I'm actually surprised to see WC coming out with these; I can't imagine that a fragmenting 115 grain bullet, "designed with sharp edges", would be a good idea for self-defense. Just like with those RIP rounds a few years ago, I have a feeling that these would be a prosecutor's wet dream. I would love to see Mas's take on them.
@@ryantobin9299 They make other bullets that will do that, and don't make medical assistance more difficult. i could see police using them in departments with good legal cover.
Pushing these fragmenting boutique ammo gimmick type rounds is only making Wilson look foolish and giving his brand a bad look. He even has a 90 gr 9mm round like this already on the market that Underwood is trying to sell. LOL Wilson needs to stop screwing around and start promoting the 2 best rounds he has the XD and XP. These are the real thing and Wilson needs to get behind them!
@@ryantobin9299 and I'm not trying to take away from that, I personally don't care if rounds are made to be explosive, if somebody is attacking me or my children, I want them to stop. And I don't know how good or not these would be at stopping threats, other than what we've seen in gel tests. In that same vein, all of the different brands of extreme penetrator/solid fluted projectile shells are still a question mark to me in terms of efficacy - to my knowledge they have not actually been used in self-defense shooting, so we don't know how well they really will work. But I digress… My point is, with these, I am just purely looking at it from the legal standpoint of where we are right now. As I said, I would like to see Mas' take on it, given his many years of legal experience.
@@phillhuddleston9445 I don't know. You get the petals fracturing off, and then the heavy base continues on. The base retains a large portion of the original weight. It sounds like both to me!
Very nice demonstration of how this pill performs. Now folks, remember, this is the "Controlled Chaos" pill, which is supposed to perform differently than the "Extreme Defense" pill. Looking forward to seeing how that pill does using the same criteria of testing. Yes, gone are the days of woe we in L.E. cringed over when 9mm was becoming popular in the U.S. The pill technology changes are a very big welcome to equalize the performance. I still favor .45ACP as my first choice out of my 1911, but I would feel much more comfortable reaching for a 9mm with higher capacity if the need arose. The pistol is what you use to fight your way to your carbine and/or scattergun(s) if/when things go really badly.
''The pistol is what you use to fight your way to your carbine and/or scattergun(s) if/when things go really badly.'' As a civilian if I have gotten as far as my car, if the way is clear, me and my trunk gun will be on the road for far, far away. Usually you will have to solve your problem with what you have on you.
@@cameron8679 If it is an urban cop he should have backup on the way. For me as a civilian the back up cops could shoot me for a bad guy if I have a rifle in my hands for sure. A pistol even if out of the holster, should be concealed as much a possible and if the coast looks clear back in the holster as you retreat.
No thanks. I'll stick to jacketed lead hollow points. Penetration to vitals is the key to shutting down the attacker. 6 inches of massive expansion into gel is not 6 inches into flesh. The part that actually would have reached the vitals was a tiny little piece of copper. The equivalent of a 22lr. You aren't going to shut down the attacker with shock. Pistols just don't have that kind of oomph, save for magnum calibers that are equivalent in power to rifles. Before you say anything, NO, I wouldn't be interested in getting shot with this. Don't be an idiot. It just wouldn't be the round that I would rely on.
Tim Robinson Federal Syntech Defense is my home defense pistol loads but not my carry defense loads. At least not usually. Its 135gr. though not 115gr. The Syntech Defense three petal frangibles have the same performance meeting FBI protocol as these copper. It is a nasty round doing the same damage. It fragments on impact and the base keeps going. Has enough penetration on the threat but less penetration through barriers making it a good home defense round. I would like to see a version of this for .38Spl. +P.
Thanks Bill and Ken,Paul all good Wilson Folks I watch a lot when you put them on your Channel. Yes very impressed on the Leigh 9mm Max. I have purchased one box. Will get more later as my Budget allows. As being Retired now from LEO Funds are limited. Yes,subscriber to Wilson Combat. Happy 4th of July to you all Leigh and Wilson Combat Staff Instructors Contributors, (Nampa,Idaho) Follower Enhanced CCW Wife also. Be Safe God-Bless.07/03/2024.
