running out of the office to see what was going on. He destroyed his own business. He had a multi million dollar business that went belly up because of his ego prick ways. Now his shop is overgrown with kudzu and vines. He was forced to find a job. I took the best of his workers. My boss had zero patience. He would not teach the new guys anything. Come in, stfu and balls to the wall attitude. I was teaching the guys and it would eat his ass up. He couldn't fire me. I was the only one that knew how to run everything besides him, plus I had dirt on him. If he fired me, I would've wrecked his life.
I had a bad tree situation a couple of weeks ago, decided to pull it over. It was a co dominant stem that (I think) died from line clearing. The rest of the tree was not being removed. I was going to climb it until I saw the split that started a few feet up...long story short, throw line through a crotch, rigging line with a running bowline, 5:1, and when that didn't work, add a 3:1 combo, a couple of resets later, and down she came. What was left was a comfortably safe climb to finish off. After seeing this video I have started stowing my 5:1 the same way. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and experiences, my Brother! Stay safe.
I like that micropulley with prussik idea, and the backup portawrap. There is nothing worse than reaching the end of the usable length with no option to adjust while under tension. Plus it allows you to cinch up the main line tight, before using up length on the block line.
That's awesome you took the time to show your guy how to use it. My boss has little patience so we use the most basic equipment. We definitely would have done that tree with a sledge a wedge and a rope. About to do a 40" diameter Ash base tomorrow, and same thing sledge wedge and rope. Personally I like the come alongs, but the system you use is much stronger than any come along a person can buy. Cheers and great video! Thanks for all the learning tips!
Great video as always and nice setup on the 5:1. I still cannot say thanks enough for the first video you showed with the daisy chain. I love that thing!! Keep up the good stuff.
I like the circus bowline for an attachment midline knot for a felling tag line. Great to load and easy to untie. Only I clip the carabineer on the fiddle block directly to the tag
Hey Patrick, great video! Absolutely love your content and approach with the principals. To alleviate pulling from the top block and vectoring the system, I have found it helpful to redirect the rope at the anchor to achieve an in-line pull. I found you can get a steadier pull and alleviate rocking/swaying of the tree. Keep up the good work brother, Airborne!
another exceptional ! how to video mention this over the years but some folks need to see it . a major plus was a real real life scenario .. yeah team tree !
Nice work guys! I've been thinking about getting a mechanical advantage for tool box! I normally use a 4 wheeler but sometimes I can not get into a back yard. But also makes for a good brush puller!
Top notch Pat, those looked like aluminium biners on your five to one set up? I always use steel biners in any rigging/pulling system. Mind yourself, 🇨🇦 🇮🇪
I'd like to buy exactly the same Fiddle Block that you use. Where can I purchase it on the Internet. Amazon or Ebay? Please let me know the product name and the model number.
Is there an advantage of this system over a maasdam rope puller? Maasdam has 10 to 1 advantage (20/1 with snatch block), and can pull the length of the rope if needed.
Nice work Muggs. RUclips loaded your vid with ads, sure makes me like them less. Great explanation of block work. The Maasdam rigged like the blocks has become a favorite pulling tool of mine.
If the mainline can handle the loading from the French Prusik used for the 5:1, can the mainline be French Prusik'd to itself (using the necessary rigging hardware and giving the 5:1 its own anchor connection directly to the tree) instead of using the Port-A-Wrap?
4-to-1 is the result of my experiment with similar fiddle-block combos::: Lifted 60 pounds with 15 lb force!!! Do you think the remaining force was wasted on friction????
I’m so fucking jealous of your consistency in using the daisy chain hitch. I can tie 100 knots but for some reason my daisy chain hitches always fuck up in the daisy chain
Tie the rope twice as high on the tree to double the mechanical advantage yet again. If you could get the rope tie point five times as high you'd get the same force without using the fiddle block (you'd lose a bit by reducing the angle between rope and tree). I've never cut down a tree but teach mathematics and science. It's all about torque.
I'd still rather use a Maasdam rope come a long any day. 300lb pull into a 5:1 equals 1500lbs, and has length limits, resetting if longer pull, etc.... Rope come a long us 1500lb pull to start, one pulley makes it 3000lb pull. Have 300 ft of rope? It'll pull it if you have enough time
Thanks for the video. Good luck to the new guy. I made my own 5 to 1 (or maybe 4 to 1?) ... with 2 double pulleys... not as slick but a lot cheaper.... not sure if there are any inherent downsides to the actual fiddleblock?
Hey Bob, nothing wrong with a homemade 5:1. Fancy one would probably be more efficient (lose less energy to friction, but not totally sure.) If you set it up like I showed, where you are facing the load, and pulling away from it, then it's 5:1. If it's the other way, facing the anchor, then it's 4:1. - Patrick
What cord/length are you using for that prusik? Looks like 1/2" rigging line (orange) and I'm guessing 10mm cord? I'm thinking Samson Ice Tail might be a good choice for applications like this one. Or maybe Tenex.
