I've said this elsewhere: Lois isn't upset at Clark, she is upset at her father. The biggest reason she liked him was his ethics. She thought she found a guy who was exactly the opposite of her father. Now it turns out he has a double life too and it is bringing out all her old resentments. Why do you think she became a "Crusading Journalist"? It's not so strange really. My grandmother said that the reason she fell for my grandfather in the first place was "he was the kindest man I had ever met." Considering that her father's way of greeting her was to loudly complain about how fat she had gotten, I cannot say I am surprised.
I think its more specifically thats she`s upset that clark is acting uncomfortably like her father in these instances. Especially near the end of the episode where hes blatantly lying about being fine despite the huge injuries he took. Thats no far off from how her father hid all the problem her family was having until it all came crashing down.
They were not even officially dating yet. She felt betrayed by Clark lying to her yes but seeing how she liked him because she thought he was honest and exactly who he appeared to be, that's fine. And it was resolved quickly.
The difference between them is this. When Lois is written to be impulsive, sometimes hypercritical and having trust issues it's written as a flaw. She says sorry to clark about lying and she tends to apologize later. With Amber the writing forces invisible to apologize and the story acts like he is the issue.
Invincible’s story also frames Mark as 100% in the wrong and Amber 100% in the right. While MAWS clearly portrays the issue as more gray with both characters having valid points.
While it might be true that the writing is painting Amber as right and Mark as wrong its also being done to push them away as a couple. Its forced drama before the true paring happens.
One thing the episode right after Lois's jump - their search for Jimmy - did was it made hindsight better. She made it very clear that her anger with Clark stemmed from a hurt, which in turn didn't come from him keeping a secret, but that him keeping that big a secret and being willing to go as far as he did to keep it, left her feeling very uncertain about where they stood as friends and as something more. Lois couldn't see where the lie ended and the truth began, and that made her feel very insecure and manipulated. All of that could apply to Amber too, but the Superman show takes the time to explore that. We get 'the love interest perspective'. Would love a shipping video about them from you! You always add an interesting perspective.
Where the episode FAILS is that it doesn't let Clark set the reality of HIS boundaries. It just lets her guilt trip him into accepting the blame and telling Jimmy, when at the end of the day its still a personal problem on her side. Clark doesn't get to defend himself from being vilified to her problems, and is forced to take the fault. Like a real person SHE ignores the fact he has personal reasons for keeping his secrets, ignores the fact he had the right to the privacy of said secret, ignores the fact that the ONLY lie's he ever told her were to keep his secret secure, ignores the fact she wasn't entitled to said secret, and ignores the fact that SHE was in the wrong about how she handled the situation. She's acting like a real person and people are reasonably getting mad at her for the same reason they would get mad at a real person doing what she does. What s sad is that the show doesn't act like Clark has the right to defend himself against Lois emotionally, acting like Lois being upset emotionally is more important that Clark being treated fairly, which is a very real issue IRL and is sad to see even a fictional character get away with it like it ISN'T a problem.
@@windstar120025 His boundaries are unhealthy and not only hurt Lois, but Jimmy as well as this was the reason why he was captured. Boundaries can be unhealthy by distancing you from others and that causes them to not feel trusted. All the harping on how great they are ignore the truth of life that lying is the beginning of evil, and Clark started something very evil here by lying and hurt not just himself, but others.
@@basilofgoodwishes4138 EXCEPT NO THEY Aren't, at least not here.. His boundaries and simple interest to keep his secret secure has only ever caused potential harm to anyone on ONE occasion and that was the conflict of not showing up for Jimmy, which was direvn ENTIRELY by Lois' insecurity with honesty, afterall they only forgot because She blew up on Clark. Every time they had gotten in trouble it has had NOTHING to do with Clarks secret or him keeping it secure, and always to do with Lois and Jimmy being the type of people to throw themselves into the action when sanity would suggest they don't, which is entirely on them. Boundaries are Clarks right, like it is for everyone else. Lois DOES NOT have the right to push Clark as the problem when it is her insecurities that are driving the conflict. There is this whole topic of how it's looking at both sides but arguments like yours forget that the show is COMPLETELY SKIMPING on Clarks perspective being meaningful here as well. It's ALL about how Lois feels and NONE about Clarks reasons being valid. Now hopefully this will change but this isn't good relationship standards to live by, Clark CANT be in the wrong, JUST because Lois has insecurities, without validating the many people who invade their partners privacy just because their suspicious. We cant validate this behaviour because it's reflective of a real life problem.
@@basilofgoodwishes4138 Lois wasn't hurt by Clarks boundaries, she was hurt because SHE prioritized her needs above his boundaries and privacy. Jimmy got hurt, because Lois raged so hard at Clark their priorities changed for a bit. All issues still lead back to Lois
@@windstar120025I'm glad you mentioned the safety issue because people defending Lois don't seem to realize Clark is keeping his secret is to protect those he loves as well as himself. It feels really wrong that he can never have agency for himself but Lois can. And what made the Jimmy rescue episode worse for me is Jimmy knew Clark's identity and yet he still respected Clark enough to tell him on his own terms, and Lois doesn't ever self reflect on that situation, she just gets mad at Jimmy for not telling her. Jimmy gave Clark agency to his own identity but Lois didn't, that's not a good way to start a relationship
Amber hated that Mark wasn't spending enough time with her while he was out saving people, and felt entitled to his secret just because. She was mad at Mark for saving people and expressed no sympathy or concern for his safety. Lois hated that Clark kept lying even when she made it clear to him she knows he was lying, she expressed concern for Clark's safety, not concern over how much time they are spending together. She wasn't mad he was saving people, she simply hates being lied to or someone not being upfront with her, like her father did with her mother's health. Lois is not Amber.
and that Mark never gave a reason for constantly bailing on her until after they broke up! I know that Lois and Amber are not the same but I don't like this narrative that Amber is just being an entitled b**ch
I think a lot of people misunderstand the scene bc the writers did a bad job at explaining, but basically Amber figured out Mark was Invincible during the Cyborg attack and she wasn't mad that Mark ran away, but rather that he ran away to put on his costume, while his friend was being choked to death by a cyborg. She calls him a coward for caring more about his secret identity than his best friend. That was supposed to be the point, but they wrote it really really vague since we never get Amber's POV.
@@davidbodor1762yes, thank you. i never understood how most viewer could miss that point. this plot act was about the trope „i am the hero so i need to have a secret identity thingy“. this balancing of private life and super hero life. in this scene, where mark tells amber that he is this superhero guy, he was arrogant and self absorbed. that made me angry. he did not make his friends a priority when they got attacked. he made his secret a priority. he lied and justified that for weeks. when your doing good stuff you don’t have to lie about that. amber deserves to know stuff and then chooses for herself if she wants to deal with that kind of life. and civilians don’t need a savior. superhero stories are all about balancing ethics and morals. not about saving the day and get the praise for that.
One of my favorite subversions of this trope happens in Ben 10. When Julie finds out that Ben is a superhero, she supports him and tries to be as understanding as possible. Their relationship is considerably troubled, but the fact that she actually supports him from the beggining is just so refreshing and wholesome imo.
I love this version of Lois. Because for once, she feels like a real character. Not just a character’s girlfriend. She makes mistakes but that’s part of being human, and she apologizes for them. The story doesn’t try to pretend she’s automatically right. And in the end, that makes the payoff of her and Clark getting together, all the more satisfying.
I agree. If all that drama and misery didn't come first, those fireworks going off when they have their first kiss would be far too cheesy. Nah, the writers wanted to make this romance feel earned. It definitely helps that Lois went from obsessing over getting secrets out of Clark to wanting to help him learn more about his heritage, as a way of repaying him for all the good things he's done for her. Character development right there.
And it feels natural. Lois does make mistakes but her character feels complete and understandable here. She’s not just some one dimensional love interest who Clark likes for superficial reasons like in the comics.
@@phantomslay5612 You know, it always bugs me whenever people dismiss Lois as "hypocritical" because of the time when she lied to Clark and Jimmy about helping her with a case, and later revealing she hates being lied to. It makes me wonder if they even watched the first episode in its entirety, because at the end of its climax, she apologizes profusely and owns up to her mistake. And after that, she sticks to her guns and makes efforts to do better. I don't see how apologizing for a mistake that aligns with something you detest the most and actually learning from it makes someone hypocritical.
"The story doesn’t try to pretend she’s automatically right" but that's EXACTLY what Episode 6 was about. Her literally denying him the right to be correct in a situation HE WAS RIGHT FOR. EP 6 literally focused on her guilt tripping Clark with HER emotional needs, and ignoring that he had his own to take care of. SO much so that the show FORCED Clark to apologize when he hadnt done anything wrong. Worse yet the statement is inherently wrong becasue she has YET to apologize herself.
This is why I love the retcon that MJ always knew Peter was Spider-Man. The drama is less about him continually missing dates and more about how many times she has to be put through him almost dying. And then One More Day happens.
@@michaelstrong5383 I really miss Nick Spencer's run. I swear aside from the Kindred mystery going on too long it's only real problems were due to editorial meddling.
@@valentinkambushev4968Peter has been through a lot even before One More Day became a thing, but they managed to balance the good with the bad. Nowadays, it feels like the world just can't give him a break.
Amber is toxic, and the Invincible writers seem to think her views and actions are justified. In contrast Lois is a sympathetic character who exhibits human flaws. I don't think the Superman writers expect the audience to cosign on her behavior. I just wish they'd fix some of the tumblrish dialog.
In the Comics, the Same Thing happend with Amber. With one key diffrence - Amber did not knew he was a Super Hero and instead feared He was selling drugs or something like that.
@@BrotherMag actually No. The Comic writer is actually heavily involved. But because (WARNING SPOILER AHEAD) Amber will not play a big role later on. In the Comic there would be Just on scene Post season 2 (when it will Release), where Amber is Seen.
Lois is infinitely more likable and entertaining too. Amber is just a boring character regardless of the “I always knew you were Invincible. You giving me attention is more important than you saving lives.” moment
Reminder in a really old superman comic, Superman's Girlfriend Lois Lane, Lois' car breaks down on her way to work and her solution was to jump off a cliff so that Superman can catch her and fly her to the Daily Planet. Except Superman was out in space at the time so she just ended up hitting the ground and getting a brain injury.