Having carried for 48 years in LE and other, I have never been a fan of the 9mm. However, this ammo may make me consider this round as a viable option to the larger calibers for self defense applications.
I used to think that way too. But have been making some researches and 9mm is very popular because it’s effective, high velocity and lightweight, and ultimately, for personal defense it will stop any threat!
With advanced bullet design even the , 380 is becoming more effective and a popular choice where concealment is a must. I'm good with 9mm and the . 357Sig however the 9mm has been most popular and cheaper to work with due to cost and higher pressure as well , I like the 45ACP but mainly these days for range gunning, but I can say without doubt the 357 SIG is Sweet !
Looks like it would fail through wood, drywall, car door steel and glass. Permanent wound channel is good for maybe 6", but performs like a ball round after, so side shots might blow up the arm, but minimal damage beyond that. I've seen HST disintegrate with a shoulder shot, becoming ineffective as far as forcefully stopping a perp. Looks like this could be the same. Looks like a head shot would likely crumble before penetrating. Tee box might be ok though, if you are that good of shot under stress with an uncooperative perp. So for this round to be really effective, the perp has to be willing to stand facing directly towards you, refuse to use any concealment, partial or otherwise, and after being shot, stop being aggressive for the 20 or so seconds after the first shot to allow a nicked artery to bleed out. Sounds marginally better than hollow point, or not, for clear frontal shots, and possible worse than ball rounds for everything else. You already have the best bullet in the Extreme Defender 9mm, married in the Underwood +P+ round. Best all around round for all angles and all penetratible barriers. 2.5-3" permanent wound channel 14" deep, instead of just 6", so a side shot will be very effective. Plus a loaded 15 round mag weighs about 2oz less than 115g hollow point, nicer for EDC. Two mags equal quarter pound. Felt recoil and ballistics are very similar to cheap range ball ammo, so you can get meaningful reps without blowing through expensive defensive ammo. Just haven't found anything better for 9mm, and with better penetration, similar permanent wound channel, higher capacity and more compact than 40 or 45, don't see any reason to larger calibre, and I have compact 12 round 45s that are similar in size to my G19. Love them, but I only carry 9mm. At the end of the day, carry what you want, but carry... :-)
The energy dump and fracture point is done at a good depth. Most people arent 12-14" inches thick to the vitals in the chest , stomach or skull . Think about this , fmj or hollow point stays together and hits the skull . Going straight through right ? There's people that survive that . Rounds like these are turning your brain into blended jello , rupturing lungs or blowing your heart apart and you have a reduced risk of over penetration with higher lethality . Not to mention the fact that instead of 1 or 2 holes to patch up , the dr. is going to have to fish out 3 to 8 petals and a slug to close you up and odds are slim youre going to make it to them anyway.
Not likely. It's still the same weight as a conventional bullet and though it will lose some energy punching through, it's still very much a FMJ ball of lethal metal.
Federal Syntech Defense 9mm HP lead core 135gr. frangibles are just as effective by FBI protocol. They also are three segment frangibles. These are my home defense loads but not my carry defense loads. Many frangibles don't have enough penetration. I would like to see a .38Spl. +P version of one of these.
Interesting and having sharp fragments could certainly be useful. I would like to see it tested by others such as tools and targets and paul harrell. I especially want to see it after has penetrated fabric. The base is sort of like a .380 slug, except it is said to be shaper. i guess Excalibur bullets are a good thing.
Did you not watch the whole video? They DID test it on fabric, as last time I checked, denim is a fabric. Unless you meant you want to see those aforementioned channels do a similar fabric test but more with different types of fabric...
Well, it does what is supposed to do with a 4" barrel! However, I carry a pistol with a 3.2" barrel, significant difference. Now, since Bill sometimes one of his compact 1911's what does he expect this round to do for him? Or, what ammo does he carry for personal defense? Best to ya',,,,!
Thanks. A hit to the sternum, the bone, the ribs- have you seen what it will do? Maybe on the hogs you have some evidence of this kind of impact/ shot???
Outstanding AF guys!! Ilean towards 124g and 147g projectiles typically in 9mm but this looks very promising for defensive carry. Looking forward to seeing more from the channel one of the best out there imo!
