BED SCENE Analysis (Why NO KISS?)
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- #LeagueOfLegends #PiltoversFinest
Vi and Caitlyn’s romance has drawn so much love from LGBT fans, and yet some feel the relationship could have progressed faster. While Jayce and Mel’s heterosexual relationship got a big dramatic love scene, Vi and Caitlyn got an extremely intimade bed scene, but one with minimal physical contact and affection. But looking at Vi and Cait’s character, the progression of their relationship arc, and (most importantly) the function of their relationship, this type of intimacy scene empty of all noise and grand displays of drama carries special meaning a kiss may have detracted from.
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that cheek-brush-hand-grab was WAY more intimate than a kiss imo and that's why i love the way the writers have developed their relationship.
edit: and i just got to the part where you basically say that lol perfect analysis as always!
Exactly. I feel like there's not enough of characters just being intimate with each other in media. Just simple fluff moments to show they care, which is exactly what the bed scene does. Kisses are always big, passionate, moments and I feel like just brushing someone's cheek shows more than a kiss does.
Yep, my thoughts exactly.
Basically, there are more intimate ways nowdays than a kiss to show attraction or care for someone at the beginning. In fact, i would say kissing is about being passionately connected but a caress is so intimate that it means you genuinely care about someone as it's meaning is one and one only.
@@khalidtanouti8848 great point!! totally agree
@@khalidtanouti8848 👍👌 yes
As a lesbian myself I’m actually glad we didn’t get a kiss. I would much rather see vi and Caitlyn’s relationship grow than a kiss or two. I personally like the slow burn. Because they are both very emotionally closed of people it wouldn’t make much sense if that kissed.
Very true... you're cool... the issue today is that it is given for granted... without contextualizing the situation.
Honestly, it also could implicate a lot of other problems and situations, plus the emotional burden was already high.
I guess they could have a bang but not develop a relationship that happens often, but it also could be Cat is not yet ready, and Vi senses or she doesn't yet like Vi.
It will be explored in the future. We just need the chromosphere.
I agree... also, lesbian crushes last for years. 😆 short dating period, long crush. This feels right to me haha
exactly, I'm also a lesbian, and it just makes me happy to see a healthy wlw relationship in media. They always seem to be toxic or move extremely quickly. I think the bed scene is so much better without a kiss. And I'm a sucker for slow burns lol.
One of best romances I've read was a short yuri chapter: about a single mother who slept with a woman she met at a bar, who notes that she avoided kissing, and the next day the mother takes her daughter to kindergarten to find that woman is her daughter's new teacher!
It's mostly written as a comedy, but I love how the mother is willing to do favours for her new sex partner, but always avoids a kiss. Love and sex are not the same thing: to her a kiss is a sign of intimacy and indirectly agreeing to a relationship, which she doesn't want to prioritise over being a mother and father to her daughter, which she's been doing for so long while being closed off from the outside world. The partner proclaims she two will be a mother and father to the daughter (she's obviously more than qualified to do it) AND a girlfriend to the mother, and they kiss off-panel. I had to re-read that last part, because I forgot if they kissed at all because of how well written their relationship was. I'm not that knowledgeable about the LGBTQ+ community, but these series at least write them with much more depth.
@@autumntea1931 yup that’s what real representation looks like and people should be taking notes
their romance and connection is done so well that I didnt even realize until now that they didnt kiss. They're just so obviously gay for each other that my mind didnt need a kiss to "confirm" it
We can definitely understand that they're falling in love without needing to see them kiss right away--Fortiche even punched up what was in the scripts to make it super obvious--so I'm fine with Vi and Cait not kissing yet in S1 (as long as the writers weren't trying to imply that we missed their first kiss offscreen in ep 8). I'm quite happy to wait for it, but I would definitely like to see it when the time is right, for the sake of squeeing about it because I'm a hopeless romantic who adores the characters.
@@brennakingsbury9657 yey,agreed💕
In my mind, Jinx calling them girlfriends was enough confirmation
I don't really understand why anyone would need them to kiss. Their chemistry, their connection despite (And sort of because) of all their differences is so strong. These two very untrusting characters are learning to trust eachother. Their scenes come across as far much more emotionally grounded, far more romantic than Jayce and Mel's.
Jayce and Mel seem to represent lust, and a lust for power. Vi and Cait's is so much more... pure. There's no real ulterior motive to them opening up to one another.
@@SanguinaryBlade I mean, I didn't need them to kiss in that scene because the emotional tone didn't feel right for it and I prefer fictional relationships that take some time to happen, but there's nothing wrong with wanting to see two characters you adore and relate to share their first kiss in a general sense when the time is right. It's just part of enjoying romance for a lot of people, and neither character has been presented as ace, so there's nothing wrong with wanting to see that happen between them at some point. It's not the only way to express romantic feelings, which is part of the point of the scene we got, but it's still generally a happy and exciting moment to see characters act on their feelings with a kiss.
Because Vi was mourning the loss of her sister? Why would Cait kiss her then and make everything about her? They weren’t a couple then. So kissing Vi wouldn’t exactly be comforting her. They would have to change the topic to what the kiss meant to them. I don’t know why people think that particular moment would have been appropriate at all for a kiss. VI needed consoling and some comfort. So Cait told her what happened to Jinx wasn’t her fault. Then when Vi kept beating herself up about Jinx she consoled her again by caressing her. There’s no reason to think they would start kissing or having sex then.
I could not agree with this more. Sharing their first kiss when Vi was grieving for her sister, both in the sense of not being being sure if she was alive or dead, and in the sense of realizing she may never be able to reach her even if she's alive, feels emotionally inappropriate to me. Even if Vi wanted it, I think Cait would be wiser than that.
To me, it was a calm, quiet, contemplative scene that showed why they're perfect for each other, hence the yin yang symbolism. The fact that Caitlyn so instinctively gave Vi the comfort and support she needed with that gentle touch meant the world to Vi, and for me, that is the moment where she fell in love with Cait in earnest, but I don't think it means either of them tried to initiate a makeout session after we left the scene. The writers didn't intend it as shorthand for "We hid their first kiss offscreen, and then Vi dumped Caitlyn a few hours later. The drama!" I would find that to be queerbaiting nonsense, or at least queerbaiting adjacent. They will kiss onscreen next season, and this scene was one of the emotional building blocks to get us there, IMO.
@@mariarzyt_3D To be fair, "forced and unrealistic" is subjective. Plenty of women who love women think they've moved Vi and Cait's relationship too slowly based on their own personal experience. Not everyone takes things slow! Personally, I don't feel that way because I think Vi and Cait are in very specific and unique circumstances--they didn't meet at a party and recognize each other as potential romantic partners and start hanging out for that reason. They're partnered up for reasons that have nothing to do with romance, so starting a new relationship is not their top priority, though they are obviously falling in love in spite of themselves. I love a slow burn and find it more emotionally satisfying when I have to spend some time getting to know the characters and longing for them to be together, so I have the patience to wait, but I also understand why some feel that things should have moved faster. I don't agree, but I get it.
