I tested twenty 100 oz. RCM bars that I purchased online from SD Bullion on the day right after the April 15, 2013 gold market crash. I found the same problem with each of them - no ring sound. I used a screwdriver to test each on the edge of a table. I used a hammer to lightly strike each in a suspended plastic bag. Invariably they gave out a dull sound like a solid brick. Each has the exact official dimension and weight. Should I worry any of them is faked? No! I hid them away already.★★★★★
Rin/ping testing does not work very well on bars. They are often too massive to resonate well. Also note that the resonance frequency depends _highly_ on the size and shape of a bar. A ultrasound test is much better suited for testing bars.
Can you imagine while doing that, one of those silver bars falls over and onto the top of your foot while you're recording, and you start having the camera go all over the place while you're cussing about your foot?
2016 rcm bar doesn't ping either. After reading up I've come to the conclusion the ping test may not be reliable for these bars. Watch the video 'Silver Ring Test at the JH Mint,' they think a bar is fake and cut it in half only to find out it was pure silver.
Great video. Yes, there is not suppose to be any kind of material other than silver in a .999 or .9999 silver bar. I do not buy from ebay or private sellers unless I know their background. I buy my silvers from well known online dealers or the mint itself. Thank you for showing this. I hope you recovered any loss of the fake silver. Take the bar to several dealers and check them as they may have testing instruments to verify content.
9999 silver doesnt ring well. compare the maple to the eagle. probably because super pure silver is rigid. the more copper mixed in makes it resonate longer and higher pitch.
No magnet test? No ice test? Are the dimensions the same as what the rcm states they should be? Holding the bars and hitting them produce a better sound. You need more testing than this...
Have you tried the magnet test? Search for "Magnet Test on a Real and Fake Engelhard 100oz Silver Bar" here on RUclips. I don't know however how a silver plated pure copper bar will behave. A lead or brass bar the magnet will slide of very quickly. But a pure copper bar will slow it quite significantly too. At least the lead bars are very easy to identify that way.
ping test still done today since bombs use shock insensitive explosives. The government actually uses a special mallet (they cost a little over 78,000 USD for each mallet) for these explosive validation mallets used to insure our nuclear arsenal are still ready for deployment.
PM me and we will talk ping is NOT DEFINETIVE. bars hav been destroyed due to a "failed" ping test and when cut open it was 100% pure silver so don't always go by that
The test you used doesn't prove anything, sorry. Some bars ping and some don't, just like coins. A positive ping test means it's silver. A negative ping test means nothing.
I know it's been 13 years but for those wondering about the black spots on the RCM bar, I have a 2020 bar and it has the same thing on the back. YOU CAN JUST RUB IT OFF. I suspect it's material left off from casting the bar. Get yourself a little pick and scratch it off gently, it's got silver underneath the dark spot. 👍
@russellstall Yeah, I didn't meant to imply that he was trying to prove anything. I was just letting him know that the test he ran won't give us any information either way (ie: it proves nothing).
I just bought 3 RCM 100oz bars, and like the first three shown, they don't really "ping". Any update on this? Has anyone contacted the mint for an official statement? Maybe they're all like this due to the way they're poured and cooled?
It looks highly suspicious to me. I'd be surprised that the RCM would release a bar with that big of a blemish on the back. I tested my 100 oz RCM bar that I got at the Toronto Precious Metals exchange and although it doesn't have a long ring (like the coins) you can definitely hear a faint distinctive ring. If your dealer swears it came directly from the mint then I'm sure he wouldn't have a problem exchanging it with another one that passes the ring est to your satisfaction.
I saw a UTube from JH mint were they thought they had a fake one because it did not ring so they cut it in two and it was solid silver so the ring test may not be perfect.
thats why silver is such a great storage of wealth.... but one does need to know when to sell or trade for gold :) 2011 was the perfect time to sell silver at 50 or trade for gold when it was 2000 ...
To me that just means that its time to buy more. Your not gonna hit all your investments at the perfect price the long run you can average a median price over your investments.
And now it's only worth $1,500. Silver is a "great store of wealth." Yes, but only great for the person you are buying your silver from. He's taking your cash and buying Apple and Netflix and making 100% on his money. You and your silver are losing 50% of value in 10 years and almost incalculable economic loss (the loss of what your money could be worth).
