@@santiagoalonso7257 Y sabías que gano todas pero le fueron robadas incluso al que mencionas Alexis Arguello fue un robo descarado le dislocó las quijadas y le dieron el triunfo a Argüello. El mismo reconoció que perdió. El único ko que conoció fue ante púas Olivares fue un descuido pero lo tiró 3 veses a la lona. Fue en sus inicios
@@santiagoalonso7257 ¿o se que en el Salón de la fama, cuentan las que perdiste, y no las que ganaste?... de antemano muchas gracias por la información.
Those commentators wants Whitaker win just with a weak jab ,running and tying up since the first round and that is not the way to fight for a title.that’s why the judges score the way they did
Sweet pea trainer says at the beginning of 11, this is a close fight.. and there are people saying this was a robbery pffff, Ramirez won a close fight!
Whitaker fought as he was already the champion, he didn’t understood he needed to snatch the belt out of Ramirez. By the way, the biased comentators also did 😂
You're an idiot. Rounds are scored the same regardless. The vast majority of the public knew Whitaker won, and he was robbed. Just like he was robbed vs Chavez in San Antonio.
Whitaker was clearly a star on the rise here. The announcers are blind to any punches Ramirez lands while gushing over everything Pernell does. It was a very close fight...
the announcers are calling the fight many years later. This is ESPN classic where the announcers are watching the fight from the ESPN studios in the mid 1990s
It’s boxing not rock em sockem. He making him miss making him pay and he landing the more memorable blows if that’s not the formula to winning what is?
@@215thetruth making someone miss don't win you fights being forced too run don't make you win fights but landing punches sure do and ramirez clearly beat whitaker easy this is no dame running track
LOS JUEZES SON EUROPEOS...ELLOS QUIEREN VER PELEA...CON ESTA CLASE DE JUEZES MAYWEATHER HUBIERA PERDIDO MÁS DE UNA PELEA...AQUÍ NO ES LAS VEGAS..PERNELL WAS GREAT
Yes we don't like fighters who are running all the time without being able to hit effectively, if i would watch this kind of athletes i would watch 50km race walk or marathon for example lol ! The ones claiming that Pernell did beat Oscar DLH should watch something else, he was clearly backing off Oscar's power by moving all his body in awkward positions sometimes flirting or passing over the boxing rules..
@@ComaToast1 you know they are fighting in Europe right? Jose luis Ramirez is Mexican. How could it be a robbery? The European judges just wanna see a real fight, not someone running a marathon. When floyd fought in Las Vegas only because he knew he had the advantage there
En la pelea que tuvo con argüello fue robado descaradamente, incluso el mexicano mando a la lona a argüello y lamentablemente se la robaron, un grande del boxeo mundial
Ramirez solo gano ese raund el de la caída, el resto le dio cátedra Alexis, si tenes tiempo vas a contar como 450 cruzados en el tronco de la oreja y como 600 rectos de derecha y el zurdito no paro de correr en la bicicleta 😂
@@alexandrosanchez6501con todo respeto eiwiltaker mucho más marrullero que floy maywether José Luis Ramírez lo corretio toda la pelea nunca quiso pararse a dar pelea así no merecía nisiquiera un empate
He’s moving and boxing. Landing combinations, fighting behind a beautiful right jab, out throwing Ramirez, and not getting hit back. Boxing is an art, not street fighting. I think that’s something people in these comments forget about (as most of them ridiculously believe Ramirez deserve the victory). Hitting without getting hit is the way to go.
@@kdberry1997that's because the vast majority of them posting comments on here are what's termed as casuals & know absolutely SFA about the Noble Art!!! Unlike yourself as I can tell you know your boxing and understand why it's called the sweet science!👍😊🥊
La manera en que Chávez metía la derecha al mismo tiempo que hacía bending. Mucho más rápido que Ramírez y más certero. Ramírez sí está un poco por debajo de Julio.
YDKSAB, you cant run inside a boxing ring if your opponent has a rudimentary fkn clue on how to cut off the ring casual, not to mention, how the hell does the guy so called running land more telling punches, you dunce? Whitaker didnt so call run and barely clinched vs Julio Cesar Chavez and got robbed just the same, gtfoh with that garbage ass boxing IQ kid. Dont comment any further on boxing, its way too complicated for your level of intelligence,
@@200littleman 😆😆🤣🤣😂😂 The one who received the gift of his life was Pernell, the defeat he had against our great Mexican champion was painful, that style of running around the ring is useless against a hunter like José Luis Ramirez
@@200littleman “flat”? 😂😂 anyone can run in the ring LMAAAO Go do some research about why Mexicans fight like that, they need to sell the fights in the states, they are boxers, they are not in the Formula 1 where they come from a wealthy family. Chavez destroyed that style lol Oh and again, go do some research, Mexico owns the USA when it’s about championship fights 😂😂🤟🏻🤟🏻
@@phonejack8949 ‘Turning the back is a foul. This includes any method of weaving or ducking or rolling or turning such that the opponent is solely or mostly presented with the back of the head and/or body’.
Boom booms running out the mouth but Livingstone Bramble beat him twice and just whooped him like 40 going north and he stand up there for this what he should do in his tell him why didn't he do it
If you get two Ramirez-style boxers, you will have a great fight. If you get two Pernell-style boxers, you will have two guys running around the whole fight. pffft.
Toda la pelea se la paso corriendo , y eso que Ramírez ya era un veterano y aún así se creía ganador Pernell , lo que es no asimilar el profesionalismo a diferencia del boxeo amateur!
@@santiagoalonso7257 Claro que no se questiona el gran peleador que fue Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker. Tenia un estilo defensivo con excelent contragolpeo, muy buen trabajo de piernas y muy veloz de manos. Su mejor arma, la defensa, el jab, el contragolpeo a velocidad y en combinaciones. Ahora hablando de esta pelea y siendo sinceros, Whitaker empezo ganando facilmente los primeros asaltos. El 6to fue parejo, de ahi en adelante Jose Luis Ramirez tomo la iniciativa y estuve encima cortando el ring y conectando golpes. Pareciera que Whitaker no podia quitarse de encima a Ramirez que perseguia y conectaba al cuerpo y arriba, la mayor parte de los ultimos fueron para J.L. Ramirez. En el 12 Whitaker se impone nuevamente y lo gana. Recordemos que en este tiempo para que despojaran a un campeon mundial de su cinturon tenian que vencerlo claramente. Muy pocas veces Whitaker se paro a fajarse, quizas sintio el poder de Ramirez y por eso retrosedio demasiado durante la segunda parte de la pelea. Lo que si es que mas que un robo, Whitaker dejo de hacer cosas para convencer del todo a los jueces para que le dieran la pelea. En la revancha, Whitaker con sus habilidades y muy buen boxeo, fue mas constante y gano claramente.
@@santiagoalonso7257 en Europa califican diferente. Además Ramírez era manejado por dos franceses, ahí estaban en Francia. Prácticamente tenía la ventaja de local. Se que Whitaker fue un grande pero esta pelea fue horrible con todo el respeto que se merece. Yo creo que se enojaron los jueces y se la dieron a Ramírez.
Whitaker un peleador marrullero y correlon igual de arrogante y pretencioso que su entrenador Lou Duva. Ramírez definitivamente tiene que estar en el salón de la fama del boxeo,un grande del boxeo de México para el mundo.
La mayoria de los negros son oportunistas y correlones casi no presentan pelea, por eso sus peleas son enfadosas mi zurdito de Sonora José Luis Ramirez, siempre dio grandes peleas
Eso fue un bochornoso robo whitaker le dio una clase de boxeo y de defensa lo mismo q a Chávez tan bien le dio.clase y se la robaron el.americano es.mas fino.q el mejicano q lo.q saben es ir.para el frente no tienen de defensa q bochorno
No seas tonto mexicano, los mexicanos son buenos recibiendo palizas de los negros,porque será que la mejor pelea de Chaves fue contra un negro, los boxeador negros somos los mejores del mundo y con diferencia, más campeones mundiales, prefiero correr que tener parquison y hablar como un enfermo mental.recibir palizas no te hace más macho, esto es boxeo, su peleador azteca robo está pelea.
Perdió Whitaker, se la paso huyendo en el combate. La mafia del boxeo que no proteja mas a estos boxeadores, con este estilo de boxeo que con 2 o 3 golpesitos por asalto, ganan una pelea de campeonato mundial... Es una falta de respeto con el publico presente.
This was an old out of prime Jose Luis Ramirez who beat and gave a young prime Whitaker the runner he's first lost and what does Whitaker do he Cry's like a little girl on the floor lol but Great win by the great Champion Jose Luis Ramirez
HERE IS THE THING MAN..PERNELL.IS IN HIS PRIME NO WAY NO HOW A PPP GREAT OF ALL TIME SHOULD LOOSE TO A NON ALL TIME GREAT BUT WHEN CHAVEZ HAD TO.CHASE SWEET PEA ALL NIGHT LONG AND COULDNT REALLY CATCH HIM, SUDDENTLY PERNELL BECAME GREATER THAN CHAVEZ IN ALL TIME?..RELALY LOOK CHAVEZ WAS JUST ABOUT OUT OF HIS PRIME IN A DIFFERENT WEIGHT CLASS AND WAR WORN OUT..AND ALL BLACKS DETERMIN CHAVEZ CAREER BASED ON THAT FIGHT...THIS LOSS WAS WORST THAN THE CHAVEZ DRAW TO WHITTAKER...CHAVEZ IS PPP ABOVE PERNELL WHITTAKER HAD IT BEEN CHAVEZ FIGHTING HERE...WOULD BE LIGHTS OUT PERNELL...NO WAY NO HOW A PRIME OERNELL.IS PPP GREATER THAN A PRIME CHAVEZ...
