With the power differences from your alliance to some of ours, could you give us the % punch up/down in future videos? a 30K punch down at 300k is very different from 100k.
I have red skull with 4 minions 160,000 in war.(red skull 30,000) It survived an attack from an X-Men lineup no Phoenix at 310,000. Red Skull took 0 damage
For those who may not know, if u can apply defense down on RedSkull during War, he can actually be damaged regardless if he has charges or not, so supernatural and spiderverse teams are actually a nice soft counter but only if punching down, they seem to struggle punching across and cannot punch up. So u can kill RedSkull first in war but only if he has defense down, but making sure he keep it is tough cuz of his high resistances so keep this in mind.
I've laughed when my team was only 85K and wrecked someone trying a 130k punch down with Kree. That had to give them a wtf moment. I almost never see inhumans, so it should annoy people for a while.
Used a +50k winter soldier, Minn, Thanos, Ronan, capt marv with a hangar deflect combination successfully in war medbay no de/buffs. Have thoughts on kree + Thanos.. on my need to try list.
Still did not try against RS squad but I have a question regarding life steal. How does it work with a Minerva or Phoenix that steal life instead of doing damage? RS kit makes him immune to damage with full hydra squad but maybe not stealing life... anyway it does not make a big difference into a fight but I was just wondering about this aspect of RS kit.
I think you are using it wrong!? Punching up is a term use when someone engages in a conflict with an adversary who has greater power/status then themselves. The antonym of "Punching up" would be "Punch down", wherein someone engages in a conflict with an adversary who has less power/status then themselves.
The game is going down the same dangerous road as most games in this genre, which is called power creep. If they don't introduce really good catch-up mechanics for new players the game will run into troubles very fast.
That's a catch 22 though. If there's no power creep, no one is much better than anyone else and all the newly released characters will make us say "who cares". It's a fine balance.
Minn is a hard counter as well because she gives health every death and bypasses death proof and kills the minions with death proof but from the most part I’ve only seen that top tier teams are really the only counters
Ben Scott Sorry should’ve been more clear in my original post I meant the hydra minions with death proof will go down easier because minns ult downs them if they’re low enough and then she gives out a ton of health and sustain and with groot there it should help to
RearAdmiralSnackBar quote a few of the match up pics and vids that were sent to us were over 250-300k so we are pretty confident it still holds true at that level also
If red skull starts the match with full health he starts with full charges... So u have to kill enough minions to deal some dmg to red skull so on your second hit of the team if needed he won't have his recharges if he isn't full health.. Like doing a 2 tap on an ultron defense team... Just have to make sure u hurt ultron a bit so on second tap ultron won't revive.. So do some dmg to redskull by killing enough minions to hurt red skull so second tap he won't be a revive king...
@@ibanborak Seems like you are mistaken a bit. After the battle Red skull - full HP 5 charges and all minions are alive. So next turn he is still with 5 charges - checked!
@@rolef74 you obviously didn't check properly he starts with 8 charges.it is possible to do a tiny bit of damage to him when if you don't remove all his charges and if that's the case even if u have done 1dmg to him he will start with the charges left he had on the previous fight. So if you took him from 8 charges to 5 on your first attack on him but got lucky n managed even do 1dmg to red skull which would not seem noticeable he will start with only those 5 charges. If he's full health he starts next fight with 8 charges. I've killed a shit ton a red skulls. Since they are absolutely everywhere now. I'm in gold2 war. Read his kit. U have it wrong
Just read the passive on Red Skull. It says that if he get reborn, as if a new match start, have 100%life an 0 charges. Then he get 8 charges. So if you can get him down to like 1 charges, he does not get new carges. He only get new charges if he has 0 charges and full health then the fight starts.
