Ryan Can you do a 10 minute talk on using a Plumb Bob to level a scope with the light method? And a demonstration on bore sighting might help a lot of people also.
After watching this video in it’s entirety i have to say i really admire the perfectionist side of Ryan and would trust him to work on any rifle i have 💯😁
Another bit of advise, when setting your eye relief for a hunting rifle wear your hunting jacket. It adds a bit that is different wearing a standard shirt.
It’s hard to overemphasize this crucial step for making sure your rifle setup is all it can be,the farther you shoot the more important it becomes,good work guy’s💯🇺🇸
I like it gents, I've started adding an extra step, jb weld steel stick, the 2 part putty, mix it and put a thin amount under the scope base avoiding the holes by a little more than an 1/8 inch and tighten it down while cleaning the squeeze out with a towel and tooth pick and its bedded onto the receiver, it's own little happy home and mounted in virtually a perfect surface made my the 2 parts themselves.
I went through the ringer a while back trying to get supplies to level scopes 😂 ordered several levels that were not level and required quite a bit of tuning to get them level. I needed at least one decent level for the action so I could do the plum bob method. Been waiting for this video. Great video
@14:19..., recently learned that it is beneficial to wet mount ring bases onto the rail. As explained the clamping force of the ring base to picatinny rail produces galling conditions which will cause base loosening from recoil forces.
Only thing I would add that I don't recall hearing mentioned would be to lap your rings. Definitely a must for cheaper rings, but over the years I have found that even some very high dollar CNC machined rings will often need lapping. Whether the misalignment is in the rings themselves or caused by a slight warp in the action from the heat treating process you want to lap them to ensure they're not putting stress on the optic. Worst case I ever came across was a set of CZ rings for the 11mm dovetail on some of their rimfire rifles.
(Not for bolt actions) but Leapers pro scope cantilever mounts have been 100% perfectly lapped from the factory. I will never buy expensive rings for this reason.
Hey guys. Love your optics, I personally own 4 variation of Vortex optics and love them all. Ryan’s comment comes from Top Gun, “because I was inverted” was the line Maverick used to explain how he could see the enemy fighter when they were above them at close proximity.
Excellent guide, I would of mentioned buying the appropraite sized scope rings for your rifle too. A lot of first time long range shooters buy rifles with pre-atttached scopes thinking they can swap them out for just any other scope. And so the rabbit hole opens.
I’ve found my self not even watching one of these podcasts it Ryan isn’t on it he reminds me of one of my friends who always gives me a good laugh who I don’t see much anymore
Aviation standard torque practice is to incrementally torque up to final value (in three steps), working from inner to outer points to move binding stresses out to edges of material. After the final torque value is achieved a 5 minute wait period is preformed with light rapping of fasteners done with plastic handle of screwdriver (to relieve thread tension), then the final torque value is applied one last time.
For checking equal spacing/gapping between the ring halves when tightening, I use a credit card as a gauge to attempt uniformity between the halves. It usually works out pretty good.
Facts, I remember when a guy who recently became a citizen was telling me that the citizenship test had a whole section dedicated to Tom Cruise Trivia.
I like to lap also if needed, most rings are fine but some are not (the factories cant QC every item) and sometimes the edges of the rings have high spots The action, rail screw holes, and rail itself may cause slight misalignment of the rings if slightly out of spec. Lapping kits come with a bar to check if lapping is necessary. To each his own tho, i cant really say if it makes a difference for accuracy or scope function.
Also witness mark ring bases to caps. As they are line bored before caps are cut/seperated from bases. This prevents putting a cap on the wrong base OR putting the match bored cap 180° out from its mate. Alignment dowels are an added assurance to plane alignment and possibly the need for lapping.
Phenomenal video. One point I wish you would have touched on is what if you rings are touching each other prior to you reaching the full torque value???
I'd love to see a 10 min talk about the Beretta brx1 and hear what Ryan thinks about the system. Or maybe a long format podcast about straight pull rifles in the general.
Another little tippy tip instead of levels there is a tool called Arisaka optic leveler it is a wedge that squares the scope to the rifle so you don’t even have to worry about the rifle being leveled it’s super fast and more accurate than a bunch of levels
Superb tutorial, mention of the Axis, include the 110 action also. Would love to see an indepth discussion on length of pull, how it effects eye relief. How thick clothing effects eye relief. Optics are mounted when t-shirts are worn, not acceptable in most cases.😮 just a idea im throwing out there. Thank you for what you do. No such thing as too much information.
