New Boston Marathon Time Standards for 2026?! Sage Canaday Running
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
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Thanks Sage. It's an interesting topic, glad to hear you looking forward.
The cutoffs were approaching 7 minutes recently, so the new standards are basically just accounting for this.
The gimmicky massive net downhill marathons should not be considered. I would imagine this would account for a decent amount of the people with BQ times. I’ve noticed that these downhill marathons are pretty popular amongst the influencer class who just want to say they have run a “sub 3 bro” but instead they just threw themselves down a mountain
Boston is a downhill marathon. Should Boston not be a Boston qualifier?
@@LearningFast I am not sure what was confusing about my post. I was referring to the revel type marathons that basically drop you off a cliff that Sage talked about in the video. Boston does not fit that description as it has close to 900 feet of elevation gain despite the fact that’s it a net downhill course. Anyone that has run Boston will tell you that it’s an honest course and is in no way related to the types of marathons Sage referred to or that others have also pointed out in the comment section.
The Marine Corps Marathon is a great race. It’s for everyone!!
Getting into Boston feels like one of the last attainable, yet fair goals in running. A 2:55 marathon is quick, but you can still have a life outside of running and hit that goal.
The people shouting about how soft gen-z is and "Kids these days are entitled!" and "They all want a participation trophey!" are the same ones commenting "no no please make it a lottery I deserve it :("
Hypocrisy and cynicism make the world go round, not compassion and gratitude.
First😎
Enjoying the content, it has helped a lot
why binary need less time..... comon dafuq
Yep. People cheat. All the time. And this just opens up the opportunity to simply declare oneself running in this category and that’s it. You get a place a potentially push out other men or women that would have had that spot.
I don’t care about people gender. But it should be fair laying field and those that have gone through puberty as a man have an unfair advantage against those who did not. Therefore they need to qualify with the time related to those having the same body development history.
Category shouldn't even exist.
Male female that should be it.
Yeah dumb. And it’s just the same times as the women’s category. Like, why? Just to virtue signal pretty much
I have been joking to people I can either keep my pace and wait until I get to 80 or cut my dxck off to be qualified lol
💯 Right on, Sage!
That’s how Chicago marathon does it - if you meet a standard you’re in!
Also, REVEL downhill marathons and other downhill marathons certainly contribute to faster times, which can then affect cutoff times… and can’t compare it to flat marathon (or hilly) times… Boston should do it the way Chicago does it - if you BQ you’re in… even if they have to increase the field size or raise standard even more…
The logistics of the Boston course make it so they really can’t increase the field. It’s already a struggle to bus 30,000 people 26 miles west of the city and then squeeze them all in the relatively narrow roads that make up the course.
Hats off to all marathon racers. I top out at the half marathon limit, I have no desire to do a full Marathon.
I said the same thing until I challenged myself to run 16 miles. After that I only had 4 to go. 😂😂 That being said, I’m very slow.
@@MNP208 well you still have six more to go after that for a full Marathon 😉😊.
I read an interesting Reddit that recommended that a separate charity marathon be introduced, due to the amount of applicants they have. Would open more slots to time qualified runners
@@joshuaroque6514 interesting thought but putting in a race like Boston is a huge and expensive undertaking, commitments from cities, volunteers, the public, the sponsors- to expect them to do it again with the same fanfare and excitement would be a colossal ask.
Runners who do qualify should be admitted before all these charity runners that just pay their way into running Boston with slow times!!!
its a business ,betting baa prefers the opposite
One thing I really wish is that there was more access to races for those of us who are of lower income. Because I see a lot of runners in the U.S. seem to have a decent amount of money, but lots of us don't and so we end up either not being able to race in dream races or having to save up for a long time to do a race, or being set back/in debt. Especially when living in an area that doesn't have races or competitive races. But a lot of these races are price gouging, as you said Boston does. Which obviously some races do it would be alright but it seems like every race is doing it now. If they lowered the prices more people would be able to do it.
Booked in to do my one and only Boston for 2025 with a 14:29 buffer. Could well be my last major as I have no real desire to add Chicago and Tokyo to my other stars at the price it will cost. Abbott have almost put me off running Sydney which I have had half an eye on since 2017 as I was considering ticking off a Marathon on the remaining Continents I have yet to run one on. It's definitely very expensive for someone on a lower income. I have already seen and done more than what I would have ever believed possible. Wouldn't mind returning to Africa and having a bash at Comrades. Would love to tick off a race in Asia (Hanoi, Beijing and Mumbai might not be World Majors but all look great events and would work out cheaper I would imagine). I would much rather run the Rio Marathon than going to run in Chicago just because it is a missing Major. If the prices of Sydney are hiked due to it becoming a Major then surely it would be better to try for another destination if I can ever afford to get myself to run somewhere in Oceania. The Antarctica one is just ridiculous. There are definitely many businesses out there trying to gouge every last penny that they can from those willing to pay in the running community. Everywhere other than the ones that I have run in Eastern Europe or at home over the last 3 years appears to be getting quite costly. Boston was never really in my plans until I started to edge towards the qualifying time required and thought why not after ticking off the other 3 Majors that I probably would have picked out of the 6 to run in 2017.
