@Pingu0 Not an expert but here's my 2 cents. 1) Stars come from the opinions of your staff, and thus can be flawed. Pay more attention to WHY they rate them as they do eg. is he injury prone/unprofessional/etc. This plays into their overall assessment of the player. 2) Form is the best 'stat' in the game. If a player is playing well, I don't care what a guys attributes/star rating/CA/PA is, he will continue to play for me.
So much this. I started a save in Stockport County and in 2029 I'm beating Dortmund 5-1 in the Champions League and they're worried about long term save realism?
@@Soddyn ye but FIFA ranking in itself is actually something very weird on it's own. Me from Belgium can not see how we actually became number 1 and are the number 1 for the last three years. I mean we bottled the European Championship versus Wales. We did well on the World Cup ending third, we bottled the Nations League. And we lost against Italy in the Euro's again. We never (with exception of the Olympics in 1920) won anything. So I think it is questionable on how we became first in the first place. On the other hand yes we improved as a nation. From being low on the FIFA ranking and had no players that where actually top quality (with the exception of Daniël Van Buyten at Bayern Munich). And we evolved into a nation that brought forward the likes of Vincent Kompany, Yannick Carrasco, Eden and Thorgan Hazard, Axel Witsel, Kevin De Bruyne, Romelu Lukaku and Thibault Courtois.
@@TomVerhaegen yeah fifa rankings are nonsense and friendly results massively skew team rankings but it doesn’t mean that Belgium didn’t improve significantly from where they were before the golden generation of players came through
The realism excuse doesn't hold water. What SI should strive for are realistic outcomes to the events in the game. If you are winning champions league after champions league with an Austrian club and winning world cups and euros with the Austrian national team, how could Austria not see a drastic rise in the interest in football and investment into youth development. This disconnect is the very reason why people wanted dynamic youth ratings in the first place. It felt unrealistic that your actions had no impact on the country's youth development.
I’m a 25 year old American, basically every woman around my age that was into sports loved and played soccer because of the womens national team. And that’s just one team, not even a league, that inspired a generation. And the continued success of the UWNT has lead to more and more of that. No reason something like that shouldn’t be reflected in football manager
I be savescumming and made Indonesia won 2 WC and every competition we participate in. Indonesia is still producing melons. It's unrealistic and not fun
Portugal won the Euros. I can tell you that factually, nothing changed. And Portugal is big into football. The play grounds continue to be busted, the decent ones are locked behind fees. The only way to play football is to play for a club or play at school in a 50 year old asphalt field. There is 0 investment. And again we are talking about Portugal. Belarus is a hugely corrupt dictatorship. The money comes in and like magic it disappears. The US exemple is that it costs money to play football, the US will never be a huge force until that changes. But basketball? Every ghetto as a busted court (same for Portugal and football, I live in one so I speak from experience ), that is what makes good players, people escaping their shitty life, not the rich people hobbies.
Honestly the dynamic youth rating was a huge reason I upgraded to fm22, this is nowhere near how this was marketed. Very disappointing, now I see little reason to go back to my 15 year build a nation save. What a shame.
Just got FM earlier this week for the same reason, got to say I'm disappointed that dynamic youth rating doesn't really work...... I think FM22 still has some huge improvements in match engine and data hub but having one of your selling points under-functioning is just unfortunate.
Same. Haven’t played the game since 2019 and decided to come back this year because of DYR. I’m 9 years in with my save and I was hoping to make Denmark a better at producing talents. Seems like it’s not going to happen.
Also: In real life the interest in football spiked drastically after Denmark’s participation in the 92’ EC. Since last summer the interest in football has increased due to the performance of the national team, too. It really isn’t that unrealistic to have DYR..
only thing I can think of if you feel you accomplish a big objective (such as winning the ucl) manually boost ur countries ratings to make it better. I know it doesnt sound great because of the editor but personally, I'd rather do that than throw away my 10 year polish save. Not sure what good boosts to the nation for what accomplishments would be though atm
@@ranvir5576 The Network Game started up again on Twitch last Thursday and WorkTheSpace was in a board meeting trying to convince Leeds to buy Mbappe, and while mindlessly clicking through the options *he resigned*. Benjy's got the first video on youtube of it.
So it’s just straight up false advertising. Being able to do a build-a-nation save was the main reason I wanted to buy FM22 instead of just playing FM21. Kind of want a refund tbh
i think Brøndby in Denmark is perfect example of how things can be dynamic. When the club was founded in the 60's there was no professional clubs in Denmark. They were first movers. In the 80's the Danish national did great but everyone played abroad. But Brøndby had slowly gotten professional and when the Danish National Team won the European Championship in 1992 it was a team with mostly Brøndby Players. And because of Brøndby's succes the bigger clubs in Denmark also had to get professional. FC Copenhagen was formed, almost as an direct challenger to the monopoly Brøndby had over Danish football. But they were far more professional when looking at the financial side of football. That meant that overtime they overtook Brøndby as the flagship in Danish football, and played way more CL football than Brøndby ever did. During Copenhages rise to prominence, in the other end of the country, a new Club was formed, to battle the to teams from the Copenhagen area, FC Midtjylland. But they came in with another way of thinking. They focused heavely on youth development, they had the first actual academy in Denmark, and now they battle for the league every year. And now all the bigger clubs in Denmark has something akin to an academy. And our national team might never have been better and danish players are playing in all the big countries. And Denmark is a small country, so this should be possible to somewhat replicate in FM in other countries.
It is great to know that SI have lied to us. Guarantee that they hold back on ever implementing DYR properly into FM22 and will keep it and advertise FM23 with an amazing new feature of DYR!!!
honestly it serves me right to pre-purchase a brand new edition. Was so excited to go from FM 20 to FM 22 because of the engine and other great sounding offers. But now with the persistent trial bugs and this now, I wonder whether I should not just have gotten FM 21 at a discount.
@@justjelmer6654 at first the attributes would not persist after trials ended, so that either you would have no knowledge, or only the base knowledge you had before the trial. Right now the attributes do hang around, after a "fix" from SI, but it will not remember the ability and potential still. Very inconvenient when doing a lower league save.
@@JamesHussain82 i myself got promoted my red star team from N3 to L1 in France, without any of these. It is easy, in the second season, I did lose only 3-1 to Monaco
@@JamesHussain82 don't think wonderkid videos help in non league... If you've played enough and understand the features like trials, good scouting programs, signing players expiring contracts it becomes easy to upgrade your team massively every season while making profit. Ultimately it's a game and it's made to be beaten so any experienced player should have an easy time finding success
@@4tyu3318 Thank you. It is a video GAME at the end of the day. I'm sick and tired of SI forums using the realism card to justify the screw ups and inconsistencies. "Oh wow i have no idea how you lost that game BUT you know realistically things don't always work out the way we want them to, shit happens you know" and i'm like shut the fuck up, i paid for this shit, is simply saying "yeah that's weird, we'll look into it." too much to ask.
Well.. this blows, big time! I play with Altinordu and can only sign Turkish players (philosophy and rule made by the club). I make the board invest millions in facilities and youth recruitment. But this will only hurt the youth rating of Turkey...? A sad day for me and Altinordu..
Great video Zea. Dynamic youth ratings motivated so many long term players to upgrade from older versions of the game and was heavily marketed as a game changing feature. In reality, your nation doing well in a sport will automatically mean more people will watch it and in the long run, have more people playing it. More people playing the game will lead to further investment and game importance.
Game importance in India is low now, but if India ever qualifies for a World Cup, that will change overnight. Look at the USA, since hosting in 1994 they've turned into a genuine mainstay, barring the odd slip-up. Australia is the same, since beating Uruguay to qualify in 2006 and moving federations to Asia, as well as the founding of the A-League, the quality floor of Aussie players has gone way up (still haven't matched Kewell and Bresciano, but the Australia subs bench is the best it's ever been). South Korea since 2002 is similar. Game importance not being dynamic is a huge oversight.
Indeed. Its not even a stretch to imagine the real world scenarios... the USA is literally a blueprint for how it works in a developed nation, I can't name one but I imagine a bit of googling will find that there are African and South American nations classed as Developing or Third World that also have done similarly.
eh not to worry, they'll make one of those factors dynamic in fm23, you'll just have to buy it again. By fm30, we should see all those factors turn dynamic... Damn, it must be real nice to be SI, fascinating business model for sure, and fascinating how our community tolerates such crap
Yeah, my save where I try to build up Mozambique has been thoroughly disappointing. Fm22 feels tactically easy (I'm winning a lot), but nothing can budge the youth rating it seems.