You guys should watch the Torque Test Channels segment on thread locker and its affect on torque values. They had a couple of videos on it. A main point they found is that expired thread locker will actually decrease the applied torque fairly significantly. Normal good quality thread locker that isn’t expired did not significantly increase torque applied.
At first I wanted to dismiss this video since I’ve done this numerous times using the Wheeler level, level, level system with great success. But I reminded myself that you can always learn something, and I did! As an aside, didn’t y’all do a ten minute talk on the 257 Weatherby? If you did, I don’t see it.
I use the Real Avid scope leveling system. It uses projected light and has a great system for assuring the rifle is level. Note: Another major US scope manufacturer warns not to trust the turret for leveling, so I never do.
Re leveling I want the vertical portion of the reticle pointed at the bore regardless of what a level might say. For rings and bases I prefer the Leupold dual dovetail and Weaver Top Mount, but they have extra complicating steps in setting up well.
18:20 When shouldering the rifle, do it with eyes closed, then open them when in position. Most people will unconsciously move their head to get a better sight picture.
MERRY CHRISTMAS Y'ALL from 12/25 to 1/21 is the rut here in Alabama. Some does go a little later here which is why the season goes into February here in Alabama. Google Alabama rut map 2024 and it will pull up a really helpful map showing rut dates across the state. Happy hunting and man I am still fired up for the rut even though I am 51 now and been hunting all my life.
Good Video, I was already practicing most of those items. The only question is, do modern rings require honing? I typically do run my honing bar on a new set of rings to remove minor high spots.
So I have long been of Vortex optics and recently found your Podcast, love the content and am slowly making my way through the library but have been wondering what is with the Spam Cans in the media room?
I know this will sound funny. But at some point on scopes. There will be a pair sets of painted lines designating the zones of where you can put scope rings.
I enjoy learning from my nation, but have never heard how to utilize Vortex Rifle Scopes while humoring the ridiculous constraints imposed by Washington State ie optic/reticle illumination. The hunting public here interprets the restrictions differently. Can you touch on this issue for us?
Alright Ive got a question for you. I have a gun that was built crooked from the factory, you can look at the top flats in the receiver and see it’s not true, look at the iron sights and see it too. Now my question. If I mount it properly to the gun, even though it’s crooked, should it still work fine and be accurate? Either way it’s a notoriously inaccurate rifle, Ruger M77/357. I’ve tried multiple rounds and mounting options to get roughly softball sized groups out of it.
A couple of questions: I got in the habit a long time ago of marking ring tops and bottoms the first time I separate them to keep the orientation the same and match front to front and back to back. Is that necessary? Also, I try to get the longest functional eye relief at the maximum magnification. IOW start with the scope too far away and move it toward your eyeball just enough to get a good sight picture without shadow, etc. Recently mounted a 15-year old 4.5-14x scope where there was barely any overlap between the maximum magnification eye box and the minimum magnification eye box (which always is farther away - longer eye relief). Are new scopes just better in that regard?
Most of my scopes are fixed 4X or 6X. I set them up as shown in the "shotgun" position, because that is mainly how I shoot. Unfortunately, this makes some of them nearly impossible for me to shoot prone, because I can't get my eye far enough away.
I'm struggling to understand the leveling process because I didn't see them confirm how the top of the gun/scope base was considered level as laid into the gun vise. Don't you have to confirm someway that the gun is held into the vise in a perfectly level way before you try to spin the scope to level??? What am I missing??
Great video, but much of this is dancing on the head of a pin. I've mounted 15 plus scopes on my hunting rifles over the years, first without levels, more recently with. Zero discernible difference for hunting accuracy. And lapping should NOT be necessary with quality components. In fact if not done precisely right, it's detrimental.
I haven't bothered lapping rings in over a decade. Most newer produced rings from major manufacturers simply don't require it. Also, scope bodies are more rigid and less prone to flex/deformation which also makes lapping rings less necessary. You can get a set of rings under a hundred bucks that are perfectly fine out of the box from several manufacturers
I know this will sound funny. But at some point on scopes. There will be a pair sets of painted lines designating the zones of where you can put scope rings.
Ryan Can you do a 10 minute talk on using a Plumb Bob to level a scope with the light method? And a demonstration on bore sighting might help a lot of people also.