Looks like it would have a better chance of severing an artery. Not to mention a better chance of them dying on an operating table after being shot when the surgeon tryst to pick the petals and the projectile out
I run the 155gr ex defender from a 6” 10mm@1400fps…135gr nosler asp@1550…and 180 and 200gr xtp’s@1300…the nosler does the most damage and vaporizes bottles but the cheap 180gr hp blem ain’t far off…
Looks like a replica of the "RIP round, even watching the slow mo looks like your watching the same video. Identical results from an identical round, go figure!
Congratulations on what looks to be an innovative and tech that has a future. It seem to cure the issues with the failed R.i.P. round with better properties. I will be picking up, (ordering a box). But I am sold on the solid scalloped nosed rounds you make! ;
Failed? Have you watched the test videos? It's literally identical, even the travel of the "wad cutter" is literally identical. They literally copied the RIP round and got identical results!
I've ran 100 rip rounds through my glock 22 and nothing about it is a failure . If you wish to believe so , please stand in front of one being fired and let us know how much it fails .
Ken, let's keep it defensive. "Hunting two legged critters" is not the phrase I want a prosecutor to discover while I'm defending myself in court. I'm pretty sure Mas and Marty will not appreciate the extra work. Good round though.
Stop listening to internet lawyers. He could say "this is great ammo to shoot another human being in the torso and head repeatedly until they are dead", and that is not in any way, shape or form illegal, nor is it somehow going to be used against you in court. I'd love to see someone cite a single (just one) case of ammo choice/legal gun modifications/terminology choices resulting in a prosecution where there otherwise wouldn't be.
@@JJ_SDWRmy defensive use of force is to STOP a deadly threat, not to hunt, not to kill. Anything you say, write or wrongly hold as a justified round fired will be used against you in court.
I have always been a supporter of flechette producing projectiles and I believe this video is an excellent example as to why I feel the way I do about them I shall buy the 9mm version of this bullet but I really hope there is a 45 ACP version in the que?
A big game or self-defense bullet had better mushroom, stay together and penatrate or I have no use for it. Fragmenting bullets are great for prairie dogs or hide hunting coyotes. Anything else is marketing B.S. in my opinion.
here in Italy it's forbidden for self defense. You need a FMJ ball ammo otherwise you will hurt criminal too much and he doesn't deserve such a treatment...
Inflation has hurt ammo sales. World war III is just around the corner but no one is buying ammo! Wilson is so desperate for sales that he has lost his dignity and started pushing this fragmenting stuff!
On the Meat Target we see typical damage to the pork chop pectoral, where it hit ribs shattered it perhaps to a greater degree than typical as this is where the 3 segments are seperating out, interestingly the damage to our orange lung tissue was Very impressive in the oranges at the front of the target where the 3 petals were found but nearly NONE existant in the oranges in the back, and the base was found stuck in the plastic packaging of the ribs on the back of the target with no penetration to the back ribs. Many may consider this under penetration as typical 9mm jhps will be found in the T-shirt on the backside of the target or the first few layers of our new and improved high tech fleece bullet stop. Is it the right ammunition for me? No. Is it the right ammunition for you? You be the judge.
Nope, doesn't seem like a good idea at all. I want more effect through the entire channel, not some gimmick. Edit to add: These look terrible! A light for caliber wadcutter with a shallow flesh wound is laughable. Stick to HSTs and Gold Dots, folks!
And why do you censor and hide my comment? This is a dangerous ammunition, and should be banned. It could have serious legal implications. Again, why do you hide my observation?
"What do you guys think of this?" "Gosh, I am really impressed with [product we are selling]! I did not expect [product we are selling] to perform as well as it did! I was really very skeptical about [product we are selling] up until this very moment! [product we are selling] has won me over!"
Bill should have founded a software company. It doesn’t penetrate 3a armor - that’s not a bug, it’s a feature 😁. I‘ll stick with the Lehigh Xtreme Defense for my 357 Sig
I'm fairly sure it's a legal requirement for handgun ammo not to be "armor piercing"; although, the actual definition of "armor piercing" is weird. From a practical standpoint, I don't know why someone wouldn't want armor piercing ammo if the terminal performance on flesh is still good.