I just ran into this video. The RCM is not cooperative when it comes to providing helpful Info. Two different phone calls, first one provided zero info, and didn't want to hear any of my concerns. When I called a second time, 10 minutes later, got a different representative, who after hearing my concerns said she'd pass the info along to her supervisor, and that he'd be calling me. Four months later, still haven't gotten a call. They don't care, it's really a caveat emptor situation.
Prop the bar up at a steep angle and drop a magnet on it...the magnet should ooze down it- slower than normal. But I'm not sure if it works if the coating is thick.
I would never use the ping test on big bars of varying sizes like this. Its for rounds and coins of known size, preferrably using a reference. These are valuable so you really want to know if they are real. Use the specific gravity test. Big old bars like this will give you nice accurate results.
You got ripped off! If you go to the alibaba website they fake more RCM bars (Gold or Silver) than any other manufacturer. Specific gravity is your best bet, but you got wrecked, post the dealer's name and address. Also RCM does not deal with two bit dealers, they only distribute to handful of main distributors in the US.
Ultrasonic thickness gauges (UTG) can detect these types of fakes. Ping test is not 100% reliable because sometimes even pure silver doesnt ping the way you would expect it to.
This is the exact reason I ONLY buy the newer Sunshine Silver bars with the Mint Mark SI VALID indicator on the back. I would sell them back to the dealer you got them from, and get Sunshine Bars if they have them. I am wondering why you didn't weigh your bars in your video. Selling fake bars is a big time felony, I am sure your dealer would buy them back if you had the police with you. Any updates?
Hold at 45 degree angle and see if it's also magnetic - if should flow off nicely. I would also ask the dealer to do an acid test. There are too many counterfeit products in the markets. Ping test is okay but not definite.
the company whos name is on the fake bars is not the company making the fake bars its the chinese and its the most trusted sellers thay are counterfieting,and yes there are lots of fake englehard bars out there
Hmm, even volume testing and weighing it might not prove whether they are real or fake, I would imagine that such a large fake like that (especially from the rcm), would most likely be made of an alloy of heavier than silver (like tungston or lead) and lighter than silver (like tin or zinc) metals. That way you could get the exact density of silver with the right ratio. Finally with a coat of real silver for acid testing. Cutting one would be the only way to know for sure.
The bars you purchased that came from the mint have numbers on them. Verify through the mint that those bars were sold to the dealer you purchased them from.
Perhaps since the Canada mint bars are order of magnitude more pure than all the rest of the bars your test illustrates a tendency for the more pure ingots to crystallize into slightly stressed crystal boundaries, thus reducing the odds of single-crystal resonance harmonics. As you add impurities (i.e. the 999 bars) there is a greater chance of reduced-stress grain boundary formation which in turn would lend itself to more favorable and monolithic harmonics as you count on these things to resonate correctly upon impact. For the folks who mentioned tungsten nefariously being substituted for gold, spot on. Their densities are extremely similar (less than 0.2% difference), so dimensional check would be easier to fake. But lead substituting for silver?? It's about 8% more dense, you'd have to be very bad with a ruler or other density determination to make that kind of mistake. If there were lead in any of those it would be very obvious. Finally, I'll bet those bars would look interesting using ultrasonic imaging. You'll find more inclusions and bigger grain structure in the 3 soundless ones. One thing, why didn't you hit the ingots with the plastic end of the screwdriver? Seems like you could have wailed on them much harder without risking a dent in the bars. Cheers!
Would a .09% really change the "ping" that much? I dought it but i could be wrong, id like to buy a couple rcm bars and ping them myself.... You may be right,but i think they are lead filled.
Lead's quite a bit more dense than silver, so simple density calculations can prove or disprove that, just use volume of a trapezoidal cube and assume some loss for rounding. Plus if you get your silver from a reputable source it's going to be a stretch to find doctored silver. Maybe when it goes up to $500/oz there would be a reason but not at $15. The purity level affects things for sure, from my experience. It may not seem like a big amount of change when you do simple subtraction like that, but instead what's happening is removing impurities *by an order of magnitude*, thereby removing the atomic obstacles preventing the silver from forming ever larger and uninterrupted crystal networks. Things like crystal networks affect sound transmission, for sure. Another "purity" example in the world of materials engineering is the purity of alumina (just popped up recently 'cause I'm spec-ing out materials for a sensor right now). Just going from 99% to 99.8% purity gives you 14% extra thermal conductivity! (www.mcdanelceramics.com/alumina.html) Also alumina's strength goes up as it becomes more pure. I realize with silver we're discussing one decimal farther out, but with the "ting" should be expected to be of better quality from more pure stock material.
chugginbeers Yes, poured vs. extruded could have mildly different properties with enough to result in a different ting. Plus those two processes occur at different temperature profiles, and the morphology of the crystal lattice will be quite different as a result of the process. So two things are working towards a different sound. Thanks for the compliment! Cheers, I like beer too! :D
+Chemist BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH, do specific gravity, it will tell you what you need to know without destroying the bars, then call the local DA and file a police report. The "Reputable" dealer will beg to give your money back when he faces felony charges for theft and other things.
