God, that image you described of Capt. Burke sadly waving goodbye to the crew as his ship sank, is probably one of the saddest things I've ever heard. :'(
Weather it was a medical emergency that made his decisions irrational or intentional self- retirement, I am very greatful the rest of the crew survived.
He was over 50? If he was not drunk, then it may have been an onset of Alzheimer or other form of dementia or maybe an anomaly in blood circulation in his brains. We will probably never find out.
I got to see a presentation by Dan Fountain, who located the wreck, last weekend. He speculated that the captain had a heart issue since there was a family history, and the last photos of him showed a man who looked far older than his actual age. Fun fact- Dan and the museum folks thought they had located the Bannockburn, until the ROV lit up the name board on the stern.
As somebody who works in the medical field, It sounds like he might have had a Stroke. This would impair his thinking and explain why he did not respond to his crew. The description sure sounds like the lead into a stroke.
It might be only a remote possibility but could a TBI of some kind do the same thing? Like say a self inflicted small caliber gunshot wound to the head that wasn’t obvious in the dark and hectic conditions? I saw a video of a msn who was shot just below the eye and had a small caliber bullet in his brain who was being interviewed by police and he honestly looked and sounded like a confused drunk or high person with a black eye….the detectives didn’t even notice his gunshot wound and call medics until almost an hour into interrogating him.
After witnessing a close friend experience a stroke over the course of 36 hours, the odds are near 100% that the Captain was suffering from one also. The stubbornness, incoherent communication, withdrawal from duty, this man stroked out.
Stroke recognition was not very good back then, so that's as good as guess as any. Some sort of mental breakdown would also be a candidate. The crew was lucky to survive that.
Lake Superior is not so much a lake as it is a freshwater ocean. The first thing I learned being at the lake is that you do not turn your back on it. The second thing I learned was to not underestimate it. Even in summer the waters are cold. The waves can go from placid to breaking in the course of a few minutes. The lake almost seems alive, and even seems to have a pulse. I gained a whole new respect for sailers and others who brave the waters, and I never left the beach! They have to be somewhere betweeen enlightened and stark raving mad!
Also it's about 10 times more likely to drown to a fresh body of water. It takes just a couple spoonfuls of fresh water in the lungs to drown you while you can get a relatively large amount of salt water in the lungs and still survive.
In aviation there's a phenomenon called "Getthereitus" or "Gethomeitus" where a pilot will be so concerned with the need to "get there" or "get home" that they seemingly ignore all other factors telling them that they cannot get there or get home. The weather won't allow it, or the plane is incapable of flying the route, or the pilot lacks the skill and experience to do it. But the pilot bulls on ahead regardless because they have become completely tunnel visioned on the need to get to their initial destination, and a lot of the time where they end up is crashed into the ground and dead. This sounds to me like one of those cases.
Ditto long haul truckers. Also remember to add to the personal ambitions and reputations of captains the fact that many company's (air, ship, truck, and train) dispatchers have yearly bonuses at stake and that creates a recipe for disaster. As a pilot for his whole post WW2 life my father had the ability to ground whatever flight he captained. I saw him actually threaten to ground a full airliner due to his own walk around preflight inspection, which was not required, but Dad always did his own walk around. They checked and inflated a soft tire. Then he flew the flight. As a truck driver I had the right to refuse to haul any load and did refuse several routes my dispatcher told me to drive. Upon arrival at one of our company's yards the other drivers asked me if I'd taken the "short cut" my dispatcher had told me to take. I was a new driver, but not green to the world of push push push. I told them I hadn't because I can read a topo map. They told me my dispatcher had killed a driver the previous year by insisting he drive that route. That poor guy lost his life because he was reluctant to go against the dispatcher. If you don't think your bosses will kill you for profit, think again. Thank heaven the crew survived. There are seriously ill people hauling 80,000 lbs on roads right now, flying non scheduled airplanes and whatever else is moving freight/passengers. Watch yourselves.
@@shelleymarquis2887 That is one of the best comments I have ever read on YT. Thanks. Companies do not care about their people. We are all just "human resources", to be used to meet company goals.
I stick to the stroke theory. It surely is a possibility - but the captain was mumbling and staying in his cabin as much as he could. This change in behaviour doesn't line up with getthereitis.
Wow. This was exceptionally interesting, especially with the wreck being found so recently. I, like others, suspect the captain had suffered a stroke or other cerebral damage. I'll raise a glass to the crew and to the captain, and to the lake that "never gives up her dead." Thanks very much.
As a commercial airline pilot we are trained in CRM (crew resource management)….ships and their command authority are similar in their need for teamwork oriented decision process’ to produce the best outcome. It seems shipping happens at a slower pace and can lull skippers into a false comfort as conditions worsen and options fade quickly…lots of aviation lessons learned from these old shipping stories. Thanks for the excellent content.
Great video. Growing up and going to school in Wyandotte, where the Arlington was built, freighter watching was a favorite past time of many. In the 60's my Grandfather would take us to Bishop Park to watch the big old boats. Seemed like they went by every few minutes back then. Grandpa would clip the vessel passages from page 2 of the Detroit papers and keep it in his pocket.
My Dad, Lloyd Amundson sailed on The Great Lakes out of Duluth 1943-45 on Henry J. Ford, he spoke often of how the weather could change in an instant. They were sailing out of Buffalo the day President Roosevelt died.
If he wasn’t washed out of the wheelhouse as it went down, then there’s some evidence of him still in there somewhere. There were bodies on the bridge of the MS Estonia after it went down for some years. Probably still are.
When he is still with her, his Body probably got preserved trough adipoceration. However, I think it's unlikely one could find something that detailed. I would let him rest there as he went down with her alone.
Great video! It's an absolute miracle that all of the crew were saved (except the captain, of course). I agree with the commenters who suspect that the captain may have suffered a stroke.
