I just don't get why some drivers think that, just because there is some paint on the ground that they can close pass a cyclist? They must think it's some kind of magic paint that will protect the cyclist from the close passing lunatics! The thing is, if cyclists keep getting close past in a 'CYCLE LANE' they could decide to just take the main lane, especially with some police forces thinking it's ok to close a cyclist in a cycle lane; then the motorists will really have something to pull their hair out about. Especially when there is NO legal requirement for a cyclist to use a cycle lane!! Food for thought!!
Unfortuately in some countries (e.g. Germany) cyclists ARE required to use a bike lane if one is provided; even if it is inadequate or unsafe, as we know many of them are.
It’s sad reflection of the lack of proper protected cycling infrastructure in this country. You use the painted cycle lane on roads and you get a minority of drivers who will still squeeze past you. You ride in the primary position when you think it is safer and to not get squeezed past and you then get drivers beeping and screaming abuse that you should be on the left or some imaginary cycle lane. Until they sort out proper cycling infrastructure and more shared paths on pavements then you’re not going to attract more people to cycle and we are not going to get to net zero especially with 35m vehicles on the road. It’s because of successive governments transport policies being car centric we have got to this point where it creates massive agro and lack of consideration on the roads.
I would say that its not even a minority. I get far more close passes in a cycle lane than on a road without one even when they are the same width. I think far too many drivers genuinely believe that as long as you are in the cycle lane and they aren't, its not a dangerous pass. A moments thought would tell them that is ridiculous that you wouldn't have to pass with 1.5m just because of a bit of paint.
See my comment in the main for context, but I can tell you that shared pathways are horrible. The walkers walk abreast, & don't move out of the way. Therefore shared paths are only really useable in the hours of darkness.
That is not a cycle lane, its a road shoulder being used as a cycle lane. &, your traffic lanes are way, way too narrow for the traffic that they have to carry. Fortunately, I'm in Western Australia, which although not quite perfect, is a whole world away from your nightmare scenario. I absolutely would not ride on that. The other side of the country is very poor by comparison, but still far better than what you have.
I am pleased to hear that the cycling infrastructure in Western Australia is not to the same shitty standards as in the UK. The lane Paul was cycling in is an absolute disgrace of a cycle lane and is a damning indictment of crappy planning. I can only assume many local planners in the UK have neither ridden a bike nor possibly even seen one in real life.
@@Biking360 Actually you can see it on YT. There are a number of posters, Bug Bay Canada is one such, (hope I got that right) because it is so good. The newer sections are all on crushed limestone base so its smooth as, & doesn't move with age. Whilst the older sections are constantly being upgraded. Greater Perth is about 140 km north/south & about 60 or 70 east from the Indian Ocean. The bike paths cover the entirety both sides of the river, & are all interconnected. There must be a thousand kilometers of it now. All this was only made possible because our city planners of old, in their wisdom allowed loads of future proof free space beside & around infrastucture. Something that did not happen in the Eastern States. I live in Fremantle & bikes have legally mandated priority status in traffic here. Similarly pedestrians have priority status over bikes on shared paths. Moreover, the rail network covers the whole & one can take the bike on free of charge off peak weekdays, & anytime on the weekends to easily access any part of it. Weather is excellent 10 months of the year & if you want to ride with a tailwind in one direction, you can return by rail, or vice versa. Check it out if you get a chance 360, as I said, its not perfect but it is bloody fantastic nonetheless, & will give you a basis for thought, but remember that I also said that our carriageways are all wide. Quite frankly, I was horrified at what I saw in your vid. Its bloody lethal.
I don't think that is a cycle lane - it's just the edge of the road. If it is, it's too narrow, it undermines the 1.5m rule. Anyway, I'd have ridden in the lane, to the right of the white line. This would "claim the lane" and ensure there would be no possibility of the truck passing except by moving over when it was safe to do so and there was no incoming traffic. Keeping well over to the left can be misconstrued as an invitation to overtake regardless of how close the passing vehicle would be to the cyclist. claiming the road is not always easy but it avoids ambiguity and is safer for everyone.
@catshoemike OK. Same points apply. it's too narrow. Each vehicle keeps in its lane and a close-pass is the inevitable outcome. if the min distance to pass a bike is 1.5m and handle bars are 50cm (MTB) and we allow room for a wobble, no cycle lane less than 2.5 m should exist anywhere. Yet they paint these absurdly narrow and dangerous corridors as though they make cyclists safe. Quite the opposite. I think all cycle lanes could be just 1.5 m wide if painted down the dead-centre of the lane.