I think it’s good the times are lowered. I have qualified (yet) put improvements in training , shoes etc mean people are running faster. Keep the standard high👍
I have run Boston twice for charity as I am someone who will never make qualifying time. I am incredibly grateful for those experiences. Those of you like me who need to run for charity - do it! Know that raising the money required is just as difficult and time consuming as the training. All things considered, the race is really that great and totally worth all the struggle to get to the starting line. Stoked you’re running it again, Sage! I’ll take some footage of you around mile 7 and send it to you on instagram.
How would you feel about having a separate event for charity runners as opposed to taking a spot from someone who had a BQ? I'm just curious. I mean I'm all for charity and charity races, and I commend you for the work you put in to raise the money, but the truth of the matter is that due to field size limitations, for every charity runner, that is one less BQ runner that will be able to participate.
😂😂are you for real? He's not taking any one else's spot, the organizers have those spots for them exclusively, if someone didn't get that BQ that means they didn't run fast enough, besides , it's not like it's the end of the world, go back and try again and again till you get it. stop crying., life is not supposed to be fair or easy. @@justinnevins107
Also..even though the qualifying times have become faster, the time required to actually run the race remains the same. This just means less paperwork for BAA.
thank you for calling out the price gouging. I just got really turned off by boston this year and probably won't ever run it again. I was looking to register this year with a 28+ min buffer but the cost is not worth it. I'm glad to just give my spot to someone else who earned it and wants it way more than me. I'm going to be looking at other races now, but I don't imagine ever running Boston again.
🙏 Sage
Hard no on the lottery for Boston. I do think the big net downhill races shouldn’t count as BQ events. I’d like to see the BAA adopt a ratio or to account for net downhill races - like for every 100 ft of downhill, the course must have at least 50 ft of uphill, or something to that effect. Big Sur is an example - net downhill I believe, but like 2k of uphill out there.
great points!
In my opinion the "double dipping" where you run a time qualifier during the first week in September which allows you to utilize the time for current year and next year entries, should be abolished. Some of those specially organized races are also net downhills for sole purpose of getting into Boston. As far as setting preference for first time qualifiers over those who have run it multiple times, this would in my opinion again, only reduce faster runners from ever applying.
I think updating it by 5 minutes is better than it being 5 minutes slower but you stell needed to run 6min faster than the qualification time
The time to qualify is harder but yeah, the time to get in stays the same. It just means fewer applications (which may be a lot nicer for the BAA people going through applications).
@@IanLoughead 100%. I'd rather know than have to sit and wait for several months to see if I made it or not.
The moving target is really frustrating, but with so many applications they'd have to drop the standard by 10min+ to ensure that a BQ meant guaranteed entry. I think the downhill races need to be eliminated as qualifiers.
I knew this was coming. I just did Boston this last year and even to get in for my age range you needed under a 2:55 which they don't tell you that before you race your qualifying race. So going into my race all I knew was sub 3 would be good enough. Luckily, I blasted through with a 2:52.
nice work! congrats!
I love running Revel races and I will not apologize for it😂
would you count them as your "PR" though?
@@Vo2maxProductions 100%, and I do. My feet still carried me 26.2 miles. If anything, as someone who lives at sea level, the downhill cancels out the altitude for me.
Either way, I’m not a professional athlete, just a guy trying to push myself to improve so if I’m improving my time on those courses then I’m still improving
I'm going to give a positive shout out for the charity places. As a Boston local - I see how much the race takes over the cities - not just of Boston but all of them along the course.
The race's existence and history is built upon the goodwill of local people, thousands of volunteers, and tens of thousands of spectators that make it special.
Its absolutely fair for the race to give back to those communities and the charity runners are one of the key ways it does so.
Don't be upset if you (like me) have ever "lost a place to a charity runner" - there wouldn't a race to lose a place to without them.
Having never run Boston (yet), I've heard discussions about expanding the field size and then the topic of it having a huge impact on the communities it runs through. The streets being closed for the majority of the day. Why does the race start as late as it does. Could it not start at the same time as most other marathons? Is there a reason for such a late start?
1st time boston qualifiers, auto in. let ppl live their dream. everyone else can go by time cut off or lotto draw.
I don't hate this idea
First year I ran S.F. and then CIM they changed the qualifying time under 3:10 in my age bracket and I ran a 3:05:23 first CIM, now I'm finally so close to qualifying thinking I'll run this one under 3:05:00 and they change it again to sub-3 cry😢
My goal is to run sub-3 someday, but I was hoping to run Boston regardless.
I applied for the 2025 race with a 4:31 buffer knowing that I probably wouldn’t get in. Then the news of the additional 5 mins came out. Quite disheartening and humbling. I’m just going to keep running and wait 3 years until I get into the next age bracket.
If I follow your strategy, I may be able to qualify at age 70. 😂
Lol. Same here! 4:32 buffer and thought I was good to go. Then the Cut off came out as 5:29 and I missed by 0:57. But it was my own fault, I was shooting for a 10 minute buffer but didn't follow my race plan and only had a 4:32. But that's OK, other people did better so how can I be upset?
