Low Bar Squat Grip: Wrist, Elbow, Shoulder Pain
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- Опубликовано: 16 сен 2024
- Paul Horn Low Bar Stretch: • Low Bar Position Stret...
In this video I explained why I switched from a thumbless grip to a full grip with my thumbs wrapped around the barbell. I briefly explain why the low bar squat can cause wrist, elbow, and shoulder pain and some possible solutions.
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Untamed Strength is a Powerlifting/Strongman gym located in Sacramento, CA
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Best thing I ever did was purchase a red resistance band and warm up before low bar squat and I tell you the bar has never felt so comfortable. To warm up I hold the band with both hands in front of me and do 15 pull aparts (sort of like standing rear delt flies), bring my arms to either side of me. Then I hold the band above my head and do 15 pull aparts bringing my arms lower behind my head. Then I put band across my back, and repeatedly pull my arms in front of me and to the sides again (like I'm doing the seated pec fly), and finally I alternate the band in front and behind my body, rotating my arms to bring it over my head and down in front of me, then over my head and round to my back, going forward and back counts as 1 rep, do this 15 times. Take a few seconds rest between each of these exercises, more if your shoulders feel fatigued and you will find when you get under the bar, your arms are way more flexible and it's easier to get everything tight!
I also do dead hangs on a pull up bar between sets, and while warming up practice grabbing the bar and bringing my upper back towards it, and holding for a few seconds, while not actually touching the bar with my back. I take a rest and then repeat this 2 or 3 times, each time getting closer to the bar. Then I take a rest and then actually grab the bar and start lifting. Again I found this helps with mobility and with your shoulders and upper body all warmed up it's easier to find a comfortable position. I've been struggling with low bar squat for months, after converting from high bar, and it is so much more comfortable and tight now, warming up like this, vs wrist pain, and the weight resting more on my wrists than my back, due to flexibility issues. Try this! I also use a much wider grip, putting my little fingers on the hand position rings on the bar. Experiment with width to see what suits you.
This was helpful. I'm going to try the thumb-around grip. I have long forearms and get really intense tendinitis in my elbows and have to stop the workout from low-bar thumb-over grip. I can see in the mirror that thumb-over grip and trying to grip narrow pushes my upper-arms in so much that my elbows practically disappear behind my back. I am saying all of this, because I think there is a special population of people in the same bucket with me with the long forearms (at the bottom of the overhead press, the bar sits near my chin and it's impossible to rest the bar on my front deltoids).
I had on again off again elbow/bicep pain from squatting (low bar) for months. Everyone just told me to widen my grip but that didn’t solve the problem. What I realized is that I actually have less pain when I bring my grip in close, use a thumbless grip, and focus on pulling my elbows down to engage my lats as opposed to pushing them back like many videos say.
If you have elbow pain, I would suggest watching Chris Duffin’s How to Squat video. I had to watch it a couple times but after doing Smolov Jr for a month it finally clicked and I was able to dial in my squat. Getting your back tight and engaging your lats will help you get way tighter and remove pain. It also put 30 pounds on my squat within a month.
Still the best tutorial I could find all these years later
The placement if the bar was tricky for me. Im a tall guy of 6,6. When I placed the bar low, where i can get the right lean angle and create the most ammount of force, I had to grip so wide, that I re-racked the weight onto my hand... which was a great experience with 300lbs...
After that I tried a more narrow grip and just ruined my shoulder. It rolled out of that position when I stood back up and instead of just dropping the weight, I tried to hold it and turned my shoulder in a direction in which shoulders should not be turned while holdingthe bar. It worked! But only once... and again with 300lbs. Suuuper intelligent :-D And Im not even trying to get nominated for the Darwin Awards!
After that, I placed the bar higher, just a bit lower than the highbar squat. Now I can have a grip more narrow and secure, with neutral wrist position, no rolling of the bar or squishing of bodyparts, but now my backangle is way more upright, because I have to maintain balance over mid-foot. It also costs me 50lbs in my squat, because I loose my hip drive.
I have a realy long torso and realy long forearms, that wont allow me to rest the bar on my shoulders during the press. So... ? Any suggestions, what might help?