If pulling a huge back leaner do you still attach with prusik? What prusik should I buy? 9/16 husky bull rope. Want safely be able to pull 3k......if need be in emergency... Daily 500-800lbs
The rope you were pulling on, looked too low on the tree. The rope was pulling more horizontally against the tree than vertically. If the rope had been 12-15' higher, it would have more likely come down the first time your man tugged on it.
Great video but for the beginners I'd recommend making the back cut an inch or 2 higher then the bottom of your notch to protect yourself from the bottom kicking back I was training a guy and he didn't want to hear my warnings about this and it was inches away from seriously injuring him possibly ending his life I'm just happy it was done on the ground where he had a place to run rather then if he made that mistake while being in a tree and with the tension applied from the fiddle block this guy is a pro and I'm sure he was conscience of this but since people are using videos for education think it's important to state this ~Stay safe and fucking send it
It's safe if you can ensure they don't sideload. It's not the optimal connection, ideally you'd use a rigging plate, ring or textile connector inbetween, but it's not unsafe to use two carabiners.
@@raphaelbeinhauer9242 advancing up the tree while in the tree, double rope. The zigzag has a really tite rubber grommet where carabiner attaches. So, I could leave one biner attached to zigzag and re-attach the 2 biner after new tie in point is established.
@@jolkraeremeark6949 If you do that I would suggest using a rubber band or something to keep your eye splice secured on the top biner to minimize the potential for crossloading.
It must be a new tree worker thing… if you want to save a lot of time and money.... just use a rope come along… it's been around for years and it has endless rope....
Im extremely committed to all aspects off tree work and always give 150% , i had reached the point in my life that the bigger trees were calling me however , i found out that 35 is now too old to work in Canada !! ?¿ sad times / i can do the same amount of work as 3 of todays 20 year olds !!!
Ha! Yer right, auto tune sucks. I remember when we got the first batch of those turds, it was winter, working on rattlesnake habitat clear cut in a remote spot. We'd routinely leave our gear onsight all week as to save on the hike. Those pos auto tune huskys would not start! Change in temperature, no start. High humidity, no start! Aggggh!! I talked to a husky rep this past winter at a trade show, sez no more 372 :(
Way too fast, way too advanced, I can't keep up. Your hands move super fast on all the stuff you're doing, but you're very casually explaining. You need to be more deliberate, go slower, show what you're doing more explicitly. Camera work is very shaky. I wish you would re-do this video. Sorry to be so critical.
I like how you have patience with teaching and stay calm in your work. Flying off the handle and having no patience to teach new workers (as I have experienced as a ground worker) is discouraging to new guys and counter-productive. Cheers
If you experience an ego prick boss, walk off the job. It's easier for workers to find other jobs than it is for ego prick bosses to hire new people. Tree work doesn't have folks knocking the doors down to get hired. Bosses can make or break it. I worked for a prick for 22 years. A steel fab shop. I watched dozens of great guys come and go. My boss was hawking non stop. No talking guys, lets go guys. Wtf are we doing guys. Any sudden silence and he was running out of the office to see what was going on. He destroyed his own business. He had a multi million dollar business that went belly up because of his ego prick ways. Now his shop is overgrown with kudzu and vines. He was forced to find a job. I took the best of his workers. My boss had zero patience. He would not teach the new guys anything. Come in, stfu and balls to the wall attitude. I was teaching the guys and it would eat his ass up. He couldn't fire me. I was the only one that knew how to run everything besides him, plus I had dirt on him. If he fired me, I would've wrecked his life.
Hot headed arrogance has no room in this field......... unfortunately its rampant with alot of climbers
Thank you for taking the time to teach.. I pray you have a prosperous year!
I had a bad tree situation a couple of weeks ago, decided to pull it over. It was a co dominant stem that (I think) died from line clearing. The rest of the tree was not being removed. I was going to climb it until I saw the split that started a few feet up...long story short, throw line through a crotch, rigging line with a running bowline, 5:1, and when that didn't work, add a 3:1 combo, a couple of resets later, and down she came. What was left was a comfortably safe climb to finish off. After seeing this video I have started stowing my 5:1 the same way. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and experiences, my Brother! Stay safe.
I like that micropulley with prussik idea, and the backup portawrap. There is nothing worse than reaching the end of the usable length with no option to adjust while under tension. Plus it allows you to cinch up the main line tight, before using up length on the block line.
That's awesome you took the time to show your guy how to use it. My boss has little patience so we use the most basic equipment. We definitely would have done that tree with a sledge a wedge and a rope. About to do a 40" diameter Ash base tomorrow, and same thing sledge wedge and rope. Personally I like the come alongs, but the system you use is much stronger than any come along a person can buy. Cheers and great video! Thanks for all the learning tips!
