Ghosts, Updating The Bible, & Eternal Earth | Atheist Experience 27.10
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- Опубликовано: 7 окт 2024
- In today’s episode of The Atheist Experience, Forrest Valkai is joined by Jmike! Our hosts will take calls about ghosts being real, whether the bible should be updated, and that everything in the universe is eternal.
01:00 Intro
01:14 Share Your Experience!
02:58 Frank-(USA) | Existential Evidence For God
29:42 Chris-SC | Sex & Gender Are The Same Things
40:07 Superchats: Part 1
47:37 Cliff-(CA) | Assuming God IS Real, Why Should We Worship It?
57:03 Superchats: Part 2
57:39 Mr. Warlight-AK | Haunted Houses Are Evidence Of Houses With Haunters
1:19:18 Abhishek-(IN) | Why Is It Important To Question Religion?
1:43:28 Andrew-(CA) | Old Science Textbooks Are Evidence For God
2:14:33 Superchats: Part 3
2:21:12 Chuck-HI | Look At The Palm Trees & Coral
2:36:58 Superchats: Part 4
2:39:00 Outro
SHOW NOTES
In today’s episode of the Atheist Experience, Johnny P. Angel is joined by Seth Andrews!
Frank from the USA claims that if you don’t believe in God, your life is meaningless. The first premise of this fallacious “argument” is the existence of objective morality. Here’s my advice, slow down and think this through.
Chris from SC wants clarification on the difference between sex and gender.
Cliff from Canada wants to ask, eventually, why we ought to worship God assuming it is real.
Mr. Warlight is calling in with an argument for the supernatural that our hosts just CAN’T HANDLE.
Abhishek from India wants to know why it’s so important to question religious beliefs and focus on its problems when it does have benefits.
Andrew from Canada’s argument for God is the same processes science textbooks go through when they are updated. Why revamp the bible? If it’s outdated in terms of its conclusions about reality, why would it be useful to go back and rewrite it with our current scientifical findings integrated when the bible has nothing to do with modern science? Instead of having a story with inaccurate claims about reality, you now have a story with some inaccurate carry-overs, because they have to be there for the bible to still be the bible, with some modern scientific understandings sprinkled in.
Chuck from HI believes that matter, space, stars, and Earth are all eternal. Oxygen is as eternal as everyone’s excitement about Marvel’s Eternals. I would add more, but anything I say would detract from whatever just happened.
WHAT IS THE ATHEIST EXPERIENCE?
The Atheist Experience is a weekly call-in internet show in Austin, Texas geared at a non-atheist audience. The Atheist Experience is produced by the Atheist Community of Austin.
Call the show on Sundays 4:30pm-6:00pm CT: 1-512-991-9242 or use your computer 💻 tiny.cc/callaxp and tell us what you believe and why!
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01:00 Intro
01:14 Share Your Experience!
02:58 Frank-(USA) | Existential Evidence For God
29:42 Chris-SC | Sex & Gender Are The Same Things
40:07 Superchats: Part 1
47:37 Cliff-(CA) | Assuming God IS Real, Why Should We Worship It?
57:03 Superchats: Part 2
57:39 Mr. Warlight-AK | Haunted Houses Are Evidence Of Houses With Haunters
1:19:18 Abhishek-(IN) | Why Is It Important To Question Religion?
1:43:28 Andrew-(CA) | Old Science Textbooks Are Evidence For God
2:14:33 Superchats: Part 3
2:21:12 Chuck-HI | Look At The Palm Trees & Coral
2:36:58 Superchats: Part 4
2:39:00 Outro
Wow! That was fast! The AXP Elves are on the ball today!
Thanks guys - these are really helpful!
Shit. How many times did cliffe say ok? So annoying lol
Thanks, timestamp crew!
What happened to Pearson?
I once had a toilet and every couple of hours it would start filling up the tank with water even though nobody had used the toilet. I had to conclude that there was a very thirsty ghost that was drinking water out of the tank and that is why it kept filling itself. Then, one day, I replaced the leaking flapper valve and the toilet stopped filling the tank. I had to conclude that the ghost was either no longer thirsty or they had simply moved on to drink from someone else's toilet.
It must have been a ghost dog
How could you not believe that? There are SO MANY toilets to drink from.
Very reasonable deduction sir. Nothing else it could have been. 😂 Very underrated comment.
Yes, THAT is why there's always liquid all over the floor on that side. Totally thirsty ghost dog.
You experienced a miracle. Did you see an image Jesus in a rust stain after the Jesus ridded your toilet of the Ghost?
The guy who said less people would get divorced if they thought they'd go to hell by doing so has never been in a bad marriage. It is literally hell. They have zero to lose.
I don't understand what their problem is with divorce. What's wrong with ending a relationship that at least 1 participant wants to end?
"fewer" (sorry)
@@bikeshop2002 historically, it was so that men didn't just abandon their wives if they got old or sick, because women had few options to sustain themselves on their own in those very strictly patriarchal societies.