I've killed 2 inhuman teams so far with blackbolt in it and they where like 30/50k higher than my hybra and power armor works really well if u stagger the aoe attacks they do way better than my Wakanda team :(
Why do you think they moved Red Skull ahead of Ironheart? Cause they didn't want you to pull Vision out of Power Armor yet. Cause he is the key to dropping the Red skull/hydra team. VISION
@@Hyper4ctiv3 this is just on paper theory crafting here cause my roster is not strong enough to test at proper levels. I like Ultron, Vision, Shuri, Korath and Antman/Merc Lieutenant. You seem to need to maintain a good balance of sustainability/ buffing/ debuffing and Aoe. VISION with the others offers alot of that. CHEW I want a Vid shootout if this works lol
@@theprofessor5237 Thanks, I was also thinking of Vision but more like SN with Vision instead of Elsa. I don't want to break up the teams though, so I also haven't tried them out yet.
we agree on paper but atm havent seen it unless a massive pounch down. Until we get a few more big symbiote teams it will be hard to know for sure but one we are keeping an eye on
@@AlternerdReality I use my symbiote/spidey team all the time against red skull hydra and walk through them easily. once you get all 4 minions down once its a slaughter fest since all you do is use Maul on Venom to flip death proof and with Carnage's speed up from passive they don't stand much of a chance.
I want to try hydra paired with ultron because they do have stuff and if you take out sniper and put ultron on defense it should be pretty powerful even though red skull doesn’t have 100 percent dmg reduction he’d still have 75 percent
Having 2 summoners on the team isn't great, but the reality is that even if that team is a little bit tougher in a 5v5 than RS+minions, that Ultron can be used to make either an amazing offensive team or a second great defensive team. In this situation, the economy of making an invincible RS with autorevive minions is undeniable since those minions are low-tier in any other configuration.
Mestai31 the thing is red skull will still be 75 percent immune and ultron and 2 of the minions still have synergy the taunter and the trooper I’m not saying it’s better but still a pretty good option as well
Who with and what was the power difference? Key is to focus all speed and TM reduction on TS and avoid killing rifle trooper. I don’t recommend aim trom as others do as they debuffs fall off too quick
@@AlternerdReality I used ultron drax merc riot guard capt marvel and mantis.. Don't get me wrong I would've killed it if the match went for 8 mins... Just not enough time. It was a 50k punch down... I don't have black bolt but the best success I've had is with bkt... I wasted my ultron team on that hydra and won't do it again.. N I'm talking bout a 7* gt14 ultron too... I just simply disagree with ultron being a hard counter maybe if u punch down 100k yeah but then that's a soft counter not a hard counter... But with my ultron team I can usually punch up over 100k on other teams with ease but against hydra 50k punch down I simply ran out of time.. Also I believe full spiders team is a good counter even though u never mentioned it... Yes hydra die fast so mass debuffs don't last but if u have spiders built right u can gain bulk speed bar and transfer debuffs via carnage n venom... I haven't tested punch ups on hydra with my spiders.. Because my spider are just over 300k in war n I haven't come across hydra big enough yet to try... But having t4 in carnage passive symbiote passive n miles ult makes them work well against hydra.. Not a hard counter.. But much better counter then ultron in my experience.... Just giving u my experience... But I usually use my spiders to hard counter as guardians... And bkt to punch down on hydra... Just my feedback bro. Love your vids.
That name makes more sense than BKT; I have begrudgingly started using BKT since that has stuck but I much prefer Technerva or Minnardians as a name for those teams.
A lot of the war screenshots and videos we looked at were from top alliances with teams in the 350k+ range and I stand by inhumans and Ultron squads based on that collected info. At that point, youre right in the sense that some of the soft counters like minardians may fall off in effectiveness but those two still function just fine
What we *REALLY* need (more than PvP) is INTERNAL sparring! How else can I prove that my 200k Asguardisn team fights BETTER than my 250k Guardians team?
CHEW, u didnt mention asgardians. LMAO. if you DONT have asgardians set to defense, they can punch realllly well vs hydra. I beat a 190K hydra with a 220k asgardian VERY easily. They have self heals, high sustain, and thor will get his charges up VERY quickly. Also HELA FLIPS their deathproof as well. You may want to try it out yourself, you'll be pleasantly suprised.
omfgitzalex for good reason my man - they are the best defensive team in the game right now. We saw a few teams used on offense to good effect but to pull them off of D to take on hydra when there are multiple hydra counters seems very inefficient
A reminder, dark pheonix special ignores deathproof (just like minn erva's ult)
With the power differences from your alliance to some of ours, could you give us the % punch up/down in future videos? a 30K punch down at 300k is very different from 100k.