Also, the episode before episode five, is revealed that Lois has a lot of trust issues, based on what happened to her father. So when she finds out Clark secret, you got a wonder what she’s thinking. Who is Clark and who is Superman? Is the person I love genuine or is this all just the cover to protect the secret. That’s probably was running through her head is completely genuine
I think the funniest thing about this video is learning that Lois Lane in the comics leaps out of buildings with zero provocation. I mean at least thisLois knew that Superman was right in front of her and she was in no actual danger, the comics ones are like "elevator's broken, not interested in stairs, I'll just jump out the window and hope Superman saves me!".
No she wasn't she was mad that her bf only told the secret to get out of an argument. Not out of trust. Plus the entire show every character is telling Mark to tell Amber bc that classic superhero thing doesn't work, that's why nobody felt sad for him bc they warn & told him to just tell her off the bat
Lois was still acting out of entitlement, whether she felt betrayed doesn't change that it was privileged information she had no right to force out of him. She was acting out a need/desire to be told the truth regardless of the reason it was kept from her. Imagine being mad at someone for not coming out the closet to you, or being mad at them for not telling you about a history with Abuse. She knew the secret and still refused to even remotely think that Clark had the right to keep it private.
Looking back, it kind of makes sense why Amber was mad at Mark for leaving her during the Cyberman attack despite knowing he's Invincible. In her eyes he could've saved her and Will right then and there, but he valued his secret identity more.
@@Scalesthelizardwizardokay, why is that an issue. Also, Spiderman has at multiple occasions has revealed his secret to others. Also, people in universe won’t have the same understanding of a secret identity as the viewers.
@@mangamandrewusually to people he trusted right? Like people he fought alongside for a long while. (I mostly seen the cartoons and stuff so who knows if there was some comic I missed) If Batman started spouting to Commissioner Gordon or some doctor in the Asylum that he's also Bruce Wayne then having a secret identity has no point. People will start targeting them just to get at the newly found out Brucie Batman. It's the usual rule for most super hero types.
@@jamesbond3w Not every time. In the movies, he has revealed his secret identity to people to help save them or to people he wanted to build a stronger relationship with. This spans from all forms of media. And the thing is that there is a difference between telling people you don’t know vs people that you trust/are close too. And the thing is that if a villain finds out the secret identity, it’s going to in danger the people around them. While Batman keeps his identity secret, he also keeps people at arms length. The point being that even if you tell no one your secret, a single accident can cause everyone you know to be targeted wether or not they know your secret identity
It is because humans look for similar traits in things they perceive as negative to not eat something else that is dangerous but this trait has some unintended side effects on the media we consume
Lois sped run Superman's secret identity and I respect it. Episode 1, she never saw his face. Episode 2, she briefly saw his face after surviving what I assume has been the first ever superhuman battle in history. Episode 3, is able to fully see him, acknowledge him, and realizes exactly who Superman is. It's great that the show allowed Lois to logically acknowledge Clark's identity.
Episode 4 Learns his identity, Episode 5 abuses that information out of a sense of entitlement to force him to "Reveal" his secret then immediately attacks him for keeping a reasonable secret, Episode 6 pushes all the fault of HER actions onto him and guilt trips him into accepting the blame, Episode 7 acts like she didn't completely disrespect his right to privacy.
Personally, I think the reason this comparison is even happening to begin with is because not only did Invincible handle it badly, it did it really badly, bad enough it basically soured anything similar to it. It basically handled the situation so badly that when the next superhero cartoon decides to do something similar our first thought was the Amber situation and how bad it was/we couldn’t view the Superman one in a vacuum. It’s sorta like what happened with Sam raimi’s Mary Jane , I love those Spider-Man films but MJ was done really bad in those and basically every MJ afterwards had to sorta over correct and go “I’m not like OTHER MJs” because it sorta soured how people view her
Look, I'm not saying "Media literacy is dead! Things were better back in my day" but I do think streaming services and the binge routine of watching tv shows has kind of messed up people's ability to fully digest episodes and plot points, like just f*cking wait a minute. "WHAT LOIS LANE JUMPED OFF THE BUILDING TO GET CLARK TO REVEAL HIS SECRET AND DIDN'T APOLOGISE!? I CAN'T BELIEVE THE WRITERS THINK WHAT SHE DID WAS OK!" Like we're five episodes it, just give it a minute, it's okay to have a conflict and build tensions that aren't immediately resolved. "WHY DID SHE DO THAT?!" "Just wait till the next episode." "I WANT TO KNOW NOW!" "Just give it a second!" "I WANT TO KNOW NOW! I WANT TO KNOW RIGHT NOW!" "THEY'RE F*CKING SETTING THEM UP AS A COUPLE YOU F*CKING SCUMBAGS!"
Nah, fuck that melodrama shit, the whole reason she jumped was because Clark literally denied it when she just wanted to understand why he is hurt, which stinks. Besides, the best thing about Invincible comic was the ability to avoid bs melodrama tropes while building characters in organic way.
Throwing yourself off a building and threatening to kill yourself just so someone will out their secret to you is still a bit extreme even if its something Lois tends to always do.
Any normal person should just break up with someone who mysteriously has to always disappear. That being said, if ya can’t trust your partner to keep a secret, are they really worth it?
@@Scalesthelizardwizard Yeah, that’s fair in my opinion. Crazy how Sarcastic Chorus doesn’t think she’s at least a bit more toxic, considering she even puts her life on the line for what, a measly truth that provides nothing but knowledge who Superman really is? It’s not like she’ll rat him out to the public, so her sacrificing herself is ultimately meaningless. At least if she was the average selfish reporter, her extreme drive for wanting to 100% confirm his identity for clout would make more logical sense. The story wants to portray her as a character we should root for, meanwhile her actions resemble more of a character we would otherwise dislike, not because they’re badly written, but because the plot demands it.
@@Scalesthelizardwizardeven tho episodes after this he admits he wasn't of that bc he knows Lois wouldn't he was scared of being rejected, not accepted for being an alien & how he really doesn't really care about the secret identity thing
The worst thing about Amber, even if Amber was justified in everything else she does, is that she decides to give Mark more time to tell her he’s a hero, but then gets mad at him immediately after he shows back up from the attack, despite giving him literally zero chances to tell her he was Invincible, since they were either in public, or she was avoiding him. He even tells her the first chance he gets, and she slams the door in his face, then tells him to ‘fly away, flyboy.’
Don't forget that Lois has Dad issues, on top of that. Dad issues I would have liked to see, but for some reason, they took a "tell, don't show" approach to it.
I feel like her dad will show up. But he will probably be too busy leading a team of criminals, monsters, and references to kill his daughter's boyfriend.
Also lois puts her life on the line multiple times for the truth whether that's against the alien weapons or a psycho with bombs, I see her as a messy chatacter with no regard for her safety and just looking for the truth. She's the definition of curiosity killed the cat
Forcing Clark to have a panic attack watching the person he loves possibly about to die? Gee, wonder where Lois got that idea? Maybe like, 10 minutes ago when Clark did the same shit to her? Lois' action was completely valid in this mess. She clearly was more upset about Clark brushing of her literally fearing for his life and being so upset at being unable to help him, so she gave him a moment to be in her position and understand he can't handle it.
The issue with Amber was less her getting mad at Mark and more the weird “I knew you were a superhero already” twist they clearly didn’t have planned out If they had just stuck to her not knowing, then it would’ve been pretty justified to be upset at Mark for constantly running off on her out of nowhere and leading her on With Lois, her figuring out Clark’s identity was clearly planned out, so the writers could write around her being upset Clark would lie to her over the course of the show. That’s really different from Amber cause they basically changed the reason she was upset last minute for the sake of the twist. And in retrospect, her having the full context of Mark’s situation made her being upset worse
On one hand, a Spider-Man vid made an important point that you should let your loved ones know about the secret identity for their safety. God forbid a villain figures it out and decides to go after a significant other, kid(s) etc., they can at least have some kind of game plan/strategy to escape and get help or just not freak out to the point of having a heart attack. On the other hand, despite relationships requiring honest and clear communication, I don’t think that it necessarily means anyone’s entitled to everything about someone. I also keep in mind that despite what the show is trying to depict, these couples have only known each other for a relatively short time (anywhere from say a few weeks to a couple months) at least in my eyes. The time obviously varies from person to person, I’d wait longer to reveal something of this magnitude to anyone. Thanks for awesome vid SC!❤
Yes!! Like, sure, you can criticize some of the dialogue, you can criticize the rushed pace, you can criticize some narrative inconsistencies, but criticizing the characterizations is just reaching.
Lois doing something like that is perfectly in character with many versions of the character. The biggest difference between Lois and Amber is that Lois is endgame for Clark while Amber is just Mark's first love. So making her look bad to push Mark away from her and towards Eve is kind of the point. Especially since the show removed another road block toward Mark and Eve ending up together that exists in the comics. William being openly gay instead of a closet case like in the comics means they will skip him and Eve dating.
1. Lois in this show was alrey setup to have massive trust issues because of her father 2. She gets over it pretty quickly and is understanding that, at the end of the day, Clark is genuine about wanting to help people and that he didn't want his friends to treat him differently cause of him being a literal alien Unlike Amber who KNEW about Mark being Invincible and still called him a coward in front of everyone, probably hoping to goad him into telling the truth and then acts like *he's in the wrong*
Lois jumpin off a building totally something she would do.I personally hate that troupe of being angry for not telling me your secret. I pefer the decision to respect the privacy of the other person amd let them decide when to tell you like Jazz from Danny Phantom. I think that the people did not give it time to see the result and they jumped a compare her to Amber.
