Me 262: Hitler's Secret Jet Fighter
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- Опубликовано: 12 дек 2023
- In July 1942 a German Messerschmitt took off from Leipheim airfield in Bavaria…but it was no ordinary aircraft…
It was an Me 262 - the world’s first operational jet fighter.
Powered by two Junker Jumo 004 turbojet engines and able to travel 120 mph faster than the revered American P-51 Mustang, the Me 262 offered a ray of hope in the increasingly dark skies of the German Luftwaffe.
On paper, it was faster and more deadly than any other Allied fighter plane, yet despite this remarkable feat of German engineering, the Me 262 proved not to be the salvation Hitler had hoped for…
Why did such a frightening aircraft that could have been the kryptonite to the Allied Air Force, fail to make its mark during the Second World War? And how did this special aircraft spark a new era in aviation history…
In this video, Dan Snow travels to the Battle of Britain Memorial Flight (BBMF) at RAF Conningsby in Lincolnshire to see a remarkable reproduction Messerschmitt Me 262 fly in the skies over England for the first time since a captured example was flown shortly after the end of the Second World War.
GOPRO FOOTAGE: @ CROWN COPYRIGHT
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In college I heard a lecture by a professor who had actually been in the Luftwaffe during the war (1944). He joined to avoid being drafted by the SS, and was basically a foot soldier on the Eastern Front.
He said he was somewhere in Poland or Russia one cold autumn morning when he saw a formation of 30 Soviet fighters flying a few kilometers away. From out of the sun two black fighters making a terrible noise swooped down and took out the entire formation: ME-262s. One man jumped up and started screaming with joy, "It's Hitler's secret weapon! We've won the war!" A nearby sergeant, who had been shaving, turned around and punched the man in the jaw and said, "Shut up, a**hole... it's too late for that." Later, as they retreated back towards Germany by train, he said he saw dozens of 262s covered by camouflage netting or hidden in treelines, because there was no fuel to fly them (and possibly a lack of pilots as well).
Fascinating guy. Had many stories to tell. Neither he nor his family were Nazis, but he did open the talk by saying, "Everyone asks me what I thought of Hitler at the time. Well, When I was 15 I spent my entire summer flying gliders in the Hitler Youth... what do you think I thought of Hitler?" He was a Soviet prisoner for a time, but managed to escape and walk through Czechoslovakia all the way back to southern Germany to his hometown. Shame he never wrote a book about his experiences.
Cool story man !
Oh my God! Please share more stories. A professor of what? A Soviet prisoner? For for how long? Did he fly any planes?
I may be wrong, but I don't believe that men were "drafted" into the SS. The SS were made up of the most ardent and devoted of Hitler's fighters. The rest of Germany's populace would have volunteered for the Luftwaffe, Navy, or Army, or been simply drafted into the army.
@@handroids1981 I don't remember what his department was, and I don't have my notes to refer to, but this was in 1990 at Indiana University in Bloomington, IN. My American military history prof brought him in when we studied WW2 to give "an opponent's view of the war" so to speak.
He had so many fascinating stories it would be hard to recount them all, but there are three stories that really stuck with me (besides the one about the ME-262s that I've already told)...
Due to his glider experience, he had papers from the Luftwaffe to join their pilot program once he graduated from school and enlisted. One day in 1943 (I think) the SS showed up at his school and pulled everyone with Aryan features 6' tall and taller and told them they'd have the "honor" of joining the SS. He and the others chosen were told to pack a few personal items and report back. He was not at all keen on this "honor", so he ran off and hid in an attic. The next day he came out of hiding and went to the schoolmaster's office to ask what to do. The schoolmaster said that the SS were furious and would likely be back for him, so he'd better just go and join the Luftwaffe immediately, which he did. I believe he was 17 at the time. Just a few weeks after his basic training, they gave him a rifle and shipped him off to the Eastern Front as a simple foot soldier. He didn't talk at all about his combat experience, but simply said he knew immediately things were not going well for Germany.
In the winter of 1944 he was in Poland or Czechoslovakia, retreating back toward Germany when he was captured by the Russians who then marched their prisoners east. They did not search their prisoners well, so in addition to his personal belongings, he actually had a P38 in his coat (though he never used it). None of the Soviets spoke his language, so when asked where they were being taken, the Russians answered in broken German from an obviously memorized script, "You go to Russia. Work in factory. Make weapons. We go west, fight Imperialist America." When they were nearly in Russia, he took advantage of low visibility during a snowstorm to dive into a snowbank. When the column passed, he worked his way back through Czechoslovakia to Austria, surrendered to American forces. He then worked for the US occupation in his hometown in S. Germany. Since he and his family were known not to be Nazi members, he got work helping the US set up the local government, assisting in the ID of good Germans vs. Nazis to help the US get decent folks in positions of local authority. One day he told the American soldier he worked for (a captain or major) what the Russians had told him during his captivity, and said that the USSR was no friend of the US. The officer called him a "g-d Nazi" and said, "You're just sore because they kicked your ass!" He told the officer, "Mark my words, within 15 years you'll be back here in Europe fighting them." Then he told my class, "Thankfully, I was wrong about that last part."
His talk was not without controversy, which I recount here NOT to stir up any crap, but simply to tell a very surprising part of his story. During his service, he kept a diary of the places he stayed in or passed though, or where he had fought. He recorded only the first two letters of each location in case he was captured and the diary taken. After the war he was looking at a map and matching up roads and rail lines with those two-letter town names from the diary to retrace his journey. He noted that one troop train he was on stopped in "AU"... which with the rest of the route matched up to Auschwitz. He was not there long (I believe the train was delayed due to partizan activity further east), noticed nothing unusual, and remembered it as a "typical Polish town." He said he told this once to the head of the Jewish Studies department at IU, who did not believe he could have missed what was going on there. "But you must have known! You had to have seen the smoke and smelled the bodies!" He replied that he only saw a bit of the town from the train station, and could not see any camps from there. To him, there was nothing remarkable about the place. This did not sit well with the other professor, who he said believed him a liar or at least willfully ignorant of the situation. Again, I'm not trying to insinuate anything or revise history here, just recount one soldier's recollection of the town near that infamous place.
It was a singular experience to get to hear the enemy perspective of the war, and certainly one of the most engaging talks I've ever heard... as is evidenced by the fact that I remember so much of it all these years later.