I have red skull with 4 minions 160,000 in war.(red skull 30,000) It survived an attack from an X-Men lineup no Phoenix at 310,000. Red Skull took 0 damage
For those who may not know, if u can apply defense down on RedSkull during War, he can actually be damaged regardless if he has charges or not, so supernatural and spiderverse teams are actually a nice soft counter but only if punching down, they seem to struggle punching across and cannot punch up. So u can kill RedSkull first in war but only if he has defense down, but making sure he keep it is tough cuz of his high resistances so keep this in mind.
He has immense defence down resistance if you read his passive. It is virtually impossible to apply it
@@LuckyGrinFTW well then... idk wat to say to that other than i prolly just got lucky those few times.
I beat a 150k Hydra team with my 400k defenders easily
I've laughed when my team was only 85K and wrecked someone trying a 130k punch down with Kree. That had to give them a wtf moment. I almost never see inhumans, so it should annoy people for a while.
Very clear, thanks
Used a +50k winter soldier, Minn, Thanos, Ronan, capt marv with a hangar deflect combination successfully in war medbay no de/buffs. Have thoughts on kree + Thanos.. on my need to try list.
I use Ultron on attack with SL/RR/Groot/Minerva so that will work ;)
havocgr1976 haha that should be an easy win my friend
Still did not try against RS squad but I have a question regarding life steal. How does it work with a Minerva or Phoenix that steal life instead of doing damage? RS kit makes him immune to damage with full hydra squad but maybe not stealing life... anyway it does not make a big difference into a fight but I was just wondering about this aspect of RS kit.
Update: You can use Zemo and Deathpool. They hard kill minions. Zemo even makes them not be revived by Red Skull.
I think you are using it wrong!? Punching up is a term use when someone engages in a conflict with an adversary who has greater power/status then themselves. The antonym of "Punching up" would be "Punch down", wherein someone engages in a conflict with an adversary who has less power/status then themselves.
The game is going down the same dangerous road as most games in this genre, which is called power creep. If they don't introduce really good catch-up mechanics for new players the game will run into troubles very fast.
René G I agree though I don’t think red skull is that character as yet. However, I think black order will be that team
That's a catch 22 though. If there's no power creep, no one is much better than anyone else and all the newly released characters will make us say "who cares". It's a fine balance.
Big success with
Venom carnage and symbiote Spider-Man shuri and Black panther.
I used a f4 team and smoothly sailed thru. Didnt quite expect it but yeahh was smooth enough. Yes it was a punch down 210k vs 155k.
Minn is a hard counter as well because she gives health every death and bypasses death proof and kills the minions with death proof but from the most part I’ve only seen that top tier teams are really the only counters
Sasuke Uchiha Deathproof is only when she revives someone though. With the cooldown, it isn’t the best. Minn and groot would be better
Ben Scott Sorry should’ve been more clear in my original post I meant the hydra minions with death proof will go down easier because minns ult downs them if they’re low enough and then she gives out a ton of health and sustain and with groot there it should help to
Sasuke Uchiha Ah, yes. That does make more sense, thanks
Your BB and Hela are insane btw
I'm really looking forward to the future video on this team in a few weeks after they've been built up and we have some practice fighting them
RearAdmiralSnackBar quote a few of the match up pics and vids that were sent to us were over 250-300k so we are pretty confident it still holds true at that level also
@@AlternerdReality the HYDRA ALREADY 250-300!?!?!?!! Oh lawd this is gonna be tough
Asgardians team is good as well. I discovered Ref Skull cannot revive hydra members after a bit
Hate wasting an overpowered team to rush a weaker team with unreal synergy
Horrible design made to make people whale for blackbolt
does Red Skull lose charges to the next attack when he resurrects minions? Or he always starts with full charges in a new round?