I like that little insert from “A Night To Remember”. 👍 Another well done video - very interesting & informative. Your work always impresses me. Cheers
I got interviewed for the local radio when the Arlington was discovered. fascinating story and mystery that I'd only heard in passing before it was found.
It sounds like the Captain suffered some sort of medical emergency. Poor guy. I wonder if he really understood what was happening to him (and around him)
The one thing that is clear is that the Captain was having some kind of medical emergency, I agree it sounds most like a stroke. He was obviously too incapacitated to do much besides occasionally leaving his room. He may have felt something was wrong with him and wanted to get to shore as soon as possible without admitting the reason. But he just kept deteriorating as time passed. It’s tragic that the officers felt they could not do what needed to be done. When it was apparent the Captain was incapacitated, the second in command should have just taken over. The Captain was probably so disoriented by the end, and so ill, that he simply did not understand he was about to die. I am so relieved the crew did not have to pay the ultimate price for the Captain’s mistakes.
How could waterlogged wheat be recoverable after 80 years on the bottom of the Lake? or how could there be any wheat left , washed away and eaten by the fish? IDK anything about Great Lakes shipping, I just discovered this subject on You Tube. Thank you.
Having seen the initial release from the shipwreck hunters I was hoping for a programme which would tell us the story of this incident. Thank you. Having seen your account, I was wondering if Captain Burke had had a stroke or similar incident, and a number of your correspondents clearly think the same. Poor man; may he rest in peace. I suspect that the First Mate would have had his hands full already in coping with the crisis, without wondering if he should usurp the Captain's authority as well. He and his crew all did exceptionally well in such a crisis.
It's such a sad, strange story. Captain "Tatey Bug" Burke sending his ship to her death, then remaining in the pilot house waving goodbye -- it was like he didn't know where they were going or what was happening. It seems like he was definitely impaired somehow that night.
First mate should have assumed command, declaring to the crew a medical emergency for the captain. But it was a different era back then. With a do and do not list of things varying from boat to boat, and captain to captain. While it is sad he went down with arlington, medical emergency or not, he did so with great courage and honor. Seeing his crew rescued and waving goodbye, at the helm doing what he obviously loved to do. Captain of his boat...
Captain Davidson's behavior was moreso reliant on "gethereitis" and using outdated weather information. Captain Burke's behavior seems to have been caused by a brain aneurysm or outright stroke.
Thank goodness the ship following them didn't pay for Burke's mistakes and was able to lend aid. Air crash investigations have turned up several cases of "subtle incapacitation" like this, possibly from a stroke or minor seizure. It cannot be very common, because out of millions of flights this has happened a handful of times. Like most copilots do when faced with this inexplicable problem, the crew of the Arlington initially follow orders and continue doing so as dangers mount - it's drilled into them to do so, usually for good reasons. Luckily, unlike in a plane, they were given sufficient time to realize that he was not rational, and they then took charge and acted exactly as pilots are now trained to do, taking charge, avoiding panic, and seeing to the rescue of everyone aboard.
It’s not so much guilt as knowing that you made the critical mistake. Going down with the ship makes sure that you don’t have to deal with the consequences. It also kind of helps redeem your name a bit in the eyes of the public. That way your family, particularly any children you may have, don’t end up as the children of disgraced former captain whose bad decisions sank his ship, they at least end up as the children of the gallant captain who stayed at his post right till the bitter end. And in Burke’s case in particular, it meant he didn’t have to go back and face his two brothers. After all, they trusted him and he destroyed the best ship in their fleet. Given that this was still the tail end of the Great Depression, that this loss probably caused their business severe financial hardship if it didn’t outright bankrupt it, and that the loss was clearly his fault, the resulting fights could well have torn the family apart. He may have also recognized that if he died in the wreck, his brothers might get some sympathetic treatment from their creditors
@@augustosolari7721and try and take everyone on the ship with him? Not entirely impossible but doubtful. Possibly it was just a case of "get-there-its"
@@michaelimbesi2314 I agree. Also there's the adage about not speaking ill of the dead, so he will mostly be spoken of reverently, The classic 'Captain Going Down With His Ship'. If an inquiry is conducted into the sinking, well, he's not here to answer any questions, so we're probably not going to ask too many of those questions. Hopefully, the ship was insured. If memory serves, aren't there clauses like, if its an 'Act of God' insurance pays, but if its negligence / recklessness, insurance doesn't pay; so, the Captain is not here to answer any questions, therefore the ship sunk due to an 'Act of God' (bad weather) or something like that perhaps?
This leads me to one of my morbid curiosity questions; are the captains remains still on the bridge? I'm always curious what becomes of crew in the cold of Superior.
Fantastic work as always, Brad. I appreciate the detail you put into these stories I've never heard of. It's always as if I truly experience it personally.
If the first hand accounts can be trusted he was definitely suffering from a form of stroke. Considering it was their first time at sea under his command and the fact that everyone who served with him prior had good things to say about him I don't know why they'd have lied. It's not out of the realm of possibilities but very unlikely. My father had a stroke while on the job. He'd been a finish carpenter for almost 30 years. He was measuring a large 3 story home to get the trim package ordered and I got a call from the homeowner saying something wasn't right. It was like he was on autopilot. Shuffling around and mumbling yet kind of making sense. He knew the trade but nothing made sense specific to that job. I finally pulled him to the side and asked him, in a stern and rude way, "Hey man, wtf is your problem." His response was way off so they called for an ambulance. Like he said, we'll never know what happened to him for sure. I'd put my money on him suffering a stroke. It was seems to fit.
Oh, neat! I was born precisely 102 years, to the day, from Captain Burke. It's always silly hearing your birthday from a different year and then being excited lol!