Today, it mostly comes from men who want to continue to hold the same level of control as those societies in the past.
@@simone6090 historically, that sounds like pro patriarchy propaganda
Currently people hate divorce because men have "dominion" over women and women don't like having their humanity and autonomy stripped away by an abusive husband.
Abuse is permitted if one has "dominion". Rejecting abuse means rejection of the notion of "dominion" which is a fundamental challenge to the Christian worldview as God has that exact same "dominion" over humanity, including explicit justifications for abuse.
Spare the rod spoil the child, original sin, God hurting you because he loves you, humans being God's "servants" (slaves), etc.
Allowing divorce challenges the power dynamic that's justified by the Bible. It challenges the Bible.
Women having autonomy challenges the Bible.
It’s funny but don’t religious people get divorced as well you’d think they’d at least know but somehow then don’t religious people are nonsensical at the best of times 🤭🤭💖
Thanks for not letting Cliff say OK a thousand more times.
The poor bastard would of rambled on incoherently for hours if they let him, all the while thinking to himself he is doing the lords work
Typical religious theists .. rambling on and on.. without any concrete evidence..I only understood his ok..ok..😂
It was obviously his favorite word & used as a filibuster for his "argument". I think he was reading off a script, expecting a lot more interruptions & refusing to read it in a way that made his point coherent.
Ok ok ok ok ok so launch pad ok
If God ok
Ok ok ok
You ok guys ok ok
Launch pad ok
Ok why not ok worship ot
Ok ok ok
He said it 79 times by my count, though i almost certainly missed a few. I think a good half of those were from various iterations of "ok- ok, so- ok so..."
That's about 13 okays per minute, more than one okay every 5 seconds for the entire time he was on the line
I’m going to start comforting people with my new found wisdom:
“When a ghost closes one door, another ghost opens a new one.”
And that ghost closes that new one and the first ghost opens the first door and then closes it again and the other ghost opens its door until everyone realizes that ghosts just like to open and close doors.
@@jquest99 well TBF i could've gotten that same level of understanding ghosts from watching a bit of Scooby Doo. xD
@@irrelevant_noob Dang! I could have proven the existence of God if it wasn't for you pesky kids!🤣
We always joke that there’s a ghost butler opening our door on windy days. Our doors are old 😅
I believe that is the basic principle of Quantum Phan-tanglement.
These two are literally the Batman & Superman of this channel.
Yeah they are my favorites
I translated a bit of the Hindi that JMike was saying. I think he way asking, "do you bleed?"
My favorite combo of hosts.
Literally meaning virtually? Irregardless of the answer it was confusing. 😂😂😘
@@kylas1902 Literally! I read it in a comic book!
To Andrew: My husband and I will celebrate our 40th wedding anniversary this fall. He was raised Catholic and I was raised 100% without religion. His first marriage failed after 2 years. (They married mostly because everyone kept asking them when they planned to marry. At age 20?)
Our marriage has been wonderful! We made a commitment to one another, not a promise to any god. I laugh, because we got married in a church, purely out of convenience - it was 2 doors down from the hall we'd reserved for our reception. It was a Baptist church as well, which still makes me laugh.
Btw, we became engaged just 6 weeks after our first date. We married 2.5 months later. No, there was no unplanned pregnancies, either. We were and still are responsible adults and had just one child, by choice 3 years after our marriage began.
If you think religion gives people morality, you've been seriously propagandized.
We have never smoked, we gave up alcohol when our son was very small. We rarely drank and it just made sense to set a good example. He's now 36 and has chosen to never drink, either. We have chosen to not use drugs for recreational use. I swear like a sailor, but my husband much less so!
We have never attended church as a family, except to attend a handful of weddings. (A number of those did end in divorce, and those of my friends who are now on their second or third marriages, happened to have been the one's who were very religious.)
Faith between spouses is not necessary to have begun by the couple's faith in religion. You need to begin to accept that as a fact.
Religion fixes nothing, it just creates glazed over people who simply live their lives with blinders on. It doesn't make them better or wiser or wealthier. It just saddles them with guilt and fear and financial obligations to support their religion.
How can you state your husband is 36 yet you have been married for 40 years? Unless you made a typo mistake.
@@jackwhitbread4583 Her son is now 36, not her husband
Being an Indian, I’m happy to see that Abhishek asked such nuanced query which I personally had with my family as I (&my sister) became atheist.
I tell my people that it’s the fear that we are alone and there is no one backing us from behind when we (as humanity, living beings) fail. That feeling is scary and people make up fantasy stories of super father sitting up and waiting to help us… 😅
It’s actually so natural for animals wanting safety, and humans being more thinking-types, we created a safe place for us.
@lizmol-san Totally agree. Once you start thinking critically about the psychology of humans and the basic tenets of every religion, the community and comfort it provides coupled with the ignorance of humanity means it was inevitable. And the evidence of thousands of very different religions throughout history, to me, means you can throw out the claims made by all religion. From there, the only relevant information is the psychology that allows humans to pin things on the supernatural using the type of logic they apply to absolutely nothing else.