Try a 2005 Honda CRV. It has a tie off loop attached to the rear floor-pan.
Lmfao😂
Great video as always and nice setup on the 5:1. I still cannot say thanks enough for the first video you showed with the daisy chain. I love that thing!! Keep up the good stuff.
I like the circus bowline for an attachment midline knot for a felling tag line. Great to load and easy to untie. Only I clip the carabineer on the fiddle block directly to the tag
Same here, good one!
Hey Patrick, great video! Absolutely love your content and approach with the principals. To alleviate pulling from the top block and vectoring the system, I have found it helpful to redirect the rope at the anchor to achieve an in-line pull. I found you can get a steadier pull and alleviate rocking/swaying of the tree. Keep up the good work brother, Airborne!
Great job keep up the good teacher for everyone. I’d really appreciate it.
its very good about you that you read all the comments and reply
13:30 mark....that double bite and tail through is slick. THANKS!
This awesome video made my day. Loved your teaching style and wish I was there also to learn. Keep up the great work and also, stay safe friend.
Dude, amazing instructional video. Exactly what I was looking for. Subscribed.
Awesome, welcome to the channel! - Patrick
another exceptional ! how to video mention this over the years but some folks need to see it . a major plus was a real real life scenario .. yeah team tree !
Nice work guys! I've been thinking about getting a mechanical advantage for tool box! I normally use a 4 wheeler but sometimes I can not get into a back yard. But also makes for a good brush puller!
Thank you so much for this knowledge. Incredibly useful
Thanks for posting this vid man. I really appreciate your content.
Nice overview and tips man! As always, thanks for sharing!
Great video. Very helpful. Well done!
Love em. Put one on the pwc was mad. Only prob is they close. Cheers
Top notch Pat, those looked like aluminium biners on your five to one set up? I always use steel biners in any rigging/pulling system. Mind yourself, 🇨🇦 🇮🇪
I'd like to buy exactly the same Fiddle Block that you use. Where can I purchase it on the Internet. Amazon or Ebay? Please let me know the product name and the model number.
So cool man thanks 😊
Is there an advantage of this system over a maasdam rope puller? Maasdam has 10 to 1 advantage (20/1 with snatch block), and can pull the length of the rope if needed.
I prefer the fiddle block when there's more than one person available on the ground, it's usually faster for us than the Maasdam... - Patrick
Nice work Muggs. RUclips loaded your vid with ads, sure makes me like them less. Great explanation of block work. The Maasdam rigged like the blocks has become a favorite pulling tool of mine.
High 5 (to 1).
.
.
.
I’ll see myself out.
Ju7
Don’t forget to do the shoe laces up on your white new balance before you go. Wouldn’t to fall over in front of the other dads.
If the mainline can handle the loading from the French Prusik used for the 5:1, can the mainline be French Prusik'd to itself (using the necessary rigging hardware and giving the 5:1 its own anchor connection directly to the tree) instead of using the Port-A-Wrap?
4-to-1 is the result of my experiment with similar fiddle-block combos::: Lifted 60 pounds with 15 lb force!!! Do you think the remaining force was wasted on friction????
I’m so fucking jealous of your consistency in using the daisy chain hitch. I can tie 100 knots but for some reason my daisy chain hitches always fuck up in the daisy chain
@EducatedClimber : Hi very interesting video, is it possible to have the part number of Your 5:1 please ? and an URL maybe ? Thanks in advance
That was a quick hinge shot lol but long enough to see something 👀
Tie the rope twice as high on the tree to double the mechanical advantage yet again. If you could get the rope tie point five times as high you'd get the same force without using the fiddle block (you'd lose a bit by reducing the angle between rope and tree). I've never cut down a tree but teach mathematics and science. It's all about torque.
What knot did you use at the top of the tree? And how do you know how far up to tie the tree?
He mostly use Daisy Chain
I personally prefer my 2005 to one. My 2005 Honda CRV pulls like a D9 dozier.
I'd still rather use a Maasdam rope come a long any day.
300lb pull into a 5:1 equals 1500lbs, and has length limits, resetting if longer pull, etc....
Rope come a long us 1500lb pull to start, one pulley makes it 3000lb pull.
Have 300 ft of rope? It'll pull it if you have enough time
Good work 😀
Thanks for the video.
Good luck to the new guy.
I made my own 5 to 1 (or maybe 4 to 1?) ... with 2 double pulleys... not as slick but a lot cheaper.... not sure if there are any inherent downsides to the actual fiddleblock?
Hey Bob, nothing wrong with a homemade 5:1. Fancy one would probably be more efficient (lose less energy to friction, but not totally sure.) If you set it up like I showed, where you are facing the load, and pulling away from it, then it's 5:1. If it's the other way, facing the anchor, then it's 4:1. - Patrick
@@TreeMuggs_PatrickM thanks Patrick... of course... 5 lines coming from the *moving* point make it a 5:1, right?