Or then, maybe a stroke, or an anomaly in brains blood circulation or maybe early stages of Alzheimer or other dementia. He may also have had a brain tumor right in the wrong place.
@@MasterControl-MCP If my source of information is correct, it is now confirmed by objective sources that Biden has actually fallen ill with dementia (I am not surprised at all). That would mean he cannot be allowed to run a second term but requires permanent medical assistance for whatever years alive he has left.
Last Week, when I saw the discovery of the Arlington on the (TV) news, I thought: "I wonder how long B.O.B. will take to do a segment on it's back story? I bet its You Tuber is on it right now!" And sure enough, it appeared, and so soon! Thanks so much for such a fine job. Captain Burke must've gone insane some time before they sailed. Thanks goodness the other ship was there or else it could have been another Fitzgerald. I'm also surprised that they would discover the wreck at this time (Winter) of year, knowing Superior's reputation. And evidently it's too warm this year for ice. But did they find Burke himself in the wheelhouse, or his bones if he wasn't in fact in the legendary "waxy" or "soapy" state?
It sounds like a medical emergency, perhaps a stroke (there are different types of stroke with different symptoms), or type 2 diabetes > low blood sugar. High blood sugar looks like intoxication, and the victim will "blow" high blood alcohol content on a breathalyzer, because the sugar ferments in the blood and turns to alcohol. The victim looks, smells, and sounds drunk. I know a type 1 diabetic who was arrested for intoxication and taken to the jail, but all he remembers is thinking he was getting help from the police and telling them on the side of the road that he was diabetic. He awoke in the hospital, and heard the cops demanding a blood test for alcohol content, while the doctor was explaining to the idiots that it doesn't work that way. If you give insulin to an intoxicated person, you get an intoxicated person with dangerously low blood sugar. If you give insulin to a diabetic with high blood sugar, there's still a blood alcohol content for a time because the sugar already fermented. But the cops took the guy back to jail and said they weren't charging him with anything, and they would release him into the custody of a relative. Weeks later he got a letter from the prosecutor, and despite the medical records from that night, along with testimony from his endocrinologist, he was convicted of drunk driving, because it was revealed in court that the cops took him to jail to give him a breathalyzer before they got him to medical treatment. Idiot cops are going to kill some innocent diabetic. It happens every year somewhere, but no matter how many times police departments are sued, they still treat diabetics as intentional drunks.
Excellent video! Such a sad story. What a very scary event for the crew. You wonder how they could go right back out there with those memories in their minds, and the same for the families as well. It's great to see this story told in such a thoughtful way. Thank you for your wonderful videos and all your efforts!
Ya never know what goes through people's heads. I had a friend who was a retired laker. He'd been having problems with his legs and after seeing a doctor he was told he might lose his ability to walk. a few days later he got up one morning, dressed and walked down to the river and drowned himself.
One must wonder what was going on in the Captain's personal and professional life. He was reluctant to join his brothers in the family business. Who knows the state of the business at that time, as well. His unusual behavior leads one to think he was suffering from a medical issue, or may have been dealing with a mental health crisis. Apart from this, I'm surprised First Officer Maxey did not relieve the Captain of duty, and take charge. Possibly he was concerned with loss of his job, and loyalty to Burke kept him from doing so. Thankfully the Collingwood was at hand. Quite an interesting story.
The poet in me smells a possibility here...The Legend of Tatey Bug Burke. 🤔⚓ It seems as though the Captain "checked out' mentally. The crew was at the mercy of someone who was incapacitated. The fear must have been palpable.
Yeah true, it’s a tragedy no matter what ship goes down. Captain Dudley Paquette of the Wilfred Sykes knew Earnest McSorely & said he went full speed ahead all the time and rarely checked down even in bad weather. Seems the abuse the Fitz took in being overloaded so much & lack of maintenance by the company caught up with her that November night. Captain McSorely it seems was afraid of the Fitz & mentioned to others like when it “worked” or “wiggled” in heavy seas. Well, God Bless em all.
I wonder if Captain Dudley Paquette was any relation to the late Nicole Paquette. She was a kindergarten teacher in her first year, filling in for a teacher who was out on maternity leave. She left a New Year's Eve party shortly after midnight, January 1, 2014, and went missing. Her body was found in some woods after an extensive search. My grandson was in the kindergarten classroom next door to hers, and the two classrooms shared a coat room between them. She had coat and backpack duty with the little ones, while my grandson's teacher took hall duty. Just a year or two prior to that, my older grandson's former preschool teacher was stabbed to death by her estranged husband. I don't recall her exact title or duties, but she worked with my grandson from preschool to grade 1, and also worked at the after school daycare. It was awful. To think that Canada has such a low murder rate, yet two of my grandkids lost their teachers to murder a year or two apart from one another, it's just tragic. My heart aches for both of the women's families. They were beautiful and so loving. May they rest in peace with the Angels.
About him having a stroke or a TIA.......... he seemed to be walking fine in the wheel house,,,, It could have been excess drinking mental issue, so many things, I've a had a stroke and 3 TIA's so it could be anything,,,,,, it dies with him,,,,,,,,,,,, thank GOD they all survived
Macksey did a brilliant job in ensuring the safety and survival of those onboard (and thank God the Collingwood was close by too) but I wonder why he didn't take the opportunity to relieve the Captain of his command when it became increasingly clear that he wasn't mentally able to effect command of his ship?
After watching your video, I immediately heard a voice, rather muffled saying, "Tell them I had a stroke." So that's what I came here to say. You don't have to believe me or even believe in ghosts, but that's what I heard.
May Captain Frederick John Burke rest in peace. When a ghost wants your attention, he or she is usually asking for prayers for the repose of his or her soul.
That was a stroke. And when he knew he would never captain again, He self retired. Especially with never putting a foot wrong in his entire career except for that night? Yeah he took himself out at the end.