To be honest Mozambique's Sport minister announced a decade ago how we would one day win the world cup, and we haven't even qualified for the African Cup of Nations since. So feels like fm is working perfectly there...
One thing is the potential, other thing is reaching that potential. Dynamic youth rating should mean more player with potential while facilities mean only the hability of a club to make a player reach that potential(with coaches).
The thing that pushed me to actually buy this game (I had been playing FM20, because it was free in epic games) was literally that feature. I kinda feel betrayed, tbh. Ofc I'm gonna still spend hours in this game (I already bought it instead of buying any other game, when I can barely afford one a year), but I for sure ain't gonna buy anymore if this is not somewhat patched. I don't intend for Belarus, for example, to become brazil like ever, even, in the game. Not enough people, poor-ish country. I get it. But maybe getting it to the top 30-20, idk, see that change! It's really, really disappointing
Agree. So disappointed in SI. If they’re dedicated to ‘realism,’ then surely population should grow, and economic development improve, as is the trend for countries around the world during the past century.
Their "realism" excuse is always just their way of self-defense. Any time the playerbase is unhappy with something, they just say "well, realism" to shut us up. Hopefully, we can put enough pressure on them over this for them to make some actual changes to this FM over this.
Alright, my stance on this is actually that Day 1, the game should be as realistic as possible. It should strive to be the real thing as close to possible as can be. Once you press continue, however, that should be relaxed. Dynamism should slowly overtake the realism in an effort to make long term saves much more interesting. And when the real players are all gone, I want madness. I want coaches to emerge and drive Cheddar United to the CL. I want Zaire to become the next great superpower in 3150. Madness. Because that's fun and unique, and makes your save a perfect little snowflake of coolness.
SI yet again failing to deliver changes and features people wanted… They get away with it because FIFA and EA are slightly worse, but make no mistake about it, SI are lazy as well
Fifa is a completely different game. We Are Football is their only competitor, and that game is half a decade away from getting 10yards close to fm, unfortunately.
Yes Zea, great video! Impassioned, informative and rational. The problem I have with SI's realism comment is that their game-world is already not realistic. Thanks to liscening we have "Zebre" and "Man UFC" we have players that by and large have personalities that shine a light on their more positive aspects rather than being realistic. We have in game financial wizardry that stops a player from ruining a clubs finances "too much." We have clubs that give the player more power than any club is willing to give a manager these days. Not to mention silly things like if I wanted I could make 20 managers, and manage every Premier League club, with the sole purpose of having each one collude to destroy Man City without the game intervening or questioning it in the press. Further to that, the game without DYR cannot realistically replicate the rise of nations like the USA (like you mentioned) or even things like the historic fall of Hungary as a footballing nation. But, importantly real football isn't realistic. It's the sense of "anything could happen" in the real world sport that produces stories of glorious FA cup runs. Or, stories like Maradona and Pele-kids from deprived backgrounds going on to be one of the best players ever. Or the "1000-1" odds of Leicester. Im sure there are plenty of examples. But my point is real football is not realistic, that is the magic. Football is not realistic things happen all the time that "shouldn't." It's that romanticism that had us all dreaming as kids, its that romanticism that has us all on the edge of our seats as adults and ultimately its that romanticism that has us all playing Football Manager.
it takes about half an hour to fix the real names, put kits, badges, logos, stadiums, trophies, city pictures and correct competition names and colours in.
I see why they've done it the way they have but I disagree. Until they improve this feature I don't see myself upgrading to newer versions of the game I'm afraid.
I gave up after 12 seasons , and bought FMRTE. Each time my team does well in continental cups (above quarters) i add 2 points to the NYR , when teams from my league do well in continental cups i add 1 point for each team. If the nation does well in the world cup or the euro (above quarters) i add 3 points. I play with Farul Constanta in Romania and I manage both and Romania starts with 91 and i have increased it now until 110. I chose this team because it's a youth academy type of team like Barcelona based on it's vision and it's granted to give me wonderkids which I can then distribute in my league as needed.
One of the problems this highlights for me is the ghost nature of federations in the game. They're trying to chuck these limitations up to "realism", when in reality federations are not fixed numbers, but rather groups of people who take decisions and whose points of view can change. For a system of dynamic youth ratings to be fully functional, the role of federations needs to be dynamic itself, and preferably visible in-game, not just through numbers on an editor. There could be a yearly screen where the federation informs you of changes in youth ratings, infrastructure, and their plans for the future, which should be dynamic according to how your save is going (within reason).
wow I thought I was doing something wrong this entire time, I took Ireland as my build a nation and I took a small team from Ennis to the champions league. At the moment I've won the cl x7 and every other club continental competition at least twice. After a couple of years of glory I thought some change would of happened. I took over the Irish national team, from then I've won 1 world cup, 2x Euros and 2x UFEA nations league. Through the 20 years of youth intakes I've only gotten one player that could be considered world class around 159 pa. But this video answers that but I'm a little disappointed, as I would love to see Ireland be the bigger nation in the UK.
Maybe the best idea would be an option to allow more dynamic youth rating to turn on and to turn it off at the start point of a save similar to the sttributes masking, that way the player can decide if they want an extreme realistic save or not when it comes to youth rating
This is the first FM I've ever played in my life. Until very recently, I had little interest in football altogether. On my first save, I took Wrexham from the Vanarama to the PL in back-to-back-to-back-to-back, 1st place auto-promotions. (Yeah I used 4-3-3 gegenpress) I can do the aforementioned easily, despite 0 experience with the game and little knowledge of football, but we can't have *actual* dynamic youth ratings? Please... They want to use the "we want realism" excuse as an argument, but it just doesn't add up, for the reasons you mentioned in the video, as well as a bunch of others. Worst of all, in my opinion, is announcing dynamic youth ratings as a major feature and then not delivering. The difference of opinion between us and the devs is one thing, but outright lying on a major feature is false advertising and grounds to sue or at least request a refund.
Macedonia's youth rating was 64 for long time. On FM22 it is 71 and it made my enjoyment playing with my local club in the regional leagues even bigger.
Тоа ми сметаше и мене минатите верзии. Колку и да правев успеси со мојот клуб, пак излегаа лоши regens во клубот секоја година. П.С. Не знаев дека има и други од Македонија кои го следат каналов :)
@@Jazz-mj5tx последно играв нешто како мини верзија на Journeyman, па почнав со Кадино каде сепак останав повеќе сезони (Европа Лига најчесто влегував). А претходно имам играно и со Вардар (редовно влегував во ЛШ), но и со Осогово (Европа Лига многу често)
Agree strongly with your poins at the end. It reminds me of how there's a restriction on building a club stadium if your club recently built one as it's unrealstic for a club to rise so quickly. Surely that's approaching the issue from the wrong angle?
When managing an international team there should be options to invest/encourage youth investment based on your success on the pitch as there is at club level
wow I am so disappointed, I started a build a nation save in Bosnia and Herzegovina with my favourite club Fk Zeljeznicar Sarajevo and I noticed after many seasons that nothing changed and it is so sad. I was really hyped to build the nation and get it to the top. Now I know it is all nonsense thank you Z for clearifying the situation.
i did a 25 season save early on in the games life cycle, and i was in control of three norwegian clubs. all the clubs won the champions league at some point, with at least one of the teams winnng most season. 3 worldwide reputable clubs, 2nd most reputable league and yet a +7 to youth rating. england on the other side increased by like +30 for maintaining their top status despite our rise
This was the feature I was looking forward to the most. Holding of buying now until this improves in future games. I played FM 19 to 2074 so i love a long term save.
I gave up my 10 year latvia save last week, taking a Latvian team to the Champions League semi finals and the national team from 138th to 36th world ranking so far. My dynamic youth rating has gone up by 1 and honestly it's very demoralizing and takes away all the fun. The unrealistic thing isn't that the youth rating would dramatically increase, the unrealistic thing is that I was able to take the club's to that level in the first place. The nation suddenly becoming way more invested in football is if anything the realistic thing to happen in that situation. Also it should be possible to increase these other locked factors (FA financial power is a no brainer). If you look at club's like man city that have also contributed massively to helping and developing their local area. If you take a club from a tiny nation and make it one of the richest clubs in the world, buy state of the art facilities and have loads of players, staff and youth players on ridiculous wages for that nation you are sure to see a slight trickle effect in the local area.
I was looking forward to doing a build a nation save with a large country like India to see if I could eventually print wonderkids like Brazil does. From what I understand in this video, that doesn't seem possible. What a shame! I trust SI to fix DYR in the future.
