Unfortunately, the customer is the loser here. Fixing it after it is installed is far more expensive and sometimes impossible to do. Every time I see a job like that I just want to run and see it no more. I know the customer may never be satisfied. Hope you can do them well. Looking forward to follow up videos. GFM
+grayfurnaceman Completely agree! Thankfully on this job all ductwork is accessible so all these wrongs can be righted. Thanks for watching GFM. Been a big fan for years!
@@joshuaseaton4526 i’m not justifying their existence but it is important to remember jobs like this are the result of a gross lack of training. Unfortunately this is largely The case industry wide.
Great information here! I am always amazed at the shotty workmanship and simply ingnorant installation methods ESPECIALLY with zoning. I have been involved troubleshooting zone control systems since 2004 and this is more common than you would think. Thank you for showing the mistakes on this system because the more information like this that gets shown hopefully the less terrible installs there will be (wishful thinking).
Hey Dave I’m having a similar problem with my zone system which is fairly new. Would you be willing to do a consultation over phone to help me figure out what it is? It’s actually for my elderly mother in law. I can pay you if you’d like. I feel bad for her. Thank you for your time :)
LOL I want to say welcome to my world... people call me to come fix this kind of stuff at least one or two almost every week... some I have seen even worse than that one. I have a video listed as "Lennox to Trane with zones" that system was less than 2 years old when I ripped it out and replaced it. What a shame for the people in their new place they purchased as a retirement home. So if you get to fix this one at all Brad, we would love to see it after it is improved !!
Lol…. If you can’t get them to come back & repair…. there’s a reason! They know they butchered your system and they aren’t really good at what they’re doing! CHEAPER ISN’T ALWAYS BETTER!!!! I got tired of people haggling my prices & let them find out the hard way!!! U want cheaper low quality work…. have fun! That supply non plenum was an absolute joke! Smh!
Very interesting your video .. Im a house owner and I don't know anything about air condition but sometimes you try to save money and get people that is not qualified to do the job and this is the result ... pitiful
I have the same system and i have a bonus room upstairs. Its been working fine but now when i try to turn the air on up there it wont cut on. Downstairs works fine but nothing in the bonus room. Ive tried cutting the downstairs one off completely and kinds of other things. From experience any idea of what it could be? The zone 1 shows red and the zone 2 shows green on the panel if that helps
Wow the stuff we see and the clients who have to pay. I see these types of jobs daily and it frustrates me and makes me think that our industry lacks a lot good trained techs.
Inspected from the golf course. The homeowners lawsuit should certainly be able to include the town if they passed that garbage they are equally as responsible.
That guy must pay his installers by the foot. Thats why they dont stretch the flex. Cut the bag, let it grow a second, cinch it down and on to the next one.
Just moved into a house built kind of recently and I have 2 damper zones off of the main plenum, controlled by an HZ311 Honeywell Zone board, but noticed there is no DATS sensor hooked up to it. It’s a gas 1H/1 Cool system. Is it bad that the sensor is not installed?
Prob ok if you’re talking about the sensor that goes in the supply plenum!? Most ac have hi & low (press switches) safeties in them & the furnace have high heat limit safeties. If a damper isn’t working(for the called/desired area) the system will usually lock out furnace on several tries. Which indicates there’s a problem! Ac a little different! Jus occasionally monitor operation of your ac system in spring summer months! Should be ok 👍🏽 👌 👋🏼 If there’s an air flow problem in heat mode there’s probably an A/C airflow problem issue too!? Same dampers …. Same problems.
I think I could fix that zone by increasing the size of flex to the upstairs bonus room and bring it and the damper all way back to header end of the air handler plenum. When the upstairs call the damper opens and creates enough pressure drop to the downstairs that it would meet set point without over cooling too bad. No bypass needed
+Joe Shearer Thankfully the customer wants to pay us to do things right so no rigging will be required. They will then file a lawsuit on to thr builder from what Im told.
kind of looks like the best option is add a mini-split in the bonus room, get rid of existing ducts to it and leave the rest of the house alone. that is if the rest of the house is working right as is..
+throttle bottle This duct system and air distribution is terrible and far from working right. lol. I could never leave it as is. We will be fixing the duct system and correcting the zoning.
