.45 Colt/.454 Casull and .45 Super/.460 Rowland really got robbed of their popularity by .44 Mag and 10mm....if only introduction times were a bit different.
Yep. The 10mm Auto thing is getting a little out of control imo, especially as regards "woods carry" or "dangerous animal defense" round. 44 SPL, 44 Mag and 45 Colt are all more suitable for that. On the "low end" you have cartridges that are very easy to shoot, from extremely easy to pack pistols, whilst still being more effective than 10mm. On the "high end," you have things such as the 45 Colt, so-called "Redhawk-only-loads," which are as powerful as a the old 45-70 Government load delivered from the 1873 carbine. For God's sake lol. All the while, most everyone seems obsessed with magazine capacity for the 10mm. Revolvers are simply a much more sound choice for woods/bush/country carry than an autoloader, not to mention modern polymer frame autoloaders. Even if someone is bent on an autoloader with a large capacity magazine for "the bush," the 45 ACP is the elephant in the room: when did 45 ACP just get relegated to irrelevance in that context? Anyway, as others have hit on in this thread, there are so many good options for people. Treating 10mm Auto like it's the only show in town is embarrassing.
@@LibertysetsquareJack I completely agree. This obsession with capacity is the admission you’re going to miss a lot. The first shots are the most important. Miss with those, and you probably won’t be alive to fire shots 7 and more. A .44 Special/Magnum loaded with a 250-255 grain SWC or LBT LFN at 1050 fps is far superior to 10mm. I don’t hate 10mm or higher capacity, but they’re not the only things.
Alec Baldwin tragically demonstrated the efficacy of .45LC. The round penetrated and killed one person and then lodged in a second person wounding him.
@LibertysetsquareJack I fired a 45 Colt cowboy round out of a Bond Arms derringer with a 3" barrel. It was a 200 grain hardcast rated at 705 fps...weak even among cowboy rounds...and it went through four layers of denim plus three news magazines. It also deformed enough to make me realize it would most likely do horrible damage to a human. So yes...the 45 Colt round is potent no matter how it's loaded.
@@anonymousf454 Remington 210 grain hollow points,round sanctioned by department. Shot competition with home cast 220 grain slugs hunted mule deer with both. Both worked well. I know the 44 mag is popular in Alaska I would not hesitate to carry a 41 there with either load.
220 slug was semi wad cutter case from wheel weights. I shot my N frame enough I had to send it back for repairs 2 times. Second time they could not repair so with a little haggling they replaced it with a new SS N frame which I still have. Bbl length .for job was 4 in whin I got the gun it had a 6 in bbl with it they had to put a 4 in on the gun and sent the 6 in with it when they returned it
Your videos are EXCELLENT. Thank you. Ruger made a GP100 in 44 Special, 3" barrel, 5 shot. I have almost left the store with one a few times...non fluted cylinder. Beautiful revolver. Some are still out there.
I believe Paul Harrell covered the 44 special as well. He didn’t give it a great review in the video, but he later left a pinned comment saying that after some time with the Ruger, that 44spl is now a part of his regular rotation of carry guns.
Excellent video there are of few of us Crusty ,Rusty folks that love .44 special and handloaded properly it can do any task with outstanding accuracy and very controllable. Hey thanks for mentioning it. >>> And a huge fan of Elmer Keith and John Taffin.
Makes me want to take another look at a 44 Special Night Guard I was ogling. Excellent presentation of the calibers. I have learned a lot. Thank you, sir!
It's hard to explain to younger shooters how a mystique grew around the .44 Special round in the '70's and early 80's. It was almost impossible to find revolvers chambered in the round. I thought I had died and gone to heaven when I found a pre-24 4th Model Hand Ejector target at a gun show. Mostly because of a gun writer named Skeeter Skelton, I've always loved the .44 Special and the Smiths that chamber it.
Great video as always! I agree with your assessment on the 40s four special, especially Skeeter Skeletons, hot 44 special loads. A 44 with 240gr Lead flat nose, or hollow points semi wadcutters at 900 to 1000fps in a 44mag pistol (I only shoot those loads in 44 magnum rated guns). is about perfectly balanced. The recoil is manageable and it hits with plenty of authority! Skeeter knew his stuff…
@ ~ 16:00 mark through c. 21:00 There actually is a very viable, concealable revolver for 45 Colt, as well as one in 45 ACP, both currently made by Charter Arms. Charter calls the 45 (Long) Colt version the "Bulldog XL," and it's essentially identical to their 2.5" barreled 44 SPL Bulldog, but with a heavier top strap and cylinder. Iirc, it weighs about one (1) ounce more than the 2.5" 44 Bulldog. So five shot, DA/SA, swing out cylinder, overall length just a hair past 7" (and can be considerably shorter if the the "combat grips" are switched out for smaller stocks), shrouded ejector plunger, weighs ~ twenty one (21) ounces empty. The other is the "Pitbull," in 45 ACP. Again, identical essentially to the 44 SPL Bulldog with 2.5" barrel, five shots, etc. Even more interestingly, the Pitbull does not need moon clips: it has a proprietary extractor that seats and ejects the rimless cases. Charter Arms also chambers the Pitbull in both 40 S&W and 9mm Luger. Finally, people may be interester to know that Charter did make a 41 Magnum Bulldog for several years. It's called the "41 Mag Pug." Production was short run, from like 2015 to only 2020 or so; but they are out there, if someone is inclined towards 41 Magnum and want a fully modern, practical, defense oriented 41 with concealed-carry in mind.
@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb the Bulldog XL is a bit snappy with anything more than cowboy action loads but still manageable with defensive loads. I've had mine about 3 years & it's fairly accurate & a good action for a Charter. Last I checked still available. Taurus also made the model 450 5 shot 45colt snubby a few years back. I've only seen one & the owner wasn't interested in selling at twice what he paid for it.
Dick I gotta say, I have enjoyed your channel since its inception has much as anything on RUclips in a long time! Great job!! Thank you from an old FUDD like you😁.
Used every caliber you mentioned and STILL Do. I used a 6" S&W Model 29 with rollers that could adjust front sights too. This with .44 Special I packed in a shoulder rig. Used a Model 58 .41 and Model 57 both 4". Today I still have a Model 58 a 4" Model 29 and a 629 2.6". Used a Colt 1873 .45 Colt and have carried one in black bear country hunting and tent camping in Colorado. ( bear had been spotted a week before at our camp area) It was comforting when making a head call in the middle of the night. I had a buddy in a small agency who carried a Model 57 all his career and with 210 grain police load and his own reloads ( his agency allowed that). He was an excellent shot too.
Thanks for the trip down Memory Lane. I carried a Model 629 during my rookie year with Houston PD, in Texas, March 1984 to March 1985. I became eligible to use an auto-loading duty pistol after that first year of service, and, backed down to a 9mm HK P7 for six months, in an old-school flap holster, locally custom-made to meet PD specs. One reason for 9mm was to let my hand heal! Then, I returned to big boredom, finishing out the Eighties, carrying an ex-San Antonio PD Model 58 .41 Magnum, in the duty holster, and during much of my personal time. The Model 58 was loose by 1990, starting to go out of time, when I transitioned to a Colt Stainless Commander, .45 ACP. The Nineties became my .45 ACP and .357 Magnum era, for duty and carry handguns. 1990 was also about time when I admitted to myself that I have K/L/GP100-sized hands, so I now use the “4” cartridges in single-action sixguns, for recreational purposes. The grips are smaller in volume, and, the reach to a single-action trigger is shorter. Non-magnum cartrdiges are now my friends.
"hand heal" Struck a bell with me! I decided a LONG time ago the 44 mag was a little too much for me. I stuck with the .357 mag and have not been disappointed. The muzzle flip on the .44 was really too much to control when you had other potential targets.
Our local PD, during the LE Revolver Era, restricted the Officer to a .38 Spec +P+. They adopted that Policy at some point in the late 50s early 60s. I never heard if whether there was a specific incident that prompted the Policy change. Prior to that, there was a plethora of cartridges used. My Grandfather carriec a S&W Hand Ejector chambered in 32-20. He did use a Semi Jacketed Flat Tip Soft Point Amnunition. Unfortunately, his revolver was pawned by my Drunken Uncle, and we didn't find out he had pawned it until much later.
That's one of the "problems" with 44 SPL, the relative rarity of the store-stocked ammo. It's actually gotten better than it was like fifteen years ago though. The price is actually significantly cheaper now (when inflation is accounted for), and loadings such as the Hornady 165 grain FTX exist. When I got a Bulldog almost fifteen years ago, it was basically just the old school, 246 grain LRN in stores. Anyway, so-called "Cowboy Ammo" is a good comprise option now for price and performance, if one doesn't want to handload or carry handloads for legality headache. A box of 50 HSM "Cowboy" regularly goes for $48-$49 in Alaska nowadays, which is saying something, considering it isn't cheap to live here otherwise, not at all.
@@michaellavaughnrobinson that's the stuff going for 70 here. I've never tried it, but had horrible .223 from them couple years ago. I've got about 500 casings left, so it'll be quite awhile, before in need.