I don't understand. What exactly is it that scares you?
"Why Is It Important To Question Religion?" Because TRUTH MATTERS. FACTS MATTER.
@@ThEjOkErIsWiLd00 And we should not fear the truth but deal with it, together, in healthy and productive manners.
Having JMIke and Forrest is such an interesting contrast in styles. JMike the philosopher, Forrest the scientist. Pretty good!
@@JimCastleberry Not a fan of reality I see 😂
Great combo!
I agree. JMike uses tech jargon I don't rili understand. Forrest less so.... but he did do bring the Latin/Lladin.
I'm into boils me.... ChYU/LOL
Not to disparage the other hosts, but there are so many times a particular call comes in and I go "I wish JMike was here" or Forrest or Shannon or Dan. They all have different strengths. Jmike and Forrest are a good duo to tackle some of the common topics that seem to come up these days.
I need a ghost that turns the lights off when the kids leave a room.
Cliff can cay "OK" more times in a single sentence than I have ever said in a whole day.
Of course, since Cliff is from Canada!
Definitely annoying. Not all Canadians speak like that lol.
That was so aggravating to me 😃
He kept resetting. I wanted to throw my phone in the trash listening to him.
More than Leo Getz from Lethal Weapon 2.
I was watching an episode of Geraldo, like 30 years ago, and he had some guests on who were really into ghosts being real and believed they had all sorts of unassailable evidence. Geraldo was really skeptical and turned to the audience and said, "anyone here who has ever seen a ghost, stand up."
About a a third of the audience stands up-- Geraldo is shocked. So he says, "ok, if you've seen a ghost and spoken with a ghost remain standing, everyone else please sit."
Most of the audience is now seated, but there are still a bunch standing.
Geraldo can't believe this, so he's like, "OK, if you've seen a ghost, spoken with a ghost and made love to a ghost, remain standing."
Everyone sits down, except for one guy. Geraldo says, "Wait, so you've seen a ghost, spoken with a ghost and made love to a ghost!!??" And the guy responds, "Ghost? I thought you said goat."
That's terrible but still better than Warlight's actual argument.
That's BAAAAAAD.
@@krisaaron5771😂😂😂💀
Frank: Fine you can throw me in a box.
JMike: I did. You’re in the non sequitur box.
😂😂😂
This was awesome😂
slow down
"I don't need to pick through that to find the little bit of sweetcorn in that turd"
Gotta love the way Forrest expresses himself
Real world example of what Forrest was talking about, my mother is a theist and part of the apocalyptic side of Christianity. When I talked to her in the late nineties about my sister’s college fund, she said she wasn’t going to bother saving because the world was going to end before she got to college anyway. She was dead serious. She thought 2000 was too obvious a choice, so she assumed that her god, in order to be sneaky or whatever, was going to end the world in 2003. It’s been 20 years and she still thinks ‘It’ll happen any day now.’ She doesn’t care about climate change, the limited resources of the planet or overpopulation. All of those problems won’t matter when the world ends.
Which is why these psychos shouldn't be in charge of a steering wheel let alone society.
These people think that when their life ends it’s the same as the world ending. I let them know they’ll be dead and gone and the world will continue without them
Pretty much describes a lot of (if not all) retral world views.
And I recently heard somebody making a statement that pretty much sums it all up:
"Those who keep on living in the past don't have to fear the future."
I guess this is the reason for the majority of today's problems...
My mom is convinced that she's going to "disappear" and that when she does it will bring me back to God... when climate change comes up - she's convinced it's actually a good thing because it means God's getting close to ending the world
This is so sad! What an unhappy way to live. I am truly sorry for your family.
First caller Frank was insufferable. “Slow down there homeboy.” What a tool. He was a classic mix of ignorance + arrogance and had no idea how much JMike completely dismantled his argument. Hard to tell these days if someone is a troll or a complete idiot.
"Hard to tell these days if someone is a troll or a complete idiot"
There is a very close correlation between the two.
And by Frank you mean Xeno?
Or both.
@@chrisccc22it seriously sounded like him to me. Maybe he's done pretending to be in Korea?
Sip your drink every time Cliff says "Okay"
I got alcohol poisoning now...😢
Listening to Cliff explain why to worship God is like watching a guy start a NASCAR race by slowly backing up from the starting line while his engine sputters and farts.
If a god can create universes and life, she could make a book that auto-updates.
If god can create universe and life she could make a book that doesn't need updates.
It would communicate exactly what she desires to agents that have the innate will to carry it out to the best of their ability.
no cuz she made the one book and it was a product of the time so slavery is justified , us sinful humans should be able to read the book and figure out what parts are truth or metphors becuase if we dont were gonna get tortued for eternity or flooded out again. look she made us so, If she wants to flush us she can its part of her mob boss plan
Chuck: wow I’m so excited to talk to a scientist
Chuck: oxygen is eternal
Forrest: no it’s not (explains why)
Chuck: YES IT IS YOU'RE WRONG
😑 🤦♀️
My favorite part was when he declared that all of science was wrong and he was right. I’m wondering if that makes him a candidate for ALL of the Nobel prizes 😂
My youngest son has been sending his cousins Forrest's RUclips videos. He's concerned, because they go to a Christian school. It's worked, because neither kid will be returning to that indoctrination camp
That's awesome.