Yeah, I was about to buy the game. Luckily I watched this video. So according to SI, you can win 40 Asian Champion's Leagues with an Indian club and 10 World Cups with India, the people will still not be interested in football and play cricket
The year is 2043, world cup winners San Marino still has infastructure where youth players must play on muddy pitches with one groundskeeper, Vitali, struggling to draw the lines. Football Boots are rare. Goal frames are wooden and there are no nets. Instead of cones, the San Marinese must simply rely on the holes in the ground for dribbling drills. Meanwhile, Brazil has just announced they now have bioengineered children who have been genetically perfected to become wonderkids.
I mean this feature is essentially a failure, loads of people were really excited about this, me included but it just doesn't really work and takes the shine off playing really long term saves in smaller countries.
Totally agree. One of the most frustrating things about games like this is investing 10s/100s of hours of your life, doing *everything* right, and only then finding out that the game doesn’t reward how you thought it would, or some dumb glitch prevents you attaining the goals you set out at the start of the save. I get the thing about realism, but surely a better aim for the devs is to allow players to create their own worlds that *seem* realistic to us, based on the efforts we’ve put in. If the FM world of football looks the same after 50 seasons as it does in the first, that’s pretty boring (and not IMO very realistic).
SI deleting their comment and the video’s title changing suggests “discussions” have taken place between Zealand and SI. Hopefully if so it doesn’t stop Zealand from criticising them so entertainingly in the future.
They didn’t delete their comment it got held by auto mod so I had to release it again, should be there now Also I’d never give up my ability to do whatever I want, someone’s gotta keep them honest
I think it's more than a little disingenuous of SI to claim a "realism" defense here when they specifically omitted certain effects of COVID in the game (postponed matches, players being unavailable due to illness with COVID, empty stadiums, etc.) despite them being very real things that we are still dealing with now. And they acknowledged that leaving those things out flew in the face of realism, but they did so because they wanted this game to be *fun*; an escape from whatever might be going on around you. Why can't the same approach be taken here? So what if the odds of San Marino becoming a global football powerhouse are slim to none? Let us do it anyway! Make it a slow process, but let us directly and indirectly influence that progression!
Doing a Luxembourg challenge nation is something that I've been considering for quite a while: they're going through a "golden" generation (to their standards at the very least), and it's a nation that has been achieving great results both as a league (Dudelange qualified for Europa League's group stage TWICE in a row... that was MASSIVE) and as a national team (they even managed to get a draw away against France). After reading that the youth system would finally be dynamic I thought that it'd actually a feasible thing to pull off (I was even considering the option to create a team in one of its neighbouring countries' league systems, most likely Belgium, to help with the challenge's growth)... So, learning that regarldess of the effort and potential results I might pull off will be for naught... is a huge blow. Not gonna lie, I feel both disappointed and disheartened.
Magnificiant video zealand! it's such an important matter than Si get to know these kind of opinions and thank you for voicing that in such a magnificiant way! I feel completely represented by your speech. Congrats and lets hope they consider more improviments on this in next version. Cheers from Brazil!
Okay i'm bummed about this. I have a save from the Beta with my hometown Finnish club SJK. I've built up the club and the league's reputation so that the Finnish league is 9th in the rankings and SJK are 3rd on club level after winning 2 champions leagues. In every window i invest in other finnish clubs with good amount of money and after all this work it could all be for nothing...
Unrelated to DYR, but you lot got a player (Monreal) on a free transfer from MY hometown club. And I just wanted to say thank you for taking him off our hands.
@@tomson123tomson Monreal played almost the entirety of the league as our starting number 9, he didn't score a single goal in the league and eventually got relegated to the bench by a 17 y.o youngster. He's the second worst striker I've ever seen at my club. If he actually plays well for you, that'd be a miracle.
Can't say I have too much faith in him. He dropped down to the second tier because he couldn't hack it in the first and then managed to do it even worse in the second tier.
@@VodkaHellstorm Started with them as well and played a handful of seasons. The league became boring, but never generated enough newgen talent to achieve anything but domestic success. I moved to Jablonec in Czechia. I already have 4 youth players in 2 seasons that have great potential. I would have stuck with fm21 if I knew dynamic youth rating was a inconsequential.
It'll be interesting to see what Miles says in response to this (if he says anything), as he's often extremely defensive, ewven rude, when dealing with criticism of the game.
No kidding. When I saw the intro, I was like damn… because I know that guy tends to be aggressively defensive in criticism, and he might see a “joking skit” as a slight. Like, I feel mean pointing it out, but the fact that people all over the fan base knows it means it’s pretty accurate.
Side note: One of the unofficial save editors (it has 5 letters) you CAN edit game importance. And it's cheaper than the official ingame editor. Yes I know that the unofficial ones may break things but you can edit something SI don't want you to that makes the game more realistic and something they should have done in the first place
I think the whole web of game importance, nation youth rating, financial power HAS to be revamped in accordance with international management. Intl management has long been neglected and somehow laughable compared to the rest of the game. SI should revamp intl management to include not only simple stuff like better interactions, trainings, selecting camp locations, BUT you should be able to see an FA’s financial situation and have a club vision, so as clubs in the country or the national team win tournaments/games and get more money (a way to increase an FA financial power?, you can go to the FA a say a vision we should have is to spend more money on grassroots infrastructure and thus the DYR increases in a realistic manner (a win-win for SI and those of us that want an actually REALISTIC intl management part of the game) with the World Cup next December too, I think FM22 would be an ideal time to implement this revamp too as people will probably be more interested with intl matches and management
Absolutely. They're talking about realism when the actual answer is that they don't want to bother building financial and game importance models for FAs. If they want it to be realistic it should be almost impossible to arrange home friendlies as an OFC nation. New Zealand last played at home in 2017, and the last home friendly was in 2014! Most OFC countries never play friendlies except right before the Nations Cup and Olympic qualifying.
Well, I guess I am glad I stuck with FM21 then. This might've been the big reason to get the FM22 but if not, then there is little reason for it. Maybe next year they actually make it worthwhile. Because if you can win Champions League with a small nation or team...you bet your ass that game importance etc will jump significantly. Not to mention there are nations like Belgium who where nowhere near as good a decade ago and now they are a top nation.
I agree completely with you Zealand. A real dynamic youth system improves what is possible in the game. As you said, FM tries to be as realistic as possible which is great but no one knows the future and the global football map in 50 years time is likely to be different than it is today
it's true! if you told someone even right after the 2010 World Cup that the Netherlands would go through an inexplicable decline for like ten years just because their talent couldn't keep pace with the rest of Europe, you would get laughed at! the footballing world is more dynamic than SI have implemented, and I for one think it would be awesome to see an unexpected country do well. I won the 2022 world cup managing Senegal during FM17 due to a sort of one-in-a-million golden generation and it's a huge letdown knowing that's likely not achievable this year.
I actually disagree that being able to build up nations is unrealistic, look at Iceland, there should be things in place that you can suggest to the FA of your nation about putting plans in place, look at the German reboot
@@Telsion don't want to be wrong but I think it's the plan developed by the DFB in the early 2000s that allowed the creation of regional centers for scouting and development of players (and other things) . Those player would later be signed by major clubs that would allow them to reach the pro level.
@@Telsion There’s a book by Rafa Honigstein titles ‘Das Reboot’ and it details the plan of how after bad tournaments and an ageing squad with big big egos the DFB needed to change and build the team that would eventually win the World Cup in 2014
Soccernomics by Simon Kuper and Stefan Szymanski goes into this in some detail and uses good data analysis to back up their findings, SI would do well to read it. Essentially the economic state of country/FA to invest in football doesn't matter that much, and in reality, poorer nations have wider pools of talent because many kids try to improve their situation by sport and can't afford things like games consoles, so they spend a good deal of time playing football as they grow up, it's the same basic principle as to why even in Western European nations so many top players have humble backgrounds. You do then factor in the more mathematical variables of population size and what other accessible things may be competing for kids attention, the cricket in India example. Belarus tends to support Olympic sports as well as football, so if we say Zealand's Borisov peaked football to the primary sport, if you look at population size and GDP as some kind of guide, it would probably compare to a Paraguay, and probably should never rival Brazil. This isn't a defence of SI promising dynamic youth ratings and not delivering it as they promised, just a view on when we talk about reality, what we're actually talking about.