Mint orders to dealers still use couriers. You gotta figure anytime there is a separation from what you are purchasing and the product in your hand the magic is in the receiving exactly what you ordered and not a counterfeit. I.E. Expect to be counterfeited.
I remember a water displacement test some people were doing to see if there was a core made of some other crap metals. Only two ways to find out if they are solid silver is the displacement test or drilling into the bar, i guess. Not an expert, though. hehe
You should perform a specific gravity test and if that is inconsistent then you need to contact RCM directly and arrange to have them verify conclusively with ultrasound, as well as alerting them to the vendor that sold you the bars in case they find something funny going on.
No, there are fake Englehard 100oz bars as shown in this video: ruclips.net/video/NgSXg-WOEVY/видео.html And fake JM bars shown in this video: ruclips.net/video/MA83UhWpO80/видео.html
Weigh them. Do a simple magnet test. Drop some acid on the silver plated ones that the dealer (or last seller) obviously did to find out they were fake (thus the acid hole you observed). Then video post the results for us. The weights should be identical, and the magnet tests together should be enough to confirm your suspicions...
I just checked the metal density tablet (in case he checked for density) silver has pretty close density to lead. I wonder if lead would pass a magnet test. Will it slow down the neodymic magnet just like silver does?
The Royal Canadian Mint is one of the most prestigious mints in the world, if not the best, I'd trust anything they make over any other mint. The RCM makes a 99.99999% gold Maple Leaf coin most other mints just make 91% or 99.999%, actually that's probably because the other mints are only able to make lower purity metals compared to the RCM..
you could do the water displacement test. you can get directions on line, it's not very complicated. I hope it works out and your bars are not tungsten filled. Good luck.
US Silver Eagles "ring". Using my own stack, I can get them to ring with my hands. If you are a silver noob, make your Silver Eagles ring this way - Take an un-sharpened wood pencil. Gently toss the Eagle up into the blunt edge of the pencil, so that the Eagle strikes the pencil in mid-air and bounces back down in your hand. THAT COIN WILL RING GUARANTEED! If it doesn't, it's a fake.
That's not entirely accurate, do it with the same striking force exerted on all objects. I use a guide with a metallic sphere taking advantage of the free fall of gravity 9.81 m / s2. Then I measure the sound spectrum comparing together different sound waves. All this is best done at room temperature between 20 and 22 degrees Celsius.
@dregsta I've just made a purchase of 1 oz. silver bars and they were more than $38 bucks. It cost me bout $44 an once. Wish I had bought it back in 2010, I could've got it for $20 I believe according to some of the people that have commented on youtube.
Ping test has dubious results. Diamagnetic & Specific Gravity testing offers more accurate results. And of course ultrasonic test will be conclusive, but that will involve a 3rd party.
I never put much faith in ring tests. Unless it's like an ultrawave test or something lie that to me it doesnt mean anything. I'll give you a hundred bucks for that one "fake" bar if your concerned with it LOL
I'm sorry but I simply can't understand you. I've seen the fake gold bar you're talking about, and I've seen many other fake gold bars in the past as well. I can't see how it has anything to do with the comment I made on this video about silver bars.
I better ping test is to place center your bar on a quarter on a hard surface then tap the bar if you get a nice ping you should be alright if not your screwed.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
I tested twenty 100 oz. RCM bars that I purchased online from SD Bullion on the day right after the April 15, 2013 gold market crash. I found the same problem with each of them - no ring sound. I used a screwdriver to test each on the edge of a table. I used a hammer to lightly strike each in a suspended plastic bag. Invariably they gave out a dull sound like a solid brick. Each has the exact official dimension and weight. Should I worry any of them is faked? No! I hid them away already.★★★★★
Rin/ping testing does not work very well on bars. They are often too massive to resonate well. Also note that the resonance frequency depends _highly_ on the size and shape of a bar.