@@scatoutdebutter Yessir!
What cord/length are you using for that prusik? Looks like 1/2" rigging line (orange) and I'm guessing 10mm cord? I'm thinking Samson Ice Tail might be a good choice for applications like this one. Or maybe Tenex.
hey doug, you ve tried the petzl traxion pulley? the one that goes 13mm
Great video, can I ask what your prussik chord is rated to in this scenario and what chord you use?
This is a Samson Tenex Single Carrier Prusik cord, around 6000 lb tensile... - Patrick
@@TreeMuggs_PatrickM thanks, now when do I get to be an educated climber?
If pulling a huge back leaner do you still attach with prusik?
What prusik should I buy?
9/16 husky bull rope.
Want safely be able to pull 3k......if need be in emergency... Daily 500-800lbs
Is this French Prusik as effective as a regular prusik?
Masdaam rope puller, $50
But variable quality.........
How do you feel about a masdam rope puller compared to a fiddle?
I was wanting to know the same thing.
Great vid,s as always.
Isnt that a 4 ti 1 ratio? cam cleat is re-directing force with no mechanical advantage.
And how is it that in most instructional videos, people never stick a wedge in back cut?
In your opinion would you say this set up has more Pull then a rope come along
no, I just find the fiddle blocks a bit quicker to use... - Patrick
@@TreeMuggs_PatrickM Thank you buddy
What makes this superior to the Masdam 10:1? In what applications might this be a better option? Thanks
I just find it quicker to deply, that's why I usually prefer it... - Patrick
The rope you were pulling on, looked too low on the tree. The rope was pulling more horizontally against the tree than vertically. If the rope had been 12-15' higher, it would have more likely come down the first time your man tugged on it.
Great video but for the beginners I'd recommend making the back cut an inch or 2 higher then the bottom of your notch to protect yourself from the bottom kicking back I was training a guy and he didn't want to hear my warnings about this and it was inches away from seriously injuring him possibly ending his life I'm just happy it was done on the ground where he had a place to run rather then if he made that mistake while being in a tree and with the tension applied from the fiddle block this guy is a pro and I'm sure he was conscience of this but since people are using videos for education think it's important to state this
~Stay safe and fucking send it
Wedges?
Hi, is it safe to clip a carabiner to another carabiner - both being triple lock?
It's safe if you can ensure they don't sideload. It's not the optimal connection, ideally you'd use a rigging plate, ring or textile connector inbetween, but it's not unsafe to use two carabiners.
@@raphaelbeinhauer9242 this would be for climbing - rope to carabiner, carabiner to carabiner and finally carabiner to zigzag.
@@raphaelbeinhauer9242 advancing up the tree while in the tree, double rope. The zigzag has a really tite rubber grommet where carabiner attaches. So, I could leave one biner attached to zigzag and re-attach the 2 biner after new tie in point is established.
@@jolkraeremeark6949 If you do that I would suggest using a rubber band or something to keep your eye splice secured on the top biner to minimize the potential for crossloading.
@@raphaelbeinhauer9242 no spliced eye, tied to the biner. My thought was I would avoid retying to carabiner when advancing.
Walking in front of a stem after you already made the back cut....
in this case it's pretty darn safe, its leaning backwards, only possible way it can fall before pulling on the fiddle block is away from you
Would be a lot better if you actually showed how to set up the fiddle block
It must be a new tree worker thing… if you want to save a lot of time and money.... just use a rope come along… it's been around for years and it has endless rope....
you and me both are having a hard time finding committed help, I assume
Always, always, always.... - Patrick
Im extremely committed to all aspects off tree work and always give 150% , i had reached the point in my life that the bigger trees were calling me however , i found out that 35 is now too old to work in Canada !! ?¿
sad times / i can do the same amount of work as 3 of todays 20 year olds !!!
HALFWAY THROUGH ON THE FACE CUT ANGLED BACK CUT WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK
Please use a 461 when felling things.
That saw sounds like a transsexual yelling at its therapist that it’s parents don’t love it.
Ha! Yer right, auto tune sucks. I remember when we got the first batch of those turds, it was winter, working on rattlesnake habitat clear cut in a remote spot. We'd routinely leave our gear onsight all week as to save on the hike. Those pos auto tune huskys would not start! Change in temperature, no start. High humidity, no start! Aggggh!! I talked to a husky rep this past winter at a trade show, sez no more 372 :(
Way too fast, way too advanced, I can't keep up. Your hands move super fast on all the stuff you're doing, but you're very casually explaining. You need to be more deliberate, go slower, show what you're doing more explicitly. Camera work is very shaky. I wish you would re-do this video. Sorry to be so critical.