The .45 S&W Schofield round works, but doesn't work well in the 1873 Colt. The Schofield round at the time had a larger rim and the chambers are so close in the SAA that there wasn't enough room. Soldiers forced to use .45 Schofield in their SAA revolvers could only load every other chamber, so they were limited to 3 rounds. But it's better than none when a Schofield armed soldier was issued .45 Colt ammunition!
I like 44 specials in my S&W 629 3 inch barrel. Very accurate. Since I reload it is easy to test the different loads. I think charter arms also makes a revolver in 45 colt 3 inch barrel along with 44 special.
@@Kinetic.44 , The 45 lc can not be loaded like a 454 . The brass case can't handle it. Too much CUP pressure. When reloading you have to follow what is recommended in the reloading manual. But you can buy a 454 and shoot 45 lc in it.
Towning. Actually dick did use 45 colt brass in developing the 454. Even using duplex loads. Check out Ross seyfried’s articles on it. 45 colt brass especially federal, is just as strong as 44mag brass.
The story goes that back in the days when Elmer Keith was young, 45 Colt brass was not as strong, which is one of the reasons he worked so much with 44 SPL. But yeah, that is definitely not an issue today, or for the last forty to fifty years for that matter. Modern 45 Colt can be loaded up extremely hot, where the external and terminal ballistics actually pass up 44 Magnum considerably. It takes certain pistols to be able to do that though, namely large frame Rugers. 44 SPL remains arguably more versatile overall because of the size and weight of pistol it can be chambered in whilst attaining maximum performance. Some would say it offers a better "power to weight" or efficiency ratio for a given size of pistol, namely small and medium frames.
Ah, the .41. I recall that the cartridge looked the same as the .45 Colt. Big and long and was fired from a "38 look" revolver. I was 9 or 10 years old when my (great) Uncle Claude taught me to shoot a pistol using that beast. He had an "interesting" sense of humor. We went out in the field next to my grandmother's house (and behind her general store), he stuck a 1.5" or so stick in the ground, paced about 6 or 8 strides (he was tall and lanky, so maybe 7 or 8 yards) to where I stood. He described sight alignment, how to hold the gun, how to squeeze and not jerk the trigger... then he stood aside, and I was on my own. That gun was so heavy I could hardly hold it with both hands outstreached. I sighted it and squeezed and... THE WORLD EXPLODED ! I found myself on the ground, on my back, with rhe gun laying next to me. No malfunction; it was just had that much of a kick! I was also PISSED OFF, fuming, sputtering, cussing, and climbing to my feet... while Claude was bent over laughing so hard he was having trouble not pissing himself! All he could do between laughing and gasping for breath was to point at the stick. It was now half as long and splayed apart like an Indian War Bonnet. That was my practical introduction to handguns. I could not have hit it again for flinching, but that intro may have been why I always prefered the 1911 .45 ACP and the .357 magnum in handguns. I always liked the .22 for plinking, since my first personally owned gun was a Remington single shot bolt action rifle (I forget the model). I also owned .32 ACP, .380 (9x17mm), 9mm Makarov (9x18mm), and 9mm Luger/Parabellum (9x19mm). Good calibers all, except that .32 is a HOT cartridge. I shot an old thick walled, short sized, glass Coca-Cola bottle with it, hitting it in the neck of the bottle just above where the neck met the 'shoulders". It WENT RIGHT THROUGH THE NECK, LEAVING THE SIDES ATTACHED ! That FMJ bullet was moving FAST to have done that! For the last 20+ years my favorite handgun and the main one I would be carrying in a "serious" situation, is a .40 S&W IMI (yes, IMI and not the more recent IWI) Jericho 941, marketed in the US as the small frame "Desert Eagle" or the "Baby Eagle" and in Europe as the "Uzi Eagle". It is a totally different gun from the original .44 Mag / .357 Mag "Desert Eagle". That huge DE is more a hunting gun, while the Jericho 941 is a combat handgun evolution out of the CZ-75 and sharing a number of parts with the Italian Tanfoglio TZ-75, marketed in the USA by EAA as the 'Witness". I fire standard FMJ flat nose cartriges, and I have never failed to hit what I was aiming at. The only other gun I was that accurate with was of all things a Colt 1911 chambered in 9mm. First time I fired that gun I jumped soda can 6 times. It was such a sweet shooter, that it is one of about 5 or 6 guns I wish I'd never sold or traded. Say what you will about the .40 S&W cartridge, I love it. Most of the ballistics of the 9mm and most of the energy of the .45 ACP. One reviewer mentioned it has the same ballistics as the 1800s .44-40. I never got around to looking that up, nut if a prominent gun reviewer puts such a claim in print in a popular gun magazine, then I have a feeling it is true. As such, I tend to respect those cowboys with rifle and handgun both chambered in .44-40 for all their needs. If I am going to trek around the back country, I will still take my .308/7.62x51 NATO rifle, thank you. Or maybe a 12 Ga shotgun alternating slugs an 00 Buck. Unfortunately the weight of either of those is a serious limitation on how much you can carry. Without military style resupply, you will not be able to carry enough for an extended period period of use... no matter how strong you are.
While in the Army, I bought a S&W 25 in 45 Colt, I still have it and really enjoy shooting it! (I am glad to hear you state that the 45 "Long" Colt is incorrect). I couldn't carry it as a deputy sherrif in the 1980s, so I bought and carried a S&W 686, still shoot it periodically. When I got on the SWAT team, we carried semi-auto pistols. Revolvers should not be discounted as a defensive use firearm, just train wih it and select proper ammunition.
To be forewarned is to be forearmed. Yes, our Country is needs to tighten up. There are a lot of people who are well armed and very capable of defending ourselves but I pray things don't reach that point. Thanks for another good video.
I own and shoot a Rossi model 720 revolver, un- fluted cylinder, 3" in .44 special. I definitely agree with your assessment of this caliber! Thanks and good job!
I’ve carried a S&W 629 three inch loaded with Hornady Critical Defense in .44 special. Heavy gun but it feels like a .22 when shooting it in that caliber. It kicks like a mule with magnums. I just got my hands on a 1973-74 Charter Arms “Bulldog” three inch revolver. I purchased it from a widowed elderly woman who was selling her deceased husband’s firearms for a very low price. To be honest. Her asking price was too low. So, I upped it $50.00. It was covered in grease and seems like it hasn’t left the safe since the seventies. It had very little wear and the blueing was in good condition. I was surprised at the quality of the revolver and how well it shot. Not Smith quality. But well made and very concealable. Thanks for the great content.
Charter arms makes 5 shot revolvers in .38spl, .357mag, .44spl. .45 colt, 9mm, .40SW, and .45acp. The new ones are light weight, very sturdy and value based revolvers. I have a new production. Brushed stainless .44spl Bulldog Pug and it has nice G-10 grips on it. It's very nice looking.
Charter Arms is great. Very, very underrated manufacturer. They also make a 6-shot 357 called the "Professional," 25 ounces in weight and 4" barrel. Afaik, it's the only 6-shot 357 Magnum in that weight and size class in current production.
I've been reading about the "Fitz Special", which was typically built on the large frame Colt revolvers. Mr. Fitzgerald was said to always carry 2 of them with him in his pants pockets. Maybe with the right pants...
I looked for a 4" Smith 25 for years until I found a Redhawk 4.25" 45colt/45acp. Not a great carry revolver but awful nice for hunting. I wasn't impressed with the Smith 69 & wound up trading it for a GP100 44 that I've been quite happy with. I really don't care much for 44mag anymore but 45colt & 44 special will do anything I need them to. I do like my 4" Smith 41 as well, just wish ammo was easier to find. Thanks for the rundown, some of us still like ole wheelguns.
I was shot point blank in the neck and paralyzed by a .44 special hollow point in 1983. It put me down. I was also shot in my upper thigh with a .44 special wad. cutter. The first three rounds fired at me completely missed me even though they were fired at less than an arm's length away. My x-rays show I'm still full of bullet fragments. I carry a firearm everywhere I go (legally) my weapon of choice to carry is a .44 special
Always loved 44. Cal. Round ( have 2 s&w 29's and a Ruger super Blackhawk) bought in the 70's/early 80's. Love the Magnum but being 76y old backed off to the Special. Thank you for keeping the Revolver and especially the 44 cartridge alive.
Thank you Dick for an excellent breakdown of the “4’s”. Can you recommend any books with similar breakdown of American calibers. I’ve read all of Elmer Keith’s books Thank you again for the informative videos
I've seen ballistic test on the 44 special and 45 Colt. They hit like freight trains. People forget that the 45 Colt was the most powerful hand gun for decades.
I have a S&W model 22 in .45 acp with a 4" barrel. I used to carry it when I was in bear country. I loaded it with .45 Super 255gr bullets before I got a 10mm. It was a chunk to pack but it was better than being a bear burger. It shoots great but it stays in the safe mostly now. When I do shoot it nowadays, it's mostly ball ammo. I just opened the safe and it's got Winchester PDX1's loaded in it now. Thanks for this video. I believe I'll run some rounds through it tomorrow. Hope y'all have a great evening.
I totally agree, specifically on the semi-wad cutter h p lead .44. I have had four Charter Arms .44s, two were 3” SS bulldogs. And accurate….jacketed not so much. Thanks
I have been carrying a .45 Colt for self defense/concealed carry for a couple of decades. Being willing to dress around the gun and practice can make it viable in almost any normal sized revolver.