My two Favorite parts 1 @45:00 seeing Ramirez celebrating his victory and @45:10 seeing Whitaker crying in defeat Thoses USA Biased Commentarys don't know nothing about true boxing they did not like the decision because their favorite USA boxer got beat by a Great Mexican Champion boxer like it or not Ramirez won Framce was right along with other nations boxing sports who also saw Ramirez as the rightful winner An old out of prime Jose Luis Ramirez BEAT Perrnal Whitaker and gave him his first LOSS Whitaker thought because Ramirez was out of his prime he was going too win instead he got a boxing lesson from the great champion Jose luis Ramirez Whitaker fans like it or not your boy Perrnal Whitaker got BEAT by a great Mexican champion justlike how Chavez and Dela hoya beat whitaker as well NO matter how good a black boxer might be there will always be a mexican boxer who will beat them why because God made us mexicans for that very reason we have everything thing that a real fighter boxer has too beat them Perrnal Whitaker remains me of Floyd Gayweather Jr who also was undefeated at 27-0 in 2002 but all that changed when Floyd Mayweather jr got BEAT by a great out of prime boxer named Jose Luis Castillo who clearly out boxed and beat Floyd Mayweather easy
@@Aldine281How can u say Ramirez beat Whitiker. Even if they penalized Pernell for holding hed still come out leading. I understand the heart in Ramirez sure. Hes a good fighter and I like the guy. But seriously bro, dont just say he won because hes Mexican and he tried really hard. Thats great n all. But Pete won. You can count the times Ramirez connected. even A draw wouldve been a robbery with this fight
Not the robbery people say it was. Whitaker was putting on a clinic for the first 5 rounds but slowed down and was getting clipped with hard shots round 6 onwards. I had it a draw.
the execucioner : Muéstra el documento de una organización mundial donde se establezca que se toman en cuenta esos 4 criterios que dices a la hora de calificar en las tarjetas. Defensa ? No tirar golpes cuenta como puntos en las tarjetas ? ring generalship ? Representas al boxeo Olímpico Internacional ? Robo ? Robo el que hizo la dictadura argentina en el mundial del 78, el agua contaminada del equipo argentino a los jugadores brasileiros vs Brasil en el 90, y la mano delincuencial de Maradona en el 86. Muestra el fallo de ese "robo" El boxeo es un deporte de apreciación y no siempre los jueces aplican el mismo criterio, de ahí la polémica del boxeo. Unos le dan más valor al que más propone o es ofensivo, o a los golpes de poder sobre los golpes de "punteo"y los efectivos, no la defensa. Ramírez ganó bien, ante ese estilo de mierda de ese boxeador perfectamente olvidable que tanto te gusta, que además, aplicó todas las mañas en el ring y que hasta hoy, no se castigan en ese deporte.
@@santiagoalonso7257 : Tú eres el lineal. El artículo habla precisamente de la disparidad de criterios y la subjetividad de los mismos por parte del sistema y de los jueces, más allá de esos 4 criterios, en donde el aspecto de defensa no es el prioritario y no es efectivio si no se complementan con golpes limpios y conectados. El boxeo es un deporte de contacto, donde se privilegia al que conecta por encima del que evade. Es un deporte profesional y de espectáculo, debido a la industria que trae atrás, y por lo mismo, donde algunas veces se privilegiará al que haga mayor uso de la ofensiva con eficacia en peleas cerradas. Y sigue siendo un deporte de apreciación ( esto incluye a los jueces ) Tu hablas en teoría a rajatabla en un sistema de calificación imperfecto. "Clearer guidelines for judges regarding the criteria on how to score a round of boxing would ensure less disparity. “Clean punching” is the most important" Que tu cabecita limitada no lo entienda no es mi problema. Ahora bien, la pelea la GANÓ Ramírez, así lo ví yo y así lo miraron los JUECES, que eran los facultados en la materia, y la autoridad en la decisión final, oficial, legítima y legal ( el delito de robo solo está en tú cabecita calenturienta ) y que, además, estaban presentes EN la arena. Tú opinión no importa.
@@santiagoalonso7257 : Jajaja, no mames, ahórrate tus burdas justificaciones de esas suciedades deportivas ( el agua puerca, la mano puerca, el dopaje, la presión de la dictadura, etc ) NO LAS VOY A LEER. Más bien en lugar de llamarme y generalizar a toda una población dicéndome "mexicano bruto", corre y educa a los miles de argentinos brutos como tú, ellos comentan y lloran en RUclips las derrotas de Maidana vs Maywather, y hablan de robo jajaja, eso si es chistoso. JAJA. Ese costalito Maidana se llevó un baile y se cansó de pegarle a la "piñata" (palos al aire ) dando palos de ciego y llevándose una cachetiza. Debió aprender de mexicanos como Jose Luis Castillo y Oscar de la Hoya. ESAS si fueron peleas cerradas. Y del mismo Ramírez. 442.perfil.com/2014-05-04-277167-la-argentina-gris-e-inutil-y-el-robo-consentido-al-chino-maidana/ ruclips.net/video/UoA-ak4Yc1E/видео.html
@@santiagoalonso7257 : el robo es un delito tipificado en la mayoría de los códigos penales del mundo, pelotudo. La información; así sean reglamentos o leyes, hay que matizarla, contextualizarla, criticarla y llevarla a un criterio propio. Aprende eso.
Sorry, wasn't big robbery. I had whitaker in almost every round up till 6th, he tired and Ramirez the champ started landing. Whitaker running and being hit look like he was unable to stop ramirez from turning the fight. If you know anything about old school boxing they wont pulk tittle in close fight. Whitaker had better performances, but this one Whitaker blew more then Ramirez won.
dm gmail yes, great point. Whitaker, 115-113. I got to say the fights Whitaker was robbed was very bias. Ok, so he beat Chavez 116-112, at worst 115-113. Chavez 87-0 so I see a draw. Look at Ramirez, he’s stalking and clearly winning 7-10 and 11. Clearly dominated in rematch though.
/@@davidshipman2007 Agreed, but Ramirez was a bit shopworn ..Love Sweat Pea, just sayin...Just.look how many fights Jose already had by this time here...and against guys like Arguello and Rosario, both in their primes, and Mancini, Boza Edwards, and Camacho ..just off the top of my head..These were "wars"....He finished w over 100 fights...Cat was the very definition of "Old School"> One of the few to knock Arguello down when Alexis was in his prime Peace
I've always felt that way. I remember this fight well and I don't think a man that grab's his opponent by the thigh to avoid fighting deserves a title for it. Whitaker is one of the most overrated, blown up fighter in history. A master at whining and avoiding fights with the best people.
Vine a ver está pelea por Erik Morales que le estaba haciendo una entrevista de un raun más era un mstruo este mexicano ganar witeker no era fácil y le ganó
Fue un robo bastante claro, quitémonos las gafas de patriotismo barato, le pusieron una arrastrada al zurdo, no hay que ser hipócritas, vergüenza debería darles decir que "ganó".
17:50, that is why no body miss this kind of shitty boxers, running, hugging etc.. they claim it is called " hit and not being hit" true it is called boxing decadence
@fr Aa how is he dumb for speaking facts Whitaker mayweather all are runners huggers dirty boxers Whitaker was getting forced too run do too the punches of Jose Ramirez just like how Chavez outboxed and forced Whitaker too backpedal run away you are the only true casual fan here Dumbass
@@aldinewestfield5821 you guys are fucking idiots. Its the job of a pro fighter to handle any style/situation theyre confronted against , they met in a confined square and agreed to box it out, if a guy is running from you, YOUR JOB IS TO CATCH HIM if a guy is wrapping you up YOUR JOB IS TO DEAL WITH IT AND OUT FIGHT HIM IN THE CLINCH, TIME HIM TRYING TO HOLD. you idiots have no concept lets all praise the loser for not knowing how to deal with footwork and angles
@@enriquerojas9758 it's called outboxing, something you know nothing about because you only watch dudes come forward while throwing punches and missing 99% of them.
Whittaker gave this fight away. Ramirez was the better fighter on this night but Sweet Pea is so much more skilled tbh. He should've done a little more in my opinion.
The first of a series of Robberies which jaded the career of my favorite Fighter. PERNELL WHITAKER made this look too easy. He made RAMIREZ look slow, and kept the jab in his face all night long. When he did land, Whitaker paid him by with crisp combinations. Mexican fans swear he wouldn't come forward, but they didn't understand his angles, and ring generalship. RAMIREZ kept coming Forward, but DID NOT CORNER HIM OR CUT OFF THE RING. The reason why he was awarded this atrocious decision was because the WBC and WBA wanted an all-Mexican fight between Chavez and Ramirez after this one. Anyone, whether Hispanic or not, who thinks Jose Luis Ramirez won this fight, has snorted fetanayl. It was not close. WORST DECISION OF THE 1980s.
@@castlewoods4753 The object of the Sweet Science is to Hit and not be Hit. Your boy Chavez Got Schooled by Whitaker, who bullied him in his own Backyard.
