I hope that the system expands to UH, Ala Moana and Waikiki. As the line looks now I’m not confident it will get the ridership. Oahu desperately needs a solution to the traffic but it’s a shame that many of the most transited destinations on the island won’t have stations, especially considering the cost. I hope the line is a success and isn’t just a money pit.
The announced operating pattern for the first segment is nonsense. Closes at 7pm and an off peak frequency of 10 min. Unless they improve that, that’s a total waste in the investment in autonomous trains.
Really well done piece! This was super informative and the behind the scenes as well as perfectly paced interviews made this an enjoyable watch! Awesome work! Subscribed! 👍
Really difficult to be optimistic about this project. Have you seen the operating plan for the first segment? The line will close at 7pm and have an off peak frequency of 10 min which squanders the investment in autonomous trains. There are so many puzzling choices in the design and operation of HART.
@@house_greyjoymy point is it squanders the massive investment if you run such poor service. What the hell’s the point? They didn’t even utilize the automation to keep capital costs lower. The stations are enormous and the trains are far too long. Should be short trains and small stations with very frequent service.
The first autonomous and mostly-elevated rail system in the US was BART. And HART is literally a carbon copy of BART, even in the naming convention! If you ask the people who advocated for HART they will tell you that they deliberately copied BART's infrastructure, running pattern, and general feel. BART does have train attendants in the cab cars of their trains, but they don't actually drive the train. The system itself is completely automated. The attendants are only there for safety reasons and to serve as a conductor in case if the train needs to be evacuated in an emergency.
@@ianhomerpura8937 I don't really understand why some people are so into platform screen doors. I personally find those Asian stations with the fishtanks extremely claustrophobic. You're already underground, how much more oppressive do you want to make those spaces?! Anyway, platform screen doors are insanely expensive for what they offer. You can add an extension with a few more stations instead of platform screen doors at all the existing stations. For example, BART's paused platform screen door project (until after the train upgrade completes) will cost more than double the cost of the extension to Livermore. I'd rather have more service than the doors that we survive just fine without right now.
@@TohaBgood2 there is one good reason why platform screen doors are so common across rail systems in the Asia-Pacific: air-conditioning. It can get too hot in the summer, in some places up to 40ºC (104ºF) or even higher. We need some respite from all that. However, this is being installed mainly in newer lines. Except in Singapore, which had them since 1987.
im sorry, what? im literally from the bay area and grew up in hawaii for majority of my life and barely anything about the skyline (not hart) feels like bart except for the fact they are both third-rail powered and bart has some over ground parts. their headways are not even the same with the skyline’s being 10 mins for the next train and bart being 15 and before 2023 being 20-30 mins, plus if you knew anything about rail systems you’d know this is a light metro system and not a full-scale one like bart, lastly, what infrastructure was copied? the fact that it’s both overground? (which has literally been a thing for like decades)
@@ryy4n_ Both are fully automated systems that mostly run on viaducts. Oh, and only 4 of BART's 50 stations get 20 minute frequencies. BART is a heavily interlined system with all the lines sharing all of their track with at least one other line. You just hop on the next train and transfer at the next transfer station. The system is designed around these timed cross-platform transfers. Any point in the system is accessible with at most one transfer.
Braddah took you to Zippys?! haha. It's nice to see some positive coverage about the rail. It actually has a pretty terrible reputation with people here because a lot of us just don't understand transit. I'm hoping that reputation turns around when service starts.
@@eriklakeland3857 No, but I'd assume it's not to burn money on nothing before the full segment is done. I don't even think they can win that battle anyways. If they ran empty trains on that segment until 12 people would have a fit about "wasting our tax dollars" anyways.
@@meijiishin5650 that's a red herring. You could make the same argument for the bus, but they still fill up and run outside the HART schedule today, tomorrow, and the day after the rail will run. And how much ya wanna bet they don't prepare for the crowds who are unaware they could be stranded? And what happens to your car if it's in a lot? Does it get towed?
@@eriklakeland3857 it has to do with rules over budget control and funds for waged workers.THO THAT IS FISHY CONSIDERING ITS AUTONOMOUS. Once it's operating outside the standard work day a couple things come into play. I think the union, overtime, specifically security and third party contracting? Also the power over the project would have to be shared bc the city "closes" at night or some shit and this town isn't an actual city it's an unincorporated county meaning the state would take over. That means you're having to do state deals and city deals on the same deal but this was paid with a county tax and federal money? Idk. But considering the third rail runs power 24/7 no matter what it AINT ABOUT ENERGY COST.