Interesting, but I do not know if dumping its maximum disturbance in the 1st few inches is better than a fully expanded bullet traveling into the 12 - 18 inch mark. Consistency is certainly a very important factor, but I still would like more data to see if it is a better mouse trap.
@nicolatesla768 How thick are your shoulders? If you get in a situation where you need to defend yourself and the guy isn't squared up with you, a few inches of penetratiin isn't going to cut it. 12"-18" seems like a good baseline.
@@tray22 I do plenty of research, and come to my own conclusions. If I can see a particular round used on an animal, that generally seals the deal for me. 9mm Federal Syntech Defense does what this round does. I've seen test done in meat. The rear base can overcome bone and penetrate further, Lethal cartridge. Permanent wound cavity is huge. The three pedals have a Greater chance of hitting other vitals as well.
I once sent a Springfield to Novak for improvements from Vances and Ken shot it, according to the report I got back. Out of the box my Springfield basic 1911 in 1986 shot like a smoothbore. They made it combat ready.
I want to see Paul Harrell test this
Yoooo! Paul Harrell is The Man!
You be the judge
Yeah me too. Definitely would be interesting
@@janice5791 I'm not sure how people get his address to send him stuff
Yes we need to see what these bullets do to the meat target?
I'm actually surprised to see WC coming out with these; I can't imagine that a fragmenting 115 grain bullet, "designed with sharp edges", would be a good idea for self-defense. Just like with those RIP rounds a few years ago, I have a feeling that these would be a prosecutor's wet dream. I would love to see Mas's take on them.
Because I want to stop whatever threat is coming my way
Human or other wise
@@ryantobin9299 They make other bullets that will do that, and don't make medical assistance more difficult. i could see police using them in departments with good legal cover.
Pushing these fragmenting boutique ammo gimmick type rounds is only making Wilson look foolish and giving his brand a bad look. He even has a 90 gr 9mm round like this already on the market that Underwood is trying to sell. LOL Wilson needs to stop screwing around and start promoting the 2 best rounds he has the XD and XP. These are the real thing and Wilson needs to get behind them!
@@ryantobin9299 and I'm not trying to take away from that, I personally don't care if rounds are made to be explosive, if somebody is attacking me or my children, I want them to stop. And I don't know how good or not these would be at stopping threats, other than what we've seen in gel tests. In that same vein, all of the different brands of extreme penetrator/solid fluted projectile shells are still a question mark to me in terms of efficacy - to my knowledge they have not actually been used in self-defense shooting, so we don't know how well they really will work. But I digress… My point is, with these, I am just purely looking at it from the legal standpoint of where we are right now. As I said, I would like to see Mas' take on it, given his many years of legal experience.
Most "Experts" agree that a standard or typical JHP is best for self-defense when it comes to the Courts.
Best to ya',,,,!
*2013* : weight retention is the key to effective performance
*2023* : breaking apart is the key to effective performance
This gives you BOTH!
its all a compromise ,
@@andyhuebschmann5616 You can't have both in this case!
@@phillhuddleston9445 I don't know. You get the petals fracturing off, and then the heavy base continues on. The base retains a large portion of the original weight. It sounds like both to me!
Both are correct, depending on the engineering of the round.
Very nice demonstration of how this pill performs. Now folks, remember, this is the "Controlled Chaos" pill, which is supposed to perform differently than the "Extreme Defense" pill. Looking forward to seeing how that pill does using the same criteria of testing. Yes, gone are the days of woe we in L.E. cringed over when 9mm was becoming popular in the U.S. The pill technology changes are a very big welcome to equalize the performance. I still favor .45ACP as my first choice out of my 1911, but I would feel much more comfortable reaching for a 9mm with higher capacity if the need arose. The pistol is what you use to fight your way to your carbine and/or scattergun(s) if/when things go really badly.
''The pistol is what you use to fight your way to your carbine and/or scattergun(s) if/when things go really badly.''
As a civilian if I have gotten as far as my car, if the way is clear, me and my trunk gun will be on the road for far, far away. Usually you will have to solve your problem with what you have on you.
@@loquat44-40 as a civilian being the important distinction there
@@cameron8679 If it is an urban cop he should have backup on the way. For me as a civilian the back up cops could shoot me for a bad guy if I have a rifle in my hands for sure. A pistol even if out of the holster, should be concealed as much a possible and if the coast looks clear back in the holster as you retreat.