@@williamcooper6274 This ain’t no science laboratory this is pure comeback boxing that means you have to fight you have to hit and get hit with you like it or not it’s not Tom and Jerry cat chasing a mouse she’s real boxing how can someone win a fight while he’s being forced to run away backwards and you think because he survived 12 rounds now you think he won gtfo nigga Chavez made him run like a scared bitch
That is al you negros have as an argument, the adjective racist. Maybe you are the racist and are mad because most fans prefer to watch Chávez videos and not whitaker's.
I have no white guilt therefore I tell it like it is. Blacks believe their own lies. Whitaker and his impersonator Mayweather, are both clowns, cocky, racist, disrespectfuk, boring, cowards and huggers. Most people agree with me, you have no clue what boxing is about, let alone what a man is about. Whitaker had zero power. Could not ko R Mayweather and was knocked down. Could not ko haugen, Ramirez, et al. Chávez did. Afrocentrists like you are the reason Blacks are not liked ANYWHERE.
Pernell won this fight....got robbed in classic boxing way, "bribed judges".....no way you can justify giving 10 rounds to Ramirez (which one judge did at 118)who barely hit his target all night.
Whitaker, was a great boxer. Here he did survive. Does not mean he won. Getting beat up while beautifully running backwards? You have to beat the championship out of your opponent.
@@williamcooper6274 Whittaker's lack of punching authority really showed here, what I usually call sticking and moving in this fight looked more like pecking and running. I can count on my hands how many meaningful shots pernell landed
Hector Camacho had MUCH better footwork than Whitaker. Whitaker crosses his legs all the time. He also had much better speed and would have beat Whitaker
Mayan Empire I see u a lot but u never give a clear reasoning on how Whittaker lost... I hope u know judging a fight isn’t just about aggression, fact is that judges look at defense and ring genres hip as well and when we talk aggression they look at effective aggression running doesn’t put u down on scorecards missing does it puts the other fighter up because that’s called defense making ur opponent miss do u know this or are u looking at the fight in a biased way ?? I can put money on it that u watched this fight wanting José to win which isn’t very good when judging a fight cause that’s where the biased comes into play
Reading the comments, there needs to be a separate division for Mexican fighting fans who do not like boxing, but instead prefer 2 people standing flat footed in front of each other, seeing who is the biggest man that can take the most headshots. Ring magazine called this decision the worst of the decade. And clowns on this thread think Ramirez won.
@@santiagoalonso7257 correle a ver si ya metió gol boca o river o quién te enajene, deja niño que los expertos veamos boxeo de calidad jajajaja tienen a "maravishhhaaa" y ya se mojan todos jajajaja
@@santiagoalonso7257 que la canción,. Whitaker: metia los codos, empujaba, amarraba, se agachaba más allá de la cintura (no es permitido) al abrazar pegaba por detrás, metía el pie, era marullero, correlon, defensa buena mmm a lo mejor pero no todo es defensa! Un tipo que aburría, el boxeo al ser apreciación dependerá que te guste y ahí si cada quien, saludos pelotudo como dicen uds, pasa buena noche!
Had it a draw it could of gone either way I see why they gave it to Ramirez, but it was much closer than the judges score cards. Sweet pea clearly won the first 4 or 5 after that Ramirez was taking over. Very close though like I said either way
JC Chávez tiene un estilo de pelea muy parecido al del zurdo Ramírez , siempre para adelante , y sus guardias son Yam parecidas , ambos son mexicanos y hasta se parecen mucho en el físico , cuando los 2 pelearon fue alucinante 🤗🤗
Good Decision , Ramirez clearly won the fight , if you want the title take it from the champ , don't back pedal and run then complain about the decision.
like always mexican coming forward and the american boxing from the outside running around the ring its a craft that americans will die for. its good that ramirez took the win he deserved it more looked for it consistently.
That's not running. That's called boxing. Whittaker outboxed him then got robbed. That's why Whittaker completely outclassed and embarrassed him in the rematch.
Solo digo que si prohibieran los abrazos en el boxeo, y el correr hasta dando la espalda literal, el Boxeo sería otro, nunca hubiera llegado Whitaker, Floyd M. Y muchos correlones más. 2 llamadas de atención y a la 3ra, pierden pelea.
Jose luis realices es.un.ejempllo de profesionalismo Boxisticamente Qué me reserva su ingreso Al salón de la Fama del boxeo mundial.que Ya que puso a prueba a grandes boxeadores con Un.rrecord que no debe de ser Olvidado
These USA commenters are fools based on Whitaker nuts because Whitaker is a US boxer who they wanted too win but Jose Luis Ramirez clearly beat Whitaker the runner and france mexico and the world saw jose luis ramirez won and Anyone who thinks Whitaker won this fight needs too stop watching boxing and go watch some videos of running track because Jose Luis Ramirez won clearly and Whitaker the runner crying because he got beat haha Jose Luis Ramirez Chavez Oscar and Tito outboxed beat and made Whitaker run as while and Jose Luis Ramirez won this fight against Whitaker the runner Fair
@@alexcorleone4340 first off, you and wife that like a man are incredibly ugly on that picture. You shouldn't have come and said something to me I'd you're that ugly. And second off you don't even know how to spell
Not a terrible decision. Could have gone either way. I think Ramirez edged it out. Whitaker ran and held. I always heard this was a terrible decision that should have gone the other way. That is not true. Whitaker is not as good as people say he was. And the Chavez fight was a just draw. He ran too much in that too.
Fabián garcia, Exacto y eso mismo no lo llevo a ser el gran ídolo, porque desgraciadamente para llegar a ser ídolo en muchas de las veces tienen que ser borrachos, mujeriegos, despilfarradores de dinero, vida desordenada, y el humilde que prefirió ser de un perfil bajo
I think that Pernell Whitaker is the boxer most screwed in thr history of boxing.I agree that the last 7 rounds were very close,than Ramirez was the champion and Whitaker was often irregular(but not worst than Ali,Leonard and Mayweather) but how can the judges give him only 2 won rounds then he clearly won the first 5?Reading your commentaries I understand that almost all of you say that Whitaker didn't deserve to win because he was too defensive.But if we take always these criterias,Ali,Leonard and Monzon,3 of the greatest champions of the history would NEVER win any fight by decision!
I agree. What these subjective Mexican fans commenting on here don't understand is two fold. Firstly, the Mexican based WBC favors its own. Chavez and Ramirez were favorite sons of the WBC. Chavez got several dubious decisions. Ramirez got one here. Secondly, aggressiveness, however "manly" it is in the eyes of the Machismo obsessed Mexican fans, is not in itself the be all and end all trait in boxing. Scientific boxing is the kryptonite for aggressiveness, and Pernell Whitaker and Floyd Mayweather are two of the best practicioners of scientific boxing in recent history. Boxing is about hitting and not being hit. Holding to break an opponent's rythem, moving, slipping punches are all important traits. Against Whitaker, both Ramirez and Chavez were not effectively aggressive enough to win any of the three fights in my eyes, and in the eyes of many objective fans.
Mark Phelps I could kill for my soccer team but I hate nationalism in INDIVIDUAL sports.In USA I am shocked that Latinos never write on youtube for heavyweight fights and so on...I hate the criteria of aggressiveness,if it was the main criteria,Mayorga would be the greatest of all times and Ali,Mayweather or Leonard would have lost most of their fights by decision.
Mark Phelps Please tell list the dubious decisions Chavez got from the WBC? I keep hearing people say this, but I have yet to see an instance of it other than against Whitaker and the WBC didn't score that or any other fight. Also, Georgie Benton is on record in 1991 saying that they wanted Chavez to age a bit before Whitaker fought him. I have watched the other so called robberies against Lockridge and Laporte. Chavez beat Lockridge straight up, no question about it. The Laporte fight was close, but by no means a robbery. Whitaker though, was a great fighter and the only contemporary fighter I see giving him a challenge is Roberto Duran. One thing that was usual about Whitaker was the fact that he had such a great jab. Whitaker wasn't a tall rangy fighter, but he had one of the best jabs you'd ever want to see.
Frédéric Avalli I had the second fight close, the WBC and its stupid rule that the fighter that doesn't sustain a cut loses a point. You know in the 1988 when Chavez fought Ramirez, the same thing happened except it was Chavez who lost the point. I had Chavez well ahead in that fight, but the scorecards were much closer. At least two of them were. Had the WBC and Richard Steele been in Chavez's back pocket, he wouldn't have lost the first fight. Remember Richard Steele took two points from Chavez and even with the knockdown by Randell Chavez would have won the fight had he not lost the two points. I get so sick of hearing this shit that Chavez Sr. never won a fight fair and square. When he destroyed Rosario, well most people say that was because Rosario was on drugs or that Chavez headbutted, elbowed and landed low-blows to beat him. Chavez was on the slide by the time he fought Randell and from what I understand he started drinking quite a bit between fights and Don King pissed away last couple of good years of Chavez's career. In 1991 cover page on Ring or KO Magazine - A Warning to Boxing don't Waste JCC's Last Good Years. They were wasted, partly due to King and partly due to Chavez's problems with alcohol.