@@T.Imhotep
I truly appreciate the detailed response. Fascinating.
I can't help but imagine what a HBO mini series might look like, but I fear those day have passed. RE: The Politicization of Everything.
Thank you again.
As an aerospace engineer i love this plane. Its sleek and truly beautiful, the first of its kind and way ahead of its time. Amazing.
Totally agree! One sexy looking plane. Old girl got some curves! 😅😊😂
If you think it's way ahead of its time you are not much of an aerospace engineer. The Allies had comparable jet programs. The allies engines were better as well.
@@JohnFrumFromAmerica was about to say the samething
@JohnFrumFromAmerica I'm pretty sure he's talking about the design and not the engines.
@@kcpir4te257 the engines are the core technology for transonic fighters. Also the British had an advanced supersonic fighter program in WW2 that looked very plausible. So German jets were not way ahead of there time they were definitely a product of there time. If they were far ahead then they would have had mach2 performance and more efficient and reliable engines.
The engineer that developed this engine also designed the AGT-1500 gas turbine found in the United States Army Abrams M1 battle tank. I worked with him at the Army Engine plant in Stratford, CT (Avco Lycoming). We lived in the same town that the plant was located. The Junmo 400 was developed by Dr. Anselm Franz who was allowed to enter the United States at the end of WW2 through the top secret Operation Paperclip
A correction he was not alowed he has brought in to the US as many others.
@@altergreenhorn Correction to your correction: He was actually "allowed" into the United States as were other Nazi scientists. Please read up on Operation Paper Clip for the whole story. BTW, do you know that if the United States brought a Nazi into the country at the end of WW2 that person would therefore (logically) be "allowed" into this country? Makes zero difference if it was one, two or a group of 1,100...they each were "allowed". Sheesh!
Not a bad powerplant considering they had to make do with less-than-ideal materials and sometimes purposely questionable workmanship.
Frank Whittle .
I have just watched a Real Engineering video about the M1 Abrahams and its Jet engine, that works with Diesel, kerosene etc. I was wondering about that.
12:30 Come on Dan, you know better than to intimate that the Mustang and Spitfire were powered by a radial engine.
Rolls-Royce Merlin V-12 engine: "I am no radial engine!"
Oops moment!
Came to say the same thing - Dan is a great presenter/historian but them engines are in-line not radial, simple way to tell as well: You got a big fat plane engine: Radial, it's slimmer streamlined cousin is the in-line.
@@celticdr I'm pretty sure Dan knows the difference, and just made a slip of the tongue, but the director was too dumb to notice to do a retake.
Strange would have been the Spitfire with a DB-601 engine surviving…
Frank Whittle also deserves a full episode, the British jet genius who literally rose from the ranks.
yep no mention of the meteor
The Welland engine, 180hrs between overhauls. The engine on the ME 262 only 10 to 12 hrs. Whittle and his team built a veritable workhorse not a short-winded racehorse.
I always wondered if Frank is related to my family.
I read somewhere that if Frank Whittle had been given the support and help he wanted instead of been told by the RAF to carry on with what the RAF wanted him to do we in the UK could of had jet fighters during the Battle of Britain.
@@richardwaring8613The Meteor was also still flying in service with the RAF up until the 1980s . I can never understand why these people consistently rave about German Engineering, when invariably someone in this country has invented ,designed or built something equally as good or even better . Instead they seem more interested in belittling this country’s achievements in designing,inventing ,manufacturing anything new or ground breaking.
I’ve seen one in person. It looked surprisingly modern in its design.
Now think that Heinkel had at least as modern looking models a whole 5 years before Messerschmidt... and a very similar model just without the flat underside about a year before the 262 ...
I know of no modern aircraft that looks anything like it.
I’ve modern American jet fighters, I can’t say this looks modern. It looks like it’s from its era.
@@namenotfound8747exactly. It looks like your average prop plane, except for the turbines and a slimmer front because no engine. It maybe looks a bit like a 50s design already but thats it.
@@Mr.Marbles the design was from 1939... Did you have such average prop planes around that time?
I was in the RAF at Conningsby over 20 years ago, and i remember having to walk to the air traffic tower to get my airfield driving permit resigned.
It was a lovely clear summers day,and the Station Commander and his XO had gone up in Spitfire and Hurricanes and flew about above the airfield.
Was an amazing sight and sound to here...and literally the entire airfield ground to a halt...folks of all different trades stopped to watch. They even came out of offices etc to see the spectacle.
Was a real privilege to see that.
The BBMF is a real jewel.
It's my understanding that the RAF owns and operates a number of Spits and Hurris, as well as at least one Lanc.
I was lucky enough to work at Flugplatz Manching outside of Ingolstadt Germany. They have an operational Me 262 in the Willie Messerschmitt museum on base. It was amazing to watch them perform check flights over the base. They also had two Me 109s and the sound of that V12 was unmistakable in a dive. I also got to fly a FanTrainer they had in the commercial hangers. That was truly a blast.
An Me 262 in Flying Heritage Collection, Everett, Washington, United States, is currently undergoing restoration to flying condition. It is intended to fly using its original Jumo 004 engines. The aircraft was bought from the Planes of Fame Air Museum, Chino, California.
Because of construction flaws built in to the original airframes, I would never recommend flying a real World War II production Me.262 - restored or not. Even well-built planes of that era - like most of the Allied fighters and many Axis aircraft built before 1944 - are very close to the end of their fatigue lives. They kill a few pilots every year. Better that they be put in museums and be seen by generations than be flown for a thrill and be lost forever.
@@georgettewolf6743Imagine what balls this pilots back then had , flying planes made out of wood . Well some of them , but a Me262 at more than 800kph is scarry as well . This was more than 60 years ago ....
Flying with a Jumo would be foolish.
jajay All that changed when Paul Allen died, the museum has been sold to a Walton and is to be moved south. that restored plane has never flown and may never fly !!!
@@georgettewolf6743 Wait till you learn how americans, brits or soviets were making planes. You will be lucky if half of original plane have correct parts that were not installed backwards regardless of origin.
Something I feel is often overlooked was the armament. Those four 30mm mine shell were throwing the equivalent of a hand grenade into a bomber. Hits like those don't see planes return home.
