AlphaSpook he’s the only puff player in the top 30, and one of only 2 in the top 50! There aren’t that many top level puff players compared to Fox, Marth, even Shiek or Falcon. Then again, Axe is the only Pikachu player in the top 100 and Amsa is the only Yoshi player in the top 100 and they’re both in the top 10, so maybe those characters need more experimentation too
Shadoninja I believe it was because every single one was a full hop. Fox is pretty notoriously hard to short hop with without practice so it somewhat signified he didn’t have all the tech down
By the way, Hbox's awful wavedash with fox has a simple reason: he wavedashes with tap jump, which is unusual on its own, but it works well enough with puff's 5 frame jump squat. This does not apply to fox with a 3 frame jump squat, which is why the wavedashes look very dodgy.
@@swimswum tap jump is pressing up on the stick to jump. It's slower to wavedash with because you first move your stick up and then diagonally down for the wavedash input, which is hard to do in 3 frames.
I'm a little let down that you didn't show the complete rise and fall of Armada's Young Link. He picked up Young Link to counter Jigglypuff, but then Hungrybox finally started beating his Young Link with Puff.
Was M2K allowed to just pick Sheik like that? I thought you have to declare your character first and then the stage. Please let me know how it actually works
Wow, those commentators don't know anything about Luigi, do they? Luigi's back air has a huge starting hitbox, his up smash is disjointed, his down air and starting nair are disjointed, his forward tilt is stupid long and down smash is also really scary for Puff if she tries to land. In other words, Luigi has incredible pressure in neutral and only loses the matchup because of his recovery.
Luigi loses the matchup and hard because Puff's back air is far more disjointed, and Luigi is sluggish in the air. It's far more than just his recovery.
Also, fox full hop is an amazing option and if you play to take advantage of it, it's obvious in your playstyle. For example, IBDW is known for using loads of full hop because it's a good option
@@kestrel7493 you completely missed the point. The point is that hbox NEVER full hopped. Full hopping is good but you have to short hop too. He plays puff who has the smallest full hop in the game
@@mitkru16 ???? and? doesn't matter how iCoNiC it is when he actually competitively uses sheik and mewtwo has always been for lower leveled players, most people who think of his secondary they think of his sheik because he actually uses it unironically and that has been known for a while
@@mitkru16 he actually tried counter picking a god of melee with young link because they went fox not he went young link to style on someone who is nowhere near top 100
@Comment Cop personally as someone who mains neither fox or marth, i do think that marth wins 60-40, so i disagree with hax. What i respect is that he believer in his character while most other foxes just complain
ChamplooMusashi he may have that title on his tombstone but he also has the title of most tournaments won of all time, and its not very close, and didnt come from farming easy tournaments constantly. Might be lame, but he does it because its sometimes smarter
It still shocks me to this day that Hax thought he could convince everyone with his Dark Triad shtick. So much of his argument hinged on 'He's a dark Triad he's evil I see his true intentions', which took away so much from his argument
imagine if in an alternate reality where hungrybox is hungryfox
Yes.
AlphaSpook he’s the only puff player in the top 30, and one of only 2 in the top 50! There aren’t that many top level puff players compared to Fox, Marth, even Shiek or Falcon. Then again, Axe is the only Pikachu player in the top 100 and Amsa is the only Yoshi player in the top 100 and they’re both in the top 10, so maybe those characters need more experimentation too
That’s just 20XX
mang0 would be the jigglypuff main
Weegee Plays 20FF
The fact that Mang0's reverse dolphin slash didn't hit Hax with the sweet spot still confuses and frustrates me to this day.
I wish mango won so badly
When does this happen?
NEVERMIND I SEE IT
Its insane dude
It always been like this with Mang0: mixed results
Every now and then I come back to look at Hungrybox's Fox
Those full hop bairs man... He's so dumb I love him.
i mean he did pretty well as genghis juan
Are those back airs dumb or just against the meta?
Shadoninja I believe it was because every single one was a full hop. Fox is pretty notoriously hard to short hop with without practice so it somewhat signified he didn’t have all the tech down
Hes not dumb, just inexperienced with Fox, lol
@Ryan Yeah, it's almost like he doesn't play the character regularly or something.
By the way, Hbox's awful wavedash with fox has a simple reason: he wavedashes with tap jump, which is unusual on its own, but it works well enough with puff's 5 frame jump squat. This does not apply to fox with a 3 frame jump squat, which is why the wavedashes look very dodgy.
Huh never considered that
What does tap jump mean? Why is it slow?
@@swimswum tap jump is pressing up on the stick to jump. It's slower to wavedash with because you first move your stick up and then diagonally down for the wavedash input, which is hard to do in 3 frames.
he WHAT?
He actually only tap jumps
I'm a little let down that you didn't show the complete rise and fall of Armada's Young Link. He picked up Young Link to counter Jigglypuff, but then Hungrybox finally started beating his Young Link with Puff.
I love how Swedish Delight and Hbox were laughing and talking the entire time they were playing
Probably a good friendship
But when Z*ck and L*ma talk to each other it's blasphemy
@@genesisfgc Zack and Lima were stalling deliberately as a joke and casually chatting at evo grand finals their not really comparable.