I have a 1970's era bulldog. It quite light and small. Butt it's a hammer. I whacked a raccoon about a month ago in the backyard. I have federal swc hollow point. Good grief that was a mess. It didn't get back up.
The closest I could get to that was I had a Colt Anaconda, and with defense loads, it was a love-hate relationship . I was definitely abused and battered, but I still loved her, lol. But that follow-up shot would be kind of tough.
The 325 Smith pistols are viable .45 acp carry options as well as the 3 inch (discontinued) 625 and 4inch Model 22s. Charter Arms puts out a 45 acp Pug. Over the years larger .45 acp revolvers have been modified for carry by shortening barrels. It should be mentioned that the .45 acp is roughly equivalent to that .44 special that you love. Loved your presentation. Revolvers rule. If it doesn't spin it isn't in.
Just found this channel last week when I was looking up what side arm to take when I go out west in a couple months and we will be camping and enjoying those mountains. I settled on a Glock 20 and bought one and ordered some Xtreme penetrators along with 200 hardcast bc I fill this would be better than my hog leg 44 redhawk I got when I turned 16 by my dad. Watched every video since. Love this channel
I hope the bear is polite enough to wait while you clear your double-feed, stovepipe, nosedive, failure to feed, or magazine follower jam ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Let me tell you what you're going to do against a bear with 16 rounds of 10mm: You're either going to spray-fire all 16 shots and hit next to nothing, OR you're going to fire 5 or 6 well aimed shots, same as you would with a revolver... only you'll be shooting a boosted .40 instead of an honest magnum. You made the popular choice, not the right choice. Good luck, vaya con Dios, and happy trails, tactical dan. 😂
It depends on how accurate you are and if you can be accurate when SHTF with a bear. If you need just one shot, the .44 mag will be fine. Practice with the G20, it will be better for multiple targets and shots if needed. PS: Bears are probably not the most dangerous animals in the woods, people and moose are higher IMO.
@Mrelindio42 You clearly don't shoot, and you clearly didn't comprehend my comment. Let me help. 44mag revolvers hold 6 shots, not 1, and revolvers have been reliably slaying man and beast since the 19th century, both in war and on the frontier. Consistent, accurate fire is very doable with a revolver inside the narrow time constraints of a bear attack, and make no mistake, TIME is the single greatest limiting factor in most fights, NOT ammunition capacity. You simply will not have TIME to accurately fire more than a handful of accurate shots before a bear is on you. You won't be taking cover, you won't be laying down suppressive fire, and you absolutely will not get to reload your weapon. You would be wise to maximize the effect of every bullet fired. If 10mm is truly your upper limit for recoil tolerance, then please carry it. However, choosing a 16 shot 10mm over a 6 shot 44 when you're probably only going to fire 6 shots anyway is a fashion choice, not a practical one.
How many bears have you killed? Ever had one charge you, tear a hole in your tent, start folowing you in the woods, become a camp pest, raid your food cooler? I have been shooting revolvers/pistols for over 60 years as a LEO and hunter. I just don't prefer a single shot .44 mag in bear country over a G20. The 44 is a single shot because after the first shot the barrel is usually pointed at the sky. IMO the 44 mag is a great hunting round for close range for deer and elk. I have one in a Winchester Trapper model lever action and have also qualified with a 44 mag revolver years ago. PS: I have never, and don't plan on ever, laying down suppresive fire with anything. No warning shots either! The bottom line is, carry what you want! I prefer almost any rifle to any pistol for bear.@@ajm2872
The pitbull in 40S&W has a bit of recoil, but any experienced revolver shooter won't mind. The 45 acp version is on the list as a 2nd carry at bad breath distance. I'm inclined to think that that would alter someone's thought process about making you a victim.
There’s an old S&W 58 that I’ve been eyeing. Like you said, I have no need for it, but it’s such a rare and beautiful piece of history that I’ve been trying to come up with an excuse to buy it! Lol
Legend has it that a cowboy in the old west sauntered into the general store and asked for a box of .45 Colt ammo. The shopkeeper slaps a box of the shorter schofield length .45 M1887 on the counter. The cowboy replies "No thanks! I"ll take the long colts". Of course referring to the longer .45 Colt. So although .45 long Colt is not a proper name. It was used to differentiate .45 M1887 (short) from .45 Colt (long).
More likely he was handed the 45 Colt Government which was a 45 Colt case but the length of the S&W so it could be used in the S&W Schofield revolver but it was a Colt round (i.e. a short Colt).
Your point on the .41 magnum police load ballistics is well taken. I shoot 210 grain RNFP’s at about 850 fps in local action matches. Still powerful, but very sweet shooting. I actually find .45 ACP more interesting in a revolver than an auto. No bullet shape or COAL constraints.
Talk sometime about the 454 casuall... I carry the ruger super Red Hawk 2.75 inch in chest rig in alaska for critters 4 or 2 legs. With extreme hunter I'm probably only getting one good shot anyway 🤷 ....THX.
Nicely done.... Carried both a 58 and 57 while in LE in the 1970s and 80s... The POLICE load from Remington clocked 930 fps and the Winchester 960. You didn't mention the 10mm and .40 S&W that make ideal big bore 6-shot carry gun loads when used in the Ruger GP 100 Match Champion and 3" WC Special. I have both and it is just what Keith/Jordan/Skelton were looking for..
One revolver that I think is really neat is the Smith and Wesson 610. It can fire 10mm auto or .40S&W. Now of course you need moon clips (no problem, I'm a fan of moon clips anyway). But if I had one of these, I don't think I would be able to resist trying to make a "10mm Auto Rimmed" case from a cut down, resized and reamed .30-30 case....I'm SURE someone has done that SOMEWHERE. A real neat gun regardless, with 10mm auto you right in there at the low end of .41 Rem Mag power.
Thanks for a great video. I have had a Charter Arms Bulldog 44 Spcl on my CCW for a number of years. Can't shoot full power loads as it damages the gun. But great gun.
Love this series of videos. Very well done. I have to say though, it was always my understanding that the .44 Russian was not a lengthened .44 American but a totally redesigned internally lubricated bullet. . I do know the Russian can be fired in a .44 magnum which I routinely do Afain, great job.
You're correct. I was watching the vid again this evening and I caught that too, and wanted to see if anyone had posted, so I saw you're comment. Fairburn was saying 44 S&W ("American") was the first consumer cartridge with an internally lubricated bullet, and the 44 Russian was lengthened. The 44 Russian was indeed lengthened in case, but the entire cartridge is also different: larger base diameter, larger rim diameter, and internally lubricated bullet, of smaller caliber (~ .429 for the Russian versus ~ .434 for American). The story goes that it was actually at the behest of the Imperial Russian officer acting for procurement that S&W changed to the non-heeled (internally lubricated) design. So yes, as you allude 44 Russian can to this day be chambered in various arms that will take the 44 SPL or 44 Magnum, because they are all in the same line of descent. The 44 American though is it's own thing.
Thank you, Dick, for an excellent video and an outstanding series of videos, all of which are entirely factually and very well presented. With respect to this “4” video, I agree that revolvers chambering .41 magnum, .44 Spacial and magnum, and .45 ACP and Colt are generally too heavy and large for daily concealed carry. BUT (imho) a Smith 25/625 or a Ruger Redhawk, chambered in .45 Colt or ACP, is an entirely viable defensive firearm for many homeowners. Many individuals will, of course, question their comparatively limited capacity; however, I’d respectfully suggest six rounds is overwhelmingly likely to be more than adequate.
Especially for open belt carry, the "4s" are perfect for folks living in the country, and with a pancake or similar holster they conceal easily under a jacket or vest.
I carry a Charter Arms 44spl Bulldog & at times a Charter Arms Boomer , 44spl which is similar in size as a 642 At times I carry a Charter Arms in a 45acp .. smaller than a K frame and a Charter Arms in 40 S&W I’d like to see a 6 shot 10mm revolver with a 3.5 inch barrel
I carried a S&W 25-5 4” a good bit on a southern CA municipal PD. We had pretty flexible handgun policy so I always carried a .45 Colt or a .45 acp 1911. I would not change my choice of guns or calibers after 25 years of day to day experiences. I’ve seen about every caliber succeed or fail at one time or another. Now retired, I live in an area where feral dogs and wild hogs are encountered at times. I carry a 3” mdl 24-3 in .44 spl most frequently. CCI Blazer 200 gr jacketed hollow points work well in it though the aluminum cases can’t be reloaded.
@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb No. I got that from a Federal Officer and it’s become my favorite carry piece. It’s been slicked up with a smooth combat trigger in it. It’s sort of a compact version of my 4” 629 that I used to carry in Idaho on elk hunts.
The Buffalo Bore, 45 AUTO RIM +P - 225 gr. Wadcutter @ 1,125 fps for use on 45ACP revolvers seems to me to be able to solve nearly every problem. And, It leave the option of using 45ACP 230gr ball (legit in it's own right as you have said) in a full moon clips which is quick to reloading and plenty available. S&W 325 TR is light enough to carry but still wide and 4" of barrel.