That must have been exciting to see those planes, never mind watching them take off. My father worked for De Havilland Aircraft and through the 60's/70's/80's and into the early 90's and I visited the factory many times for Christmas parties and family days, later he'd take me in on weekends after hours when he needed to go in and it was so exciting for me as a kid. He was always yelling at me to stop fooling around on the planes but I couldn't resist, they are amazing. Thanks for the video.
My favourite WW2 fighter, however when Chuck Yeager was asked what he thought when he first saw it-
‘didn’t, just shot it down’
I have a collection of photos taken by my grandfather during WW2. One is of an ME-262 parked in a field near Munich. On the back of the picture he wrote, "a Jerry plane".
I live 15 minutes from this airfield and have been in the BBMF museum (even been inside the Lanc!). I wish I had known these planes were coming together - what a sight they must have been!
German fighter ace and former commander of the German fighters Adolf Galland answered this question with "No. It would just have prolongued the war and therefore have cost more lives." He should know.
Saw this fly a RIAT this year. It was amazing to see. For a WWII plane, it looked very modern compared to every thing else from this era
And it was. It took years for allies to recognise that germans were absolutely right in their construction choices, well after the war has ended. From understanding benefits of swept wings instead of making wing thinner (F-80/84) or just increasing engine diameter (Meteor, vampire and again F-80) instead of making high-pressure turbine engine.
This is a beatiful video, but i would say that plane is a replica with modern engines, not jumos
GE J-85's
You think about it, this is the Great Grandfather of all modern jets. The problem is he has a tendency to get a *little* racist...
😂😂😂
??
You Smoke Joints ?
@@fritzkraut4860 ???
😂
Hey Dan. Love your work 👍
One of my favorite quotes about the Me-262 was Chuck Yeager’s, who said, “the first time I ever saw a jet aircraft, I shot it down.”
He finished the war with 11.5 official victories, including one of the first air-to-air victories over a jet fighter, a German Messerschmitt Me 262 that he shot down as it was on final approach for landing.
"If we are going to do things like this, we sure as hell better make sure we are on the winning side". Yeager said, "I'm certainly not proud of that particular strafing mission against civilians. But it is there, on the record and in my memory".
He forgot to mention that the aircraft shown has modern engines. The originals were just not reliable enough, as the parts wore out after not many hours of flight. That is one of the reasons why this wonder weapon was less effective than hoped. As for the sound, yes it sounds nice, but the sound of those three merlines was beautiful, and instantly recognisable. I’ve heard that sound several times in the skies over my house, and when I looked up, it was indeed one or more Merlin engines, in fact ten when two Lancs, a Spitfire and a Hurricane flew over.
Well...problem are no engines, you can remake them (like is done with many other parts of old engines), but the fact that it would be very unforgiving with older ones just due to them being underpowered. Not to mention that operational (and fully completed) engines are just priceless, because there is so few of them were ever made...
yep, operational life was 12 hrs.
Another 'design of circumstances' of the 272 was the swept wing tip (outboard of the engine nacelles). The Urban Legend was the swept tip wasn't originally swept for high-speed performance, but rather the engines turned out heavier than expected during development so they had to come up with an easy way early on (hard-points of design already set) to move the CofG rearwards slightly. Sweeping those wings was enough to get the result they were after with the bonus of improved high speed handling. I've heard this from multiple sources over the years.
The wings of the Me262 are not swept, only the leading edges are Swept back, same as a DC3/C47 of the 1930's !!!
@wilburfinnigan2142 outside of the engine nacelles the trailing edge is still swept back slightly. The entire leading edge is swept and only the trailing edge inboard of the nacelles are not swept back but instead swept forward from its root.
I recognised that voice, ahh Dan Snow and his podcast helped me through the hours at work, a comfy voice for me haha on another note the Me 262 is a marvel！
Nice one Dan, I am extremely jealous as I went to Fairford on one of the wet days so didn't get to see it fly. But radial-engine Spitfires and Mustangs? Absolutely not.
Quanto orgulho pra divulgar o ME 262... Meus parabéns...!
Can only imagine the absolute shock Allied pilots had when they first saw the ME262!!
there’s audio of an ally pilot’s reaction and it’s fascinating, he freaks out like it’s a ufo
But in 1941 Frank Whittle's jet flew . . . . In Lutterworth the building that he built the first jet engine in still exists. He built it on a trolley on the first floor of a two storey brick building. Then it occurred to him that if it worked it would move across the room so he chained it to a steel brace bolted through the brick wall. He fired it up, the engine and trolley shot across the room and tore a 10ft diameter hole in the wall. The mortar where the hole was repaired is still visible.
Yeah I thought frank wittle was the man who invented the jet engine
The last shot really shows how tiny these WWII planes are. The cockpit is claustrophobia inducing
...Not really different nowadays. Looks bigger, but all space inside is for computers and indicators, the pilot have just enough seat to fit and not press everything at once.
In the quickly years, the German engineers have a deadly war machine in the world war 2 era. That's was absolutely amazing.
Germans didn't have access to quality raw materials and metals like British and Americans and had to improvise the impossible. They were decade ahead both in engine and design...
The aircraft you are showing does NOT have Jumo motors. It has General Electric J85/CJ-610 as engines.
+@bernardmueller5676 CJ610 engines. Paul Allen's museum has restored their original Me-262 with Jumo engines, but ground testing/final work is not completed at this time.
You should have included a few samples of Blue Oyster Cult's ME 262 song in your soundtrack.
Geez. Never thought that this would happen to me, but the sight of the F16 passing the ME262 gave me goosebumps and chills together.
🤦 that's a Eurofighter, much newer aircraft.
@@eaglemmoomin_418He should have known, I think he's Dutch or smth they operate F16s
Even if the 262 decimated the bombers it wouldn’t have changed the war that dramatically. The resources it used were in very scarce and the allies would have caught up quickly. The ground forces were still overwhelming the Germans and a short period of air superiority would not have changed much.
Are you guys just reacting to a clickbait headline or are you actually bothering watching the whole video?
The problem with the Me.262 was NOT with fuel scarcity but with engines that were put into production before the bugs were discovered. As for the fuel, the jet was a gift. It didn’t need rare, expensive gasoline at all. Instead it could run on almost any reasonable oil-like liquid. Most of them were fueled with kerosene, which was more plentiful than gasoline. But in a pinch alcohol or even peanut oil would do. What a shame to be used with an aircraft that was first starved of development time, then suddenly rushed into production, with Hitler giving contradictory orders that he’d then change. The bomber debacle was merely one of them.