Thank you so much for making this video. I have been experiencing extreme pain when squatting, recently. I follow the starting strength program, and I believe in what Rip says…about most things. However, when I went from “thumb-around” to “thumbless” grip (to keep my wrists straight, I would have A LOT of pain in my elbows. Right in the bend of my elbows actually. And it was severe enough that when I tried to bench afterwards, I nearly dropped the bar in myself…and I was nowhere near my working weight set. I actually took 2 weeks off because of how much my elbows hurt. Now, I have a lot of anxiety about squatting, but being close-minded, I wanted to do it the way Rippetoe was saying to do it. I’ve gone back to a “thumb around” grip and it seems to be getting better.
These videos are great. Even if it is a subject I'm not 100% interested in, I still watch and like because its somehow relaxing.
Alan Thrall convinced me to purchase a one pronged belt after watching his video where he claimed it was the best belt. Now I’m squatting much better with my gymreapers one pronged belt. Thanks Alan!
Edit ✍️
Also my gymreapers knee wraps is a game changer ! That and I learned the low bar squat from Alan Thrall’s videos also!
Timing couldn't be more perfect. Saves me a lot of trouble and time searching the internet for answers, thanks Alan. Experiencing the exact same elbow pain as you are describing. Though not just while lifting, but throughout the entire day. Figured it came from low bar squatting, but didn't know what to do about it, now I do :). Had already made up my mind on going back to high.. Now I'm sticking to low bar! :D
When you're watching Alan Thrall and there's an ad for Kinobody's Greek God programme 😂
Darragh O'Boyle d'oh!!
then you should consider using an adblocker dawg
INSULT
i love how i just sign up at gym this week after ages of sitting on my ass and i somehow find you, uploading videos about all my favourite exercises!!! it's like you're inside my head!!! i attribute my successes to you, my friend alan
Full Force Did it work for you?
Full Force Yeah, but not either one will work equally good.. It seems pretty thought trough, so I'll give it a try
Timely video, been having trouble. Hope this works for me as well
Dude you just saved my life. Tried this and it worked. I was so depressed. Thank you
This is gold. Around the minute 3:30 when he talks about ribcage down but also elbows not too high. As I was learning to squat (I'm still on it), I was experiencing lots of pain in elbows. I was flexible enough, and warmed up; my problem was I was raising them too much. So, Alan thank you for saving time for the rest of people.
I don't know guess it very individual. I actually found that the thumb-less tip you have in another video actually helped me, since I have crappy mobility in my shoulder.
There is nothing wrong with a thumbless grip.
Sorry I have one more question... Do you recommend getting squat shoes? And is there certain brands that are better?
Yes, he recommended this in other videos !
Thank you
Αustin Baraki tamed Alan...
hah best comment I've seen on this channel
I always come back to this video to check my form
I had the exact same experience. I was 4-5 months into the Stronglifts 5x5 squatting with a thumbless grip - and my elbows (and shoulders) were killing me after every squat. I ended up turning my hands out a little bit and that was enough to relieve some of the pressure. I still squat thumbless now with no pain.
Sam Tidwell what do you mean?
@@bruthafromanothamutha7372 when you nod your head yes but you wanna say no
Mic is not on the beard? Dislike
Funny thing is you didn't actually dislike because there are no dislikes at the moment. It's awesome to be part of his fanbase.
Remy Fockaert haters will say I hit the thumbs up
@@illbeyourfriend3555 well now they removed the dislike button lol
I've been having elbow tendonitis from lowbar squatting and only recently figured out I wasn't doing 2 things: paying attention to thoracic extension and actively contracting the upper back. Those things have started to help. I'm still using a thumbless grip, too.
I don't recommend this for everybody, Alan, but on the Starting Strength forum, there's an post that was started where a guy rigged up a pair of handles out of pvc pipe and climbers rope. I started with this system when I initially started low bar until I increased flexibility and could do it without. Very useful for me at least
"You just answered your own question."
Classics Alan.
That hurt.