How do their parents feel about that?
@@darth-imperiuswho cares? It's the children who matter not the parents' religious indoctrination program.
Result!
Omg listening to Chuck was probably the most painful thing I've ever heard. It hurt my brain so much. This is why education is so important.
"wet cake" was an ironically solid description. "Can you cut an atom?" YES, that's how we ended WWII. Surely someone in HI would have heard of it. Unless he meant he IS HI.
I’ve recently started listening more to these shows, and find them to be frustrating, at times, given the absurd and poorly articulated positions of many callers. I often feel the interactions leave us with little more than frustrated wishes that theists would be capable of more.
But that Abhishek call, and your responses to his very serious concerns- and meeting him with thoughtful compassion-- this was truly helpful. Thank you.
Mr. Cliff from Canada's call reminds me of Dominic Monaghan's impression of John Rhys-Davies ordering dinner for his LOTR cast members _("We'll have nine lobster ... and fifteen shrimp ... and twelve red snappers ... and fifteen filet mignons ... and some grilled mushrooms ... I'll have twelve onions ... and uhh ... wild boar ... and pheasant ... and grouse ... and ... _*_do you have partridge?_*_ Bring the partridge!")_ except instead of ordering a sumptuous feast, all he could manage to do was order all-you-can-eat word salad for everyone at the table.
I was renovating a Sacramento 4-plex in 2010. The dwelling had 2 front doors. One door led to the two ground level apartments, the other door went up a flight of stairs to the two upper level apartments. I was sleeping in a first level unit and every morning I would awake to someone tiptoeing about the room above me then running down the stairs and and out the 2nd floor front door. I was convinced that a vagrant was spending the night upstairs, then leaving every sunup. One morning, well before sunrise, I hid in the downstairs hallway to catch this trespasser (baseball bat in hand). I heard him tiptoe about the room, run down the stairs and exit. Only the other door never opened. The next night I slept in the room with the "ghost". As morning approached I noticed a window precariously balanced in its frame. As the sun rose and temperatures and atmospheric pressures changed, the window started rattling gently (sounding like some one on tiptoes) then the window rapped back and forth, sounding like someone running down the stairs, finally ending in a slam, like someone exiting a door. I fixed the old window and the "ghost" went away. It makes me wonder that a more ignorant man would have sworn the building haunted.
A fine comment indeed good sir.
That is an amazingly clear depiction of how if we use fact and evidence gathering techniques we can overcome superstition and fantastical thought. Thank you for sharing this!
It could have been a cat.... the divine creature... you are so ignorant. There are is a book about cats. You have to believe or...go to hell... he he
Sorry, good sire, me Just trying to be funny..
I'd love to see Forrest debate Matt Walsh. Forrest would destroy Walshs fallacious BS.
Yeah, but from what i have seen- MW would take the video and edit it to make it look like he won. In my opinion, he is not honest in anything he does.
@@marksuper4920 last time he showed an uncut video of a supposedly "edited video"( something about a transgender court hearing Idk)
It was shorter than the edited video
We need to make this happen
For the sake of Forrest's blood pressure, I hope such a thing never happens.
The biggest take away from the AE is that, nervousness aside, any caller that says they want to be quick, or their explanation will be short, is lying.
You can see the pain in Forrest's face when JMike was painfully trying to explain things to Frank. They BOTH tried really hard and when Frank literally had no leg to stand on, it became a revert to the Bible...bravo hosts, this was truly a fantastic rebuttal.
Yeah. I'm on Frank now - 13 mins in - and this is painful. 🤦♂️
He's condescending and worse yet he's wrong AF.
Frank didn't call to listen, he just wanted to preach.
I don't know how they get so hung up on obvious prank callers
He's what I like to call a pseudo-pseudo-intellectual. He tries to sound like people who sound like they have ANY idea wth they're talking about. But they don't, and by extension, neither does he. And it goes without saying that he's nowhere near smart enough to understand that.
@@ChainsawChristmas Amen! I mean, prank or not, spending 25 minutes on him is WAY too much. 🙄
When JMike was talking to Chuck, it made me think of what my dad used to tell me: you can't have a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Forrest said he wants to be Bill Nye when he grows up. In a recent episode, someone said he was the next Bill Nye and he said, "I don't want to be the next Bill Nye, I want to be the first, best Forrest Valkai." I love character development 😊
Cliff said he was gonna be quick then started explaining each part of a normal conversation in great detail without having the conversation
@Ken North That "bong hits" sums up my thoughts listening to him ramble on endlessly... yet mentally go nowhere.