That's remarkable that the Arlington was found recently. As for Tatey Bug, sorry not sorry, but I'm about to come down on him like a pile of rocks in a landslide. I don't know what was going through his head that day, but it's clear that he really dropped the ball on this one, ESPECIALLY after you mentioned the previous wrecks he'd been in, none of which were his fault, and how heroically he acted in them. Deliberately steering this little old ship into a roaring gale when it's weighed down by cargo so much to the point that its already shallow freeboard is only *3-and-a-half-feet* above the waterline, when everyone else who had their heads screwed on right could see that that was stupid and were all in favor of steering further away to hug the coastline and avoid the full brunt of the storm is inexcusable. He must've had some brain damage, and it honestly sounds like it. If that were the case, then you have a cognitively impaired, incapable and incompetent captain on your hands. A recipe for disaster. Mind you, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt here, in suggesting that maybe something was just wrong with him and not something else more stupid or even sinister. Nonetheless, as far as I'm concerned, his brothers made a mistake convincing him to join them.
Great video, don't mess with the Gales of November ever. Their is a fantastic story on the Great Lakes regarding the 2 Boblo boats. You might want to do a documentary on them?
The crew needed to relieve him of command and confine him to quarters, then head in and get the Capt. to a hospital. But it’s incredibly hard to do that, and could be considered mutiny.
It's not difficult to choose a safe route in the midst of a storm. Mutiny ... if they lived and it had gone to court, I think it would have been ruled a safe course of action.
I think you’re right, but if the El Faro is any example, we still haven’t trained our mariners to do it (challenge a master’s authority or even relieve them) when justified & necessary. They need to be given some kind of protection from retaliation for it from the company or the service. And it doesn’t seem like we’ve gotten there yet.
@@Rose-SingingWolf PS ... The First Mate or Chief Officer is the only one who can remove the Captain from authority. Otherwise, it's considered a mutiny.
I'd say a micro-stroke. Can happen while you sleep, without any outward signs, but can drastically alter personality and hamper logical thinking. Captain might have only have partially come to his senses once the ship started sinking and been unable to process the guilt he felt leading him to his death.
Or he might not have been aware of what was happening right to the end. Stroke victims may seem like they're responding to the world, when in reality their brains aren't processing correctly.
God, that image you described of Capt. Burke sadly waving goodbye to the crew as his ship sank, is probably one of the saddest things I've ever heard. :'(
Weather it was a medical emergency that made his decisions irrational or intentional self- retirement, I am very greatful the rest of the crew survived.
Amen to that!
I agree. It sounds like he wasn’t there mentally
He was over 50? If he was not drunk, then it may have been an onset of Alzheimer or other form of dementia or maybe an anomaly in blood circulation in his brains. We will probably never find out.
Whether, not weather.
Most likely Captain Burke was suffering from a stroke.
I got to see a presentation by Dan Fountain, who located the wreck, last weekend. He speculated that the captain had a heart issue since there was a family history, and the last photos of him showed a man who looked far older than his actual age.
Fun fact- Dan and the museum folks thought they had located the Bannockburn, until the ROV lit up the name board on the stern.
As I recall, the Bannockburn is also a ghost ship, she is occasionally seen plying the waters.
As somebody who works in the medical field, It sounds like he might have had a Stroke. This would impair his thinking and explain why he did not respond to his crew.
The description sure sounds like the lead into a stroke.
It might be only a remote possibility but could a TBI of some kind do the same thing? Like say a self inflicted small caliber gunshot wound to the head that wasn’t obvious in the dark and hectic conditions? I saw a video of a msn who was shot just below the eye and had a small caliber bullet in his brain who was being interviewed by police and he honestly looked and sounded like a confused drunk or high person with a black eye….the detectives didn’t even notice his gunshot wound and call medics until almost an hour into interrogating him.
Why have you got such a hard on for the captain topping himself ? This is your 2nd comment trying to push that narrative.
After witnessing a close friend experience a stroke over the course of 36 hours, the odds are near 100% that the Captain was suffering from one also. The stubbornness, incoherent communication, withdrawal from duty, this man stroked out.
I wonder if he suffered a stroke? The shuffling, mumbling, etc., seems to point to something like that.
I was thinking that as well. 👍👍👍👍
What I was thinking...my dad had a stroke and he lost some logical thinking during it but seemed okay at first
Stroke recognition was not very good back then, so that's as good as guess as any. Some sort of mental breakdown would also be a candidate. The crew was lucky to survive that.
I bet you’re right because I sure know what it feels like and how it effects you at least in general terms.
While watching the video, that was my thought as well. Looked outwardly fine but his mannerisms and actions grossly changed.
Lake Superior is not so much a lake as it is a freshwater ocean. The first thing I learned being at the lake is that you do not turn your back on it. The second thing I learned was to not underestimate it. Even in summer the waters are cold. The waves can go from placid to breaking in the course of a few minutes. The lake almost seems alive, and even seems to have a pulse. I gained a whole new respect for sailers and others who brave the waters, and I never left the beach! They have to be somewhere betweeen enlightened and stark raving mad!
Also it's about 10 times more likely to drown to a fresh body of water. It takes just a couple spoonfuls of fresh water in the lungs to drown you while you can get a relatively large amount of salt water in the lungs and still survive.
Shows you Do not follow idiots listening to your inner self is a better option
In aviation there's a phenomenon called "Getthereitus" or "Gethomeitus" where a pilot will be so concerned with the need to "get there" or "get home" that they seemingly ignore all other factors telling them that they cannot get there or get home. The weather won't allow it, or the plane is incapable of flying the route, or the pilot lacks the skill and experience to do it. But the pilot bulls on ahead regardless because they have become completely tunnel visioned on the need to get to their initial destination, and a lot of the time where they end up is crashed into the ground and dead.