Totally agree with you at the end of the video. I'm disappointed that FM22 dynamic youth rating isn't as dynamic as most people, and myself, expected. I'm still playing FM21 and enjoying my Fluminense save a lot, basically dominating South America and bossing everyone in the continent around, but I will think more than twice now about buying FM22 because of this. If Dynamic Youth Rating is affected by all those things, those economic things and so on, should also be dynamic. And yes, just as you said, I understand if there's no huge change immediately, but if I have one of the best clubs in the world in Belarus, following your example, I expect some form of tangible improvement in the next few decades. If that's not the case then yes, I'm disappointed. DYR was one of the main reason I wanted to switch to Football Manager 2022 sooner or later but knowing this now... Well, they'll definitely need to make things even more dynamic next year. Hopefully they will
I’d decided not to buy FM22 after seeing the original feature announcements. This was the feature that convinced me to buy. Has Miles blocked you on Twitter for this video yet?
Lol who planned this?! "Becoming more succesful as a club makes NYR less likely to increase" "More success on a national level cannot change NYR" "Investing in youth development makes NYR less likely to icnrease" Could they list something that they think actually DOES increase it?
I'll tell you. But you'll have to wait until November to buy FM 23. Preorder in September for the broken (beta) version a whopping two weeks early! We'll have fixed it in the next instalment, we swear! Best, Miles Jacobson
Holy shit, my forum post is bringing awareness to the issue! I feel cheated by the answers given by SI so far since the sims were reported, it's a shame
Thank you for this Zealand. I was planning on spending some Christmas gift cash on FM22. The biggest selling point for me was dynamic youth rating and being able to do a proper, long-term build-a-nation save. I'll now be sticking with my FM19 save and spending the money elsewhere.
Exactly. This is the one (and maybe even only) this that absolutely should be dynamic. If Belarus have a team that wins the champions league, then they start doing well in world cups, absolutely game importance would go up. I can't see any reason why it wouldnt.
Welp, there went my reason for buying the game, kinda wish I stuck to FM21 since I had a save going there, but I deleted all of that when I got FM22. Wanted to take Bodø Glimt to the top in Europe, while bringing the other teams, as well as the national team, with me.
I like your ending argument, especially looking long term the growth is slow, but with big wins, more teams winning or world cup wins can help build the country youth dynamic rating. You did a great job.
I commented about this on your last video yesterday, and also posted the link to this on the sub-reddit ... So I'm taking credit for this video. You're all welcome haha
Me 16 years into a Gibraltar save: 🙃 Edit: I pretty much monopolise the league and ended up handing out 1 million pounds to all the other teams in the league.
After seeing the amount of comments from people who have poured hundreds of hours into getting small clubs to glory, and now knowing that it will never improve that club/nation etc., what an absolute shit show. SI need to sort that BS. I've been playing Champ Man since 1992 on the Amiga. It's 30 years later. Surely to F they can do this DYR thing properly.
Investing in grassroots soccer is absolutely a thing irl. Sporting KC have grassroots clubs all over the midwest, not just in Kansas and Missouri but in Nebraska, Iowa, and Arkansas as well. This is a fairly recent investment (10-15 years) and has already produced young players that have followed the path of grassroots->Academy->Second team-> First team
in the end si is a company that, like every other company, is interested in making as much money as possible. weve seen developers mislead their customers in the past years increasing a lot and since si has a monopoly on football sim genre, they probably think they can afford it because theres no competition anyways. just like ea
the way I see it the main thing that determines your country's youth rating should be how well the country's top teams are doing in Europe because as you said with the WC coming to the USA in the 90's, that had a massive impact or your youth, it wasn't that the USA did well (coz they didn't) but having that level of top talent from around the globe in your country would've had a massive impact, so therefore the more top talent playing in Denmark for instance the more impact that'd have on the youth of that country coz they're seeing great players performing at the top level in their country and if Danish teams are in the UCL there's a chance of playing against the greats E.g Barcelona, PSG, Man UTD and that'd bring more kids eyes to football and make them wanna play it as a side note, although I think stuff like UCL participation is more important than stuff like a good WC run I still think it should have some impact, for instance when the WC did come to the USA, Bulgaria finished 4th and Sweden finished 3rd which is massive for a small country, so i think there is a balance to be found
You said it yourself zealand, if we had a DYR and played 100 seasons and the game is constantly feeling fresh because of it.. some might be less inclined to pay for a new FM every year :)
Thank you so much for not being an FM shill and making a video like this. Much like others in the comments I've done about all their is to do in the club scene, now I want to make an international dynasty and I simply can't with the way the game is currently programmed. It's pure laziness on SI's part, they're raking in the cash and have no incentive to innovate with next to no competition. Just as you said, it is SI's job to define NYR, it's not that complex an ask, but instead I'm sure we'll next year they'll just do the usual UI changes and add a couple of press conference response options because that's far less effort.
Really appreciate how well you make your point about why we should be able to increase the youth rating at the end. This is wild, glad I didn’t go for my Irish youth rating save right away.
If u want to play save more than 10 years your team will consist of 7 brazilians 1 columbian 1 mexican 1 belgian 1 dutch player and thata pretty much same every time. DYR has to be more “dynamic” and fixed.
SI pulling a EA on all of us and hyping up a feature that turns out to be a lie. Their whole explanation is convoluted and just straight up wrong. One example is how a country won't invest in a sport if a club is doing well. In reality if a sport is doing well they want to invest more. Here is NZ the govt. has put a huge amount of money into Rugby, Rowing and Sailing because we do them better than the rest of the world
I guess the only way to really build a nation is to do a one-league journeyman where you raise the quality of every team in hopes that a whole league's worth of youth facilities produce talent (still constrained by the stuff shown in the editor, though)
IT'S BEEN LESS THAN 12 HOURS AND I'M ALREADY BEING RINSED IN INTROS FOR ACCIDENTALLY RESIGNING. I HATE IT.
If it's any consolation, you are often the highlight of these streams 💜
wait... you accidentally resigned???
WorkTheJobCentre
@Pingu0 Not an expert but here's my 2 cents.
1) Stars come from the opinions of your staff, and thus can be flawed. Pay more attention to WHY they rate them as they do eg. is he injury prone/unprofessional/etc. This plays into their overall assessment of the player.
2) Form is the best 'stat' in the game. If a player is playing well, I don't care what a guys attributes/star rating/CA/PA is, he will continue to play for me.
Look at this way, you provided a new focal point for the day's stream
If we can take non league clubs to the UCL in a matter of years then I don’t think taking a mid tier country to the top is that much of a stretch
So much this. I started a save in Stockport County and in 2029 I'm beating Dortmund 5-1 in the Champions League and they're worried about long term save realism?
Belgium went from 66th in the FIFA ranking in 2009 to 1st in 2018, so it isn't a stretch a all.
@@RagnarozSR lol agreed.
@@Soddyn ye but FIFA ranking in itself is actually something very weird on it's own. Me from Belgium can not see how we actually became number 1 and are the number 1 for the last three years. I mean we bottled the European Championship versus Wales. We did well on the World Cup ending third, we bottled the Nations League. And we lost against Italy in the Euro's again. We never (with exception of the Olympics in 1920) won anything. So I think it is questionable on how we became first in the first place.
On the other hand yes we improved as a nation. From being low on the FIFA ranking and had no players that where actually top quality (with the exception of Daniël Van Buyten at Bayern Munich). And we evolved into a nation that brought forward the likes of Vincent Kompany, Yannick Carrasco, Eden and Thorgan Hazard, Axel Witsel, Kevin De Bruyne, Romelu Lukaku and Thibault Courtois.
@@TomVerhaegen yeah fifa rankings are nonsense and friendly results massively skew team rankings but it doesn’t mean that Belgium didn’t improve significantly from where they were before the golden generation of players came through
Best video you've made on this channel.
I thought it was the Saving of Thames video. 😂
Spot on he hit the nail on the head.
@@TheAmrumBoy That's about 5th below the other excellent videos he's made with me...
The realism excuse doesn't hold water. What SI should strive for are realistic outcomes to the events in the game. If you are winning champions league after champions league with an Austrian club and winning world cups and euros with the Austrian national team, how could Austria not see a drastic rise in the interest in football and investment into youth development. This disconnect is the very reason why people wanted dynamic youth ratings in the first place. It felt unrealistic that your actions had no impact on the country's youth development.
Literally couldn’t have put this any better
agreed
I’m a 25 year old American, basically every woman around my age that was into sports loved and played soccer because of the womens national team. And that’s just one team, not even a league, that inspired a generation. And the continued success of the UWNT has lead to more and more of that. No reason something like that shouldn’t be reflected in football manager
I be savescumming and made Indonesia won 2 WC and every competition we participate in. Indonesia is still producing melons. It's unrealistic and not fun
Portugal won the Euros. I can tell you that factually, nothing changed. And Portugal is big into football.
The play grounds continue to be busted, the decent ones are locked behind fees. The only way to play football is to play for a club or play at school in a 50 year old asphalt field.