@@MNP208you are right sir. Just get faster. Make the committment and just get it done
I think it should be a lottery, with preference for first timers and those who have continually not been accepted. It's not a championship-type race that should require qualifying times, unless the BAA aspires to be some kind of amateur championship.
What do you think would be a reasonable marathon race pace for someone who does (most recently) 20 mile long run in 2:25 (7:16, with mile 20 at 6:57 pace) and earlier (March) diagnostic 15k run in 59:37 (6:24 min/mile) pace… would 3:05 marathon be realistic?
For my age group (50-54) the new time standard is the same as it was back in '81-'89 and we have the super shoes and hydrogel advantages today so I'm "OK" with the new standard. (Albeit warmer weather to train in with global warming)
Having said that, I think the main problem is the limited field size vs. growing demand from around the world. If the selection process don't change, I can see in few years time the demand and time needed will be so high that it becomes unattainable for someone with work ethics and run 80 miles weeks for years and still won't get in, unless they're genetically predisposed with high vo2max/slow-twitch.
BAA could change the selection process so first timer (validated based on WMM star for Boston not yet claimed) could have first dibs competing for the limited spots. The remainder spots could then be fought out by those who has already ran Boston before but after thrill of the chase.
Not ideals for Boston veterans but it allows as many to experience Boston at least once, scratch it off their bucket list, while keeping the competitive spirit and exclusivity of the race.
It's always been a 7:35 pace for lions. Every 10 years, they jack up the times by 10 years. Can't imagine an 80 year old doing a sub 5 hour marathon. Are 80 year olds going to throw down 3:30 marathons in 30 years?
At current trajectory BQ times are eventually going to reach elite levels, and that's not what the Boston Marathon is: it's not a championship race, it's supposed to be a pillar of the running community. Regardless of popularity a BQ should remain a challenging-but-accessible life goal.
My humble opinion: a two-tier system. Have a fast guaranteed-entry time for half the field, and then fill out the rest with a lottery with the 2013-2019 qualifying times. Random lottery, not a secret second cutoff dependent on entries. That keeps the BQ a special goal to try to attain without putting it out of reach of the non-elite running community.
I don't think they are going to reach "elite levels" unless they drastically changed the percentage of charity runner entires (because then it would but more pressure on and have less spots for time qualifiers). Boston seems to mean different things to different people....so what is "fair" and "accesible" will depend on a person's perception and what they view might be possible. It is a "prestigious" marathon and many would also say "elitist" in a lot of ways (I'd say almost more from a financial perspective rather than an actual speed/talent perspective though). But true Elite Runners don't always run Boston because they may pick another Spring Marathon....so really there aren't that many people running under 2:20 or sub 2:15 or so.... I've heard "back in the day" the BQ used to be like 2:40 or sub 2:50 at least though? I could see the fastest age group times heading in that direction.
It's nice to have an apirational race. I wish the marathon majors were all like this, rather than having so many lotteries.
🙏🙏🙏
I’m 57 and I think the standards for some of the upper age groups are too easy relative to the under 40 standard. I don’t think they require a relatively similar level of training to obtain. IMO we olds get a break because most of our running peers when we were younger “injured out” of the sport. I assume the reason for the disparity is to maintain some semblance of age diversity.
Too many charity runners in Boston. Some runners esp older may only manage after a lot of hard work to qualify once and that many are turned down for charity runners is a shame
I live near Boston and have run qualified. I am waiting to hear about my application for 2025, but I am 61 and have enough cushion. I agree about the charity runners. Too many and it is too tough a course for most people who are slower runners. I've volunteered on the course at mile 17, which is where the hill begin, and people are already dying. The charity runners are in the later wave, so they have been waiting a long time and running at the hotter part of the day. Many people who were never runners are emotionally motivated for a charity, but never run again because the training and the race are so taxing on the body.
Yeah charity and helping people less fortunate is the real problem! **shakes fist**
London has a faster qualifying time and 2025 has 840K entries for about 20k ballot places.
Much easier to get a charity place in London though (not so easy to get the required amount of sponsorship though) , it is only due to the crazy volume of applicants that it has gotten silly . Boston you need to make the grade just to apply.
@@JohnBirtchetSharpeI got a 3:13 when London was 3:15 but they drew the line at 3:11, Boston was 3:25 that year and all got in.
Charity places are about £2000 at London.
@@garybowes6284 sorry to hear that , and yup the charity places require crazy amount of money , I did it last year and it took me 7 months to raise just over that. Never again, more stressful then the training itself .
London realistic good-for-age time for most guys under 45 is 2:45 (GFA official time id 2:55 for that age group, but I think less than 3k places for ages 18-50). Berlin auto time is 2:44 for that age group, and I think Tokyo is something like 2:30
I so wish London extended the “good for age” standard to non-UK applicants. Same with Tokyo.
First time qualifiers auto entry first, then 2nd+ time qualifiers, then charity fill in the gaps at the end if there's extra space leftover
Pretty good idea 🙌....make the "veterans" who have already run the race go a little faster than the time standards...whereas first-timers get that "auto in" regardless of how far under the time standard they are
A social event being run by big business, disgusting, most charities are because out of every dollar a small percentage of that dollar actually goes to the charity, next there are more people dying running a marathon because of the look at me affect that are not medically cleared or healthy enough to run. A serious runner is content running less notorious events and are just as satisfied with their success because all the family and friends are there to love and support them. Get over your ego to run a big six event that charge an exorbitant amount of money and can deny you entry even if you qualify.