All I’m gonna say, an aroace superhero would have an easier time, none of this romantic drama bs. Still the consequences of not giving people time but not the tired trope of being a bad partner. Also would be some cool representation
What makes the scenario with Amber shittier is the Invincible world has super heroes everywhere and they’ve been around for decades. Her being mad at Mark for hiding his secret identity doesn’t make any sense because he’s required to do so for different reasons, even Omni-Man has a secret identity and it’s to protect themselves and their loved ones from being targeted constantly by villains, I believe the government even requires them to do so as well. Even if Cecil was helping protect them even he could only do so much when the threats can put even Omni-Man into a tight spot so that makes her look worse, she knows how Super hero culture is but still got unjustifiably mad at Mark for doing his job which she knew for a while.
Amber knows Invincible's literally saving lives and doing everything he can for all the right reasons, and yet she still judges him for not making their dates or meeting her parents or whatever. I'm sorry but if I knew my girlfriend was keeping people FROM DYING every time she went out, I daresay I would be more tolerant of her lack of punctuality, and also not be so demanding about this aspect of her life. Meanwhile Lois finds herself falling in love with a man/being she knows nothing about other than what is presented to her at face value, which she has been conditioned to question because of how her parents treated her growing up. It's still a little frustrating when she won't just accept the good that's right in front of her but at least in this case you *get it* and it makes sense. In any normal circumstance, a guy like Superman would absolutely be too good to be true. So now we see Lois coming to grips with the fact that her "too good to be true" actually is true.
It’s kind of weird people compare these two characters specifically. Like you said, this whole (& slightly annoying) secret identity superhero dating trope is in literally so many comics. When I watched Superman, I wasn’t even thinking of comparing Lois to Amber or the show as a whole to Invincible-they’re totally different. The only similarity they share is that they have somewhat similar art styles I guess.
I said I will be pissed IF they turn Lois into an Amber. They did not, and in the next episode when you find out she was more worried about all of Clarks affections being lies (to cover for Superman) I was ok with that reasoning... enough. Just thank Mxyzptlk they get over it in one episode!
As a fan of my adventures with Superman I was thrilled they got the secret identity reveal out of the way quickly, it meant they could focus more on character work and the government conspiracy while keeping Lois and Jimmy more in the loop while avoiding will they won’t they cliches
Uuuuggghhh as someone who grew up with Jem and the holograms, I am pissed that this trope continues to thrive. The whole 'I hate liars!' personality for significant others of secret identities is just so dumb! As someone who is no longer a child and realizes that there is a degree of lies that are acceptable and that people are allowed to keep secrets, it is no longer cute for the SO to be this angry about a secret identity. Especially if the other is a SUPERHERO! The Invincible show really fumbled with the secret identity reveal, as the comic had Amber being okay with Mark being Invincible. No being angry about lies or anything, she's just 'wow my BF is a superhero!' which in my mind is a much more clever subversion of the 'Secret identity reveal.' Imagine, a SO being okay and understanding of their partner keeping a superhero identity a secret. Now that is subverting expectations.
I think the other part of the issue is that a lot of people lack the media literacy to understand that it is, in fact, fine for characters to have flaws, for not every relationship to be healthy (or be problem free), and that framing/presentation, and the overall writing and treatment of the flaws and behavior matter a lot more. So they see character behavior that kind of matches the behavior of a character they didn't like and go "It's the same!" when the reality is that the problem with Amber's not the actual actions, but the POVs and characterization before and after it not supporting the show's framing of her not being in the wrong for it, whereas Lois' behavior is presented as understandable but not necessarily *right*. But it's fine, actually sometimes even good for characters to be messy; it gives you a lot of sources of narrative conflict and tension.
actually there was a scene in the beginning that hinted at their relationship conflict at the end. I think it was about Lois trying to get the scoup while lying to mark that what she was doing is totally legal and approved. He then got rightfully angry at her for lying when the chief called him and called out her lies. But right after that is when they found out about Superman, aka marks secret identity. So this showed me that he is to a point hipocritcal, at least both of them. Since I was sure she would get angry at him if his lie came to light. But the other guy (I forgot his name) was clearly portrait as the one to be invole tarily dragged into their fights and thus a casualty of this conflict. So ig that's a pretty good foreshadowing for me to grasp this at the very first viewing. It wasn't too much on the nose, but still obvious enough for many to get it.
SPOILERS for episode 7 (as of now the latest one): I feel like the show’s really playing off of both Lois’ love for Clark as well as her paranoia about the unknown. Her first instinct to get Clark a gift isn’t to get a present, but to literally help discover his etymology and home planet so he can know just who and what he is, it’s clear as day she loves him and respects him a great degree but that she’s also paranoid as sin. She’s told by other variants of herself (that were possibly fake? Idk considering Mxy escaped the multiversal compound with no explanation, I wouldn’t be shocked if the whole thing was an elaborate plan to mess with Supes) that superman isn’t to be trusted and despite staying steadfast in her beliefs that he’s not like how they’re portraying him, at the very end of the episode, Lois ends up seeing a hologram of what some of the evil supermen variants have done and it leaves her both visibly shaken and with an unknown green kryptonite shard. I really want to see where they go with this
Honestly, that part made me laugh, because it is literally plot point in Invincible comic which season 2 will introduce. So if they do it better like with Lois vs Amber, I will lose my shit.
@@mikhaelgribkov4117 can you elaborate on how it’s a plot point in invincible? I tried looking but I can’t find it. That or I’m using wrong keywords tbh
Good vid, it's nice more people are showing that Twitter's "HAHA GOTCHA" moments aren't gonna work anymore if people actually think about it for a bit. Also I dont know if this was mentioned by you before, but did your opinion on Amber change from your own personal thoughts after the vid 2 years ago, or after lots of others' opinions? I ask cause I recently saw the old vid and you seemed more understanding and sort of on her side, tho now you are way more against it. Not "calling you out", I just always like to hear thoughts and opinions of a person change after a while and why they do so. Makes them more interesting, at least to me.
So here's my take on this. First, we like Lois. We were *told* to like Amber. Mark was crazy about her. William shipped them. Amber taught Eve how to be a hero. It was ridiculous how relentless the Amber hype train was, and when the audience is told to like or hate someone, we tend to do the opposite. Second, we understand why Lois was upset with Clark and why she jumped off the building, even if we might not agree with her. We were *told* that Amber was right and Mark was wrong. Mark gave him no sympathy, and Eve, who warned him against revealing his secret identity blamed him for not revealing his secret identity. In fact, Amber is never written as wrong about anything throughout the show, while Lois was written as wrong in the first episode. We're sympathetic to people who make mistakes, but we actively look for flaws in people presented as perfect. Third, Lois was written consistenly. Before she confronts Clark, she's shown to be impulsive, emotional, and with major hangups about being lied to. When she confronts Clark, she behaves accordingly. Amber was written to be cool, collected, and as someone who cares about helping people. When she found out that Mark was secretly saving people's lives, she behaved emotionally as someone who put her whims over other people's lives. More than that, there was no indication that she found out weeks before they confronted each other. In fact, she was shown to *not* know, so either she lied to Mark when he told her, offering a specacular poker face, for the sole purpose of hiding her ignorance, or, more likely, the writers forgot that she didn't know the episode before and wanted to make her right about everything, even when that didn't make sense.
"We need to stop getting so mad about fictional characters and instead just start questioning why they were written like that in the first place" Say it louder for the idiots at the back
I am loving this show so much and one of the things I love the most is that all the characters are flawed in some way, like it's a cartoon but they feel like real people with in depth personalities. I like that Superman, Lois, and Jimmy are far from perfect and just act like non perfect human beings/kryptonians! lol.
Lois being mad at Clark didn't really bother me that much because of how they framed it. Both sides were wrong in this situation: Clark for telling such obvious BS lies when it's clear she knows something's up and Lois for expecting him to tell her when she has gone on record saying that she would find out his secrets and write about it for everyone to learn. Whereas in Invincible, the writing tries to frame it as Mark as completely in the wrong for not telling Amber, being gaslit by her and even his friends, despite the fact that the latter (especially Eve) should be a bit understanding of the messy situation here.
But here is the thing, Mark was a bad BF. Being a hero is not an excuse. The issue is not that Mark should have told her but that he should have told her sooner because he knew the secret identity was partially responsible for the relationship failing.
@@mangamandrew And I am not denying that. Mark was a bad BF. Boy was not ready for being a hero and a boyfriend at once. My problem was that Invincible was making Mark out to be the bad guy when it is a delicate and messy situation. Yes, he keeps flaking on Amber and it's not fair to her but the dude is also saving innocent lives. It's not a black and white situation. If they had just added more clues that Amber knew, cut out that whole spiel about him not caring after he saved William, and had her say something like "You're doing good work Mark. You're helping people...but until you can handle being both Mark Grayson and Invincible, I don't think this will work between us" then I think this would have been fine.
@@neonstarch3210 Maybe, but the issue is that what he did as a whole is not acceptable wether or not he is a superhero. And there were clues that she knew such as her knowing Mark was lying about the bus accident that he was in or her calling out to Mark during the robot fight. I can see why people may have wanted to see her learn about in real time but in hindsight, there were hints. And the issue is that Amber without knowing he is a superhero tells him that he needs to balance his life. The issue though is that she is not made that her is a superhero but that he was constantly lying and broke is promise etc.
Just throwing this in: "She was that way in the comics" is a bad, and in this case even unneeded argument. This is a new rendition of the story, meaning any similaritys to the source is up in the air and shouldn't be used as an argument to explain what is happening in the show, since remakes/reimaginings do change things about the story and characters. And like I said, it's unneeded here. I only watched the first episode, and I can alredy see all the characteristics that would explain why this girl woulf throw herself off a building to proofe her point. In the first episode alone, she risked her job for a story for which she got insight from a CHILD. Risked her safety, and the safety of the interns-now-turned-friends that she got entrusted with to FOLLOW CRIMINALS WHO WHERE IN POSETION OF HIGH-TECH MILITARY ROBOTS! Did I mention that they nearly died? She lied her ass off, and later had to apologize. What does that tell us about her? That she is implusiv, determined to an unhealthy degree at which point it becomes stuborn, willimg to apologize if she accepts she screwd up, and desperate to reach her goals. This is absolutely a character that would jump off a building to proofe the story she figured out! Hell, I'd go so far as to say that she might even be a character willing to push someone else off a building to proofe her story! This is nothing but consistent character writing! And I didn't need to read the comics to figure that out!