Hey!! I live here in Lexington SC. Have a Honeywell hz311 with zone 1,2,3. Zone 1 is down stairs and zone 2 is upstairs. Upstairs works great with nice cool air. Downstairs is getting no air. The system is just pumping all the cold air into the attic!! What to do?
Unless you use Aprilaire zone dampers with bypass adjustment! Totally agree with you tho! It’s a better set up with TXV! Especially large systems with by pass dampers etc. Long time ago I saw a house a retail retro salesman did! He had 3 zones on a 5 ton system! His basement zone had two 8” ducts on it! (Carrier 3 zoned system) with by pass! Our seasoned tech was sooo mad at the retail guy! Think it lost 2 compressors at that house! Such a stupid zone set up! Glad I was paying attention to what the veteran tech was explaining! It was before I had worked on zone systems!
Wow. I’ve seen a lot of bad zoning Jobs here in NC But that is God awful! I tell people all the time, The second you start to feel like the original company he’s doing damage control or being dishonest, get a second opinion immediately from an established company with good reviews.
And sometimes the home builder shops for the cheapest price, and the poor home purchaser holds the bag, in this instance the builder should be responsible for hiring unqualified company's.
Should just make it a slave zone IF they are not going to be using that bonus room alot. Cheapest way If not then like you said bypass and damper. And strap up all the ducts 😐
+Jesse Luna The bonus room is an office and the homeowner wants it done right no matter cost. They will be pursuing a lawsuit against the builder from what Im told.
Please tell me what stuff I pointed out that you feel doesn't make a difference and doesn'teffext the performance of the system? Airflow is a terribly misunderstood yet critically important part of this industry that far to me guys in the field flat out dont understand. This job and many others I've shown over the years are prime example of that. Its unfortunate..
Like you said thats a garbage job horrible strapping, horrible builder for letting it look like that in rough stage too at the end i bet the duct install was a easy overpriced money making day
This is exactly whats going on at work unfortunately their is 30+ homes design like this (Its the usual bonus room upstairs houses that all builders are doing) Long story short all that house needed was A extra 16/18” damper plus a bypass damper that way all all the dampers are coming out the plenum supply closing all the down stairs trunks to push the flow towards the upstairs damper and you know the rest
I know buddy I started in 1991 they all suck now. And I’d be lying if I said I never installed a Goodman ha ha hoping somebody comes out with Systems with 407C in them maybe someday we will have lower pressures and less leaking evaps
Watching that mess looks like everything down here in Florida and what really sucks is if try to do it right you won’t get the job because nobody will pay☹️ also these damn architects design these houses and can’t even give us 1 closet for our equipment. I’m old school I was brought into thus trade making metal duct and know a days it’s all spider duct because there’s no room for anything else with shit airflow
I might add , good metal trunks, sized at proper static , would be a start, it pi__es me off to see unqualified tecs doing jobs like this, it should be jail time for this.
Well reason why I mentioned that is it seems to be way more common with Goodman installers than others. In the rental house I live at, the installers of course put in a Goodman system, but not only that, they didnt do it properly. No surprise there, the plenums do not have the brake folds in them so every time the AC runs it pops, clicks, pounds, crinkles etc...
fyi every thing u point out have nothing to do with the heat or cool not working right the only thing u need to do just get the zone dampers to work right that will be it what’s the return box will do if the have 16 inch flex going right to the back of the unit what deferent that box going to make also if they use the 24 volt of the air handler transformer or separate transformer longer or shorter flex u really need to work on ur technical skill before u go around post videos with false information also do u know why thy don’t have a bypass u actually don’t need a bypass in the variable speed air handler because you will always have a sensor it would read the static pressure just friendly advice do some more homework
FYI, you are either "special" or have zero understanding of airflow, psychometric, zoning, the list goes on. Just a general moron I guess. I can tell you're a tool carrier because I show the model of the AH, and you still claim its variable speed. I've have clueless kids in my HVAC class like you every year. But at least they learn. Hopefully you will. 😂
Unfortunately, the customer is the loser here. Fixing it after it is installed is far more expensive and sometimes impossible to do. Every time I see a job like that I just want to run and see it no more.
