Very good information. It would be great if you could talk more about what you mean by very little meat loss with a high shoulder shot. That high shoulder is one of my favorite cuts on the front half of a deer. Maybe make a video butchering a shoulder shot deer to demonstrate meat loss?
Thanks for another interesting video. I have always gone for the "boiler room" shot, aiming about 1/3 up the chest along the back edge of the front leg. My goal is to take out the lungs and hopefully also get the top of the heart. This is a forgiving shot that allows for deer movement and a less than perfect shot. I use Nosler BT ammo, which makes a small hole going in and a big hole coming out and the deer rarely moves more than 50 yards after the shot.
My last deer taken was at 98 yards with a single broadside traditional double lung shoot between two trees using my 30-06 rifle. The deer ran about 25-30 yards straight ahead and died. Massive blood trail to follow and an easy find in the fall leaves. Inside 100 yards I may start trying the high shoulder. Beyond that I'll probably stick to double lung to give more room for error.
Double lung shot is traditional because it has worked, still works, and will continue to work (kinda like the good ole 30.06) no matter what you are shooting. Within reason of course. Bigger margin for error as well. I’m picking double lung every time. And if that high shoulder shot does “stun” it and it gets back up, guaranteed a deer isn’t getting up from a double lung shot.
There is no animal that can survive a hole through its lungs. That trapper in AK that used a 220 swift to kill grizzlies shot out their lungs. I recall seeing a poacher kill a bull moose with a .50 cal pump air rifle and shot it in the lung.
You’re right. The key is to stop oxygenated blood from reaching the brain. That big hole through the lungs interrupts that blood flow. Even if the heart is still beating it is pumping blood into the “boiler room”. The brain shuts down in the matter of 1 - 2 minutes. After that, it doesn’t go anywhere. Besides, the only way to truly bleed out your deer is to shoot it through the lungs. You want the heart to pump all of that blood out of the muscles. Old butchers don’t destroy the heart first, they stun or destroy the brain, they cut the carotid artery and let the animal bleed. Generations of old hunters used to cut the throat of their dead deer which accomplished absolutely nothing but to ruin good neck roasts. If the heart is destroyed, the deer can’t be bled. That’s why I won’t take a heart shot.
"it has worked, still works, and will continue to work" What do you mean, it works? If by "works" meaning, it kicks up its hind legs, runs off into the wilderness/woods/grassland somewhere leading to a trailing expedition and all the stories behind that (from minutes to days, to never finding it)? Why not just drop it where it stands and be done with it? Tradition is blind. Blasting mass hydraulic shock (that destroys tissues, busts, bones, turns stuff into jelly) ON....or NEAR the spinal chord isn't going to "stun" them. Ever set a soup can on top of a 2x4 and shot the can, completely blasting that 2x4 into pieces from the hydraulic shock? Pretty "stunning."
Tried this high shoulder shot yesterday. Worked amazingly well. 100% lights out, not a twitch. Upon processing, we found about 3 inches of the spine was absolutely mangled on the bottom. No waste on the forelegs. I'm sold on the high shoulder shot. Great info, thanks for sharing.
First deer of the year this weekend. 60 yards away slightly quartering high angle (i was 35 foot up on top of a cliff) small deer still walking in a shallow river. Traditional double lung slightly high posterior through liw anterior behind the opposite shoulder with 45-70. Massive blood loss, went 25 yards tops and frankly I was impressed he made it that far. No meat ruined just ribs, which was my intention.
Older solo hunter here and for my entire life been using traditional double lung shot. Rifle, Muzzleloader and Archery. Living in FL with brush growing 7x24 and swamps. Will try this high shoulder shot. Gets tiring tracking thru chest high brush. Running .270 Win with 140 gr. Nosler reload. Looking fwd to results from end of yr survey.
Excellent video! I would like to add another shot placement, which is the high-lung shot. It's just a bit behind and below the high-shoulder shot. It drops game in their tracks, loses very little meat, and offers good margin for error. I have shot many "lights-out" animals with this shot!
Risky and very frustrating shot if loss happens. The gap between top of lung & spine is not fatal, they can leap back to life & gone. Mostly big ones (150kg liveweight up), but worth knowing the risk.
Your video address hunting deer, therefore I think it is a very fair and reliable presentation. You make a good point on knowing anatomy, there are many, many, many blue wildebeest and gemsbuck (oryx) to name just two who are running around with scars on them attesting to failed attempts on high shoulder shots. The high shoulder shot has very little room for error and mostly leads to hitting the spinal processes, and only knocking them out temporarily.
Opening day for gun season was this past Saturday in Missouri. I hunted with my two friends and we had all watched this video. We all shot a deer on Saturday and we all used the high shoulder shot. All three deer went down immediately and all of us were impressed. Thanks for sharing your experience. We are all impressed and will continue to aim for the shoulder.
Hi Jim! Am glad that you included that last little cautionary note at the end of your video - mentioning the possibility of hitting too high and just stunning the deer. I've seen this happen - when my hunting partner's buck dropped instantly I told him to chamber another round and get ready. Good thing he did! Buck got up, and got shot again, putting him down for good. Good video. Typically I go for the high shoulder as well, but any of those good vital area hits work well.
I am one of the 8% guys , I have been hunting for over 50 years and the high shoulder shot is by far my preferred shot unless you like to practice your tracking skills. great video Jim.
Then you missed learning about how newer bullets can help prevent your deer from running so far. Even with your experience, there have been improvements. Double lung hits usually drop most deer within 30 - 50 yds. Mostly within sight or hearing of the hunter. I use a Winchester Classic Featherweight in 6.5X55 Swede. I did have a Douglas barrel installed. I prefer a Barnes 120 gr TTS. My load chronographs at 2780 fps. No magnums, no cannons. None have gone 30 yds. Always double lung at quiet deer
I enjoyed the follow up video, and I appreciate the feedback I received on the shot placement graph. I've had great results with the heart shot, and yes most of the time the deer will run about 15 to 20 yards before going down. Now I have a disability, and don't get around so well. If I get the opportunity to go hunting, I need the deer to drop where I shoot it. I plan to try the high shoulder next time my son in law and grandsons take me out hunting.
I agree position matters heavily on where you place a shot. Also ensuring you have the shot as well. I will be trying high shoulder this season on at least 1 deer and see the meat loss and damage difference. I hunt with a 308 so could be interesting.
i was taught to aim at that shoulder with the 270 and have put many down on the spot. As i got older, i started experimenting with aiming at vital organs and i have had similar experiences with the heart shots. They run a bit. I think if you have a fast gun with knock down, the shoulder is fine. A smaller caliber, not so much.
Shot choice should depend on game type, cartridge, distance, wind, etc. but I agree that the high shoulder shot usually anchors the animal in place which is especially valuable if hunting on public lands with other hunters nearby. I have seen animals tagged by the first hunter to find them whether or not they made the shot so dropping them in their tracks is a big plus.
I knew I recognized you. Watched a lot of your project 24 videos. Shot 3 this yr. Always aimed for heart shots. Usually high heart. Small doe heart shot dropped in spot Large doe, clipped top of hesr and lungs. Ran 20yrds crashed into tree. Spun around hit another tree and dropped. Medium size doe (I was 30" up a tree on a hill and deer in ravine) so I aimed higher lung. She ran her ass off. Hella blood trail (blood everywhere) say she ran a solid 150 to 200yrds. Was honestly shocked based on blood loss how far she made it.