100% agree with you ... this was a quiet contemplative moment of tenderness between them, which showed that they were starting to have feelings for each other on a deeper level, and respect and understanding too - In my opinion this does so much more to establish their bond, and will make any future kiss at a more appropriate time feel so much more meaningful.
Agreed!
Totally agree
I'm almost 30 and this pairing makes my heart race like I'm a teenager discovering fan fiction for the first time while secretly using the family WiFi at 12am in the morning
Damn that's true 😅💓
Could not have phrased it any better
haha same at 36
Yeah!!
as a teenager who is doing that to continue the rush of this ship: please stop calling me out
For Jayce and Mel, that kiss only happened after around 6 years of being around each other. For Caitlyn and Vi, how long have they spent together? 2 days? Maybe 3? Personally I do feel a kiss would have been too hasty, but their development with each other is so good, and I love it. With them just getting more comfortable with one another, to Vi actually being able to open up about her feelings. Honestly, that to me is far more intimate than just a kiss.
Ya people need to chill. I'm glad they didn't rush it, but they showed more than with the show and not tell aspects of it. Also like you said, Jayce and Mel had way more time together.
Not only that, it happens AFTER Jayce becomes her social Equal. She has elevated Jayce to the position of Councilor - and I would not be surprised if part of the reason she did so was because she wanted to have sex with him but her own (or perhaps the Piltover) moral code makes sex between classes taboo.
(That's something which is NOT supported by any kind of canon, it's just a thought that occurred to me when watching the show - Jayce is fekkin' HOT, she was obviously interested in him right from the beginning (couched in terms of his research being what she was interested in, but... well, this is my head canon, blah), but it wasn't until he became her social equal that she would allow herself, or society would allow her, to be intimate with him.)
Not to mention they are in completely different situations, Jayce and Mel aren’t chasing criminals round the undercity.
On top of that, Jayce is very emotionally open and Mel is about average on that scale, whereas Cait and Vi are emotionally closed off.
Yeah people miss the fact that they knew each other during the time skipped. And also Mel’s intentions were different initially.
Something else that I noticed immediately while watching for the first time was that they’re in a Yin and Yang kind of position. They are opposites but they come together and complete one another or at least work hand in hand. I think that it’s quite beautiful, even if it might not be intended the way I thought it was.
I definitely think it was intended exactly that way. 🙂 Maybe also to be comforting and suggest a positive outcome in the end, since things actually went downhill after this.
Yup that's what I was thinking too - it also symbolises a culmination of their arc in that despite them being from different worlds and being entirely different people, there's still a spark of connection and familiarity within each of them
Haha 69
Short version’s probably going to be “they’re comfortable with each other, but Vi is never going to see herself as good enough for Caitlyn since they’re from opposite ends of the city.” And also it just wasn’t time. They knew each other for like 2 days max. Where Jayce and Mel knew each other for a couple years.
eh I dont think Vi thinks less of herself bc of her being from the under-city. I think the reason why Vi is so hesitant about her relationship with caitlyn isnt because she is ashamed of being from the undercity, or because she thinks she isnt worthy, but rather she feels like people from the undercity and overcity are fundamentally different from each other, and that the damage and conflict between the two cities is so severe that it will permeate even interpersonal relationships between the people of these cities, and thus a relationship between an overcity and undercity person will be filled with nothing but conflict and turmoil
@@botanicalitus4194 Yep.
Yep it’s too soon and also we have to remember that they’re actually pretty exhausted, wounded and knees deep in a clusterfuck of a situation. Maybe they hugged, cuddled and talked, but kissed is pretty unlikely (some believe they even had sex???)
@@botanicalitus4194 yep
I don't think so, vi has never seen herself as lower than the topsiders she doesn't have that type of superiority complex so it would be unlikely that that is the reason. Maybe it because Riot was too hesitant to show any physical lgbt affection that crosses the boundaries between cute and sexual
what i love about this relationship is that they didn’t even *need* a kiss. you could tell by everything else, all their gestures and words that they already had feelings for each other. the golden kiss rule is, if you need two characters to kiss for the audience to know that they love each other, it’s not a well written relationship - and they are written so well that they didn’t kiss and still everyone is able to see how they feel. kudos to arcane writers for creating an incredible ship!
in my experience, younger LGBT+ people tend to demand a "proof" from the media they consume. such as, a kiss or a verbal confirmation that said character\s are queer. I understand that theyre coming from a place of hurt (years of queerbaiting and companies not willing to commit) but personally, i dislike romances that start and end with a kiss. the feelings are clearly there, and im here for a slow(ish) burn story. lesbians don't have a lot of those in popular media, let alone animation.
great point, but I wish they would take that advice for every straight romance in fiction. kisses and sex scenes are almost mandatory if you want to film a movie/show. but if there's a queer romance, they always "choose good writing because it works best for their characters to not show physically intimacy"
@@coreyholt8522 I get your point, but I think it makes sense, because most gay people often need time to open up about being gay, so they would probably need time with intimacy aswell. While a lot of straight characters who go towards intimacy quite fast are very outgoing. Take Mel as an example.
Completely agree. Especially with wlw stereotypes, it's nice to see a slow burn
Great point!
Yeah I see people getting mad and saying Arcane is just queerbaiting, but you can tell they're being very explicit with it and just setting the foundation for their relationship.
I think most are fine with having no kiss or big gesture as long as you can tell the clear intentions with the relationship and that the creators aren't holding themselves back. What frustrates most is when the creators will hint around the relationships but not explicitly confirm it to please everyone, or straight up add hints they have no interest in actually following up on. It doesn't have to be confirmed with a kiss but it should be explicit enough that the average straight viewer catches onto it too, like Arcane!
I am a straight male. The Vi/Cait romance is the greatest I have ever seen put to screen. I have never felt it more. I have never been invested in any romance quite like this. I am also a dude that goes out of my way to never get close to anyone physically. To the point where it's really weird when anything along those lines happens......it means more. Granted I have a very bizarre view of myself, I think.
Caitvi is so powerful they created male fujoshis
Small thought, but they're first major cooperation scene is set in a brothel, where the importance of kissing/sex is negligent. Meaningless. Vi is comfortable there, comfortable with the idea of meaningless intimacy.
Conversely, the face touch is an action of meaningful intimacy, and probs not something Vi has gotten a lot both in the timeskip and before. So it could be more meaningful for Vi than a kiss.
Reverse everything for the Jayce sex scene.
Something else I want to add, that's more tied to general LGBTQ+ theme, but hands are very important motifs in sapphic literature! Personally, as someone who is sapphic myself, seeing little touches and hand holding made it feel way more intimate that a kiss would have. It's not as grand a gesture as a kiss, but our hands are what allow us to interact with the world, and for queer fems especially it has so many real life and metaphorical meanings.