Thank you for your time and expertise in this series. I've thoroughly enjoyed it. Very well done. Curiously enough, Charter Arms makes a Bulldog 5-shot revolver chambered for 45 Colt AND a "Pitbull" 5-shot 45 acp revolver that has no need for use of moon clips. At least, I think they still make them... I don't know how well they would hold up if shot a lot, but they're out there. I plan to buy one for myself if I ever run across one. Thanks again for your hard work! EDIT: is the cartridge you aren't sure about either the 9x18 Makarov or the 7.62 Tokarev? My brother swears by his CZ chambered for 9x18, but I can't imagine he shoots it much, since so little ammunition is available these days
Cnl.fritz modified the s&w cut the back to ejector rod, make cyl latch button smaller ,bob hammer ,cut trigger guard off front of trigger either hand gloved works then ,can be fired from inside a coat pocket , I've made a half a dozen.for people.
@17:02 Dick, just to add to the info, believe it or not the San Francisco Police Dept issued the .41 Magnum, as did the Amarillo Police Dept., who my father worked for before going to the Texas Highway Patrol. In fact, many of the APD officers continued to carry their m58's (and a few nice m57's) up until the mid to late 1990's, pretty sure the motors guys were the one that liked it the best. Makes sense, after all if you're on a bike and have to shoot into cars, it'd be hard for a 9mm or a .45 ACP to compete with a 175 gr Silvertip running (back then) about 1400 fps.
Back in the early 70s the head of the Arizona State Police, himself an Apache, was asked why they carried 41 magnum instead of 38 Special. ”Because 41 doesn't bounce of a hard skull." So be it.
Have carried a 1911 in .45 ACP for most of my life. BUT, my Charter .44 SPL loaded with swc’s is more concealable, lighter and, extremely powerful. In a true pure defensive use, unmatched, five rounds is sufficient - not dealing with zombie apocalypse in the real world, also very reliable. Gone back to it for daily carry, big bore wheel guns get the job done for non LEO’s.
My only regret on the 41 mag is I did not buy a marlin 1894 lever in 41 when they were readily available. But Deputies with family’s did not have a lot of spare cash.
@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb really I hadn’t heard. Wonder how scarce they are. Today prices probably puts them around $1200.00 a shade more then the marlins In the 70’s
"Handguns are not powerful enough" ".44 Rem Mag is too much power" JHP that fall within FBI penetration standards are avaliable for .44 Mag, like Winchester Platinumtip. I dont understand this mentality, if you hit what your aiming at you shouldn't need such rapid follow-up shots and with such limited capacity in a revolver accuracy is more important than speed.
It's about the energy transfer. Monster magnums aside, no handgun cartridge delivers anywhere near the muzzle energy level of a centerfire rifle. Even when a pistol projectile strikes a critical organ such as the heart or brain, it may not impart enough damage to cause instantaneous collapse. A centerfire rifle projectile fired at close range produces enough energy to sufficiently damage the affected organ and surrounding tissue, including nervous system disruption. This will not always be the case, but the probability of it happening is much higher with the rifle than with the handgun.
@Paladin1873 Energy transfer entirely depends on bullet design and construction with any caliber of round. The Winchester Platinum Tip 44 Rem Mag round I already mentioned penetrates on the low end of the "12 -18" in ordnance gel and expands huge, transfering a ton of energy. There are all kinds of bullets, including compressed metal powders and prefragmented copper/brass monolithic, which are specifically designed for high energy transfer. Some of these can produce extremely high rifle velocity due to the lightweight materials. Handgun energy levels are generally par with that of a .223/5.56 carbine. I'm not even talking about +P+ "Ruger only."44 Mag loads or .454 Casual, which exceed intermediate rifle round energy levels. You don't need a monster X frame round to prove my point.
@@Kinetic.44 Self-defense, hunting, and combat rounds meet different criteria. We are not dealing in absolutes. We are dealing in probabilities. Projectile construction is only one factor. Its sectional density is also critical. Light-for-caliber projectiles are less likely to penetrate as deeply as heavy-for-caliber projectiles. They also bleed off velocity more rapidly. Other critical factors include the effect of barriers (clothing, hair, muscle, bone) on penetration, contact velocity, and bullet placement (wound path). A round that strikes bone, a vital organ, or severs a major artery or blood vessel will be more effective than one that does not. A round that fully penetrates and leaves a gaping exit wound can cause more rapid blood pressure drop. A round moving too fast may self-destruct or expand prematurely and not penetrate deeply enough to damage organs. A round moving too slowly may not expand, tumble, or break apart as designed, or it may impart insufficient energy into the body to have the desired hydrostatic shock. This last factor has been much debated over the past century. Part of the problem in judging its effectiveness is the difference in construction of the projectiles and not knowing the contact velocity involved with many wounds. The results of studies I've read are all over the map on their conclusions. With regard to the 5.56 round, the Army concluded in an OIF report that 2500 fps was the minimum contact velocity needed to maximize the effect of the 5.56 round in use at the time. This would equate to 860 foot-pounds of contact energy. The standard muzzle velocity of the M4 carbine is about 2950 fps, which equates to 1198 foot-pounds. A long barrel 44 Magnum firing a Buffalo Bore 270 grain 44 Magnum round at 1450 fps will generate 1260 foot-pounds. So, yes, you can find handgun loads that supersede the 5.56 when fired from the 14.5" M4 barrel. However, when fired from a 20" barrel, the 62 grain bullet can develop 3150 fps, which is 1366 foot-pounds. These comparisons mean little because the rounds are designed to meet different performance criteria. One is a short range (100 yard) game load; the other is a short to medium range (500 meters) combat load.
September 11, 1999: Jerry Miculek fired six (6) rounds from a S&W 625 in .45acp, reloaded, and fired six (6) more rounds in 2.99 seconds.
we all saw the devastating consequences of such speed two short years later
In a strong revolver the 45 Colt is a much better cartridge than it gets credit for. With my reloads my Ruger Blackhawks can be quite a power house.
.45 Colt/.454 Casull and .45 Super/.460 Rowland really got robbed of their popularity by .44 Mag and 10mm....if only introduction times were a bit different.
My wife carries a 45 colt derringer.
Even in an S&W. They can handle the same 23,000 psi as revolvers chambered in.45 ACP.
Yep. The 10mm Auto thing is getting a little out of control imo, especially as regards "woods carry" or "dangerous animal defense" round.
44 SPL, 44 Mag and 45 Colt are all more suitable for that. On the "low end" you have cartridges that are very easy to shoot, from extremely easy to pack pistols, whilst still being more effective than 10mm.
On the "high end," you have things such as the 45 Colt, so-called "Redhawk-only-loads," which are as powerful as a the old 45-70 Government load delivered from the 1873 carbine. For God's sake lol.
All the while, most everyone seems obsessed with magazine capacity for the 10mm. Revolvers are simply a much more sound choice for woods/bush/country carry than an autoloader, not to mention modern polymer frame autoloaders.
Even if someone is bent on an autoloader with a large capacity magazine for "the bush," the 45 ACP is the elephant in the room: when did 45 ACP just get relegated to irrelevance in that context?
Anyway, as others have hit on in this thread, there are so many good options for people. Treating 10mm Auto like it's the only show in town is embarrassing.
@@LibertysetsquareJack I completely agree. This obsession with capacity is the admission you’re going to miss a lot. The first shots are the most important. Miss with those, and you probably won’t be alive to fire shots 7 and more.
A .44 Special/Magnum loaded with a 250-255 grain SWC or LBT LFN at 1050 fps is far superior to 10mm.
I don’t hate 10mm or higher capacity, but they’re not the only things.
Alec Baldwin tragically demonstrated the efficacy of .45LC. The round penetrated and killed one person and then lodged in a second person wounding him.
That's after it went through a plexiglass panel
Wonder what kind of round it was.
@@michaellavaughnrobinson probably a cowboy load , but still 250 grains has alot of momentum evem at 700 fps
@@44SWAGNUM-MAGA5**"Probably a cowboy load, but still, 250 grains has a lot of momentum even at 700 fps."**
Yep.
@LibertysetsquareJack I fired a 45 Colt cowboy round out of a Bond Arms derringer with a 3" barrel. It was a 200 grain hardcast rated at 705 fps...weak even among cowboy rounds...and it went through four layers of denim plus three news magazines. It also deformed enough to make me realize it would most likely do horrible damage to a human. So yes...the 45 Colt round is potent no matter how it's loaded.
I'm a huge fan of flat nose bullets.
Carried a 41 mag for many yrs as a deputy sheriff love the round
Strangley enough, I'm seeing more and more of that on the shelves lately.
Did you carry mild or wild loads?
@@anonymousf454 Remington 210 grain hollow points,round sanctioned by department. Shot competition with home cast 220 grain slugs hunted mule deer with both. Both worked well. I know the 44 mag is popular in Alaska I would not hesitate to carry a 41 there with either load.
220 slug was semi wad cutter case from wheel weights. I shot my N frame enough I had to send it back for repairs 2 times. Second time they could not repair so with a little haggling they replaced it with a new SS N frame which I still have. Bbl length .for job was 4 in whin I got the gun it had a 6 in bbl with it they had to put a 4 in on the gun and sent the 6 in with it when they returned it
S&W had fantastic customer service back then
Your videos are EXCELLENT. Thank you. Ruger made a GP100 in 44 Special, 3" barrel, 5 shot. I have almost left the store with one a few times...non fluted cylinder. Beautiful revolver. Some are still out there.