For most of my hunting experience it just depends on the situations I generally use the double lung shot but have used the high shoulder. But it really depends on the bullet type. So it really comes down to the actual position of the deer and the distance and remaining calm and as my dad always preached to me was to bear down boy.
@@danielsooon8128that's my thinking as well, I use hand loaded speer gold dot 62g bonded soft points. Great for Texas deer and deadly on double lung and heart shots. But I'm not sure it make it through the bone to hit the spine. I do know a few that neck shoot for the spine for fast drops but they're really good shooters.
@danielsooon8128 I have killed deer with a 223, and yes, it's legal in Kentucky, and my late father did also. Shots were under 75 yards, and it worked. Now that said, my normal rifle is a 25/06 with Hornaday Whitetail 115 grain. I agree with your comment. I refrase my statement depends on the caliber and the situation for shot placement.
The center of the lungs is where I generally advise people to shoot because it gives you the greatest margin of error in all directions. I tell people to visualize a basketball inside the front of the Deers chest and aim at the center of that
A little over a week ago, I got a pronghorn at 296 yd (I estimated it to be 280). It was not quite full 1/4 to me, showing left flank with a 5mph wind almost directly from its rear toward the head. I went for a high shoulder, hitting about 1.5 inches low and left of my point of aim. I completely forgot to account for wind in my excitement. I ended up catching the top edge of the left lung, severed the aorta, destroyed the top forward third of the right lung. Entry cost me about 1 lb of left shoulder and the exit was about two ribs forward of the diaphragm. The heart was intact. I'm very glad I watched this video, since it reminded me not to automatically aim exactly where I'd programmed myself to see "the perfect aim point" on the hide, which would've earned me gut damage on my first hunt in 28 years. The animal definitely did not suffer a long death, as it landed in the deep hoof marks it made when impacted. Thanks for great content, Sir.
My son made a nice quartering away high shoulder shot at about 40 yards this year. 308 Barnes 150 copper at about 40 yards, dropped immediately. Took out a few ribs, pinched a hole through the opposite shoulder blade and was recovered!
I favor a neck shot just below the head. I was amazed there are so few of your viewers who commented on this method. Fifteen years ago, when I started hunting deer, a good friend who had been hunting at least 40 years told me the neck shot was the best. The deer will drop right where it was shot. It also does not ruin any valuable meat. My friend also told me he has hunted with all different calibers and preferred 30 caliber rifles as a minimum. There is a lot to be said about diameter. Consider being shot with a sewing needle traveling at 10,000 ft per second, or a bowling ball traveling at 200 feet a second. Where I hunt, the brush is dense. If a deer runs 5 yards, it is likely going to be in a blackberry thicket. The tree stand has a height of 20 ft. A few years ago, I shot a buck just below the head with an old 30-30, at a distance of 50 yards. It dropped as though the legs were cut off. The hydrostatic shock fractured the skull of the deer. There was no damage to any valuable meat.
Sometimes neck and head shots are not out of the question. I know many will disagree but it takes practice. And it is something I have worked on over the years. But my shout of choice is absolutely unequivocally the high shoulder shot. I stumbled on to it by a mistake one day and learned from there. Somehow I missed the distance of the deer and the shot was very high up in the shoulder and it dropped like a rock.
Agreed. My last deer was a neck shot just bellow the head. Taking out the spine drops them in there tracks. If or where you shoot really depends on the situation. Distance angle obstructions movement equipment competence and confidence.
I've grown up archery hunting with mechanical broadheads and I was always told to aim about an inch or two behind shoulder crease. if you hit the shoulder with a mechanical broadhead there is a high chance you won't get a good pass through and a poor blood trail. Since I practiced archery more than rifle I just always aimed there. When I got good confidence with my rifle I started only taking neck shots. Every time the deer dropped in its tracks and there was never fear of damaging meat or clipping guts. I only aim for the neck with a rifle and I only take the shot if its a doe or small buck.
High shoulder is always the fastest kill for me: so often its actually no steps. I usually hunt on top of the the hilliest nastiest rhododendron scrub in mtns of NC and its so hard to track down those hollers
Those guys shooting in the crease between the neck and the shoulder, those guys know what its all about. Been teaching it for years its instant lights out and it doesn't matter what caliber you use!
That was an awesome video on high shoulder shot. I want to try it but have never come across a good enough video explaining exactly where to shoot! Thanks so much!
I've always been a fan of the neck shot. I've taken quite a few deer and elk with it and found you either dispatch the animal very quickly or miss completely with only damaging neck meat.
I discovered early on when taking a heart shot it is important to be aware of the off side shoulder position. A pass through can often damage the off side shoulder if it's not out of the way.
I made my first intentional high should shot last season. Previously I always aimed for heart or lung. It was an Oklahoma 9 point buck standing broadside, 170 yards, using .308 150 grain Remington core lokt. The buck fell where he should and did not take even a half step. A very effective shot but when uncertain of the shot, I will always go for heart/lung. I say intentional because in past years I have sometimes hit deer and had the drop where they stood and in retrospect they high shoulder shots. I did not know about the mass of nerves in the high shoulder area.
Thank you for informing me about the high shoulder shot. I have just returned from a SC hunt and shot a nice 8-point buck at 110 yards and it dropped right where I shot him and he did not move an inch.
It depends on the bullet type. I would only take a high shoulder shot with a bonded or partition bullet. Only a traditional or heart shot with a cup and core. I have had cup and core fail on the high shoulder. I now only use a partition and bonded for hunting. That way I can choose between each shot that’s presented with confidence.
The shot depends on the bullet construction. IE a Barnes TTSX vs something like a Hornady SST. For the SST, you will grenade in the double lung shot. Where as with a tougher construction type of a bullet like a Barnes or etc, you'll want more resistance than a double lung.
While I certainly agree on larger and or tougher game like elk, I think you're fine with deer. I've killed quite a few with the double lung shot with 165 grain sst's from a .308 with complete pass through. Granted, that's not super fast, and I wouldn't use that in say a 300 magnum
@@calvinruggles732 Either way, I'd rather have a SST over a TTSX if I was only going for double lung shots on deer. For a high shoulder shot on a big mule deer, I'd prefer something like an accubond or TTSX.. depending on range and cartridge.
In addition to bullet construction the distance you expect to take deer also greatly depends on shot placement .while ttsx in standard cartriges isnt touted as a long range bullet and they dont expand below about 2100 fps or much past 300 yds say per example 180 grain in 06 Unless Hitting shoulder bone which causes expansion If I'm shooting deer or elk with an 06 much past 300 yds with an 06 om going with a bonded lead core jacketed high bc bullet like the 190 grain ABLR all the way Ttsx are great but at extended ranges you need to hit shoulder to initiate expansion if your bullets velocity is down to say 2100 fps or below whatever distance you're shooting
@jamiehurtt3530 again, with standard calibers and deer sized game, it's really not that critical. Magnum calibers/velocities, and elk sized game is where bullet selection and shot placement become critical
I use to hunt mostly public land and if it went very far someone else would shoot it I always went for shoulder shot. I always called it the pancake them shot they never took another step. But got sick of the mess that created and went to the lung shot still my 6.5prc OK got last year (love that cartridge) pancake the one buck of the two I hit in the classic lung shot. I have hit a bunch in the lungs with my 7mm08 that just dropped in there tracks my favorite deer cartridge. Darren
I'll take K10 for the venison, Alex. Deer appears to be angled a bit away, if it was broadside J10. I still have a tag left and I may try a high-shoulder shot just to see. J10 (double lung just below centerline) worked with deer #1this morning. Did not collapse but it was an easy blood trail and very little meat damage. I'm a bowhunter as well and double-lung with bloodtrail is SOP. I hunt for meat so that is a consideration. Shoulders = roasts. Ribs are ground burger or stew meat (or spedies in this region . .. a regional marinated treat).