There is 0 investment. And again we are talking about Portugal. Belarus is a hugely corrupt dictatorship. The money comes in and like magic it disappears.
The US exemple is that it costs money to play football, the US will never be a huge force until that changes. But basketball? Every ghetto as a busted court (same for Portugal and football, I live in one so I speak from experience ), that is what makes good players, people escaping their shitty life, not the rich people hobbies.
Honestly the dynamic youth rating was a huge reason I upgraded to fm22, this is nowhere near how this was marketed. Very disappointing, now I see little reason to go back to my 15 year build a nation save. What a shame.
Just got FM earlier this week for the same reason, got to say I'm disappointed that dynamic youth rating doesn't really work...... I think FM22 still has some huge improvements in match engine and data hub but having one of your selling points under-functioning is just unfortunate.
Same. Haven’t played the game since 2019 and decided to come back this year because of DYR. I’m 9 years in with my save and I was hoping to make Denmark a better at producing talents. Seems like it’s not going to happen.
Also: In real life the interest in football spiked drastically after Denmark’s participation in the 92’ EC. Since last summer the interest in football has increased due to the performance of the national team, too. It really isn’t that unrealistic to have DYR..
only thing I can think of if you feel you accomplish a big objective (such as winning the ucl) manually boost ur countries ratings to make it better. I know it doesnt sound great because of the editor but personally, I'd rather do that than throw away my 10 year polish save. Not sure what good boosts to the nation for what accomplishments would be though atm
yep i'm not buying fm22 unless they change this, the other updates from fm21 don't justify the price tag at all imo
The WorkTheSpace reference resigning happened LAST NIGHT and made it into the video. Props to the team for getting it in there so quickly!!
what happened? i didn’t get the reference
@@ranvir5576 The Network Game started up again on Twitch last Thursday and WorkTheSpace was in a board meeting trying to convince Leeds to buy Mbappe, and while mindlessly clicking through the options *he resigned*. Benjy's got the first video on youtube of it.
So it’s just straight up false advertising. Being able to do a build-a-nation save was the main reason I wanted to buy FM22 instead of just playing FM21. Kind of want a refund tbh
i think Brøndby in Denmark is perfect example of how things can be dynamic. When the club was founded in the 60's there was no professional clubs in Denmark. They were first movers. In the 80's the Danish national did great but everyone played abroad. But Brøndby had slowly gotten professional and when the Danish National Team won the European Championship in 1992 it was a team with mostly Brøndby Players. And because of Brøndby's succes the bigger clubs in Denmark also had to get professional. FC Copenhagen was formed, almost as an direct challenger to the monopoly Brøndby had over Danish football. But they were far more professional when looking at the financial side of football. That meant that overtime they overtook Brøndby as the flagship in Danish football, and played way more CL football than Brøndby ever did. During Copenhages rise to prominence, in the other end of the country, a new Club was formed, to battle the to teams from the Copenhagen area, FC Midtjylland. But they came in with another way of thinking. They focused heavely on youth development, they had the first actual academy in Denmark, and now they battle for the league every year. And now all the bigger clubs in Denmark has something akin to an academy. And our national team might never have been better and danish players are playing in all the big countries. And Denmark is a small country, so this should be possible to somewhat replicate in FM in other countries.
I wonder how much SI started sweating profusely when everyone went around saying they were gonna do a 'build a nation' save
They sweat in money from all the people that bought the game hoping to build a nation.
@@hristorusanov23 sweating from sucess
@@mykullbubbles sweating from falss advertising. Dynamic youth rating was the reason I updated from FM15
@@BrunoCarvalho-mr3ts same
LMAO, that WorkTheSpace reference in the beginning of the video has made me laugh so hard. Well played!
Quick turnaround too. Less than 24 hours.
It is great to know that SI have lied to us. Guarantee that they hold back on ever implementing DYR properly into FM22 and will keep it and advertise FM23 with an amazing new feature of DYR!!!
honestly it serves me right to pre-purchase a brand new edition. Was so excited to go from FM 20 to FM 22 because of the engine and other great sounding offers. But now with the persistent trial bugs and this now, I wonder whether I should not just have gotten FM 21 at a discount.
@@ArjanSchaeffer fm21 has completely bugged analysis tools. if you use those for tactics then it's better to just skip it cause their unusable.
@@ArjanSchaeffer what trial bug?
@@justjelmer6654 at first the attributes would not persist after trials ended, so that either you would have no knowledge, or only the base knowledge you had before the trial. Right now the attributes do hang around, after a "fix" from SI, but it will not remember the ability and potential still. Very inconvenient when doing a lower league save.
@@ArjanSchaeffer well that was in fm20 too, its nice they fixed it now
11:48 "Keep things realistic" yeah, 90% people going from Vanarama regional to championship in 5-6 years is very realistic SI!
That's because everyone watches wonderkid videos, downlands tactics and uses FMRTE.
@@JamesHussain82 i myself got promoted my red star team from N3 to L1 in France, without any of these. It is easy, in the second season, I did lose only 3-1 to Monaco
@@dhaisa if fm was 100% realistic no one would play it as it would be way to hard to do anything
@@JamesHussain82 don't think wonderkid videos help in non league... If you've played enough and understand the features like trials, good scouting programs, signing players expiring contracts it becomes easy to upgrade your team massively every season while making profit. Ultimately it's a game and it's made to be beaten so any experienced player should have an easy time finding success
@@4tyu3318 Thank you. It is a video GAME at the end of the day. I'm sick and tired of SI forums using the realism card to justify the screw ups and inconsistencies. "Oh wow i have no idea how you lost that game BUT you know realistically things don't always work out the way we want them to, shit happens you know" and i'm like shut the fuck up, i paid for this shit, is simply saying "yeah that's weird, we'll look into it." too much to ask.
Actually mental that game importance isn’t dynamic. If that logic existed in real life no one outside England would care about football
*Scotland
Valid criticisms of one of the most anticipated features of FM22.
So expecting a lot more foreigners signing for Florinsdorfer now lol.
Well.. this blows, big time! I play with Altinordu and can only sign Turkish players (philosophy and rule made by the club). I make the board invest millions in facilities and youth recruitment. But this will only hurt the youth rating of Turkey...? A sad day for me and Altinordu..
Great video. What a joke that SI promoted this as a huge new feature.
*SLAMS TABLE* THANK YOU!
2060 in Hungary and "Dynamic" Youth Rating is a lie!
Tell me about that bro
I wasted 30 seasons in north Korea
Great video Zea. Dynamic youth ratings motivated so many long term players to upgrade from older versions of the game and was heavily marketed as a game changing feature. In reality, your nation doing well in a sport will automatically mean more people will watch it and in the long run, have more people playing it. More people playing the game will lead to further investment and game importance.
Game importance in India is low now, but if India ever qualifies for a World Cup, that will change overnight. Look at the USA, since hosting in 1994 they've turned into a genuine mainstay, barring the odd slip-up. Australia is the same, since beating Uruguay to qualify in 2006 and moving federations to Asia, as well as the founding of the A-League, the quality floor of Aussie players has gone way up (still haven't matched Kewell and Bresciano, but the Australia subs bench is the best it's ever been). South Korea since 2002 is similar. Game importance not being dynamic is a huge oversight.
Seems like an oversight that not more of these factors, like game importance, are not also dynamic
Indeed. Its not even a stretch to imagine the real world scenarios... the USA is literally a blueprint for how it works in a developed nation, I can't name one but I imagine a bit of googling will find that there are African and South American nations classed as Developing or Third World that also have done similarly.
eh not to worry, they'll make one of those factors dynamic in fm23, you'll just have to buy it again. By fm30, we should see all those factors turn dynamic... Damn, it must be real nice to be SI, fascinating business model for sure, and fascinating how our community tolerates such crap
Or laziness. Either one.
To be honest they have to take responsibility for deliberate false advertising. A lot of people only upgraded to fm22 for that very reason..
This is really stupid, how disappointing considering how hyped of a feature this was.
I almost want to contact the swedish ARN to make a case of fraud. This is the main reason I bought the FM22 when I already have FM21
Agree.
Yeah, my save where I try to build up Mozambique has been thoroughly disappointing. Fm22 feels tactically easy (I'm winning a lot), but nothing can budge the youth rating it seems.
After 20 years in the polish league I used the in game editor to change youth rating I just couldn't wait anylonger
To be honest Mozambique's Sport minister announced a decade ago how we would one day win the world cup, and we haven't even qualified for the African Cup of Nations since. So feels like fm is working perfectly there...