Gonna try these techniques tomorrow I've been playing with the low bar and the bar slid down by back today and this should help alot
Thanks for this video! I low bar squat and whenever I get above 70% max, my wrists hurt because I was hyperextending them. Will definitely fix that next time
On a low bar squat video I watched earlier I commented that I always warm up my rotators before a squat session, and noted that I can have a longer session with high bar because my shoulders don't like too much time low bar squatting. Hopefully this video will help me. Clicking play now
This changed everything for me. It's literally like everything you learned in starting strength is wrong. I find I'm having to undo nearly everything Rippetoe told me.
Love the comment at the end Alan! If someone says that something is completely impossible and that they can't ever do it, they're probably right...
Lmfao I was literally thinking throughout all of today during school; about searching up videos on wrist positioning on the low bar squat. Alan, you have read my mind you bearded fuckin genius!
Same lol
Your squat does look much improved Alan so thanks for expressing what has helped you.
Spotter's hat is on POINT-- "Gotta Catch 'em All"
I guess everyone is different. I started squatting with a full grip, thumbs around bar, 15 years ago. No problems. Then came back to competing after a 12 year break (just plateued and maintain with 315lbs squats in gyms off and on). After 8 weeks of training, I making gains fast, and so I was getting Golfer's Elbow (throbbing arm with pain in bicep). Then I changed to the thumb-over-bar while keeping wrist and hand flushed with forearms and now the Golfer's Elbow is gone and there is less pain. BUT now I get Tennis Elbow (Throbbing arm with pain above elbow). Don't know what's causing this, but I'm starting to think my joints haven't caught up to the fast growth in weights yet. Was hoping this video was gonna cure me, but very informative though.
Kingcredible man, this is what stopped me from hitting low bar again. I had this awesome squat day, hit a big weight/volume PR and was so happy. Next time I went to bench press my arms.... my biceps were destroyed. It ruined my bench and other pressing motions for over a month. I just can't risk trying to sort out what technique changes I can make to fix low bar, if all it takes is one wrong squat day to create a months injury.
I mainly think it was from making gains too fast and my body couldn't keep up with the speed of it. Never had this problem and I been squating the same way for 16 years. But I changed a couple things and it doesnt hurt as much. It went from Golf Elbow to Tennis Elbow. Golf Elbow is much more annoying to me. My body is great with Low bar, but i need to figure out the little thing that is causing this throbbing pain.
Kingcredible Hey man! You might wanna check out the RUclips channel Athlean X. The Guy is a physiotherapist and made a couple of videos on elbow pain. They helped me out pretty good! Hope that helps! Cheers!
aahh thanks. i randomly watch some of his videos but didnt know he had one about this subject.
Kingcredible No problem!
I am learning a lot! Just switched to low bar squat. Thank you for this Allan!
Love these videos 🤙🏽, trying to get away from the Highbar squat
Just want to give you all cred for your videos! They are awesome!! Just found you on RUclips, and already you are among my favorite accounts
Hey Alan, thanks for saving my elbows. its been almost a month of zero elbow pain.
Thanks for the tips Alan. My shoulders are a little junky right now, but the work continues.
good video. I also use wrist wraps (36 inch) when squatting anything after warmups - this eliminated any elbow pain for me
You mentioned that it's good to be nice and narrow/tight at the top, and I was just wondering why I see videos of powerlifters with extremely wide grips! Why do they grip so wide? Wouldn't this give them less control of the barbell? Also I've been experiencing some pretty aggressive wrist pain after switching to low bar, but overall I agree that low bar is the better option as my numbers have gone up. Great video with simple tweaks that I can see working super easily, I will definitely be implementing these modifications and reminders on my next squat day!
I'm still super stoked that I meet u at Disneylamd
Starting Strength is the way to go! Great video.
this pain is exactly what is happening to me. thank you for the tips.
Alan you are really starting to sound like a starting strength coach. Are you going for that certification? I am not very mobile in the shoulder area, but as you said low bar squats really help stretch them out. High bar squats were miserable for me personally, the lower position really helps my squat depth. Still working the mobility in that area tho. Anyway thanks for the videos and sharing your experiences in your lifting journey.Peace bro!
He has the Starting Strength Coach cert. There's a video on this channel, called "I Am a Starting Strength Coach," if I remember the title right.
Thanks for this video. I've been having exactly this problem.