A ultrasound test is much better suited for testing bars.
take extreme caution and dispose of those fake bars immediately. Send them to me and I will take care of this mess for you. no charge.
Can you imagine while doing that, one of those silver bars falls over and onto the top of your foot while you're recording, and you start having the camera go all over the place while you're cussing about your foot?
2016 rcm bar doesn't ping either. After reading up I've come to the conclusion the ping test may not be reliable for these bars. Watch the video 'Silver Ring Test at the JH Mint,' they think a bar is fake and cut it in half only to find out it was pure silver.
I watched that video, and laughed so hard! I asked if I could get if for half price! lol
What's the prognosis, dude? What happened on these? Was the source really as questionable as the ping on those RCM's.
Ping test is not accurate in silver bars.
Great video. Yes, there is not suppose to be any kind of material other than silver in a .999 or .9999 silver bar. I do not buy from ebay or private sellers unless I know their background. I buy my silvers from well known online dealers or the mint itself. Thank you for showing this. I hope you recovered any loss of the fake silver. Take the bar to several dealers and check them as they may have testing instruments to verify content.
9999 silver doesnt ring well. compare the maple to the eagle. probably because super pure silver is rigid. the more copper mixed in makes it resonate longer and higher pitch.
No magnet test? No ice test? Are the dimensions the same as what the rcm states they should be? Holding the bars and hitting them produce a better sound. You need more testing than this...
I highly recommend using the ice test
Does the fact that RCM is purer, 9999, than the other bars affect the ping?
@0muffins0 thanks man much appreciated you think silver will go to 38$ a oz this year?
Nope
Did you drill into those other bars that were suspected of being fake? What did you find out?
1966Hemi426 i think the dark spot tells
+Dave Silver The dark spot is graphite. It's residue left over from the molds they are casted in.
Update ?
Have you tried the magnet test?
Search for "Magnet Test on a Real and Fake Engelhard 100oz Silver Bar" here on RUclips.
I don't know however how a silver plated pure copper bar will behave. A lead or brass bar the magnet will slide of very quickly. But a pure copper bar will slow it quite significantly too. At least the lead bars are very easy to identify that way.
We used to ping test bombs back in the day to find duds... Good times !
ping test still done today since bombs use shock insensitive explosives. The government actually uses a special mallet (they cost a little over 78,000 USD for each mallet) for these explosive validation mallets used to insure our nuclear arsenal are still ready for deployment.
PM me and we will talk ping is NOT DEFINETIVE. bars hav been destroyed due to a "failed" ping test and when cut open it was 100% pure silver so don't always go by that
WISH I READ THIS BEFORE I MADE MY COMMENT , DO YOU HAVE PROOF , FOR THE PING TEST I MEAN
The test you used doesn't prove anything, sorry. Some bars ping and some don't, just like coins. A positive ping test means it's silver. A negative ping test means nothing.
Please update on what these are.
I know it's been 13 years but for those wondering about the black spots on the RCM bar, I have a 2020 bar and it has the same thing on the back. YOU CAN JUST RUB IT OFF. I suspect it's material left off from casting the bar. Get yourself a little pick and scratch it off gently, it's got silver underneath the dark spot. 👍
Are all the weights the same? Try doing a specific gravity test. Ultrasound it or just drill it to make sure.
@russellstall
Yeah, I didn't meant to imply that he was trying to prove anything. I was just letting him know that the test he ran won't give us any information either way (ie: it proves nothing).
can we go this test on gold bar?
I just bought 3 RCM 100oz bars, and like the first three shown, they don't really "ping". Any update on this?
Has anyone contacted the mint for an official statement? Maybe they're all like this due to the way they're poured and cooled?
Any updates?
Hi, how did you go on testing? what came out?
Also, silver can be electrically charged to become pretty magnetic, like most other metals.
It looks highly suspicious to me. I'd be surprised that the RCM would release a bar with that big of a blemish on the back.
I tested my 100 oz RCM bar that I got at the Toronto Precious Metals exchange and although it doesn't have a long ring (like the coins) you can definitely hear a faint distinctive ring.
If your dealer swears it came directly from the mint then I'm sure he wouldn't have a problem exchanging it with another one that passes the ring est to your satisfaction.
I saw a UTube from JH mint were they thought they had a fake one because it did not ring so they cut it in two and it was solid silver so the ring test may not be perfect.