Thanks for the kind words. The Ruger would make an excellent self-defense revolver.
I believe Paul Harrell covered the 44 special as well. He didn’t give it a great review in the video, but he later left a pinned comment saying that after some time with the Ruger, that 44spl is now a part of his regular rotation of carry guns.
I got a gp100 5 inch 44 special from my brother in law and it's absolutely my favorite pistol. Wouldn't mind a 3 inch to go with it lol
@@emoryzakin2576Is that the blued with the half lug barrel? One of the sharpest wheel guns Ruger is offering right now.
@@jdoerr779it is. I didn't even know it existed till my brother in law picked one up, which I traded for
I carry a 44 special with a WFN 250 grain lead bullets. Its my bicycle and walking to the mailbox gun.
Excellent video there are of few of us Crusty ,Rusty folks that love .44 special and handloaded properly it can do any task with outstanding accuracy and very controllable. Hey thanks for mentioning it. >>> And a huge fan of Elmer Keith and John Taffin.
Makes me want to take another look at a 44 Special Night Guard I was ogling. Excellent presentation of the calibers. I have learned a lot. Thank you, sir!
It's hard to explain to younger shooters how a mystique grew around the .44 Special round in the '70's and early 80's. It was almost impossible to find revolvers chambered in the round. I thought I had died and gone to heaven when I found a pre-24 4th Model Hand Ejector target at a gun show. Mostly because of a gun writer named Skeeter Skelton, I've always loved the .44 Special and the Smiths that chamber it.
Great vid Dick. I totally understand the "sickness" lol There are just certain guns that I would instantly buy if I find them for a sane price.
Great video as always! I agree with your assessment on the 40s four special, especially Skeeter Skeletons, hot 44 special loads. A 44 with 240gr Lead flat nose, or hollow points semi wadcutters at 900 to 1000fps in a 44mag pistol (I only shoot those loads in 44 magnum rated guns). is about perfectly balanced. The recoil is manageable and it hits with plenty of authority!
Skeeter knew his stuff…
Thank you sir for this entire series of videos. It has certainly been an education sir.
Yes. Thanks again for this series. Way better than 95% of the content currently out there.
@ ~ 16:00 mark through c. 21:00
There actually is a very viable, concealable revolver for 45 Colt, as well as one in 45 ACP, both currently made by Charter Arms.
Charter calls the 45 (Long) Colt version the "Bulldog XL," and it's essentially identical to their 2.5" barreled 44 SPL Bulldog, but with a heavier top strap and cylinder. Iirc, it weighs about one (1) ounce more than the 2.5" 44 Bulldog. So five shot, DA/SA, swing out cylinder, overall length just a hair past 7" (and can be considerably shorter if the the "combat grips" are switched out for smaller stocks), shrouded ejector plunger, weighs ~ twenty one (21) ounces empty.
The other is the "Pitbull," in 45 ACP. Again, identical essentially to the 44 SPL Bulldog with 2.5" barrel, five shots, etc. Even more interestingly, the Pitbull does not need moon clips: it has a proprietary extractor that seats and ejects the rimless cases.
Charter Arms also chambers the Pitbull in both 40 S&W and 9mm Luger.
Finally, people may be interester to know that Charter did make a 41 Magnum Bulldog for several years. It's called the "41 Mag Pug." Production was short run, from like 2015 to only 2020 or so; but they are out there, if someone is inclined towards 41 Magnum and want a fully modern, practical, defense oriented 41 with concealed-carry in mind.
Great rundown on the Charter Arms revolvers. I hadn't followed their additions to their lineup.
@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb Sure thing.
@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb the Bulldog XL is a bit snappy with anything more than cowboy action loads but still manageable with defensive loads. I've had mine about 3 years & it's fairly accurate & a good action for a Charter. Last I checked still available. Taurus also made the model 450 5 shot 45colt snubby a few years back. I've only seen one & the owner wasn't interested in selling at twice what he paid for it.
My charter arms pit bull in 45acp is a great conceal carry option for me.
Dick I gotta say,
I have enjoyed your channel since its inception has much as anything on RUclips in a long time! Great job!! Thank you from an old FUDD like you😁.
FUDDs of a feather ... Thanks!
I bought the 3" 5 shot gp100 in 44spl. I use that around home in the summer with mix of snake shot and my cast bullets.
I carried my grandfather’s S&W 44 spl hand ejector when I started my career in LE, due to ammo shortage I switched to the S&W mdl 28.
I carry a ruger super redhawk Alaskan 44mag for edc its very concealable I love it
Used every caliber you mentioned and STILL Do. I used a 6" S&W Model 29 with rollers that could adjust front sights too. This with .44 Special I packed in a shoulder rig. Used a Model 58 .41 and Model 57 both 4". Today I still have a Model 58 a 4" Model 29 and a 629 2.6". Used a Colt 1873 .45 Colt and have carried one in black bear country hunting and tent camping in Colorado. ( bear had been spotted a week before at our camp area) It was comforting when making a head call in the middle of the night. I had a buddy in a small agency who carried a Model 57 all his career and with 210 grain police load and his own reloads ( his agency allowed that). He was an excellent shot too.
Thanks for the trip down Memory Lane. I carried a Model 629 during my rookie year with Houston PD, in Texas, March 1984 to March 1985. I became eligible to use an auto-loading duty pistol after that first year of service, and, backed down to a 9mm HK P7 for six months, in an old-school flap holster, locally custom-made to meet PD specs. One reason for 9mm was to let my hand heal! Then, I returned to big boredom, finishing out the Eighties, carrying an ex-San Antonio PD Model 58 .41 Magnum, in the duty holster, and during much of my personal time. The Model 58 was loose by 1990, starting to go out of time, when I transitioned to a Colt Stainless Commander, .45 ACP. The Nineties became my .45 ACP and .357 Magnum era, for duty and carry handguns.
1990 was also about time when I admitted to myself that I have K/L/GP100-sized hands, so I now use the “4” cartridges in single-action sixguns, for recreational purposes. The grips are smaller in volume, and, the reach to a single-action trigger is shorter. Non-magnum cartrdiges are now my friends.
I carried a P7M8 for most of my years in Wyoming. A pistol FAR ahead of its time.
"hand heal" Struck a bell with me! I decided a LONG time ago the 44 mag was a little too much for me. I stuck with the .357 mag and have not been disappointed. The muzzle flip on the .44 was really too much to control when you had other potential targets.
My favorite is the 625 s&w im a big guy so no problems concealing
Our local PD, during the LE Revolver Era, restricted the Officer to a .38 Spec +P+. They adopted that Policy at some point in the late 50s early 60s. I never heard if whether there was a specific incident that prompted the Policy change. Prior to that, there was a plethora of cartridges used. My Grandfather carriec a S&W Hand Ejector chambered in 32-20. He did use a Semi Jacketed Flat Tip Soft Point Amnunition.
Unfortunately, his revolver was pawned by my Drunken Uncle, and we didn't find out he had pawned it until much later.
I use 44spl. Stuff goes for $70 per box here, so I roll my own. 240gr flatnose
Why do you go with .44 Spl instead of .45 Colt?
That's one of the "problems" with 44 SPL, the relative rarity of the store-stocked ammo.
It's actually gotten better than it was like fifteen years ago though. The price is actually significantly cheaper now (when inflation is accounted for), and loadings such as the Hornady 165 grain FTX exist. When I got a Bulldog almost fifteen years ago, it was basically just the old school, 246 grain LRN in stores.
Anyway, so-called "Cowboy Ammo" is a good comprise option now for price and performance, if one doesn't want to handload or carry handloads for legality headache.
A box of 50 HSM "Cowboy" regularly goes for $48-$49 in Alaska nowadays, which is saying something, considering it isn't cheap to live here otherwise, not at all.
@@Kinetic.44 It's what was around for me at the time, and uses same bullets as my Vetterli rifles.
Freedom munitions has pretty cheap 44 special. It's always worked for me and it's like 32 bucks for 50.
@@michaellavaughnrobinson that's the stuff going for 70 here. I've never tried it, but had horrible .223 from them couple years ago. I've got about 500 casings left, so it'll be quite awhile, before in need.
The .45 S&W Schofield round works, but doesn't work well in the 1873 Colt. The Schofield round at the time had a larger rim and the chambers are so close in the SAA that there wasn't enough room. Soldiers forced to use .45 Schofield in their SAA revolvers could only load every other chamber, so they were limited to 3 rounds. But it's better than none when a Schofield armed soldier was issued .45 Colt ammunition!
That is why the Army eventually developed the .45 cartridge that would work in both revolvers.
Was hoping for your view of the .357 Sig. We carried them in our Sheriff's Office.
You'll want to check his video on *The Super 9s* from about a month ago.
@@cgsimons1187 Thanks, I guess I missed that one.. Found it..
What sheriifs office??
I like 44 specials in my S&W 629 3 inch barrel. Very accurate. Since I reload it is easy to test the different loads. I think charter arms also makes a revolver in 45 colt 3 inch barrel along with 44 special.