I know the customer may never be satisfied. Hope you can do them well. Looking forward to follow up videos.
GFM
+grayfurnaceman Completely agree! Thankfully on this job all ductwork is accessible so all these wrongs can be righted.
Thanks for watching GFM. Been a big fan for years!
@@HVACinSC I would love to punch that installer in the face, seriously!! I can't believe he could ever think it would work.
Is there a city ordinance that the company must follow according to installation?
@@jeriyonka4176 Most cities, counties and states have install regulations.
GFM
@@joshuaseaton4526 i’m not justifying their existence but it is important to remember jobs like this are the result of a gross lack of training. Unfortunately this is largely The case industry wide.
Great information here! I am always amazed at the shotty workmanship and simply ingnorant installation methods ESPECIALLY with zoning. I have been involved troubleshooting zone control systems since 2004 and this is more common than you would think. Thank you for showing the mistakes on this system because the more information like this that gets shown hopefully the less terrible installs there will be (wishful thinking).
Hey Dave I’m having a similar problem with my zone system which is fairly new. Would you be willing to do a consultation over phone to help me figure out what it is? It’s actually for my elderly mother in law. I can pay you if you’d like. I feel bad for her. Thank you for your time :)
LOL I want to say welcome to my world... people call me to come fix this kind of stuff at least one or two almost every week... some I have seen even worse than that one. I have a video listed as "Lennox to Trane with zones" that system was less than 2 years old when I ripped it out and replaced it. What a shame for the people in their new place they purchased as a retirement home. So if you get to fix this one at all Brad, we would love to see it after it is improved !!
Anti DIY HVAC We get to see all to much of this hackery ourselves. lol
We call it putting out dumpster fires one house at a time. 😆
Great vid ... This really helps the younger guy's coming up ...
Thanks for watching Eddy!
Excellent informative video!!! Look forward to hopefully seeing some of the remedies!
KungFuMaintenance Thanks for watching!!
@@HVACinSC [l
0
us
Lol…. If you can’t get them to come back & repair…. there’s a reason! They know they butchered your system and they aren’t really good at what they’re doing! CHEAPER ISN’T ALWAYS BETTER!!!! I got tired of people haggling my prices & let them find out the hard way!!! U want cheaper low quality work…. have fun! That supply non plenum was an absolute joke! Smh!
Very interesting your video .. Im a house owner and I don't know anything about air condition but sometimes you try to save money and get people that is not qualified to do the job and this is the result ... pitiful
I have the same system and i have a bonus room upstairs. Its been working fine but now when i try to turn the air on up there it wont cut on. Downstairs works fine but nothing in the bonus room. Ive tried cutting the downstairs one off completely and kinds of other things. From experience any idea of what it could be? The zone 1 shows red and the zone 2 shows green on the panel if that helps
Wow the stuff we see and the clients who have to pay. I see these types of jobs daily and it frustrates me and makes me think that our industry lacks a lot good trained techs.
Wonderful explanation , is bypass damper required for 2 stage variable speed furnace and AC ?
I saw one just like that in NC earlier this month, guy said yeah his buddy installed it for him, it is 3 years old already an issue!!!!
Thanks for the video. Madness indeed. Was a permit pulled for this job? If so, did it pass any inspection?
Tc I'm sure permits and inspections were performed but that side of the industry is just as hacked as these fly by nights doing this sort of garbage.
Inspected from the golf course. The homeowners lawsuit should certainly be able to include the town if they passed that garbage they are equally as responsible.
That guy must pay his installers by the foot. Thats why they dont stretch the flex. Cut the bag, let it grow a second, cinch it down and on to the next one.
cheapest bid wins again!
Capitol Refrigeration,Heating,and Cooling Yep but this homeowner is suing the builder so cheapest bid is gonna end up being very expensive for them.
@@HVACinSC unfortunately the builder will probably file bankruptcy and open up with a different name the very next day.
Just moved into a house built kind of recently and I have 2 damper zones off of the main plenum, controlled by an HZ311 Honeywell
Zone board, but noticed there is no DATS sensor hooked up to it. It’s a gas 1H/1 Cool system. Is it bad that the sensor is not installed?