@@fordgraca Yeah and England, Germany and Spain have been producing a lot of talent thanks to their Federation changing things up
One thing is the potential, other thing is reaching that potential.
Dynamic youth rating should mean more player with potential while facilities mean only the hability of a club to make a player reach that potential(with coaches).
The thing that pushed me to actually buy this game (I had been playing FM20, because it was free in epic games) was literally that feature. I kinda feel betrayed, tbh. Ofc I'm gonna still spend hours in this game (I already bought it instead of buying any other game, when I can barely afford one a year), but I for sure ain't gonna buy anymore if this is not somewhat patched.
I don't intend for Belarus, for example, to become brazil like ever, even, in the game. Not enough people, poor-ish country. I get it. But maybe getting it to the top 30-20, idk, see that change! It's really, really disappointing
Agree. So disappointed in SI. If they’re dedicated to ‘realism,’ then surely population should grow, and economic development improve, as is the trend for countries around the world during the past century.
Their "realism" excuse is always just their way of self-defense. Any time the playerbase is unhappy with something, they just say "well, realism" to shut us up. Hopefully, we can put enough pressure on them over this for them to make some actual changes to this FM over this.
Alright, my stance on this is actually that Day 1, the game should be as realistic as possible. It should strive to be the real thing as close to possible as can be. Once you press continue, however, that should be relaxed. Dynamism should slowly overtake the realism in an effort to make long term saves much more interesting. And when the real players are all gone, I want madness. I want coaches to emerge and drive Cheddar United to the CL. I want Zaire to become the next great superpower in 3150. Madness. Because that's fun and unique, and makes your save a perfect little snowflake of coolness.
SI yet again failing to deliver changes and features people wanted…
They get away with it because FIFA and EA are slightly worse, but make no mistake about it, SI are lazy as well
Fifa is a completely different game. We Are Football is their only competitor, and that game is half a decade away from getting 10yards close to fm, unfortunately.
Yes Zea, great video!
Impassioned, informative and rational.
The problem I have with SI's realism comment is that their game-world is already not realistic. Thanks to liscening we have "Zebre" and "Man UFC" we have players that by and large have personalities that shine a light on their more positive aspects rather than being realistic. We have in game financial wizardry that stops a player from ruining a clubs finances "too much." We have clubs that give the player more power than any club is willing to give a manager these days. Not to mention silly things like if I wanted I could make 20 managers, and manage every Premier League club, with the sole purpose of having each one collude to destroy Man City without the game intervening or questioning it in the press. Further to that, the game without DYR cannot realistically replicate the rise of nations like the USA (like you mentioned) or even things like the historic fall of Hungary as a footballing nation.
But, importantly real football isn't realistic. It's the sense of "anything could happen" in the real world sport that produces stories of glorious FA cup runs. Or, stories like Maradona and Pele-kids from deprived backgrounds going on to be one of the best players ever. Or the "1000-1" odds of Leicester. Im sure there are plenty of examples. But my point is real football is not realistic, that is the magic. Football is not realistic things happen all the time that "shouldn't." It's that romanticism that had us all dreaming as kids, its that romanticism that has us all on the edge of our seats as adults and ultimately its that romanticism that has us all playing Football Manager.
SI board needs to open their minds, football changed a lot in the last 30 years
it takes about half an hour to fix the real names, put kits, badges, logos, stadiums, trophies, city pictures and correct competition names and colours in.
I see why they've done it the way they have but I disagree. Until they improve this feature I don't see myself upgrading to newer versions of the game I'm afraid.
This will be their plan. Get you to buy FM23 because it now has a feature they promised 1 year earlier.
@@drm9575 Cheeky way these guys work, uh?
@@drm9575 this is why i stuck with fm19 unti i bought fm21, looks like i wont be upgrading soon lol
I gave up after 12 seasons , and bought FMRTE. Each time my team does well in continental cups (above quarters) i add 2 points to the NYR , when teams from my league do well in continental cups i add 1 point for each team. If the nation does well in the world cup or the euro (above quarters) i add 3 points.
I play with Farul Constanta in Romania and I manage both and Romania starts with 91 and i have increased it now until 110. I chose this team because it's a youth academy type of team like Barcelona based on it's vision and it's granted to give me wonderkids which I can then distribute in my league as needed.
One of the problems this highlights for me is the ghost nature of federations in the game. They're trying to chuck these limitations up to "realism", when in reality federations are not fixed numbers, but rather groups of people who take decisions and whose points of view can change. For a system of dynamic youth ratings to be fully functional, the role of federations needs to be dynamic itself, and preferably visible in-game, not just through numbers on an editor. There could be a yearly screen where the federation informs you of changes in youth ratings, infrastructure, and their plans for the future, which should be dynamic according to how your save is going (within reason).
wow I thought I was doing something wrong this entire time, I took Ireland as my build a nation and I took a small team from Ennis to the champions league. At the moment I've won the cl x7 and every other club continental competition at least twice. After a couple of years of glory I thought some change would of happened. I took over the Irish national team, from then I've won 1 world cup, 2x Euros and 2x UFEA nations league. Through the 20 years of youth intakes I've only gotten one player that could be considered world class around 159 pa. But this video answers that but I'm a little disappointed, as I would love to see Ireland be the bigger nation in the UK.
Ireland isn't in the UK though..?
@@GGMatt In terms of geographical location, sorry should've said that
@@GGMatt independent country
@@GGMatt the correct term would have been British Isles
I absolutely agree with you hugely disappointed with this. Main reason why I stop playing as there is no way to improve no matter how well you do
Unsurprising from SI, and very poor false advertisement from Miles as usual. But he won't care as he already has taken people's money.
The fact that tv deals can't change either is a huge problem as well
Maybe the best idea would be an option to allow more dynamic youth rating to turn on and to turn it off at the start point of a save similar to the sttributes masking, that way the player can decide if they want an extreme realistic save or not when it comes to youth rating
This is the first FM I've ever played in my life. Until very recently, I had little interest in football altogether.
On my first save, I took Wrexham from the Vanarama to the PL in back-to-back-to-back-to-back, 1st place auto-promotions. (Yeah I used 4-3-3 gegenpress)
I can do the aforementioned easily, despite 0 experience with the game and little knowledge of football, but we can't have *actual* dynamic youth ratings? Please...
They want to use the "we want realism" excuse as an argument, but it just doesn't add up, for the reasons you mentioned in the video, as well as a bunch of others.
Worst of all, in my opinion, is announcing dynamic youth ratings as a major feature and then not delivering.
The difference of opinion between us and the devs is one thing, but outright lying on a major feature is false advertising and grounds to sue or at least request a refund.
Macedonia's youth rating was 64 for long time. On FM22 it is 71 and it made my enjoyment playing with my local club in the regional leagues even bigger.
Тоа ми сметаше и мене минатите верзии. Колку и да правев успеси со мојот клуб, пак излегаа лоши regens во клубот секоја година.
П.С. Не знаев дека има и други од Македонија кои го следат каналов :)
What are the registration rules in the league ? How many foreign players you are allowed to sign ? :D
@@IL_Capitano_ up to 7 in the First League, less in the lower tiers
@@voislav1 so kogo igras?
@@Jazz-mj5tx последно играв нешто како мини верзија на Journeyman, па почнав со Кадино каде сепак останав повеќе сезони (Европа Лига најчесто влегував). А претходно имам играно и со Вардар (редовно влегував во ЛШ), но и со Осогово (Европа Лига многу често)
Agree strongly with your poins at the end. It reminds me of how there's a restriction on building a club stadium if your club recently built one as it's unrealstic for a club to rise so quickly. Surely that's approaching the issue from the wrong angle?
When managing an international team there should be options to invest/encourage youth investment based on your success on the pitch as there is at club level
This is a kick in the nuts for so many people's saves
wow I am so disappointed, I started a build a nation save in Bosnia and Herzegovina with my favourite club Fk Zeljeznicar Sarajevo and I noticed after many seasons that nothing changed and it is so sad. I was really hyped to build the nation and get it to the top. Now I know it is all nonsense thank you Z for clearifying the situation.
It's not real. It's just a game.
@@moneyaigencyy wow really?
@@moneyaigencyy thank you mate, your comment helps a lot hahahaha
To be fair, it is not the first time that Miles has led us down the garden path.
He's a rat
i did a 25 season save early on in the games life cycle, and i was in control of three norwegian clubs. all the clubs won the champions league at some point, with at least one of the teams winnng most season. 3 worldwide reputable clubs, 2nd most reputable league and yet a +7 to youth rating. england on the other side increased by like +30 for maintaining their top status despite our rise
This was the feature I was looking forward to the most. Holding of buying now until this improves in future games. I played FM 19 to 2074 so i love a long term save.
