gravis, i've known people who've spent half a decade in digital audio workstations before being able to produce something _half_ as coherent. you've got one hell of a natural talent for composition, and if that's what you put out for your first song with soundblaster restrictions, i'm _very_ excited to hear what you're capable of with something like openmpt!
thank you so much. also the funny thing is modplug (before it was openmpt) was the first thing i ever tried, like 15 years ago; I just didn't put my back into the work.
Hello -- that motherboard is actually not custom. I don't know what the form factor is called, but I have a Ti 486 board in the same form factor that fit into this computer. I assume it's some standard industrial form factor. . . I actually have one of these PCs as well, with the original working external power brick and the same anti-theft device glued on. I bet they all came from the same lot as mine is missing the spray paint but has some rust on it too.
I have seen it in some industrial (literally cnc machines) computers. I think theyre called SBCs in a generic sense but apparently even the raspberry pi is under that umbrella so idk
@Palmtop_User No, this wouldn't be considered a single board computer in the traditional sense. Also that refers to function more than form, though SBCs are typically small.
Cybernet continued making keyboard PCs until around 2017. See my video about their ZPC-H6, with a Core i5 and HDMI output. There was also the Great Wall U310 from around 2011 with an Intel Atom CPU, also rebadged as the Commodore VIC Slim -- I did a video about it as well.
I remember seeing ads in _Maximum PC_ for them, along with an All-in-one that they reviewed about a decade ago as a child. Didn't know they made keyboard PC's in the 90's.
You really went all out to save that little oddity's life. Personally, I think the lofi aspects and ridiculous institutional stencil spray letters make it perfect for when you want to put on some tracker tunes.
yoooo dude not bad AT ALL for a first song! the drums coming in with a rising velocity was a super nice touch! great job! EDIT: oh man that quiet part back into the climax was great, seriously this is a jam! great work ahaha
Touch typing on typewriters was ubiquitous for secretaries and typing pools. I was taught on a mechanical typewriter with a cover over the keys. To accommodate the key and hammer mechanics the rows were considerably steeper in their rake. This assisted in the muscle memory and made mistaken keys less frequent. Fingers moved "up to the right" or "down to the left from the familiar home key; ASDF ;LKJ. Your hands could lay on the keys at rest when reading back your work without risking phantom strokes, such was the force required to operate. Olivetti electromechanical 'golf ball' typewriters flattened the angle and compressed the gap between keys. It was a very hard adjustment at first.
17:08 FYI, that is called a “flat flex cable” (not “ribbon cable”, because that term refers to the thicker, lots-of-round-wires-stuck-together cables like the gray one for the hard drive), or FFC for short. Orange ones like this are made of Kapton (polyimide), not Mylar (metalized biaxially-oriented PET, like in Mylar birthday balloons). The reason people sometimes confuse them is that the metalized Kapton films used on the lunar module and such were often mistakenly referred to as Mylar, even though they weren’t! People often thought one side of those was gold-plated, but the gold color actually came from the Kapton. As for the tear: if you can solder decently, you can use a fiberglass brush to carefully expose the broken metal conductor and then solder a bodge wire to fix it. Alternatively, if the ends of the FFC are standard, which they probably are, you might be able to buy an off-the-shelf replacement and then make a few 45 degree folds in it to make it lay properly. This isn’t a weird hack, it’s actually a common way FFCs are routed in commercial products instead of costly custom FFCs.
The first song you've ever written is not only perfectly inoffensive, it aptly captures an era to where I'm suddenly nostalgic for a game that never existed.
"As soon as I do that it'll just turn into a PC and become boring so let's not turn it on yet." This, right here, is why I keep coming back to this channel.
Dude this is one cool project you got there :) also I just wanted to say that your power mod for the thing is actually quite novel and functional, even if not aesthetic. And function is more important than form with PCs. And that first Adlib song you made is a real banger. You got some talent there :)
They make these things called Pico PSUs, they're tiny little boards you can mount in the case, wire the outputs to the board then for input they have a DC jack and an external brick to do conversion. It would be a much cleaner solution. Edit - You'd need to pick up a 20 pin ATX Pico and a 20 pin ATX to AT converter cable but it should still be fine.
@@robertbackhaus8911 You can use a voltage regulator and derive -5V from the -12V rail. Though it's very likely not needed. Original Sound Blasters needed -5V, but SB16s which the Vibra in the video shouldn't need it. The PicoPSU would be a great option to clean up the build.
@@robertbackhaus8911 -5v is only actually needed for some of the older expansion cards, most will work fine without it. Its almost exclusively soundcards and even then most of the newer ISA cards simply derive it from the -12v line.