I'm using a 185 in my 45acp and this one in my 9mm.
Preferated organs with a 9mm. What a concept.
No thanks. I'll stick to jacketed lead hollow points. Penetration to vitals is the key to shutting down the attacker. 6 inches of massive expansion into gel is not 6 inches into flesh. The part that actually would have reached the vitals was a tiny little piece of copper. The equivalent of a 22lr. You aren't going to shut down the attacker with shock. Pistols just don't have that kind of oomph, save for magnum calibers that are equivalent in power to rifles. Before you say anything, NO, I wouldn't be interested in getting shot with this. Don't be an idiot. It just wouldn't be the round that I would rely on.
Federal has this design as part of their SynTec line of ammo for years. Theirs is a fracturing hardcast lead instead of copper.
Tim Robinson Federal Syntech Defense is my home defense pistol loads but not my carry defense loads. At least not usually. Its 135gr. though not 115gr. The Syntech Defense three petal frangibles have the same performance meeting FBI protocol as these copper. It is a nasty round doing the same damage. It fragments on impact and the base keeps going. Has enough penetration on the threat but less penetration through barriers making it a good home defense round. I would like to see a version of this for .38Spl. +P.
Yes and would be better 138 gr more retained momentum and segments angle forward more if one were to choose segmenting for unknown reasons of wow gee
Thanks Bill and Ken,Paul all good Wilson Folks I watch a lot when you put them on your Channel. Yes very impressed on the Leigh 9mm Max. I have purchased one box. Will get more later as my Budget allows. As being Retired now from LEO Funds are limited. Yes,subscriber to Wilson Combat. Happy 4th of July to you all Leigh and Wilson Combat Staff Instructors Contributors, (Nampa,Idaho) Follower Enhanced CCW Wife also. Be Safe God-Bless.07/03/2024.
The star of this video isn't the bullet; it's Paul's mustache. That's some Ron Swanson power right there.
Having carried for 48 years in LE and other, I have never been a fan of the 9mm. However, this ammo may make me consider this round as a viable option to the larger calibers for self defense applications.
I used to think that way too. But have been making some researches and 9mm is very popular because it’s effective, high velocity and lightweight, and ultimately, for personal defense it will stop any threat!
With advanced bullet design even the , 380 is becoming more effective and a popular choice where concealment is a must. I'm good with 9mm and the . 357Sig however the 9mm has been most popular and cheaper to work with due to cost and higher pressure as well , I like the 45ACP but mainly these days for range gunning, but I can say without doubt the 357 SIG is Sweet !
I come from same camp but bullets have come long way and I pack one time to time but 10mm is my choice
You are stuck in the 1970s. I would pass on this ammo in favor of the best - 147 grain Federal HST. It will absolutely get the job done.
@@SN-cb9xj 147hst is what’s in both my 9’s lol
Would like to see this tested on bone or pvc to simulate bone to see what the effect on the bullet is going through a harder object.
That was my first thought.
oh yeah bone test pls
Looks like it would fail through wood, drywall, car door steel and glass. Permanent wound channel is good for maybe 6", but performs like a ball round after, so side shots might blow up the arm, but minimal damage beyond that. I've seen HST disintegrate with a shoulder shot, becoming ineffective as far as forcefully stopping a perp. Looks like this could be the same. Looks like a head shot would likely crumble before penetrating. Tee box might be ok though, if you are that good of shot under stress with an uncooperative perp. So for this round to be really effective, the perp has to be willing to stand facing directly towards you, refuse to use any concealment, partial or otherwise, and after being shot, stop being aggressive for the 20 or so seconds after the first shot to allow a nicked artery to bleed out. Sounds marginally better than hollow point, or not, for clear frontal shots, and possible worse than ball rounds for everything else. You already have the best bullet in the Extreme Defender 9mm, married in the Underwood +P+ round. Best all around round for all angles and all penetratible barriers. 2.5-3" permanent wound channel 14" deep, instead of just 6", so a side shot will be very effective. Plus a loaded 15 round mag weighs about 2oz less than 115g hollow point, nicer for EDC. Two mags equal quarter pound. Felt recoil and ballistics are very similar to cheap range ball ammo, so you can get meaningful reps without blowing through expensive defensive ammo. Just haven't found anything better for 9mm, and with better penetration, similar permanent wound channel, higher capacity and more compact than 40 or 45, don't see any reason to larger calibre, and I have compact 12 round 45s that are similar in size to my G19. Love them, but I only carry 9mm. At the end of the day, carry what you want, but carry... :-)
I really enjoy these videos as they are so informative. Bullet is excellent.