I agree with you that taking the lane to the right of the white line is a good option in these kinds of circumstances. It is a common strategy though it seems that the cycling community is quite divided about doing so. Paul in his detailed message to me confirmed that this is a cycle lane and not just a line painted on the road btw. However, it is such a shitty cycle lane I am not surprised that you would think that it wasn't. Ride safe. Jay
@@Biking360 Singaporeons like the Brits tend to follow the rules ..more or less so when somebody drives badly we tend to be surprised it stands out. Whereas the rest of SEA is more chaotic so you expect poor driving skills and adjust your expectations to suit. In Singapore you can legally ride on the pavements so most people do. And of course the pedestrians hate you as well as the drivers....so it's a no win situation. There are some weird laws in SG....handlebars cannot be wider than 700 mm and yes they will measure them and riding in groups of more than Six is illegal making club rides difficult .....funny old world we live....Take care Tim
Even if you dont need to navigate around objects the simple fact the turbulent air from the vehicles can cause the cyclist to be sucked in to the vehicle. Thats how on the side of the vehicle gets covered in dirt by the air pulling the dirt in and also why at a train platform you are told to stand behind the line so any passing trains you dont get sucked in. Thats the dangers to start with not just objects
@wrightwoodwork: "vehicles can cause the cyclist to be sucked in to the vehicle" You are so right 👍especially when a 44 ton lorry is close passing you within cms of your bike and handlebars. It's a very scary experience!!
Very dangerous!
I just don't get why some drivers think that, just because there is some paint on the ground that they can close pass a cyclist? They must think it's some kind of magic paint that will protect the cyclist from the close passing lunatics!
The thing is, if cyclists keep getting close past in a 'CYCLE LANE' they could decide to just take the main lane, especially with some police forces thinking it's ok to close a cyclist in a cycle lane; then the motorists will really have something to pull their hair out about. Especially when there is NO legal requirement for a cyclist to use a cycle lane!! Food for thought!!
There is absolutely nothing you have said that I disagree with. Thanks for the contribution to the discussion and of course ride safe. Jay
Unfortuately in some countries (e.g. Germany) cyclists ARE required to use a bike lane if one is provided; even if it is inadequate or unsafe, as we know many of them are.
@@nbartlett6538 Well I'm just glad that Britain isn't Germany just yet!!
It’s sad reflection of the lack of proper protected cycling infrastructure in this country. You use the painted cycle lane on roads and you get a minority of drivers who will still squeeze past you. You ride in the primary position when you think it is safer and to not get squeezed past and you then get drivers beeping and screaming abuse that you should be on the left or some imaginary cycle lane.
Until they sort out proper cycling infrastructure and more shared paths on pavements then you’re not going to attract more people to cycle and we are not going to get to net zero especially with 35m vehicles on the road. It’s because of successive governments transport policies being car centric we have got to this point where it creates massive agro and lack of consideration on the roads.
So, so true on all points.
I would say that its not even a minority. I get far more close passes in a cycle lane than on a road without one even when they are the same width. I think far too many drivers genuinely believe that as long as you are in the cycle lane and they aren't, its not a dangerous pass. A moments thought would tell them that is ridiculous that you wouldn't have to pass with 1.5m just because of a bit of paint.
See my comment in the main for context, but I can tell you that shared pathways are horrible. The walkers walk abreast, & don't move out of the way. Therefore shared paths are only really useable in the hours of darkness.
The 1.5mt is also required because passing vehicles create a change in air pressure that can push or pull the cyclist sideways.
That is an excellent point and thanks for pointing that out. Take care and ride safe. jay
That is not a cycle lane, its a road shoulder being used as a cycle lane.
&, your traffic lanes are way, way too narrow for the traffic that they have to carry.
Fortunately, I'm in Western Australia, which although not quite perfect, is a whole world away from your nightmare scenario. I absolutely would not ride on that.
The other side of the country is very poor by comparison, but still far better than what you have.
I am pleased to hear that the cycling infrastructure in Western Australia is not to the same shitty standards as in the UK. The lane Paul was cycling in is an absolute disgrace of a cycle lane and is a damning indictment of crappy planning. I can only assume many local planners in the UK have neither ridden a bike nor possibly even seen one in real life.