(Sorry for the long post, but I've been thinking a lot about this the last week or so and I thought I'd share what I was thinking)
I have no problem with time qualification, nor cut offs to match the allowed field size. Let the fastest qualifiers run. If you are faster than the next guy, you make it. If not, you don't. I don't believe something like the Boston Marathon, with its rich tradition of being a premier event should worry about people who do not make the cut having the opportunity to run Boston. Yes, it is an amazing race to run (or so I'm told as I've yet to qualify), and obviously many people would like to do this. But what makes it an amazing race to run is that it is difficult (for most normal humans) to qualify for, and almost everyone who hopes to qualify has to make sacrifices to do so (sometimes major ones).
But it should not be about giving people an opportunity to run Boston. You (and by "you", I mean "one" or people in general) HAVE an opportunity. You just have to run faster than enough other people who want to run Boston to make the cut. If you don't have the ability, work ethic, finances, free time, dedication, motivation, pain tolerance to make the cut off time... well, then maybe the Boston Marathon is not the right thing for you. And that's OK. But you think it is, you can keep on trying!
What makes Boston special (or in my opinion what SHOULD make Boston special), is that only the top 3%-4% of runners can get a qualifying standard and make the cut off. So you HAVE to be good, and better than 96% - 97% of other runners to be admitted into this prestigious club. But wanting something and deserving something are two different things. Just because you WANT to run Boston doesn't mean you DESERVE to run Boston. If you cannot get in with a BQ and Cut Off time... then you don't deserve it... you just don't. It doesn't matter if this is your first time qualifying, if you have qualified and missed the cut 20 times before, or if you have run it every year since you were 20. It SHOULD be about making the standard to run the race, in my opinion (I'm sure some people will disagree).
If they do a lottery, or a "first time qualifiers get an entry whether they make the cut off or not", or people who raise X amount of money for charity get in, or you are a celebrity who all of a sudden got it in their head they would like to run a Marathon and figured running Boston for their first one would be cool, or you have a bunch of Marriott Bonvoy travel points to bid for a race bib (yes, this is now a thing), you have to remember that for every person that is being let in by these means results in another runner, who worked very hard (sometimes for years or even decades) and actually DID get their BQ and now is being left out because someone else, who didn't get the BQ is being allowed to run.
I'm sorry, "but I really, REALLY want to run Boston and I can't get a BQ or make the Cut Off" is not a good reason, in my opinion, to let someone have an entry. The more people you let in with non-qualifying times, even if its for charity, or celebrity, or first time qualifiers (what about all those people before you who were first time BQs that didn't make the cut in past years), the less special it becomes.
I realize people want to run Boston because it is special, but if you make exceptions for so many non-qualifiers (BQ and Cut Off), it is no longer special. I mean last year, 27% of the participants were charity entries (or "non-BQ and Cut Off" entries... it is hard to get exact numbers on actual charity bibs). That means that 33% of the people who actually DID get a BQ were not allowed an entry... over 11,000 out of 33,000 applications. But nearly 8,000 people who did NOT BQ or Cut Off ran the race. I'm honestly really happy for these 8,000 people who got this opportunity and I'm happy for all the money that was raised for charity... I think it was like $70M!!!
But if you think about it. Charity runners are guaranteed an entry (if they make the charity goal). Boston Qualifiers are not... in fact, 1/3 of them, in spite of putting in all the long hours, training, injuries, early morning runs, life sacrifices, avoiding illness or injury etc. and finally getting their BQ, did not get entry. I wonder how charity runners would feel if in spite of meeting their fund raising goal, 1/3 of them were not given entry into the race. Would that seem "fair" to them?
Maybe they should limit charity entries to the top 66% of fund raisers. Have a qualifying standard, like $7500. But then on September 15th, release the "Cut Off" and tell people who had raised at least $7,500 that they actually had to raise $10,300 to get entry. I mean how would that feel to people who had put in all that work to raise money for charity, make the goal and then be told you didn't make it?
I'm really not trying to rag on charity runners. These entries are a part of the race and wow, $70M?! That is going to do a LOT for a lot of people in need. But it just seems like the RUNNERS are kind of treated like second class citizens here and all the priorities seem to be going to charity runners, celebrities, travel groups, frequent fliers, influencers (except @TheSeriousRunner... we know how the BAA feels about him!). Whatever entries are left after these other people are taken care of then go to the runners. It just seems a little backwards to me.
Great points! Thanks for writing that all out in such resonable detail and logic. Makes sense. That's actually a much higher % of Charity Runners getting a Boston Bib then I thought there would be...
😮😂 What a great rant!! 😂 I'm not knocking what you have said in any way.
Honestly, BQ times are way too easy. NYC marathon is much harder to qualify for and Boston should use similar times. Sage, please do a shakeout group run in Boston 2025. I would love to meet you in person, I'm running Boston 2025.