Prob ok if you’re talking about the sensor that goes in the supply plenum!? Most ac have hi & low (press switches) safeties in them & the furnace have high heat limit safeties. If a damper isn’t working(for the called/desired area) the system will usually lock out furnace on several tries. Which indicates there’s a problem! Ac a little different! Jus occasionally monitor operation of your ac system in spring summer months! Should be ok 👍🏽 👌 👋🏼
If there’s an air flow problem in heat mode there’s probably an A/C airflow problem issue too!? Same dampers …. Same problems.
Wow! That’s down right fugly! Hate that the customer got the shaft from some hack chuck in a truck.
I think I could fix that zone by increasing the size of flex to the upstairs bonus room and bring it and the damper all way back to header end of the air handler plenum. When the upstairs call the damper opens and creates enough pressure drop to the downstairs that it would meet set point without over cooling too bad. No bypass needed
+Joe Shearer Thankfully the customer wants to pay us to do things right so no rigging will be required. They will then file a lawsuit on to thr builder from what Im told.
@@HVACinSCI bet they didn’t win anything
@@brandoncorrea511 You would lose that bet. The builder settled w/the owner out of court.
kind of looks like the best option is add a mini-split in the bonus room, get rid of existing ducts to it and leave the rest of the house alone.
that is if the rest of the house is working right as is..
+throttle bottle This duct system and air distribution is terrible and far from working right. lol. I could never leave it as is. We will be fixing the duct system and correcting the zoning.
I figured there's other issues, there's rarely only one hack-fest spot. lol
Hey!! I live here in Lexington SC. Have a Honeywell hz311 with zone 1,2,3. Zone 1 is down stairs and zone 2 is upstairs. Upstairs works great with nice cool air. Downstairs is getting no air. The system is just pumping all the cold air into the attic!! What to do?
Just move to florida all homes are one floors 😂
Not true. Live in Florida and I have a loft and office upstairs with a full bath. Zone 2 is upstairs.
They left there duct knife & side cutters @ home that day ..they cut & do not stretch flex lol
Also, no TXV, a must have with zoning!
Unless you use Aprilaire zone dampers with bypass adjustment! Totally agree with you tho!
It’s a better set up with TXV! Especially large systems with by pass dampers etc.
Long time ago I saw a house a retail retro salesman did! He had 3 zones on a 5 ton system! His basement zone had two 8” ducts on it! (Carrier 3 zoned system) with by pass!
Our seasoned tech was sooo mad at the retail guy! Think it lost 2 compressors at that house! Such a stupid zone set up! Glad I was paying attention to what the veteran tech was explaining! It was before I had worked on zone systems!
@@orlandojohnson5742 The system still needs to have a TXV. ;)
@@markbeiser ok! Have a great day!
The branch should run off the flex and flex back to flex then add more flex to make it more flexible
What a flippin' cluster! This is why our industry get's a bad name, it's makes me furious!
Michael Housh Exactly right! Thanks for watching buddy!
Wow. I’ve seen a lot of bad zoning Jobs here in NC But that is God awful! I tell people all the time, The second you start to feel like the original company he’s doing damage control or being dishonest, get a second opinion immediately from an established company with good reviews.
What type of flashlight is that
Antonio Santiago Its the Dewalt 20VMAX flashlight.
I run into the same crap on a daily in ATL!
See this all the time, u get what u pay for, get the cheapest price ,get the crappiest job. Sometimes the homeowner is part of the problem.
Spaghetti city with the flex. Unfortunately this scenario is out there
Norman Fields Indeed it is and we make good money coming in a fixing these dumpster fires.
Hows the job market in SC??
They hire people from charlotte or atlanta to come work lol
lowest bidder i am assuming?
You get a Duct Board box!
YOU get a Duct Board box!!
EVERYONE gets a Duct Board box!!!!!
And sometimes the home builder shops for the cheapest price, and the poor home purchaser holds the bag, in this instance the builder should be responsible for hiring unqualified company's.
Should just make it a slave zone IF they are not going to be using that bonus room alot. Cheapest way
If not then like you said bypass and damper. And strap up all the ducts 😐
+Jesse Luna The bonus room is an office and the homeowner wants it done right no matter cost. They will be pursuing a lawsuit against the builder from what Im told.