Jose Luis Ramirez definitely won that fight yet it was a close fight ill give it that. Those Commentators never once gave any respect to Ramirez when he was throwing his punches and winning .Mexicans are the Best in the boxing industry, and yet there still being portrayed as underrated by bullshit commentators. So I'm glad Ramirez proved them all wrong !
i scored the fight 118-110 whitaker. up there with one of the worst decisions ive seen. but when sulaiman and king wanted a fight between chavez and ramirez you can understand this decision
Q lastima que ni un reconocimient o a J Luis Ramírez un gran mexicano en el box🥊 gracias Zurdo por tan buenísimas peleas, siempre te la rifaste 🇲🇽
Robbery 😂
Ramirez en mi opinion merece estar en el salon de la fama
@@yosilokojoto3225 what robbery you moron Ramirez beat whitaker easy
José Luis fue un gran campeón y merece un gran reconocimiento
Un gran guerrero José Luis Ramírez 🇲🇽 debería estar en el salón de la fama!
Exacto pero está pelea no es el mejor ejemplo de para ponerlo ahí XD.
¿Por qué el Zurdito Ramírez no está en el salón de la fama del boxeo? Su récord es admirable
A la mejor en los próximos años.
@@santiagoalonso7257 Y sabías que gano todas pero le fueron robadas incluso al que mencionas Alexis Arguello fue un robo descarado le dislocó las quijadas y le dieron el triunfo a Argüello. El mismo reconoció que perdió. El único ko que conoció fue ante púas Olivares fue un descuido pero lo tiró 3 veses a la lona. Fue en sus inicios
@@santiagoalonso7257 y en la 2da lo noquio a Rosario
@@santiagoalonso7257 ¿o se que en el Salón de la fama, cuentan las que perdiste, y no las que ganaste?... de antemano muchas gracias por la información.
El salon de la fama es para el que le agrada..como uno que dio la espalda y se tiro en segundo raund esta en Salon de la fama.
RAMIREZ GRANDE..
Whitaker was told he was taking part in the tour de France and used his bicycle all night long.
While bashing Jose’s face in and winning only way Mexicans could beat hood black fighters back then was through robbery
Womp
But he lose cuz he black
That figh was in France is not like it was here in Vegas where there's a lot of Mexicans
@@zurypuebla8879no you Ramirez should of lost
Tuvo triunfos y grandes peleas durante su carrera boxistica fue un herrero en el rin para que hoy este en el salón de la fama un gran guerrero
En el ring
@@JoseMartinez-ns7hr en el Rin si su vida personal no la conosi
Hizo unos barandales bien chingones como “ herrero”
Hay k mandarle una Carta Al carnal de Jose sulaiman
Those commentators wants Whitaker win just with a weak jab ,running and tying up since the first round and that is not the way to fight for a title.that’s why the judges score the way they did
Sweet pea trainer says at the beginning of 11, this is a close fight.. and there are people saying this was a robbery pffff, Ramirez won a close fight!
Ramirez won Pernell ran away the whole fight and was holding the entire fight.
This fight was FAR closer than people would have you believe. I remember this day well.
@@rkg1930circling and stepping back isn’t running. Look at how many punches he’s throwing
@AmericanJohnGrass You just described running. 😂
No inventes, fue un robo descarado, luego nos quejamos cuando le roban a los mexicanos, no seamos hipócritas.
Whitaker fought as he was already the champion, he didn’t understood he needed to snatch the belt out of Ramirez. By the way, the biased comentators also did 😂
You're an idiot. Rounds are scored the same regardless. The vast majority of the public knew Whitaker won, and he was robbed. Just like he was robbed vs Chavez in San Antonio.
Este José Luis peleó con lo mejor de lo mejor excelente deportista y gran campeón
Que guerrero mexicano.. merece el salon de la fama y mucho mucho mas
Whitaker was clearly a star on the rise here. The announcers are blind to any punches Ramirez lands while gushing over everything Pernell does. It was a very close fight...
the announcers are calling the fight many years later. This is ESPN classic where the announcers are watching the fight from the ESPN studios in the mid 1990s
lol....time travel references are always funny
@@phelpsmarc Joe Tessitore would Have been 17 years old in 1988. And I was trying to figure that out. Thanks Mark for clearing that up!
lol, and Ramirez was way out of his prime, no excuses
It was a fixed fight. Whitaker and his trainer called the WBC out for obvious favoritism and corruption.
I don’t think this is the robbery everyone says it was. You can’t take a title moving and sliding quite this much. It’s a close call
It’s boxing not rock em sockem. He making him miss making him pay and he landing the more memorable blows if that’s not the formula to winning what is?
@@215thetruth being a mexican
@@215thetruth they don’t like boxing like that they re primitve stupid Neanderthals they want you to stay still so they can hit you
@@215thetruth making someone miss don't win you fights being forced too run don't make you win fights but landing punches sure do and ramirez clearly beat whitaker easy this is no dame running track
@@Aldine281 Boxing it's only pressure lol
LOS JUEZES SON EUROPEOS...ELLOS QUIEREN VER PELEA...CON ESTA CLASE DE JUEZES MAYWEATHER HUBIERA PERDIDO MÁS DE UNA PELEA...AQUÍ NO ES LAS VEGAS..PERNELL WAS GREAT
Yes we don't like fighters who are running all the time without being able to hit effectively, if i would watch this kind of athletes i would watch 50km race walk or marathon for example lol !
The ones claiming that Pernell did beat Oscar DLH should watch something else, he was clearly backing off Oscar's power by moving all his body in awkward positions sometimes flirting or passing over the boxing rules..
Really?So you really want to see a in a electronic scooter to fight a road runner isn't this about fighting, boxing...
Fuck off why are you Mexicans always fkn bud it’s like you’s aren’t even real boxing fans you’s just go for your own race
This was a robbery I don’t know what kind of fight you’s where watching
@@ComaToast1 you know they are fighting in Europe right? Jose luis Ramirez is Mexican. How could it be a robbery? The European judges just wanna see a real fight, not someone running a marathon. When floyd fought in Las Vegas only because he knew he had the advantage there
En la pelea que tuvo con argüello fue robado descaradamente, incluso el mexicano mando a la lona a argüello y lamentablemente se la robaron, un grande del boxeo mundial
Eran los tiempos donde el nicaragüense tenía de marido a Sulaimán
Ramirez solo gano ese raund el de la caída, el resto le dio cátedra Alexis, si tenes tiempo vas a contar como 450 cruzados en el tronco de la oreja y como 600 rectos de derecha y el zurdito no paro de correr en la bicicleta 😂
!! Sin duda una tremenda Pelea !
Ramírez demostró una gran determinación de todo un Guerrero del Ring
la pelea la tiene muy bien merecida el mexicano, no entiendo porqué el Réferi no le descontó punto o puntos al maratonista de whitaker
Por lo menos que haga una pelea tipo Joshua contra Ruiz Mayweather contra marquez y canelo pero no usar sus patas para correr
Pernell gran pugilista le ganó a Chávez
@@alexandrosanchez6501con todo respeto eiwiltaker mucho más marrullero que floy maywether José Luis Ramírez lo corretio toda la pelea nunca quiso pararse a dar pelea así no merecía nisiquiera un empate
That decision was crazy, but not totally out of the realm of how corrupt boxing can be!!…
@@woodystoreyYDKSAB. 😃
Merecido triunfo de Ramirez
Yes
Si mijo si
Hell na sweet pea took him to school 😂
@yo si loko joto Whitaker lost this fight because all he did was run. He shpuld have ran away but from that car that smashed his dumb ass.
The commentators just call Pea’s blows, quiet when Ramírez lands!
You just dont win fights by running around
He’s moving and boxing. Landing combinations, fighting behind a beautiful right jab, out throwing Ramirez, and not getting hit back. Boxing is an art, not street fighting. I think that’s something people in these comments forget about (as most of them ridiculously believe Ramirez deserve the victory). Hitting without getting hit is the way to go.
@@kdberry1997 exactly, i dont know what they seeing, but they don't see skill, the only see blood
@@kdberry1997 Whitaker ran like a bitch
Mayweather somehow made a career out of that....
@@kdberry1997that's because the vast majority of them posting comments on here are what's termed as casuals & know absolutely SFA about the Noble Art!!! Unlike yourself as I can tell you know your boxing and understand why it's called the sweet science!👍😊🥊
me alimenta mucho su boxeo, mejor que el de JCCH, para mi en lo personal, se me hace un CAMPEON OLVIDADO
Un campeón olvidado por apestoso
Fue mas leyenda que juan Manuel Marquez
@@that_onebrunette456 me refiero "apestoso" whitaker, Jose Luis Ramírez es grande entre los grandes!!
@@raulgomez8005 you stupid
La manera en que Chávez metía la derecha al mismo tiempo que hacía bending. Mucho más rápido que Ramírez y más certero.
Ramírez sí está un poco por debajo de Julio.
El chelis Ramírez siempre para de lanteee unos de los mejores boxeadores de México y del mundo.
JOSE LUIS RAMIREZ DE LOS MEJORES BOXEADORES DE MEXICO EN TODA LA HISTORIA DEL BOXEO 👌
No way... Serio??
Running and holding your opponent in boxing is a strong show of weakness
You're a an IDIOT!
YDKSAB, you cant run inside a boxing ring if your opponent has a rudimentary fkn clue on how to cut off the ring casual, not to mention, how the hell does the guy so called running land more telling punches, you dunce?
Whitaker didnt so call run and barely clinched vs Julio Cesar Chavez and got robbed just the same, gtfoh with that garbage ass boxing IQ kid. Dont comment any further on boxing, its way too complicated for your level of intelligence,
El floy de aquellos tiempo marrullero correlon
El negro era un payaso solamente
the execucioner si era un payaso y marruyero que pegaba y abrazaba y corría mucho no nos agamos pendejos y reconoscamos que así es
@@rudyromero4001 jajaja ya te gustaría tener su defensa.