The energy dump and fracture point is done at a good depth. Most people arent 12-14" inches thick to the vitals in the chest , stomach or skull . Think about this , fmj or hollow point stays together and hits the skull . Going straight through right ? There's people that survive that . Rounds like these are turning your brain into blended jello , rupturing lungs or blowing your heart apart and you have a reduced risk of over penetration with higher lethality . Not to mention the fact that instead of 1 or 2 holes to patch up , the dr. is going to have to fish out 3 to 8 petals and a slug to close you up and odds are slim youre going to make it to them anyway.
4 Layers of denim sounds like someone wearing a Canadian tuxedo.
1999 called, it wants its Aguila 9mm +P frangible ammo back.
So, for self defense, maybe inside the home, for instance, if you miss and it hits a wall, does it loose power?
Not likely. It's still the same weight as a conventional bullet and though it will lose some energy punching through, it's still very much a FMJ ball of lethal metal.
Are there any real world documented self defense incidents with this round? Thanks
Federal Syntech Defense 9mm HP lead core 135gr. frangibles are just as effective by FBI protocol. They also are three segment frangibles. These are my home defense loads but not my carry defense loads. Many frangibles don't have enough penetration. I would like to see a .38Spl. +P version of one of these.
Interesting and having sharp fragments could certainly be useful. I would like to see it tested by others such as tools and targets and paul harrell. I especially want to see it after has penetrated fabric. The base is sort of like a .380 slug, except it is said to be shaper. i guess Excalibur bullets are a good thing.
Did you not watch the whole video? They DID test it on fabric, as last time I checked, denim is a fabric. Unless you meant you want to see those aforementioned channels do a similar fabric test but more with different types of fabric...
Tools and target already did
@@someguy2741 I will look it up.
No amount of testing will help this crap.
Well, it does what is supposed to do with a 4" barrel! However, I carry a pistol with a 3.2" barrel, significant difference.
Now, since Bill sometimes one of his compact 1911's what does he expect this round to do for him? Or, what ammo does he carry for personal defense?
Best to ya',,,,!
Thanks. A hit to the sternum, the bone, the ribs- have you seen what it will do? Maybe on the hogs you have some evidence of this kind of impact/ shot???
Impressive. Most impressive. 👍
Outstanding AF guys!! Ilean towards 124g and 147g projectiles typically in 9mm but this looks very promising for defensive carry. Looking forward to seeing more from the channel one of the best out there imo!
I run 124grn gold dots
Wonder how this bullet would perform in a court of law in a self defense case?
This round definitely looks effective, although I would be afraid of the base passing through and hitting a non intended target. Great video.
Critical duty barrier blind.😊
This must be the latest in snake oil bullets. I will stick to 124 grain Gold Dots and HST’s.
Those look nasty. Way to go, Bill.
_Surgeons HATE Him!_
Looks nice. Hopefully to see more in the future.
Glad to see you exploring new technologies, but I think a single copper projectile closer to the Barnes is the way to go.
How about testing them up against the extreme defense bullet.
Great video
I’m not sure I’ll switch from Xtreme Defender +p 90gr
Great info as always. I will be picking up some of this.
Third guy needs to get with it, not gonna join the pot belly club anytime soon
This reminds me a bit of jim cirillos safe stop
How about performance through barriers like glass, wood, cars, walls and the like?
Excellent... ready to buy some factory loaded cartridges!
I thought the video was done for us not for only you guys
Looks like it would have a better chance of severing an artery. Not to mention a better chance of them dying on an operating table after being shot when the surgeon tryst to pick the petals and the projectile out
Really excellent performance.