I always tell myself to go for the shoulder shot (I going to include the high part from now on). But I often take the double long shot reflexively because I only have a moment to take the shot. Here where I hunt in Georgia the deer are usually 20 to 40 yards and are often about to spot me as I try to take aim. But I hate taking the lung shot because of how often I have to look for it in thick cover. The high shoulder have much easier. I have to train myself to do without having to think about it. Or better yet no even take the shot if I don't have time to take a more careful shot. It's not like I'm going to die of hunger if I don't get the deer.
True I high shoulder shot will anchor the deer if you are steady enough to do that. With the heart lung shot you have a bigger target and a good shot hear with kill the deer, you may have to track 50 - 100 yards, however you don’t ruin any meat!
30 years ago, I accidentally hit a high shoulder shot, it looked like the deer was electrocuted, at the time there was no internet to find opinions on it. Over the years I take it when I can on deer, elk, caribou, etc. and coupled with the Berger hybrid it is devastating and has never failed. I have found it harder to find on a bear, so I just shoot for the middle. Great video thanks.
I typically do a shot about where you listed the heart shot to be. If deer “drop” when the shot goes off, I get the traditional “double lung” hit. If it doesn’t do anything weird, it’s a heart shot. The last 2 years I’ve shot 8 point bucks with a .270 Winchester using 130gr Winchester deer season ammo, and both of them dropped where they were standing. My son put a 160gr Hornady LeverEvolution round from my Marlin 30-30 right behind the shoulder of a 140lb (skinned and cleaned) doe at 135 yards and had a clean pass through and like you said- she bolted about 30 yards and fell dead just off the edge of the field she came out in. Your high shoulder shot footage is definitely impressive, but I do t like to play around with what’s working for me when it’s on a living animal. It’s tempting to try, but I’m a creature of habit. 😂 Thanks for the videos, I love your content!
It also depends on the ammo you use as well. I use a lead hollow point with a polymer coating. I have dropped 3 of my biggest deer with a heart shot. Surprisingly, some of the smaller deer have run, but none past 30 yards. The only issue I take with the high shoulder shot is that the reason why they just drop straight legged is because they are paralyzed. They do die shortly after, but I don't personally see that as an ethical choice. (We are all entitled to our own opinions, so I don't want to hear about it!) Higher caliber rifle ammo with a spear tip, even a hollow point, I have had pass through the deer and they run for a long time. I think that is what you have experienced too. So, to be fair in a choice of shot placement, I think that caliber and ammo types should be included in the decision. That's my humble opinion.
I always go for high shoulder if i don't want to track. Being close to a property line, or keeping the deer from running into thick cover, shoulder is just a better shot to knock them down.
My only problem with this video is that you have proper guns, sighted and tested. You are pretty good shot and you're training all the time. 98% of your viewers are not and they shouldn't be encouraged to take risky shot that you have 2" margin on elevation with gore consequences if missed. I've seen spine shots gone wrong and hunters emptying 5 additional shots into a kicking and screaming animal and fail to finish it. Lung and heart shot carries a lot less risk and pretty much the same result. I do heart only for the last few years, most of the time they don't even know what happened, they just take a few steps and fall.
The no track drt.. back of front leg up just where front shoulder moves and down from back bone small caliber bullet 115 to no more than 130 bullet size is important that all it takes field dress withing five minutes a must if not meat will be a bloody mess u will see the difference when cooking safe hunting be blessed
I showed this to my wife (fist time hunting last fall), she took a 6 point with a 6.5 Creedmoor at appx. 60 yards with this shot, I was at the other end of the field (430yds appx) watching with binoculars, perfect 'freeze and drop' shot. I took a doe near the same spot with the high shoulder shot, and I had to do a 'quartering towards me' shot with a 6.5 Grendel on another doe - she went about 18 yards, both lungs were taken out, I aimed slightly to the right of the 'v' graphic in the video near the end.
Ive been using the high shoulder method for years, and i can unequivocally say that if you like to watch them fall in the scope, its the ticket. I have had some meat damage in the past, but it was mostly when i was still shooting lead bullets. Since I've switched to copper, it's just not much of an issue. Shoot light for caliber bullets and push them as hard as your rifle will allow while maintaining good accuracy. 3000 fps is the floor for me, and theres not a ceiling. As a side note, if you can catch a deer with its head down, the high shoulder shot is even more devastating.
@Dusdaddy Yup, I shoot that same load in my 308. Fill it up to the neck with Win 748 and I'm getting just over 3100 fps in my 20" R700. Whitetails hate it.
When you showed the picture of where not to aim, I've always been told that a headshot on a deer is likely an unethical one, because the brain is quite small and encased in a lot of differently angled bones. This leads to some shots being "dead on" but being a little off means the bullet can travel through skull/face and exit without hitting spinal column or brain, leaving a very wounded deer to suffer.
Sounds great for long gun hunting, I always end up drawing archery ( when I do draw out) and getting the hunters choice archery elk every year. I'm not so sure an arrow through the scapula is such a good idea.
Last two deer I shot were in between heart and double lung. Neither ran more than 20-25 yards from where they were standing when shot. The buck landed a little bit higher as the blood from the wound showed that it had hit the lungs. The doe was a bit lower, and with the angle of the shot due to it being very close range, completely destroyed the destroyed the bones on the opposite side, so it didn't really sprint, per se. Both deer where shot with handloaded 30-06 with Hornady 165 grain Interlock boattail soft points. All of that is to say that the heart shot definitely has that high likelihood of the deer running a short distance, but that reaction is definitely due to sudden adrenaline rush as once the deer lost sufficient blood and lost the adrenaline rush, they drop pretty much instantly.
I hunt with a 7 Rem Mag, and I generally have gone for the shoulder. Not high shoulder, but just to the heart. It does ruin the meat in that shoulder, but I never have them run where I might not find them. The shoulder shot generally makes them fall in their tracks, or they only make it that one step the their shoulder destroyed. Since there are so many arteries and veins going through there, they bleed out quickly. I think just the shock of the bullet hitting them there still does a whole lot of damage to the heart, as the bone fragments get into from the blast.
I hunted for 50 years. 30 deer later I’ve had 3 standing still. Mine are usually on the run in Northern Canada on public/crown land. When there full speed I shoot for the front end, plenty have been hit further back into both lungs, they have run 60-200 yards. Not much meat damage.
A friend of mine I have known most of my life, a country boy, always goes for a neck shot. He says it always brings them down on the spot. (he has always hunted with a 30-06.
I watched my buddy shoot a doe in the spine right where the neck and her shoulder met and she didn’t even take one step, just fell right over. I shot one that same weekend in the heart and it ran straight into a creek. I had never even considered shooting a deer anywhere other than heart/lungs until I saw him do that.
It depends on how fast the deer is moving to whether I use a spine or kidney shot. There are major veins in the back strap. I think I have killed less than 10 with a chest, head, or kidney shot and more than 50 with a spine shot. The funniest shot entered near the butt hole and stopped in the heart. He never saw it coming! Most people have no clue how dangerous a kidney shot is! Which means most people don't much about the subject.