Gun VICE !!!!!!!! Mark that was smoother than a tikka action!
After watching this video in it’s entirety i have to say i really admire the perfectionist side of Ryan and would trust him to work on any rifle i have 💯😁
"You're not gonna wanna do this on your lap while watching TV" I think that was directed right at me 🤣
Another bit of advise, when setting your eye relief for a hunting rifle wear your hunting jacket. It adds a bit that is different wearing a standard shirt.
I've been busted by that before.
It’s hard to overemphasize this crucial step for making sure your rifle setup is all it can be,the farther you shoot the more important it becomes,good work guy’s💯🇺🇸
Very good. Also Desert Dog did a scope series last December that was good as well.
Thank you gentlemen! We’ve been updating the scopes around here and your timing is exquisite.
Great advices from a true professional! Now I got the need to re check my scope
Thank you fellas for this video, it’s been the most satisfying video on the subject technically speaking. Cheers from NSW Australia 🍻
I like it gents, I've started adding an extra step, jb weld steel stick, the 2 part putty, mix it and put a thin amount under the scope base avoiding the holes by a little more than an 1/8 inch and tighten it down while cleaning the squeeze out with a towel and tooth pick and its bedded onto the receiver, it's own little happy home and mounted in virtually a perfect surface made my the 2 parts themselves.
I went through the ringer a while back trying to get supplies to level scopes 😂 ordered several levels that were not level and required quite a bit of tuning to get them level. I needed at least one decent level for the action so I could do the plum bob method. Been waiting for this video. Great video
For decades I mounted scopes by eye. Wanted to move past 200y. Bought some levels. Checked older mounts and found most of them were good.
I could listen to Ryan Muckenhirn talk guns and cartridges all day.
@14:19..., recently learned that it is beneficial to wet mount ring bases onto the rail. As explained the clamping force of the ring base to picatinny rail produces galling conditions which will cause base loosening from recoil forces.
Only thing I would add that I don't recall hearing mentioned would be to lap your rings. Definitely a must for cheaper rings, but over the years I have found that even some very high dollar CNC machined rings will often need lapping. Whether the misalignment is in the rings themselves or caused by a slight warp in the action from the heat treating process you want to lap them to ensure they're not putting stress on the optic. Worst case I ever came across was a set of CZ rings for the 11mm dovetail on some of their rimfire rifles.
(Not for bolt actions) but Leapers pro scope cantilever mounts have been 100% perfectly lapped from the factory. I will never buy expensive rings for this reason.
Hey guys. Love your optics, I personally own 4 variation of Vortex optics and love them all. Ryan’s comment comes from Top Gun, “because I was inverted” was the line Maverick used to explain how he could see the enemy fighter when they were above them at close proximity.
The “We were inverted” reference was from “Top Gun” I believe. “We were, you know, communicating 🖕🏼”…..😂😅
I hate it when it does that!
Got my first flintlock kill this past weekend!
Perfect timing, I was just getting ready to mount my first scope
Excellent guide, I would of mentioned buying the appropraite sized scope rings for your rifle too. A lot of first time long range shooters buy rifles with pre-atttached scopes thinking they can swap them out for just any other scope. And so the rabbit hole opens.
I’ve found my self not even watching one of these podcasts it Ryan isn’t on it he reminds me of one of my friends who always gives me a good laugh who I don’t see much anymore
Thanks guys,,enjoyed that! alot of helpfull points there .Awesome podcast!
Aviation standard torque practice is to incrementally torque up to final value (in three steps), working from inner to outer points to move binding stresses out to edges of material. After the final torque value is achieved a 5 minute wait period is preformed with light rapping of fasteners done with plastic handle of screwdriver (to relieve thread tension), then the final torque value is applied one last time.
For checking equal spacing/gapping between the ring halves when tightening, I use a credit card as a gauge to attempt uniformity between the halves. It usually works out pretty good.
If you don’t get the Top Gun reference, you may not be an American.
I immediately thought of the ice cream guy. “Invert the spoon, over all 9000 taste buds.”
Facts, I remember when a guy who recently became a citizen was telling me that the citizenship test had a whole section dedicated to Tom Cruise Trivia.
I like to lap also if needed, most rings are fine but some are not (the factories cant QC every item) and sometimes the edges of the rings have high spots The action, rail screw holes, and rail itself may cause slight misalignment of the rings if slightly out of spec. Lapping kits come with a bar to check if lapping is necessary. To each his own tho, i cant really say if it makes a difference for accuracy or scope function.