Someone living in Hawaii: "Here I am in Waikiki beach a place this train will never reach to." The Hawaiian rail project is bridge to nowhere that connects the airport to a mall and a stadium that is being demolished. No locals will ever use it and no tourist will ever bother with in. HART is a boondoggle that should have been canceled years ago.
I have criticisms of this project, but the “train to nowhere” stuff is nonsense. Look at what Queens was like when the 7 train was built - Kapolei will grow up around the train so the development will be dense and geared towards transit. Even the underwhelming first segment manages to connect 2 college campuses.
While this dude butchered every possible name and place in this video, trains are good and necessary for a great city. Every negative comment is pretty much from someone who has never lived in a place with good transit. Even Japan’s Shinkansen was wayyy over budget, but no one whines about that now. It’s a bummer HART doesn’t reach Waikiki yet but that doesn’t mean we should not build anything in the meantime.
yup thats true, ppl love to hate on it but dont know how phases work and most likely have never even been on a train before and the shinkansen fact is so right, many opposed the tokaido shinkansen and now its the most used line out of all the shinkansen lines
That is partly because for some reason, you Americans hate mass transit so much. Also, your construction companies are way too slow. In other countries, the entire system would be finished in five years.
@@ichigokurosaki2725 So you agree that your first comment was wrong because no matter where this train goes there are just too many people everywhere on the island for it not to be useful. Good. Did not expect you to be so conscientious, but I accept your apology.
That’s pretty good in a vacuum since it includes the stops, but it’s even better when you consider it’ll perform like that practically every time whereas driving is a much more variable experience
2031? They don't even have clearances- soon will only go to Middle street- no one lives at Middle Street. Haven't gotten near urban areas. Skeptics abound!
Many metro lines have NO ONE living around them when first built, i.e. Queens in NYC was practically built around the railway lines branching out from Manhattan
@@CarltonAbas another genius here I see. Hopefully you’re not working on rail too. Why don’t you try your Google and see where Madeira is. Ps, China is right next to Japan, if you get my drift, but I don’t think you do.
@@meijiishin5650 I think you need to use your brain. You don’t even seem to understand my comment. It has nothing to do with generations, it’s about basic geography…that you apparently don’t know either. Madeira isn’t part of Spain. 🙄 You might want to use that brain bruddah before you make irrelevant comments altogether trying to insult me while making yourself look like the brainless one. It would be like claiming Hawaii was part of the USSR.
2:38 "The first segment will go from the West side of the island to the Stadium." Aloha Stadium is permanently closed and will be demolished next year. This train is literally a bridge to nowhere.
A rail system should have been erected ABOVE the main roads into Honolulu, connecting the airport, connecting Waikiki, connecting East Oahu with West Oahu, and all points in between! $10 billion?! There NEEDS to be a complete independent audit, to see who actually received/took that money, and/or basically stole it! This is ridiculous, that something so small could cost so much! As a new Hawaiian transferee, I am appalled at the criminality on full display with this boondoggle waste of taxpayer money, thus far! Shame on ALL you Public Servants who were, and are, involved in this rail project!
It already goes along Kamehameha highway and Dillingham. Those are literally 2 of the main highways. If you put that train over the freeway then people are going to stop off too far from their destination. Also, 10 billion isn't actually that crazy all things considered. It's more than was billed for sure, but if you take a look at similar infra projects in the US almost none of them come on budget or on time.
This is what is commonly called a boondoggle. It is way over budget, is a blight on the landscape because it is so out of scale with the community, and will do little to resolve the transit issue in Honolulu. When it is someday completed, ridership will be almost non-existent and the project will drown in red ink.
Trains are actually much better for islands, since they do not have to rely on oil and gas, subject to constant fluctuations like what is happening nowadays. Relying only on cars for transportation is a deterrent to growth in the long run.
I think that the train system is a very bad idea from day one. Who in their right no wait wrong Mind came up with Rhiannon Spence . You all laughing and thing this was a good idea. How many homes and business you displaced. Terrible human thought. Not a good idea. And you had the nerve to charge all the people all these years.
I hope that the system expands to UH, Ala Moana and Waikiki. As the line looks now I’m not confident it will get the ridership. Oahu desperately needs a solution to the traffic but it’s a shame that many of the most transited destinations on the island won’t have stations, especially considering the cost. I hope the line is a success and isn’t just a money pit.