I loved the scene where Lois jumped off it works well. She is impulsive but already knows he’s Superman and isn’t going to let her die, and on the %1 chance he isn’t Superman would probably save her anyways
HOLY S*IT MAWS lois lane is actually a good female character that doesn't only care about herself and being a narcissistic self-centered character ep 7 shows us that she actually care about her partner, the show is fun and the characters are written well enough and aren't too goofy and the comedy lands well this show is an easy 8/10 if the finely turns out to good this well earn a place in the top 30 of the best DC animated media ever. Have fun playing baldur's gate 3 ❤
The fact that Sarcas didn’t make a Catradora reference is UNDERSTANDABLE but still surprising to me- I’m glad I wasn’t being delusional when I didn’t understand why people were angry even without knowing the history of the show.
I think a big difference is that we actually got to see Lois discovering Clark was Superman for herself. So we understand where she’s coming from and why she would be upset with him for keeping secrets from her. Amber just said “Yeah, I know you’re Invincible, Mark.” despite the show having no implication that she was suspicious prior to that point. Clark and Lois’ situation feels like authentic realistic drama between two characters that care about each other instead of a forced twist and botched subversion of the “superhero telling their partner they’re a superhero” trope.
TBH, I thought Lois was angry since Clark made it obvious that he didn't like lying and was acting like a hypocrite but Jimmy telling him that he knew he wasn't comfortable talking about it. Also like she mentioned when she was caught lying that he would have helped if she had asked could mean like, she could have trusted her. I like this version of Lois and I like everything they've done so far. Can't wait for the Lois jumping of a window to be the gag of the show
>"People acting like this is the massive breaking point of the show rather than the speed bump it is..." **eyeing the Helluva Boss's fandom's gripe about the Ozzie's fallout "lacking"** yup.
If I were a superhero, supervillain, or (most likely) super-morally-grey-person, I'd reorganize my schedule to make more room for my super activities, and I'd honestly probably pick my highest-priority personal stuff a lot unless the world was ending or some dire injustice, massive crime, or big problem needed to be resolved *now* or *never.* Honestly, I'd probably focus more on addressing the root causes of society's ills so that I didn't have to spend as much time nipping this crime and that crime and the other crime in the bud. (Full disclosure, this "addressing root causes" would likely involve melting some faces.)
It should be noted there's a staunch difference between a superheroes schedule and a supervillains. Villains are usually proactive in their plans to steal, comquer rampage etc, and Heroes are reactionary in having to stop all that. It's not exactly like they coordinate either so a superhero is pretty much at the mercy of whatever the villains is depending on how many other heroes would be able to handle it alternatively. Like being part of the back up crew pfft.
Love how almost everyone miss the real issue with Lois. It isn't that she jumped off the building forcing Clark to reveal himself. It's after the fact, she mad at him for not telling her sooner. The problem with both Amber and Lois and why they're being treated the same. It's the fact that both of them feel entitle to the other secrets they're mad about being lied to rather than saying how it is. Just cause you're in a relationship with someone doesn't mean you're entitle to all their secrets. That take time and a trust bond for the person to tell you. Depending on the secret they might not ever wanna tell you because they fear you treating them entirely different. The fact is both Amber and Lois handle it entirely wrong. Instead of expressing their mad about the secret they should just explain why they didn't like it. Amber case she needed someone that will be there when she need it. That's fine Invincible can't really provide that for her. Lois needed to express how much it hurt her that she couldn't help Clark, that he's getting hurt and her not knowing entirely how or why.
For what you do next, I know Good Omens is probably outside your wheelhouse, but dude I would KILL to hear you trash talk Crowley and Aziraphale while you break down their relationship lmao
Static Shock’s best friend (whoever his name is), is the REAL chad - knows his friends’ identity, totally chill with it, even helped him design his suit, and eventually became a super hero himself! (In fact, the bros of the superheroes are always chill with it! Bros!)
I like that you describe them as messy, because like they are in their 20s,(they're all interns, and I believe Lois said she was 23) what person in their 20s has their shit together, we are all mess at that age.
Well, it's "Superman for bisexuals not named Jon Kent", because I don't think he'd want to watch a show where his parents are hot. Now *I* on the other hand...
Nah, they’re both annoying. Clark literally watched Lois’ obsession with publishing all of Superman’s secrets and putting him as some menace and her response is “BUT I NEVER WOULD HAVE DONE THAT TO YOU!” Meanwhile she’s jumping off buildings just to PROVE he was Superman (what if her dumbass was wrong?) I don’t understand what it is about Superheroes’ girlfriends not getting how serious a secret identity is. Also no, a secret is NOT a lie hello?? Is Lois stupid? A lie of omission is a lie, a secret is a secret. One is meant to manipulate a situation, the other is to preserve the secret holder. Just because her old incarnations did it too doesn’t make it less toxic or weird. She’s actually an idiot because if Clark was as obsessed with lying to everyone like she thinks he is he would have let her fall. Clark didn’t lie because he let her go on her obsessed tirades, he just kept his secret. It’s not his fault that Lois couldn’t figure out the obvious especially when he has reason to keep quiet. Lois’ only motivation for knowing who Superman is is 100% selfish “You lied to me! You lied to me!” but no one ever wants to stop and ask the reason WHY, don’t they?
Clark has to lie but his secret identity Not to mention, she has said numerous times that she is going to expose Superman for all of his secrets. Why would he tell her?
It was old Kirkman, a man who made whole Reboot arc to take piss on Miles Morales and who killed Spider-man in Marvel Zombies by inflating him with sand, that one wouldn't miss opportunity to take a piss to mock fans. I miss that one.
Lois just comes off as a lil flippant from how fast the story and writing are dealt out. Amber is a consequence of tweaking a trope without considering what kind of person the "i always knew" twist makes her into. Calling mark a coward for abandoning her RIGHT AS invincible showed up. The fact amber seems to be extra proud of her efforts meanwhile invincible saves hundreds if not thousands of lives every week, also twists that quite a bit.
13:35 This. So much. Drives me up a fucking wall that Breaking Bad "fans" kept sending Skyler's actress death threats, while somehow still praising the writers who wrote her lines. You'd think this is obvious but this stupidity keeps happening again and again.
Lois and Jimmy. Well mainly Jimmy. Are the examples of good or better writing. Unlike amber in the invincible show. Also in the comics. Mark and others have had similar flawed to Lois. Best example being mark when he got angry at his mom for telling her new bf he’s invincible. But he didn’t get angry when eve did it. He was on the news and the new bf pointed it out. And he walked into the house wearing his outfit with his brother flying. But these moments along with Lois aren’t bad or toxic. That’s something we’re all probably guilty of doing once in our life. It’s normal and still understandable but flawed
10:11 that’s the only thing bothered the hell out of me is even though she may have had faith that Superman would save her but she gambled her life to force a very personal secret out of her friend to be that obsessed over knowing something about someone without their consent is just wrong but yeah at least the series didn’t beat this like a dead horse like Miraculous Ladybug still continues to do over 4+ seasons with the will they won’t they bullshit or the whole secret identity bullshit that never had any grounds in the first place being a roadblock
I've said this elsewhere: Lois isn't upset at Clark, she is upset at her father.
The biggest reason she liked him was his ethics. She thought she found a guy who was exactly the opposite of her father. Now it turns out he has a double life too and it is bringing out all her old resentments. Why do you think she became a "Crusading Journalist"?
It's not so strange really. My grandmother said that the reason she fell for my grandfather in the first place was "he was the kindest man I had ever met."
Considering that her father's way of greeting her was to loudly complain about how fat she had gotten, I cannot say I am surprised.
Hello, it's you again
Yes no. She dumped him straight up for lying to her same as Amber did.
I think its more specifically thats she`s upset that clark is acting uncomfortably like her father in these instances. Especially near the end of the episode where hes blatantly lying about being fine despite the huge injuries he took. Thats no far off from how her father hid all the problem her family was having until it all came crashing down.
They were not even officially dating yet. She felt betrayed by Clark lying to her yes but seeing how she liked him because she thought he was honest and exactly who he appeared to be, that's fine. And it was resolved quickly.
@@DarkEclipse23difference is, even when she's crossed with him she still worries about his safety. I love that so much
The difference between them is this.
When Lois is written to be impulsive, sometimes hypercritical and having trust issues it's written as a flaw. She says sorry to clark about lying and she tends to apologize later.
With Amber the writing forces invisible to apologize and the story acts like he is the issue.
But the thing is, Mark does not Apologize.
@@mangamandrewI wouldn’t either cause wtf
Invincible’s story also frames Mark as 100% in the wrong and Amber 100% in the right. While MAWS clearly portrays the issue as more gray with both characters having valid points.
While it might be true that the writing is painting Amber as right and Mark as wrong its also being done to push them away as a couple. Its forced drama before the true paring happens.
@@Step43099 So you would not apologize for constantly lying to your partner?
One thing the episode right after Lois's jump - their search for Jimmy - did was it made hindsight better. She made it very clear that her anger with Clark stemmed from a hurt, which in turn didn't come from him keeping a secret, but that him keeping that big a secret and being willing to go as far as he did to keep it, left her feeling very uncertain about where they stood as friends and as something more. Lois couldn't see where the lie ended and the truth began, and that made her feel very insecure and manipulated. All of that could apply to Amber too, but the Superman show takes the time to explore that. We get 'the love interest perspective'.
Would love a shipping video about them from you! You always add an interesting perspective.
Where the episode FAILS is that it doesn't let Clark set the reality of HIS boundaries. It just lets her guilt trip him into accepting the blame and telling Jimmy, when at the end of the day its still a personal problem on her side. Clark doesn't get to defend himself from being vilified to her problems, and is forced to take the fault. Like a real person SHE ignores the fact he has personal reasons for keeping his secrets, ignores the fact he had the right to the privacy of said secret, ignores the fact that the ONLY lie's he ever told her were to keep his secret secure, ignores the fact she wasn't entitled to said secret, and ignores the fact that SHE was in the wrong about how she handled the situation. She's acting like a real person and people are reasonably getting mad at her for the same reason they would get mad at a real person doing what she does. What s sad is that the show doesn't act like Clark has the right to defend himself against Lois emotionally, acting like Lois being upset emotionally is more important that Clark being treated fairly, which is a very real issue IRL and is sad to see even a fictional character get away with it like it ISN'T a problem.