I would recommend you watch some ranch fairy videos. Yes I know he is talking about bow hunting but I personally try to hit heart and lung. 2 reasons. 1 it’s a fast kill 2 it’s lower on the body so they bleed out a lot faster. I have taken high shoulder and I have spined a deer before. The last deer I shot was a spine shoot from 350 yards and dropped her
A big consideration is 'what am I armed with'. It makes a difference if the deer is likely to drop several inches before an arrow arrives.also,whether or not the projectile hitting the animal is delivering enough energy to penetrate solid bone and cause shock, or is relying on blood loss to kill the animal. All of these factors and more play a part in your shot placement decision.
I like the high shoulder shot, not sure if I've mentioned on your channel. But one must be conscious about a non-broadside shot, and keep in mind of where the exit wound will occur...
I personally like a double lung shot in the triangle formed by the Deers leg bones. The reason is that there is zero loss of meat. they will run however and in cases where you cannot afford to have them run it makes sense to use something like a high shoulder or base of neck shot that will crumple the deer immediately. There will be some loss of meat but it helps ensure that you get the deer at all
Bullet construction makes a big difference. I anchored a buck last year with a double lung shot with my 350 legend, using winchester polymer tips. It sat him right down in his tracks.
It happens. Just not as certain as having the cavitation right next to the spine to cut the marionette strings. If they drop, great. No meat loss. We're going to lose some if we go for the shoulder
Heart shot behind the shoulder or neck/spine shot with light bullet .22 centerfire rifles like .223s and .22-250s. I stay away from the shoulder and lungs if possible. Lungs take longer to drop the deer and shoulder bone deflection is not a pretty thing when it happens. I am not a fan of having to track down a wounded deer if I don't have to. So a shoulder shot may be a good option for larger bullets but maybe not so much for lighter bullets. That is not to say a light bullet on a shoulder won't do the job because it will but the odds of bone deflection are a concern. Your level of confidence in your shot and shooting skills will dictate what shot or even if the shot should be taken. Many times we are not give the perfect shot as deer will be behind concealment or cover or even on the move/run. So we either take the shot we are given or we don't take the shot.
I have shot 2 deer so far (1 each year of 2 years hunting). I also took my son out hunting last year and he harvested. We all used the traditional aim point. All three deer ended up with heart shots. His was a perfect broadside, head up, at 60 yards. The hind quarter twitched and the deer fell over. Mine was a perfect broadside, head up, at 90 yards. He mule kicked, walked 20 feet and lay down. The last one was a perfect broadside, head down, at 25 yards. She took off running for 40 yards and piled up. All were shot with the same Savage Axis .308 with Federal 180gr soft points.
An issue with the high shoulder is that when you are a little to high but still below the spine. The deer drops like a rock and then gets up and runs off. Your above the lungs and when they recover from the shock they can take off. I don't think your far off though. I would go a little lower. Most guys can't actually hit the heart and there is to much room for error.
Unless it’s a big ole buck that I want mounted I typically take a head shot. Drops them in their tracks and they literally die instantly which I prefer and their is zero damaged meat. If it’s a big buck I may want mounted I’ll usually take that traditional shot and it’s about 50/50 in my experience if they run 20-30 yards or drop on their tracks. Either is not a problem for me usually situation dependent of course.
I will shoot double lung if the deer is in open ground with plenty of light but will switch to high shoulder if light is fading fast or the deer is near a wood or boundary. 👍 I’m in the uk and generally shoot smaller blocks of land so dead deer jumping fences is not ideal!
It makes 100% sense most American shot placement shows a lot of lung to the back of the deer the ranch fair shows a shot placement diagram more in line with the South African game animals
I use a 300PRC because it will anchor a deer no matter where I shoot it ... according to the internet. The last time I went hunting, I tried a high shoulder shot for the first time. DRT. If I have a shorter shot, I am shooting there. If not, double lung.
I like the high shoulder shot, when possible, but if the shot does not present itself, I take whatever shot is available to bring home the meat. I have shot them high shoulder, lungs, heart, neck, head and the Texas heart shot. Depends on what O am hunting with and the shot available. The heart shot is my least favorite due to how far they can run after a heart shot.
Having shot many deer the most memorable was my first. Hit high on the spine, the moment I pulled the trigger I saw hooves straight in the air through the scope. Shooting vitals is fine but you might have to look (not always) for a couple hundred yards. Same thing happened pistol 44 mag. Sniffing ground 30 feet in front of me. Straight on neck shot in spine, no lost meat and dropped on the spot. He wasn't even gasping for air.
We have gone to the high shoulder now for the past 5 years. I WILL ONLY take a classic traditional shot if the shoulder is covered by brush. The shoulder shot ALWAYS puts them down right there.
I agree I have always put my shot high shoulder but if possible I always go toward the he’d a few inches. Mainly a neck shot an I have not had one one even take a step in 25 years. Not one out of atleast 30 deer. That’s just me.
My high shoulder aimpoint is horizontal crosshair even with butthole and vertical crosshair even with front leg on a full broadside. On quartering away you move vertical slightly back, on quarter to slightly ahead(like aiming for opposite shoulder. I use the bung level on hogs as well. I like using a bullet that will exit, but also expand. Most of my shots are 100 yards or less, but in thick stuff that you don't want to traipse, more likely crawl, through...DeadRightThere is the goal(StoppedRightThere is a good 2nd, with a quick finisher).
"Where to Shoot a Deer with a rifle."
If I see a deer with a rifle, I'm not shooting, I'm running!
Top of the heart for the win. Very good results for my 46 years shooting them.
The kick and jump and run off somewhere, don't they?
Very good information. It would be great if you could talk more about what you mean by very little meat loss with a high shoulder shot. That high shoulder is one of my favorite cuts on the front half of a deer. Maybe make a video butchering a shoulder shot deer to demonstrate meat loss?
Agreed.
Thanks for another interesting video. I have always gone for the "boiler room" shot, aiming about 1/3 up the chest along the back edge of the front leg. My goal is to take out the lungs and hopefully also get the top of the heart. This is a forgiving shot that allows for deer movement and a less than perfect shot. I use Nosler BT ammo, which makes a small hole going in and a big hole coming out and the deer rarely moves more than 50 yards after the shot.
Thats not “boiler room”. That would be a headshot
My last deer taken was at 98 yards with a single broadside traditional double lung shoot between two trees using my 30-06 rifle. The deer ran about 25-30 yards straight ahead and died. Massive blood trail to follow and an easy find in the fall leaves. Inside 100 yards I may start trying the high shoulder. Beyond that I'll probably stick to double lung to give more room for error.
What rifle were you using
Double lung shot is traditional because it has worked, still works, and will continue to work (kinda like the good ole 30.06) no matter what you are shooting. Within reason of course. Bigger margin for error as well. I’m picking double lung every time.
And if that high shoulder shot does “stun” it and it gets back up, guaranteed a deer isn’t getting up from a double lung shot.
There is no animal that can survive a hole through its lungs. That trapper in AK that used a 220 swift to kill grizzlies shot out their lungs. I recall seeing a poacher kill a bull moose with a .50 cal pump air rifle and shot it in the lung.
Tried and true, you let the air outa them with a double lung shot and they don't go far!
06 fan too.