Just sign up as non-binary
I’m not a trail runner, but I’ve done most of the majors, and for me (as a Brit) Boson was really something very special. I was able to qualify for Boston, Chicago and London (there is a qualifying process for British runners, which are times faster than Boston). Chicago was the ‘fairest’ in one way when I did it, as you hit the time and you’re in. Boston and London you’re not totally sure until the times are released. Berlin I got in via the lottery, Tokyo I went for charity. Tokyo is interesting as they only give a very small number of qualification places at very, very fast times.
I wouldn’t like to see Boston, or any race, filter out people who’ve done the race before. Talking about my British friends, getting a London qualifying time is what drives them each year to get out the door, enter marathons, trying to get that time. Some do it just the once, some never make it, others do it year after year. But the lure of working towards that time each year motivates veterans and newer runners alike. I’m sure it’s similar for runners who target Boston every year.
I benefit from being British with regards to London, but actually I do think it’s unfair that foreign runners can’t qualify for London. If London opened up qualification to foreigners, it would mean that the times would get a lot harder, and that would really upset the British runners that chase the time. London have already upset clubs and club runners as they have reduced the numbers of places that clubs get allocated.
You’re right about the costs. Flights, hotel fees, even race entries does not make this a cheap hobby for us hobby joggers! In fairness to London, they keep the entry fees pretty low at under $100.
I think ultimately though, any race can organise themselves however they like. I’ve thought this even when I kept missing London times, and when London made the times harder over the years. When I finally got the time, it made it even sweeter.
As a male in the 18-34 age group currently chasing a BQ, I’d be more annoyed if they raised the time. I think the harder standard will make it all the more worthwhile when I finally achieve my goals.
Boston should not be a lottery. If Boston were a lottery like Western States or UTMB, it would mean that it's not something to work hard for, but something that requires the means to keep running races to get lottery entries or collect stones. It would ruin Boston.
What about very wealthy Charity Runners that can "buy their way in" for $10k-15k or so? Then it's not about "hard work" or "speed" either 🤣....but rather pure financial privilege!
@@Vo2maxProductions Charity spots are a separate issue... I just meant that comparing Boston to Western or UTMB is not quite accurate because no one assume you are fast because you ran Western or UTMB; participating in these events does not create the assumption of talent/hard work. You can be the slowest runner in the world and get lucky in the Western lottery. If Boston went to lottery, running it similarly wouldn't say anything about your talent/hard work. And if Boston is not a difficult-yet-achievable accomplishment to be proud of, it would lose what makes it special.
@@TheSeriousRunner First, I'm definitely opposed to a lottery for entry for the same reason as you. But for the sake of argument/discussion, what if the lottery was among people with a qualifying time? That way, at least you are not the slowest runner in the world. A lottery for any slow runner results in the same issue with slower runners getting in from a charity, celebrity, influencer, travel group or frequent traveler mileage points bid entry (Yes, Marriott Bonvoy points can be used to bid on Abbott Marathon Entries now). IT would ruin the specialness of the event.
@@justinnevins107 I think a lottery among qualifiers would be illogical because then the qualifying standard would be completely subjective. Right now, the standards are somewhat objective or logical at least. Using rounded numbers, the race can have about 30,000 runners. Say 5,000 are charity runners. That leaves 25,000 spots roughly. The BAA sets standards that hopefully will align with 25,000 qualifiers and when they are wrong, there is a cut off.
However, if there was a lottery amongst qualifiers, how do you then set the qualifying standard? There would be no objective reason to set the standards. For instance, why not just have a BQ time of 4 hours for everyone, and just have a massive lottery?
if performance is no longer the deciding factor, then why bother with performance standards at all?
@@Vo2maxProductionsThat’s what I hate about the sixstar-medal.
Now it means only you have enough money to travel the world. It’s not a physical achievement.
Collecting money for charity is a good thing. But there should be at least 1 marathon (Boston) you have to prove yourself by qualifying.
I'm 46 years old, done 6 marathons. PB is 3:34 in 2023. BQ has always been a reach goal. When it was a sub 3:20 it felt like if the stars ever aligned, I might be able to make it. But a sub 3:15 is truly out of reach for me. That is ok. If reach goals were easily attainable they wouldn't be reach goals.
No way should any advantage be offered for downhill
Anything more than a 1000 ft is ridiculous
I like that they lower the qualifying times so there are fewer people who think they may have gotten the chance to run only to see it slip away durring registration. Especially if you run a qualifying time in April and have to wait half a year to figure out if you get in.
Speaking to the race itself, Boston has always been a special one to me growing up in the area and spectating from the top of heartbreak hill most years of my life. I got a non-qualifying number for 2024, but couldn't run after picking up a stress fracture just 4 weeks out. I trained back up and ran a marathon a couple weeks ago and hope to run Boston next year.
Good luck to anyone else who is waiting to see if they get in, and to Sage for 2025.
As the demand is increasing and folks are getting faster, it is inevitable that the times would reduce. Having qualified for the past 7 years, i have only had the joy of running it once in 2018 (where i got to meet you in person Sage), as i can't afford the costs of travel and accommodation, which is real bummer! Would of loved to have entered for 2025....maybe one day i may get a corporate sponsor? Good luck to you Sage in 2025!
thanks for saying hi!