@@karlkarlos3545The clickbait titles have gotten so ubiquitous & ridiculous they overpower whatever content follows.
@@philipliethen519 true.
The video states the 262s were fearsome opponents. They weren't, because there weren't enough of them. Had the war dragged on, the British would have soon introduced the Glouster Meteor while the USA was testing the P-80 Shooting Star.
"This is not a step forward, this is a giant leap" - well that's certainly a familiar sounding quote!! Would Neil Armstrong have been familiar with it? There were a lot of former pilots involved in the early NASA programs...
I didn’t realize that until you mentioned it.
Remember watching a video on how inconsistencies in the Luftwaffe’s records on the ME262 could mean that it wasn’t truly operational until after the Meteor. Cannot remember the exacts, but an interesting thought!
in the south african war museum in johannesburg there is the only [i belive] 2 seat ME 262 trainer in almost perfect condition. in fact they are a hidden treasure of aircraft
+@fergusbroad The example in the South African Museum of Military History is Me-262B-1a/U1 two-seat night fighter, Wk.Nr. 110305. There is a two-seat trainer version (Me-262B-1a, Wk.Nr. 110639) at the US Navy Museum in Pensacola, FL and it is a trainer version, and it was the exact aircraft used by Allied pilots to train on the Me-262 with a POW Luftwaffe instructor pilot.
@@FiveCentsPlease Yes !!! Very true !!!
Whenever somebody makes the claim this or that weapon would have won the war I ask you this :
Imagine an alternative to WWII where the Panther, the MG-34 and or the 88mm were never put into service. Those weapons were quite advanced and it would be easy for people in sait alternative timeline to claim that these weapons would have won WWII.
The problem is that all these weapons came only after the Nazi warmachine had already lost most of its capacities. Between constant problems to get their hands at the necessary rare ressources and the loss of bombed out factories/hasty relocation to bunker complexes, combined with the idiocy of letting slaves build important war machines, inviting sabottage and lacklustre effrots in doing good work, they just had no chance to ever reach anything like sufficient numbers to make any changes to the overall situation.
Late 44, early 45 the manpower losses also started to really show, making manning such "super weapons" with qualified aces nearly impossible as all that was left was the dregs they had to recruit now after most of the ablebodied men already were at the fronts... old men, teenagers, and debilitated but somewhat combat capable personnel they wouldn't have used for service at the beginning of the war... all with way too little training.
@@Ugly_German_Truths They had one artillery shell per unit, they couldn't even win a ground war with better technology.
If they had 5000 operational ME 262's and the crews to man them they could have defended their airspace but wouldn't have been able to use them offensively. They didn't have the range.
@@claytonberg721 They very much could. And were used offensively in france and on eastern front. They also very much could reach the isle, tho there was no need in this, because He-111/V-1 combo was good enough to attack it from range.
Quite impressive it was barely 60 years from a simple motorised aircraft to mankind standing on the moon
With the Ox-cart/Blackbird special recconaissance programme as well. Also unique in it's advancement, beyond all comprehension, for it's time.
Definitely! It shows that we probablybcan combat climate change as well if we are just as dedicated.
Not about being dedicated. It is about releasing blocked patents that have been invented over the past 100 years. We have had the technology. But.... those getting rich off "climate change" would lose money.@woutmoerman711
@@baker64177 I think it is more about companies and people getting rich by continuing the old ways.
Even the best design doesn't help without the needed fuel. This little fighter was full of technology ahead the time.
It is also untrue that this aircraft is forgotten. Blue Oyster Cult's ME 262 from the 74 album Secret Treaties has been educating folks to history for 50 yrs.
What a damn beautiful machine - I have the die cast. Model in my family room and I look at and admire this Jet every day.
Imagine taking an F-1 car and the boss insisting it be a rally car!
To be fair, a rally car is still fast, agile, but with way more versatility and ruggedness.
Also, while we're on that comparison, a lot of German "superweapons" were like entering in one F1 car that needed to constantly rebuild it's engine into endurance race where everyone else has several teams of rally drivers who's cars can run straight through several races
@@hyperx72 Some overestimate that low engine lifetime. You know how many bombers you can shoot down in 25 hours? That's probably 10+ missions. These engines could be rebuilt anyway, and even if not: "Two engines for a 4-mot? Here, take my money".
@@0Turbox That depends on if they can find and shoot down bombers in that time. They can't for instance, fly patrol missions, not find their target, or otherwise be unsuccessful in shooting them down without a key part in their construction needing to be replaced.
@@hyperx72 Dude, do you even know how the air war over Europe was fought? They had radar and observers, and you need no patrols to find several hundred bombers strong formations.
@@0Turbox Ground radar mostly, fog of war still played an effect especially when radar stations get targeted.
Created in an undisclosed Hangar in Paine Field near Everett, WA USA. 5 Me-262 replicas one of which went to Germany. The project was called "Stormbird".
+@JuergenGDB The project wasn't a secrect, they needed buyers. Classic Fighter Industries collaborated with an expert in Texas and then the aircraft were complete in WA. CFI was reformed into Legend Flyers and they do restorations.
Can you do the Panzer VIII Maus next? And of course - Landkreuzer P1500 MONSTER
A truly massive tank weighing up to 1,500 tonnes that was only found in blueprints
Such a beautiful and brilliant aircraft,love what galland said,like flying on the wings of angels 👌
Pretty much ugly......
Fascinating- anyone who has ever caught or seen a Lesser Dogfish in the UK would immediately recognise the fuselage of this plane when seen from 45 degrees forward-the gun ports even mirror the eyes !
I never saw a dogfish with 4 eyes?
Spot on.
🦘🇦🇺👍
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small-spotted_catshark
There were a lot of good looking aircraft that came out of WWII but for me this is no. 1 for aesthetics.
Chuck Yeager was asked what his impression of the 262 was when he first saw one. He said, "I shot it down".
The P51 and Spitfires did not use radial engines, as mentioned by the host.
Nor was the ME262 the worlds first operational jet aircraft, that tile belongs to the Gloster Meteors of RAF 616 squadron, poorly researched video.
It was estimated that a SINGLE hit from a German 30mm (MK 108) cannon would down a P-51 almost every time! And it would take 3 to 4 hits from this weapon to down a B-17!!! Fortunately, the thing was too fast for it to shoot and hit with the gunsight it had!!