You’re right. The key is to stop oxygenated blood from reaching the brain. That big hole through the lungs interrupts that blood flow. Even if the heart is still beating it is pumping blood into the “boiler room”. The brain shuts down in the matter of 1 - 2 minutes. After that, it doesn’t go anywhere. Besides, the only way to truly bleed out your deer is to shoot it through the lungs. You want the heart to pump all of that blood out of the muscles. Old butchers don’t destroy the heart first, they stun or destroy the brain, they cut the carotid artery and let the animal bleed. Generations of old hunters used to cut the throat of their dead deer which accomplished absolutely nothing but to ruin good neck roasts. If the heart is destroyed, the deer can’t be bled. That’s why I won’t take a heart shot.
"it has worked, still works, and will continue to work"
What do you mean, it works?
If by "works" meaning, it kicks up its hind legs, runs off into the wilderness/woods/grassland somewhere leading to a trailing expedition and all the stories behind that (from minutes to days, to never finding it)?
Why not just drop it where it stands and be done with it?
Tradition is blind.
Blasting mass hydraulic shock (that destroys tissues, busts, bones, turns stuff into jelly) ON....or NEAR the spinal chord isn't going to "stun" them.
Ever set a soup can on top of a 2x4 and shot the can, completely blasting that 2x4 into pieces from the hydraulic shock? Pretty "stunning."
Tried this high shoulder shot yesterday. Worked amazingly well. 100% lights out, not a twitch. Upon processing, we found about 3 inches of the spine was absolutely mangled on the bottom. No waste on the forelegs. I'm sold on the high shoulder shot. Great info, thanks for sharing.
First deer of the year this weekend. 60 yards away slightly quartering high angle (i was 35 foot up on top of a cliff) small deer still walking in a shallow river. Traditional double lung slightly high posterior through liw anterior behind the opposite shoulder with 45-70. Massive blood loss, went 25 yards tops and frankly I was impressed he made it that far. No meat ruined just ribs, which was my intention.
Older solo hunter here and for my entire life been using traditional double lung shot. Rifle, Muzzleloader and Archery. Living in FL with brush growing 7x24 and swamps. Will try this high shoulder shot. Gets tiring tracking thru chest high brush. Running .270 Win with 140 gr. Nosler reload. Looking fwd to results from end of yr survey.
Excellent video!
I would like to add another shot placement, which is the high-lung shot. It's just a bit behind and below the high-shoulder shot. It drops game in their tracks, loses very little meat, and offers good margin for error. I have shot many "lights-out" animals with this shot!
Risky and very frustrating shot if loss happens. The gap between top of lung & spine is not fatal, they can leap back to life & gone. Mostly big ones (150kg liveweight up), but worth knowing the risk.
Your video address hunting deer, therefore I think it is a very fair and reliable presentation.
You make a good point on knowing anatomy, there are many, many, many blue wildebeest and gemsbuck (oryx) to name just two who are running around with scars on them attesting to failed attempts on high shoulder shots. The high shoulder shot has very little room for error and mostly leads to hitting the spinal processes, and only knocking them out temporarily.
I’m glad to see another hunter that prefers the high shoulder shots
Opening day for gun season was this past Saturday in Missouri. I hunted with my two friends and we had all watched this video. We all shot a deer on Saturday and we all used the high shoulder shot. All three deer went down immediately and all of us were impressed. Thanks for sharing your experience. We are all impressed and will continue to aim for the shoulder.
Awesome! More shot placement videos please. Like cover other scenarios and angles.
Agreed. Also, covering more species would be helpful.
Curious why you shot that doe with a fawn in tow?
Hi Jim! Am glad that you included that last little cautionary note at the end of your video - mentioning the possibility of hitting too high and just stunning the deer. I've seen this happen - when my hunting partner's buck dropped instantly I told him to chamber another round and get ready. Good thing he did! Buck got up, and got shot again, putting him down for good. Good video. Typically I go for the high shoulder as well, but any of those good vital area hits work well.
I am one of the 8% guys , I have been hunting for over 50 years and the high shoulder shot is by far my preferred shot unless you like to practice your tracking skills. great video Jim.
Can a 222 Remington do the job when shot there
I've never double lunged a deer and it go more than 50 yards. No tracking involved I think with your full of shit or possibly a shitty shot
Then you missed learning about how newer bullets can help prevent your deer from running so far. Even with your experience, there have been improvements. Double lung hits usually drop most deer within 30 - 50 yds. Mostly within sight or hearing of the hunter. I use a Winchester Classic Featherweight in 6.5X55 Swede. I did have a Douglas barrel installed. I prefer a Barnes 120 gr TTS. My load chronographs at 2780 fps. No magnums, no cannons. None have gone 30 yds. Always double lung at quiet deer
@@johnstruewing1164 yes! I have read articles stating that the 6.5 x 55 mm swede takes down moose in Scandinavia!!
@@johnstruewing1164 I have read that in Scandinavia they use a swedish Mauser { 6.5 x 55} on Moose .
I enjoyed the follow up video, and I appreciate the feedback I received on the shot placement graph. I've had great results with the heart shot, and yes most of the time the deer will run about 15 to 20 yards before going down. Now I have a disability, and don't get around so well. If I get the opportunity to go hunting, I need the deer to drop where I shoot it. I plan to try the high shoulder next time my son in law and grandsons take me out hunting.
My first deer was taken with a british.303 Enfield mk 3 with a weaver scope using Remington ammo
You have a good son in law apparently.
The best
I agree position matters heavily on where you place a shot. Also ensuring you have the shot as well. I will be trying high shoulder this season on at least 1 deer and see the meat loss and damage difference. I hunt with a 308 so could be interesting.
i was taught to aim at that shoulder with the 270 and have put many down on the spot. As i got older, i started experimenting with aiming at vital organs and i have had similar experiences with the heart shots. They run a bit. I think if you have a fast gun with knock down, the shoulder is fine. A smaller caliber, not so much.
Shot choice should depend on game type, cartridge, distance, wind, etc. but I agree that the high shoulder shot usually anchors the animal in place which is especially valuable if hunting on public lands with other hunters nearby. I have seen animals tagged by the first hunter to find them whether or not they made the shot so dropping them in their tracks is a big plus.
I knew I recognized you. Watched a lot of your project 24 videos.
Shot 3 this yr. Always aimed for heart shots. Usually high heart.
Small doe heart shot dropped in spot
Large doe, clipped top of hesr and lungs. Ran 20yrds crashed into tree. Spun around hit another tree and dropped.
Medium size doe (I was 30" up a tree on a hill and deer in ravine) so I aimed higher lung. She ran her ass off. Hella blood trail (blood everywhere) say she ran a solid 150 to 200yrds. Was honestly shocked based on blood loss how far she made it.
For most of my hunting experience it just depends on the situations I generally use the double lung shot but have used the high shoulder. But it really depends on the bullet type. So it really comes down to the actual position of the deer and the distance and remaining calm and as my dad always preached to me was to bear down boy.
If you are hunting with 223, almost certainly better to go for a lung shot right? Need a bigger caliber for shoulder shot I’d figure?
@@danielsooon8128that's my thinking as well, I use hand loaded speer gold dot 62g bonded soft points. Great for Texas deer and deadly on double lung and heart shots. But I'm not sure it make it through the bone to hit the spine. I do know a few that neck shoot for the spine for fast drops but they're really good shooters.
@danielsooon8128 I have killed deer with a 223, and yes, it's legal in Kentucky, and my late father did also. Shots were under 75 yards, and it worked. Now that said, my normal rifle is a 25/06 with Hornaday Whitetail 115 grain. I agree with your comment. I refrase my statement depends on the caliber and the situation for shot placement.