Where did you get the bars from?
Wow. At the time of this video those bars (if real) were worth about $3000 each. Today they are worth about $1600 each. That's a $1,400 loss per bar!
thats why silver is such a great storage of wealth.... but one does need to know when to sell or trade for gold :) 2011 was the perfect time to sell silver at 50 or trade for gold when it was 2000 ...
TroyOunce you're correct, but did you hear that Deutsch bank is being fined for manipulating the silver price
To me that just means that its time to buy more. Your not gonna hit all your investments at the perfect price the long run you can average a median price over your investments.
TroyOunce I’ll buy them all right now
And now it's only worth $1,500. Silver is a "great store of wealth." Yes, but only great for the person you are buying your silver from. He's taking your cash and buying Apple and Netflix and making 100% on his money. You and your silver are losing 50% of value in 10 years and almost incalculable economic loss (the loss of what your money could be worth).
i hope you make a follow up video about the efficacy of the ring test in telling the authenticity of silver
That's brutal. Those bars are like 2 grand each. Unfortunately your dealer is going to tell you it's real, whether he's scamming you or not.
for anyone that can't hear the ping in your silver bars i'll be glad to take them from you FREE!
what was the outcome of this whole thing?
I call BS on this video... you posted a video on YT rather than informing the RCM or the police?
+VisualAssault2011 why not both?
From my experience , with a 1 0z gold lingot, RCM do not answer your e-mail
I just ran into this video. The RCM is not cooperative when it comes to providing helpful Info. Two different phone calls, first one provided zero info, and didn't want to hear any of my concerns. When I called a second time, 10 minutes later, got a different representative, who after hearing my concerns said she'd pass the info along to her supervisor, and that he'd be calling me. Four months later, still haven't gotten a call. They don't care, it's really a caveat emptor situation.
Prop the bar up at a steep angle and drop a magnet on it...the magnet should ooze down it- slower than normal. But I'm not sure if it works if the coating is thick.
Hey I live in Toronto and just bought an RCM 100Oz. Bar. Any suggestions as how to how I can verify its authenticity?
Cheers :)
This is 3 years old - and still NO UPDATE on whether they are real or fake. Post the final results - PLEASE !!!!!
CaseModVideos 3 years lattet
I would never use the ping test on big bars of varying sizes like this. Its for rounds and coins of known size, preferrably using a reference. These are valuable so you really want to know if they are real. Use the specific gravity test. Big old bars like this will give you nice accurate results.
You got ripped off! If you go to the alibaba website they fake more RCM bars (Gold or Silver) than any other manufacturer. Specific gravity is your best bet, but you got wrecked, post the dealer's name and address. Also RCM does not deal with two bit dealers, they only distribute to handful of main distributors in the US.
how many bars do you have know
Ultrasonic thickness gauges (UTG) can detect these types of fakes. Ping test is not 100% reliable because sometimes even pure silver doesnt ping the way you would expect it to.
Any update ? Were they real or no ?
and STOP buying silver from ebay .
Think it would work best if you tied them to a string and beat on them.
do specific gravity test
Follow up m8. we all need to know if there are fake RMC bars out there so we dont get stung.
Thnx for the vid.
Regards Hawkwood23
How much does one of those cost you?
Current today price in link below
www.jmbullion.com/100-oz-rcm-silver-bar-new/
You should also do a weight and magnetic test on those 3 bars .
lettering is messed up on the emblem. I would send it off to reputable dealer for ultrasonic testing.
This is the exact reason I ONLY buy the newer Sunshine Silver bars with the Mint Mark SI VALID indicator on the back. I would sell them back to the dealer you got them from, and get Sunshine Bars if they have them. I am wondering why you didn't weigh your bars in your video. Selling fake bars is a big time felony, I am sure your dealer would buy them back if you had the police with you. Any updates?
I just noticed the loud ping of a Morgan compared to silver eagle
The bar with the rust color (4th) bar on the table,had the most different sound than the other ones.
No, they don't. The purest coin they make is the 99999 Gold Coin - Mountain Avens
Hold at 45 degree angle and see if it's also magnetic - if should flow off nicely. I would also ask the dealer to do an acid test. There are too many counterfeit products in the markets.