Grande Ramírez no sabía que le ganó a un top 5 de los mejores boxeadores defensivos en la historia del boxeo
He didn’t beat him he got a gift
@@200littleman 😆😆🤣🤣😂😂
The one who received the gift of his life was Pernell, the defeat he had against our great Mexican champion was painful, that style of running around the ring is useless against a hunter like José Luis Ramirez
Así es hermano 👍, fue polémica la desicion de empate contra Chavez, pero esta fue victoria clara para nuestro zurdo Ramirez
@@lineaaaaaaa It’s called boxing and flat footed Mexicans lose to it more often than they don’t 😂
@@200littleman “flat”? 😂😂 anyone can run in the ring LMAAAO Go do some research about why Mexicans fight like that, they need to sell the fights in the states, they are boxers, they are not in the Formula 1 where they come from a wealthy family. Chavez destroyed that style lol Oh and again, go do some research, Mexico owns the USA when it’s about championship fights 😂😂🤟🏻🤟🏻
Look at 17:53 and 31:52 Can you run away from your opponent like that in boxing? Pernell W was with his back away from Ramirez...
that is why no one miss this shitty boxer, just like mayweather, they brought shame to boxing
@@shiroumxm2052 you're an idiot
You're an idiot
@@phonejack8949 go back to your ghetto
@@phonejack8949 ‘Turning the back is a foul. This includes any method of weaving or ducking or rolling or turning such that the opponent is solely or mostly presented with the back of the head and/or body’.
They don't like the runners in Europe. Well, I'm sure they do now.
Boom booms running out the mouth but Livingstone Bramble beat him twice and just whooped him like 40 going north and he stand up there for this what he should do in his tell him why didn't
he do it
Never run
no excuses...ramirez kicked the ass to pernell
You're stupid
If you get two Ramirez-style boxers, you will have a great fight.
If you get two Pernell-style boxers, you will have two guys running around the whole fight.
pffft.
Toda la pelea se la paso corriendo , y eso que Ramírez ya era un veterano y aún así se creía ganador Pernell , lo que es no asimilar el profesionalismo a diferencia del boxeo amateur!
@@santiagoalonso7257 Claro que no se questiona el gran peleador que fue Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker. Tenia un estilo defensivo con excelent contragolpeo, muy buen trabajo de piernas y muy veloz de manos. Su mejor arma, la defensa, el jab, el contragolpeo a velocidad y en combinaciones. Ahora hablando de esta pelea y siendo sinceros, Whitaker empezo ganando facilmente los primeros asaltos. El 6to fue parejo, de ahi en adelante Jose Luis Ramirez tomo la iniciativa y estuve encima cortando el ring y conectando golpes. Pareciera que Whitaker no podia quitarse de encima a Ramirez que perseguia y conectaba al cuerpo y arriba, la mayor parte de los ultimos fueron para J.L. Ramirez. En el 12 Whitaker se impone nuevamente y lo gana. Recordemos que en este tiempo para que despojaran a un campeon mundial de su cinturon tenian que vencerlo claramente. Muy pocas veces Whitaker se paro a fajarse, quizas sintio el poder de Ramirez y por eso retrosedio demasiado durante la segunda parte de la pelea. Lo que si es que mas que un robo, Whitaker dejo de hacer cosas para convencer del todo a los jueces para que le dieran la pelea. En la revancha, Whitaker con sus habilidades y muy buen boxeo, fue mas constante y gano claramente.
@@santiagoalonso7257 en Europa califican diferente.
Además Ramírez era manejado por dos franceses, ahí estaban en Francia. Prácticamente tenía la ventaja de local.
Se que Whitaker fue un grande pero esta pelea fue horrible con todo el respeto que se merece. Yo creo que se enojaron los jueces y se la dieron a Ramírez.
Whitaker schooled Ramirez casual
@@trey4323 whitaker run like a chicken
me ubiera gustado vet Boston una revancha Ramirez vs Camacho y Alexis argueyo
That is what he gets for running most of the time,!!!!!!
No he outmaneuvered him, which is part of boxing.
Whitaker un peleador marrullero y correlon igual de arrogante y pretencioso que su entrenador Lou Duva. Ramírez definitivamente tiene que estar en el salón de la fama del boxeo,un grande del boxeo de México para el mundo.
La mayoria de los negros son oportunistas y correlones casi no presentan pelea, por eso sus peleas son enfadosas mi zurdito de Sonora José Luis Ramirez, siempre dio grandes peleas
Eso fue un bochornoso robo whitaker le dio una clase de boxeo y de defensa lo mismo q a Chávez tan bien le dio.clase y se la robaron el.americano es.mas fino.q el mejicano q lo.q saben es ir.para el frente no tienen de defensa q bochorno
@@juandiazresto8938 pendijo
@@juandiazresto8938 Esta fue muy pareja, lo de Chavez si fue un robo absolutamente descarado.
No seas tonto mexicano, los mexicanos son buenos recibiendo palizas de los negros,porque será que la mejor pelea de Chaves fue contra un negro, los boxeador negros somos los mejores del mundo y con diferencia, más campeones mundiales, prefiero correr que tener parquison y hablar como un enfermo mental.recibir palizas no te hace más macho, esto es boxeo, su peleador azteca robo está pelea.
Son fanfarrones, correlones, miedosos..uno bueno de muy pocos fue Meldrick Taylor ese si daba buenas peleas...
Perdió Whitaker, se la paso huyendo en el combate. La mafia del boxeo que no proteja mas a estos boxeadores, con este estilo de boxeo que con 2 o 3 golpesitos por asalto, ganan una pelea de campeonato mundial... Es una falta de respeto con el publico presente.
Falta de respeto más bien para los que no saben de box.
@@UsuariodeRUclipsRandom FALTA DE RESPETO PARA EL DEPORTE DEL BOXEO.
UNA COSA ES EL BOX DEFENSIVO Y OTRA MUY DIFERENTE SER COBARDE Y REUSAR A BOXEAR.
@@danielrusso3617¿Cobardía es no quiere tener parquison a los 40 años?
Ustedes los mexicanos tienen prohibido usar el cerebro😂😂
Ramírez beat his ass
No mames wey.🤔🤨🙄
The true 🏃🏾♂️ man Whitaker 🤦🏻♂️how the heck would they give him the fight ?! He f ran all night
Esa pelea le dieron el triunfo a JLR merecidamente y para Pernell fue un castigo por correlon.
Ramirez clearly won, Whitaker ran and hugged most of the fight.
pernell,,,,,,,,,,,,,CORRECAMINOS,,,,BEEP,BEEP,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
éso es fue, un corre camino 👎
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
This was an old out of prime Jose Luis Ramirez who beat and gave a young prime Whitaker the runner he's first lost and what does Whitaker do he Cry's like a little girl on the floor lol but Great win by the great Champion Jose Luis Ramirez
Shut up. Luis is trash and clearly lost but the world doesn't respect him like whitaker as a legend.
@@thedarksideoftheforce6658 LMFAO the world remembers Ramirez more then Whitaker don't get mad because Whitaker the runner got beat by a Mexican
High Meadows, The only people who remember Ramirez remember his fights with Whitaker. That says it all.
@@The_Ex_Boxing_Nerd go ask the mexicans and they will tell you how much they remember how much Jose luis Ramirez fights btch
This loss did Pernell no harm @ all.
In fact, made him a far better technician. Ramirez just a complete Professional man..
HERE IS THE THING MAN..PERNELL.IS IN HIS PRIME NO WAY NO HOW A PPP GREAT OF ALL TIME SHOULD LOOSE TO A NON ALL TIME GREAT BUT WHEN CHAVEZ HAD TO.CHASE SWEET PEA ALL NIGHT LONG AND COULDNT REALLY CATCH HIM, SUDDENTLY PERNELL BECAME GREATER THAN CHAVEZ IN ALL TIME?..RELALY LOOK CHAVEZ WAS JUST ABOUT OUT OF HIS PRIME IN A DIFFERENT WEIGHT CLASS AND WAR WORN OUT..AND ALL BLACKS DETERMIN CHAVEZ CAREER BASED ON THAT FIGHT...THIS LOSS WAS WORST THAN THE CHAVEZ DRAW TO WHITTAKER...CHAVEZ IS PPP ABOVE PERNELL WHITTAKER HAD IT BEEN CHAVEZ FIGHTING HERE...WOULD BE LIGHTS OUT PERNELL...NO WAY NO HOW A PRIME OERNELL.IS PPP GREATER THAN A PRIME CHAVEZ...
mario gutierrez I hate cringe idiots like you who write in all caps
@@jaydengray4015 fuck yourelf fuck runner
Whitaker won this fixed fight lmao
he sucks ass
My two Favorite parts 1 @45:00 seeing Ramirez celebrating his victory and @45:10 seeing Whitaker crying in defeat
Thoses USA Biased Commentarys don't know nothing about true boxing they did not like the decision because their favorite USA boxer got beat by a Great Mexican Champion boxer like it or not Ramirez won Framce was right along with other nations boxing sports who also saw Ramirez as the rightful winner
An old out of prime Jose Luis Ramirez BEAT Perrnal Whitaker and gave him his first LOSS Whitaker thought because Ramirez was out of his prime he was going too win instead he got a boxing lesson from the great champion Jose luis Ramirez
Whitaker fans like it or not your boy Perrnal Whitaker got BEAT by a great Mexican champion justlike how Chavez and Dela hoya beat whitaker as well
NO matter how good a black boxer might be there will always be a mexican boxer who will beat them why because God made us mexicans for that very reason we have everything thing that a real fighter boxer has too beat them
Perrnal Whitaker remains me of Floyd Gayweather Jr who also was undefeated at 27-0 in 2002 but all that changed when Floyd Mayweather jr got BEAT by a great out of prime boxer named Jose Luis Castillo who clearly out boxed and beat Floyd Mayweather easy
Did you cry like sweet pea after Castillo lost the Mayweather? Both losers thought they won the fight. Castillo and sweet pea
Facts backed by Stats
Crawford smashes all of them
@@jdvlanka265crawford loses too all pf them easy
@@Aldine281How can u say Ramirez beat Whitiker. Even if they penalized Pernell for holding hed still come out leading. I understand the heart in Ramirez sure. Hes a good fighter and I like the guy. But seriously bro, dont just say he won because hes Mexican and he tried really hard. Thats great n all. But Pete won. You can count the times Ramirez connected. even A draw wouldve been a robbery with this fight
ramirez dominates the fight with his own jab
Lmao delusional
Not the robbery people say it was. Whitaker was putting on a clinic for the first 5 rounds but slowed down and was getting clipped with hard shots round 6 onwards. I had it a draw.