'The Queer Erotics of Hand Holding in Literature' (very interesting read, do check it out) talked about hand holding in wlw relationships in literature, specifically because of the book The Price of Salt, and there's an interesting quote that I really like: "Hands are used to mark instances of scarcity and plenty. They’re always reaching out; to touch something, anything, to embrace another person so they know they aren’t alone. Touch in these instances moors the characters in space and time."
Of course I would love a kiss too, the two are not mutually exclusive, but hands will always hold a special place in my heart.
Right? A kiss is okay. But the focus of hands and touch are the Big Deal in queer fiction and relationships. I didn't know anything about LoL when I first watched Arcane and my *ding* light bulb moment for these two (aside from the "man or woman" scene of course) was the moment when Caitlyn was cradling Vi's face during the Shimmer scene and the little thumb brush. Then I was like, OH That's where this is going. My sapphic alarms were going off before but that was *chef's kiss*.
The short version here is: love is not about kissing nor big displays NOR sex. Love is about CONNECTION and INTIMACY and showing VULNERABILITY. And that was the focus of the scene. That gesture was filled with emotion and Vi's was being vulnerable for the first time in a very long time. That's what she needed, connection and understanding. Not lust or desire or sex.
This is a very real portray of Love, unlike the distorted stuff we're used to be fed by Holywood blockbusters.
To me, the shape Vi and Cait make with their bodies when talking on the bed feels like a deliberate reference to Revolutionary Girl Utena.
RGU was (in part) about two women living very different lives slowly falling in love, but it was on Japanese TV in the 90's so the creators had to be very careful about how they went about portraying that love. The leads weren't allowed to kiss or hold hands or anything, but at night they would lie down on a giant S-shaped bed (with their heads facing each other but their bodies curving away in different directions) and talk. This was a moment where they both allowed themselves to drop the roles they had to play in public and be a bit more honest. Even though their heads were close together, their bodies went different ways bc they still weren't on the same page and were coming from very different places.
Arcane is soooooo well written bc they absolutely are referencing not only the scenes where this happened but also all of the symbolism, while adding *still more layers* in the context of the story. An absolute masterclass of writing.
It’s ridiculous masterclass because the whole theme of arcane is duality. We’re introduced to the yin/yang imagery with the opening shot of the steampunk vinyl disc, which is reinforced a couple times until we get to the bed scene, which I think is the culmination. AND THEN that particular moment doubles as a secondary reference to RGU too?? I’m feral
As a bisexual woman when I first saw Vi and Cait together in bed scene I was so happy that finally someone didn't define same-sex relationship with sexual attraction alone.
Unfortunately viewers including the lgbt community recently always expect direct confirmation of a specific couple in the form of a declaration of love or sex/kiss even though it may simply destroy the story.
I understand that this is extremely important for many people but personally I am tired of such objectification of feelings towards another person. Love made of kisses alone is not love.
When you started telling at the end of this video that Cait and Vi's relationship in Arcane is mainly about their bond and that bond in their story is the most important I felt a warmth in my heart. I love your channel for such moments. And yes bonding is what binds people together and I can't wait to see Violyn grows in Season 2.
Yea but cat is more of a replacement for powder then a romantic partner.
People are inferring romance into a intimate sisterly relationship.
The show is even color coded if we are too dumb to get it.
Cat and powder are coded blue
When they are on the bed vi only talks about her sister and how it feels similiar w cat?!
If you want to have sex you don’t spend time talking about your sister.
Vi also got to teach cat some things that she didn’t get to teach her sister. How to use being an attractive woman to get info. Jinx doesn’t have this ability so she pounces and intimidates people.
I don’t think jinx sitting on Silco is sexual. She does it out of fear of abandonment. You if on top of someone they can’t leave you. She does it to the bartender boy. It’s an act of control not sexual
*cough* ahem, Its Violet. I just had to correct that since it was bothering me. Sorry, I mean no offense.
But everything you said was beautiful. I also agree on that love doesn't have to be all about physical intimacy or declarations of love. There is literally a whole thing about "Your own love language" and how people each have their own way of conveying their love. My love language is gift giving and physical touching and words. Though for me spending time with someone you love even though no words are spoken and just the silence and comfort you have of each others presence is enough for me. Its a bit boring to some but I am hoping to have a partner or a lover who can enjoy intimate moments like that with me.
@@ChessheromusicCait and Vi as a couple are canon in the game. In this case it's very forced to define their relationship as sisterhood.
Cait isn't Vi's second sister, and she never will be. The sisters don't tell themselves they're sexy, don't look at their lips looking for a kiss and they don't stroke each other's cheek.
However, I will agree that Cait is a kind of substitution for Vi's feelings for Powder. It's her the need for affection, understanding and closeness that she had until she was imprisoned with her younger sister.
Since Vi later lost it all when Jinx showed up, Vi found the perfect person from whom she got everything she needed with a bonus romantic relationship.
And I don't think we watched the same video because schnee said several times that Vi and Cait's relationship is not about sex and kissing, but about this connection and the bond between them. You don't have to see two naked people making love to find out that they are actually sexually attracted to each other. Sometimes subtle glances and gestures, as in Arcane, are enough to make everything obvious. Love is not just sex.
@@Ferytowa I don’t know anything about the game. From my experience it’s not written as well and characters are not layered nearly as deep either.
It may very well be canon in the game.
I was only speaking about the beats and themes of the show .everything vi does towards cat is something she wanted to do with her sister. When they are alone vi talks only about her sister.
The scene in the brothel is the best example.
Vi teaches cat to use her sexuality to people to open up. She directly shows her to be confident and aggressive. It’s very much something she wanted to teach powder as jinx does not have this subtlety at all. Vi even pairs cat with a man, as it about the lesson. Cat is stumbling over herself but she’s trying.
Later, vi comes back to see cat is doing great. Vi look was a look of approval that cat was listening to someone spilling their guts as cat has them in the palm of her hand.
This story is very similar to a tale of two cities”. It’s opposites driving each other.
Maybe the story will go that way in season.
It’s just not what the story is trying to say at this moment.
And
Vi very much is intimate with powder. Looking into her eyes, pushing her hair out her face
@@jinx.love.you. actually Varus is cannonically gay. Two gay lovers merged with a Darkin.
Honestly, I’m happy that there wasn’t a kiss in S1. Their relationship is building such a fantastic foundation to build upon for S2. I would’ve been disappointed if it was all undercut by going straight to “u-hauling lesbians”. They’ve known each other for three days.
Great video!
Slow burns are my favorite kind of romances. And I was happy they didn't kiss. The soft touch and intense eyes of Cait was more emotionally powerful to me then the purely physical sex scene between Mel and Jayce.
As a big ol' lesbian myself, I could not have said it better than your final conclusion. Focusing on the intimate, not-so-sexual aspects of their burgeoning relationship is even more powerful (at least to me) queer rep than having them kiss. It is clear how both Cait and Vi feel in that moment, but we don't need to push that boundary in that specific moment.
Plus, when compared to Jayce and Mel's relationship, CaitVi seems to be WAY more integral to the plot moving forward, so it's not surprising that the writers would want to weave it into a longer tale with more developed arcs than Jayce and Mel.