Ping test is okay but not definite.
the company whos name is on the fake bars is not the company making the fake bars its the chinese and its the most trusted sellers thay are counterfieting,and yes there are lots of fake englehard bars out there
@0muffins0 I have First Majestic rounds directly from First Majestic and guess what? They ring better than any of my silver coins.
That RCM is likely real.....RCM's are known for not pinging.
Hmm, even volume testing and weighing it might not prove whether they are real or fake, I would imagine that such a large fake like that (especially from the rcm), would most likely be made of an alloy of heavier than silver (like tungston or lead) and lighter than silver (like tin or zinc) metals. That way you could get the exact density of silver with the right ratio. Finally with a coat of real silver for acid testing. Cutting one would be the only way to know for sure.
drill in 3 areas on the back side of the three suspect bars at least 1/4 to 1/2 inch deep and see what material comes out.
The bars you purchased that came from the mint have numbers on them. Verify through the mint that those bars were sold to the dealer you purchased them from.
Perhaps since the Canada mint bars are order of magnitude more pure than all the rest of the bars your test illustrates a tendency for the more pure ingots to crystallize into slightly stressed crystal boundaries, thus reducing the odds of single-crystal resonance harmonics. As you add impurities (i.e. the 999 bars) there is a greater chance of reduced-stress grain boundary formation which in turn would lend itself to more favorable and monolithic harmonics as you count on these things to resonate correctly upon impact.
For the folks who mentioned tungsten nefariously being substituted for gold, spot on. Their densities are extremely similar (less than 0.2% difference), so dimensional check would be easier to fake. But lead substituting for silver?? It's about 8% more dense, you'd have to be very bad with a ruler or other density determination to make that kind of mistake. If there were lead in any of those it would be very obvious.
Finally, I'll bet those bars would look interesting using ultrasonic imaging. You'll find more inclusions and bigger grain structure in the 3 soundless ones.
One thing, why didn't you hit the ingots with the plastic end of the screwdriver? Seems like you could have wailed on them much harder without risking a dent in the bars.
Cheers!
Would a .09% really change the "ping" that much? I dought it but i could be wrong, id like to buy a couple rcm bars and ping them myself.... You may be right,but i think they are lead filled.
Lead's quite a bit more dense than silver, so simple density calculations can prove or disprove that, just use volume of a trapezoidal cube and assume some loss for rounding. Plus if you get your silver from a reputable source it's going to be a stretch to find doctored silver. Maybe when it goes up to $500/oz there would be a reason but not at $15.
The purity level affects things for sure, from my experience. It may not seem like a big amount of change when you do simple subtraction like that, but instead what's happening is removing impurities *by an order of magnitude*, thereby removing the atomic obstacles preventing the silver from forming ever larger and uninterrupted crystal networks. Things like crystal networks affect sound transmission, for sure.
Another "purity" example in the world of materials engineering is the purity of alumina (just popped up recently 'cause I'm spec-ing out materials for a sensor right now). Just going from 99% to 99.8% purity gives you 14% extra thermal conductivity! (www.mcdanelceramics.com/alumina.html) Also alumina's strength goes up as it becomes more pure. I realize with silver we're discussing one decimal farther out, but with the "ting" should be expected to be of better quality from more pure stock material.
chugginbeers Yes, poured vs. extruded could have mildly different properties with enough to result in a different ting. Plus those two processes occur at different temperature profiles, and the morphology of the crystal lattice will be quite different as a result of the process. So two things are working towards a different sound. Thanks for the compliment! Cheers, I like beer too! :D
You're welcome. Now to find those damn 100oz bars...www.providentmetals.com/100-oz-rcm-royal-canadian-mint-9999-silver-bar.html
+Chemist BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH, do specific gravity, it will tell you what you need to know without destroying the bars, then call the local DA and file a police report. The "Reputable" dealer will beg to give your money back when he faces felony charges for theft and other things.
Those three are fake for sure. I can tell just by looking at them also.
I thought your Heraeus was fishy looking, but it sounds good.
+Richard's World No, the Heraeus was fishy for sure, it sounded filled with a layer of silver.
Water displacement test
Mint orders to dealers still use couriers. You gotta figure anytime there is a separation from what you are purchasing and the product in your hand the magic is in the receiving exactly what you ordered and not a counterfeit. I.E. Expect to be counterfeited.
Try flipping then on their sides. Hopefully there is too much surface area and grip making those things sound dead inside. Let me know if you try.