The center of the lungs is where I generally advise people to shoot because it gives you the greatest margin of error in all directions.
I tell people to visualize a basketball inside the front of the Deers chest and aim at the center of that
Excellent way to help new hunters visualize the kill zone!
A little over a week ago, I got a pronghorn at 296 yd (I estimated it to be 280). It was not quite full 1/4 to me, showing left flank with a 5mph wind almost directly from its rear toward the head. I went for a high shoulder, hitting about 1.5 inches low and left of my point of aim. I completely forgot to account for wind in my excitement. I ended up catching the top edge of the left lung, severed the aorta, destroyed the top forward third of the right lung. Entry cost me about 1 lb of left shoulder and the exit was about two ribs forward of the diaphragm. The heart was intact. I'm very glad I watched this video, since it reminded me not to automatically aim exactly where I'd programmed myself to see "the perfect aim point" on the hide, which would've earned me gut damage on my first hunt in 28 years. The animal definitely did not suffer a long death, as it landed in the deep hoof marks it made when impacted. Thanks for great content, Sir.
I’ve changed to high shoulder shot and did so 30 years ago. Down right there.
My son made a nice quartering away high shoulder shot at about 40 yards this year. 308 Barnes 150 copper at about 40 yards, dropped immediately. Took out a few ribs, pinched a hole through the opposite shoulder blade and was recovered!
I favor a neck shot just below the head. I was amazed there are so few of your viewers who commented on this method. Fifteen years ago, when I started hunting deer, a good friend who had been hunting at least 40 years told me the neck shot was the best. The deer will drop right where it was shot. It also does not ruin any valuable meat. My friend also told me he has hunted with all different calibers and preferred 30 caliber rifles as a minimum. There is a lot to be said about diameter. Consider being shot with a sewing needle traveling at 10,000 ft per second, or a bowling ball traveling at 200 feet a second. Where I hunt, the brush is dense. If a deer runs 5 yards, it is likely going to be in a blackberry thicket. The tree stand has a height of 20 ft. A few years ago, I shot a buck just below the head with an old 30-30, at a distance of 50 yards. It dropped as though the legs were cut off. The hydrostatic shock fractured the skull of the deer. There was no damage to any valuable meat.
Sometimes neck and head shots are not out of the question. I know many will disagree but it takes practice. And it is something I have worked on over the years. But my shout of choice is absolutely unequivocally the high shoulder shot. I stumbled on to it by a mistake one day and learned from there. Somehow I missed the distance of the deer and the shot was very high up in the shoulder and it dropped like a rock.
Agreed. My last deer was a neck shot just bellow the head. Taking out the spine drops them in there tracks.
If or where you shoot really depends on the situation. Distance angle obstructions movement equipment competence and confidence.
My man knows how to make a good video. States the question and answer in first minute and great timing of the video
I've grown up archery hunting with mechanical broadheads and I was always told to aim about an inch or two behind shoulder crease. if you hit the shoulder with a mechanical broadhead there is a high chance you won't get a good pass through and a poor blood trail. Since I practiced archery more than rifle I just always aimed there. When I got good confidence with my rifle I started only taking neck shots. Every time the deer dropped in its tracks and there was never fear of damaging meat or clipping guts. I only aim for the neck with a rifle and I only take the shot if its a doe or small buck.
High shoulder is always the fastest kill for me: so often its actually no steps. I usually hunt on top of the the hilliest nastiest rhododendron scrub in mtns of NC and its so hard to track down those hollers
Those guys shooting in the crease between the neck and the shoulder, those guys know what its all about. Been teaching it for years its instant lights out and it doesn't matter what caliber you use!
I use the high shoulder shot and as you demonstrated it's instantly lights out.
Tried a high shoulder this year for the hell of it. It really does anchor them.
That was an awesome video on high shoulder shot. I want to try it but have never come across a good enough video explaining exactly where to shoot! Thanks so much!
I shot cow elk & a whitetail buck both with high shoulder shots. Both didn't even take a step. Down and out.
I've always been a fan of the neck shot. I've taken quite a few deer and elk with it and found you either dispatch the animal very quickly or miss completely with only damaging neck meat.
I discovered early on when taking a heart shot it is important to be aware of the off side shoulder position. A pass through can often damage the off side shoulder if it's not out of the way.
I made my first intentional high should shot last season. Previously I always aimed for heart or lung. It was an Oklahoma 9 point buck standing broadside, 170 yards, using .308 150 grain Remington core lokt. The buck fell where he should and did not take even a half step. A very effective shot but when uncertain of the shot, I will always go for heart/lung. I say intentional because in past years I have sometimes hit deer and had the drop where they stood and in retrospect they high shoulder shots. I did not know about the mass of nerves in the high shoulder area.
Thank you for informing me about the high shoulder shot. I have just returned from a SC hunt and shot a nice 8-point buck at 110 yards and it dropped right where I shot him and he did not move an inch.
Fantastic!!! So glad to hear that.
It depends on the bullet type.
I would only take a high shoulder shot with a bonded or partition bullet.
Only a traditional or heart shot with a cup and core.
I have had cup and core fail on the high shoulder.
I now only use a partition and bonded for hunting.
That way I can choose between each shot that’s presented with confidence.
The shot depends on the bullet construction. IE a Barnes TTSX vs something like a Hornady SST. For the SST, you will grenade in the double lung shot. Where as with a tougher construction type of a bullet like a Barnes or etc, you'll want more resistance than a double lung.
L take
While I certainly agree on larger and or tougher game like elk, I think you're fine with deer. I've killed quite a few with the double lung shot with 165 grain sst's from a .308 with complete pass through. Granted, that's not super fast, and I wouldn't use that in say a 300 magnum
@@calvinruggles732 Either way, I'd rather have a SST over a TTSX if I was only going for double lung shots on deer. For a high shoulder shot on a big mule deer, I'd prefer something like an accubond or TTSX.. depending on range and cartridge.
In addition to bullet construction the distance you expect to take deer also greatly depends on shot placement .while ttsx in standard cartriges isnt touted as a long range bullet and they dont expand below about 2100 fps or much past 300 yds say per example 180 grain in 06
Unless Hitting shoulder bone which causes expansion
If I'm shooting deer or elk with an 06 much past 300 yds with an 06 om going with a bonded lead core jacketed high bc bullet like the 190 grain ABLR all the way
Ttsx are great but at extended ranges you need to hit shoulder to initiate expansion if your bullets velocity is down to say 2100 fps or below whatever distance you're shooting
@jamiehurtt3530 again, with standard calibers and deer sized game, it's really not that critical. Magnum calibers/velocities, and elk sized game is where bullet selection and shot placement become critical
I’m a big fan as of late to shooting them right below/behind the ear
I use to hunt mostly public land and if it went very far someone else would shoot it I always went for shoulder shot. I always called it the pancake them shot they never took another step. But got sick of the mess that created and went to the lung shot still my 6.5prc OK got last year (love that cartridge) pancake the one buck of the two I hit in the classic lung shot. I have hit a bunch in the lungs with my 7mm08 that just dropped in there tracks my favorite deer cartridge. Darren
I'll take K10 for the venison, Alex. Deer appears to be angled a bit away, if it was broadside J10. I still have a tag left and I may try a high-shoulder shot just to see. J10 (double lung just below centerline) worked with deer #1this morning. Did not collapse but it was an easy blood trail and very little meat damage. I'm a bowhunter as well and double-lung with bloodtrail is SOP. I hunt for meat so that is a consideration. Shoulders = roasts. Ribs are ground burger or stew meat (or spedies in this region . .. a regional marinated treat).