This + the fact of how long both pairs have known each other. We are comparing years to days here so it made sense.
When you said it shows the "love" side of queer relations and not the "sexual" side it made complete sense plus it almost made me cry. Now I love arcane even more. Such deep validating authentic representation
My take on it is that they both have trust issues on a certain level.
Vi is the more obvious one: growing up in the Undercity, being a leader figure since early childhood made her think that vulnerability is a weakness - she only shares hers to Powder, when she needs to learn that it's natural to make mistakes. And possibly the more important aspect of this is that Cait is an enforcer and Vi has an image of the oppressive and cruel enforces carved into her brain since she lost her parents and validated for years.
So in short, Vi is still testing Cait if she really is different.
Cait on the other hand is frustrated with people patronising her and despite being obvious about her desire of independence - everyone close to her (Jaice, her parents) seem to try to contain her in a way. Vi is different, so that explains why she is so attracted to her after she is tested as trustworthy. Still, Cait might take things slow to ensure she isn't limited by the relationship, especially since Vi has a charismatic and strong personality.
Also, from a narrative point of view their romantic feelings being slightly ambitious helps the "oil and water" scene, because we anticipate the development of those feelings and are more heart-broken after Cait being "rejected" by Vi
Caitlyn, Cait. Also Jayce.
@@TykoBrian7 ok, fixed it now. Thanks for the tip
I think one thing that caitlyn probably likes so much or finds so enduring about Vi, is that Vi doesn't really have that same "I have to protect you" feeling that everyone else forces over her. Vi is like aight ima do my thing, you better follow along, I'm not gonna slow down just for you. Only after they start having some sort of feelings for each other does vi become any sort of protective, and it's never in a helicopter sort of way. To me, vi likes that Cait tries to keep up with her and would never tell her to stop just because it's dangerous.
The relationship felt perfect. It felt completely natural and normal, like it should. It’s loving, and progressing, despite one of them (Vi) being a complete disaster emotionally. She’s basically in denial and mourning her sister, while discovering that she CAN be loved, even by someone who should have no business loving her. I think the writers got it exactly right… and despite the rest of the series being trauma after trauma I still hold hope for them.
“They finally choose each other” GOD JUST RIP MY HEART OUT. Caitvi is keeping me going
We are so used to kisses being the confirmation that this subtlety was very refreshing. Their looks, their actions, and their gestures show the love that has started to grow.
"...this subtlety was very refreshing."
YES I sooo agree, I want mor lovestory's of all kinds that are written like that. It is so much better and more valuable than the usual shit.
Yeah I dislike shows that need a kiss to confirm a relationship, because if that is necessary, than your writing isnt good.
ruclips.net/video/sMbch47oz2c/видео.html&ab_channel=OverlySarcasticProductions
It's actually one of the best romantic stories in modern media. Two fantastically strong women that have built walls around themselves because of the world they live in, cautiously inching out on the ice together, slowly chipping away a space in those walls to find each other.
The cheek touch was frankly one of the greatest romantic triumphs in recent storytelling memory. Vi is invulnerable, impenetrable, and untouchable. Cait is constantly in control of herself and reserved.. and she allowed herself to touch Vi.. and Vi allowed someone to show her affection, and actually responded in kind by grasping Cait's hand.. They both let themselves be vulnerable for that brief moment, and it was exceptionally beautiful.
I'm not a member of that group, but if I were, I'd be thrilled with this emotionally-stirring deeply-connective relationship as representation. A lot of modern "LGBT representation" characters nowadays are just that... representation. Badly-developed characters, included solely to check a box, and their main purpose is to run around basically saying "hey look at us, we're LGBT!"
With Vi and Cait, however.. they are two of the most deeply-developed characters in the series, and are forming a true bond with each other that we can feel, not just the superficial "hey look two gay people kissed!" approach many use today. Kind of like you said.. this is one of, if not the most truly human relationship in the show, and it will be beautiful to watch this fragile sprout of connection grow into what we ALL hope it becomes.
I love them so much. They helped me realize I like girls, one of the many reasons I love this show.
Loving women… ah (bad news) they’ll break your heart and leave you to die without caring
I think forgoing the kiss now also builds up audience tension and excitement for when it finally happens in season 2, so it'll feel like it means so much more
One of the few comments that don‘t have read more
This is an awesome breakdown bc it’s all true. I’m sure a kiss will happen in season 2 between them. But I like that there was no kiss or sex at least BEFORE the episode 9 tea party. While media lovveesss to focus on everyone’s sex lives it’s nice to see Arcane focusing on what romance means in the realm of human connection. There’s something more deep rooted than desire. There’s trust, there’s comfort, there’s a desire… to share experiences not just a desire for the other person.
As an aroace their relationship is so special to me - I don't really understand sexual desire or relationships that are built purely on physical attraction, so even Jayce and Mel's relationship feels somewhat empty to me, but I can feel Vi and Caitlyn's on such a personal level, for me personally it really is a rare occasion when it comes to romantic love in media
hey! i'm a lesbian myself (and someone who has this scene as my desktop bg) so i can comment on the social aspect a bit here. as for censorship i don't believe that was the case with this scene or with caitvi at all. it's very much a "we're not quite there yet with this relationship" from a story perspective, it's not meant to be queerbait. while i have that worry in the back of my head that it is bait and i've just taken it hook line and sinker because it's so convincing, i'm also confident this is not what they're doing. amanda overton, lead writer of the show, has posted a lot about these two, and the showrunners themselves have said that we will be happy with what they're doing in s2 and that they're going into it knowing how we see them and how they see them (and that they are at the center of s2). amanda has also stated before that they have discussed marketing (a common excuse for big companies to not show gay relationships lest they lose precious money from homophobic countries) and it was never a big problem they had full agency to tell the story they wanted. unless amanda or another crew member comes out and says something about them being censored i can believe that they aren't being censored.
and while amanda did mention in the same interview where she said the above abt marketing that she had to fight to keep in the "you're hot, cupcake" scene, she said it was because they didn't feel it fit vi's character and that was the reason they wanted to toss it. not because they're trying to censor this relationship.
vi and caitlyn are super important to me, i was dying to watch this and it was excellent! cant wait to see your next upload :D
I'm honestly surprised they thought "you're hot, cupcake" did not feel right to them for Vi's character. I don't know about her LoL persona, but in Arcane, Vi's love language fits perfectly into that line.
@@peaceandloveusa6656 Oh that line is so much more like Vi in the game
Vi has flirty personality in the game lol
I actually do think it may have something to do with queer censorship
The game is super popular in China and that's one of their biggest markets. Korea is one of them too and they're known to be quite homophobic. Just recently the country decides to not put Dr strange multiverse in cinema because there is a lesbian couple, but Marvel was like "we don't need you guys" and skip the country.
Also LOL community is known to be pretty toxic. There are two male game champions just confirmed to be couple and many players start selling accounts that have those champions.