@@windstar120025 His boundaries are unhealthy and not only hurt Lois, but Jimmy as well as this was the reason why he was captured. Boundaries can be unhealthy by distancing you from others and that causes them to not feel trusted. All the harping on how great they are ignore the truth of life that lying is the beginning of evil, and Clark started something very evil here by lying and hurt not just himself, but others.
@@basilofgoodwishes4138 EXCEPT NO THEY Aren't, at least not here.. His boundaries and simple interest to keep his secret secure has only ever caused potential harm to anyone on ONE occasion and that was the conflict of not showing up for Jimmy, which was direvn ENTIRELY by Lois' insecurity with honesty, afterall they only forgot because She blew up on Clark. Every time they had gotten in trouble it has had NOTHING to do with Clarks secret or him keeping it secure, and always to do with Lois and Jimmy being the type of people to throw themselves into the action when sanity would suggest they don't, which is entirely on them. Boundaries are Clarks right, like it is for everyone else. Lois DOES NOT have the right to push Clark as the problem when it is her insecurities that are driving the conflict.
There is this whole topic of how it's looking at both sides but arguments like yours forget that the show is COMPLETELY SKIMPING on Clarks perspective being meaningful here as well. It's ALL about how Lois feels and NONE about Clarks reasons being valid. Now hopefully this will change but this isn't good relationship standards to live by, Clark CANT be in the wrong, JUST because Lois has insecurities, without validating the many people who invade their partners privacy just because their suspicious. We cant validate this behaviour because it's reflective of a real life problem.
@@basilofgoodwishes4138 Lois wasn't hurt by Clarks boundaries, she was hurt because SHE prioritized her needs above his boundaries and privacy. Jimmy got hurt, because Lois raged so hard at Clark their priorities changed for a bit. All issues still lead back to Lois
@@windstar120025I'm glad you mentioned the safety issue because people defending Lois don't seem to realize Clark is keeping his secret is to protect those he loves as well as himself. It feels really wrong that he can never have agency for himself but Lois can. And what made the Jimmy rescue episode worse for me is Jimmy knew Clark's identity and yet he still respected Clark enough to tell him on his own terms, and Lois doesn't ever self reflect on that situation, she just gets mad at Jimmy for not telling her. Jimmy gave Clark agency to his own identity but Lois didn't, that's not a good way to start a relationship
Amber hated that Mark wasn't spending enough time with her while he was out saving people, and felt entitled to his secret just because. She was mad at Mark for saving people and expressed no sympathy or concern for his safety.
Lois hated that Clark kept lying even when she made it clear to him she knows he was lying, she expressed concern for Clark's safety, not concern over how much time they are spending together. She wasn't mad he was saving people, she simply hates being lied to or someone not being upfront with her, like her father did with her mother's health.
Lois is not Amber.
Amber said she was made at the lying, not the fact he was not spending time with her.
and that Mark never gave a reason for constantly bailing on her until after they broke up! I know that Lois and Amber are not the same but I don't like this narrative that Amber is just being an entitled b**ch
I think a lot of people misunderstand the scene bc the writers did a bad job at explaining, but basically Amber figured out Mark was Invincible during the Cyborg attack and she wasn't mad that Mark ran away, but rather that he ran away to put on his costume, while his friend was being choked to death by a cyborg. She calls him a coward for caring more about his secret identity than his best friend.
That was supposed to be the point, but they wrote it really really vague since we never get Amber's POV.
@@davidbodor1762yes, thank you. i never understood how most viewer could miss that point. this plot act was about the trope „i am the hero so i need to have a secret identity thingy“. this balancing of private life and super hero life. in this scene, where mark tells amber that he is this superhero guy, he was arrogant and self absorbed. that made me angry. he did not make his friends a priority when they got attacked. he made his secret a priority. he lied and justified that for weeks. when your doing good stuff you don’t have to lie about that.
amber deserves to know stuff and then chooses for herself if she wants to deal with that kind of life. and civilians don’t need a savior. superhero stories are all about balancing ethics and morals. not about saving the day and get the praise for that.
@@davidbodor1762It is explicitly not the cyborg attack when she finds out, she says she knew for weeks.
One of my favorite subversions of this trope happens in Ben 10. When Julie finds out that Ben is a superhero, she supports him and tries to be as understanding as possible. Their relationship is considerably troubled, but the fact that she actually supports him from the beggining is just so refreshing and wholesome imo.
Too bad that didn't actually lead to anything. A great start to a disappointing continuation.
And then their relationship failed in every other way, up to and including Julie joining ersatz Scientology…
I love this version of Lois. Because for once, she feels like a real character. Not just a character’s girlfriend. She makes mistakes but that’s part of being human, and she apologizes for them. The story doesn’t try to pretend she’s automatically right. And in the end, that makes the payoff of her and Clark getting together, all the more satisfying.
I agree. If all that drama and misery didn't come first, those fireworks going off when they have their first kiss would be far too cheesy. Nah, the writers wanted to make this romance feel earned. It definitely helps that Lois went from obsessing over getting secrets out of Clark to wanting to help him learn more about his heritage, as a way of repaying him for all the good things he's done for her. Character development right there.
And it feels natural. Lois does make mistakes but her character feels complete and understandable here. She’s not just some one dimensional love interest who Clark likes for superficial reasons like in the comics.
@@phantomslay5612 You know, it always bugs me whenever people dismiss Lois as "hypocritical" because of the time when she lied to Clark and Jimmy about helping her with a case, and later revealing she hates being lied to. It makes me wonder if they even watched the first episode in its entirety, because at the end of its climax, she apologizes profusely and owns up to her mistake. And after that, she sticks to her guns and makes efforts to do better. I don't see how apologizing for a mistake that aligns with something you detest the most and actually learning from it makes someone hypocritical.
"The story doesn’t try to pretend she’s automatically right" but that's EXACTLY what Episode 6 was about. Her literally denying him the right to be correct in a situation HE WAS RIGHT FOR. EP 6 literally focused on her guilt tripping Clark with HER emotional needs, and ignoring that he had his own to take care of. SO much so that the show FORCED Clark to apologize when he hadnt done anything wrong. Worse yet the statement is inherently wrong becasue she has YET to apologize herself.
@@windstar120025 Actually, she already did apologize to him. Do your research next time.
This is why I love the retcon that MJ always knew Peter was Spider-Man. The drama is less about him continually missing dates and more about how many times she has to be put through him almost dying. And then One More Day happens.
And then, after One More Day, Paul happened.
@@michaelstrong5383 The writers just have a kink about torturing Peter.
@@michaelstrong5383 I really miss Nick Spencer's run. I swear aside from the Kindred mystery going on too long it's only real problems were due to editorial meddling.
@@valentinkambushev4968Peter has been through a lot even before One More Day became a thing, but they managed to balance the good with the bad.
Nowadays, it feels like the world just can't give him a break.
@@thebeavpercabethftw9604 We could have had a proper arc to Peter and MJ's relationship, but nope!
Amber is toxic, and the Invincible writers seem to think her views and actions are justified. In contrast Lois is a sympathetic character who exhibits human flaws. I don't think the Superman writers expect the audience to cosign on her behavior. I just wish they'd fix some of the tumblrish dialog.
I think they skimmed the comic
In the Comics, the Same Thing happend with Amber. With one key diffrence - Amber did not knew he was a Super Hero and instead feared He was selling drugs or something like that.
@@BrotherMag actually No. The Comic writer is actually heavily involved. But because (WARNING SPOILER AHEAD) Amber will not play a big role later on. In the Comic there would be Just on scene Post season 2 (when it will Release), where Amber is Seen.
Comics amber and TV amber are wholly different characters. At first I liked the change cuz comics amber was kinda lame.
Lois is infinitely more likable and entertaining too. Amber is just a boring character regardless of the “I always knew you were Invincible. You giving me attention is more important than you saving lives.” moment
Reminder in a really old superman comic, Superman's Girlfriend Lois Lane, Lois' car breaks down on her way to work and her solution was to jump off a cliff so that Superman can catch her and fly her to the Daily Planet.
Except Superman was out in space at the time so she just ended up hitting the ground and getting a brain injury.
What?!?😂 That's wild
Also, the episode before episode five, is revealed that Lois has a lot of trust issues, based on what happened to her father. So when she finds out Clark secret, you got a wonder what she’s thinking. Who is Clark and who is Superman? Is the person I love genuine or is this all just the cover to protect the secret. That’s probably was running through her head is completely genuine
It was stupid to make Amber act stupid until she revealed that Mark was Invincible.
I think the funniest thing about this video is learning that Lois Lane in the comics leaps out of buildings with zero provocation. I mean at least thisLois knew that Superman was right in front of her and she was in no actual danger, the comics ones are like "elevator's broken, not interested in stairs, I'll just jump out the window and hope Superman saves me!".
the difference is right there. lois didn’t know and amber did. lois felt betrayed while amber just came off as entitled.
No she wasn't she was mad that her bf only told the secret to get out of an argument. Not out of trust. Plus the entire show every character is telling Mark to tell Amber bc that classic superhero thing doesn't work, that's why nobody felt sad for him bc they warn & told him to just tell her off the bat
Lois was still acting out of entitlement, whether she felt betrayed doesn't change that it was privileged information she had no right to force out of him. She was acting out a need/desire to be told the truth regardless of the reason it was kept from her. Imagine being mad at someone for not coming out the closet to you, or being mad at them for not telling you about a history with Abuse. She knew the secret and still refused to even remotely think that Clark had the right to keep it private.
Man I can't believe people are comparing Louis to Amber, Amber is more selfish. Love your content
And Lois and much more likable and entertaining too
People are forgetting she was willing to CHEAT on Mark too but the dude had a GF
Looking back, it kind of makes sense why Amber was mad at Mark for leaving her during the Cyberman attack despite knowing he's Invincible. In her eyes he could've saved her and Will right then and there, but he valued his secret identity more.