"Wobbly" video is extremely indicative of old, dried up capacitors, usually in the power supply, but not necessarily. When power draw increases, so do the fluctuations. Whether that's from increased HDD activity or more CPU load.
except that Pentium and later computers don't actually support a turbo/slow mode. The only way to practically do that is to disable the L1 cache. At that point the Pentium might be more like a 486 or 386.
@@SeeJayPlayGames probably yes Still, I do remember some first pentium MMX computer having a turbo switch and LED 🤔🤔 which might also be faked and just turning on and off just the LED, indeed
@@Grizzly_Lab Your are probably correct as at that stage low end machines were using last years cases that did actually use the turbo function. i have a pentium 100 still running strong and it has no turbo options on the mother board pins, best guess is by that stage no one really wanted to slow down a windows based pc to run 4.7 mh games
Agreed. Windows 98 with a disconnected Ethernet card take forever to boot. Disabling the card or connecting the cable before booting will fix the issue.
I already press like on any new video you post on principle, but I’d like a double like button for the music you composed. I genuinely think it’s fantastic. I am a professional musician so can be super-critical, but I have no need to be. This is really great.
seriously, that track... from a musical perspective: deceptively simple start, but still chill vibes. the progressive layering gets quite complex without polluting the rhythm/spectrum and turning it into sludge (not easy). and the ~20s from about 39:05 to 39:25... structurally, that it exists is impressive for a first song, and i really like it could be projecting a bit myself, but if there's a chance you want to be making music and don't think you're good enough... even if they're "accidental", your intuition and taste guided you to some great choices, and you're selling yourself short
I just need to let you know something. I've been subbed for a while now. I LOVE how much you've been branching out on subject matter. I read the title of this video and thought to myself "ehhh..." then I saw it was from your channel, and thats when I got interested. Always love hearing your take on just about anything that gets you riled up.
@@CathodeRayDude not even really that it sucks, i just happen to be a rando who is subbed to a bunch of retro pc channels and thought it was one of them at first. Ngl, i love the neccissary horrors inside this one, and how you let us know what was about to happen, top notch entertainment lol
Those annoying round pin power connectors are Kycon connectors. I think they're specifically Kycon KPJX or KPPX series connectors but in my experience they just get called Kycon connectors. You can still buy them new, the mating half for the one on your machine is probably a KPPX-4P-SR7DI.
Those Winbond chips are probably the L2 cache, based on how they're close to the CPU (and based on my experience with other Socket 7 motherboards that have L2 cache there too). The PIIs (and earlier PIIIs) are massive because the L2 is put onto the processor card to bring it closer to the CPU. Intel switched back to sockets with later PIIIs once they were able to reliably package the L2 directly onto the CPU die and no longer needed the card space.
@@CathodeRayDude Dont forget that there were a lot of first gen pentium machines with NO L2 Cache. Made them not a lot faster than a 486. I bet if Intel had never integrated the cache or done so later that there would have been OEMs building machines with no cache right up to that point. I love that you acknowledged the evolution of the first gen pentium too, the first ones were 800nm 5 volt monsters!
That long pause is a Windows 98 thing. If I recall correctly, it happens when you have an Ethernet port with no cable plugged in. I think it's a timeout where it's waiting for an IP address from a DHCP server (that it will never get if the cable isn't connected).
I remember I had two external hard drives at one point that used that weird 4-prong plug. One used a 5V supply, the other one used a 12V supply (which I found out when I mixed up the two power bricks and blew one of them up). That day I learned to label all of my power supplies as to which device they belong to.
At work I have a 4 disk toaster dock, a Dell laptop dock, and a third power supply also from Dell but we don't know what it goes to, with that connector. 6, 12, 24V, it's hilarious. I think the 12V one is even like 16 amps for some reason
The Wii and Wii U have a similar issue, they use the same connector but aren't quite compatible. They won't immediately blow up but they'll get really unhappy, my Wii had issues for at least a year after I plugged it into a U supply by accident
I want to say about a year ago I seen one of your videos... I'm like what's this goofy nerd doing... since then you and your content have slowly grown on me. I'm not a patreon, but reaching out to say I truly appreciate what you're doing I enjoy the stories you tell.
I do remember quite a few modern wedges, though they're usually very rare and only one somewhat popular design, the RasPi 400. but cybernet, Great Wall are a few others I can remember off the top of my head. I've only ever seen one windows 10 wedge, most of them are WinXP era. wedge is pretty generous, they're basically a normal keyboard but most of an inch thick (except for the great wall)
yeah that's kinda why i make the distinction; even if there *are* newer integrated machines, I'm sure they're all just kinda flat "trays." Not nearly as exciting as a wedge!
my favorite form factor. I was half excited about a production cyberdeck with that asus eeepc thing with the integrated display but it went absolutely nowhere.