So I'm worried that they may add some kinda lovey dovey scenes for Caitlyn and Vi to satisfy their fans but won't confirm they're a couple. However, it seems like the game begins posting more LGBTQ+ content more recently (I hope it's not queerbait) and there are more queer champions. Who knows? Maybe they will be like Marvel and don't give a damn about homophobic players.
(English is not my first language so sorry for any typos and grammar errors)
@@peaceandloveusa6656 i agree! I don’t agree with the other writers views and I’m glad Amanda fought for it. Feels just like Vi to mess with Caitlyn in that way to get rid of her, while also being brutally honest, everything about her is honest
LOL Vi and Arcane Vi are quite different (so far). Arcane Vi is younger and has tons of unresolved and unprocessed trauma. She’s angrier and more serious, but also more openly lovingly and caring. Apparently, the other writers thought Arcane Vi would be too emotionally guarded and closed off (like how she underreacts to the kid dying despite being upset) to openly flirt with Cait so early on like she does.
I'm actually glad they didn't give them a sexual scene, lesbian relationships are often sexualized and fetishized in media, so it's nice to see a relationship with 2 women be focused on them and their bond instead. (It's also nice for ace people to see non-sexual relationships in media)
I like when romance goes beyond a kiss or sex. People often forget that you should be friends with your partner first before lovers. The physical can only hold you together for so long. So if or when they do eventually kiss in the series, it'll feel genuine and fulfilling.
Thank you so much for yet another great video! Your analytical skills are off the charts, I really love that about your videos. And I agree with your take on Caitlyn and Vi, they were SO not ready for a kiss! They're, as you say, finally quiet together and equal, now that they've accompanied each other in both their worlds and have laid their mutual animosity to rest entirely. The attraction has been there from early on (not the beginning though!), but it isn't until the bed scene that they are on the same page and open to each other. But definitely NOT ready for a kiss. They're exhausted, emotionally and physically, Caitlyn is injured, Vi is devastated about losing Powder/Jinx yet again (she doesn't know if she's dead or not, either way, she's with Silco), and everything is unresolved with Silco, shimmer, the gem, the council meeting, etc. They are not choosing each other just yet, because their other objectives are more important, but they acknowledge (albeit not verbally) that the feelings are there... Beautiful
As an Aromantic one of my favorite things about this show.... Was the fact that they DIDN'T kids yet. It was smooth running, natural, realistic and not generic GOD I JUST love everything about this show
3 months late but did you mean ‘kiss’ ?
@@nuclearpancake3683Left on read,damn
@@justaghostinthesea 😔 pain
"...but heterosexuality and homosexuality is also about what type of person you want love from and what type of person you want to love" tears in my eyes T.T
I’m a lesbian and lemme tell ya. I loved arcane before, styling, character depth, and storyline, but with some of my two favorite characters having a very obvious wlw relationship made me so happy. They included it perfectly? Not sexualizing it, or making it a big deal. Same sex relationships are fine and normal and they projected that perfectly.
I love that the show runners are taking their time with Vi and Cait, and building a strong solid foundation to build a romance on. It's so rare in romantic arcs that you have something as simple yet profound as a mere touch. The thing I love most about it isn't Cait reaching out and gently stroking Vi's cheek, but that Vi reaches up and holds Cait's hand in response. It's such a perfect non-verbal way for the characters to show that they have feelings for one another. And then the look Vi gives Cait, that is the most vulnerable Vi looks in the whole show.
Their relationship doesn’t need kissing at this point what they need right now is comfort.
1. The point about emphasizing their emotional bond over their physical attraction is valid, especially at this point in the story. There is a tendency to overemphasize the "sex" part of homosexuality, especially when politicians are doing the talking. Sex is not what little kids are thinking about when other kids talk about their mom and dad, and it's not what they think about when a kid mentions their two dads or two moms, either. What gender a child's parents are is not about sex, it's about love, and that narrative needs to be pushed harder.
2. However, the fact that there is a tendency in the media to oversexualize LGBTQ+ sensual love doesn't mean it needs to be hidden away offscreen. That's just giving in and letting ourselves be treated differently and "othered," IMO. Kisses are beautiful, and so is sex. (They're not the only ways to express love, of course, and their absence doesn't make a love "less than," but I don't believe these characters were presented as asexual.) Vi and Cait don't need to have a sex scene, IMO--I don't need them to have one just because Mel and Jayce did--but a kiss is not some dirty, oversexualizing moment when done right and timed appropriately. Fans deserve to be able to see characters they relate to and adore share something as simple as an onscreen kiss.
3. Acting like not showing a kiss is some super edgy choice for a wlw pairing is just giving Riot permission to play it safe. They had these characters inches apart sneaking glances at each other's lips (the first shot in this analysis vid) in order to telegraph their physical attraction and build anticipation. It's 100% okay, IMO, that they did not kiss in the bedroom scene. It wasn't the right time for it emotionally or narratively, and personally, I love a slow burn and a bit of longing in my fictional romance. But visually teasing a kiss and then never following through is a classic queerbaiting move, and I think we can and should hold them accountable for following through. They showed us the physical attraction, and then they showed us that what is building between them is even deeper and more powerful than that physical attraction. But the attraction still exists, and expecting fans to not want to see that tension released at some point is a little ridiculous, IMO.
4. Amanda Overton has dropped hints that they will kiss onscreen. S2 was already written when she did so, and she was actually the one running the writers' room for S2, so surely she would know! The speculation that they intended to imply that "something happened" offscreen because Riot wouldn't allow them to kiss onscreen is, IMO, silly. I mean, I get why people think it, but if the lesbian writer who ran the writers room is leading fans on by dropping hints about kissing that will never happen, then she is not going to have a good time on Twitter when the S2 finale rolls around. Even without her hints, accusing the writers of resorting to a tired old homophobic trope because the characters didn't kiss onscreen after knowing each other for 3 chaotic, sleep-deprived days is a bit premature.
I dont know if this was addressed but the Harry Potter x Cho Chang kiss at 9:12 is really funny because Cho is played by Katie Leung, who also voices everyones favorite lesbian sheriff. :)
i think another aspect of that scene is that, despite how vulnerable and open they may look, they're _still_ closed off and guarded. Caitlyn's position in the bed is curled up into a ball, making herself smaller and protecting herself, while Vi is more open and spread out, which has been up to this point how she's protected herself - by taking up more space to have the image of someone bigger. Caitlyn reaching out to Vi in that position has the effect of it seeming like she's letting her guard down in the smallest of ways, trying to let someone in, while Vi grabbing her hand puts her in a slightly smaller position by bringing her arm closer to herself. In essence, Cait reaching out is opening herself up and taking up an infinitesimal amount of space while previously she has tried to seem small and unnoticed, and Vi accepting her hand is bringing her guard back in and letting herself be just the slightest bit smaller than the big scary fighter she's had to give the impression she is.