Why do you choose .44 Spl over .45 Colt? If i reloaded i would be all over .45 Colt and God forbid. 454 Casull.
A good book to read is Elmer Keith 's Six Gun. You can still buy it. Thats were I decided to give the 44 special a try. I'm happy that I did.
@@Kinetic.44 , The 45 lc can not be loaded like a 454 . The brass case can't handle it. Too much CUP pressure. When reloading you have to follow what is recommended in the reloading manual. But you can buy a 454 and shoot 45 lc in it.
Towning. Actually dick did use 45 colt brass in developing the 454. Even using duplex loads. Check out Ross seyfried’s articles on it. 45 colt brass especially federal, is just as strong as 44mag brass.
The story goes that back in the days when Elmer Keith was young, 45 Colt brass was not as strong, which is one of the reasons he worked so much with 44 SPL.
But yeah, that is definitely not an issue today, or for the last forty to fifty years for that matter.
Modern 45 Colt can be loaded up extremely hot, where the external and terminal ballistics actually pass up 44 Magnum considerably.
It takes certain pistols to be able to do that though, namely large frame Rugers.
44 SPL remains arguably more versatile overall because of the size and weight of pistol it can be chambered in whilst attaining maximum performance. Some would say it offers a better "power to weight" or efficiency ratio for a given size of pistol, namely small and medium frames.
Ah, the .41. I recall that the cartridge looked the same as the .45 Colt. Big and long and was fired from a "38 look" revolver. I was 9 or 10 years old when my (great) Uncle Claude taught me to shoot a pistol using that beast. He had an "interesting" sense of humor.
We went out in the field next to my grandmother's house (and behind her general store), he stuck a 1.5" or so stick in the ground, paced about 6 or 8 strides (he was tall and lanky, so maybe 7 or 8 yards) to where I stood. He described sight alignment, how to hold the gun, how to squeeze and not jerk the trigger... then he stood aside, and I was on my own. That gun was so heavy I could hardly hold it with both hands outstreached. I sighted it and squeezed and...
THE WORLD EXPLODED !
I found myself on the ground, on my back, with rhe gun laying next to me. No malfunction; it was just had that much of a kick!
I was also PISSED OFF, fuming, sputtering, cussing, and climbing to my feet... while Claude was bent over laughing so hard he was having trouble not pissing himself! All he could do between laughing and gasping for breath was to point at the stick. It was now half as long and splayed apart like an Indian War Bonnet.
That was my practical introduction to handguns. I could not have hit it again for flinching, but that intro may have been why I always prefered the 1911 .45 ACP and the .357 magnum in handguns. I always liked the .22 for plinking, since my first personally owned gun was a Remington single shot bolt action rifle (I forget the model). I also owned .32 ACP, .380 (9x17mm), 9mm Makarov (9x18mm), and 9mm Luger/Parabellum (9x19mm). Good calibers all, except that .32 is a HOT cartridge. I shot an old thick walled, short sized, glass Coca-Cola bottle with it, hitting it in the neck of the bottle just above where the neck met the 'shoulders". It WENT RIGHT THROUGH THE NECK, LEAVING THE SIDES ATTACHED ! That FMJ bullet was moving FAST to have done that!
For the last 20+ years my favorite handgun and the main one I would be carrying in a "serious" situation, is a .40 S&W IMI (yes, IMI and not the more recent IWI) Jericho 941, marketed in the US as the small frame "Desert Eagle" or the "Baby Eagle" and in Europe as the "Uzi Eagle". It is a totally different gun from the original .44 Mag / .357 Mag "Desert Eagle". That huge DE is more a hunting gun, while the Jericho 941 is a combat handgun evolution out of the CZ-75 and sharing a number of parts with the Italian Tanfoglio TZ-75, marketed in the USA by EAA as the 'Witness". I fire standard FMJ flat nose cartriges, and I have never failed to hit what I was aiming at. The only other gun I was that accurate with was of all things a Colt 1911 chambered in 9mm. First time I fired that gun I jumped soda can 6 times. It was such a sweet shooter, that it is one of about 5 or 6 guns I wish I'd never sold or traded.
Say what you will about the .40 S&W cartridge, I love it. Most of the ballistics of the 9mm and most of the energy of the .45 ACP. One reviewer mentioned it has the same ballistics as the 1800s .44-40. I never got around to looking that up, nut if a prominent gun reviewer puts such a claim in print in a popular gun magazine, then I have a feeling it is true. As such, I tend to respect those cowboys with rifle and handgun both chambered in .44-40 for all their needs. If I am going to trek around the back country, I will still take my .308/7.62x51 NATO rifle, thank you. Or maybe a 12 Ga shotgun alternating slugs an 00 Buck. Unfortunately the weight of either of those is a serious limitation on how much you can carry. Without military style resupply, you will not be able to carry enough for an extended period period of use... no matter how strong you are.
While in the Army, I bought a S&W 25 in 45 Colt, I still have it and really enjoy shooting it!
(I am glad to hear you state that the 45 "Long" Colt is incorrect).
I couldn't carry it as a deputy sherrif in the 1980s, so I bought and carried a S&W 686, still shoot it periodically. When I got on the SWAT team, we carried semi-auto pistols.
Revolvers should not be discounted as a defensive use firearm, just train wih it and select proper ammunition.
Very nice to hear your experience. That model 25 is sa nice one.
To be forewarned is to be forearmed. Yes, our Country is needs to tighten up. There are a lot of people who are well armed and very capable of defending ourselves but I pray things don't reach that point. Thanks for another good video.
I own and shoot a Rossi model 720 revolver, un- fluted cylinder, 3" in .44 special. I definitely agree with your assessment of this caliber! Thanks and good job!
Glad you liked it.
I’ve carried a S&W 629 three inch loaded with Hornady Critical Defense in .44 special. Heavy gun but it feels like a .22 when shooting it in that caliber. It kicks like a mule with magnums. I just got my hands on a 1973-74 Charter Arms “Bulldog” three inch revolver. I purchased it from a widowed elderly woman who was selling her deceased husband’s firearms for a very low price. To be honest. Her asking price was too low. So, I upped it $50.00. It was covered in grease and seems like it hasn’t left the safe since the seventies. It had very little wear and the blueing was in good condition. I was surprised at the quality of the revolver and how well it shot. Not Smith quality. But well made and very concealable. Thanks for the great content.
Charter arms makes 5 shot revolvers in
.38spl, .357mag, .44spl. .45 colt, 9mm, .40SW, and .45acp. The new ones are light weight, very sturdy and value based revolvers. I have a new production. Brushed stainless .44spl Bulldog Pug and it has nice G-10 grips on it. It's very nice looking.
Charter Arms is great. Very, very underrated manufacturer. They also make a 6-shot 357 called the "Professional," 25 ounces in weight and 4" barrel. Afaik, it's the only 6-shot 357 Magnum in that weight and size class in current production.
I've been reading about the "Fitz Special", which was typically built on the large frame Colt revolvers. Mr. Fitzgerald was said to always carry 2 of them with him in his pants pockets. Maybe with the right pants...
I looked for a 4" Smith 25 for years until I found a Redhawk 4.25" 45colt/45acp. Not a great carry revolver but awful nice for hunting. I wasn't impressed with the Smith 69 & wound up trading it for a GP100 44 that I've been quite happy with. I really don't care much for 44mag anymore but 45colt & 44 special will do anything I need them to. I do like my 4" Smith 41 as well, just wish ammo was easier to find.
Thanks for the rundown, some of us still like ole wheelguns.
I was shot point blank in the neck and paralyzed by a .44 special hollow point in 1983. It put me down. I was also shot in my upper thigh with a .44 special wad. cutter. The first three rounds fired at me completely missed me even though they were fired at less than an arm's length away.
My x-rays show I'm still full of bullet fragments.
I carry a firearm everywhere I go (legally) my weapon of choice to carry is a .44 special
My goodness that's an event. Happy you still here with us Ed. God Bless.
Always loved 44. Cal. Round ( have 2 s&w 29's and a Ruger super Blackhawk) bought in the 70's/early 80's. Love the Magnum but being 76y old backed off to the Special. Thank you for keeping the Revolver and especially the 44 cartridge alive.
Dick I would love to see a video on the .38s&w . Thank you for the great content .
That would be nice. I have some old shooters bibles that have those in it. Very interesting round.
Thank you Dick for an excellent breakdown of the “4’s”. Can you recommend any books with similar breakdown of American calibers. I’ve read all of Elmer Keith’s books
Thank you again for the informative videos
Elmer Keith's "Sixguns," in case you haven't read that one.
I've seen ballistic test on the 44 special and 45 Colt. They hit like freight trains. People forget that the 45 Colt was the most powerful hand gun for decades.
I have a S&W model 22 in .45 acp with a 4" barrel. I used to carry it when I was in bear country. I loaded it with .45 Super 255gr bullets before I got a 10mm. It was a chunk to pack but it was better than being a bear burger. It shoots great but it stays in the safe mostly now. When I do shoot it nowadays, it's mostly ball ammo. I just opened the safe and it's got Winchester PDX1's loaded in it now. Thanks for this video. I believe I'll run some rounds through it tomorrow. Hope y'all have a great evening.