I think there were probably more (and more obscure) wedge computers that you're aware of. For a start, at least four companies made versions of that Sinclair PC200 (Amstrad PC20, Schneider Euro PC, Olivetti PC1). Then you get things like the "Commodore 64 Web It", which was a wedge PC that booted into a C64 emulator. I'm sure there are many, may more examples but most of them have been lost to obscurity.
The PC20 was just a "paint job and a logo" over the PC200, but the Euro PC and PC1 we only similar in as much as they all were XT Clones. From CPU to Gfx to motherboard layout, very different beasts.
Love your straightforward explanatory approach. I am ignorant of much of your specialist area, yet i can learn so much. I see you there, quietly being a good true person in the midst of... the stuff. Subscribed.
"So don't be too harsh, this is literally the first song I've written." This track would have been right at home in the demoscene or PC / Amiga games of the early 1990s. And that's a good thing.
I completely agree with most of the comments here about the first song you've written. It is amazing and perfect for any 8 bit game that you might create one day soon. It's so catchy and could quickly become a classic.
I know I'm like the whole freaking half a year behind on this but the switch you put in for the atx I'm smiling writing this I haz a tear of happiness forming....ty for being you 😊 and then magic happens and I'm in full tears of happiness now...wow
Dude! Your videos are like a birthday present 🎁 I've been waiting for a new one while watching the old ones over and over 😅😊 thanks for your hard work!
There's a very good reason a wedge shaped PC is rare: Health'n'safety! Wedge shaped was a great way to have a home computer - just one box to store in a drawer when not in use, and you plug it into the living room TV to play games on. In schools, apples and BBC micros lived under monitor stands. However in the office, their chunky keyboards were judged poor ergonomically, as you noted the height, but the killer was you could not adjust the rake, so they were considered a hazard for RSI. They also took up depth of desk unless you stacked the monitor on them, and unless you had a school style monitor stand, you couldn't adjust the position of the keyboard. This meant they were considered unprofessional and unacceptable in most major offices, which went for the IBM PC style beige box with separate adjustable keyboard. In the UK, due to their popularity in some 'prosumer' applications, some companies (eg Viglen) even made conversion cases for the BBC micro to turn it into a 2-box solution so it could fit into an office environment more acceptably. Since the PC started in the business world, it's not surprising it took til much later for someone to go the other way, and even less so that the application was for an education setting. So easy to deploy and maintain a room-full of these one-box PCs in a computer suite - if one goes down you swap out the whole unit. Young people not in your employ, using the machine for a limited session, are less likely to sue you for their crippling RSI. Push and pull factors satisfied. --- 4-pin power Mini-DIN connector. Awful, you can too easily plug them in the wrong way round and fry devices.
I saw quite a few of the Amstrad keyboard PCs in the UK, including the Sinclair PC200 one. Although the Amstrad PPC was really a portable with integrated screen, like a precursor to modern laptops.
Huh, didn't expect an adlib tune this nice from a self-proclaimed first-timer. You should definitely continue down that path, a welcome addition to this community.
I wonder if you've looked into the PicoATX PSUs, would allow you to put it internally and have the 12v barrel jack in the original hole.. Tho they might need an extension harness with a -5v regulator if that soundblaster really needs it.
I was impressed by your little tune :-) not really surprised though, you primed me talking about that awful ride cymbal ; if you know your way around a drumkit surely you can compose music hahaha
On the Amstrad PPC512/640, I have a working one and they are around in the UK/Europe. They're actually designed as a portable machine and can run off battery power or 12v DC from a car, hence the integrated LCD. 🙂 Awesome video, love these weird form factors!
I like that you've kinda made this half way to your own cyberdeck with all the mods, the jank and the custom ad lib tracker song. It's got its own character now with all the jank going on.
Hey, that song you wrote was actually pretty good! Took a little to warm up but then it really popped off! Fair to say if we were teleported back to the 90s as our younger selves, we would have been pretty impressed by it.
oh awesome. I have one of these but it proved to be the MOST ANNOYING FUCKER I've ever used. Like, I couldn't identify any 1 component that was bad, all the caps seemed fine, nothing was getting too hot, but it would only ever run for like 10 minutes at a time at best. I spent weeks trying to repair it into something like functionality, and completely failed.
and thank you for mentioning the Tandy. the whole time you were listing the other wedges I was like TANDY! TANDY! GRAVIS DIDN'T I BUY OR SELL A TANDY 1000 OFF YOU?
also I was totally about to go "hey you know cybernet kept making this until at least the pentium 4 era" before you mentioned it. well done on the research!