That just goes to show she doesn't understand the point of a secret identity
@@Scalesthelizardwizardokay, why is that an issue. Also, Spiderman has at multiple occasions has revealed his secret to others. Also, people in universe won’t have the same understanding of a secret identity as the viewers.
@@mangamandrewusually to people he trusted right? Like people he fought alongside for a long while. (I mostly seen the cartoons and stuff so who knows if there was some comic I missed) If Batman started spouting to Commissioner Gordon or some doctor in the Asylum that he's also Bruce Wayne then having a secret identity has no point. People will start targeting them just to get at the newly found out Brucie Batman. It's the usual rule for most super hero types.
@@jamesbond3w Not every time. In the movies, he has revealed his secret identity to people to help save them or to people he wanted to build a stronger relationship with. This spans from all forms of media.
And the thing is that there is a difference between telling people you don’t know vs people that you trust/are close too. And the thing is that if a villain finds out the secret identity, it’s going to in danger the people around them. While Batman keeps his identity secret, he also keeps people at arms length. The point being that even if you tell no one your secret, a single accident can cause everyone you know to be targeted wether or not they know your secret identity
Nah, they just idiots who forgot that scene from the comic just doesn't fit her character.
I don't know why people keep comparing the new Lois from Amber from Invincible. It's annoying.
It is because humans look for similar traits in things they perceive as negative to not eat something else that is dangerous but this trait has some unintended side effects on the media we consume
Especially when it's obvious she's just Luz from the Owl House.
Lois sped run Superman's secret identity and I respect it. Episode 1, she never saw his face. Episode 2, she briefly saw his face after surviving what I assume has been the first ever superhuman battle in history. Episode 3, is able to fully see him, acknowledge him, and realizes exactly who Superman is. It's great that the show allowed Lois to logically acknowledge Clark's identity.
Episode 4 Learns his identity, Episode 5 abuses that information out of a sense of entitlement to force him to "Reveal" his secret then immediately attacks him for keeping a reasonable secret, Episode 6 pushes all the fault of HER actions onto him and guilt trips him into accepting the blame, Episode 7 acts like she didn't completely disrespect his right to privacy.
Personally, I think the reason this comparison is even happening to begin with is because not only did Invincible handle it badly, it did it really badly, bad enough it basically soured anything similar to it. It basically handled the situation so badly that when the next superhero cartoon decides to do something similar our first thought was the Amber situation and how bad it was/we couldn’t view the Superman one in a vacuum. It’s sorta like what happened with Sam raimi’s Mary Jane , I love those Spider-Man films but MJ was done really bad in those and basically every MJ afterwards had to sorta over correct and go “I’m not like OTHER MJs” because it sorta soured how people view her
Look, I'm not saying "Media literacy is dead! Things were better back in my day" but I do think streaming services and the binge routine of watching tv shows has kind of messed up people's ability to fully digest episodes and plot points, like just f*cking wait a minute.
"WHAT LOIS LANE JUMPED OFF THE BUILDING TO GET CLARK TO REVEAL HIS SECRET AND DIDN'T APOLOGISE!? I CAN'T BELIEVE THE WRITERS THINK WHAT SHE DID WAS OK!"
Like we're five episodes it, just give it a minute, it's okay to have a conflict and build tensions that aren't immediately resolved.
"WHY DID SHE DO THAT?!"
"Just wait till the next episode."
"I WANT TO KNOW NOW!"
"Just give it a second!"
"I WANT TO KNOW NOW! I WANT TO KNOW RIGHT NOW!"
"THEY'RE F*CKING SETTING THEM UP AS A COUPLE YOU F*CKING SCUMBAGS!"
Nah, fuck that melodrama shit, the whole reason she jumped was because Clark literally denied it when she just wanted to understand why he is hurt, which stinks.
Besides, the best thing about Invincible comic was the ability to avoid bs melodrama tropes while building characters in organic way.
Throwing yourself off a building and threatening to kill yourself just so someone will out their secret to you is still a bit extreme even if its something Lois tends to always do.
Any normal person should just break up with someone who mysteriously has to always disappear. That being said, if ya can’t trust your partner to keep a secret, are they really worth it?
That's one of the reasons why Clark didn't want to tell Lois she wanted to tell the world Superman's secrets
@@Scalesthelizardwizard Yeah, that’s fair in my opinion. Crazy how Sarcastic Chorus doesn’t think she’s at least a bit more toxic, considering she even puts her life on the line for what, a measly truth that provides nothing but knowledge who Superman really is? It’s not like she’ll rat him out to the public, so her sacrificing herself is ultimately meaningless. At least if she was the average selfish reporter, her extreme drive for wanting to 100% confirm his identity for clout would make more logical sense.
The story wants to portray her as a character we should root for, meanwhile her actions resemble more of a character we would otherwise dislike, not because they’re badly written, but because the plot demands it.
@@Scalesthelizardwizardeven tho episodes after this he admits he wasn't of that bc he knows Lois wouldn't he was scared of being rejected, not accepted for being an alien & how he really doesn't really care about the secret identity thing
The worst thing about Amber, even if Amber was justified in everything else she does, is that she decides to give Mark more time to tell her he’s a hero, but then gets mad at him immediately after he shows back up from the attack, despite giving him literally zero chances to tell her he was Invincible, since they were either in public, or she was avoiding him.
He even tells her the first chance he gets, and she slams the door in his face, then tells him to ‘fly away, flyboy.’
*Biggest difference between Lois and Amber:*
Lois has her flaws, but also has redeeming qualities.
Amber has her flaws and only her flaws.
Don't forget that Lois has Dad issues, on top of that. Dad issues I would have liked to see, but for some reason, they took a "tell, don't show" approach to it.
I feel like her dad will show up. But he will probably be too busy leading a team of criminals, monsters, and references to kill his daughter's boyfriend.
Because General is clearly Lois dad and Lois telling why is pretty reason enough to understand why it bothers her.
Honestly lois has thrown herself of buildings so many times and this one one of the least toxic least crazy version
Also lois puts her life on the line multiple times for the truth whether that's against the alien weapons or a psycho with bombs, I see her as a messy chatacter with no regard for her safety and just looking for the truth. She's the definition of curiosity killed the cat
Forcing Clark to have a panic attack watching the person he loves possibly about to die? Gee, wonder where Lois got that idea? Maybe like, 10 minutes ago when Clark did the same shit to her?
Lois' action was completely valid in this mess. She clearly was more upset about Clark brushing of her literally fearing for his life and being so upset at being unable to help him, so she gave him a moment to be in her position and understand he can't handle it.
The issue with Amber was less her getting mad at Mark and more the weird “I knew you were a superhero already” twist they clearly didn’t have planned out
If they had just stuck to her not knowing, then it would’ve been pretty justified to be upset at Mark for constantly running off on her out of nowhere and leading her on
With Lois, her figuring out Clark’s identity was clearly planned out, so the writers could write around her being upset Clark would lie to her over the course of the show. That’s really different from Amber cause they basically changed the reason she was upset last minute for the sake of the twist. And in retrospect, her having the full context of Mark’s situation made her being upset worse
Yeah, that was clearly a retcon put there for pure subversion and the only in universe way to sense of it is if she was a sociopath all along.
I was hesitant to continue the show after the drama on Twitter and RUclips but this video made it clear i need to get back to it
Clark in MAWS the Himbo Hero we deserve. Great video as always!
On one hand, a Spider-Man vid made an important point that you should let your loved ones know about the secret identity for their safety. God forbid a villain figures it out and decides to go after a significant other, kid(s) etc., they can at least have some kind of game plan/strategy to escape and get help or just not freak out to the point of having a heart attack.
On the other hand, despite relationships requiring honest and clear communication, I don’t think that it necessarily means anyone’s entitled to everything about someone. I also keep in mind that despite what the show is trying to depict, these couples have only known each other for a relatively short time (anywhere from say a few weeks to a couple months) at least in my eyes. The time obviously varies from person to person, I’d wait longer to reveal something of this magnitude to anyone.
Thanks for awesome vid SC!❤
He didn't really reveal it she just found evidence he was hiding and that made him look worse from Lois perspective.
Yes!! Like, sure, you can criticize some of the dialogue, you can criticize the rushed pace, you can criticize some narrative inconsistencies, but criticizing the characterizations is just reaching.
You should do a Sarcastic Summary of season 1 when it finishes. I seriously miss that series.
Lois doing something like that is perfectly in character with many versions of the character.
The biggest difference between Lois and Amber is that Lois is endgame for Clark while Amber is just Mark's first love. So making her look bad to push Mark away from her and towards Eve is kind of the point. Especially since the show removed another road block toward Mark and Eve ending up together that exists in the comics.
William being openly gay instead of a closet case like in the comics means they will skip him and Eve dating.
You're forgetting that Clark had no reason not to believe that Lois would mouth off to everyone if he told her.
Also literally the next episode and they figured it out in a way that’s not gonna hurt the plot moving forward
1. Lois in this show was alrey setup to have massive trust issues because of her father
2. She gets over it pretty quickly and is understanding that, at the end of the day, Clark is genuine about wanting to help people and that he didn't want his friends to treat him differently cause of him being a literal alien
Unlike Amber who KNEW about Mark being Invincible and still called him a coward in front of everyone, probably hoping to goad him into telling the truth and then acts like *he's in the wrong*
"this show is essentially superman for bisexuals-"
Damn I did NOT need this callout but you are RIGHT LOL
Lois jumpin off a building totally something she would do.I personally hate that troupe of being angry for not telling me your secret. I pefer the decision to respect the privacy of the other person amd let them decide when to tell you like Jazz from Danny Phantom.
I think that the people did not give it time to see the result and they jumped a compare her to Amber.
Man, thank you. Twitter went absolutely apeshit over it and blew the whole thing out of proportion.