Yeah rather than sharing his ideal mind discussion, he should have just had the discussion.
I thought right before they cut in, he was going to make a point about all cultures believing in something. Which is basically an argument from popularity. “All these people CANT be wrong, man!”
@Nick if you have ADHD that’s literally every second of every day, except there’s three Cliffs all saying ok at different intervals.
@@captainkong I'd recommend him to start from explaining why should anyone ever worship anything and what worshiping even is: because worshiping is not being someone's friend or liking them - concept of worship comes from cultures believing that divine entities can grant you favors if you placate them by performing its rituals or following its rules. But what if God wanted his worship to consist of respecting people's pronouns - surely that would mean that JMike and Forrest would worship them whether they want to or not - I guess what Cliff wanted to say that if God was shown to be real, we'd see wisdom in following their rules and performing its rituals and would do them anyway because God is not evil bastard. Unfortunately the Bible seems to suggest otherwise...
JMike and Forrest are my favorite combo at the ACA. It’s always a great show. Thank you guys and the whole crew.
Chuck used to call AXP almost every episode years ago, still the same exact questions. Truly a one dimensional thinker.
I have never laughed out loud as much as I did listening to him saying how atoms can't be split and don't believe in gravity and a whole lot of other things.
It was SO funny that he hasn't ever heard of Rutherford but he doesn't believe in the atomic theory! 🤣🤣🤣
@@jquest99 is he a flerf,too?
I knew I recognized that nasally, whiny voice.
I'm growing increasingly fond of Jmike. Dude is AWESOME.
Forrest's smile is contagious. What a gem!
I thought Frank was sad and then there was Cliff. Sweet baby Jesus.
And by Frank you mean Xeno?
Bro cliff is the reason I opened the comments section. Literally braindead
@@chrisccc22 im not xeno
@@oakworm5526 why even bother to comment that?
Ok so ok I ok want ok to ok apologize ok for ok Cliff, ok ok.
They don't always find ghosts, but when they do, they don't.
A friend of mine stayed at one of those Haunted Hotels. This one featured a cigar smoking ghost. "I woke up at 3 AM and my room smelled like cigars!" my friend said. I told him "Silly, they pump cigar scent through the vent to make you think the place is haunted." He got mad at me for spoiling his fun.
Chuck is truly the gift that just keeps giving.
I really like that Forrest is part of this now. His awnsers are so helpful and concise.
The worst person to run into in Heaven is my abuser. He "repented" on his death bed, so he will be sitting next to Jesus.
Yep. That's the HORRIFIC fact of the Christian theology: there is no crime, committed against ANY number of other people, that cannot be simply be washed away by "repenting" to a being that WASN'T the victim. But there is the crime of not having the correct thoughts about that being, that deserve _infinite_ punishment.
Oh, feel the love!
@@BlarglemanTheSkeptic2 yep, backwards batshit lunatics.
@@BlarglemanTheSkeptic2 No greater hate than Christian love.
@@wwlib5390 Thank you very much for preaching at me. ... it was the fucking first by the way.
@@wwlib5390 Sure, but only if you've won the bible god lottery and belong in the few group from the book of Matthew. The Jesus prophecy spoils John 3 16 for most people. And I disagree with you on the bible god's intent, when very clearly this god desires for people to perish. It creates people specifically to perish. See Matthew 7 13-14 Proverbs 16:4 John 12:40 Romans 9:18 and 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12.
Chuck is the poster boy for how disastrous a minimum knowledge combined with conformation bias can be
The Cackling Maniac! The Jehovah's Witness (not a Jehovah's Witness) from Hawaii! I was wondering if he was still around.
@@Riplee86 Was he the one calling few months ago laughing and denying evolution? Poor guy.
Chuck thinks atoms are solid and can't be broken down. What does he think happened when we tested the first atomic bombs?
@@Sejl I don't know about a few months ago, but he used to call into the Atheist Exp years ago. It always went the same way; he makes a claim, claim was rebutted, and he would just cackle before moving onto something else. Also, he would support beliefs and talking points from Jehovah's Witness, but deny belonging to any specific religion.
@@DeanCole Magic 🤣🤣
When Matt left I wondered if this show was going to implode or not. The answer is easy - NOT. JMike is probably my favourite of all but the people fronting the show now are fantastic. Thanks Forrest and JMike great job.
JMike and Forrest, y’all did such a great job talking to Abhishek about his parents. As someone who went through deconstruction in the last year, the feelings you described were spot on. 💙💙💙
Jmike and Forrest definitely brought me back to watching the Atheist experience. Great job y'all!
I never got the obsession with wanting to have a RUclipsr hairstyle until I learned about Forrest
It's a thing of beauty
58:00 - Mr. Warlight's call summed up.
START: "Hey guys, I think ghosts could exist!" END.
I mean, there is some very interesting shit out there regarding apparitions, but... yeah, there's not any means to measure, or replicate, so there's not much to work with from a scientific standpoint.
Chuck is SOOOOO funny when he says atoms can't be split. It gets done ALL the time in accelerators.