16" is way to small for that return. That's a rat's nest of flex. I would've wanted to start from scratch.
I don't think that is as bad as your making it out to be lol. Picked out a lot of stuff that doesn't make a difference. What was the complaint even?
You seem to have this diagnostic in the bag. You tell me what the complaints were. 🥴🤷♂️🤙
Please tell me what stuff I pointed out that you feel doesn't make a difference and doesn'teffext the performance of the system?
Airflow is a terribly misunderstood yet critically important part of this industry that far to me guys in the field flat out dont understand. This job and many others I've shown over the years are prime example of that. Its unfortunate..
Did they hire a couple guys waiting outside home depot?
Probably
Wow man thats horrible
It’s gotta be Long heating and Air
Like you said thats a garbage job horrible strapping, horrible builder for letting it look like that in rough stage too at the end i bet the duct install was a easy overpriced money making day
🤦🏻♂️ WTF! I feel bad for the homeowner...
+Neil Comparetto Me too brotha.. me too
Blow Joe from the apartment maintenance complex crew who learned hvac from prison did this horrible job.
This is exactly whats going on at work unfortunately their is 30+ homes design like this
(Its the usual bonus room upstairs houses that all builders are doing)
Long story short all that house needed was
A extra 16/18” damper plus a bypass damper that way all all the dampers are coming out the plenum supply closing all the down stairs trunks to push the flow towards the upstairs damper and you know the rest
Start with that damn unit haha
Rip all that flex out and install hard pipe. I hate flex duct
+Tony Keith Not a fan of flex but it has its place in the industry. If sized and installed properly its a solid product.
That is really bad job, for new system. 1) return with no bypass. Poor duct design..
Shameful. More of the same half assery.
Stop worrying about the flex and worry about the BAdMan I mean Goodman
Goodman is just a brand. Sadly these days its ALL garbage that is not built to last. Regardless of what brand you sell.
I know buddy I started in 1991 they all suck now. And I’d be lying if I said I never installed a Goodman ha ha hoping somebody comes out with Systems with 407C in them maybe someday we will have lower pressures and less leaking evaps
Watching that mess looks like everything down here in Florida and what really sucks is if try to do it right you won’t get the job because nobody will pay☹️ also these damn architects design these houses and can’t even give us 1 closet for our equipment. I’m old school I was brought into thus trade making metal duct and know a days it’s all spider duct because there’s no room for anything else with shit airflow
I might add , good metal trunks, sized at proper static , would be a start, it pi__es me off to see unqualified tecs doing jobs like this, it should be jail time for this.
If anyone is getting jail time it should be the employers that hire unqualified people
Holy smokes
?
Typical goodman installer. Fly by night contractors, etc..
THEtechknight See it with almost every brand out there sadly.
Well reason why I mentioned that is it seems to be way more common with Goodman installers than others. In the rental house I live at, the installers of course put in a Goodman system, but not only that, they didnt do it properly. No surprise there, the plenums do not have the brake folds in them so every time the AC runs it pops, clicks, pounds, crinkles etc...
I don't see what the big deal is here, probably just low on charge!
Bless your heart...
HVAC in SC
Lol
Wow
anti-zoning lol..... hackety hack hack....
This duct work is trash
fyi every thing u point out have nothing to do with the heat or cool not working right the only thing u need to do just get the zone dampers to work right that will be it what’s the return box will do if the have 16 inch flex going right to the back of the unit what deferent that box going to make also if they use the 24 volt of the air handler transformer or separate transformer longer or shorter flex u really need to work on ur technical skill before u go around post videos with false information also do u know why thy don’t have a bypass u actually don’t need a bypass in the variable speed air handler because you will always have a sensor it would read the static pressure just friendly advice do some more homework
FYI, you are either "special" or have zero understanding of airflow, psychometric, zoning, the list goes on. Just a general moron I guess.
I can tell you're a tool carrier because I show the model of the AH, and you still claim its variable speed.
I've have clueless kids in my HVAC class like you every year. But at least they learn. Hopefully you will. 😂
@@fatimanasser9812 Be sure to "correct" my other videos. This could become very entertaining to share with my techs and installers. Hours of fun.
Lmfao.
poor quality 💩
A very sloppy job to say something.
+José Cruz Hack job