That's also why the kiss doesn't work there. This is the first moment that they've had the chance to be something different, be their own versions of unguarded (Cait being physically open, Vi being physically smaller), granting the impact of the slightest amount of progression towards trust. It's not the leap yet. Even after this scene, Caitlyn pulls herself back into her shell and redirects her focus towards the case, this time with the subtext of her wanting to get the case out of the way so she can let her guard down completely and actually let Vi in.
It was one of my favorites scenes in the series. I felt just right, i felt like i feel when i am next to my significant other, talking about something, or just sharing the silence, next to each other. It was THAT organic.I think that if in that scene there was a kiss instead of the touch, it wouldn't have been the same. Sometimes a caress is way more intense than a kiss.
as a queer agender man, i loved their relationship. oftentimes, writers rush queer relationships, creating a reinforcement of stereotypes concerning gay relationships, whether it be that theyre sexually motivated (oftentimes seen in gay men) or that they are too highly emotionally driven (as seen in sapphic/lesbian relationships). their relationship was definitely a nice fresh breath of air.
attention they are not in couple
I think it's also important to note that in lots of lgbt relationship you see in shows or movies most have the main conflict being, "trouble in accepting sexuality." So since this is pretty common I feel like lots of lgbt ppl (including myself) sometimes need "proof." Which basically is something that just addresses that it's romance and not "extreme friendship." Especially since the media likes to queerbait and make us think that something is lgbt when it never was to begin with (canonically).
for the moment their relationship isn't canonical so be careful with the hype around this ship there's a risk that they won't be paired up in season 2 ok? simple advice from a scriptwriter
I don't think it would have made sense for their characters to actually kiss. It's definitely set up in such a way that most other media would have gone for it, but Arcane is notoriously good at the good kind of subversion where it defies the trope and actually makes more sense than if they did the trope thing in context.
Vi definitely wouldn't be in the headspace to initiate. I know she flirts with Caitlin, but it kinda has the same energy as when she does with Jayce. Sort of sarcastic & more like she's trying to mess with topsiders she sees as prudish and full of themelves. She's most flirtacious with Cait in the early stages while she's deliberetely throwing her into jarring situations, keeping secrets from her, wandering off on her own and casually insulting her. It kinda circles back to Vi not being very good at expressing her emotions in ways that aren't punching & she's processing her developping attraction very similarly to a schoolboy pulling pigtails.
Caitlin would be in a much more likely headspace but I think it'd have been a mistake. Vi is sort of a window for her to see the real world. A figure that represents a sense of rebellion and escaping the safe little box her parents keep trying to put her in. Going for it would certainly be a big moment of catharsis for Caitlin. But I think it'd read as selfish. It'd be good for her, but it wouldn't be good for Vi. Vi is processing feelings of guilt for abandoning powder at that very moment. And having to run away on the bridge mirrors that abandonment again. She might find it comforting in the moment but I think she'd hate herself for it. And then you've poisoned this moment of tenderness that's been sorely lacking for her whole life with all that unresolved shame. I think Caitlin has too much empathy & emotional intelligence to do that, and she still believes the counci is about to start fixing everything at this point so she doesn't need to seize this particular moment.
They are literally yin and yang, coming from completely different backgrounds but slowly finding love and balance and harmony, their position on the bed showcases that. Just a detail i liked
All I can say is that was a nice breakdown of the scene and I always melt when I see Vi’s expression at the very end of that scene…sigh
I'm bisexual and Vi and Cait's relationship was my favorite in the entire show. I thought it was handled perfectly and felt completely natural given how those characters were developed and everything that was going on around them throughout the show. If it had progressed any faster, there interactions would have felt more in service to their relationship rather than being about two people growing passed their prejudices to deeply care for one another. All the other relationships, intimate or otherwise, were fine and everything, but I never felt anywhere near as invested in anyone else's relationship as I did in Vi and Cait's.
I totally wanted them to have a kiss when I first saw this scene, but rewatching it, I absolutely adored how intimate that scene is. It's this quiet moment to just breathe and be honest with each other. Their intimacy and openness in that moment was more powerful for their relationship than a kiss. Vi has to also be really touch/affection starved from her time in prison, so rushing a romance to more overt physical forms of affection would have ended up feeling wrong because it would come across more as a trauma bond. I love the relationshop and building of trust between Vi and Cait. I can understand wanting to see a bigger confirmation of attraction and romance, but the small gestures and the trust shown in this scene is much more impactful.
One awesome thing about this scene: Vi looks directly at the camera for a split second in the end
as a lesbian myself I trust the writers. the way they did it was absolutely perfect. I'm sure they will explore it more in season 2 but for season one I agree that a kiss would have been too rushed. vi has been locked up half her life, she's not ready for that sort of intimacy. just being able to be touched was a huge mile stone for her and it seems cait is understanding of that and shes going at vis pace. it seems so healthy and the build up is perfectly setting up more in season 2. really well done video, im buzzin for season 2
I agree, their relationship is growing it's to quick for them to kiss but for season 2 i hope they do
cait's leg movement was genious, i am in love with fortiche
Honestly, your "Social Commentary" has this lesbian's stamp of approval. (So does the whole rest of the video, but.. y'know.. that part in particular) it was very... aware.
I'm okey with not having a kiss in season 1, but if they make them just friends in the second season I'm throwing hands, just a warning. But a very violent warning.
Absolutely love this ship, and I think it will continue to develop in S2. I think you made some really great points, like how it's more about the deeper human connection/bond between these characters and that the politics were always in the way of them before. Also, as a person from the LGBTQ+ community, I was slightly disappointed that we didn't get a kiss, but the small tender moments make up for it, because they're very adorable and it's so worth it! Great video!! :D
DUDE!! Thank you for pointing out the detail of Cait pulling her knees in getting more comfortable while listening to Vi. That drew my eyes straightaway on first watch and such a micro-movement spoke so loudly to me
11:39 THIS DUDE OH MY GOD YES
this is why im so in love with this relationship- its NOT just thrown in to be inclusive its so beautiful and true!! its awesome!!! thank you so much for this!
Sheeesh! What an excellent story analysis. I finally understand why as much I would have wanted a kiss scene, I’m glad we didn’t get it in that scene. Great work!
Wonderful video!! I absolutely agree that the writers know what they're doing and aren't going to cut corners on the characters and relationships. Personally, as someone on the ace spectrum, I feel elated that these two are coming together without sexual expressions of intimacy. I know it will probably happen in the next season, so I cherish the small moments that Vi and Cait share in the first season.
I feel like it was good they didn't kiss in season 1, they needed that relationship development i hope they do kiss in season 2
Agreed.