I gave up my 10 year latvia save last week, taking a Latvian team to the Champions League semi finals and the national team from 138th to 36th world ranking so far. My dynamic youth rating has gone up by 1 and honestly it's very demoralizing and takes away all the fun.
The unrealistic thing isn't that the youth rating would dramatically increase, the unrealistic thing is that I was able to take the club's to that level in the first place. The nation suddenly becoming way more invested in football is if anything the realistic thing to happen in that situation.
Also it should be possible to increase these other locked factors (FA financial power is a no brainer). If you look at club's like man city that have also contributed massively to helping and developing their local area. If you take a club from a tiny nation and make it one of the richest clubs in the world, buy state of the art facilities and have loads of players, staff and youth players on ridiculous wages for that nation you are sure to see a slight trickle effect in the local area.
I was looking forward to doing a build a nation save with a large country like India to see if I could eventually print wonderkids like Brazil does. From what I understand in this video, that doesn't seem possible. What a shame! I trust SI to fix DYR in the future.
Yeah, I was about to buy the game. Luckily I watched this video. So according to SI, you can win 40 Asian Champion's Leagues with an Indian club and 10 World Cups with India, the people will still not be interested in football and play cricket
The year is 2043, world cup winners San Marino still has infastructure where youth players must play on muddy pitches with one groundskeeper, Vitali, struggling to draw the lines. Football Boots are rare. Goal frames are wooden and there are no nets. Instead of cones, the San Marinese must simply rely on the holes in the ground for dribbling drills. Meanwhile, Brazil has just announced they now have bioengineered children who have been genetically perfected to become wonderkids.
I mean this feature is essentially a failure, loads of people were really excited about this, me included but it just doesn't really work and takes the shine off playing really long term saves in smaller countries.
It's one of the big reasons I even bought the game...thanks Miles.
@@logorex Me too. I thought: Finally! It has a point to play in my homecountry...
Also hats off to the editors and the animators for the quick turnaround in the WTS bit!!
Ah yes, we are finally going to talk about this. Thought my save was bugging.
I agree, more you win more the whole standings should increase.
Totally agree. One of the most frustrating things about games like this is investing 10s/100s of hours of your life, doing *everything* right, and only then finding out that the game doesn’t reward how you thought it would, or some dumb glitch prevents you attaining the goals you set out at the start of the save. I get the thing about realism, but surely a better aim for the devs is to allow players to create their own worlds that *seem* realistic to us, based on the efforts we’ve put in. If the FM world of football looks the same after 50 seasons as it does in the first, that’s pretty boring (and not IMO very realistic).
SI deleting their comment and the video’s title changing suggests “discussions” have taken place between Zealand and SI. Hopefully if so it doesn’t stop Zealand from criticising them so entertainingly in the future.
They didn’t delete their comment it got held by auto mod so I had to release it again, should be there now
Also I’d never give up my ability to do whatever I want, someone’s gotta keep them honest
@@ZealandonYT Fantastic to hear. Best FM content on YT.
OMG we already got a network save reference in the intro. Thank you Mr. Animator
12:53 - 13:42 - the essence of FM explained. Someone should print and frame this to Miles, for his office.
I think it's more than a little disingenuous of SI to claim a "realism" defense here when they specifically omitted certain effects of COVID in the game (postponed matches, players being unavailable due to illness with COVID, empty stadiums, etc.) despite them being very real things that we are still dealing with now. And they acknowledged that leaving those things out flew in the face of realism, but they did so because they wanted this game to be *fun*; an escape from whatever might be going on around you. Why can't the same approach be taken here? So what if the odds of San Marino becoming a global football powerhouse are slim to none? Let us do it anyway! Make it a slow process, but let us directly and indirectly influence that progression!
Doing a Luxembourg challenge nation is something that I've been considering for quite a while: they're going through a "golden" generation (to their standards at the very least), and it's a nation that has been achieving great results both as a league (Dudelange qualified for Europa League's group stage TWICE in a row... that was MASSIVE) and as a national team (they even managed to get a draw away against France).
After reading that the youth system would finally be dynamic I thought that it'd actually a feasible thing to pull off (I was even considering the option to create a team in one of its neighbouring countries' league systems, most likely Belgium, to help with the challenge's growth)... So, learning that regarldess of the effort and potential results I might pull off will be for naught... is a huge blow.
Not gonna lie, I feel both disappointed and disheartened.
Magnificiant video zealand! it's such an important matter than Si get to know these kind of opinions and thank you for voicing that in such a magnificiant way! I feel completely represented by your speech. Congrats and lets hope they consider more improviments on this in next version. Cheers from Brazil!
Okay i'm bummed about this. I have a save from the Beta with my hometown Finnish club SJK. I've built up the club and the league's reputation so that the Finnish league is 9th in the rankings and SJK are 3rd on club level after winning 2 champions leagues. In every window i invest in other finnish clubs with good amount of money and after all this work it could all be for nothing...
Unrelated to DYR, but you lot got a player (Monreal) on a free transfer from MY hometown club. And I just wanted to say thank you for taking him off our hands.
Hopefully he comes in gold for us as supposed to your trash then by the tone of it 😅
@@tomson123tomson Monreal played almost the entirety of the league as our starting number 9, he didn't score a single goal in the league and eventually got relegated to the bench by a 17 y.o youngster. He's the second worst striker I've ever seen at my club. If he actually plays well for you, that'd be a miracle.
He's going down to Veikkausliiga so you never know i suppose... *gulp*
Can't say I have too much faith in him. He dropped down to the second tier because he couldn't hack it in the first and then managed to do it even worse in the second tier.
well... there goes my dream to make Latvia a world power
Same here :( started with Valmiera, you?
@@VodkaHellstorm Started with them as well and played a handful of seasons. The league became boring, but never generated enough newgen talent to achieve anything but domestic success.
I moved to Jablonec in Czechia. I already have 4 youth players in 2 seasons that have great potential.
I would have stuck with fm21 if I knew dynamic youth rating was a inconsequential.
thank you for trying - a latvian
@@VodkaHellstorm I started with Liepaja. Beautiful city so wanted to play with them
I regret watching this video, I miss thinking that I could make Georgia the best national team
in fkn fifa manager 10+ years ago you could invest in grassroots. Really a shame that its not a thing in football manager yet
It'll be interesting to see what Miles says in response to this (if he says anything), as he's often extremely defensive, ewven rude, when dealing with criticism of the game.
No kidding. When I saw the intro, I was like damn… because I know that guy tends to be aggressively defensive in criticism, and he might see a “joking skit” as a slight.
Like, I feel mean pointing it out, but the fact that people all over the fan base knows it means it’s pretty accurate.
Lol I legitimately cannot wait to see his defense.
Side note: One of the unofficial save editors (it has 5 letters) you CAN edit game importance. And it's cheaper than the official ingame editor.
Yes I know that the unofficial ones may break things but you can edit something SI don't want you to that makes the game more realistic and something they should have done in the first place
I think the whole web of game importance, nation youth rating, financial power HAS to be revamped in accordance with international management. Intl management has long been neglected and somehow laughable compared to the rest of the game. SI should revamp intl management to include not only simple stuff like better interactions, trainings, selecting camp locations, BUT you should be able to see an FA’s financial situation and have a club vision, so as clubs in the country or the national team win tournaments/games and get more money (a way to increase an FA financial power?, you can go to the FA a say a vision we should have is to spend more money on grassroots infrastructure and thus the DYR increases in a realistic manner (a win-win for SI and those of us that want an actually REALISTIC intl management part of the game) with the World Cup next December too, I think FM22 would be an ideal time to implement this revamp too as people will probably be more interested with intl matches and management
Absolutely. They're talking about realism when the actual answer is that they don't want to bother building financial and game importance models for FAs. If they want it to be realistic it should be almost impossible to arrange home friendlies as an OFC nation. New Zealand last played at home in 2017, and the last home friendly was in 2014! Most OFC countries never play friendlies except right before the Nations Cup and Olympic qualifying.
Well, I guess I am glad I stuck with FM21 then. This might've been the big reason to get the FM22 but if not, then there is little reason for it. Maybe next year they actually make it worthwhile. Because if you can win Champions League with a small nation or team...you bet your ass that game importance etc will jump significantly.
Not to mention there are nations like Belgium who where nowhere near as good a decade ago and now they are a top nation.