His personal incredulity was SO astounding when he disbelieved that atoms can be split!
Are you sure that atoms are split in accelerators?
You will probably say they do it all the time at CERN but don't you think that it's weird that even though CERN is located underneath the territory of France and Switzerland everybody at CERN speaks English? And why do you think that is, huh? Because it's infiltrated by the English - and you can't trust them. Just as that Russellford dude with the bogus gold experiment lied back then, they're lying to us today!
True story!
He needs to tell the people of Japan that the bombs dropped weren’t real or the people of Chernobyl didn’t have to move these people are funny until they get into power 🤨🤭🤯🤤💖
Wow! Cliff…. such phenomenal erudition, such piercing clarity, such extraordinary cogency…. I’m sure the legendary Hitch would have cowered in terror! 🤪
That 6th caller actually makes a very interesting connection. The Bible (and religion in general) is basically a textbook that explains the natural world and defines a system of morality. So you really could look at it as a REALLY old science / philosophy textbook. The only problem is that instead of updating it as we learn new things, people have a cultish mentality around it and take it as absolute truth.
Kudos to Chris for his honesty and interest in learning. Also, Forrest has great videos for explaining biological topics like this!
I agree. Forrest’s video is great. I had my mom watch it. She watched it 3 times to understand it all and now has a completely different view on thing.
Big props to Forrest for immediately recognizing that this was a set up by the caller's friend. Also, please, don't do this. If the friend's plan was "he's wrong about sex and gender, so I'm going to bait him into a call in hopes the hosts embarrass him on air." To what end? That would likely not have changed his mind, if anything it would have the opposite effect.
So good on the hosts for being kind and respectful and not coming in hot.
@@terryhinch
Well, we don't know that that was his friends intention. He may of just known that Forrest is good at explaining it.
Absolutely love JMike and Forrest! I could listen to an entire day of these two superstars! Keep up the great work guys.
Been an atheist experience show fan for many years, still a cool show
My personal favorite anti-ghost argument is to start explaining how ghosts are described differently (and play by different rules) based on cultures. For example, Chinese ghosts work drastically differently than American/European ghosts.
First discovered this show years ago but mentally wasn’t ready; rediscovered this channel in the past couple months and it has been huge in helping me shift the way I think about my life and thus the quality of my life! Thank you folks for the efforts you put in, they are commendable.
Frank: OK, just throw me in a box.
JMike: I just did. I threw you in the non sequitur box.
😅😅😅
Lol
It’s a bad argument. It’s very bad. 🤣. JMike ran intellectual circles around this fool.
Although JMike didn't LITERALLY throw Frank into a box!
QFE is your official new handle. 🤣🤣🤣
@@Thistuffgetnucknfutz so still can't formulate an argument or an adult insult?
When I realized it was Chuck from Hawaii I groaned… but Forrest and JMike really drew out the details of his broken brain programming.. thank you!! We never need to hear his calls again!!
His whole schtick is about how no one can explain anything without his version of his god, so it’s true by necessity. He’s admittedly not trying to find answers and to things and study them, by trying to constantly undo the things we find when investigating. In favor of more ignorance.
@@NotALiberalSoSkipTheScript 100🎯
Puddle ana logy. Rusks of Dadjoke, floating on a thin oily film of yuk yuk. Over a dark--but shallow--pool of yuck.
Anyone that claims there is an objective morality, has never scratched the surface of cultural anthropology.
Most people that claim there is an objective morality haven’t given it any critical thought whatsoever.
The notion that there are a set of objective facts about human morality is an absurd notion to me, for all sorts of reasons.
Did these facts exist prior to humans existing? Will they continue to exist after humans are long gone?
How can there even be an answer about what a person should do without there first being a goal to achieve?
For those saying God is the basis of this objective morality - how can a single subjects thoughts be objective? That’s the definition of subjective! Yet people claim that this obvious subjective thing is objective. Somehow in their minds “God is super important, therefore His opinions are objective”.
It’s all an absolute nonsense to me.
Forrest, I want to thank you for being so outspoken about your perspective and the science behind gender vs sex. It has been a huge help to me at a personal level and you were part of the initial nudge into a journey for me, of learning about our world and our experience as humans. I grew up very with conservative views and suppressed a lot of my own identity because of fear of rejection. The fact that people like you exist, makes me feel courageous enough to express myself the way I want to express myself. Those that judge me for it should just learn more, it's all far more arbitrary than people think. So anyway, thank you. You're generally so affirming and so chill about so many things. Keep being awesome, man!
Over a decade of calls from Chuck and they are still hilarious.
JMike always spits straight fire! Suffer no fools, King!
Have you heard him with Darth Dawkins? Classic
Jmike😍
Darth Dawkins, eh 😎🤓🤣
Wow! Frank was a mess! He had NO argument or evidence. And of course, he didn't understand that he had nothing. 😅
Quee Fee said so. 😆😂🤣😭🤣😂😅
And how JMike And Forrst totally diffused his platform was a masterwork --as they did with every other caller where systematic diffusion was crucially required.