This sounds to me like one of those cases.
Glad someone else thought of this!
Ditto long haul truckers.
Also remember to add to the personal ambitions and reputations of captains the fact that many company's (air, ship, truck, and train) dispatchers have yearly bonuses at stake and that creates a recipe for disaster.
As a pilot for his whole post WW2 life my father had the ability to ground whatever flight he captained. I saw him actually threaten to ground a full airliner due to his own walk around preflight inspection, which was not required, but Dad always did his own walk around. They checked and inflated a soft tire. Then he flew the flight.
As a truck driver I had the right to refuse to haul any load and did refuse several routes my dispatcher told me to drive. Upon arrival at one of our company's yards the other drivers asked me if I'd taken the "short cut" my dispatcher had told me to take. I was a new driver, but not green to the world of push push push. I told them I hadn't because I can read a topo map.
They told me my dispatcher had killed a driver the previous year by insisting he drive that route.
That poor guy lost his life because he was reluctant to go against the dispatcher.
If you don't think your bosses will kill you for profit, think again.
Thank heaven the crew survived.
There are seriously ill people hauling 80,000 lbs on roads right now, flying non scheduled airplanes and whatever else is moving freight/passengers. Watch yourselves.
@@shelleymarquis2887 That is one of the best comments I have ever read on YT. Thanks.
Companies do not care about their people. We are all just "human resources", to be used to meet company goals.
target fixation
I stick to the stroke theory.
It surely is a possibility - but the captain was mumbling and staying in his cabin as much as he could.
This change in behaviour doesn't line up with getthereitis.
I really appreciate the way you speak clearly and at a moderate speed with no hysterics. Very professional. Bless you.
Aha, I made a similar compliment above. This man's work is of a consistently high standard.
10-4
I don't usually click on RUclips notifications, but Big Old Boats seems to be the exception! Cheers to you and your team!
Me too-your channel’s great! Thanks!
Me too. Excellent channel @@tundrawomansays694
Wow. This was exceptionally interesting, especially with the wreck being found so recently. I, like others, suspect the captain had suffered a stroke or other cerebral damage. I'll raise a glass to the crew and to the captain, and to the lake that "never gives up her dead." Thanks very much.
Big props to the ship that picked the guys up in 15 minutes! That captain was Jonny on the spot.
Your style of narration enhances the videos tremendously.
As a commercial airline pilot we are trained in CRM (crew resource management)….ships and their command authority are similar in their need for teamwork oriented decision process’ to produce the best outcome. It seems shipping happens at a slower pace and can lull skippers into a false comfort as conditions worsen and options fade quickly…lots of aviation lessons learned from these old shipping stories. Thanks for the excellent content.
Had CRM training been a thing back then, we probably wouldn't be watching this video now.
Great video. Growing up and going to school in Wyandotte, where the Arlington was built, freighter watching was a favorite past time of many. In the 60's my Grandfather would take us to Bishop Park to watch the big old boats. Seemed like they went by every few minutes back then. Grandpa would clip the vessel passages from page 2 of the Detroit papers and keep it in his pocket.
I was heading toward some rough water this Saturday morning, but Big Old Boats steered me to a mellow harbor. Thanks B.O.B. 👍😁
Just the person you needed to help you get ship shape!
@@caseking3656 ☺️🤟😊👍
Good choice 👌👍
Best reply I’ve seen in a while!
Sounds like he was suffering from a stroke would definitely explain the behaviour
My Dad, Lloyd Amundson sailed on The Great Lakes out of Duluth 1943-45 on Henry J. Ford, he spoke often of how the weather could change in an instant. They were sailing out of Buffalo the day President Roosevelt died.
Small brain hemmorage? Can cause unusual behaviour.
I too thought some acute illness. Especially as he wasn't communicating and wanting to take to his bed. It wouldn't have been seasickness, even.
Perhaps Alzheimer or other form of dementia in relatively early stages or maybe an anomaly in blood circulation in his brains
Manic Depression. Classic.
Drunk. 😂 Geniuses.
@@redtobertshateshandles A Captain wouldn't go to work drunk. His crew would also know if the Captain was drunk.
Interesting.
Knowing the way Lake Superior preserves bodies, I wonder if the Captain is still there and what an autopsy might reveal.
If he wasn’t washed out of the wheelhouse as it went down, then there’s some evidence of him still in there somewhere.
There were bodies on the bridge of the MS Estonia after it went down for some years. Probably still are.
When he is still with her, his Body probably got preserved trough adipoceration.
However, I think it's unlikely one could find something that detailed.
I would let him rest there as he went down with her alone.
@@rosemiller417 Like 'Old Whitey' on the SS Kamloops, turned to a waxy-soap from almost a century under the waters of Lake Superior.
Great video!
It's an absolute miracle that all of the crew were saved (except the captain, of course).
I agree with the commenters who suspect that the captain may have suffered a stroke.
Yes! The SS Arlington. This is the one I've been waiting for since it was first discovered a couple of weeks ago.
I like that little insert from “A Night To Remember”. 👍 Another well done video - very interesting & informative. Your work always impresses me. Cheers
I was hoping for a short clip from "Titanic" instead. Jack and Rose down in the cargo hold with a Model T filled with grain.
I got interviewed for the local radio when the Arlington was discovered. fascinating story and mystery that I'd only heard in passing before it was found.
It sounds like the Captain suffered some sort of medical emergency. Poor guy. I wonder if he really understood what was happening to him (and around him)
The one thing that is clear is that the Captain was having some kind of medical emergency, I agree it sounds most like a stroke. He was obviously too incapacitated to do much besides occasionally leaving his room.
He may have felt something was wrong with him and wanted to get to shore as soon as possible without admitting the reason. But he just kept deteriorating as time passed.