@@Biking360 Actually you can see it on YT. There are a number of posters, Bug Bay Canada is one such, (hope I got that right) because it is so good. The newer sections are all on crushed limestone base so its smooth as, & doesn't move with age. Whilst the older sections are constantly being upgraded. Greater Perth is about 140 km north/south & about 60 or 70 east from the Indian Ocean. The bike paths cover the entirety both sides of the river, & are all interconnected. There must be a thousand kilometers of it now. All this was only made possible because our city planners of old, in their wisdom allowed loads of future proof free space beside & around infrastucture. Something that did not happen in the Eastern States.
I live in Fremantle & bikes have legally mandated priority status in traffic here. Similarly pedestrians have priority status over bikes on shared paths. Moreover, the rail network covers the whole & one can take the bike on free of charge off peak weekdays, & anytime on the weekends to easily access any part of it. Weather is excellent 10 months of the year & if you want to ride with a tailwind in one direction, you can return by rail, or vice versa.
Check it out if you get a chance 360, as I said, its not perfect but it is bloody fantastic nonetheless, & will give you a basis for thought, but remember that I also said that our carriageways are all wide.
Quite frankly, I was horrified at what I saw in your vid. Its bloody lethal.
I don't think that is a cycle lane - it's just the edge of the road. If it is, it's too narrow, it undermines the 1.5m rule. Anyway, I'd have ridden in the lane, to the right of the white line. This would "claim the lane" and ensure there would be no possibility of the truck passing except by moving over when it was safe to do so and there was no incoming traffic. Keeping well over to the left can be misconstrued as an invitation to overtake regardless of how close the passing vehicle would be to the cyclist. claiming the road is not always easy but it avoids ambiguity and is safer for everyone.
It's a cycle lane, it has a broken line. If it was just the edge of the road it would be an unbroken line.
@catshoemike OK. Same points apply. it's too narrow. Each vehicle keeps in its lane and a close-pass is the inevitable outcome. if the min distance to pass a bike is 1.5m and handle bars are 50cm (MTB) and we allow room for a wobble, no cycle lane less than 2.5 m should exist anywhere. Yet they paint these absurdly narrow and dangerous corridors as though they make cyclists safe. Quite the opposite. I think all cycle lanes could be just 1.5 m wide if painted down the dead-centre of the lane.
I agree with you that taking the lane to the right of the white line is a good option in these kinds of circumstances. It is a common strategy though it seems that the cycling community is quite divided about doing so. Paul in his detailed message to me confirmed that this is a cycle lane and not just a line painted on the road btw. However, it is such a shitty cycle lane I am not surprised that you would think that it wasn't. Ride safe. Jay
Dangerous driving for sure.....it's a daily occurrence here in Singapore.
Sorry to hear that. Have you ridden anywhere else in S.E. Asia and is it the same? Take care. Jay
@@Biking360 Singaporeons like the Brits tend to follow the rules ..more or less so when somebody drives badly we tend to be surprised it stands out. Whereas the rest of SEA is more chaotic so you expect poor driving skills and adjust your expectations to suit. In Singapore you can legally ride on the pavements so most people do. And of course the pedestrians hate you as well as the drivers....so it's a no win situation. There are some weird laws in SG....handlebars cannot be wider than 700 mm and yes they will measure them and riding in groups of more than Six is illegal making club rides difficult .....funny old world we live....Take care Tim
Even if you dont need to navigate around objects the simple fact the turbulent air from the vehicles can cause the cyclist to be sucked in to the vehicle. Thats how on the side of the vehicle gets covered in dirt by the air pulling the dirt in and also why at a train platform you are told to stand behind the line so any passing trains you dont get sucked in. Thats the dangers to start with not just objects
A very valid comment and analysis. Take care and ride safe. Jay
@wrightwoodwork: "vehicles can cause the cyclist to be sucked in to the vehicle" You are so right 👍especially when a 44 ton lorry is close passing you within cms of your bike and handlebars. It's a very scary experience!!
Impatience certainly plays a roll, in situations like this but also bias towards cyclists also.
Agree 100%
Drivers should be banned and have to retake their tests, driving like that. I will have to say, It's not as bad as it used to be.
I agree with both points.
It was perfectly legal pass
Very interesting, thanks for sharing.
BV67 OUE.....Shocking!