Anyone back here after the rise of Genghis Juan?
came to the comments to see this
no i just saw for whatever reason
Sometimes you just need to switch to a crappy secondary to appreciate how good your main character is
Kinda love hboxs ratchet ass fox, his decision making is so different from regular ones it makes it kind mesmerizing, cuz none of it is bad
Bad tech, but yeah honestly probably the only problem, his decision making was great
@@harpot678 mans just too used to Puff...
> Be hbox
> Play jigglypuff for 10+ years
> Pick fox against the best player in the world
> fullhop
Huh why does this match seem so familiar?
“You do need that edge guard”
Oh yeah
Roy's our boy
No
ROY'S OUR BOY!
Weeb Killer shut the freak off
did he just......?
WALK UP AND DOWN SMASH????
He did. He really did, though.
Slowly
That Luigi at the end made the whole video.
luigi needs to get to a higher tier
His peach Marth and falcon need a bit more favor in the matchup lol.
Though very good and fun character
Was M2K allowed to just pick Sheik like that? I thought you have to declare your character first and then the stage. Please let me know how it actually works
You pick the stage then the winner of the match picks their character then the loser picks their character
You just have fun
Hfox just looks like my 2 month practice fox
Except he can face Armada at EVO...
23:04 that last stock made me mad, and I remember watching this live.
Ikr that was so bullshit
i guess this is where Mang0 learned fox-marth on FD is 60-40
shout out to summit 11
I had to view 5:45 over again, beautiful.
i can't believe axe played falcon
This thumbnail looks totally fine
Dang that was S I C K
5:45
Sheik2Joints
When I play video games, and every 1000 points... I sheik2joints
Smoke2Sheiks
I live for mango secondaries (and mains lol)
2:15 Fun fact, Danes ruled over England for about 50 years. So a Swede doing it isn't as unlikely as you might think.
Wow, those commentators don't know anything about Luigi, do they? Luigi's back air has a huge starting hitbox, his up smash is disjointed, his down air and starting nair are disjointed, his forward tilt is stupid long and down smash is also really scary for Puff if she tries to land. In other words, Luigi has incredible pressure in neutral and only loses the matchup because of his recovery.
I mean can you really blame them for not knowing the intricacies of a very niche MU, they didnt act like they knew what was happening
Luigi loses the matchup and hard because Puff's back air is far more disjointed, and Luigi is sluggish in the air.
It's far more than just his recovery.
Them full hops from Hfox tho haha
why cut the beat of mango with hax$
hungrybox plays fox?
Why did hbox play fox?
It looks like Hbox can’t short hop? Is short hopping not a thing if you’re puff?
Different frames, i think fox needs 3, puff 5
It’s easier to short hop on puff, they have different jump squat frames. Hbox also uses tap jump to short hop and wave dash
Hbox uses tap jump I cant imagine short hopping with tap jump
Also, fox full hop is an amazing option and if you play to take advantage of it, it's obvious in your playstyle. For example, IBDW is known for using loads of full hop because it's a good option
@@kestrel7493 you completely missed the point. The point is that hbox NEVER full hopped. Full hopping is good but you have to short hop too. He plays puff who has the smallest full hop in the game
and the rise again
Lol hbox fox look so busted
The best game ever.
Nice
What about Leffen's Mewtwo
not his sheik?
@@ColemakDH Not nearly as iconic as his Mewtwo
@@mitkru16 ???? and? doesn't matter how iCoNiC it is when he actually competitively uses sheik and mewtwo has always been for lower leveled players, most people who think of his secondary they think of his sheik because he actually uses it unironically and that has been known for a while
@@ColemakDH That's why the first clip is of Armada with Young Link
@@mitkru16 he actually tried counter picking a god of melee with young link because they went fox not he went young link to style on someone who is nowhere near top 100
15:21
Hbox may have the ugliest high level fox ever XD
Geez dude Taj's commentary on the axe set was SO ANNOYING OH MY GOODNESS LOL
How so I thinks it’s kinda hype
Really wish Hax lost, probably my least favorite player of all time
Did you forget that Army and Nintendude exist?
He's not a bad person or anything
why do u not like him? hes one of the only foxes that wholeheartedly believes in his character and doesnt think marth wins 6-4 or anything like that
@Comment Cop personally as someone who mains neither fox or marth, i do think that marth wins 60-40, so i disagree with hax. What i respect is that he believer in his character while most other foxes just complain
Bro you spelled Leffen wrong
someone needs to put lamest player of all time on m2ks tombstone
ChamplooMusashi he may have that title on his tombstone but he also has the title of most tournaments won of all time, and its not very close, and didnt come from farming easy tournaments constantly. Might be lame, but he does it because its sometimes smarter
Play lame, win game
I think you didn't see smash con 2018 grands
That's just how you win
Why do people hate what it takes to win
You need Jesus
?
Pearsrs do you have a question about Jesus?
@@fooladoo1076 Not really, just wondering why you commented that
Pearsrs I don’t see why not lol
@@fooladoo1076 don't force religion upon people
Mango was imitating a dark Triade and using dark tactics to make hax uncomfortable
It still shocks me to this day that Hax thought he could convince everyone with his Dark Triad shtick. So much of his argument hinged on 'He's a dark Triad he's evil I see his true intentions', which took away so much from his argument
@@harpot678 like 300 people on twitter believe it and will raid your dms if you say anything negative about hax it's wild