You're bang on with this scene/ship/arc being better without a kiss and I appreciate the analysis. I hope you're right about Arcane 2 and them. I do think your "closed off" label fits Vi way more than Caitlyn. Caitlyn is open nearly from the jump. She crosses the red line (open to trust), open to being challenged by Vi on her prejudice ("In what world would I trust someone like you" "You enforcers are all the same") then literally opens the cell at risk to career, opens up to the woman at the brothel, tries to tend to Vi and build trust, is openly compassionate to Huck, begins intimate physical contact with "easy, easy, easy", openly sacrifices herself to Ekko for Vi's safety, admits her concern, and nuzzles in on the bridge hug. I think Caitlyn is in touch with her emotions and is willing to share many of them with her Mom , Jayce, Huck, Ekko, the council and even her love for Vi.
honestly even aside from all the amazing points everybody makes about how beautiful and intimate and better than a kiss this scene was, it's even a pretty accurate scenario for baby gays anyways lmfao. it's such a common occurrence for those incredibly tumultuous and intimate relationships with another, sometimes closeted sometimes not, sapphic best friend where looking back you realize those strong feelings you had for them were love, so much more than just friends, but neither of you ever acted or even acknowledged it, or if you did it ended up falling apart so horribly. i understand the disappointment from a surface level for the lack of a kiss, but they honestly nailed a pretty niche experience lmao
Love your work. One addition - Caitlyn not killing Jinx in the grande finale, when she had a chance, was unbelievably unprofessional and criminally stupid. Just put any real-life terrorist at Jinx’s place and like… what tha fuck?
Had it been preceded by a big kiss scene, this would look just cheap. Instead, this was the “a-ha!” moment. A-ha, they’re both around twenty, there’s tension, there’s guilt (incarceration and dead parents), there’s trust and sense of responsibility, there are those 2-3 incredibly intensive days with both killing and not being killed. This was the actual big ‘romantic’ moment that should not be - and was not - dimmed by anything overt before.
Caitlyn is still shocked. She thought Vi would do smth to convice Jinx. She still thought it could be done without bloodshed. And it was stupid but at the same time she didn't have this kind of experience. Lots of people think that love heals everything. But it's only a help and a person has to find self worth themselves. They both didn't know it. Jinx didn't know it too. That's why it ended in such a tragic way
. if you watched the series you would have noticed that Mel and Jayce are a couple after a 5 year eclipse while Vi and Caitlyn have only known each other for 2 or 3 days they are not a couple and do not go out together. for the moment their relationship isn't canonical so be careful with the hype around this ship there's a risk that they won't be paired up in season 2
I don’t think I’ve ever appreciated a romantic character arc so much in a show as much as these two. This breakdown really expressed some ideas I grasped bits and pieces of the subtle messages the writers were trying to communicate to the viewer but you really laid it out very beautifully.
I think I’m decent at analyzing shows with a small amount of education in film but I’d love to be able to pick up on and articulate the details and messages of these stories the way you do.
Honestly, as long as we eventually get something more, I'm fine with waiting. The build-up of their relationship felt very organic, and a kiss might have been rushing it. We do know that Season 2 will continue exploring it, so there's that.
I honestly love they didn't make it that easy. Their connection feels deeper now. So when they do kiss it has so much more meaning. Not just a "Oh I feel like kissing you now" kiss.
I actually really like that they are creating a slower build in Kaitlyn and Vi’s relationship. It absolutely does emphasize the bond and that will make the eventual kiss mean even more.
However, this is coming from someone who loves Jane Austin’s Pride and Prejudice. I’m all about stories with a slow build of sexual tension and then having a show of physical affection when it has been earned or when it feels natural.
The reason they don't ever kiss is because as @The Dragon Knight said Vi sees herself unworthy of Caitlyn because she's from The Undercity whereas Caitlyn is from another world entirely and It wasn't the time. However, I do see them kissing at the end of Season 2 or season 1 with Caitlyn giving Vi a kiss on the cheek
It isn't sure they trust each other fully yet. Watch ViCait theory by Machinae. As for question in the vid: writers and animators worked independently. Hence the way each team interpreted these two may have varied. Also Chinese company put lots of money in the show and they have anti-LGBT policy
The reason why I can get behind Vi and Cait's relationship, is because it was so organic and they grew to learn from each other. It let them get to know each other, and that's kind of how healthy relationships work. Compared to Mel and Jayce... Mel literally used and manipulated him, no matter if she grew into a more sympathetic character later, her actions is the way to set up a relationship as a toxic failure. I kind of like how these two relationships contrast eachother, where one is healthy and open, and the other is built on manipulations and schemes.
I guess that's why Jayce/Victor has such a strong fandom I guess, they're actually friends that talk and have a good relationship, a relationships that falls apart when Mel starts her emotional manipulation of Jayce btw.
if you watched the series you would have noticed that Mel and Jayce are a couple after a 5 year eclipse while Vi and Caitlyn have only known each other for 2 or 3 days they are not a couple and do not go out together. for the moment their relationship isn't canonical so be careful with the hype around this ship there's a risk that they won't be paired up in season 2
This just makes me so much more excited for their first kiss (at the perfect moment!! Hopefully next season) and to see their relationship grow!
I was also expecting a kiss but honestly, it's a melancolic scene, Vi is sad. Sad isn't turned on
Cait can't relate with that pain but she's there to comfort her gf like a good partner uwu
I fuckin love your videos, my dude. I appreciate the level of care you take in communicating sensitive subject matter without making it seem burdensome or unnecessary. Mad respect for the staunch respect! ❤️
Again, excellent video Schnee. Excellent analysis on the interactions between Caitlyn and Vi. I love you how you notice the obstacles that these two have to overcome before reaching that quiet bed moment. There, nothing is between them, except for their newfound love, admiration, and feelings for each other. Though the "Oil and Water" scene may have lead to many wishing Caitlyn to stop Vi, question her actions and their time together, and begging for the latter to stay, it did however allows them to separate for awhile, giving the Jinx to kidnap and bring them together for the biggest showdown and ultimatum: Jinx's Tea Party (10:46). And I have to admit, that is great writing in a story. Plus, you saw how that moment connect the choices of our two star-crossed lovers. Especially with Jinx acting as the bridge between the two.
I LOVE when shows flush out character relationships. I find it annoying when shows outwardly push a relationship gay or not or a queer person just to say "hey see that, they are gay, gay and proud look! Look! We did this for you guys" even when the relationship doesn't make sense.
Forced relationships suck and is lazy writing. But Vi and Caitlyns relationship is done so well. It's a million times better than if they had just kissed with no build up. The scenes when Caitlyn is touching Vi's face are so intimate.
Like he said thier relationship is to tell a story and to get plot points across. It does that very nicely
Honestly youre the best documentarian to bing watch, tysm for these videos
Such a joy to listen to your analysis of this masterpiece. Thank you!
Such an amazing show and love these 2 together. Something that i have not seen mentioned before. Because of the fact that Cait has blue hair , perhaps subconsciously Vi sees Cait as a mother figure . And because of her parent trauma , it feels great for Vi to have someone that protects her and treats her like that. Cait is very caring with Vi all the time
your analysis on Arcane is always fascinating and very well put I would love to see you analyze other shows like Hannibal
So i'm bi and kinda loved that they're taking it slowly with the relationship, I've seen it compared to the Bumblebee ship in RWBY a lot, who have also never kissed in 8 seasons (hopefully Arcane won't take that long haha) due to both parties having gone through a lot of trauma lately that directly involved each other, so it was never going to feel natural if they got together without first overcoming/addressing that trauma.