With the classic double lung shot. From an elevated stand. Often the heart is hit in the process.
Ok, I will try it this weekend during modern gun season, I might even try it muzzle loading season if it works out.
I always tell myself to go for the shoulder shot (I going to include the high part from now on). But I often take the double long shot reflexively because I only have a moment to take the shot. Here where I hunt in Georgia the deer are usually 20 to 40 yards and are often about to spot me as I try to take aim. But I hate taking the lung shot because of how often I have to look for it in thick cover. The high shoulder have much easier. I have to train myself to do without having to think about it. Or better yet no even take the shot if I don't have time to take a more careful shot. It's not like I'm going to die of hunger if I don't get the deer.
True I high shoulder shot will anchor the deer if you are steady enough to do that. With the heart lung shot you have a bigger target and a good shot hear with kill the deer, you may have to track 50 - 100 yards, however you don’t ruin any meat!
Super excited for this season. This video just encouraged me to finally try the shoulder shot. Been double lunging for 26 years
30 years ago, I accidentally hit a high shoulder shot, it looked like the deer was electrocuted, at the time there was no internet to find opinions on it. Over the years I take it when I can on deer, elk, caribou, etc. and coupled with the Berger hybrid it is devastating and has never failed. I have found it harder to find on a bear, so I just shoot for the middle. Great video thanks.
Something also to consider is the bullet construction
I typically do a shot about where you listed the heart shot to be. If deer “drop” when the shot goes off, I get the traditional “double lung” hit. If it doesn’t do anything weird, it’s a heart shot. The last 2 years I’ve shot 8 point bucks with a .270 Winchester using 130gr Winchester deer season ammo, and both of them dropped where they were standing.
My son put a 160gr Hornady LeverEvolution round from my Marlin 30-30 right behind the shoulder of a 140lb (skinned and cleaned) doe at 135 yards and had a clean pass through and like you said- she bolted about 30 yards and fell dead just off the edge of the field she came out in. Your high shoulder shot footage is definitely impressive, but I do t like to play around with what’s working for me when it’s on a living animal. It’s tempting to try, but I’m a creature of habit. 😂 Thanks for the videos, I love your content!
Deer are quick but can't "drop" at the sound of the shot because the bullet gets there before the sound does. With a bow it's a different story.
Good stuff Jim, I listened to the podcast with John McAdam when he interviewed you, I enjoyed it.
Wonder what you think about the texas heart shot?
😂
It also depends on the ammo you use as well. I use a lead hollow point with a polymer coating. I have dropped 3 of my biggest deer with a heart shot. Surprisingly, some of the smaller deer have run, but none past 30 yards. The only issue I take with the high shoulder shot is that the reason why they just drop straight legged is because they are paralyzed. They do die shortly after, but I don't personally see that as an ethical choice. (We are all entitled to our own opinions, so I don't want to hear about it!) Higher caliber rifle ammo with a spear tip, even a hollow point, I have had pass through the deer and they run for a long time. I think that is what you have experienced too. So, to be fair in a choice of shot placement, I think that caliber and ammo types should be included in the decision. That's my humble opinion.
I always go for high shoulder if i don't want to track. Being close to a property line, or keeping the deer from running into thick cover, shoulder is just a better shot to knock them down.
I shoot a 30 30 after hunting many years with a bow , high shoulder shot is lights out! Every time !
My only problem with this video is that you have proper guns, sighted and tested. You are pretty good shot and you're training all the time. 98% of your viewers are not and they shouldn't be encouraged to take risky shot that you have 2" margin on elevation with gore consequences if missed. I've seen spine shots gone wrong and hunters emptying 5 additional shots into a kicking and screaming animal and fail to finish it. Lung and heart shot carries a lot less risk and pretty much the same result. I do heart only for the last few years, most of the time they don't even know what happened, they just take a few steps and fall.
The no track drt.. back of front leg up just where front shoulder moves and down from back bone small caliber bullet 115 to no more than 130 bullet size is important that all it takes field dress withing five minutes a must if not meat will be a bloody mess u will see the difference when cooking safe hunting be blessed
I showed this to my wife (fist time hunting last fall), she took a 6 point with a 6.5 Creedmoor at appx. 60 yards with this shot, I was at the other end of the field (430yds appx) watching with binoculars, perfect 'freeze and drop' shot. I took a doe near the same spot with the high shoulder shot, and I had to do a 'quartering towards me' shot with a 6.5 Grendel on another doe - she went about 18 yards, both lungs were taken out, I aimed slightly to the right of the 'v' graphic in the video near the end.
Ive been using the high shoulder method for years, and i can unequivocally say that if you like to watch them fall in the scope, its the ticket. I have had some meat damage in the past, but it was mostly when i was still shooting lead bullets. Since I've switched to copper, it's just not much of an issue. Shoot light for caliber bullets and push them as hard as your rifle will allow while maintaining good accuracy. 3000 fps is the floor for me, and theres not a ceiling. As a side note, if you can catch a deer with its head down, the high shoulder shot is even more devastating.
Couldn't agree more. I'm shooting 130 grain Barnes in my .308, light and very fast.
@Dusdaddy Yup, I shoot that same load in my 308. Fill it up to the neck with Win 748 and I'm getting just over 3100 fps in my 20" R700. Whitetails hate it.
When you showed the picture of where not to aim, I've always been told that a headshot on a deer is likely an unethical one, because the brain is quite small and encased in a lot of differently angled bones. This leads to some shots being "dead on" but being a little off means the bullet can travel through skull/face and exit without hitting spinal column or brain, leaving a very wounded deer to suffer.
My last 3 deer I dropped with a head shot. Lights out and dropped in their tracks. Zero meat loss. Very ethical. More ethical than any other shot.
Sounds great for long gun hunting, I always end up drawing archery ( when I do draw out) and getting the hunters choice archery elk every year. I'm not so sure an arrow through the scapula is such a good idea.
Last two deer I shot were in between heart and double lung. Neither ran more than 20-25 yards from where they were standing when shot. The buck landed a little bit higher as the blood from the wound showed that it had hit the lungs. The doe was a bit lower, and with the angle of the shot due to it being very close range, completely destroyed the destroyed the bones on the opposite side, so it didn't really sprint, per se. Both deer where shot with handloaded 30-06 with Hornady 165 grain Interlock boattail soft points.
All of that is to say that the heart shot definitely has that high likelihood of the deer running a short distance, but that reaction is definitely due to sudden adrenaline rush as once the deer lost sufficient blood and lost the adrenaline rush, they drop pretty much instantly.
I hunt with a 7 Rem Mag, and I generally have gone for the shoulder. Not high shoulder, but just to the heart. It does ruin the meat in that shoulder, but I never have them run where I might not find them. The shoulder shot generally makes them fall in their tracks, or they only make it that one step the their shoulder destroyed. Since there are so many arteries and veins going through there, they bleed out quickly. I think just the shock of the bullet hitting them there still does a whole lot of damage to the heart, as the bone fragments get into from the blast.
High shoulder spine shot with a .308 solid copper expansion bullets but a .556 head shot is good also
I always shoot high shoulder ... I have never had a deer even take a step, 30 years now! They Drop like a rock!