Will there be a 38 Special loading?
I want to see how it does going through dry wall
I know it's the wrong place but what are your guys thoughts on czs
Is it made in .30 carbine ?
I run the 155gr ex defender from a 6” 10mm@1400fps…135gr nosler asp@1550…and 180 and 200gr xtp’s@1300…the nosler does the most damage and vaporizes bottles but the cheap 180gr hp blem ain’t far off…
Other calibers?
Nice!!
I just looked up this ammo on the internet less than and hour ago and this shows up on my RUclips feed. Seriously?
Looks like the ruler started at the 1” mark, so really it was 16” penetration.
Good news for an active shooter with light body armor.
Looks like a replica of the "RIP round, even watching the slow mo looks like your watching the same video. Identical results from an identical round, go figure!
Interesting ammo very interesting
Be nice if the petals themselves would go a bare minimum of 9 to 10 inches. If they made it in a 357 Magnum I bet you could get some good results.
Good results. Thank you.
I carry a canik sfx rival
Works in compact pistol, or does it need a full size pistol ?
Need it in 45acp
The evolution of the arrow. Amazing performance! I want some! I just hope this design won't be another Black Talon. We certainly don't need that.
Congratulations on what looks to be an innovative and tech that has a future. It seem to cure the issues with the failed R.i.P. round with better properties. I will be picking up, (ordering a box). But I am sold on the solid scalloped nosed rounds you make! ;
Failed? Have you watched the test videos? It's literally identical, even the travel of the "wad cutter" is literally identical. They literally copied the RIP round and got identical results!
I've ran 100 rip rounds through my glock 22 and nothing about it is a failure . If you wish to believe so , please stand in front of one being fired and let us know how much it fails .
Ken, let's keep it defensive. "Hunting two legged critters" is not the phrase I want a prosecutor to discover while I'm defending myself in court. I'm pretty sure Mas and Marty will not appreciate the extra work. Good round though.
Stop listening to internet lawyers. He could say "this is great ammo to shoot another human being in the torso and head repeatedly until they are dead", and that is not in any way, shape or form illegal, nor is it somehow going to be used against you in court. I'd love to see someone cite a single (just one) case of ammo choice/legal gun modifications/terminology choices resulting in a prosecution where there otherwise wouldn't be.
@@JJ_SDWRmy defensive use of force is to STOP a deadly threat, not to hunt, not to kill. Anything you say, write or wrongly hold as a justified round fired will be used against you in court.
Like that ...very nice for close quarters fighting and around the home ...where can we get them ?
What if a shorter barrel pistol is used?
👍👍
Need this in 40 cal
Self defense ammo needs to be proven is multiple gunfights before you carry it to save your life. I'll stick with 124gr +p Gold Dot.
I’m sold! I’m guessing their not cheap, but you often get what you pay for…..most of the time.
I have always been a supporter of flechette producing projectiles and I believe this video is an excellent example as to why I feel the way I do about them I shall buy the 9mm version of this bullet but I really hope there is a 45 ACP version in the que?
Check out Liberty Civil Defense.
@@THall-vi8cp their loads are way too light and dont pernitrate anywhere deep enough. terrible ammo
@zack991
I guess shooting through car doors and punching through 3A like it isn't there is poor penetration and too light of a load. Who knew?
Try some hog hunts with this ammo at resizable ranges with the pistol , keep up the good work.👍
👍
Hm 🤔 you sold me. I'm going to grab a box.
Sharp? mmmm... I'll take it.
My concern is functionality. Do they feed reliably?
A big game or self-defense bullet had better mushroom, stay together and penatrate or I have no use for it.
Fragmenting bullets are great for prairie dogs or hide hunting coyotes. Anything else is marketing B.S. in my opinion.
here in Italy it's forbidden for self defense. You need a FMJ ball ammo otherwise you will hurt criminal too much and he doesn't deserve such a treatment...
Who’s going to fill their shoes?
Too me, it looks like it would over penetrate unless it hits a bone.
Are you hyping your own product?
Inflation has hurt ammo sales. World war III is just around the corner but no one is buying ammo! Wilson is so desperate for sales that he has lost his dignity and started pushing this fragmenting stuff!