BTW: you could argue that the Me262 was a 4 engine airplane! Each nacelle had a small 2 cylinder, 2 cycle (piston) engine for starting the Axial Flow jet engine it was "nested with"!!! Allowing for "Scrambles" without having a specialized starting cart alongside the fighter!!
The Mk.108 30mm cannon also had a low muzzle velocity which did not help.
My latest airfix builds are the ‘dogfight double’ series! Not sure which I’d rather fly, that or the p-51!
P-51, it's on the side that won and its engines don't usually spontaneously combust.
@@pvt.potato1943 Ask meteor and F-80 pilots about spontaneous combustion. Just how much can be forgiven, cause "we win so it doesnt matter"...
P-51. Sit on backline on mainland, do almost nothing entire war gaining easy money.
"Those jet engines sound much more modern than the radial engines of the spitfire and the mustang"
Weren't they Rolls Royce V12s?
I think just misspoke. He meant piston engines.
The allies had jet fighters as well, so even if Germany was somehow able to pump out more jet fighters to the point that they were a more consistent threat, the allies could've just brought the meteor or pressed the shooting star into heavier production to counter it.
Allied fighters were at a similar level of development. The Germans were just desperate enough to use the Me-262. At its development level, It would not have been accepted for service under normal circumstances.
@@jamesricker3997 The Meteor was actually used, though kept back defending Britain since they were worried about the jet engines being captured.
@@hyperx72The F-80 wasn't ready until 1947 and the Meteor was just too slow , it was barely faster than a prop fighter . The mk 3 in 1945 was as fast as the Me262 , but by that time the Germans had plans for a 262 HG1 and HG2 with up to Mach 1 . The design of the Meteor was just too old , no swept wings wich help at high speeds .
F-80C and Meteors were outclassed by Mig 15 in the Korean War by the way , F86 Sabre was the better jet .
@@5co756 The F-80 did see limited service in the war, and "Oh at some point the Germans thought about making this cool design" doesn't really count for much when said design was just a drawing on paper.
Also no surprise that planes built several years later would be better than the first attempts at jet fighters.
@@hyperx72 This was a YP-80A wich 4 of them were send to Europe , 2 to the RAF wich one exploded and killed the pilot and one crash landed and was also scrapped . And 2 went to Italy in 1945 , non of them flew any mission . They went to the US again and one of the YP-80's crashed also during a flight from Ohio to Texas . Wich also killed the pilot , this thing was a death machine or widow maker . And the last one was rebuild into an unmanned drone , wich I can understand .
In 1947/48 it went into full production and was called F-80C , so if you wanna talk about such jets try to have some facts ready . And not just claims , you were the one that comes up with Meteors and the F-80 . Wich all were combat ready long after the war ends and not in 1944 .
Frank Whittle the British genius deserves full credit here not only did he invent the jet engine but also produced the only workable, reliable and effective jet fighter of the war.
He didn't invent anything, his 1930 patent didn't produce a workable engine.Germans flew 2 years before..Whittle was a charlatan..
Workable and effective ? It saw no combat and was barely faster than a prop fighter , this was a kids toy compared to the Me262 . The engines were much more reliable yes , but also not that aerodynamic and they produced way less power or thrust . This changed with later versions , but it was still sluggish . In the Korean War it was outclassed by Mig 15 or F86 Sabre .
@@5co756 Derwent 1 - max thrust 2000lb, Pressure Ratio - 3.9:1 and Thrust to weight ratio 2.04
Ju 004B - max thrust1980lb, Pressure Ratio - 3.14:1 and Thrust to weight ratio 1.25
Great episode and beautifully presented. Is this a WW2 rebuilt and restored aircraft or was it produced by airbus according to the earlier plans? May have missed hearing that in video.
+@fr.michaelknipe4839 Five new-build Me-262s were manufactured by a special project in the US, for unique buyers. Four of those are flyable. There is one original restoration that was rebuilt for short flights but it is not finished yet.
It's a modern replica, using modern alternative engines
The Junkers Jumo 004 engine had tubine blade failures due to natural harmonics. The delay in redesign of the engine to be made without high temperature alloys and blade redesign sealed the fate of German jet aircraft, and they became too little too late to affect the wars outcome. The ME 262 also had fuselage and wing problems when it flew at speeds in the transonic region. If flown into the transonic region, it risked breaking up in flight, so there were airspeed restrictions for the ME 262. It also had no airbrakes and could overshoot the target aircraft and miss hitting the target, which also made it hard to wash off speed to land the ME 262. I often wonder how many German pilots were killed by the aircrafts faults alone.
Look, all aircraft had some development faults developed in a wartime rush. The Germans fixed them, the 262 according to Capt Eric Brown the most experienced test pilot in history who was responsible for evaluating advanced German types for the Royal Aircraft Establishment at Farnborough is on film saying that ‘without a shadow of doubt, the ME262 was the most formidable fighter plane of World War Two!’ Of course one single weapon is going to win a war, that’s obvious. It’s kill ratio, by the way, despite overwhelming odds was 5:1, end of story.
@drstrangelove4998 The kill ratio was operationally about 4 to 1 with losses of ME 262's resulting from these engagements also. The effect on the allied airpower and mainly bombers was only about 1 % of the total forces. A mosquito bite compared to up to the 5% loss rates the Allies had experienced on bombing missions to all causes in operations that were considered acceptable at the time. The fact that the ME 262 only reached squadrons late in the war in early 1945, I think February, which were largely organised by Adolf Gallards' efforts, was a definite case of too little too late. Willie Messerschmidt was a political animal that took advantage of the Nazi regime. Post war when Germany stated producing aircraft again, his firm built the Lockheed 104 Starfighter under contract, another military project in which corruption was evident. He did two years in prison for utilising slave labour in his factories during the war so was a convicted war criminal. Germany may have been better served with the Heinkel 280 jet fighter to introduce and familiarise aircrews to jet aircraft and their operational procedures with training of pilots and ground support, which could have happened in 1943. But the political manouverings of Willie Messerschmidt won out in favour of the ME 262, causing delays in getting any jet into service with the Luftwaffe. It is a tangled web one weaves when playing what might have been in light of the harsh reality of what transpired history.