Wouldn't trust that daughter card above the graphics chip either. It's old, unshielded, and the device itself probably wasn't built with top shelf components, so there's a good chance that the electronics in it are dying/bad, screwing up the voltage rails its making or even creating EMI. Just an educated guess, and I can't really rewind to correct my assessment since YT doesn't like to save comment replies on mobile.
I believe the only keyboard integrated PC which is produced nowadays is the raspberry pi one. In the early 2010's there were some of those with netbook like specs. With those awful Atom processors which were too slow to run windows 7.
I have always been fascinated by the CyberNet PCs! The Jefferson County Public Libraries in Colorado had these in use for YEARS after they were relevant for looking up book locations, and the Pentium 4 machines were used for free web access. I remember being a 10 year old boy who was BEGGING his mother to buy him one of these MMX machines off of eBay for Christmas
The computer "POISK" was created in the USSR. Modern Ukraine, which appeared in 1992, has nothing to do with the creation of this computer, which was created in the Ukrainian SSR. Modern Ukraine, completely and completely denies everything that was created during the USSR. So you are being misled.
Scrolled down to see if one of the mad lads from your Patreon magically knew why the graphics were rippling, but everyone was (rightfully!) talking about your lovely music. I'll have to wait for the sudden thrilling conclusion you may discover in $TIME! What a mystery! I think it's sweet that you'll just "let it be weird." If only all of us could be granted such grace in our lives.
Big points, that composition is really solid stuff, especially for working in adlib constrictions! What a fun little machine, having an adlib player feels like something that'd come in handy.
The screen issue sounds more like a shielding issue which could be in the VGA cable or with the VGA port and path shielding. I used to see this with cheap crappy VGA extension cables in data centres back in the day, which then confuses the hell out of modern monitors as they are digital and don’t really understand analogue signals, which is what VGA is. Had you had this on an old school CRT, it would likely have also shown up as ghosting with interference from pretty much anything causing screen artifices of one form or another. Oh, and Jan Hammer is pronounced as Yan Hammer, worked alongside him once when I was setting up the computer systems at a live performance once. Nice guy and increasingly talented musician.
I almost missed the CWU stencil, lol. I've worked there for over 20 years now, started out as a student assistant in the "microcomputer" lab in the library... Surplus sales to die for! Glad to see our old hardware getting new life from RE-PC. Graet content keep up the great work.
I remember the first "wedge PC" I ever made (and it was the last, fortunately). These steps work best in about 1999: First, get a Compaq Armada laptop. Then, set it on top of a rack mounted server you're working on while it's slid out on its rails. Then, from the back, slide the server back into the cabinet while forgetting your laptop is on top. Pick the laptop up off the floor. Now, while you're waiting for a replacement for your destroyed display, just remove it, and you have a Wedge PC until the new monitor arrives! (Fortunately the HDD and everything else still worked!)
I'm going to bet this board was manufactured by Advantech. The SIS5571 and the "LCD/CRT" video output point to this being an industrial/kiosk motherboard. The internal layout of the computer could easily follow the board requirements.
Sick tunes man, that was a real bop. You should make some more. Maybe you could offer them up to other people to use for sound demos so they too can avoid the content id
Wow! For your first composition this is shockingly competently done. I have been teaching about music production, and I don't take any of the composition skills for granted, and your intuition is really good here. I think you could really make some nice music, consider exploring this more if it was fun, and I assume it was :)
I remember Zero Footprint PC ads from my dad's old issues of Wired magazine. What a blast from the past! Great tunes, Gravis! You could moonlight as a chiptune musician.
I know I’m joining in with others saying that tracker tune was decent, but hell yeah, that was definitely decent! You started with the fourths on the bassline, and the melody was guided by that! You didn’t try to do anything too complex, just a straightforward little bop. The moments of tension and increased rhythm section were effective, and overall it stayed in its lane. Well done! It’s simple enough that I actually kinda want to cover it and improvise a more complex melody over the top haha
If it's one thing I always wonder about retro tech collectors, its 'what do you actually do with the devices you own?' so hearing your story of how you repurposed it along with a study of the oddities of this machine was super interesting. Plenty of devices I'm sure are just museum pieces but actually seeing how, even if you must modify the system a bit first, you've found a way to keep it useful for a task (such as making really good music! :D Well done!) or for fun as a MIDI jukebox and 'DOS game-console'. A much better way for a computer in its 'retirement' to find purpose than just slowly going bad on a shelf, before eventually being recycled or worst, becoming e-waste.
Yeah! I think about this constantly - "okay, I have this stuff, it's neat, but how can I actually do something with it?" Much of the time... I basically can't, hah.