I'm glad you made this video, I feel like about 5 % of people squat with there wrist down
Was excited to see this video. But really didn't go into my shoulder pain issue. My shoulders ache even the day after I squat. Will try the the thumbed grip.
You tell the problem and you solve it 🎉
I was having the same problem and this was the same thing that helped me.
I had this elbow pain issue. I ended up solving it the same way I actually solved a should pain issue when benching, forcing my neck back to force that tightness.
I always do LP until I get to 255 bench for 5. 315 squat for 5. 155 ohp for 5 and 315 deadlift for 5. I always quit bc I get low back pain from dead lifting and then going to work heavy construction with a fatigued back, and painful wrists and elbows from the squats. Wish I could afford a coach to help me throigh this but this video helped me a lot. Maybe I won’t quit this time
Good note about the skinny guys. My has started low bar squats but he's very lean and has very little if any rear delt shelf to rest the bar. I've been coaching him to keep his elbows down and tucked but he complains it's uncomfortable/painful. I'll let him slightly flare back his elbows to create more shelf. I noticed the bar has a tendency to roll down on him.
Thank you for this. I recently tried switching from high bar to low bar, and was finding myself using a full grip on the low bar, when I had been thumb less on high. I was fighting myself to try to stay thumbless.
Dude, I suffered what my doctor could only describe as a “mega-cramp” from low bar squatting 😩😩😩 I love them but I have to re-evaluate once I have the strength back, it was so bad that I lost almost all the strength in my left bicep and shoulder girdle... I start physical therapy today to further diagnose and repair what damage has been suffered... I believe it’s because I was using a super narrow grip
Athlean-X and Alan Thrall are my guardian angels.
Killer content as usual homie, keep up the hard work!.
Alan, do you have any advice on beard itch. I'm at the itchy stage and it's driving me nuts
I use a bristle hair brush to scrub the skin underneath. No more beard itch after I discovered that trick.
Matthew Collins it's a test of how bad you really want it
Groom Untamed!
Hey Alan! I have a question about stance width and toes pointing outward. I have very tight hips, I have a desk job so I sit for at least 9 hours a day + additional sitting at home. I also have poor rotation of the hips, lying down with knees up and at 90 degrees I can only rotate my legs out like 5 degrees. I squat a tiny bit wider than shoulder width and normally point my toes out like 45 degrees, I do however get a slight hip pain. Stretching my hip flexors normally makes the pain less severe however, pointing my toes out even more fixes it completely. Imagine like a sumo squat, if I point my toes out like 70 degrees it feels fine. My knees don't cave in and it seems fine overall. But are there downsides to pointing your toes out this much? I'm working on my hip mobility, I try to stretch and open my hips every day because that is how tight they are, so hopefully one day I'll be able to turn the toes in a little bit more but until then, are there downsides to pointing the toes out this much?
@@MartianManhunterNumberOne did ypu ever find a solution to your hip pain if not just try warming it up better with the empty bar until it feels good
Just got my first taste of that elbow pain today, it comes on shortly after i rack the bar and it ain't nothing nice! Driving my elbows back instead of down made the aftermath of the last sets far less painful. I'm a 6'8 string bean and finally found a squat that doesn't want to snap my ass in two or make me fall over backward. I really want to squat so i'm praying this is the first and last time i experience this.
thank you Allen for the good work you always do and you're very helpful tips thanks.
Didn't know the legendary Punchnugget had a name!
I honestly went through this exact same issue over the last 3-4 months. The only thing that eventually helped was simply increasing my squat frequency so that my body better adapted to the position and the forces pushing against it. It used to be that it was impossible for me to do any upper body exercises within three days after squatting heavy. Now I can do a heavy chest/shoulder routine the next day and not notice it.
One thing that helped me was stop bending the bar, but instead just leaving my hands on top of it. When playing with a wider grip I get shoulder pain. WIth thumbaround grip I get wrist pain.
Good thing you had a coach. I ended up with tendinitis a month in, from not understanding things as clearly as I do now, and took about a year before my elbows started to heal. I think they're ok now, before I'd have intense pain while power cleaning or chinning. However, my PCs seem fine and as my chins increased the pain got better until it essentially vanished. I guess the real test would be to wrestle with someone since that alwayd seemed to cause it to hurt right away, and chins/PCs/squats aren't causing pain anymore.