The announced operating pattern for the first segment is nonsense. Closes at 7pm and an off peak frequency of 10 min. Unless they improve that, that’s a total waste in the investment in autonomous trains.
I think by the end of phase 3 it will see good ridership.
Great idea! Honolulu has needed this for years.
Really cool! Interesting. That sunset though🤩🫶
2031 worth all the wait for sure
Really well done piece! This was super informative and the behind the scenes as well as perfectly paced interviews made this an enjoyable watch! Awesome work! Subscribed! 👍
1:56 - “It’s gonna serve the island of Hawaii…” Nope. The island of Oahu, not Hawaii.
So many errors in this
Not to be picky, but its on the island of O'ahu, not the island of Hawai'i. The island of Hawai'i aka Big Island is the one with the volcanos.
Great content!
Really difficult to be optimistic about this project. Have you seen the operating plan for the first segment? The line will close at 7pm and have an off peak frequency of 10 min which squanders the investment in autonomous trains.
There are so many puzzling choices in the design and operation of HART.
Operating cost?
@@house_greyjoymy point is it squanders the massive investment if you run such poor service. What the hell’s the point? They didn’t even utilize the automation to keep capital costs lower. The stations are enormous and the trains are far too long. Should be short trains and small stations with very frequent service.
I would not use it if I had concerns that working late would mean I need to take a taxi home.
10PM shut down time minimum.
The first autonomous and mostly-elevated rail system in the US was BART. And HART is literally a carbon copy of BART, even in the naming convention! If you ask the people who advocated for HART they will tell you that they deliberately copied BART's infrastructure, running pattern, and general feel.
BART does have train attendants in the cab cars of their trains, but they don't actually drive the train. The system itself is completely automated. The attendants are only there for safety reasons and to serve as a conductor in case if the train needs to be evacuated in an emergency.
Although HART has something no other US transit agency has - platform screen doors.
@@ianhomerpura8937 I don't really understand why some people are so into platform screen doors. I personally find those Asian stations with the fishtanks extremely claustrophobic. You're already underground, how much more oppressive do you want to make those spaces?!
Anyway, platform screen doors are insanely expensive for what they offer. You can add an extension with a few more stations instead of platform screen doors at all the existing stations. For example, BART's paused platform screen door project (until after the train upgrade completes) will cost more than double the cost of the extension to Livermore.
I'd rather have more service than the doors that we survive just fine without right now.
@@TohaBgood2 there is one good reason why platform screen doors are so common across rail systems in the Asia-Pacific: air-conditioning. It can get too hot in the summer, in some places up to 40ºC (104ºF) or even higher. We need some respite from all that.
However, this is being installed mainly in newer lines. Except in Singapore, which had them since 1987.
im sorry, what? im literally from the bay area and grew up in hawaii for majority of my life and barely anything about the skyline (not hart) feels like bart except for the fact they are both third-rail powered and bart has some over ground parts. their headways are not even the same with the skyline’s being 10 mins for the next train and bart being 15 and before 2023 being 20-30 mins, plus if you knew anything about rail systems you’d know this is a light metro system and not a full-scale one like bart, lastly, what infrastructure was copied? the fact that it’s both overground? (which has literally been a thing for like decades)
@@ryy4n_ Both are fully automated systems that mostly run on viaducts.
Oh, and only 4 of BART's 50 stations get 20 minute frequencies. BART is a heavily interlined system with all the lines sharing all of their track with at least one other line. You just hop on the next train and transfer at the next transfer station. The system is designed around these timed cross-platform transfers. Any point in the system is accessible with at most one transfer.
I used to live in Waikiki and often took the #8. It was 10¢ when I was a kid 🤣🤣🤣oh jeez I'm old. 😂
I still have the bus token. I miss old Hawai’i
That's crazy! It's $3 now.
🙌🙌🙌
🙌🙌🙌
Wow lead the way that is a great looking system good luck for the future
Braddah took you to Zippys?! haha.
It's nice to see some positive coverage about the rail. It actually has a pretty terrible reputation with people here because a lot of us just don't understand transit. I'm hoping that reputation turns around when service starts.
Have you seen an explanation why the service will stop at 7pm for the initial operating segment?
@@eriklakeland3857 No, but I'd assume it's not to burn money on nothing before the full segment is done. I don't even think they can win that battle anyways. If they ran empty trains on that segment until 12 people would have a fit about "wasting our tax dollars" anyways.