I like the high shoulder either side
I’ve shot a few directly in the heart, most have ran 50-75 yards painting the ground red.
Been thinking about this. Going to try the high shoulder. It also takes Dow the nervous system to the entire body.
I love the high shoulder shot with a rifle. No tracking necessary. 😊
Great video Jim. I vaguely remember Jack O’Connor writing about how a high shoulder shot would just drop game.
I hunted for 50 years. 30 deer later I’ve had 3 standing still. Mine are usually on the run in Northern Canada on public/crown land. When there full speed I shoot for the front end, plenty have been hit further back into both lungs, they have run 60-200 yards. Not much meat damage.
A friend of mine I have known most of my life, a country boy, always goes for a neck shot. He says it always brings them down on the spot. (he has always hunted with a 30-06.
I watched my buddy shoot a doe in the spine right where the neck and her shoulder met and she didn’t even take one step, just fell right over. I shot one that same weekend in the heart and it ran straight into a creek. I had never even considered shooting a deer anywhere other than heart/lungs until I saw him do that.
It depends on how fast the deer is moving to whether I use a spine or kidney shot. There are major veins in the back strap. I think I have killed less than 10 with a chest, head, or kidney shot and more than 50 with a spine shot. The funniest shot entered near the butt hole and stopped in the heart. He never saw it coming! Most people have no clue how dangerous a kidney shot is! Which means most people don't much about the subject.
I do neck shots. Lights out instantly, they drop in their tracks. No tracking, and you don't mess up any meat.
I would recommend you watch some ranch fairy videos. Yes I know he is talking about bow hunting but I personally try to hit heart and lung. 2 reasons. 1 it’s a fast kill 2 it’s lower on the body so they bleed out a lot faster. I have taken high shoulder and I have spined a deer before. The last deer I shot was a spine shoot from 350 yards and dropped her
I took a buck with a low front right shoulder shot this season. Instant drop . Hit the heart directly
A big consideration is 'what am I armed with'. It makes a difference if the deer is likely to drop several inches before an arrow arrives.also,whether or not the projectile hitting the animal is delivering enough energy to penetrate solid bone and cause shock, or is relying on blood loss to kill the animal. All of these factors and more play a part in your shot placement decision.
I contend that all bow hunters should be required to have a good tracking dog. 😁
I like the high shoulder shot, not sure if I've mentioned on your channel. But one must be conscious about a non-broadside shot, and keep in mind of where the exit wound will occur...
I personally like a double lung shot in the triangle formed by the Deers leg bones. The reason is that there is zero loss of meat.
they will run however and in cases where you cannot afford to have them run it makes sense to use something like a high shoulder or base of neck shot that will crumple the deer immediately. There will be some loss of meat but it helps ensure that you get the deer at all
Bullet construction makes a big difference. I anchored a buck last year with a double lung shot with my 350 legend, using winchester polymer tips. It sat him right down in his tracks.
It happens. Just not as certain as having the cavitation right next to the spine to cut the marionette strings. If they drop, great. No meat loss. We're going to lose some if we go for the shoulder
Heart shot behind the shoulder or neck/spine shot with light bullet .22 centerfire rifles like .223s and .22-250s. I stay away from the shoulder and lungs if possible. Lungs take longer to drop the deer and shoulder bone deflection is not a pretty thing when it happens. I am not a fan of having to track down a wounded deer if I don't have to. So a shoulder shot may be a good option for larger bullets but maybe not so much for lighter bullets. That is not to say a light bullet on a shoulder won't do the job because it will but the odds of bone deflection are a concern. Your level of confidence in your shot and shooting skills will dictate what shot or even if the shot should be taken. Many times we are not give the perfect shot as deer will be behind concealment or cover or even on the move/run. So we either take the shot we are given or we don't take the shot.
I have shot 2 deer so far (1 each year of 2 years hunting). I also took my son out hunting last year and he harvested. We all used the traditional aim point. All three deer ended up with heart shots. His was a perfect broadside, head up, at 60 yards. The hind quarter twitched and the deer fell over. Mine was a perfect broadside, head up, at 90 yards. He mule kicked, walked 20 feet and lay down. The last one was a perfect broadside, head down, at 25 yards. She took off running for 40 yards and piled up. All were shot with the same Savage Axis .308 with Federal 180gr soft points.
the high shoulder is great,but gives more room to wound,I go center mass behind the shoulder.
An issue with the high shoulder is that when you are a little to high but still below the spine. The deer drops like a rock and then gets up and runs off. Your above the lungs and when they recover from the shock they can take off. I don't think your far off though. I would go a little lower. Most guys can't actually hit the heart and there is to much room for error.
Good video. I liked the dog running after you on your ebike.
Unless it’s a big ole buck that I want mounted I typically take a head shot. Drops them in their tracks and they literally die instantly which I prefer and their is zero damaged meat. If it’s a big buck I may want mounted I’ll usually take that traditional shot and it’s about 50/50 in my experience if they run 20-30 yards or drop on their tracks. Either is not a problem for me usually situation dependent of course.
I will shoot double lung if the deer is in open ground with plenty of light but will switch to high shoulder if light is fading fast or the deer is near a wood or boundary. 👍
I’m in the uk and generally shoot smaller blocks of land so dead deer jumping fences is not ideal!
I have always used the heart shot with a gun but this past year i went hi shoulders it dropped in its tracks definitely trying it some more .thanks
It makes 100% sense most American shot placement shows a lot of lung to the back of the deer the ranch fair shows a shot placement diagram more in line with the South African game animals
I use a 300PRC because it will anchor a deer no matter where I shoot it ... according to the internet.
The last time I went hunting, I tried a high shoulder shot for the first time. DRT. If I have a shorter shot, I am shooting there. If not, double lung.
When u spend a whole day hiking into the backcountry and someone goes by at 20 MPH on their electric bike😂
I like the high shoulder shot, when possible, but if the shot does not present itself, I take whatever shot is available to bring home the meat. I have shot them high shoulder, lungs, heart, neck, head and the Texas heart shot. Depends on what O am hunting with and the shot available.
The heart shot is my least favorite due to how far they can run after a heart shot.
High shoulder usually always drops them with my 264mag. Lung shot they usually run.
Having shot many deer the most memorable was my first. Hit high on the spine, the moment I pulled the trigger I saw hooves straight in the air through the scope. Shooting vitals is fine but you might have to look (not always) for a couple hundred yards.
Same thing happened pistol 44 mag. Sniffing ground 30 feet in front of me. Straight on neck shot in spine, no lost meat and dropped on the spot. He wasn't even gasping for air.
We have gone to the high shoulder now for the past 5 years. I WILL ONLY take a classic traditional shot if the shoulder is covered by brush. The shoulder shot ALWAYS puts them down right there.
I agree I have always put my shot high shoulder but if possible I always go toward the he’d a few inches. Mainly a neck shot an I have not had one one even take a step in 25 years. Not one out of atleast 30 deer. That’s just me.
My high shoulder aimpoint is horizontal crosshair even with butthole and vertical crosshair even with front leg on a full broadside. On quartering away you move vertical slightly back, on quarter to slightly ahead(like aiming for opposite shoulder. I use the bung level on hogs as well. I like using a bullet that will exit, but also expand. Most of my shots are 100 yards or less, but in thick stuff that you don't want to traipse, more likely crawl, through...DeadRightThere is the goal(StoppedRightThere is a good 2nd, with a quick finisher).