Why get a 10mm instead of putting those .45 Supers in a semi auto?
I just never resprung one to do it.
I totally agree, specifically on the semi-wad cutter h p lead .44. I have had four Charter Arms .44s, two were 3” SS bulldogs. And accurate….jacketed not so much. Thanks
I have been carrying a .45 Colt for self defense/concealed carry for a couple of decades. Being willing to dress around the gun and practice can make it viable in almost any normal sized revolver.
Excellent. Thank you
Thank you for the presentation.
Great job!
I have a 1970's era bulldog. It quite light and small. Butt it's a hammer. I whacked a raccoon about a month ago in the backyard. I have federal swc hollow point. Good grief that was a mess. It didn't get back up.
I asked a question (letter when he was G&A Editor) to Elmer Keith back around 1970. His answer was 44 Special, 45 Colt, and 45 Auto …
Matteson, IL PD carried S&W Model 57 revolvers for several years in the revolver era.
Very detailed and concise.
Another great video. Thank you.
The closest I could get to that was I had a Colt Anaconda, and with defense loads, it was a love-hate relationship . I was definitely abused and battered, but I still loved her, lol. But that follow-up shot would be kind of tough.
The 325 Smith pistols are viable .45 acp carry options as well as the 3 inch (discontinued) 625 and 4inch Model 22s. Charter Arms puts out a 45 acp Pug. Over the years larger .45 acp revolvers have been modified for carry by shortening barrels. It should be mentioned that the .45 acp is roughly equivalent to that .44 special that you love. Loved your presentation. Revolvers rule. If it doesn't spin it isn't in.
Great content as usual!
Excellent video. Informative.
Excellent stuff. Thank you Mr. Fairburn.
Great and interesting info!
I have really enjoyed this entire series Mister! Thankyou!
Another very interesting article. Great job!
Dick, thank you for the interesting and informative video! I’m sad that it is the last of the series - because I’ve enjoyed them all!
Thinking about a series on fighting rifle calibers????
Do it! About the only thing I enjoyed in school was history and they didn't even talk about guns.@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb
Thanks for covering the .4x calibers, very interesting.
Just found this channel last week when I was looking up what side arm to take when I go out west in a couple months and we will be camping and enjoying those mountains. I settled on a Glock 20 and bought one and ordered some Xtreme penetrators along with 200 hardcast bc I fill this would be better than my hog leg 44 redhawk I got when I turned 16 by my dad. Watched every video since. Love this channel
Thanks!
I hope the bear is polite enough to wait while you clear your double-feed, stovepipe, nosedive, failure to feed, or magazine follower jam ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Let me tell you what you're going to do against a bear with 16 rounds of 10mm: You're either going to spray-fire all 16 shots and hit next to nothing, OR you're going to fire 5 or 6 well aimed shots, same as you would with a revolver... only you'll be shooting a boosted .40 instead of an honest magnum. You made the popular choice, not the right choice. Good luck, vaya con Dios, and happy trails, tactical dan. 😂
It depends on how accurate you are and if you can be accurate when SHTF with a bear. If you need just one shot, the .44 mag will be fine. Practice with the G20, it will be better for multiple targets and shots if needed.
PS: Bears are probably not the most dangerous animals in the woods, people and moose are higher IMO.
@Mrelindio42 You clearly don't shoot,
and you clearly didn't comprehend my comment. Let me help.
44mag revolvers hold 6 shots, not 1, and revolvers have been reliably slaying man and beast since the 19th century, both in war and on the frontier. Consistent, accurate fire is very doable with a revolver inside the narrow time constraints of a bear attack, and make no mistake, TIME is the single greatest limiting factor in most fights, NOT ammunition capacity.
You simply will not have TIME to accurately fire more than a handful of accurate shots before a bear is on you. You won't be taking cover, you won't be laying down suppressive fire, and you absolutely will not get to reload your weapon. You would be wise to maximize the effect of every bullet fired. If 10mm is truly your upper limit for recoil tolerance, then please carry it. However, choosing a 16 shot 10mm over a 6 shot 44 when you're probably only going to fire 6 shots anyway is a fashion choice, not a practical one.
How many bears have you killed? Ever had one charge you, tear a hole in your tent, start folowing you in the woods, become a camp pest, raid your food cooler?
I have been shooting revolvers/pistols for over 60 years as a LEO and hunter. I just don't prefer a single shot .44 mag in bear country over a G20. The 44 is a single shot because after the first shot the barrel is usually pointed at the sky. IMO the 44 mag is a great hunting round for close range for deer and elk. I have one in a Winchester Trapper model lever action and have also qualified with a 44 mag revolver years ago.
PS: I have never, and don't plan on ever, laying down suppresive fire with anything. No warning shots either!
The bottom line is, carry what you want! I prefer almost any rifle to any pistol for bear.@@ajm2872
I agree. Good job
The pitbull in 40S&W has a bit of recoil, but any experienced revolver shooter won't mind. The 45 acp version is on the list as a 2nd carry at bad breath distance. I'm inclined to think that that would alter someone's thought process about making you a victim.
I enjoyed your series on Self Defense rounds.
There’s an old S&W 58 that I’ve been eyeing. Like you said, I have no need for it, but it’s such a rare and beautiful piece of history that I’ve been trying to come up with an excuse to buy it! Lol
I understand! Maybe there really is no excuse if you really dig it! Might want to jump on that one:)
@@mitchsalawine5420 $700 is not a bad price ;)
All great calibers. I own a S&W model 24-3 lew Horton in 44 special, a model 57 6” and a model 25-5 6” 45 colt.
Legend has it that a cowboy in the old west sauntered into the general store and asked for a box of .45 Colt ammo. The shopkeeper slaps a box of the shorter schofield length .45 M1887 on the counter. The cowboy replies "No thanks! I"ll take the long colts". Of course referring to the longer .45 Colt. So although .45 long Colt is not a proper name. It was used to differentiate .45 M1887 (short) from .45 Colt (long).
More likely he was handed the 45 Colt Government which was a 45 Colt case but the length of the S&W so it could be used in the S&W Schofield revolver but it was a Colt round (i.e. a short Colt).
Your point on the .41 magnum police load ballistics is well taken. I shoot 210 grain RNFP’s at about 850 fps in local action matches. Still powerful, but very sweet shooting.
I actually find .45 ACP more interesting in a revolver than an auto. No bullet shape or COAL constraints.
They're absolutely practical for getting "the job" done, regardless of "the job" needed!!
I have an out of production Taurus 450 five shot .45 Colt with a 2" barrel. It is the same size as a K frame.
Hi from thermopolis , great video
Well done sir
Talk sometime about the 454 casuall... I carry the ruger super Red Hawk 2.75 inch in chest rig in alaska for critters 4 or 2 legs. With extreme hunter I'm probably only getting one good shot anyway 🤷 ....THX.
"Like being bit in the hand by a rattlesnake! Wayyyyy too much power!" is what i imagine based off his thoughts on .45 Colt and .44 Rem Mag...
Nicely done.... Carried both a 58 and 57 while in LE in the 1970s and 80s... The POLICE load from Remington clocked 930 fps and the Winchester 960.
You didn't mention the 10mm and .40 S&W that make ideal big bore 6-shot carry gun loads when used in the Ruger GP 100 Match Champion and 3" WC Special. I have both and it is just what Keith/Jordan/Skelton were looking for..
I enjoyed the heck out of this. Subbed immediately. Excuse me I gotta go watch the rest of the series. 🤠👍🏽
Thanks for the sub!
One revolver that I think is really neat is the Smith and Wesson 610. It can fire 10mm auto or .40S&W. Now of course you need moon clips (no problem, I'm a fan of moon clips anyway). But if I had one of these, I don't think I would be able to resist trying to make a "10mm Auto Rimmed" case from a cut down, resized and reamed .30-30 case....I'm SURE someone has done that SOMEWHERE. A real neat gun regardless, with 10mm auto you right in there at the low end of .41 Rem Mag power.
Thanks for a great video. I have had a Charter Arms Bulldog 44 Spcl on my CCW for a number of years. Can't shoot full power loads as it damages the gun. But great gun.
Love this series of videos. Very well done.
I have to say though, it was always my understanding that the .44 Russian was not a lengthened .44 American but a totally redesigned internally lubricated bullet. .
I do know the Russian can be fired in a .44 magnum which I routinely do
Afain, great job.
You're correct.
I was watching the vid again this evening and I caught that too, and wanted to see if anyone had posted, so I saw you're comment.
Fairburn was saying 44 S&W ("American") was the first consumer cartridge with an internally lubricated bullet, and the 44 Russian was lengthened. The 44 Russian was indeed lengthened in case, but the entire cartridge is also different: larger base diameter, larger rim diameter, and internally lubricated bullet, of smaller caliber (~ .429 for the Russian versus ~ .434 for American).
The story goes that it was actually at the behest of the Imperial Russian officer acting for procurement that S&W changed to the non-heeled (internally lubricated) design.
So yes, as you allude 44 Russian can to this day be chambered in various arms that will take the 44 SPL or 44 Magnum, because they are all in the same line of descent. The 44 American though is it's own thing.