Why is it that so many Theists find it impossible to distinguish between the evidence for the claim and the _claim itself?_ It's so frustrating.
@@shelbyvillerules9962
Emotions.
That is the reason why.
@@shelbyvillerules9962Frank (and those like him) are just far too full of themselves to even consider contemplating how well founded their position is. So it never even occurs to them that they aren't actually supporting their position, they just assume that it must by obvious because they believe it.
Spirituality means not wanting to be in touch with reality!
Or pretending an alternative reality.
I used to believe in ghosts, and one of the experiences I had that steered me away from that belief was that I noticed my bedroom curtains moving on their own one evening while doing homework. The windows were closed. I was stoked, thinking this might be a ghost. I approached one of my windows to investigate and to my great disappointment, there was a 1-1.5 inch gap between the top and bottom panes of glass that wasn't visible unless you were right up to the window. I guess it just formed from the house settling and stresses from weather and changing seasons over the years.
What I'm trying to say is, even as a kid believing in ghosts, even I could investigate something I found odd to find a natural explanation when this grown ass adult did nothing and just went "well obviously it's a ghost."
Can we uphold the old ban on Warlight?
Hahaha!!! I actually started yelling at the TV when Andrew brought up the divorce rate 😂😂😂
Same here.. that was some J.P. "traditional value" style shit there.
Animals that tend to help each other have a better chance of survival. Morality evolves. What is hard to understand about that.
Because Christians especially desperately want to think we aren't animals and if that were true, then it wouldn't conform with their fairy tale.
@@ricku9487 Muslims are as bad
this is my first time seeing jmike. He handled the the first caller so good. I like the way he tried to carefully guide the caller through his own argument (or lack there of).
The best thing is that without religion you get to create your own meanings rather than having none.
I’m glad y’all try to teach callers even if they don’t understand us listeners learn thanks❤
most animated JMike I've seen yet .. thumbs up
He's just an amateur kid. Appealing to emotions aren't conducive for constructing logical debate.
@@sirfrancissnowflakes-wv8yj Yeah. I get it. You were unable to follow JMike's argument. It does take a little bit of philosophical background in order for you to understand.
@@sirfrancissnowflakes-wv8yj where did he appeal to emotions?
@@sirfrancissnowflakes-wv8yj lol maroon
Admittedly so I didn't listen to this particular show but I have a feeling it went a little bit something like this.
Somebody called in explaining their faith based belief in the nature of God the religious aspect and the host told them you can't prove it with physical evidence so I won the argument.
It's kind of like somebody having a show and they have a position that transgenderism isn't real and the host knowing it cannot be proven with physical evidence has people who identify as transgender calling in and telling the host why they believe in faith that they were born in the wrong body and the whole saying well you didn't provide the physical evidence to prove transgenderism is real .
I wonder why none of these hosts from Atheist experience or nobody on the threads who call themselves atheist want to debate the logic of the origins of Life coming into existence because of a Creator, God, versus the logic of the origins of life being the result of a non intelligent occurrence .
Could it be because the atheist realizes that there's absolutely no argument that justifies believe in the origins of life is the result of a non intelligent occurrence rather than a creator and that the idea of the Creator is logical.
PS anybody want to take me up on that offer
Today I learnt there are Americans who think electrons are a British conspiracy theory. Kudos to Forrest and JMike for trying to reason with Chuck-the-electron- denier. It was a pleasant surprise to hear 'atheist Jesus' speak in Hindi! Another great show!
Chuck in Hawaii should be given a five-minute slot to himself every week - the man is a comic genius. He's the greatest satirist Hawaii has ever produced.
@@jimappleby3545 I fear he may be an one-act wonder - I just heard him present the same script (including the sarcastic laugh) in Talk heathen. If he expands his repertoire, then perhaps we may understand the true depth of his genius.
that's because the Venezuelans manipulated the particle-counting thingie. plus they conspired with them over there
I love watching you guys, and admire your patience. I can’t get this image out of my head of folks like Frank sitting there with his fingers in his ears waiting for his chance to speak, intently not listening to anything that you guys are saying, probably because to hear it would challenge his position so deeply that he just can’t face it.
I had a roommate who swears up and down that a spirit knocked over a clothes rack in their basement a couple years ago. It's so hard to explain that, even if I can't explain why the rack fell over, it probably wasn't ghosts.
What's really weird is that whenever I happened to be in that basement alone, I would often spend time antagonizing the ghost, and it never once did anything to bother me. It would have been so easy to screw with my laundry or something.
For the door opening and closing 20 times, it could be something fucky with the air pressure. In my old apartment, when the air conditioning came on, there was something about the geometry of the room or something that made the door open and close on its own if it wasnt fully latched. Freaked me the hell out the first time I saw it.
I like the tandem: specialist in philosophy and specialist in biology.
HOLYEFFIN'OMG!! FIRST POST!