Personally, I much prefer when romance takes a back seat when there's literally world-altering plot around. If it's a romcom you can have any number of romance/kissing scenes, in a fantasy adventure the focus has to be on the world building and plot that creates relationships between the characters more organically, that may or may not lead to romance depending on what the world is doing.
Secondly, having a more slow-paced relationships makes the small touches SO much more impactful, like they don't have the time or words to say everything they're feeling, but a small touch is still them trying to communicate their care. In Arcane specifically I think holding off on the kiss has made me way more invested in Cait x Vi than Jayce x Mel, though that might also be bc I'm always going to be more interested and behind non-het relationships in media X)
Also loving the most accurate representation of Cait playing back her rain conversation with Vi while in the shower - so heckin relatable XD
This relationship taught me a lot about romance in storytelling and I'm glad I watched this series before starting to publish my own work, I probably would have made an uncomfortable mistake.
Not only a touch by Caitlyn but also (in reaction) the taking of that hand by Vi, which to me is her telling that she feels close to Kate and safe with her.
I'm so glad I found another screen analyzing mind like me. Everything I see, I break down, and having found this channel gives me some insights I might have not thought about. Epic content, man.
Amazing take, as usual. Sometimes a slow burn has a better payoff :)
Good analysis. The bed scene highlights Cait offering a gentleness, affection and safety that has been wholly missing from Vi's life for a very long time. Literally every other character in Vi's life would punish her in some way should she show vulnerability, even if it's just in disappointment (even Vander would probably gently steer her back to the need to be "strong"), but Cait doesn't. I think Cait encourages it (like in the scenes where she's caring for an injured Vi) because kindness is in her nature and also if Vi can open up and be vulnerable, maybe she can too.
This is honestly one of the best romance stories I've ever seen on film.
9/10 in my 1st or 2nd hand experience of lesbian relationships it is either a real slow burn where no one is 100% sure if they r dating after a yr living together, or u get peeps who move in together after the 1st date. The later works in primarily romantic stories cuz when the romance is the focus the whirlwind is exciting. When it isn't the focus tho a whirlwind romance would feel rushed n forced cuz of everything else going on that is infinitely more important n time sensitive. If these 2 came from the same world n didn't have so much going on I could see them jumping into it. But the way the plot unfolded they needed a slow burn with obvious tension to being it organically n not overthrow the main plot
6:17 this is why I love Arcane, the storytelling is stripped to its most focused point, to where at first, I was annoyed because I was missing more background and subplots from each character, until I realized that I was watching THE best, most purposefully developed storyline I have ever seen.
//Owl House Spoilers
I think there's a similar principle applied when Luz and Amity in TOH get together, and don't kiss immediately or even have some confession of love. That's because their relationship is about something more significant than "they like each other". The relationship itself is about self-expression, perfectionism, and acceptance from peers. Their initial interactions are usually only negative when one of them focuses on their image too much (Luz tries to be cool, Amity tries to be perfect). As such, the connection feels strongest when Luz lets herself be weird and Amity drops her emotional barriers and looks at Luz equally. This is also why Amity, envious of Luz's sense of personal freedom, develops a crush first. Luz only catches feelings when she realizes Amity accepts and likes her to such a high degree despite, in Luz's eyes, being much cooler than her. So when they get together adding in a kiss would distract from the actual significance of it, which is the acceptance of one another. Cause Luz didn't get to ask her out in a super cool way and she worried that she was too cheesey and was gonna get made fun of, but Amity actually likes her so much that she interrupts and blurts out "do you wanna go out with me" before Luz could finish, then they hold hands. To me, that gesture is so much more meaningful than an over the top confession and kiss
The story break-downs u make are just amazing. I love how your understanding of the story, characters etc just functions on totally another depth.
I see you don't do video games, but I would love to hear you analysis about The Last of Us
HAPPY PRIDE MONTH!!!!😻😻😻😻🌈🏳️🌈🎈
It feels natural, not forced, just to check a LBGT Checkbox for representation. Like all the relationships in this show. Even people who get a little turned off by same sex relationships in media, at least from some people I know, actually were shipping Vi and Caitlyn. It was the slow buildup I think, When Caitlyn is in the shower unable to forget Vi. It had an impact. Very well done. If the show can get people who do not usually like to see same sex relationship in Movies or T.V. Shows. You know You're show has done something special. I cried for Vi,Jinx and the bloody Bad guy. Amazing.
I really enjoy your videos and the way you analyse things. The issue at hand is indeed very complicated and I appreciate your effort in making this one.
Unfortunately, as a lesbian myself, I've grown too sick and tired of seeing:
a) ppl trying to rationalise why queer folks don't get an onscreen confirmation disguising as "quality writing",
b) ppl trying to compare straight and queer rep,
c) mansplaining (or generally when lesbian/female issues are talked on by anyone who's lesbian/female themselves, if you will).
The gap in experiences is just too grand.
There are some things you cannot fathom to compare.
Part 1 of the continuing saga of romantically charged scenes from animated masterpieces that could end in a kiss but actually do something even more intimate where one of the characters is played by hailee stienfeld
I was putting off watching Arcane for 8 whole months. Now I've seen it almost 3 times in different languages, seen pretty much all theory videos and consider myself lucky that those 8 months saved me quite a lot of suffering before season 2! And still, videos like yours make that waiting a bit more bearable, because I don't feel like I'm alone in it.
I honestly don't even care on the social level. They longingly lounged around on a piece of furniture staring into each other's souls. There is NOT SINGLE thing more gay to do than that and the writers knowing this is a far greater sign to me that they know what they're doing than if they had just kissed.
As someone who's pan, letting the relationship be a slow burn would be more ideal imo. Neither of those two characters I feel are ready to enter any type of official relationship yet. They got other issues and trust to focus on first. Plus, having some nice wholesome fluff is sweet and comforting. Tone is a very important thing to consider when writing romantic scenes.
Honestly its a good thing their relationship is slow burn because it means its more likely that they will last, which I am here for
your last thought on Vi and Cait and what it means to be homosexual or heterosexual honestly explains it so well. I think that is why I don't like the labels, because it really does make it sound like its all about carnal pleasure, but intimacy is left behind and that is what is gold
I for one am totally okay with no kiss in season 1, we get to wallow in the beautiful and ADORABLE moments they have together which in a lot of ways feels more intimate and romantic than a kiss. I also find it refreshing to see a couple in media that the audience is supposed to really root for that doesn't get together immediately, it's more realistic (this sticks out a lot for me as a demi-romantic/sexual, I'm sure I'm not the only one) And besides, all this very well done build up is only going to make the eventual kiss we do get totally worth it and absolutely AMAZING
Completely agree! so glad they didn't rush it! They feel like actual people with real life experiences! love these two!!😭😭
a kiss ,conspicuous by absence, is what makes this relationship even more significant