RIP Sweet Pea.
Correr y abrazar no es pelear, es miedo
Que esperaba whitaker, si se la paso corriendo para atrás toda la pelea...y sólo punteando golpes, así no se ganan las peleas...
@@santiagoalonso7257 ala mejor tienes tu razon, pero estos boxeadores que pelean corriendo ,no Los miro no de gratis
the execucioner : Muéstra el documento de una organización mundial donde se establezca que se toman en cuenta esos 4 criterios que dices a la hora de calificar en las tarjetas. Defensa ? No tirar golpes cuenta como puntos en las tarjetas ? ring generalship ? Representas al boxeo Olímpico Internacional ?
Robo ? Robo el que hizo la dictadura argentina en el mundial del 78, el agua contaminada del equipo argentino a los jugadores brasileiros vs Brasil en el 90, y la mano delincuencial de Maradona en el 86. Muestra el fallo de ese "robo"
El boxeo es un deporte de apreciación y no siempre los jueces aplican el mismo criterio, de ahí la polémica del boxeo. Unos le dan más valor al que más propone o es ofensivo, o a los golpes de poder sobre los golpes de "punteo"y los efectivos, no la defensa.
Ramírez ganó bien, ante ese estilo de mierda de ese boxeador perfectamente olvidable que tanto te gusta, que además, aplicó todas las mañas en el ring y que hasta hoy, no se castigan en ese deporte.
@@santiagoalonso7257 : Tú eres el lineal. El artículo habla precisamente de la disparidad de criterios y la subjetividad de los mismos por parte del sistema y de los jueces, más allá de esos 4 criterios, en donde el aspecto de defensa no es el prioritario y no es efectivio si no se complementan con golpes limpios y conectados.
El boxeo es un deporte de contacto, donde se privilegia al que conecta por encima del que evade. Es un deporte profesional y de espectáculo, debido a la industria que trae atrás, y por lo mismo, donde algunas veces se privilegiará al que haga mayor uso de la ofensiva con eficacia en peleas cerradas. Y sigue siendo un deporte de apreciación ( esto incluye a los jueces ) Tu hablas en teoría a rajatabla en un sistema de calificación imperfecto.
"Clearer guidelines for judges regarding the criteria on how to score a round of boxing would ensure less disparity. “Clean punching” is the most important"
Que tu cabecita limitada no lo entienda no es mi problema.
Ahora bien, la pelea la GANÓ Ramírez, así lo ví yo y así lo miraron los JUECES, que eran los facultados en la materia, y la autoridad en la decisión final, oficial, legítima y legal ( el delito de robo solo está en tú cabecita calenturienta ) y que, además, estaban presentes EN la arena.
Tú opinión no importa.
@@santiagoalonso7257 : Jajaja, no mames, ahórrate tus burdas justificaciones de esas suciedades deportivas ( el agua puerca, la mano puerca, el dopaje, la presión de la dictadura, etc ) NO LAS VOY A LEER.
Más bien en lugar de llamarme y generalizar a toda una población dicéndome "mexicano bruto", corre y educa a los miles de argentinos brutos como tú, ellos comentan y lloran en RUclips las derrotas de Maidana vs Maywather, y hablan de robo jajaja, eso si es chistoso. JAJA.
Ese costalito Maidana se llevó un baile y se cansó de pegarle a la "piñata" (palos al aire ) dando palos de ciego y llevándose una cachetiza. Debió aprender de mexicanos como Jose Luis Castillo y Oscar de la Hoya. ESAS si fueron peleas cerradas. Y del mismo Ramírez.
442.perfil.com/2014-05-04-277167-la-argentina-gris-e-inutil-y-el-robo-consentido-al-chino-maidana/
ruclips.net/video/UoA-ak4Yc1E/видео.html
@@santiagoalonso7257 : el robo es un delito tipificado en la mayoría de los códigos penales del mundo, pelotudo.
La información; así sean reglamentos o leyes, hay que matizarla, contextualizarla, criticarla y llevarla a un criterio propio.
Aprende eso.
When it comes right down to it, the more experienced fighter won.
so points and good decisions don't matter to you?
@@ededd3175 Pernell first shot at the title. He was nervous, young but gifted. You notice after this fight Pernell was practically unbeatable.
@@euclideszoto997 unbeatable lol you must of forgot chavez oscar de la hoya tito trinidad jorge paez all beat him facts
@@arturolemus4824 Paez lost. You can hate all you want on Whitaker. He was one of the most gifted fighters ever and a natural southpaw.
@@ededd3175 soft punches don't win fight all the time. Ramirez was landing harder punches....did more damage in more rounds than Whitaker
Qué peleas tan feas daba Whitaker, serán campeones pero mmm no convencen!
it was a good decision. why should the champion have to chase the challenger and the challenger gets rewarded for running? Let him WORK for it!
You're an idiot
You don’t know shit bout boxing 🥊
Exactly
Agreed. We actually saw this during the Olympics.
DEFINITION OF BOXING: HIT AND NOT BE HIT... HE KEPT A JAB IN HIS FACE ALL NIGHT LONG... PLEASE, STOP SNORTING FETANAYL.
Jose Luis Ramirez won by pushing the fight and going forward. Every time parnell would get hit hw started back peddling like Mayweather.
If you want people to just stand there and hit each other then go watch Power slap 😂. This is boxing and it clearly isn't for you.
Sorry, wasn't big robbery. I had whitaker in almost every round up till 6th, he tired and Ramirez the champ started landing. Whitaker running and being hit look like he was unable to stop ramirez from turning the fight. If you know anything about old school boxing they wont pulk tittle in close fight. Whitaker had better performances, but this one Whitaker blew more then Ramirez won.
dm gmail yes, great point. Whitaker, 115-113. I got to say the fights Whitaker was robbed was very bias. Ok, so he beat Chavez 116-112, at worst 115-113. Chavez 87-0 so I see a draw. Look at Ramirez, he’s stalking and clearly winning 7-10 and 11. Clearly dominated in rematch though.
/@@davidshipman2007 Agreed, but Ramirez was a bit shopworn ..Love Sweat Pea, just sayin...Just.look how many fights Jose already had by this time here...and against guys like Arguello and Rosario, both in their primes, and Mancini, Boza Edwards, and Camacho ..just off the top of my head..These were "wars"....He finished w over 100 fights...Cat was the very definition of "Old School">
One of the few to knock Arguello down when Alexis was in his prime
Peace
I've always felt that way. I remember this fight well and I don't think a man that grab's his opponent by the thigh to avoid fighting deserves a title for it. Whitaker is one of the most overrated, blown up fighter in history. A master at whining and avoiding fights with the best people.
How do you dominate a fight by running al the time.exactly gets away
@CARLOS MENDOZA but he got hit tho José Luis Ramirez won
Vine a ver está pelea por Erik Morales que le estaba haciendo una entrevista de un raun más era un mstruo este mexicano ganar witeker no era fácil y le ganó
Fue un robo bastante claro, quitémonos las gafas de patriotismo barato, le pusieron una arrastrada al zurdo, no hay que ser hipócritas, vergüenza debería darles decir que "ganó".
17:50, that is why no body miss this kind of shitty boxers, running, hugging etc.. they claim it is called " hit and not being hit" true it is called boxing decadence
@fr Aa how is he dumb for speaking facts Whitaker mayweather all are runners huggers dirty boxers Whitaker was getting forced too run do too the punches of Jose Ramirez just like how Chavez outboxed and forced Whitaker too backpedal run away you are the only true casual fan here Dumbass
@@aldinewestfield5821 you guys are fucking idiots. Its the job of a pro fighter to handle any style/situation theyre confronted against , they met in a confined square and agreed to box it out, if a guy is running from you, YOUR JOB IS TO CATCH HIM if a guy is wrapping you up YOUR JOB IS TO DEAL WITH IT AND OUT FIGHT HIM IN THE CLINCH, TIME HIM TRYING TO HOLD. you idiots have no concept lets all praise the loser for not knowing how to deal with footwork and angles
@@JeffPenaify no bitch your job is too fight not catch this is not fucking cat chasing mouse this is a fighting combat sport you casual
@@highmeadows2030 Whitaker is landing while Ramirez can't land anything. You're dumb.