@@meijiishin5650 that's a red herring. You could make the same argument for the bus, but they still fill up and run outside the HART schedule today, tomorrow, and the day after the rail will run. And how much ya wanna bet they don't prepare for the crowds who are unaware they could be stranded? And what happens to your car if it's in a lot? Does it get towed?
@@eriklakeland3857 it has to do with rules over budget control and funds for waged workers.THO THAT IS FISHY CONSIDERING ITS AUTONOMOUS. Once it's operating outside the standard work day a couple things come into play. I think the union, overtime, specifically security and third party contracting? Also the power over the project would have to be shared bc the city "closes" at night or some shit and this town isn't an actual city it's an unincorporated county meaning the state would take over. That means you're having to do state deals and city deals on the same deal but this was paid with a county tax and federal money? Idk. But considering the third rail runs power 24/7 no matter what it AINT ABOUT ENERGY COST.
@@shwnshts9469 ...but there are west side busses that stop service at 7-8PM. The 93, for example.
How long does Hitachi maintain the rail system. In other words, when will OTS absorb rail operations?
These kinds of contracts end up lasting about 2 years after the first date of revenue service.
Been waiting and paying taxes for that for so long. Hehe. Hopefully by the time it’s done, I’m not gonna carry a senior train pass. lol
It will open on June 30.
Miami’s Metromover is elevated and automated. It’s been operating since 1986.
I wish i can see that very interesting
Someone living in Hawaii: "Here I am in Waikiki beach a place this train will never reach to."
The Hawaiian rail project is bridge to nowhere that connects the airport to a mall and a stadium that is being demolished. No locals will ever use it and no tourist will ever bother with in. HART is a boondoggle that should have been canceled years ago.
I will use it
high key think you aren’t local
@@nathanieltrinidad5880 me?
I have criticisms of this project, but the “train to nowhere” stuff is nonsense. Look at what Queens was like when the 7 train was built - Kapolei will grow up around the train so the development will be dense and geared towards transit. Even the underwhelming first segment manages to connect 2 college campuses.
you can keep your traffic then
Wakiki really? Common man 🎶
While this dude butchered every possible name and place in this video, trains are good and necessary for a great city. Every negative comment is pretty much from someone who has never lived in a place with good transit. Even Japan’s Shinkansen was wayyy over budget, but no one whines about that now. It’s a bummer HART doesn’t reach Waikiki yet but that doesn’t mean we should not build anything in the meantime.
yup thats true, ppl love to hate on it but dont know how phases work and most likely have never even been on a train before and the shinkansen fact is so right, many opposed the tokaido shinkansen and now its the most used line out of all the shinkansen lines
It’s not autonomous. They hired native menehune to run them😅.
Thank you for talking about Hawaii's 10 billion dollar train to nowhere.
That is partly because for some reason, you Americans hate mass transit so much. Also, your construction companies are way too slow. In other countries, the entire system would be finished in five years.
Lol, it's an island, bud. You can't go to "nowhere" here. There's physically no room.
@@TohaBgood2 exactly
@@ichigokurosaki2725 So you agree that your first comment was wrong because no matter where this train goes there are just too many people everywhere on the island for it not to be useful.
Good. Did not expect you to be so conscientious, but I accept your apology.
@@TohaBgood2 This train goes nowhere. Tell me where does this train starts and ends today? I will give you a hint. NOWHERE!
What if tourists pack it up, like a tourist attraction? Of course Kamaaina Rate!🤙
at least they wont be on our streets.
That is exactly how trains work in many tourist hubs. Out of the streets, into the trains they go.
I just can’t get over “Hannahlooloo” and “Waaaahkiki” 😂
And none of those people took you to get an actual aloha shirt? 🤦🏽♂️
And he was gonna catch a wave in the bathtub??
Yep it will be phenomenal how slow it is with an average speed of 30mph.
You Americans are so obsessed with speed too much. You clearly have never been abroad where mass transit functions well.
So about twice faster than driving there, correct?
30-35 mph average speed is pretty much standard for a heavy rail metro train in the us in the post war period
That’s pretty good in a vacuum since it includes the stops, but it’s even better when you consider it’ll perform like that practically every time whereas driving is a much more variable experience
O’ahu’s Rail system:
- Just a few YEARS overdue
- Just a few BILLION DOLLARS over budget
🤣‼️HAHAHAHAHAHA‼️😂
Roads and highways are worse in doing so. But go on, continue with your obsession with cars.