From what I've seen second hand, hospitals used these a lot. The two I have are both from different hospitals anyways. I like this form factor, idk exactly why, I have a WinXP version (D5) with a trackpad in place of a Numpad and it is extremely handy for the odd time I need XP for something and I don't have to settle for a laptop screen from 20 years ago or its battery. I also have the H6 variant with Windows 7, I put a larger HDD in there and since it has a DVD drive with HDMI I can play stuff I have loaded on the internal drive, streaming sites work perfectly and it plays discs. And it's so much faster and easier to use than an HDMI stick streaming device. Everything is built in.
That little board next to the CPU is essentially just a VRM (voltage regulator module) so that the system can use a CPU with different voltages than the board design otherwise provides. --- I'm not sure why a regular 3.5" IDE hard drive wouldn't work right out of the box, but the inability to use a CD drive is likely explained by the way the system supports a drive out of the box at all. That was after all an era when hard drives were either not standard or had only recently become so. --- The SiS 5571 chipset used apparently incorporates a hard disk controller, but it's entirely possible that it only supports PIO (parallel IO) modes (no DMA or UltraDMA/UDMA. I would be willing to bet that it only supports regular ATA (AT Attachment) and does NOT support ATAPI (aka 'ATA Packet Interface'). The latter is actually an extension to ATA that enables the use of other storage media than a hard drive on the same bus/controller. Not exactly sure your floppy drive is connected, perhaps there is a dedicated FDC (floppy drive controller) chip on the back side of the board,
I think the grievances you have with chunky keyboards is that you do actually rest your wrists down at an angle when typing. That's how you get RSI. Even on modern chicklet keyboards like those from Apple, you're supposed to hover your wrists off the desk keeping them level with your palms. Those foam wrist rests are just for that, resting between flurries of typing. Look at anything regarding office ergonomics, ergonomic keyboards or even a good quality typing tutor like Mavis Beacon; keep the bend in your wrist to an absolute minimum.
![Headstart's PC With The Weird GUI "OS" [Explorer]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/d1jpIiST6ec/mqdefault.jpg)
That “first song you’ve ever written” is really quite good. Some solid retro PC sounds
It's very puzzle game.
Indeed. I was expecting something... I don't know but way less. Not bad at all, especially for first track 👍
I was going to say. It goes so hard. Love it.
Thunder Force II vibes.
blown away man
gravis, i've known people who've spent half a decade in digital audio workstations before being able to produce something _half_ as coherent. you've got one hell of a natural talent for composition, and if that's what you put out for your first song with soundblaster restrictions, i'm _very_ excited to hear what you're capable of with something like openmpt!
thank you so much. also the funny thing is modplug (before it was openmpt) was the first thing i ever tried, like 15 years ago; I just didn't put my back into the work.
OpenMPT is a program I'm a user of. Funnily enough it now has an FM mode.
@@sparklesparklesparkle6318 He explains this in a q&a I think, hell of a way to ask but, uh, short answer yes.
@@CathodeRayDude bro you need to give a download for it, that's is a complete bop.
@@dedr4mhe's dating/married/with a trans person, my man
Hello -- that motherboard is actually not custom. I don't know what the form factor is called, but I have a Ti 486 board in the same form factor that fit into this computer. I assume it's some standard industrial form factor. . . I actually have one of these PCs as well, with the original working external power brick and the same anti-theft device glued on. I bet they all came from the same lot as mine is missing the spray paint but has some rust on it too.
I have seen it in some industrial (literally cnc machines) computers. I think theyre called SBCs in a generic sense but apparently even the raspberry pi is under that umbrella so idk
@Palmtop_User No, this wouldn't be considered a single board computer in the traditional sense. Also that refers to function more than form, though SBCs are typically small.
Cybernet continued making keyboard PCs until around 2017. See my video about their ZPC-H6, with a Core i5 and HDMI output. There was also the Great Wall U310 from around 2011 with an Intel Atom CPU, also rebadged as the Commodore VIC Slim -- I did a video about it as well.
I was just about to recommend your video. I still love the idea even though I hate the lack of upgradability.
Oh sick, gonna check those out.
I believe LTT has reviewed one or two over the years as well.
I remember seeing ads in _Maximum PC_ for them, along with an All-in-one that they reviewed about a decade ago as a child. Didn't know they made keyboard PC's in the 90's.
You should upload a direct rip of that tracker song separately. It's a jam.
Yup, needed cat jam overlay for sure
Seriously. I need it in rotation for my workday playlist ASAP.
It was so good I was almost mad about it.
lol entire video games have been soundtracked with less effort than this one song.
He put it on his second channel, Cathode Ray Dude Gaiden :)
It is! It is a jam! :D
That "the first song I've ever written" is equivalent of "haha it's just a sketch" when mfs do a complete and detailed painting. Very well done!