It’s tragic that the officers felt they could not do what needed to be done. When it was apparent the Captain was incapacitated, the second in command should have just taken over.
The Captain was probably so disoriented by the end, and so ill, that he simply did not understand he was about to die.
I am so relieved the crew did not have to pay the ultimate price for the Captain’s mistakes.
They actually recovered and delivered the every last bushel of wheat . Fulfilling Tatey Bug’s hardline stance on delivery at all costs.
I'm sure that was huge consolation to the families
How could waterlogged wheat be recoverable after 80 years on the bottom of the Lake? or how could there be any wheat left , washed away and eaten by the fish? IDK anything about Great Lakes shipping, I just discovered this subject on You Tube. Thank you.
Having seen the initial release from the shipwreck hunters I was hoping for a programme which would tell us the story of this incident. Thank you.
Having seen your account, I was wondering if Captain Burke had had a stroke or similar incident, and a number of your correspondents clearly think the same. Poor man; may he rest in peace. I suspect that the First Mate would have had his hands full already in coping with the crisis, without wondering if he should usurp the Captain's authority as well. He and his crew all did exceptionally well in such a crisis.
It's such a sad, strange story. Captain "Tatey Bug" Burke sending his ship to her death, then remaining in the pilot house waving goodbye -- it was like he didn't know where they were going or what was happening. It seems like he was definitely impaired somehow that night.
when they discovered it every structure of the ship still intact under 600ft+ deep.
Open hatches sank her.
@@concettaworkman5895 yes
First mate should have assumed command, declaring to the crew a medical emergency for the captain. But it was a different era back then. With a do and do not list of things varying from boat to boat, and captain to captain. While it is sad he went down with arlington, medical emergency or not, he did so with great courage and honor. Seeing his crew rescued and waving goodbye, at the helm doing what he obviously loved to do. Captain of his boat...
Reminds me of Captain Davidson's behavior during the last voyage of the El Faro.....
Captain Davidson's behavior was moreso reliant on "gethereitis" and using outdated weather information.
Captain Burke's behavior seems to have been caused by a brain aneurysm or outright stroke.
Grizzled old captain trusts his ship more than weather forecasts. His ship is found at the bottom of the lake.
This has been my Ted talk.
Thank goodness the ship following them didn't pay for Burke's mistakes and was able to lend aid.
Air crash investigations have turned up several cases of "subtle incapacitation" like this, possibly from a stroke or minor seizure. It cannot be very common, because out of millions of flights this has happened a handful of times.
Like most copilots do when faced with this inexplicable problem, the crew of the Arlington initially follow orders and continue doing so as dangers mount - it's drilled into them to do so, usually for good reasons.
Luckily, unlike in a plane, they were given sufficient time to realize that he was not rational, and they then took charge and acted exactly as pilots are now trained to do, taking charge, avoiding panic, and seeing to the rescue of everyone aboard.
The captain probably went down with the ship out of guilt since he told them to get back on their original course
It’s not so much guilt as knowing that you made the critical mistake. Going down with the ship makes sure that you don’t have to deal with the consequences. It also kind of helps redeem your name a bit in the eyes of the public. That way your family, particularly any children you may have, don’t end up as the children of disgraced former captain whose bad decisions sank his ship, they at least end up as the children of the gallant captain who stayed at his post right till the bitter end. And in Burke’s case in particular, it meant he didn’t have to go back and face his two brothers. After all, they trusted him and he destroyed the best ship in their fleet. Given that this was still the tail end of the Great Depression, that this loss probably caused their business severe financial hardship if it didn’t outright bankrupt it, and that the loss was clearly his fault, the resulting fights could well have torn the family apart. He may have also recognized that if he died in the wreck, his brothers might get some sympathetic treatment from their creditors
Maybe it is the other way round. He was suicidal and wanted to die.
@@augustosolari7721and try and take everyone on the ship with him? Not entirely impossible but doubtful.
Possibly it was just a case of "get-there-its"
@@michaelimbesi2314 I agree. Also there's the adage about not speaking ill of the dead, so he will mostly be spoken of reverently, The classic 'Captain Going Down With His Ship'. If an inquiry is conducted into the sinking, well, he's not here to answer any questions, so we're probably not going to ask too many of those questions.
Hopefully, the ship was insured. If memory serves, aren't there clauses like, if its an 'Act of God' insurance pays, but if its negligence / recklessness, insurance doesn't pay; so, the Captain is not here to answer any questions, therefore the ship sunk due to an 'Act of God' (bad weather) or something like that perhaps?
@@charliekezza It's "get-there-itis," not "get-there-its."
This leads me to one of my morbid curiosity questions; are the captains remains still on the bridge? I'm always curious what becomes of crew in the cold of Superior.
The waters and her mysteries. Thanks man.
9:18 : the music is very reminiscent of Ennio Morriconne's soundtrack for The thing.
I think it most likely that the captain had a stroke.
Fantastic work as always, Brad. I appreciate the detail you put into these stories I've never heard of. It's always as if I truly experience it personally.
Thank you so much for consistently offering great content. Much appreciated, my friend.
If the first hand accounts can be trusted he was definitely suffering from a form of stroke. Considering it was their first time at sea under his command and the fact that everyone who served with him prior had good things to say about him I don't know why they'd have lied. It's not out of the realm of possibilities but very unlikely.
My father had a stroke while on the job. He'd been a finish carpenter for almost 30 years. He was measuring a large 3 story home to get the trim package ordered and I got a call from the homeowner saying something wasn't right. It was like he was on autopilot. Shuffling around and mumbling yet kind of making sense. He knew the trade but nothing made sense specific to that job. I finally pulled him to the side and asked him, in a stern and rude way, "Hey man, wtf is your problem." His response was way off so they called for an ambulance.