@@Vo2maxProductions I didn’t even get a selfie as I was that excited to be there 🤪
Down hill marathons shouldn’t be aloud for qualifying times, if a person has got into Boston time & time again is awesome, if they keep making the qualifying time, great that they can get in again & again, good luck with getting into Boston, you’ll fly, time to fly, cheers
A slight undulation on the course can be helpful if legs tire because you get to change muscles a bit.
New York City Marathon has higher standards/cut off times (more difficult to make)
The qualifying times have changed multiple times over the history of the race. This is the oldest organized marathon in the world. Meet the qualifying and field size standards and run the race. No first qualifier card. I flew to my first Boston run with an individual who was running his 26th and earned every entry. 👍🏼
I have both run multiple times and don't feel like I need to run Boston multiple times. But the idea of giving first timers vs repeat runners is totally against the competitive idea of running. Should we stop Olympic competitors from participating in more than on year? The unique part of Boston is that it is competitive, without that I don't think Boston is that cool of a marathon to run otherwise.
Spot on with the unknowns and sliding scale .. I have qualified @55 with a 3:24 and still unsure if I will get in for April. Other majors have tougher qualifiying times but are easier to have alternative routes; With Boston it is the time that get's you in the door and for a 190lbs hobby jogger like myself it was the work myself and a my coach wittled down which in itself was anachievment. It would be better to have removed all those daft downhill courses as qulifying races then playing with times as they amend them anyhow depending on the number of entries (9000+ will be dropped this year from the looks of things ) Have a coffee on me Sage.
Hey thanks so much 🙏! I really apprecaite your support! Also congrats on the awesome time and wishing you the best of luck! Thanks for your comment and sharing your story too
I'm 6:30 under after my first marathon attempt in Eugene (55 years old, been running hard for 1 year), not sounding like I will get in by many people's opinions. My time standard moved down 5 minutes for 2026...what does that mean? The "manufactured" and advertised downhill courses are a joke...like qualifying for the US Open in golf with bigger holes!
Why don’t they simply make a qualifying time and have the race on 2 days of the weekend? Doubles the amount of ravers and money in their pockets. Then everyone’s happy
I don't think many in the local communities like their roads being shut-down for that long.
@@Vo2maxProductions Shouldn't live there then 😂
All y’all talkin bout running under 2.5 hours and I’m out here still be suffering after 5 hours. 😂😂
I have severe health problems and couldn’t break 5:00. I somehow ran a :52 400 back to back two summers ago while training for an ultra and feeling strong so did some speed work one day. Guess who cares? Absolutely no one. Point I’m trying to make here is we gotta remember to smile and be grateful. Don’t take any of it for granted. As I’m typing this Sage just said we ultimately want to be happy, and that was my point of this rant as well. ✌️
Finishing up the BQ plan to run a sub 3 at a local Colorado marathon in mid-October. Not sure if i would do boston or not if i got the qualifying time -- i kinda just wanna see if i can do it. Your running plans kick ass, I've used three of them now. Thanks Sage and Sandi.
Thanks so much for all your support of our Higher Running Marathon BQ plan! Best of luck
Boston should be hard. And people who are running through charity aren't true six-star finishers. The whole point is that Boston is not a participation trophy.
To your point about cost if you have money you can buy your way into Boston, or Chicago etc. or even the Leadville 100 regardless of experience or ability. Fairness is a complicated word when it comes to race rules, bottom line is the RD/owners create their races, make their rules, if you want to do their race you accept their rules, don’t like the rules don’t do the race. I could say Barkley is “unfair” because of the difficulty and lack of transparency even to apply, but then again its what makes Barkley Barkley and even the best in the world accept they’re probably never gonna get in.
Only problem I have with Barkley is if the public doesn't have access to some of the routes, then the race shouldn't be allowed to go through those areas either unless they are on private property. Special privilege on public land is silly. Then all the drama about who can film on some of these races when they are on public land is also ridiculous. That kind of elite attitude makes me give them the big thumbs down.
Always wondered how people get to enter Barkley?
@@markstreeter9920 I agree! Those are some logical points. I think Barkley getting a lot of media and public attention is also "unwarranted" because it's a very very exlusive race that only lets in people based on a lot of subjective bias and whims/favortism imo.
I did 2:53:40 for M45. 🙏 to get in. If so hope, to see you Sage 😊👍
Good luck! That's a great time....yes hope to see you there!
@@Vo2maxProductions thank you. 😀👍 ⌛⌛⌛😬
@@Vo2maxProductions I made it 😀 just got the email 🦄🦄🦄🦄
Ive run 50+ races including a dozen full marathons and many Ultramarathon trail races.
Im certainly not a slower runner, but im not fast enough to qualify for Boston and thats okay. Having started running at 40, i didn't expect to ever get a sub-elite time.
All of my races are within a 3 hour drive of my house and ive done big marathons with thousands of runners as well as trail races with a few dozen.
Wait? Does this mean we get to see you? You gotta host a shakeout the day before!
For sure I'll look into a meet up!