@fr Aa been watching and practicing boxing since a child..
Imagine Whitaker vs Mayweather, they would turn a boxing match into a Marathon 🏃🏿♂️
You're Stupid
phone jack Bless you
@@enriquerojas9758 yes you are
@@enriquerojas9758 it's called outboxing, something you know nothing about because you only watch dudes come forward while throwing punches and missing 99% of them.
niegas were being running outside the ring
and hiding behind the ring poles
Whittaker gave this fight away. Ramirez was the better fighter on this night but Sweet Pea is so much more skilled tbh. He should've done a little more in my opinion.
More skilled nah ramirez was old and out of prime and prove too be the better skilled fighter boxer
@@Aldine281 Lol, prime Ramirez never be a great champion, when Pernell became a superstar
Ramírez was never known for been very skilled fighter he was a warrior
An any war you never win by runing an retrieving!
Boxing matches arent wars.
@@colorado2455 mike tyson said if is like war
Boxing is hit and not get hit. Whitaker clearly won this fight. Easy
Real boxing Is fight don't run don't hugh
They take points if the fighter isnt combative
@@zeitgeist3 they should , but they dont do that anymore, thanx to boxing decadence and mafia
@Bay Area Boxing he lost because Ramirez was outboxing him every time Ramirez would hit him Whitaker would run
@@carloslisandro2344 you're an idiot
The first of a series of Robberies which jaded the career of my favorite Fighter. PERNELL WHITAKER made this look too easy. He made RAMIREZ look slow, and kept the jab in his face all night long. When he did land, Whitaker paid him by with crisp combinations. Mexican fans swear he wouldn't come forward, but they didn't understand his angles, and ring generalship. RAMIREZ kept coming Forward, but DID NOT CORNER HIM OR CUT OFF THE RING. The reason why he was awarded this atrocious decision was because the WBC and WBA wanted an all-Mexican fight between Chavez and Ramirez after this one. Anyone, whether Hispanic or not, who thinks Jose Luis Ramirez won this fight, has snorted fetanayl. It was not close. WORST DECISION OF THE 1980s.
You spoke like true black man who thinks by running away wins you fights CHAVEZ AND RAMIREZ BEAT THAT RUNNER WHITKER FACTS
@@castlewoods4753 The object of the Sweet Science is to Hit and not be Hit. Your boy Chavez Got Schooled by Whitaker, who bullied him in his own Backyard.
@@williamcooper6274 This ain’t no science laboratory this is pure comeback boxing that means you have to fight you have to hit and get hit with you like it or not it’s not Tom and Jerry cat chasing a mouse she’s real boxing how can someone win a fight while he’s being forced to run away backwards and you think because he survived 12 rounds now you think he won gtfo nigga Chavez made him run like a scared bitch
Yeah to me Sweet P won by a landslide
As a mexican American I agree this was not close Whittaker whopped that ass
que bien por el mexicano, no tengo palabras para describir al ,"oponente" sobre su comportamiento Ridiculo
He still destroyed Chavez easily
@@Philotheist777 how if cahvez was the one who made whitaker run like a scared bitch Chavez won super easy
@@Philotheist777 jajajaja
9-3 Whitaker, this was a robbery imo.
No Robbery
Por corralón...perdió la pelea ...en cambio el mexicano todo un guerrero
R.I.P. KING
una lastima q no sepas del arte del boxeo 😁
@@chrissbrown6096 Speak english
@arturo vargas lujan imbécil.
@@J4sse chi gas a tu made speak Spanish
físico impresionante del zurdo de SONORA 💪 MEX ..FIERROOO
This Is boxing no Runing
You're Stupid
@@phonejack8949 nah you are stupid
@@aldinewestfield5821 you keep liking your own comment. That's pathetic.
@@daulhernandez608 which Tyson?
@@daulhernandez608 Mike Tyson and Tyson fury.
Ramirez won fair and square. Pernell should have had points deducted for excessive holding. Running and holding is not fighting.
That is al you negros have as an argument, the adjective racist. Maybe you are the racist and are mad because most fans prefer to watch Chávez videos and not whitaker's.
I have no white guilt therefore I tell it like it is. Blacks believe their own lies. Whitaker and his impersonator Mayweather, are both clowns, cocky, racist, disrespectfuk, boring, cowards and huggers. Most people agree with me, you have no clue what boxing is about, let alone what a man is about. Whitaker had zero power. Could not ko R Mayweather and was knocked down. Could not ko haugen, Ramirez, et al. Chávez did. Afrocentrists like you are the reason Blacks are not liked ANYWHERE.
Whitaker showed he's better than Chavez when he schooled him simple
TheStonerosesHQ Yes, he schooled Chávez in the art of hugging and running.
No I mean when Chavez couldnt lay a glove to him and Whitaker stuck that jab in his face all night
Estoy aqui por el pograma "UN ROUND MAS" 🔥🔥
all defense very little offense from PW , Ramirez just chased him around the ring for the entire fight. PW did not deserve to get this decision.
Pernell won this fight....got robbed in classic boxing way, "bribed judges".....no way you can justify giving 10 rounds to Ramirez (which one judge did at 118)who barely hit his target all night.
Aprendan a perder, en las Vegas siempre le roban a los Mexicanos.
asportsnut1960 it’s called defense
Didn’t know that chasing someone and missing is winning.
Whitaker, was a great boxer. Here he did survive. Does not mean he won. Getting beat up while beautifully running backwards? You have to beat the championship out of your opponent.
He kept a jab in his face all night long. WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT??? LOOK, HE WAS ROBBED THAT NIGHT. BEAT UP? What fight are you watching?
@@williamcooper6274 Dude you’re a black guy was just going for Whitaker because you think I came in you were fake just like him like a coward
@@williamcooper6274 Whittaker's lack of punching authority really showed here, what I usually call sticking and moving in this fight looked more like pecking and running. I can count on my hands how many meaningful shots pernell landed
Hector Camacho had MUCH better footwork than Whitaker. Whitaker crosses his legs all the time. He also had much better speed and would have beat Whitaker
Just running the whole fight. How could he expect to win? Viva México!!!
Running doesn't put you behind on scorecards, stupid. Missing punches does.
@@phonejack8949 mssing punches do not count you fucking lier running away from you opponent punches it sure does
@@aldinewestfield5821 you are stupid. You don't even know how to spell.
Mssing?
Lier?
Hi get hooked up on phonics and then you can come talk to me.
@@phonejack8949 fuck you I bet you understand that huh bitch
@@aldinewestfield5821 that really hurt my feelings
Yo la tenia 8 rounds a 4, favor de Ramirez. Corrió mas de lo que pegó Parnell
Good fight of jose luis ramires clear winner
killumikun dominguez yeah, by clear you mean he lost by 6 points.
How when he landed two clean punches the entire fight smh
Mayan Empire I see u a lot but u never give a clear reasoning on how Whittaker lost... I hope u know judging a fight isn’t just about aggression, fact is that judges look at defense and ring genres hip as well and when we talk aggression they look at effective aggression running doesn’t put u down on scorecards missing does it puts the other fighter up because that’s called defense making ur opponent miss do u know this or are u looking at the fight in a biased way ?? I can put money on it that u watched this fight wanting José to win which isn’t very good when judging a fight cause that’s where the biased comes into play
@@Kevin-zj9rn is easy whitker got outboxed and ran like a bitch
Definitivamente zurdo Ramirez tiene que ser top 10 de la historia de México.
Reading the comments, there needs to be a separate division for Mexican fighting fans who do not like boxing, but instead prefer 2 people standing flat footed in front of each other, seeing who is the biggest man that can take the most headshots.
Ring magazine called this decision the worst of the decade. And clowns on this thread think Ramirez won.
@Bay Area Boxing pure facts homie
You like runners no fighters
Fu***gn damn ,then go home two runners fight...I rather see
Así fue toda su carrera meter codos empujar, jalar abrazar, muy insípido ese Whitaker
@@santiagoalonso7257 corre a comentar goles y barras que de boxeo no sabes ni madres! Adiós niño
@@santiagoalonso7257 correle a ver si ya metió gol boca o river o quién te enajene, deja niño que los expertos veamos boxeo de calidad jajajaja tienen a "maravishhhaaa" y ya se mojan todos jajajaja
@@santiagoalonso7257 que la canción,. Whitaker: metia los codos, empujaba, amarraba, se agachaba más allá de la cintura (no es permitido) al abrazar pegaba por detrás, metía el pie, era marullero, correlon, defensa buena mmm a lo mejor pero no todo es defensa! Un tipo que aburría, el boxeo al ser apreciación dependerá que te guste y ahí si cada quien, saludos pelotudo como dicen uds, pasa buena noche!
@@santiagoalonso7257 jajajaj era lógico no entiendes de boxeo, pero bueno ahí está una explicación con argumentos no los entiendes ni hablar!!!
@@santiagoalonso7257 si entiendes boxeo habrías entendido, bueno ya lo corregí para principiantes de 4to de primaria, adelante
Had it a draw it could of gone either way I see why they gave it to Ramirez, but it was much closer than the judges score cards. Sweet pea clearly won the first 4 or 5 after that Ramirez was taking over. Very close though like I said either way
Agreed--I gave Whitaker the first five, but after that I could only give him one more (the ninth), so wound up with six a piece: 114-114.