@@drstrangelove4998 They did not fix the transonic issue and as Brown said it was very tricky on sudden changes in speed and attitude.
Eric Brown in full knowledge of this still stated as you said. I suppose like all planes it had its characteristics and they had to be accommodated.
With a 100mph advantage you were a fool if you tried dogfighting a Spitfire .
The Jumo engines exhibited poor throttle response, high fuel consumption and very short on-wing lifetime. Due to its small combat radius the Me262 was stationed close to operational areas and was therefore exposed to Hawker Typhoons/Tempest attacks when on approach for landing. Even if the Me262 pilot became aware of an attack during landing the engines were too slow to spool back up to full power to get him out of trouble. The Me262 was a victim of being pressed too hurriedly into service before it had been fully developed. The RAF erred perhaps on being too cautious with the entry into service of the Gloucester meteor but at that stage in the war the large numbers of fully developed Tempests and Spitfires were sufficient for victory.
Please learn what a jet engine fuel control is modern jet engine use them. However the Jumo 004 had none. So yes move the throttle to fast forward the engine will flame out, retard the throttle to fast the Jumo 004 flames out. The 262 pilots were in direct control of the jet engine air fuel mixture from take off to landing. Just scary huh? try driving your car that way some time. : )
If the other side's fighters can freely roam around your airfields, you lost it anyway.
Wrong! The Me262 wasn't a victim of being pressed too hurriedly into service before it had been fully developed. The Jumo 004 A engine managed 100-hour full-load runs without any problems, while the Jumo 004 B series model only managed 25 hours due to the war-related shortage of raw materials such as nickel and molybdenum. The Me 262 was much more a victim of a criminal war in which Germany had overreached itself due to a lack of resources.
joe2 The P51 Mustangs are credited with destroying 120 of the Me262's the P47 25 of them and the Brits only destroyed 10 and a B17 tail gunner got a couple, thats 157 of the "Less than 200" that ever saw service. 1400 air frames were built but only enough engines for less than 200 to go in service !! !
@@wilburfinnigan2142 No wonder, when your bomber escort is up to 900 fighters strong. They would even shoot down a couple of F-35s if only guns are allowed.
262 gets the credit for being the first jet fighter however the Meteor was the first jet fighter actually used in combat
Straight up wrong. Both meteor and F-80 were late to party AND inferior as a high-speed jet fighter at the same time.
The Meteor first flew in 1943 and commenced operations on 27 July 1944 with No. 616 Squadron RAF. The Meteor was not a sophisticated aircraft in its aerodynamics, but proved to be a successful combat fighter.
The aircraft became operational with the Luftwaffe in mid-1944. The Me 262 was faster and more heavily armed than any Allied fighter, including the British jet-powered Gloster Meteor.
🦘🇦🇺👍
@@alexturnbackthearmy1907 Nothing i said was wrong. Also don't know why you're mentioning the F80 when it wasn't the first jet the US made nor was it ever operated during the war?
The four nose cannons, two jet engines what a jet fighter besides the Me 264 & Me 1011.
Lots of things could have won that war if only... The major problem was Hitler's interference and belief in his own infallability. Churchill thought he was very clever but he didn't kill people who he didn't agree with. By the time the Me262 was ready to fly on operations, the war was effectively lost as the Germans were short of materials and fuel. Hitler's paranoia and belief in his own genius would not allow any dissent and any thought he came up with as a war-winner should be produced even if there were not enough materials, fuel or people to make it work.
Hitlers interference had little to do with them losing. Wars are won by logistics, fuel, and manpower, Germany was lacking in all three departments even if they were the most effective fighting force on the planet.
@@brettnelson6710 True. They had a chance only if brits just given up africa and all offensives in europe, along with US, and just sat on their islands doing nothing. They would take ussr down (due to not having to spread out everything so thin) to maybe moscow and a bit beyond, but that about it (and only because soviet losses were so catastrophic in 1941, that they had less manpower on front then axis, despite sending few millions there). And now they stuck in annihilating, exhausting and never ending war with locals and remaning soviet factories and armies (remember, they took them very far from front).
But it will never happen, because it is too stupid to happen. The allies would take every chance to begin their offensive or strike germany, directly or not, even if their entire population was against it (like in US, when war just started).
Two important aviation firsts achieved by Nazi Germany towards the end of the war. First fighter jet and first man made object in space ( V2 rocket that crossed the Karman Line). What does it say about us that the first man made object in space was built with slave labour?
What does it say about Germans you mean?
The first jet fighters to enter service were the Gloster Meteors of RAF 616 squadron, they beat the ME262 to the title by only a few days but they were the first.
24:50 The Bypassing Aircraft: Hello Granny
Me 262: Well-done Bravo
My dad was a gunner in a B26 and shot at the 262 several times.
Fascinating, historical explanation. It’s worth checking the reports associated with Tempest and Spitfire Mk XIV squadron’s they reportedly were successful in combat against the Messerschmitt 262. Particularly the Tempest given the Luftwaffe pilots reports that they feared the Tempest the most, of all allied fighters. The Meteor was initially used to counter the V-1 flying bomb threat. 616 Squadron Meteors saw action for the first time on 27 July 1944,
2 days after the Messerschmitt 262 encounter with the Mosquito. Interestingly they never encountered each other, though the Meteor is credited with the first jet against Jet combat, August 4 would be the day No.616 opened its score. At 3.45pm, Fg Off ‘Dixie’ Dean was scrambled in EE216 ‘YQ-E’ for an anti-diver patrol between Ashford, Kent, and Robertsbridge, East Sussex.
I don't think the "Swallow" was ever sent over Great Britain (both out of fear the revolutionary technology would fall into enemy hands and due to the limited range/endurance problems) and as the Meteor was usually not sent out over Nazi controlled territory for pretty much the same reason, the chance of meeting each other were rather slim...
@@Ugly_German_Truths The Meteor squadrons were moved to Belgium and Holland during the later part of the war. The Meteor had greater range and could out turn in combat but was about 30mph slower. However, reference wasn’t made to the Messerschmitt AG Technical External Service 5.6.1945 Report by Flugkapitän Fritz Wendel Re:Me 262 Refers to a Führer-edict had been received to the effect that: 1 The Me 262 must not be flown at a speed exceeding 750 kph, 466 mph
2 It must not be dived speed exceeding 850 kph. 528mph and 3 It must not descend below 12,000 feet when over enemy territory. The latter one may because of Tempest, below 20,000 feet it was the fastest propeller allied aircraft.