The sweet ain’t as sweet without the bitter. The qualifications standard and mystery cutoff time (for me, at least) added to the mystique and prestige when training/racing to get into Boston. I was part of the 11k that got cut last year, but every marathon I raced since took a different meaning (vengeance run). Fortunately got in for 2025 (hope to catch you there), but experiencing the low of being booted due to a year’s cutoff made the acceptance all the more monumental. Now, if I could just figure out how tf to get into NYC as a time qualifier, that completely baffles me.
Never something i could attain anyway. I got a sense from my faster friends that BQing was relatively harder in the early 2000s than it had been in recent years anyway.
As a 50-year-old, 3:25 seems too generous. Moving everyone five minutes faster for '26 doesn't seem fair as going five minutes faster from 3:00 to 2:55 is way harder than going from 3:25 to 3:20 or 3:55 to 3:50 for example because your margins are so much tighter. Maybe cutting a few minutes off the masters age brackets would be better while leaving the three-hour barrier intact. Downhill course standards would help too - nothing greater than a 500-foot net drop or something.
Boston should be exclusive. Diversity doesn’t come into it. Your either good enough or your not. I’ll probably never run quick enough to run a BQ and I’m fine with that. If you can’t afford it, tough. You can’t have everything in life. Sometimes things suck. That’s life.
What’s confusing to me is why is there an adjusted cutoff for a hilly course (Boston) instead of an adjusted cutoff for Chicago which is flat and fast. It should be the other way around because Boston is a hilly course. Make no sense tbh
Not sure why several people here are comparing BQ-ing to achieving a NYC entry because of a good-for-age time. They are two different things entirely. You don’t have to qualify for NYC; they have a lottery. There is no lottery for Boston, the only way to enter is to qualify.
Tightening the standard will only streamline the application process. With cut off time higher than 5min already. There will be no impact on final acceptance result even B.A.A. don’t update the standard
Mixed feelings about the new standards. I ran my first marathon this year in 3h22 (also San Diego RNR), so the thought of one day breaking the 3-hour barrier has become a real, motivating dream. It was also my old BQ standard, so it would've been sweet to brag about qualifying for Boston at the same time--even if I don't have plans to run it!
So the higher bar for BQ feels slightly discouraging, but not as much when I think of the challenge and enjoyment that got me into running. But I can't say bragging rights are no enticement. I'd still love to BQ, and first of all to go under 3 hours. Only on a "fair" course though :P
I remember years ago when I heard of the marathon Majors, I read about what it took to run each. The Boston qualification standards were out of reach for me in my 20s. I'm in my 30s and a sub 3h marathon is something I can run in dreamland. Wonderful that when I turn 40 it will be sub 3h5. I'm nowhere near that either! I'd be happy to just run a sub 3h30.
I understand that race organisers need to make money and am fine with them targeting high income runners who are willing to travel from far, pay hiked prices for hotels and other expenses all after running insane times to qualify. Running is indeed becoming an expensive hobby! I for one will stick to my local races and do 1 or 2 races internationally or domestically in other parts of my own country, within my budget. It's fine how other runners spend their money - non of my business.
Love that photo of you breaking away from the pack at 3:15 that's such an epic photo!!! I don't feel qualified to join the discussion you're inviting people to talk about - I'm a new runner, started last October and not yet a marathoner BUT my first marathon is Hamptons Marathon next Saturday! Just ran a 10K PR yesterday at Cow Harbor 10K. Very excited to see what I can do on my first marathon next week. I've been a cyclist for a long time but watched your videos on and off for years, you definitely subliminally nudged me into being a runner, love your incredible depth of knowledge and attitude towards all running distances from 100m to 100 miles as all part of one big continuum.
I was bummed I was currently training to qualify in the 40-44 and knocking it down another 5 minutes might make or break me. I understand running right at or a minute under the old time, 3:10:00, doesn't guarantee anything I can at least say I qualified. But for the spirit of the sport and event i'm glad we are progressing!
New York has always appealed to me more than Boston. I've been to both cities but haven't run either of the marathons. I'd choose NY for sure. Chicago has recently made it a little tougher to get in.
There are plenty of marathons, and ultras for beginners. Leave the elite races for the elite.
2nd!!!!! i freaking love ur running career montage video
Why not just lottery those who have met the qualifying standards? They all beat the mark; only they get a chance at a spot via lottery, rather than only giving it to the fastest of the qualifiers.
Nice Strat
San Diego acknowledged.
Dafaq is non binary?
Boston is an exclusive event for people who put in the work to either qualify or fundraise, and I’m totally fine with that. That’s why it’s such a big deal. And I say this as someone who’s about to age up and has been chasing a marathon time that will actually get me in for a couple of years and hasn’t done it yet. Long live the BAA!
People want what they can't [immediately] have! I agree that because it is "hard to get into" it creates more demand. It also makes it more rewarding.
I love the idea that a first timer gets priority.
58y young here, BQed for 2025 with 11min buffer. 3y into structured running with Higher Running BQ Marathon Plan. Solely, never felt need for a different plan. Got me into NYC, too. Keep Boston as legendary as it is. As something ambitious age groupers can relate to. Heard a saying: the Olympics for us recreational marathon runners😂
Congrats! Love this story! Thanks for your support of our Higher Running BQ Marathon Training Plan and glad it worked out so well for you!