All I’m gonna say, an aroace superhero would have an easier time, none of this romantic drama bs. Still the consequences of not giving people time but not the tired trope of being a bad partner. Also would be some cool representation
I out loud said “my evening’s in danger!” because that scene is iconic
If your writing Lois Lane and she isn't at least a bit insane you aren't writing a good Lois.
What makes the scenario with Amber shittier is the Invincible world has super heroes everywhere and they’ve been around for decades. Her being mad at Mark for hiding his secret identity doesn’t make any sense because he’s required to do so for different reasons, even Omni-Man has a secret identity and it’s to protect themselves and their loved ones from being targeted constantly by villains, I believe the government even requires them to do so as well. Even if Cecil was helping protect them even he could only do so much when the threats can put even Omni-Man into a tight spot so that makes her look worse, she knows how Super hero culture is but still got unjustifiably mad at Mark for doing his job which she knew for a while.
Amber is a hypocrite, but Lois is a humble person
Amber knows Invincible's literally saving lives and doing everything he can for all the right reasons, and yet she still judges him for not making their dates or meeting her parents or whatever. I'm sorry but if I knew my girlfriend was keeping people FROM DYING every time she went out, I daresay I would be more tolerant of her lack of punctuality, and also not be so demanding about this aspect of her life.
Meanwhile Lois finds herself falling in love with a man/being she knows nothing about other than what is presented to her at face value, which she has been conditioned to question because of how her parents treated her growing up. It's still a little frustrating when she won't just accept the good that's right in front of her but at least in this case you *get it* and it makes sense. In any normal circumstance, a guy like Superman would absolutely be too good to be true. So now we see Lois coming to grips with the fact that her "too good to be true" actually is true.
It’s kind of weird people compare these two characters specifically. Like you said, this whole (& slightly annoying) secret identity superhero dating trope is in literally so many comics. When I watched Superman, I wasn’t even thinking of comparing Lois to Amber or the show as a whole to Invincible-they’re totally different. The only similarity they share is that they have somewhat similar art styles I guess.
I said I will be pissed IF they turn Lois into an Amber. They did not, and in the next episode when you find out she was more worried about all of Clarks affections being lies (to cover for Superman) I was ok with that reasoning... enough. Just thank Mxyzptlk they get over it in one episode!
It still seems a bit f***ed up but I'm all for moving past it.
@@acomfyslugcat It just played into her insecurities we already knew about from the dad talk in the stairs.
Amber just fucking sucks.
Please do another episode about this show! I absolutely love it so far
As a fan of my adventures with Superman I was thrilled they got the secret identity reveal out of the way quickly, it meant they could focus more on character work and the government conspiracy while keeping Lois and Jimmy more in the loop while avoiding will they won’t they cliches
Tbh. When Lois jumped off the building to make a point. I yelled "HA! Classic Lois"
Amber is the walking embodiment of gaslighting a guy just trying to handle his business. Lois is not.
Uuuuggghhh as someone who grew up with Jem and the holograms, I am pissed that this trope continues to thrive. The whole 'I hate liars!' personality for significant others of secret identities is just so dumb! As someone who is no longer a child and realizes that there is a degree of lies that are acceptable and that people are allowed to keep secrets, it is no longer cute for the SO to be this angry about a secret identity. Especially if the other is a SUPERHERO! The Invincible show really fumbled with the secret identity reveal, as the comic had Amber being okay with Mark being Invincible. No being angry about lies or anything, she's just 'wow my BF is a superhero!' which in my mind is a much more clever subversion of the 'Secret identity reveal.' Imagine, a SO being okay and understanding of their partner keeping a superhero identity a secret. Now that is subverting expectations.
I think the other part of the issue is that a lot of people lack the media literacy to understand that it is, in fact, fine for characters to have flaws, for not every relationship to be healthy (or be problem free), and that framing/presentation, and the overall writing and treatment of the flaws and behavior matter a lot more.
So they see character behavior that kind of matches the behavior of a character they didn't like and go "It's the same!" when the reality is that the problem with Amber's not the actual actions, but the POVs and characterization before and after it not supporting the show's framing of her not being in the wrong for it, whereas Lois' behavior is presented as understandable but not necessarily *right*. But it's fine, actually sometimes even good for characters to be messy; it gives you a lot of sources of narrative conflict and tension.
read the comics it will a whole new layer to way people dont like Amber being changed. And I dont mean the skintone.
actually there was a scene in the beginning that hinted at their relationship conflict at the end. I think it was about Lois trying to get the scoup while lying to mark that what she was doing is totally legal and approved. He then got rightfully angry at her for lying when the chief called him and called out her lies. But right after that is when they found out about Superman, aka marks secret identity. So this showed me that he is to a point hipocritcal, at least both of them. Since I was sure she would get angry at him if his lie came to light. But the other guy (I forgot his name) was clearly portrait as the one to be invole tarily dragged into their fights and thus a casualty of this conflict. So ig that's a pretty good foreshadowing for me to grasp this at the very first viewing. It wasn't too much on the nose, but still obvious enough for many to get it.
I think part of it is that some dude's just can't handle women being written with flaws.
SPOILERS for episode 7 (as of now the latest one):
I feel like the show’s really playing off of both Lois’ love for Clark as well as her paranoia about the unknown. Her first instinct to get Clark a gift isn’t to get a present, but to literally help discover his etymology and home planet so he can know just who and what he is, it’s clear as day she loves him and respects him a great degree but that she’s also paranoid as sin.
She’s told by other variants of herself (that were possibly fake? Idk considering Mxy escaped the multiversal compound with no explanation, I wouldn’t be shocked if the whole thing was an elaborate plan to mess with Supes) that superman isn’t to be trusted and despite staying steadfast in her beliefs that he’s not like how they’re portraying him, at the very end of the episode, Lois ends up seeing a hologram of what some of the evil supermen variants have done and it leaves her both visibly shaken and with an unknown green kryptonite shard. I really want to see where they go with this
Honestly, that part made me laugh, because it is literally plot point in Invincible comic which season 2 will introduce. So if they do it better like with Lois vs Amber, I will lose my shit.
@@mikhaelgribkov4117 can you elaborate on how it’s a plot point in invincible? I tried looking but I can’t find it. That or I’m using wrong keywords tbh
@@somerelativleyuninterestin4763 Invincible War.
Man stop gaslighting me with that “Think, Mark. Think!” Clip.
Media literacy is truly dead of they are comparing these two.
Good vid, it's nice more people are showing that Twitter's "HAHA GOTCHA" moments aren't gonna work anymore if people actually think about it for a bit.
Also I dont know if this was mentioned by you before, but did your opinion on Amber change from your own personal thoughts after the vid 2 years ago, or after lots of others' opinions?
I ask cause I recently saw the old vid and you seemed more understanding and sort of on her side, tho now you are way more against it.
Not "calling you out", I just always like to hear thoughts and opinions of a person change after a while and why they do so. Makes them more interesting, at least to me.
He is free from shows hype. Honestly, i expect it to fall off like Sherlock and everyone to go "oh, it sucked from get go, did it?" .
So here's my take on this.
First, we like Lois. We were *told* to like Amber. Mark was crazy about her. William shipped them. Amber taught Eve how to be a hero. It was ridiculous how relentless the Amber hype train was, and when the audience is told to like or hate someone, we tend to do the opposite.
Second, we understand why Lois was upset with Clark and why she jumped off the building, even if we might not agree with her. We were *told* that Amber was right and Mark was wrong. Mark gave him no sympathy, and Eve, who warned him against revealing his secret identity blamed him for not revealing his secret identity. In fact, Amber is never written as wrong about anything throughout the show, while Lois was written as wrong in the first episode. We're sympathetic to people who make mistakes, but we actively look for flaws in people presented as perfect.
Third, Lois was written consistenly. Before she confronts Clark, she's shown to be impulsive, emotional, and with major hangups about being lied to. When she confronts Clark, she behaves accordingly. Amber was written to be cool, collected, and as someone who cares about helping people. When she found out that Mark was secretly saving people's lives, she behaved emotionally as someone who put her whims over other people's lives.
More than that, there was no indication that she found out weeks before they confronted each other. In fact, she was shown to *not* know, so either she lied to Mark when he told her, offering a specacular poker face, for the sole purpose of hiding her ignorance, or, more likely, the writers forgot that she didn't know the episode before and wanted to make her right about everything, even when that didn't make sense.
"We need to stop getting so mad about fictional characters and instead just start questioning why they were written like that in the first place" Say it louder for the idiots at the back
I am loving this show so much and one of the things I love the most is that all the characters are flawed in some way, like it's a cartoon but they feel like real people with in depth personalities. I like that Superman, Lois, and Jimmy are far from perfect and just act like non perfect human beings/kryptonians! lol.
Lois being mad at Clark didn't really bother me that much because of how they framed it. Both sides were wrong in this situation: Clark for telling such obvious BS lies when it's clear she knows something's up and Lois for expecting him to tell her when she has gone on record saying that she would find out his secrets and write about it for everyone to learn. Whereas in Invincible, the writing tries to frame it as Mark as completely in the wrong for not telling Amber, being gaslit by her and even his friends, despite the fact that the latter (especially Eve) should be a bit understanding of the messy situation here.
But here is the thing, Mark was a bad BF. Being a hero is not an excuse. The issue is not that Mark should have told her but that he should have told her sooner because he knew the secret identity was partially responsible for the relationship failing.
@@mangamandrew And I am not denying that. Mark was a bad BF. Boy was not ready for being a hero and a boyfriend at once. My problem was that Invincible was making Mark out to be the bad guy when it is a delicate and messy situation. Yes, he keeps flaking on Amber and it's not fair to her but the dude is also saving innocent lives. It's not a black and white situation. If they had just added more clues that Amber knew, cut out that whole spiel about him not caring after he saved William, and had her say something like "You're doing good work Mark. You're helping people...but until you can handle being both Mark Grayson and Invincible, I don't think this will work between us" then I think this would have been fine.
@@neonstarch3210 Maybe, but the issue is that what he did as a whole is not acceptable wether or not he is a superhero.
And there were clues that she knew such as her knowing Mark was lying about the bus accident that he was in or her calling out to Mark during the robot fight. I can see why people may have wanted to see her learn about in real time but in hindsight, there were hints.