The Tempests did mid to low level sweeps, the 262 high level intercepts.
The 262 was only really vulnerable when in landing approach and were in a flak channel so it was horribly dangerous to try to attack then.
But for an allied fighter pilot a 262 was an irresistible target.
The Germans may have had their secret weapons, but the allies did too.
A Hitler was one of them.
@@DC.409Man the Luftwaffe was down in 1945 , zero chance that a Meteor would see a Me262 . There was a reason why they waited until late 45 to deploy the Meteor in Belgium . 😅
@@5co756 V1? Also because of aerodynamic issues with the control surfaces ME262 pilots were performance limited bringing them into the envelope of the fastest allied fighters. They were very cautious around the Tempest V because it could dive with them and fight in a dive. Bottom line they couldn’t dogfight. So meteor wasn’t required.
The simple truth is, no, it could not have won the war for Germany. By the summer of 1942, the war was already lost for Germany. Hitler had already invaded the USSR, and, declared war on the U.S., the twin mistakes that sealed Germany's fate.
And they bombed our chippy! Game over!
The war was lost when the USSR didn't collapse in a few weeks.
From then on it was about numbers and time.
There was zero chance of invading Britain so the British Empire and Commonwealth would fight on.
The usa made it quicker and easier.
Not won, but possibly a different outcome. Without total air dominance, the extended bombing raids on German infrastructure & industry would have looked quite different (which might have given them the option to slow down the Soviet advance), and D-Day with local German air superiority? Maybe it would have been Frankfurt & Hamburg rather than Hiroshima & Nagasaki. Or the Cold War would have never happened because not much of Stalins army would have been left after their victory 🤷♂
I would go even further and say that the war was lost for Germany on December 7, 1941 with the attack on Pearl Harbour. Once America got involved there was only ever going to be one eventual outcome: The surrender of Japan and those allied with Japan.
The invasion of USSR was a grave error that quickened the end for Germany however America was an industrial superpower that Germany wasn't able to match.
Yes, Hitler’s two greatest blunders.
The engines in the excellent Me262 replica presented here are General Electric CJ610 turbojet engines...they are definitely not original or replica copies of the Junkers Jumo 004B engines at all. Regardless of that its great to see flying examples.
It does look like a shark now that it's mentioned. So cool to see a real ME 262. Though just on a video, in person would be awesome, but still really cool.
No. Although it was an excellent aircraft capable of dealing incredible damage to the American bombers and daytime fighters, it was incapable of overcoming the vast superiority of the Allies in arms, men, resources and capabilities over the Germans.
Jet engine concept came from Frank whittle
Frank Whittle developed engine with radial compressors in contrary to the axial compressors of the german engines. Where are Engines with radial compressors now?
@@karlkirchweger4190 Frank Whittle, in his original patent application had both axial and centrifugal compressors mentioned. He went with centrifugal compressors as the theory of centrifugal compression was more fully understood as was their manufacture. Two further points, 1, A A Griffith, who was employed at RAE Farnborough wrote the seminal paper on axial compression in the late 1920s. 2, the MetroVick F1 axial flow turbojet was flying in a Meteor by the middle of 1943.
12:27 spitfire and mustang didn't have radial engines. They had inline engines (famous V shaped Rolls Royce Merlin). Earlier versions of Mustangs did use engines other than Merlin but they were never radial
Nice video indeed... a small negative at 12:27. "...sounds more modern than thos radial engines of the ... Spitfires and Mustang"
What? Radial ?? Who me- Merlin ???
(Yes I/m sure others mentioned it below... the only besmirch I can shoot at this fine video, with amazing rare footage...)
Quality
The Allies also had jet fighters. However, the Allies still had way more numbers. The Allies were also bombing German cities, and they ight have been willing to take more casualties by means of the German jet fighter. I can also see Churchill ordering a commando mission to capture said plane, or the schematics, or capture a specialist who helped develop it.
Hey, give the poor German some credit. And I don’t like Churchill.
As a licensed A&P mechanic I approve of this video.... The ME-262 started out as a
"Tail-Dragger" then was changed to a nose gear because the jet exhaust would soften up and blow away parts of the tarmac. The Spitfire, P-51 and ME-262 were all "Flying Art."
Will have to finish later --- Break is over.
Not just due to the tarmac damage... they did not have tarmac on most airfields anyway, but due to the nose up pose a start would require the pilot to try a dangerous breaking maneuver to get the tail into the airstream to take off. With the "tricicle" the posture was corrected and it was easier for less well trained pilots to fly the machines.
I think they lost several prototypes due to badly timed breaking attempts where the nose of the plane hit the ground and caused the fighter to be damaged...
The engines life span was quite short at first being about 5 hours but got increased to about 90 hours with turbine blade improvements early in 1945. Have a good day......@@Ugly_German_Truths
Thanks I was wondering why the surviving 262 had a different landing gear configuration than in the archival footage
@@jetsons101 Quite the opposite. Earlier engines were easily breaking 150 hour mark, but as they were pushed to be more powerful and use lesser quality materials...lets just say it wasnt good.
@@benroberts2222this is not a surviving 262, it is a reproduction aircraft with GE C610 engines.
The light sweep to the wings was done because of the weight and balance of the aircraft would not function with straight wings. The ability of allowing the plane to fly a bit faster because of the swept Wings was actually a surprise to them. The other problem was that it was not an operational jet fighter until about 1944, which made it way too late to do any good, not that they could get any fuel to fuel most of them anyway.
By the time the 262 was put into service, the Gloster meteor was already in service and in limited use.
They must have liked flying it, except that
80% of the early test pilots were getting killed by it.
The Brits had the first kills using a turbo jet engine during WW2. Lots of rewriting of history on You Tube.
Yes at end ww2 did a Meteor shot down a Arado ar 234 jet bomber
@@leneanderthalien It was really was only used for defence against the V1 and took many down.
Yeah like King Arthur pulling the Excalibur from stone???😂😂😂😂
No, it wasn't. A Meteor downed a V-1 on the 4th of Aug '44, true, but an actual dogfight plane-on-plane was won by a Me-262 4 days later on the 8rh when it downed a Mosquito.