Like he said, we'll never know what happened to him for sure. I'd put my money on him suffering a stroke. It was seems to fit.
As a Michigander, I love these stories.
Woohoo!! Way to make my Saturday🎉🎉🎉🎉
Oh, neat! I was born precisely 102 years, to the day, from Captain Burke. It's always silly hearing your birthday from a different year and then being excited lol!
Could the captain possibly suffered a small aneurism?
That would explain his bizarre behavior
Or then, maybe a stroke, or an anomaly in brains blood circulation or maybe early stages of Alzheimer or other dementia. He may also have had a brain tumor right in the wrong place.
Like Joe Biden?
@@MasterControl-MCP If my source of information is correct, it is now confirmed by objective sources that Biden has actually fallen ill with dementia (I am not surprised at all). That would mean he cannot be allowed to run a second term but requires permanent medical assistance for whatever years alive he has left.
@@MasterControl-MCPbasically
@@MasterControl-MCPYep! Or Mitch McConnell.
A story very well told. It sounds like the Captain was at the ball bearings in a matchbox stage mentally.
Last Week, when I saw the discovery of the Arlington on the (TV) news, I thought: "I wonder how long B.O.B. will take to do a segment on it's back story? I bet its You Tuber is on it right now!" And sure enough, it appeared, and so soon! Thanks so much for such a fine job.
Captain Burke must've gone insane some time before they sailed.
Thanks goodness the other ship was there or else it could have been another Fitzgerald.
I'm also surprised that they would discover the wreck at this time (Winter) of year, knowing Superior's reputation. And evidently it's too warm this year for ice.
But did they find Burke himself in the wheelhouse, or his bones if he wasn't in fact in the legendary "waxy" or "soapy" state?
These are such great videos! The narrator has a perfect voice for the stories he tells. Thank you!
It sounds like a medical emergency, perhaps a stroke (there are different types of stroke with different symptoms), or type 2 diabetes > low blood sugar. High blood sugar looks like intoxication, and the victim will "blow" high blood alcohol content on a breathalyzer, because the sugar ferments in the blood and turns to alcohol. The victim looks, smells, and sounds drunk. I know a type 1 diabetic who was arrested for intoxication and taken to the jail, but all he remembers is thinking he was getting help from the police and telling them on the side of the road that he was diabetic. He awoke in the hospital, and heard the cops demanding a blood test for alcohol content, while the doctor was explaining to the idiots that it doesn't work that way. If you give insulin to an intoxicated person, you get an intoxicated person with dangerously low blood sugar. If you give insulin to a diabetic with high blood sugar, there's still a blood alcohol content for a time because the sugar already fermented. But the cops took the guy back to jail and said they weren't charging him with anything, and they would release him into the custody of a relative. Weeks later he got a letter from the prosecutor, and despite the medical records from that night, along with testimony from his endocrinologist, he was convicted of drunk driving, because it was revealed in court that the cops took him to jail to give him a breathalyzer before they got him to medical treatment. Idiot cops are going to kill some innocent diabetic. It happens every year somewhere, but no matter how many times police departments are sued, they still treat diabetics as intentional drunks.
I have a new phobia thanks to all of your Great Lakes videos.
Your voice and the pacing of your speech are ideal for this sombre topic. Well researched and presented. Thank you from a 🇨🇦Canadian. 🎉🙏
Best RUclips channel
Thank you, Bradley!
Sounds like captain Burke had a stroke or something. Tha chief mate should have took over command of the ship.
Excellent video! Such a sad story. What a very scary event for the crew. You wonder how they could go right back out there with those memories in their minds, and the same for the families as well. It's great to see this story told in such a thoughtful way. Thank you for your wonderful videos and all your efforts!
Ya never know what goes through people's heads.
I had a friend who was a retired laker. He'd been having problems with his legs and after seeing a doctor he was told he might lose his ability to walk. a few days later he got up one morning, dressed and walked down to the river and drowned himself.
Never trust doctors, they are usually wrong.
Great work BoB. Glad to hear the crew made it off safely.
Thanks for another excellent episode!
Thanks again for the content
Sounds like old Tatey was just done livin.
These videos are actually so good
One must wonder what was going on in the Captain's personal and professional life. He was reluctant to join his brothers in the family business. Who knows the state of the business at that time, as well. His unusual behavior leads one to think he was suffering from a medical issue, or may have been dealing with a mental health crisis. Apart from this, I'm surprised First Officer Maxey did not relieve the Captain of duty, and take charge. Possibly he was concerned with loss of his job, and loyalty to Burke kept him from doing so. Thankfully the Collingwood was at hand. Quite an interesting story.
A story worth telling, and well narrated.
Had Burke had a stroke perhaps? His behavior is so strange during such a catastrophe
Sir, you have a very pleasant calming effect of your voice. Nice video, very enjoyable.
You are one of the best storytellers on You Tube!
One of the best Historical documentaries I've seen on RUclips!
When I heard about the Arlington being found I was just waiting for this video to appear in my recommended
The poet in me smells a possibility here...The Legend of Tatey Bug Burke. 🤔⚓
It seems as though the Captain "checked out' mentally. The crew was at the mercy of someone who was incapacitated. The fear must have been palpable.
Yeah true, it’s a tragedy no matter what ship goes down. Captain Dudley Paquette of the Wilfred Sykes knew Earnest McSorely & said he went full speed ahead all the time and rarely checked down even in bad weather. Seems the abuse the Fitz took in being overloaded so much & lack of maintenance by the company caught up with her that November night. Captain McSorely it seems was afraid of the Fitz & mentioned to others like when it “worked” or “wiggled” in heavy seas. Well, God Bless em all.