"Please excuse the crudity of this model. I didn't have time to build it to scale or to paint it." - Doc Brown
You possess a computer that automatically gives every video the wobbly sound effect that they use in memes.. This is a miracle.
The pause during boot is DHCP waiting for an IP address. The joys of networking on Windows 9x.
Came here to post this. Setting a static address is a good workaround.
You really went all out to save that little oddity's life. Personally, I think the lofi aspects and ridiculous institutional stencil spray letters make it perfect for when you want to put on some tracker tunes.
yoooo dude not bad AT ALL for a first song! the drums coming in with a rising velocity was a super nice touch! great job!
EDIT: oh man that quiet part back into the climax was great, seriously this is a jam! great work ahaha
Touch typing on typewriters was ubiquitous for secretaries and typing pools. I was taught on a mechanical typewriter with a cover over the keys. To accommodate the key and hammer mechanics the rows were considerably steeper in their rake. This assisted in the muscle memory and made mistaken keys less frequent. Fingers moved "up to the right" or "down to the left from the familiar home key; ASDF ;LKJ.
Your hands could lay on the keys at rest when reading back your work without risking phantom strokes, such was the force required to operate.
Olivetti electromechanical 'golf ball' typewriters flattened the angle and compressed the gap between keys. It was a very hard adjustment at first.
17:08 FYI, that is called a “flat flex cable” (not “ribbon cable”, because that term refers to the thicker, lots-of-round-wires-stuck-together cables like the gray one for the hard drive), or FFC for short. Orange ones like this are made of Kapton (polyimide), not Mylar (metalized biaxially-oriented PET, like in Mylar birthday balloons). The reason people sometimes confuse them is that the metalized Kapton films used on the lunar module and such were often mistakenly referred to as Mylar, even though they weren’t! People often thought one side of those was gold-plated, but the gold color actually came from the Kapton.
As for the tear: if you can solder decently, you can use a fiberglass brush to carefully expose the broken metal conductor and then solder a bodge wire to fix it. Alternatively, if the ends of the FFC are standard, which they probably are, you might be able to buy an off-the-shelf replacement and then make a few 45 degree folds in it to make it lay properly. This isn’t a weird hack, it’s actually a common way FFCs are routed in commercial products instead of costly custom FFCs.
thank you, knowledge man, for your knowledge
The first song you've ever written is not only perfectly inoffensive, it aptly captures an era to where I'm suddenly nostalgic for a game that never existed.
"As soon as I do that it'll just turn into a PC and become boring so let's not turn it on yet." This, right here, is why I keep coming back to this channel.
Dude this is one cool project you got there :) also I just wanted to say that your power mod for the thing is actually quite novel and functional, even if not aesthetic. And function is more important than form with PCs. And that first Adlib song you made is a real banger. You got some talent there :)
Thank you for all of the above!
They make these things called Pico PSUs, they're tiny little boards you can mount in the case, wire the outputs to the board then for input they have a DC jack and an external brick to do conversion. It would be a much cleaner solution. Edit - You'd need to pick up a 20 pin ATX Pico and a 20 pin ATX to AT converter cable but it should still be fine.
ATX Picos do not include the -5V that ISA ports need.
@@robertbackhaus8911 You can use a voltage regulator and derive -5V from the -12V rail. Though it's very likely not needed.
Original Sound Blasters needed -5V, but SB16s which the Vibra in the video shouldn't need it.
The PicoPSU would be a great option to clean up the build.
@@robertbackhaus8911 -5v is only actually needed for some of the older expansion cards, most will work fine without it. Its almost exclusively soundcards and even then most of the newer ISA cards simply derive it from the -12v line.
@@dungeonseeker3087 yeah, like the Sound Blaster in there
The original internal PSU was pretty much an early version of the Pico PSU concept! Newer ones are probably better quality though.
"Wobbly" video is extremely indicative of old, dried up capacitors, usually in the power supply, but not necessarily. When power draw increases, so do the fluctuations. Whether that's from increased HDD activity or more CPU load.
For a first time composer, that is a pretty good tune!
You might be able to get turbo working with ctrl-alt and (on the numpad) the plus key. Pressing ctrl-alt minus will put it in slow mode.
either that or Alt (not Alt Gr) and both left+right shift (had this sequence on a couple of computers)
except that Pentium and later computers don't actually support a turbo/slow mode. The only way to practically do that is to disable the L1 cache. At that point the Pentium might be more like a 486 or 386.
@@SeeJayPlayGames probably yes
Still, I do remember some first pentium MMX computer having a turbo switch and LED 🤔🤔 which might also be faked and just turning on and off just the LED, indeed
@@Grizzly_Lab Your are probably correct as at that stage low end machines were using last years cases that did actually use the turbo function.
i have a pentium 100 still running strong and it has no turbo options on the mother board pins, best guess is by that stage no one really wanted to slow down a windows based pc to run 4.7 mh games
32:30 It's the networking stack making Windows 98 freeze on boot. Probably waiting on DHCP.