Another RIP round. No thanks. Thanks for the vid.
My ccw instructor is 30 yr sheriff and expert witness in murder trials. He maintains this is all BS. Expensive waste of money.
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Dear lord, all these primitive imperial units.
On the Meat Target we see typical damage to the pork chop pectoral, where it hit ribs shattered it perhaps to a greater degree than typical as this is where the 3 segments are seperating out, interestingly the damage to our orange lung tissue was Very impressive in the oranges at the front of the target where the 3 petals were found but nearly NONE existant in the oranges in the back, and the base was found stuck in the plastic packaging of the ribs on the back of the target with no penetration to the back ribs. Many may consider this under penetration as typical 9mm jhps will be found in the T-shirt on the backside of the target or the first few layers of our new and improved high tech fleece bullet stop. Is it the right ammunition for me? No. Is it the right ammunition for you? You be the judge.
Thanks for articulating the benefits of the new ammo, hope to see it priced right. Now shoot it out of an smg sized barrel.
The concept is not a new one. Federals SYNTECH Defence does the same thing. Came out over 4 years ago. Lethal round!
shoot through glass, please,
Nope, doesn't seem like a good idea at all.
I want more effect through the entire channel, not some gimmick.
Edit to add: These look terrible! A light for caliber wadcutter with a shallow flesh wound is laughable. Stick to HSTs and Gold Dots, folks!
Not sure. Not a fan of anything frangible for defense. Another case of ballistic gel selling bullets.
bad guys wear body armor too
Very wrong way to smoke bacon !! Perfect for smoking bad guys !!
Wow, that's ugly...which is beautiful.
And why do you censor and hide my comment? This is a dangerous ammunition, and should be banned. It could have serious legal implications. Again, why do you hide my observation?
I now own Patriot UltraLights - 2100 fps - 9 mil
I shoulda asked too, in acp.32 or 38 sp. .357mag.
"What do you guys think of this?"
"Gosh, I am really impressed with [product we are selling]! I did not expect [product we are selling] to perform as well as it did! I was really very skeptical about [product we are selling] up until this very moment! [product we are selling] has won me over!"
well, your point is mostly valid... but these guys are friends. they are _not_ in the company.
regardless, the results are in the gel.
Bill should have founded a software company. It doesn’t penetrate 3a armor - that’s not a bug, it’s a feature 😁.
I‘ll stick with the Lehigh Xtreme Defense for my 357 Sig
I'm fairly sure it's a legal requirement for handgun ammo not to be "armor piercing"; although, the actual definition of "armor piercing" is weird. From a practical standpoint, I don't know why someone wouldn't want armor piercing ammo if the terminal performance on flesh is still good.
Run the 155s maxed out in a 10mm specialist…from testing wouldn’t want no part of gettin hit with something that mean
68g plus p extreme defense from underwood will penetrate body armor so it must not be illegal
@@riflemanm16a2 Lehigh Xtreme Defense and Lehigh Xtreme Penetrator go through IIIA soft body armor.
Still over penetrates, do you guys even know what you're talking about?
Interesting, but I do not know if dumping its maximum disturbance in the 1st few inches is better than a fully expanded bullet traveling into the 12 - 18 inch mark. Consistency is certainly a very important factor, but I still would like more data to see if it is a better mouse trap.
Critical Duty or HST for me. I don't want half weight bullets zipping deep and dropping petals one inch in.
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Keep in mind, a humans vitals are only a couple inches past the skin.
@nicolatesla768 How thick are your shoulders? If you get in a situation where you need to defend yourself and the guy isn't squared up with you, a few inches of penetratiin isn't going to cut it. 12"-18" seems like a good baseline.
@@tray22 I do plenty of research, and come to my own conclusions. If I can see a particular round used on an animal, that generally seals the deal for me. 9mm Federal Syntech Defense does what this round does. I've seen test done in meat. The rear base can overcome bone and penetrate further, Lethal cartridge. Permanent wound cavity is huge. The three pedals have a Greater chance of hitting other vitals as well.
I once sent a Springfield to Novak for improvements from Vances and Ken shot it, according to the report I got back. Out of the box my Springfield basic 1911 in 1986 shot like a smoothbore. They made it combat ready.