JC Chávez tiene un estilo de pelea muy parecido al del zurdo Ramírez , siempre para adelante , y sus guardias son Yam parecidas , ambos son mexicanos y hasta se parecen mucho en el físico , cuando los 2 pelearon fue alucinante 🤗🤗
And they both lost to Pernell and had to rob Pernell for the victory
@@ComaToast1 Pernell pasó corriendo toda la pelea contra JC Chávez 😬😬
PORQUE LOS DOS SON DE SONORA JULIO CESAR CHAVEZ Y EL ZUEDO RAMIRES UNO DE NAVOJOA Y EL OTRO DE OBREGON SONORA
@ComaToast1 pernel all nigh🚴♀️🚴♀️🚴♀️🚴♀️🚴♀️
Good Decision , Ramirez clearly won the fight , if you want the title take it from the champ , don't back pedal and run then complain about the decision.
like always mexican coming forward and the american boxing from the outside running around the ring its a craft that americans will die for. its good that ramirez took the win he deserved it more looked for it consistently.
That's not running. That's called boxing. Whittaker outboxed him then got robbed. That's why Whittaker completely outclassed and embarrassed him in the rematch.
Solo digo que si prohibieran los abrazos en el boxeo, y el correr hasta dando la espalda literal, el Boxeo sería otro, nunca hubiera llegado Whitaker, Floyd M. Y muchos correlones más. 2 llamadas de atención y a la 3ra, pierden pelea.
Eso es boxeo, llora.😹
You Mexicans are literally fkd in the heads 🤣🤣
Este no Era boxeador
Boxing will not survive as a sport if points are given for defense. Running and holding should not be rewarded.
Jose luis realices es.un.ejempllo de profesionalismo Boxisticamente
Qué me reserva su ingreso
Al salón de la
Fama del boxeo mundial.que
Ya que puso a prueba a grandes boxeadores con
Un.rrecord que no debe de ser
Olvidado
Ramirez won fair and square.
The Genius nah you're a bitch shut up
OctaviusTheGreat no
Robbery
Most important fight of Pernell's career - forced him to be a fighter and a crowd pleaser.
soft punches don't win fight all the time. Ramirez was landing harder punches....did more damage in more rounds than Whitaker
These USA commenters are fools based on Whitaker nuts because Whitaker is a US boxer who they wanted too win but Jose Luis Ramirez clearly beat Whitaker the runner and france mexico and the world saw jose luis ramirez won and
Anyone who thinks Whitaker won this fight needs too stop watching boxing and go watch some videos of running track because Jose Luis Ramirez won clearly and Whitaker the runner crying because he got beat haha Jose Luis Ramirez Chavez Oscar and Tito outboxed beat and made Whitaker run as while and Jose Luis Ramirez won this fight against Whitaker the runner Fair
Totally agree, they all beat Whitaker....and here Ramirez beat Whitaker every round
Maybe Whitaker should try a marathon event instead.
Maybe you should have been aborted
Floyd vs whitaker jajaja ! Boring!! I would not pay a dime for that fight !!
You don't even have any money
@cohenhaywood10 you're Stupid
@@phonejack8949 probably more than you, pussy boy.
@@StebanHern did it hurt your feelings when I insulted ur boyfriend
Ramirez won this fight. Whitaker needed more punches, he ran too much
Ramirez missed 90% of his punches
@@phonejack8949 .Whitaker run 100 %.
@@phonejack8949 you're stupid get a fucking job man you replied to everybody fuckjng loser
@@alexcorleone4340 first off, you and wife that like a man are incredibly ugly on that picture. You shouldn't have come and said something to me I'd you're that ugly.
And second off you don't even know how to spell
Not a terrible decision. Could have gone either way. I think Ramirez edged it out. Whitaker ran and held. I always heard this was a terrible decision that should have gone the other way. That is not true. Whitaker is not as good as people say he was. And the Chavez fight was a just draw. He ran too much in that too.
Facts
Facts
EXELENTE BOXEADOR RAMIREZ.MUY HUMILDE MUY EDUCADO.
Fabián garcia, Exacto y eso mismo no lo llevo a ser el gran ídolo, porque desgraciadamente para llegar a ser ídolo en muchas de las veces tienen que ser borrachos, mujeriegos, despilfarradores de dinero, vida desordenada, y el humilde que prefirió ser de un perfil bajo
American announcers were biased! Sweet pea ran and tied up the whole fight!
shoulda done more fighting and less running hugging and showboating pea,
You're stupid
The commentators were biased against Jose luis ramirez. He pushed the fight.
I think that Pernell Whitaker is the boxer most screwed in thr history of boxing.I agree that the last 7 rounds were very close,than Ramirez was the champion and Whitaker was often irregular(but not worst than Ali,Leonard and Mayweather) but how can the judges give him only 2 won rounds then he clearly won the first 5?Reading your commentaries I understand that almost all of you say that Whitaker didn't deserve to win because he was too defensive.But if we take always these criterias,Ali,Leonard and Monzon,3 of the greatest champions of the history would NEVER win any fight by decision!
I agree. What these subjective Mexican fans commenting on here don't understand is two fold. Firstly, the Mexican based WBC favors its own. Chavez and Ramirez were favorite sons of the WBC. Chavez got several dubious decisions. Ramirez got one here. Secondly, aggressiveness, however "manly" it is in the eyes of the Machismo obsessed Mexican fans, is not in itself the be all and end all trait in boxing. Scientific boxing is the kryptonite for aggressiveness, and Pernell Whitaker and Floyd Mayweather are two of the best practicioners of scientific boxing in recent history. Boxing is about hitting and not being hit. Holding to break an opponent's rythem, moving, slipping punches are all important traits. Against Whitaker, both Ramirez and Chavez were not effectively aggressive enough to win any of the three fights in my eyes, and in the eyes of many objective fans.
Mark Phelps I could kill for my soccer team but I hate nationalism in INDIVIDUAL sports.In USA I am shocked that Latinos never write on youtube for heavyweight fights and so on...I hate the criteria of aggressiveness,if it was the main criteria,Mayorga would be the greatest of all times and Ali,Mayweather or Leonard would have lost most of their fights by decision.
Mark Phelps Please tell list the dubious decisions Chavez got from the WBC? I keep hearing people say this, but I have yet to see an instance of it other than against Whitaker and the WBC didn't score that or any other fight. Also, Georgie Benton is on record in 1991 saying that they wanted Chavez to age a bit before Whitaker fought him. I have watched the other so called robberies against Lockridge and Laporte. Chavez beat Lockridge straight up, no question about it. The Laporte fight was close, but by no means a robbery.
Whitaker though, was a great fighter and the only contemporary fighter I see giving him a challenge is Roberto Duran. One thing that was usual about Whitaker was the fact that he had such a great jab. Whitaker wasn't a tall rangy fighter, but he had one of the best jabs you'd ever want to see.
sinusbradycardia And what about Randall 2?I had 87/84 for Randall.
Frédéric Avalli
I had the second fight close, the WBC and its stupid rule that the fighter that doesn't sustain a cut loses a point. You know in the 1988 when Chavez fought Ramirez, the same thing happened except it was Chavez who lost the point. I had Chavez well ahead in that fight, but the scorecards were much closer. At least two of them were. Had the WBC and Richard Steele been in Chavez's back pocket, he wouldn't have lost the first fight. Remember Richard Steele took two points from Chavez and even with the knockdown by Randell Chavez would have won the fight had he not lost the two points. I get so sick of hearing this shit that Chavez Sr. never won a fight fair and square. When he destroyed Rosario, well most people say that was because Rosario was on drugs or that Chavez headbutted, elbowed and landed low-blows to beat him. Chavez was on the slide by the time he fought Randell and from what I understand he started drinking quite a bit between fights and Don King pissed away last couple of good years of Chavez's career. In 1991 cover page on Ring or KO Magazine - A Warning to Boxing don't Waste JCC's Last Good Years. They were wasted, partly due to King and partly due to Chavez's problems with alcohol.
Era muy bueno Ramírez, incluso le ganó Floy el coyon
Pernell could not believe that his running ability did not land him a first place win 😂
Jose luis Ramirez le dio una clase de box a Pernel por eso se preparo bien cuando enfrento a Chavez ...no que noo😊
Chavez le eso correre a Whitaker
Viste la pelea por la radio😂😂
Jose Luis Ramirez definitely won that fight yet it was a close fight ill give it that. Those Commentators never once gave any respect to Ramirez when he was throwing his punches and winning .Mexicans are the Best in the boxing industry, and yet there still being portrayed as underrated by bullshit commentators. So I'm glad Ramirez proved them all wrong !
Those commenators were watching many years later from the ESPN studios. the original call was on ABC.
@@phelpsmarc Mexicans rule boxing you hater MEXICAN Chavez beat and Ramirez beat this runner
Y'all both bias asf he was landing on the Mexican chin all day 😆 he couldn't touch pernell and Chavez lost to Randall so what u got to say
@@aldinewestfield5821 Whitaker never ran from Chavez,he beat from outside and on inside even bullying him at times Chavez couldn't do shit
@@b.romero6846 Chavez slaped Whitaker that's why he ran all night
i scored the fight 118-110 whitaker. up there with one of the worst decisions ive seen. but when sulaiman and king wanted a fight between chavez and ramirez you can understand this decision
Your scoring is way off, Ramirez won a close decision.