If red skull starts the match with full health he starts with full charges... So u have to kill enough minions to deal some dmg to red skull so on your second hit of the team if needed he won't have his recharges if he isn't full health.. Like doing a 2 tap on an ultron defense team... Just have to make sure u hurt ultron a bit so on second tap ultron won't revive.. So do some dmg to redskull by killing enough minions to hurt red skull so second tap he won't be a revive king...
@@ibanborak Seems like you are mistaken a bit. After the battle Red skull - full HP 5 charges and all minions are alive. So next turn he is still with 5 charges - checked!
@@rolef74 you obviously didn't check properly he starts with 8 charges.it is possible to do a tiny bit of damage to him when if you don't remove all his charges and if that's the case even if u have done 1dmg to him he will start with the charges left he had on the previous fight. So if you took him from 8 charges to 5 on your first attack on him but got lucky n managed even do 1dmg to red skull which would not seem noticeable he will start with only those 5 charges. If he's full health he starts next fight with 8 charges. I've killed a shit ton a red skulls. Since they are absolutely everywhere now. I'm in gold2 war. Read his kit. U have it wrong
Just read the passive on Red Skull. It says that if he get reborn, as if a new match start, have 100%life an 0 charges. Then he get 8 charges. So if you can get him down to like 1 charges, he does not get new carges. He only get new charges if he has 0 charges and full health then the fight starts.
I would not consider a 100k punch down as a counter by any stretch of the imagination
i think a variation of minardians with vision instead of ultron can get the job done.
I've killed 2 inhuman teams so far with blackbolt in it and they where like 30/50k higher than my hybra and power armor works really well if u stagger the aoe attacks they do way better than my
Wakanda team :(
Why do you think they moved Red Skull ahead of Ironheart? Cause they didn't want you to pull Vision out of Power Armor yet. Cause he is the key to dropping the Red skull/hydra team. VISION
Why Vision?
@@Hyper4ctiv3 this is just on paper theory crafting here cause my roster is not strong enough to test at proper levels. I like Ultron, Vision, Shuri, Korath and Antman/Merc Lieutenant. You seem to need to maintain a good balance of sustainability/ buffing/ debuffing and Aoe. VISION with the others offers alot of that. CHEW I want a Vid shootout if this works lol
@@theprofessor5237 Thanks, I was also thinking of Vision but more like SN with Vision instead of Elsa. I don't want to break up the teams though, so I also haven't tried them out yet.
What’s ur TCP?
The spider-man team might do alright with a punchdown. They have sustain and can decently debuff and control the fight IMO.
we agree on paper but atm havent seen it unless a massive pounch down. Until we get a few more big symbiote teams it will be hard to know for sure but one we are keeping an eye on
@@AlternerdReality so I just tried, a just over 200k spider-man team to a 150k Hydra team. I got slaughtered.
@@AlternerdReality I use my symbiote/spidey team all the time against red skull hydra and walk through them easily. once you get all 4 minions down once its a slaughter fest since all you do is use Maul on Venom to flip death proof and with Carnage's speed up from passive they don't stand much of a chance.
And when more people start to get him it will be reworked or when the next toon comes out that completes a team it will be op
Isn't their a character in this game that removes charges? I know there is one... I just can't remember which one it is...
That removes charges? I don’t think so. Would be a cool mechanic though
Rogue (or Sauron) would be one of few that comes to mind. She's obviously not in the game yet.
I want to try hydra paired with ultron because they do have stuff and if you take out sniper and put ultron on defense it should be pretty powerful even though red skull doesn’t have 100 percent dmg reduction he’d still have 75 percent
Having 2 summoners on the team isn't great, but the reality is that even if that team is a little bit tougher in a 5v5 than RS+minions, that Ultron can be used to make either an amazing offensive team or a second great defensive team. In this situation, the economy of making an invincible RS with autorevive minions is undeniable since those minions are low-tier in any other configuration.
Mestai31 the thing is red skull will still be 75 percent immune and ultron and 2 of the minions still have synergy the taunter and the trooper I’m not saying it’s better but still a pretty good option as well
I just used AIM Tron and punched down and destroyed Red Skull.