And the issue is that Amber without knowing he is a superhero tells him that he needs to balance his life. The issue though is that she is not made that her is a superhero but that he was constantly lying and broke is promise etc.
11:50 I can't stop replaying this. It's just too funny to me.
Im glad youre giving spectacular spider-man some love.
Just throwing this in:
"She was that way in the comics" is a bad, and in this case even unneeded argument. This is a new rendition of the story, meaning any similaritys to the source is up in the air and shouldn't be used as an argument to explain what is happening in the show, since remakes/reimaginings do change things about the story and characters.
And like I said, it's unneeded here. I only watched the first episode, and I can alredy see all the characteristics that would explain why this girl woulf throw herself off a building to proofe her point. In the first episode alone, she risked her job for a story for which she got insight from a CHILD. Risked her safety, and the safety of the interns-now-turned-friends that she got entrusted with to FOLLOW CRIMINALS WHO WHERE IN POSETION OF HIGH-TECH MILITARY ROBOTS! Did I mention that they nearly died? She lied her ass off, and later had to apologize. What does that tell us about her? That she is implusiv, determined to an unhealthy degree at which point it becomes stuborn, willimg to apologize if she accepts she screwd up, and desperate to reach her goals. This is absolutely a character that would jump off a building to proofe the story she figured out! Hell, I'd go so far as to say that she might even be a character willing to push someone else off a building to proofe her story! This is nothing but consistent character writing! And I didn't need to read the comics to figure that out!
I loved the scene where Lois jumped off it works well. She is impulsive but already knows he’s Superman and isn’t going to let her die, and on the %1 chance he isn’t Superman would probably save her anyways
HOLY S*IT MAWS lois lane is actually a good female character that doesn't only care about herself and being a narcissistic self-centered character ep 7 shows us that she actually care about her partner, the show is fun and the characters are written well enough and aren't too goofy and the comedy lands well this show is an easy 8/10 if the finely turns out to good this well earn a place in the top 30 of the best DC animated media ever.
Have fun playing baldur's gate 3 ❤
Excellent analysis 👏👏👏👏
Bisexual himbo superman is what we all needed honestly
The fact that Sarcas didn’t make a Catradora reference is UNDERSTANDABLE but still surprising to me-
I’m glad I wasn’t being delusional when I didn’t understand why people were angry even without knowing the history of the show.
Amber is SO MUCH WORSE because... SHE KNOWS.
I think a big difference is that we actually got to see Lois discovering Clark was Superman for herself. So we understand where she’s coming from and why she would be upset with him for keeping secrets from her. Amber just said “Yeah, I know you’re Invincible, Mark.” despite the show having no implication that she was suspicious prior to that point. Clark and Lois’ situation feels like authentic realistic drama between two characters that care about each other instead of a forced twist and botched subversion of the “superhero telling their partner they’re a superhero” trope.
TBH, I thought Lois was angry since Clark made it obvious that he didn't like lying and was acting like a hypocrite but Jimmy telling him that he knew he wasn't comfortable talking about it. Also like she mentioned when she was caught lying that he would have helped if she had asked could mean like, she could have trusted her.
I like this version of Lois and I like everything they've done so far.
Can't wait for the Lois jumping of a window to be the gag of the show
>"People acting like this is the massive breaking point of the show rather than the speed bump it is..."
**eyeing the Helluva Boss's fandom's gripe about the Ozzie's fallout "lacking"**
yup.
You know I wondered why this was on adult swim.
And then I saw Clark without a shirt and you know what this show being on adult swim is TIGHT.
Wow, wow, wow, wow....... wow.
I might have to actually watch the show, I was only aware of Lois being Luz
If I were a superhero, supervillain, or (most likely) super-morally-grey-person, I'd reorganize my schedule to make more room for my super activities, and I'd honestly probably pick my highest-priority personal stuff a lot unless the world was ending or some dire injustice, massive crime, or big problem needed to be resolved *now* or *never.* Honestly, I'd probably focus more on addressing the root causes of society's ills so that I didn't have to spend as much time nipping this crime and that crime and the other crime in the bud. (Full disclosure, this "addressing root causes" would likely involve melting some faces.)
It should be noted there's a staunch difference between a superheroes schedule and a supervillains. Villains are usually proactive in their plans to steal, comquer rampage etc, and Heroes are reactionary in having to stop all that. It's not exactly like they coordinate either so a superhero is pretty much at the mercy of whatever the villains is depending on how many other heroes would be able to handle it alternatively. Like being part of the back up crew pfft.
One could compare heroes and villains trying to date and being in a relationship with an emergency worker
Love how almost everyone miss the real issue with Lois. It isn't that she jumped off the building forcing Clark to reveal himself. It's after the fact, she mad at him for not telling her sooner. The problem with both Amber and Lois and why they're being treated the same. It's the fact that both of them feel entitle to the other secrets they're mad about being lied to rather than saying how it is. Just cause you're in a relationship with someone doesn't mean you're entitle to all their secrets. That take time and a trust bond for the person to tell you. Depending on the secret they might not ever wanna tell you because they fear you treating them entirely different.
The fact is both Amber and Lois handle it entirely wrong. Instead of expressing their mad about the secret they should just explain why they didn't like it. Amber case she needed someone that will be there when she need it. That's fine Invincible can't really provide that for her. Lois needed to express how much it hurt her that she couldn't help Clark, that he's getting hurt and her not knowing entirely how or why.
god i fucking love my adventures w superman
For what you do next, I know Good Omens is probably outside your wheelhouse, but dude I would KILL to hear you trash talk Crowley and Aziraphale while you break down their relationship lmao
Static Shock’s best friend (whoever his name is), is the REAL chad - knows his friends’ identity, totally chill with it, even helped him design his suit, and eventually became a super hero himself!
(In fact, the bros of the superheroes are always chill with it! Bros!)
I like that you describe them as messy, because like they are in their 20s,(they're all interns, and I believe Lois said she was 23) what person in their 20s has their shit together, we are all mess at that age.
Well, it's "Superman for bisexuals not named Jon Kent", because I don't think he'd want to watch a show where his parents are hot.
Now *I* on the other hand...
I don’t think there’s anyone that really knows superheroes doesn’t understand why they keep it a secret…
Season 2 probably gonna give Amber a redemption Arc.
Nah not if it goes according to the comic, there amber is just a cheater that gets abused after.
@@ryuvereignnolife3980I’m sorry what?
@@alexvalentine5091they break up , she gets with someone else and that person beats her
At this point, I'm just waiting for Mark and Atom Eve to get together.
@@ariasity oh my god that’s bad 😰
Nah, they’re both annoying. Clark literally watched Lois’ obsession with publishing all of Superman’s secrets and putting him as some menace and her response is “BUT I NEVER WOULD HAVE DONE THAT TO YOU!” Meanwhile she’s jumping off buildings just to PROVE he was Superman (what if her dumbass was wrong?)
I don’t understand what it is about Superheroes’ girlfriends not getting how serious a secret identity is. Also no, a secret is NOT a lie hello?? Is Lois stupid? A lie of omission is a lie, a secret is a secret. One is meant to manipulate a situation, the other is to preserve the secret holder.
Just because her old incarnations did it too doesn’t make it less toxic or weird. She’s actually an idiot because if Clark was as obsessed with lying to everyone like she thinks he is he would have let her fall. Clark didn’t lie because he let her go on her obsessed tirades, he just kept his secret. It’s not his fault that Lois couldn’t figure out the obvious especially when he has reason to keep quiet. Lois’ only motivation for knowing who Superman is is 100% selfish
“You lied to me! You lied to me!” but no one ever wants to stop and ask the reason WHY, don’t they?
bro started playing the trash taste theme at 11:32
The people making this comparison probably never even watched the show but some out of context clips on youtube
For real, just conversation before the jump would make clear why Lois was pissed.
Clark has to lie but his secret identity Not to mention, she has said numerous times that she is going to expose Superman for all of his secrets. Why would he tell her?
Fun fact: Robert Kirkman, the creator of the Walking Dead & Invincible stated that Invincible can beat Superman.
Robert Kirkman can say Invicible can beat Thanos & Darkside at the same time and that would not mean anything.
It was old Kirkman, a man who made whole Reboot arc to take piss on Miles Morales and who killed Spider-man in Marvel Zombies by inflating him with sand, that one wouldn't miss opportunity to take a piss to mock fans. I miss that one.
Lois just comes off as a lil flippant from how fast the story and writing are dealt out.
Amber is a consequence of tweaking a trope without considering what kind of person the "i always knew" twist makes her into. Calling mark a coward for abandoning her RIGHT AS invincible showed up.
The fact amber seems to be extra proud of her efforts meanwhile invincible saves hundreds if not thousands of lives every week, also twists that quite a bit.
I still remember that episode of Invincible, and that whole scene. I legit thought I missed something and some context was lost. Nope, just Amber bad
13:35 This. So much.
Drives me up a fucking wall that Breaking Bad "fans" kept sending Skyler's actress death threats, while somehow still praising the writers who wrote her lines. You'd think this is obvious but this stupidity keeps happening again and again.
Lois and Jimmy. Well mainly Jimmy. Are the examples of good or better writing. Unlike amber in the invincible show. Also in the comics. Mark and others have had similar flawed to Lois. Best example being mark when he got angry at his mom for telling her new bf he’s invincible. But he didn’t get angry when eve did it. He was on the news and the new bf pointed it out. And he walked into the house wearing his outfit with his brother flying. But these moments along with Lois aren’t bad or toxic. That’s something we’re all probably guilty of doing once in our life. It’s normal and still understandable but flawed
Thank you.
10:11 that’s the only thing bothered the hell out of me is even though she may have had faith that Superman would save her but she gambled her life to force a very personal secret out of her friend to be that obsessed over knowing something about someone without their consent is just wrong but yeah at least the series didn’t beat this like a dead horse like Miraculous Ladybug still continues to do over 4+ seasons with the will they won’t they bullshit or the whole secret identity bullshit that never had any grounds in the first place being a roadblock