I lived in Waikiki for 10years and ride my bike. I never needed to ride the bus.
$12 billion+ dollars for 20 miles. Sounds like a bargain.
“It’s going to serve the island of Hawaii…”? I believe you mean Oahu is the island being served.
It's pronunciation is Wai (as in why) Kiki not Wakiki
Didn’t this start back in 2008?
2031? They don't even have clearances- soon will only go to Middle street- no one lives at Middle Street. Haven't gotten near urban areas. Skeptics abound!
Many metro lines have NO ONE living around them when first built, i.e. Queens in NYC was practically built around the railway lines branching out from Manhattan
“Portuguese man from Madeira, Spain”, direct quote from the guy responsible for the train. Doomed.
Not quite sure what you getting at. Portugal is right next to Spain, you can drive over the border from Spain into Portugal.
@@CarltonAbas another genius here I see. Hopefully you’re not working on rail too. Why don’t you try your Google and see where Madeira is. Ps, China is right next to Japan, if you get my drift, but I don’t think you do.
@@mikeuptegrove Braddah, use your brain. He said 2nd generation. That means that guy was born from Portuguese parents in Spain...
@@meijiishin5650 I think you need to use your brain. You don’t even seem to understand my comment. It has nothing to do with generations, it’s about basic geography…that you apparently don’t know either. Madeira isn’t part of Spain. 🙄 You might want to use that brain bruddah before you make irrelevant comments altogether trying to insult me while making yourself look like the brainless one. It would be like claiming Hawaii was part of the USSR.
is she joking, service in april or may?! of what 2040?
Nope, 2023 for the first segment. The trains have been test-running since 2022 without passengers.
@@hebneh lies. they wont have it open this year, theyll have more cracking spans or pillars, garranz.
@@alexgray8804 If you have a digital radio scanner you can listen in on rail operations along with Thebus dispatch.
2:38 "The first segment will go from the West side of the island to the Stadium."
Aloha Stadium is permanently closed and will be demolished next year. This train is literally a bridge to nowhere.
@@Novusod someone read the corner sign on king IYKYK
You call this on time. It is way too over due. Still not a good idea.
A rail system should have been erected ABOVE the main roads into Honolulu, connecting the airport, connecting Waikiki, connecting East Oahu with West Oahu, and all points in between! $10 billion?! There NEEDS to be a complete independent audit, to see who actually received/took that money, and/or basically stole it! This is ridiculous, that something so small could cost so much! As a new Hawaiian transferee, I am appalled at the criminality on full display with this boondoggle waste of taxpayer money, thus far! Shame on ALL you Public Servants who were, and are, involved in this rail project!
Look at the cost and time for H2. In today's money probably the same.
It already goes along Kamehameha highway and Dillingham. Those are literally 2 of the main highways. If you put that train over the freeway then people are going to stop off too far from their destination.
Also, 10 billion isn't actually that crazy all things considered. It's more than was billed for sure, but if you take a look at similar infra projects in the US almost none of them come on budget or on time.
This railway was a financial robbery
Roads and highways are worse in doing so.
the rusty rail will fail.
This is what is commonly called a boondoggle. It is way over budget, is a blight on
the landscape because it is so out of scale with the community, and will do little to
resolve the transit issue in Honolulu. When it is someday completed, ridership will
be almost non-existent and the project will drown in red ink.
How in the world is a train out of scale for a community? Lmao
Trains are actually much better for islands, since they do not have to rely on oil and gas, subject to constant fluctuations like what is happening nowadays. Relying only on cars for transportation is a deterrent to growth in the long run.
2030-2031!!! hahaha ridiculous Should have it go all the way around AT THIS RATE. dumb
Train wreck
They didn’t need trains, they just need to stagger start and finish times. Especially with the schools.
I think that the train system is a very bad idea from day one. Who in their right no wait wrong Mind came up with Rhiannon Spence . You all laughing and thing this was a good idea. How many homes and business you displaced. Terrible human thought. Not a good idea. And you had the nerve to charge all the people all these years.
why do you Americans hate trains so much? it's as if you guys only want cars and virtually nothing else.
It’s going to be a nightmare to ride it. Now the island looks like schitt.
Y’all messed up my island.
Think about it, you built a train system on an island. How moronic is that?