Also witness mark ring bases to caps. As they are line bored before caps are cut/seperated from bases. This prevents putting a cap on the wrong base OR putting the match bored cap 180° out from its mate.
Alignment dowels are an added assurance to plane alignment and possibly the need for lapping.
Phenomenal video. One point I wish you would have touched on is what if you rings are touching each other prior to you reaching the full torque value???
I'd love to see a 10 min talk about the Beretta brx1 and hear what Ryan thinks about the system. Or maybe a long format podcast about straight pull rifles in the general.
Another little tippy tip instead of levels there is a tool called Arisaka optic leveler it is a wedge that squares the scope to the rifle so you don’t even have to worry about the rifle being leveled it’s super fast and more accurate than a bunch of levels
Superb tutorial, mention of the Axis, include the 110 action also.
Would love to see an indepth discussion on length of pull, how it effects eye relief. How thick clothing effects eye relief.
Optics are mounted when t-shirts are worn, not acceptable in most cases.😮 just a idea im throwing out there. Thank you for what you do. No such thing as too much information.
Should do a video on leveling off the turret vs reticle with pros and cons and which scenarios might be best!!!!
You guys should watch the Torque Test Channels segment on thread locker and its affect on torque values. They had a couple of videos on it.
A main point they found is that expired thread locker will actually decrease the applied torque fairly significantly. Normal good quality thread locker that isn’t expired did not significantly increase torque applied.
The green threadlocker is installed on a fitted joint so it can be torqued dry. It wicks in to the pre-torqued joint.
@ Ok. I was just referring to the most common flavors that most brands sell that you apply directly to the threads, like Loctite 243, etc.
Was surprised that a check for the EGW rail to receiver plane alignment wasn't performed for bedding consideration.
Is there anything about guns that ryan doesn't know? Seriously, guy does a fanominal job! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
I highly recommend the Ariska optic leveler
At first I wanted to dismiss this video since I’ve done this numerous times using the Wheeler level, level, level system with great success. But I reminded myself that you can always learn something, and I did! As an aside, didn’t y’all do a ten minute talk on the 257 Weatherby? If you did, I don’t see it.
I use the Real Avid scope leveling system. It uses projected light and has a great system for assuring the rifle is level. Note: Another major US scope manufacturer warns not to trust the turret for leveling, so I never do.
I use a digital level which works amazing
Threadlocker or vibra tite?
Top Gun & Dodgeball references & guns & optics, what more do you need
Didn’t listen long enough 😂
Excellent video today!
Re leveling I want the vertical portion of the reticle pointed at the bore regardless of what a level might say.
For rings and bases I prefer the Leupold dual dovetail and Weaver Top Mount, but they have extra complicating steps in setting up well.
How would you do that? Just eyeball it?
@@chadwallace3598 Yes.
18:20 When shouldering the rifle, do it with eyes closed, then open them when in position. Most people will unconsciously move their head to get a better sight picture.
Vc3 is awesome!
MERRY CHRISTMAS Y'ALL from 12/25 to 1/21 is the rut here in Alabama. Some does go a little later here which is why the season goes into February here in Alabama. Google Alabama rut map 2024 and it will pull up a really helpful map showing rut dates across the state. Happy hunting and man I am still fired up for the rut even though I am 51 now and been hunting all my life.
Top gun baby
Good Video, I was already practicing most of those items. The only question is, do modern rings require honing? I typically do run my honing bar on a new set of rings to remove minor high spots.
So I have long been of Vortex optics and recently found your Podcast, love the content and am slowly making my way through the library but have been wondering what is with the Spam Cans in the media room?
I know this will sound funny. But at some point on scopes. There will be a pair sets of painted lines designating the zones of where you can put scope rings.
Oh my. You’re actually talking about scopes.
Great info and entertainment
Have you ever used the wedge that levels the scope to the base?
Any way you can guys can talk about straight wall cartridges. There's so many now that it's hard to pick one
Because I was inverted 😂😂😂 talk to me goose
Ryan, what make/company is that elastic band level?
I really like how it works and would love to get one for my own little business.
and... Top Gun... lol
I'm definitely no Ryan Muckenhirn but mine is from CTK Precision.
@@czguy3045 thank you
Top Gun!
How far forward can you put the front ring on something like the strike eagle 1-8 that doesn’t have a front bell.