I am in the early stages of what you just described. I've got some pain doing chinups now, and I've started lowbar squatting 3x a week again after a break in lifting, - (I can still squat pretty heavy) what exactly did you do to prevent your elbow pain? I'm afraid I'll develop tendinitis.
OlavHaraldsonDenHellige ! Make sure you're supporting the bar with your back not your arms. Do what Alan says.
If you do get injured you can search the startingstrength website for ibuprofen protocol and chinup protocol. Ibuprofen is useful for an acute injury but once it becomes tendinosis (like in my case) it takes a lot of work and pain before things feel normal.
First I fixed my squat. Since my elbows would hurt while squatting and the initial injury happened during the squat, I knew that something was wrong. Basically, Alan covers all the issues that I can think of. I think I initially jacked my elbows up way too high, and the bar was elevated slightly by my wrists because I was taking an excessively narrow grip relative to my limb length and flexibility. I guess my forearms are a little longer.
Next, pain still lingered during PCs and bench presses but I trained through it. Failed PCs were horrible and I think part of the reason my PCs stalled for so long was because of my elbow pain.
Worked on PCs at lower weights but with more volume. Started losing weight and as I lost weight my ability to chin increased. That's when the biggest improvement happened. First time I got sets of 4 my elbows hurt bad for 20mins then next session 4 was fine, but 5 causes pain. by the time I got to a set of 7 pain was gone during chins. I do my chinups as conditioning atm, so it's based on time rather than setsxreps. I'm back to progressing my power cleans again, as they cause no pain.
But first and foremost you have to figure out what's causing the pain, otherwise you'll just hurt yourself the next time you squat. and what I said worked for me because I had already fixed my issue while squatting.
I hear that. I thought tennis elbow was a fallacy until it happened. it's truly grim.
man i love how you reefer to "starting strength" its really professional. keep it up
Thanks Alan, super helpful video as always!
Alan, make a how to olympic jerk a barbell video, from the front and from your back. Maybe include how olympic lifters drop the barbell back on their shoulders after every rep.
Thanks this video helped a lot. I used to rest the bar too high and my bones would hurt after squatting. then i would squat with bent wrists and i would get sore wrists after each set. ill try these tips.
Very insightful video Alan. Subbed.
Thanks much Alan. I've recently started applying your tips which have been very (very) affective. But at the same time that pain you've mentioned I'm experiencing it. So I will try that palm wrap around the bar and see if it makes a difference. Thanks again #trainuntamed
My elbows are fked after 2nd session of low bar squats.. made me order elbow sleeves today! Going back to high bar for now until sleeves come in and now will try the thumbs around bar instead of thumbless grip!
why are you forcing yourself to go low bar? If you are competing in powerlifting, you can just squat high bar.
I’ve only ever had forearm pain from the squat. I remedied it by getting a slightly wider grip
Did you feel that this compromised your back muscles holding the bar?
Loving this Intro!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is one more possible side affect of poor barbell position during low bar squat, that's biceps tendonidis which is due to weight pressing on arms, and then some of the load is transferred to soft tissues, like biceps tendon. Painful and makes bench press impossible.
What kind of poor barbell position? My biceps tendon hurts after squat and I feel pain on benchpress
I think I know why I have this problem? It must be my tiny hands and short arms. Probably just making excuses. I don’t think I’m inflexible, either. Or maybe my chest is just getting too up.. my elbows are definitely down so I will try this next Tuesday.
2:56 proud dad moment 😂
Interesting... I seem to have had the exact opposite experience with low bar squats. I've found that it works better for me to use a thumbles grip and as narrow of a grip as possible. That way, the bar is resting properly on my rear delts as opposed to being supported and locked in by my arms. I remember completing three mere reps at close to 1RM, which is challenging in and of itself.... but my arms hurt like crazy afterwards, because they'd been supporting much of that weight. Well, different things work for different people.
wider grip + wrist wraps helped for me
Phlegm Atic Good point. Wrist wraps will help to force you to keep your wrists straight.