Seminole Warrior how big was the punch down
@@bartin9637 about 40k if I remember correctly
@@bartin9637 I also did it again last night with about the same punch down
what about aimtron (that i use vs asguardians);
Not really working on your supernatural guys atm? I think my team is about 180k. Also...my GOD that Black Bolt and Hela of yours...WTF?
Were is the bkt footage at lol
My 7 red mbaku for wakanda is gonna take alot of hits
I disagree with your ultron hard counter. I've tried this n did not work well. .
Who with and what was the power difference? Key is to focus all speed and TM reduction on TS and avoid killing rifle trooper. I don’t recommend aim trom as others do as they debuffs fall off too quick
@@AlternerdReality I used ultron drax merc riot guard capt marvel and mantis.. Don't get me wrong I would've killed it if the match went for 8 mins... Just not enough time. It was a 50k punch down... I don't have black bolt but the best success I've had is with bkt... I wasted my ultron team on that hydra and won't do it again.. N I'm talking bout a 7* gt14 ultron too... I just simply disagree with ultron being a hard counter maybe if u punch down 100k yeah but then that's a soft counter not a hard counter... But with my ultron team I can usually punch up over 100k on other teams with ease but against hydra 50k punch down I simply ran out of time.. Also I believe full spiders team is a good counter even though u never mentioned it... Yes hydra die fast so mass debuffs don't last but if u have spiders built right u can gain bulk speed bar and transfer debuffs via carnage n venom... I haven't tested punch ups on hydra with my spiders.. Because my spider are just over 300k in war n I haven't come across hydra big enough yet to try... But having t4 in carnage passive symbiote passive n miles ult makes them work well against hydra.. Not a hard counter.. But much better counter then ultron in my experience.... Just giving u my experience... But I usually use my spiders to hard counter as guardians... And bkt to punch down on hydra... Just my feedback bro. Love your vids.
What's darta?
Australian for Data im guessing?
Tell me how this work on papuh though? I want to know how they work on paper.
ill get right on it once ive finished in the showuh
I think the fury shield team is not a counter just my opinion
i’ve been able to punch down with spiderverse
How to summon that blue ultron minion?
you can't they are for campaigns only
You misspelled BKT
Lol you said "flexible unit"
How did you forget defenders ? They have amazing synergy and 30% additional damage against villain targets !
He didn't forget them. He addresses them in the "Don't use them because they don't work" portion of the video at the beginning.
Someone didn't watch the beginning of video. They were addressed as a team that fails against hydra
Very annoying team. Minions keep respawning. Destroyed my equal power black order.
Dude Minnardians is cringe Chew. Never use that again lol. BKT
ive always called them that my man.
@@AlternerdReality great video man despite the cringe. Ty
That name makes more sense than BKT; I have begrudgingly started using BKT since that has stuck but I much prefer Technerva or Minnardians as a name for those teams.
BKT is a terrible name. We call it CTT for cosmic Tech team
My bkt team is minnerva, rocket, starlord, Thanos and blackbolt. Bkt never made sense as a team name to me.
Im killing hydra with spiders 🤷♀️
There is no hard counter besides inhumen, you will see...
When Redskull teams are becoming maxed out
A lot of the war screenshots and videos we looked at were from top alliances with teams in the 350k+ range and I stand by inhumans and Ultron squads based on that collected info. At that point, youre right in the sense that some of the soft counters like minardians may fall off in effectiveness but those two still function just fine
what does aoe mean?
Maximiliano Vergara area of effect
@@jono051283 thanks!
What we *REALLY* need (more than PvP) is INTERNAL sparring! How else can I prove that my 200k Asguardisn team fights BETTER than my 250k Guardians team?
CHEW, u didnt mention asgardians. LMAO. if you DONT have asgardians set to defense, they can punch realllly well vs hydra. I beat a 190K hydra with a 220k asgardian VERY easily. They have self heals, high sustain, and thor will get his charges up VERY quickly. Also HELA FLIPS their deathproof as well. You may want to try it out yourself, you'll be pleasantly suprised.
omfgitzalex for good reason my man - they are the best defensive team in the game right now. We saw a few teams used on offense to good effect but to pull them off of D to take on hydra when there are multiple hydra counters seems very inefficient
first