Can we get a 6mm Rem cartridge talk and a 22 Creed vs 22-250AI cartridge comparison?
Is it important to keep the ring halves the way they are when you receive them?
Thank you
I also have one question... what would you consider a "high recoiling rifle". What calibers make that list? Is a 450 Bushmaster in that catagory?
I could use an action screw
Giggity
I enjoy learning from my nation, but have never heard how to utilize Vortex Rifle Scopes while humoring the ridiculous constraints imposed by Washington State ie optic/reticle illumination. The hunting public here interprets the restrictions differently. Can you touch on this issue for us?
Alright Ive got a question for you. I have a gun that was built crooked from the factory, you can look at the top flats in the receiver and see it’s not true, look at the iron sights and see it too. Now my question. If I mount it properly to the gun, even though it’s crooked, should it still work fine and be accurate? Either way it’s a notoriously inaccurate rifle, Ruger M77/357. I’ve tried multiple rounds and mounting options to get roughly softball sized groups out of it.
A couple of questions: I got in the habit a long time ago of marking ring tops and bottoms the first time I separate them to keep the orientation the same and match front to front and back to back. Is that necessary?
Also, I try to get the longest functional eye relief at the maximum magnification. IOW start with the scope too far away and move it toward your eyeball just enough to get a good sight picture without shadow, etc. Recently mounted a 15-year old 4.5-14x scope where there was barely any overlap between the maximum magnification eye box and the minimum magnification eye box (which always is farther away - longer eye relief). Are new scopes just better in that regard?
Most of my scopes are fixed 4X or 6X. I set them up as shown in the "shotgun" position, because that is mainly how I shoot. Unfortunately, this makes some of them nearly impossible for me to shoot prone, because I can't get my eye far enough away.
Do it Mark. Let's get the job done lol
I'm struggling to understand the leveling process because I didn't see them confirm how the top of the gun/scope base was considered level as laid into the gun vise. Don't you have to confirm someway that the gun is held into the vise in a perfectly level way before you try to spin the scope to level??? What am I missing??
HEET fuel treatment is a great degreaser also. It's 99% isopropyl alcohol.
“Keeping up foreign relations.”
Top Gun :)
Nail polish... After a couple of years of hunting and shooting, torque is still 18 in-lb on scope rings.
How much $$$ do you charge? I run by your place often up to Madison, could I stop in on my way back home in Iowa and get timely service? TIA
Top Gun
you did it all wrong!! Just kidding, thats great as usual and thx for all you do :D
You could turn Ryan's comments into a drinking game. Count the syllables per sentence, anything less than 40 (less common) is a shot.
Top gun! Now we need to see you zero and chicken proof it.
Top gun
Who else on here has always just used clear nail polish painted a little bit on the screws for a Loctite on their rifles
Ryan was about 2 meters, maybe 1 1/2 meters, away from that rifle when he torqued that screw.
It took 9 minutes to get to the mounting of the scope. Geez.
I would not recommend carb cleaner to degrease, it leaves a film behind which imo defeats the purpose
I use cheap clear fingernail polish 🤣
Muzzle break not loose… hmmm. This is what I’m going wrong when mounting a scope…
Im disappointed, a video including a hot rod 6.5 and its not a 6.5 BC
I dislike rails on bolt action rifles. I don't know what problem they solve.
660,000 is low. We have that many pig 🐖 hunting on any given day of the year here in Texas. lol.
Distal and proximal.. you sound like a doctor.
Great video, but much of this is dancing on the head of a pin. I've mounted 15 plus scopes on my hunting rifles over the years, first without levels, more recently with. Zero discernible difference for hunting accuracy. And lapping should NOT be necessary with quality components. In fact if not done precisely right, it's detrimental.
If you do not lap your rings it is an auto fail. Period.
That is absolutely not true
I haven't bothered lapping rings in over a decade. Most newer produced rings from major manufacturers simply don't require it. Also, scope bodies are more rigid and less prone to flex/deformation which also makes lapping rings less necessary. You can get a set of rings under a hundred bucks that are perfectly fine out of the box from several manufacturers
Thirty years ago, I would have definitely agreed. These days, if you buy rings from a company that knows how to make rings... not much of an issue.
"Dry" torque"= thread friction.. "wet torque"= less thread friction
I know this will sound funny. But at some point on scopes. There will be a pair sets of painted lines designating the zones of where you can put scope rings.