Thank you guys so much for providing not just insight and entertainment, but for offering, attempting and helping people to understand one another.
In Christian heaven, you can have someone who committed genocide on God's chosen people but decided in a bunker with his Frau to "accept Jesus".
Basically, in Chirstianity, everyone's a sinner, but you could commit every sin but you can still go to heaven.
From the descriptions of heaven it sounds like you get a spiritual lobotomy on entry so really nobody would be exactly who they were.
Not a very appealing prospect.
@@jayrose8638 there seems to be as many versions of heaven as there are Christians. And I want no part of any of them.
Fantastic video, JMike & Forrest make a great team. Also great that the intro is now short and sweet. Always found myself skipping the long tune in past shows to get to the talking part :)
Chuck is probably the funniest person I've ever heard on call.
I love it when Forrest is showing us his books ! I will order them to learn.
If Cliff reads this, I'd just like to mention that many atheists *were* believers, so we understand what platform you are talking about. The problem is that I suspect most of us would still disagree with the assertion that that god deserves worship. From your platform view, he (supposedly) created everything to be the way it is -- then made human lives hard and awful in so many ways. He is responsible for "The Fall" that we blame all the bad things on. Human pain and suffering is so prevalent and so terrible, and he is responsible for ALL of it. He could have made anything. He could have made it any way he wanted. He chose this. I thank my lucky stars every day that I am an able-bodied American, because the vast majority of options for the vast majority of history or the globe are way worse. And he did it for his own sake, not ours. Because of what he wanted. ☹️
Well said! Excellent
I would also like to thank Cliff for his shout out before the call, even though he didn't mention us (youtube commenters) by name. Even though Cliff failed to get his point across in the call, just calling in to debate took guts, especially for someone who has trouble with public speaking, that can be a real fear inducing moment, and he faced it.
Chris valued his relationship with a friend he got into an argument with so much that he called into a show he knew nothing about to have his beliefs challenged? Say what you will about his worldview or demeanor, but Chris is a good friend.
Frank was not equipped to support his argument. Poor Frank.
None of the callers were, that was one of the most ignorant group of callers I have heard on this show in a while
And by Frank you mean Xeno?
Yes!!! Forrest mentioned the gold foil experiment. It's my favourite (yes I have a favourite experiment). I can't imagine how excited Rutherford must of been as he detected alpha particles on the other side of that foil just as he predicted. As an added bonus some of the particles were deflected and even reflected by nuclei to give us a much more accurate model of the atom that has been built upon to this day!
"I feel a certain way about morality, wherefore everyone feels the same way and this is an objective experience and not a subjective experience and I will not verify this by seeing if other people actually feel the same" is kind of a disturbing thought process
Love seeing the two of you together! Fav hosts!!
Thank you Forrest! I worked and lived institutionally since my dad died at age 11 Foster Care, group homes, juvenile corrections and then worked in Woodlands Mental hospital and then ran group homes for the ministry of human resources. We do not perceive reality in the same way. None of us.
It's hilarious listening to people trying desperately to explain something that we have no access to whatsoever. You guys are great, thank you 😊
Ok ok so ok
I love that Frank (first caller) says "If you were a Christian you'd know that magic is forbidden" when Forrest used the word "magic" to refer to god. 😄 By definition a "miracle" is magic. A being that can create an entire universe is quite magical!
They say that all the time but magic isn't forbidden by the bible, neither is astrology like they claim, but birth charts specifically are forbidden but that is the only part of astrology that is forbidden specifically and there are many astrological refferences in the bible.
well said Forest !
Respect
Ha! 😃
Oh that beautiful moment at 50:22 when Forrest says "...you haven't said a sentence yet..." 🤪
ABSOLUTELY PRICELESS!
Way back in the early 80s when I was in my teens, I was challenged by my friends to spend the night in a cemetery alone, after we were discussing the after life and ghost and I said that I don't believe in such things .
I did it and never encountered any ghost 😅
Forrest: “I don’t need to pick through that to find the sweet corn in that turd” 🤣🤣🤣🤣👏👏👏
Always a good session when Jmike and Forrest are on. Should've asked Chuck exactly where he got his ideas about atoms, gravity, etc. and why he thinks they reflect reality.
Jmike hanging up on caller number 2 made me so happy. That caller was among the most painful the listen to. Idk how they put up with it for so long.
The source of morality is awareness.
Sophisticated awareness evolves into empathy.
Empathy evolved to understanding.
Understanding evolves into concepts of morality, ethics, right, wrong, good, bad.
Without evolutionary developed awareness, morality and ethics cannot exist even as a concept.
You guys are the dynamic duo of the ACA. JMike the philosopher and Forrest the biologist. I love watching you guys individually but when you are working together it is always a hell of a treat to watch the show.
I love it when armchair scientists try to challenge Forrest’s knowledge! “Gravity doesn’t exist…”🤯
Yeah, I enjoy that very much.
Chuck is less "armchair" scientist, and more "rock in cave" scientist
These are the best hosts!