Firstly it is not a Nazi Jet Fighter. It is a German Luftwaffe Jet Fighter. Secondly it may have delayed the Allied victory by some nonths but the overall outcome was never in doubt
This is a 1990's reproduction with modern General Electric CJ610 turbojets engines, I've read. I thought for a moment it was running with the original engines. I was listening to the pilot and thinking your days are numbered. Now if only they retrofitted an ejection seat too 🙂.
I really enjoyed this! Just to be geeky/accurate - the aircraft shown isn't an 262 - it is a 7/8 (if I remember!) scale flyable replica/model with modern jet engines. The manufacturers (Airbus, I think) scaled it down to fit the size of the nearest size of commercially available jet engines. The original engines would have been too unreliable and expensive to run on a flying aircraft. Nonetheless, an amazing achievement to fly something so closely representing the 262 in the modern age.
This is D-IMTT. I don’t believe it is scaled down, the manufacturer was in Paine Field, Seattle, Airbus just sponsors the Bavarian museum it is based out of. But you are correct, these have GE engines.
I've often thought if they'd concentrated on producing these, instead of the V rockets and other projects things could have been much harder on the allies.
They still wouldn't have had enough fuel or metal to do anything serious and the allies countermeasure would also have the benefit of max production, superior supply chain and logistics.
These are different projects + there were AA missiles in rockets program (like a proper SAM, radar guided), so idk about that. + They had about same material and "willing workforce" quality, so more of the same is not better.
Title is false. Germany would have lost even with the skies full of ME-262's. P-80's would have been rushed into Europe. The 262 was plagued with problems. It couldn't been flown at top speeds due to " tail flutter"concerns. Engines could not be rapidly accelerated. Skilled pilots by then were scarce. It wasn't the Wunderwaffe the Nazi's expected.
RAF Meteor Jet was available end of 1944 anyway and there was a jet v jet example of it shooting down a 262
@@charlieboffin2432 no the only jet aircraft shot down by a Meteor was a Arado Ar 234 jet bomber
The Me262 couldn’t slow down - which made it a lousy gun platform and vulnerable when landing.
All subsequent jets got air brakes to solve this problem of too little drag…
I think P-80s were in Italy and end-of-war undergoing testing. They did not see combat.
You might not believe it, but both were actually inferior. F-80 was a disaster (plagued with numerous problems even in korea when it was against migs), and meteor was just slightly faster spitfire, that was very comparable to it well after the war has ended. Out of these 3 only 262 could serve as a mig-15/saber contender, just because of very advanced features not present on allies planes for a very long time, and could with further development become a supersonic aircraft (obviously not made from plywood and with advanced aerodynamics that were in development at the time, along with stronger engines), kinda like mig-15 evolution to supersonic mig-19.
So is the me 262, the great grandfather of all jets?
No. There was one before it. He-280, THE very first jet plane.
@@alexturnbackthearmy1907 ahh ok then, thanks! 👍
Mr Snow, neither the Spitfire nor the Mustang had radial engines. They had V12 water cooled Merlin and Griffon engines.
History my foot
load a rubbish
Such an absolutely beautiful aircraft. I've often wondered if they studied the shape of sharks for the design. much like the Dutch did with fish for their design of sailing ships in the 16th and 17th century.
Did you actually watch the video? The shape was explained and it had nothing to do with sharks.
I thought the me262 at duxford had english jets fitted.
Heyyyyyyy the German Messerchmitt, I heard lot of stories about that
i come from rugby England where the first jet engine was tested its crazy to think my small town was used to develop something that would change the world for ever
12:00 - if this was a historical re-enactment, then surely the spitfire or mustang would have shot the ME 262 to bits upon takeoff, if not before whilst taxiing…
The early versions of the ME-262 had problems with the tail wheel. The pilots would have to tap on the brakes to get the tail up then fly off the runway this is the reason why there's a nose wheel
I was young in the 1970s, I had a beer with Paddy Lilburn who had been squadron leader of one of the first Meteor squadrons. I had thought that the early jets where ferocious. No, they where smooth as silk, beautiful to fly, he told me. Now what stopped the ME262 being effective? The engines needed to be either replaced or completely rebuilt after FOUR HOURS IN THE AIR. Look I'm retiring next month, but have had a long career in aerospace defense, particularily in Military and Civil Jet engines.
As RC models they fly SOOOO GOOD. and there are a few Electric ones you can buy, powered with EDF motor and the plane built in EPP / EPO. but i still want to build one in balsa wood or fiberglass and run two JetCat´s on it (Jet Turbine´s) that´s the closet we can come to the real one as a RC Pilot.
And history wise, i get pretty mad that they forced it to be a "bomber".
'Die Schwalbe'. Thank goodness that it was rushed into production very late in the war. A couple or three years earlier, and this machine, like the Panzer V, would have had time on it's side. Not-withstanding, the 262 like Panther, showed the brilliance of advanced German design technology and engineering. Two wonderful 'creatures', in their respective domains.
Forgotten wonder weapon? The ME 262 must be the least forgotten of the wunder waffe beside the V1...? And the radial egines of the Spit and P51? There are a lot wanting in this video...
This is where you use the word pinnacle to describe a feat of excellence.
12:41 I can't have been the only one screaming 'DO A DRAG RACE' at this point
I saw a story about an American Officer touring Germany in search of and collecting secret or advanced weapons. He was told by a proud 262 crew, that they could change the Engine on a 262, even in the field, in ½ an hour!!
I wonder how long it took to change an Engine on a Gloster Meteor?
Germany, besides the 4 engine Arado bomber and reconnaissance plane (used over the Invasion Beaches) , also had a 6 engine bomber ready with forward swept wings, for the highest windspeed and carrying ability, at the root of the wings!
Only during start and landing the German jets were a target for the Allied fighters, which couldn't follow their speed at any time, if not. A German Pilot told that he had a "periscope" put on his Arado, with a clear helicopter-like forward looking cockpit, but hardly any ability to look back, so that he could look behind to see if a fighter was following him, when coming in to land! If so he would take another turn and leave the fighter in the dust with ease.
I am shocked. Shock². Shock³. Incredible sight. Thanks for piece of aviation history
In my very humble opinion, this is the most beautiful aircraft ever designed and form was better than function. Thank god they didn't have time to develop it much further or there would have been a very different outcome over the skies of Britain with this aircraft protecting the German bombers.
It's just beautiful.