Agreed. Windows 98 with a disconnected Ethernet card take forever to boot. Disabling the card or connecting the cable before booting will fix the issue.
Or just give it a static IP Address
^^ Zot. Win 9x era was rather sloppy re: networking. I guess nobody ever considered that you might not have plugged in the cable one day.
for a first midi sequence you ever wrote, it's effing awesome!!!
I’m so happy your channel is doing well. Everything about it makes me happy
I already press like on any new video you post on principle, but I’d like a double like button for the music you composed. I genuinely think it’s fantastic.
I am a professional musician so can be super-critical, but I have no need to be. This is really great.
seriously, that track...
from a musical perspective: deceptively simple start, but still chill vibes. the progressive layering gets quite complex without polluting the rhythm/spectrum and turning it into sludge (not easy). and the ~20s from about 39:05 to 39:25... structurally, that it exists is impressive for a first song, and i really like it
could be projecting a bit myself, but if there's a chance you want to be making music and don't think you're good enough... even if they're "accidental", your intuition and taste guided you to some great choices, and you're selling yourself short
I just need to let you know something. I've been subbed for a while now. I LOVE how much you've been branching out on subject matter. I read the title of this video and thought to myself "ehhh..." then I saw it was from your channel, and thats when I got interested. Always love hearing your take on just about anything that gets you riled up.
thanks for watching and thanks for the input. I wasn't sure if the title sucked and now I am. I'll fix it.
@@CathodeRayDude not even really that it sucks, i just happen to be a rando who is subbed to a bunch of retro pc channels and thought it was one of them at first. Ngl, i love the neccissary horrors inside this one, and how you let us know what was about to happen, top notch entertainment lol
Those annoying round pin power connectors are Kycon connectors. I think they're specifically Kycon KPJX or KPPX series connectors but in my experience they just get called Kycon connectors. You can still buy them new, the mating half for the one on your machine is probably a KPPX-4P-SR7DI.
Yes, that's exactly right. I have a bag of KPPX 3 and 4 pin plugs. I blame Targus.
Those Winbond chips are probably the L2 cache, based on how they're close to the CPU (and based on my experience with other Socket 7 motherboards that have L2 cache there too). The PIIs (and earlier PIIIs) are massive because the L2 is put onto the processor card to bring it closer to the CPU. Intel switched back to sockets with later PIIIs once they were able to reliably package the L2 directly onto the CPU die and no longer needed the card space.
That would make a lot of sense! I forgot about discrete cache in that era.
@@CathodeRayDude Dont forget that there were a lot of first gen pentium machines with NO L2 Cache. Made them not a lot faster than a 486. I bet if Intel had never integrated the cache or done so later that there would have been OEMs building machines with no cache right up to that point.
I love that you acknowledged the evolution of the first gen pentium too, the first ones were 800nm 5 volt monsters!
That long pause is a Windows 98 thing. If I recall correctly, it happens when you have an Ethernet port with no cable plugged in. I think it's a timeout where it's waiting for an IP address from a DHCP server (that it will never get if the cable isn't connected).
I remember I had two external hard drives at one point that used that weird 4-prong plug. One used a 5V supply, the other one used a 12V supply (which I found out when I mixed up the two power bricks and blew one of them up). That day I learned to label all of my power supplies as to which device they belong to.
Rip
At work I have a 4 disk toaster dock, a Dell laptop dock, and a third power supply also from Dell but we don't know what it goes to, with that connector. 6, 12, 24V, it's hilarious. I think the 12V one is even like 16 amps for some reason
The Wii and Wii U have a similar issue, they use the same connector but aren't quite compatible. They won't immediately blow up but they'll get really unhappy, my Wii had issues for at least a year after I plugged it into a U supply by accident
44:45 - They eventually become 'Thermal Talkies" when the plastic bearings in their fans are cashed (12:48)!
You have a natural talent for tracker music, Gravis! I love it! It sounds like something from the early PC demo scene. It's awesome!
I want to say about a year ago I seen one of your videos... I'm like what's this goofy nerd doing... since then you and your content have slowly grown on me. I'm not a patreon, but reaching out to say I truly appreciate what you're doing I enjoy the stories you tell.
hey that tracker music sounds pretty good. wouldn't be out of place in a typical era game!