Just changed to low bar squat and in 2 weeks I started having the same problems as you with the shoulders. elbow pain and cannot press. So Im gonna try it.
haha the way you smacked his back and said "thanks" made it seem like you two phucked last knight but you haven't "talked about it" yet xD
wtf lol
Lmfao
I like how it's pretty easy to believe Alan is still natural.
decent lifts that could have been achieved through good hard work.
hey Alan what program would you suggest starting for a power lifting meet in July
Back squatting with high frequency always gives me bicep tendonitis.
That's why I wish more gyms had a safety squat bar. You still get the benefit of a back squat. But hands in front eliminates the arm position.
I’ve never had surgery on my shoulders. I really really love the low bar, but stopped because of shoulder pain due to age related arthritis. Im 44. I’m trying to avoid surgery.
I’m now doing high bar with no issues but have dropped over 50 pounds in my reps. I’m depressed because I became addicted to low bar after watching all of your videos.
With age related arthritis, is it possible to do low bar squats without inflammation? This solution would be worth gold to me.
As I started using the low bar squat, I noticed that everything git easier. No pain in the neck or the shoulders. And focusing on the hipdrive enabled me to be stronger in the squat. For me the thumbless grip made a difference. Being skinny, there was no problem finding where to place the bar. I know this is a squat-video but I remember a question I have about the press. I have watched some starting strength videos and the way they do the press, and bend their body like a bow, makes me wonder. Isn't the press supposed to be strict ? Just pushing the bar with your arms and shoulders. I would really like a video where you talk about this.
Hey Allen, really love the videos, really wish Elliot Hulse still did videos like this.
Anyway, I feel like I have the same problem you do in regards to squatting too deep, is there anything you do to focus on cutting some depth off your squat? And also, are there specific stretching routines for specific training days you do? Thanks for the read!
Also be aware that in powerlifting certain federation require you to use a thumb around the bar grip...you will be red-lighted for using thumbless.
Is this true? Which federations?
Thanks a lot for this video! If you are a gamer or work a lot on the PC, make sure to do daily mobility and stretch exercises for your forearms and wrists. The strain you put on these will transfer into your lifting causing pain or potential injury but always compromise your performance!
high quality content
I needed this! Thankyou.
Hey Alan! Thanks you again for your content, Awsome job!
For anyone interested, I have the same Issue with my elbow and I use the grip Alan swapped to. Im trying to figure out what the reason to the pain is. And im begining to think it has to do with how I have a flawed hipthrust and that i probably try to push the weight up not just with my hip & leggs but also with my hands. Not sure yet thou and im gonna try and do some lower weight lowbars with a verry wide grip to ensure I cant push with my arms and see it it goes away.
Thanks again for your videos! //Peace
I've been having the same problem with my elbows lately from squatting every workout.
had severe elbow pain and did the exact opposite lol but it is because when I wrap my hands I tend to want to support the bar with them
Nice, a very rare video to the own expieriences and not just another brainless "how to do", great job , thank you very much for sharing.
Thanks for this video helped alot!
for shoulder pain from injury, immobility, etc, you could also cheat and use a camber bar/duffalo bar
Alan please do hip pain, knees and ankles. Would appreciate it as i am trying to deal with my hips at the moment. Not allowed to do squats or deadlift for few weeks, it feels like my life is on pause 😔 i started to do 5*5 program, don't think my hips could deal with as many squats a week, as on week 5 my hips started to get sore, ignored it for a while and now i cant do a squat with empty bar.
Newbie here. I find this grip very difficult, I don't have enough flexibilty in my arms and shoulders and it's quite uncomfortable for me to reach back that far. I've tried various grip widths. Any tips?
I have a pain in the "shelf" and everytime i go a low bar that pain comes back after i put more than 60%. Where to look for solution?
my elbows are in so much pain squatting had to stop squatting today cause it was hurting so much, was suppose to bench as well
Thank you Alan. May your beard always be full.
Fuck yeah man! Giving this a try!
I recommend wrist straps if you experience wrist pain.
Strangely I was getting wrist pain from a thumbs over grip with straight wrists. When I switched to a thumbs around grip with slightly extended wrists, my wrist pain lessened. Perhaps I was supporting the weight too much with my hands with the thumbs over grip.