These big marathon can just you go *** themselves with their time restrictions and lotteries. There are enough smaller events to run and the achievement is the same.
I don’t see what’s wrong with having a time standard.
@@EffigyofChaos Nothing wrong with that, but I'm not going to chase their holy grail of participating in their oh so very special event. It's 42,2k wherever you run.
It’s much easier to get in to Boston when you get older. If you’re in your 30’s and can’t break 3 hours now, just keep at it, be patient, and do it when you are old enough for when the standards are slower. Now that I’m over 45 BQing really isn’t that hard at all.
How long have you been marathon training?
@@PoetWithPace I started running marathons in 2019 with the goal of BQing. My first attempt was in the the 3:50s, the 2nd around 3:20, and the 3rd in 3:04 which was good enough for a BQ since the standard for me at the time was 3:10. Now I’m over 45 and it has been very easy for me to break 3:20. However, I don’t always break 3:15 and I like that the new standard gives me something to work for.
BAA eject seat. 😊. Good vid!
@@jonathansandberg5267 well done! Takes time to get marathon legs which you now have and that’s why you may find it easier?
@@PoetWithPace Thank you. There is a little bit of a learning curve to running marathons but once you figure it out, it’s not that hard to repeat. Unless I get injured I’m pretty sure I will never run a marathon and not BQ again. Granted, you still have to put the time and effort into the training but it’s not complicated. The most important thing is volume followed by a good strength training routine. You also need to eat and sleep well. The rest are details.
The only benefit I told myself for turning 50 a couple months ago was i got to knock 5 minutes off the BQ. Well.. there that went :) .. Probably the only truly fair way would be the qualifying times and the lottery. But Yeah.. maybe limiting the repeaters to every other year or every 3rd year.
If you've qualified for Boston one year, maybe the next year you can only apply as a reserve to allow other first timers a chance. If there are spaces left or not enough qualifiers then you get the reserve place.
But to be honest by lowering the standards by about 5 minutes probably means if you get it or a min or two under, there's a good chance of getting in when you look at the historical cut offs.
But overall I think it's nice to have a prestigious event with a unique entry system like Boston. Charity is good, but Maybe there should be less charity spots and more qualifying chances.
missed the BQ by a few minutes earlier this year in my first ever officially sanctioned marathon race at the Jim Thorpe Marathon, a net downhill rail trail race. BQ wasn't my goal. went into it as a training run for a bigger goal, JFK50 this November. I was not a fan of the course that was marketed as a "fast course"... Boston seems overgrown and is financially out of reach for many. this year has been all about getting better at running and I have learned a lot about the importance of some of the topics and ideas mentioned in the video. some of us who show up on the scene later in life aren't aware of running culture idiosyncrasies, like PRing on courses that are flat versus not flat. it can be confusing. anyway... the BQ is BS. do something different Boston!
5 minutes improvement at those times is hard. That’s for sure.
Glad I ran Boston 2007-2011 when the standards were slower and initially a winter marathon could be used for 2 Bostons.
You just spoke my mind that I have had…Boston marathon should limit people to keep doing and prioritize people who is trying to do it maybe just once. I am not fast to be qualified but as more and more people are into marathon for the last decade and with all the super shoes help now, I can see all the spots be filled with the same group of people if they want to…and guess what, now with Sydney being the seventh star, become world major marathon finishers is becoming powerball lottery to lots of people, me included…
100% agree. I’ve not (yet!) qualified for Boston, but I don’t mind the faster qualifying times. The year-to-year variations in the cut-off times is the worst part. I want to train for a target time and then feel the sense of accomplishment when I execute the race plan and hit that target. The idea that you have to then wait all year for the BAA to release its arbitrary cut-off cheapens the accomplishment; especially when the extreme variance between the different races (and race conditions) people run in to qualify makes subtle differences in finish times basically meaningless.
I have been training to get a BQ this year after having come very closed in 2019 and then having Covid screw me over. I'm finally feeling like I could make it after a long road of training and dealing with elder care. I'm 4 weeks from the race and then I see the standards changed today. I get them wanting to make qualifying hard, and that's Boston's right, but can they not announce the changes at the beginning of the year, so people can adjust their objective a bit? It's like moving the goal posts while the ball is in the air. It's almost like they enjoy annoying the runners that haven't gotten there yet.
The reason why you can know you are in the Olympic trials when you finish is that not that many people hit that standards. The only way you could know you are in Boston when you cross the line is if they took 15 mins off all the standards. The current standards guarantee you consideration for the Boston marathon.
I ran a BQ standard qualifying time at grandmas in 2023 and missed the buffer by over 5 minutes. I think my own pitfall was not recognizing that to secure a BQ entry I would need beat the cutoff time by at least 7 minutes. Next time I want to try for a BQ I will plan my training around this reality
Maybe when im 50 and saved enough pennies.
Perhaps BAA could instill a one year cooldown for those selected on time? I dunno. I’m looking at years of work before flirting with a qualifying time. No stake in it here. Other things to worry about :)