I remember a water displacement test some people were doing to see if there was a core made of some other crap metals. Only two ways to find out if they are solid silver is the displacement test or drilling into the bar, i guess. Not an expert, though. hehe
the three without the ping sound are made of lead
You can also do a ice test
You should perform a specific gravity test and if that is inconsistent then you need to contact RCM directly and arrange to have them verify conclusively with ultrasound, as well as alerting them to the vendor that sold you the bars in case they find something funny going on.
Its very clear that the 3 bars are a lead/silver mixture,coaded with silver.
Deliver them bach asap.if they refuse, report them for fraud. Period.
looks like there counterfeited bars with tungsten inside
Neodymium magnet test them, and measure the dimensions.
Sorry there guy no test needed with Stamped JM or Englehard. As they are certified from the Mint.
No, there are fake Englehard 100oz bars as shown in this video: ruclips.net/video/NgSXg-WOEVY/видео.html
And fake JM bars shown in this video:
ruclips.net/video/MA83UhWpO80/видео.html
Weigh them. Do a simple magnet test. Drop some acid on the silver plated ones that the dealer (or last seller) obviously did to find out they were fake (thus the acid hole you observed). Then video post the results for us. The weights should be identical, and the magnet tests together should be enough to confirm your suspicions...
I just checked the metal density tablet (in case he checked for density) silver has pretty close density to lead. I wonder if lead would pass a magnet test. Will it slow down the neodymic magnet just like silver does?
The Royal Canadian Mint is one of the most prestigious mints in the world, if not the best, I'd trust anything they make over any other mint. The RCM makes a 99.99999% gold Maple Leaf coin most other mints just make 91% or 99.999%, actually that's probably because the other mints are only able to make lower purity metals compared to the RCM..
you could do the water displacement test. you can get directions on line, it's not very complicated. I hope it works out and your bars are not tungsten filled. Good luck.
follow up?
The shape contributes to most of the ringing.
Follow up????????
US Silver Eagles "ring". Using my own stack, I can get them to ring with my hands. If you are a silver noob, make your Silver Eagles ring this way - Take an un-sharpened wood pencil. Gently toss the Eagle up into the blunt edge of the pencil, so that the Eagle strikes the pencil in mid-air and bounces back down in your hand. THAT COIN WILL RING GUARANTEED! If it doesn't, it's a fake.
you should buy silver from a real dealer not eBay
All of Your Silver Bars are Pure Silver! Your Ring Test is not an Fire Assay.
you should try the magnet test
current value (3/27/12) $3,368
Current value (05/02/2020) $1,504 - a LOSS of $1,864. Silver is awesome! Yeah, sure it is!
That's not entirely accurate, do it with the same striking force exerted on all objects. I use a guide with a metallic sphere taking advantage of the free fall of gravity 9.81 m / s2. Then I measure the sound spectrum comparing together different sound waves. All this is best done at room temperature between 20 and 22 degrees Celsius.
ring test is only 90%.... they can form with a mixed molecular structure from melt.. and they won't ring. Typical of 'late' pour or mixed pour bars.
Without a control (something you know isn't silver but the same size), it is hard to know.
Earth metal and still test is in order
@dregsta I've just made a purchase of 1 oz. silver bars and they were more than $38 bucks. It cost me bout $44 an once. Wish I had bought it back in 2010, I could've got it for $20 I believe according to some of the people that have commented on youtube.
Ping test has dubious results. Diamagnetic & Specific Gravity testing offers more accurate results. And of course ultrasonic test will be conclusive, but that will involve a 3rd party.
I never put much faith in ring tests. Unless it's like an ultrawave test or something lie that to me it doesnt mean anything. I'll give you a hundred bucks for that one "fake" bar if your concerned with it LOL
I'm sorry but I simply can't understand you. I've seen the fake gold bar you're talking about, and I've seen many other fake gold bars in the past as well. I can't see how it has anything to do with the comment I made on this video about silver bars.
dude tap the bars with a piece of silver,if you want to hear it better. you got a lot of silver and get a new dealer
sadly none of these are more than a copper ingot silver plated
@0muffins0 thx for your input I already knew about a) b) and c)
You'd be a better result if you balance the gar in the center on the end of your fingertip. It gives a better ring.
I better ping test is to place center your bar on a quarter on a hard surface then tap the bar if you get a nice ping you should be alright if not your screwed.
I say fake , Drill into it and test it. thanks for the info
i have a stenless flange for turbo here, and it got the same PITCH.. im confuse