@@LibertysetsquareJack What I was thinking. I had read or watched that history as well.
Would love to see the Model 58 you speak of👍
Thank you, Dick, for an excellent video and an outstanding series of videos, all of which are entirely factually and very well presented. With respect to this “4” video, I agree that revolvers chambering .41 magnum, .44 Spacial and magnum, and .45 ACP and Colt are generally too heavy and large for daily concealed carry. BUT (imho) a Smith 25/625 or a Ruger Redhawk, chambered in .45 Colt or ACP, is an entirely viable defensive firearm for many homeowners. Many individuals will, of course, question their comparatively limited capacity; however, I’d respectfully suggest six rounds is overwhelmingly likely to be more than adequate.
Especially for open belt carry, the "4s" are perfect for folks living in the country, and with a pancake or similar holster they conceal easily under a jacket or vest.
I carry a Charter Arms 44spl Bulldog & at times a Charter Arms Boomer , 44spl which is similar in size as a 642
At times I carry a Charter Arms in a 45acp .. smaller than a K frame and a Charter Arms in 40 S&W
I’d like to see a 6 shot 10mm revolver with a 3.5 inch barrel
Rossi 720 in 44spl is an small interesting little cat. Too bad its no longer available.
I carried a S&W 25-5 4” a good bit on a southern CA municipal PD. We had pretty flexible handgun policy so I always carried a .45 Colt or a .45 acp 1911. I would not change my choice of guns or calibers after 25 years of day to day experiences. I’ve seen about every caliber succeed or fail at one time or another. Now retired, I live in an area where feral dogs and wild hogs are encountered at times. I carry a 3” mdl 24-3 in .44 spl most frequently. CCI Blazer 200 gr jacketed hollow points work well in it though the aluminum cases can’t be reloaded.
I don't suppose you'd be willing to sell that Model 24?
@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb No. I got that from a Federal Officer and it’s become my favorite carry piece. It’s been slicked up with a smooth combat trigger in it. It’s sort of a compact version of my 4” 629 that I used to carry in Idaho on elk hunts.
@@srkwixdraw Round butt grip frame?
@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb Yes, very comfortable to shoot.
The Buffalo Bore, 45 AUTO RIM +P - 225 gr. Wadcutter @ 1,125 fps for use on 45ACP revolvers seems to me to be able to solve nearly every problem. And, It leave the option of using 45ACP 230gr ball (legit in it's own right as you have said) in a full moon clips which is quick to reloading and plenty available. S&W 325 TR is light enough to carry but still wide and 4" of barrel.
Thank you for your time and expertise in this series. I've thoroughly enjoyed it. Very well done.
Curiously enough, Charter Arms makes a Bulldog 5-shot revolver chambered for 45 Colt AND a "Pitbull" 5-shot 45 acp revolver that has no need for use of moon clips. At least, I think they still make them... I don't know how well they would hold up if shot a lot, but they're out there. I plan to buy one for myself if I ever run across one.
Thanks again for your hard work!
EDIT: is the cartridge you aren't sure about either the 9x18 Makarov or the 7.62 Tokarev? My brother swears by his CZ chambered for 9x18, but I can't imagine he shoots it much, since so little ammunition is available these days
Cnl.fritz modified the s&w cut the back to ejector rod, make cyl latch button smaller ,bob hammer ,cut trigger guard off front of trigger either hand gloved works then ,can be fired from inside a coat pocket , I've made a half a dozen.for people.
@17:02 Dick, just to add to the info, believe it or not the San Francisco Police Dept issued the .41 Magnum, as did the Amarillo Police Dept., who my father worked for before going to the Texas Highway Patrol. In fact, many of the APD officers continued to carry their m58's (and a few nice m57's) up until the mid to late 1990's, pretty sure the motors guys were the one that liked it the best. Makes sense, after all if you're on a bike and have to shoot into cars, it'd be hard for a 9mm or a .45 ACP to compete with a 175 gr Silvertip running (back then) about 1400 fps.
.41 Mag stainless Ruger Blackhawk...Don't leave home without it...
Back in the early 70s the head of the Arizona State Police, himself an Apache, was asked why they carried 41 magnum instead of 38 Special.
”Because 41 doesn't bounce of a hard skull."
So be it.
You are correct Sir, The streets are getting darker indeed….
Have carried a 1911 in .45 ACP for most of my life. BUT, my Charter .44 SPL loaded with swc’s is more concealable, lighter and, extremely powerful. In a true pure defensive use, unmatched, five rounds is sufficient - not dealing with zombie apocalypse in the real world, also very reliable. Gone back to it for daily carry, big bore wheel guns get the job done for non LEO’s.
GREAT VIDEO.BUFURD PUSSER CARRIED A 41 MAGNUM.
I also likethe swc lead flatnose 38 spl +p
There is also the British.455 Webley, but ammunition is a problem. Most were converted to .45 acp.
My only regret on the 41 mag is I did not buy a marlin 1894 lever in 41 when they were readily available. But Deputies with family’s did not have a lot of spare cash.
Henry has a couple of models chambered for the .41 Magnum.
@@lockloadwithdickfairburn-cr1jb really I hadn’t heard. Wonder how scarce they are. Today prices probably puts them around $1200.00 a shade more then the marlins In the 70’s
Works on all double action type frames
"Handguns are not powerful enough"
".44 Rem Mag is too much power"
JHP that fall within FBI penetration standards are avaliable for .44 Mag, like Winchester Platinumtip.
I dont understand this mentality, if you hit what your aiming at you shouldn't need such rapid follow-up shots and with such limited capacity in a revolver accuracy is more important than speed.
It's about the energy transfer. Monster magnums aside, no handgun cartridge delivers anywhere near the muzzle energy level of a centerfire rifle. Even when a pistol projectile strikes a critical organ such as the heart or brain, it may not impart enough damage to cause instantaneous collapse. A centerfire rifle projectile fired at close range produces enough energy to sufficiently damage the affected organ and surrounding tissue, including nervous system disruption. This will not always be the case, but the probability of it happening is much higher with the rifle than with the handgun.
@Paladin1873 Energy transfer entirely depends on bullet design and construction with any caliber of round. The Winchester Platinum Tip 44 Rem Mag round I already mentioned penetrates on the low end of the "12 -18" in ordnance gel and expands huge, transfering a ton of energy. There are all kinds of bullets, including compressed metal powders and prefragmented copper/brass monolithic, which are specifically designed for high energy transfer. Some of these can produce extremely high rifle velocity due to the lightweight materials. Handgun energy levels are generally par with that of a .223/5.56 carbine. I'm not even talking about +P+ "Ruger only."44 Mag loads or .454 Casual, which exceed intermediate rifle round energy levels. You don't need a monster X frame round to prove my point.
@@Kinetic.44 Self-defense, hunting, and combat rounds meet different criteria. We are not dealing in absolutes. We are dealing in probabilities. Projectile construction is only one factor. Its sectional density is also critical. Light-for-caliber projectiles are less likely to penetrate as deeply as heavy-for-caliber projectiles. They also bleed off velocity more rapidly. Other critical factors include the effect of barriers (clothing, hair, muscle, bone) on penetration, contact velocity, and bullet placement (wound path). A round that strikes bone, a vital organ, or severs a major artery or blood vessel will be more effective than one that does not. A round that fully penetrates and leaves a gaping exit wound can cause more rapid blood pressure drop. A round moving too fast may self-destruct or expand prematurely and not penetrate deeply enough to damage organs. A round moving too slowly may not expand, tumble, or break apart as designed, or it may impart insufficient energy into the body to have the desired hydrostatic shock. This last factor has been much debated over the past century. Part of the problem in judging its effectiveness is the difference in construction of the projectiles and not knowing the contact velocity involved with many wounds. The results of studies I've read are all over the map on their conclusions. With regard to the 5.56 round, the Army concluded in an OIF report that 2500 fps was the minimum contact velocity needed to maximize the effect of the 5.56 round in use at the time. This would equate to 860 foot-pounds of contact energy. The standard muzzle velocity of the M4 carbine is about 2950 fps, which equates to 1198 foot-pounds. A long barrel 44 Magnum firing a Buffalo Bore 270 grain 44 Magnum round at 1450 fps will generate 1260 foot-pounds. So, yes, you can find handgun loads that supersede the 5.56 when fired from the 14.5" M4 barrel. However, when fired from a 20" barrel, the 62 grain bullet can develop 3150 fps, which is 1366 foot-pounds. These comparisons mean little because the rounds are designed to meet different performance criteria. One is a short range (100 yard) game load; the other is a short to medium range (500 meters) combat load.
Check out Underwood 180 grain XTP 44 Magnum.
My edc is a S&W Thunder Ranch. 44spl.
Excellent choice.
Lots of us carried Smith & Wesson 25 revolvers in.45 Colt in Houston in the 1980s.
Were you carrying the 25-5 models with the 6 inch barrel or did you come across some 4 inchers?
All were 6 inch. I don’t think I ever saw a 4 inch Model 25 in the 1980s
@@thealsatian4232 I've also never see a 4 inch, but some S&W dealers were (and still are) able to get limited runs of uncataloged variations.
It is still the size of the holes you poke when it comes to pistols. Aside from shot placement of course.