Your description of FM players and why we play FM is so spot on. It's the reason I watch your channel (and streams). We're in it for the same reasons
I agree completely with you Zealand. A real dynamic youth system improves what is possible in the game. As you said, FM tries to be as realistic as possible which is great but no one knows the future and the global football map in 50 years time is likely to be different than it is today
it's true! if you told someone even right after the 2010 World Cup that the Netherlands would go through an inexplicable decline for like ten years just because their talent couldn't keep pace with the rest of Europe, you would get laughed at! the footballing world is more dynamic than SI have implemented, and I for one think it would be awesome to see an unexpected country do well. I won the 2022 world cup managing Senegal during FM17 due to a sort of one-in-a-million golden generation and it's a huge letdown knowing that's likely not achievable this year.
I actually disagree that being able to build up nations is unrealistic, look at Iceland, there should be things in place that you can suggest to the FA of your nation about putting plans in place, look at the German reboot
The German reboot? What's that?
@@Telsion don't want to be wrong but I think it's the plan developed by the DFB in the early 2000s that allowed the creation of regional centers for scouting and development of players (and other things) . Those player would later be signed by major clubs that would allow them to reach the pro level.
@@Telsion There’s a book by Rafa Honigstein titles ‘Das Reboot’ and it details the plan of how after bad tournaments and an ageing squad with big big egos the DFB needed to change and build the team that would eventually win the World Cup in 2014
Soccernomics by Simon Kuper and Stefan Szymanski goes into this in some detail and uses good data analysis to back up their findings, SI would do well to read it. Essentially the economic state of country/FA to invest in football doesn't matter that much, and in reality, poorer nations have wider pools of talent because many kids try to improve their situation by sport and can't afford things like games consoles, so they spend a good deal of time playing football as they grow up, it's the same basic principle as to why even in Western European nations so many top players have humble backgrounds. You do then factor in the more mathematical variables of population size and what other accessible things may be competing for kids attention, the cricket in India example. Belarus tends to support Olympic sports as well as football, so if we say Zealand's Borisov peaked football to the primary sport, if you look at population size and GDP as some kind of guide, it would probably compare to a Paraguay, and probably should never rival Brazil. This isn't a defence of SI promising dynamic youth ratings and not delivering it as they promised, just a view on when we talk about reality, what we're actually talking about.
Totally agree with you at the end of the video. I'm disappointed that FM22 dynamic youth rating isn't as dynamic as most people, and myself, expected. I'm still playing FM21 and enjoying my Fluminense save a lot, basically dominating South America and bossing everyone in the continent around, but I will think more than twice now about buying FM22 because of this. If Dynamic Youth Rating is affected by all those things, those economic things and so on, should also be dynamic. And yes, just as you said, I understand if there's no huge change immediately, but if I have one of the best clubs in the world in Belarus, following your example, I expect some form of tangible improvement in the next few decades. If that's not the case then yes, I'm disappointed. DYR was one of the main reason I wanted to switch to Football Manager 2022 sooner or later but knowing this now... Well, they'll definitely need to make things even more dynamic next year. Hopefully they will
Nice to see someone using my club lol
I’d decided not to buy FM22 after seeing the original feature announcements. This was the feature that convinced me to buy. Has Miles blocked you on Twitter for this video yet?
Lol who planned this?!
"Becoming more succesful as a club makes NYR less likely to increase"
"More success on a national level cannot change NYR"
"Investing in youth development makes NYR less likely to icnrease"
Could they list something that they think actually DOES increase it?
I'll tell you.
But you'll have to wait until November to buy FM 23. Preorder in September for the broken (beta) version a whopping two weeks early!
We'll have fixed it in the next instalment, we swear!
Best,
Miles Jacobson
Game importance should increase when clubs do well in international competitions and increase in prestige globally.
Holy shit, my forum post is bringing awareness to the issue! I feel cheated by the answers given by SI so far since the sims were reported, it's a shame
Thank you for this Zealand. I was planning on spending some Christmas gift cash on FM22. The biggest selling point for me was dynamic youth rating and being able to do a proper, long-term build-a-nation save. I'll now be sticking with my FM19 save and spending the money elsewhere.
Has been said a million times already, but "game importance" being fixed makes absolutely zero sense.
Exactly. This is the one (and maybe even only) this that absolutely should be dynamic. If Belarus have a team that wins the champions league, then they start doing well in world cups, absolutely game importance would go up. I can't see any reason why it wouldnt.
That's disappointing. Really wanted to build Ireland up but just seems like you'll be forever swimming against the tide.
Welp, there went my reason for buying the game, kinda wish I stuck to FM21 since I had a save going there, but I deleted all of that when I got FM22. Wanted to take Bodø Glimt to the top in Europe, while bringing the other teams, as well as the national team, with me.
Completely valid comments and couldn’t agree more Z, hugely disappointed at how DYR has ended up turning out. Own goal from SI on this one.
I like your ending argument, especially looking long term the growth is slow, but with big wins, more teams winning or world cup wins can help build the country youth dynamic rating. You did a great job.
Great video! And very much discussed topic. My personal intake is that DYR should grow with continous club and nation international success.
I commented about this on your last video yesterday, and also posted the link to this on the sub-reddit ... So I'm taking credit for this video. You're all welcome haha
Me 16 years into a Gibraltar save: 🙃
Edit: I pretty much monopolise the league and ended up handing out 1 million pounds to all the other teams in the league.
After seeing the amount of comments from people who have poured hundreds of hours into getting small clubs to glory, and now knowing that it will never improve that club/nation etc., what an absolute shit show.
SI need to sort that BS.
I've been playing Champ Man since 1992 on the Amiga.
It's 30 years later. Surely to F they can do this DYR thing properly.
Investing in grassroots soccer is absolutely a thing irl. Sporting KC have grassroots clubs all over the midwest, not just in Kansas and Missouri but in Nebraska, Iowa, and Arkansas as well. This is a fairly recent investment (10-15 years) and has already produced young players that have followed the path of grassroots->Academy->Second team-> First team
in the end si is a company that, like every other company, is interested in making as much money as possible. weve seen developers mislead their customers in the past years increasing a lot and since si has a monopoly on football sim genre, they probably think they can afford it because theres no competition anyways. just like ea
the way I see it the main thing that determines your country's youth rating should be how well the country's top teams are doing in Europe because as you said with the WC coming to the USA in the 90's, that had a massive impact or your youth, it wasn't that the USA did well (coz they didn't) but having that level of top talent from around the globe in your country would've had a massive impact, so therefore the more top talent playing in Denmark for instance the more impact that'd have on the youth of that country coz they're seeing great players performing at the top level in their country and if Danish teams are in the UCL there's a chance of playing against the greats E.g Barcelona, PSG, Man UTD and that'd bring more kids eyes to football and make them wanna play it
as a side note, although I think stuff like UCL participation is more important than stuff like a good WC run I still think it should have some impact, for instance when the WC did come to the USA, Bulgaria finished 4th and Sweden finished 3rd which is massive for a small country, so i think there is a balance to be found
You said it yourself zealand, if we had a DYR and played 100 seasons and the game is constantly feeling fresh because of it.. some might be less inclined to pay for a new FM every year :)
Thank you so much for not being an FM shill and making a video like this. Much like others in the comments I've done about all their is to do in the club scene, now I want to make an international dynasty and I simply can't with the way the game is currently programmed. It's pure laziness on SI's part, they're raking in the cash and have no incentive to innovate with next to no competition. Just as you said, it is SI's job to define NYR, it's not that complex an ask, but instead I'm sure we'll next year they'll just do the usual UI changes and add a couple of press conference response options because that's far less effort.
Good video. Thanks for the honesty you're treating this game with
Really appreciate how well you make your point about why we should be able to increase the youth rating at the end.
This is wild, glad I didn’t go for my Irish youth rating save right away.
Good to know my 12 seasons at FC Nordsjaelland and the Danish national team have been a complete waste of time...
Same with me. 10 seasons at Prishtina and Kosovo. The save is basically over for me. What a fucking waste.
If u want to play save more than 10 years your team will consist of 7 brazilians 1 columbian 1 mexican 1 belgian 1 dutch player and thata pretty much same every time. DYR has to be more “dynamic” and fixed.
Completely agree with all points
Keep up content enjoy watching.
SI pulling a EA on all of us and hyping up a feature that turns out to be a lie. Their whole explanation is convoluted and just straight up wrong. One example is how a country won't invest in a sport if a club is doing well. In reality if a sport is doing well they want to invest more. Here is NZ the govt. has put a huge amount of money into Rugby, Rowing and Sailing because we do them better than the rest of the world
I guess the only way to really build a nation is to do a one-league journeyman where you raise the quality of every team in hopes that a whole league's worth of youth facilities produce talent (still constrained by the stuff shown in the editor, though)