I wonder if Captain Dudley Paquette was any relation to the late Nicole Paquette. She was a kindergarten teacher in her first year, filling in for a teacher who was out on maternity leave. She left a New Year's Eve party shortly after midnight, January 1, 2014, and went missing. Her body was found in some woods after an extensive search. My grandson was in the kindergarten classroom next door to hers, and the two classrooms shared a coat room between them. She had coat and backpack duty with the little ones, while my grandson's teacher took hall duty. Just a year or two prior to that, my older grandson's former preschool teacher was stabbed to death by her estranged husband. I don't recall her exact title or duties, but she worked with my grandson from preschool to grade 1, and also worked at the after school daycare. It was awful. To think that Canada has such a low murder rate, yet two of my grandkids lost their teachers to murder a year or two apart from one another, it's just tragic. My heart aches for both of the women's families. They were beautiful and so loving. May they rest in peace with the Angels.
I love your channel so much.
ONCE AGAIN, A TRIUMPH!!! GEORGIA LOVES YA'LL ❤️
wow! this is all quite very local to me in geography. Very great video!
Congrats🎉
Great Channel! This kind of stuff is what RUclips was invented for! 😎
Interesting video.
Thanks 👍
About him having a stroke or a TIA.......... he seemed to be walking fine in the wheel house,,,, It could have been excess drinking mental issue, so many things, I've a had a stroke and 3 TIA's so it could be anything,,,,,, it dies with him,,,,,,,,,,,, thank GOD they all survived
Macksey did a brilliant job in ensuring the safety and survival of those onboard (and thank God the Collingwood was close by too) but I wonder why he didn't take the opportunity to relieve the Captain of his command when it became increasingly clear that he wasn't mentally able to effect command of his ship?
At that point was too late way out in the open.
After watching your video, I immediately heard a voice, rather muffled saying, "Tell them I had a stroke." So that's what I came here to say. You don't have to believe me or even believe in ghosts, but that's what I heard.
May Captain Frederick John Burke rest in peace. When a ghost wants your attention, he or she is usually asking for prayers for the repose of his or her soul.
Dude was dealing with something in a society that would not tolerate it
That was a stroke. And when he knew he would never captain again, He self retired. Especially with never putting a foot wrong in his entire career except for that night? Yeah he took himself out at the end.
He was incapacitated by the stroke. He wasn't capable of reasoning anything about losing his command or choosing to self delete.
That's remarkable that the Arlington was found recently. As for Tatey Bug, sorry not sorry, but I'm about to come down on him like a pile of rocks in a landslide. I don't know what was going through his head that day, but it's clear that he really dropped the ball on this one, ESPECIALLY after you mentioned the previous wrecks he'd been in, none of which were his fault, and how heroically he acted in them. Deliberately steering this little old ship into a roaring gale when it's weighed down by cargo so much to the point that its already shallow freeboard is only *3-and-a-half-feet* above the waterline, when everyone else who had their heads screwed on right could see that that was stupid and were all in favor of steering further away to hug the coastline and avoid the full brunt of the storm is inexcusable. He must've had some brain damage, and it honestly sounds like it. If that were the case, then you have a cognitively impaired, incapable and incompetent captain on your hands. A recipe for disaster. Mind you, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt here, in suggesting that maybe something was just wrong with him and not something else more stupid or even sinister. Nonetheless, as far as I'm concerned, his brothers made a mistake convincing him to join them.
You should see the way police treat diabetics suffering high blood sugar.
Well done once again my Friend, thank you.
Such a very strange tale... some onset of dementia perhaps?
18:35 you get to see a few glimpses underwater at the ship.
3.5 feet of freeboard is insane to take out in any poor weather on Superior.
Great videos. Is that you Kip?
Very Interesting. A real success story that with the exception of the Captain, the crew survived
That was a weird one. He seemed like a laid back responsible captain. And the crew remained loyal to his orders. Great that they survived
Great video, don't mess with the Gales of November ever.
Their is a fantastic story on the Great Lakes regarding the 2 Boblo boats. You might want to do a documentary on them?
It was May 1st.
@garyszewc3339 Yes, I was referring to how violent Lake Superior is.
The crew needed to relieve him of command and confine him to quarters, then head in and get the Capt. to a hospital. But it’s incredibly hard to do that, and could be considered mutiny.
It's not difficult to choose a safe route in the midst of a storm. Mutiny ... if they lived and it had gone to court, I think it would have been ruled a safe course of action.
I think you’re right, but if the El Faro is any example, we still haven’t trained our mariners to do it (challenge a master’s authority or even relieve them) when justified & necessary. They need to be given some kind of protection from retaliation for it from the company or the service. And it doesn’t seem like we’ve gotten there yet.
@@Rose-SingingWolf
PS ... The First Mate or Chief Officer is the only one who can remove the Captain from authority. Otherwise, it's considered a mutiny.
Can’t imagine a ship being built in my old hometown of Wyandotte. That fact surprised me
Legend has it the crew was in fear of their lives and took matters into their own hands
I'd say a micro-stroke. Can happen while you sleep, without any outward signs, but can drastically alter personality and hamper logical thinking. Captain might have only have partially come to his senses once the ship started sinking and been unable to process the guilt he felt leading him to his death.
Or he might not have been aware of what was happening right to the end. Stroke victims may seem like they're responding to the world, when in reality their brains aren't processing correctly.
@@kimfleury There's waaaay to much variety to strokes.
I didn't know grain could be so dangerous. I've heard of silos burning and exploding, but I didn't know it could swell and burst bulkhead.
He probably had some medical thing happen to him. This is a mystery, like The Big Fitz and the hundreds of other shipwrecks
I saw this on the discovery on the news and wondered how long before I saw her story❤❤
It sounds like the captain suffered a stroke or similiar trauma
I stand corrected: that's "Old Whitey" on the wreck of the S.S. Kamloops? Is "he" for real?
New video! Today is a good day.
An incredible mystery indeed.