42:36 the voice of "bad and naughty children get put in the pear wiggler to atone for their crimes"
I do remember quite a few modern wedges, though they're usually very rare and only one somewhat popular design, the RasPi 400. but cybernet, Great Wall are a few others I can remember off the top of my head. I've only ever seen one windows 10 wedge, most of them are WinXP era.
wedge is pretty generous, they're basically a normal keyboard but most of an inch thick (except for the great wall)
yeah that's kinda why i make the distinction; even if there *are* newer integrated machines, I'm sure they're all just kinda flat "trays." Not nearly as exciting as a wedge!
my favorite form factor. I was half excited about a production cyberdeck with that asus eeepc thing with the integrated display but it went absolutely nowhere.
The Song was just SO AMAZING! Like actually wow!
I think there were probably more (and more obscure) wedge computers that you're aware of. For a start, at least four companies made versions of that Sinclair PC200 (Amstrad PC20, Schneider Euro PC, Olivetti PC1). Then you get things like the "Commodore 64 Web It", which was a wedge PC that booted into a C64 emulator. I'm sure there are many, may more examples but most of them have been lost to obscurity.
The PC20 was just a "paint job and a logo" over the PC200, but the Euro PC and PC1 we only similar in as much as they all were XT Clones. From CPU to Gfx to motherboard layout, very different beasts.
"spinning 5v straw into 3.3v gold", lovely line. there is a real poetry to your writing.
"i got in before the title/thumbnail changed" squad
You wrote a very nice demo track, and it was cool seeing Adlib Tracker again!
Love your straightforward explanatory approach. I am ignorant of much of your specialist area, yet i can learn so much. I see you there, quietly being a good true person in the midst of... the stuff. Subscribed.
"So don't be too harsh, this is literally the first song I've written."
This track would have been right at home in the demoscene or PC / Amiga games of the early 1990s. And that's a good thing.
bestie that song you just made is so good ??? it has no business being such a bop lol great job 😭😭😭
I love Wedge PCs. They just strike a fun nostalgic chord for me. BTW, If you haven't seen it, the Raspberry PI 400 is a cute little modern wedge PC.
I think that Gravis would not consider that a PC though, because of difference in hardware architecture.
Cathode Ray Dude...
Now that you've written your very first piece of kick ass music, you should use it in your opening.
I completely agree with most of the comments here about the first song you've written. It is amazing and perfect for any 8 bit game that you might create one day soon. It's so catchy and could quickly become a classic.
This is such an interesting video. Your composition is really good. I’m re listening with headphones shortly …
"It's ugly, it could've been done better, but it works" should be the entire PC industry motto.
I know I'm like the whole freaking half a year behind on this but the switch you put in for the atx I'm smiling writing this I haz a tear of happiness forming....ty for being you 😊 and then magic happens and I'm in full tears of happiness now...wow
Dude! Your videos are like a birthday present 🎁 I've been waiting for a new one while watching the old ones over and over 😅😊 thanks for your hard work!
Happy belated birthday Konrad!
There's a very good reason a wedge shaped PC is rare: Health'n'safety!
Wedge shaped was a great way to have a home computer - just one box to store in a drawer when not in use, and you plug it into the living room TV to play games on. In schools, apples and BBC micros lived under monitor stands.
However in the office, their chunky keyboards were judged poor ergonomically, as you noted the height, but the killer was you could not adjust the rake, so they were considered a hazard for RSI. They also took up depth of desk unless you stacked the monitor on them, and unless you had a school style monitor stand, you couldn't adjust the position of the keyboard.
This meant they were considered unprofessional and unacceptable in most major offices, which went for the IBM PC style beige box with separate adjustable keyboard. In the UK, due to their popularity in some 'prosumer' applications, some companies (eg Viglen) even made conversion cases for the BBC micro to turn it into a 2-box solution so it could fit into an office environment more acceptably.
Since the PC started in the business world, it's not surprising it took til much later for someone to go the other way, and even less so that the application was for an education setting. So easy to deploy and maintain a room-full of these one-box PCs in a computer suite - if one goes down you swap out the whole unit. Young people not in your employ, using the machine for a limited session, are less likely to sue you for their crippling RSI. Push and pull factors satisfied.
---
4-pin power Mini-DIN connector. Awful, you can too easily plug them in the wrong way round and fry devices.
I saw quite a few of the Amstrad keyboard PCs in the UK, including the Sinclair PC200 one. Although the Amstrad PPC was really a portable with integrated screen, like a precursor to modern laptops.
This video made me happy. That song is freaking awesome! Keep on nerding bro!
Maybe the screen ripple is because it's not verifying DMI pool data 😂
Huh, didn't expect an adlib tune this nice from a self-proclaimed first-timer.
You should definitely continue down that path, a welcome addition to this community.
I wonder if you've looked into the PicoATX PSUs, would allow you to put it internally and have the 12v barrel jack in the original hole.. Tho they might need an extension harness with a -5v regulator if that soundblaster really needs it.
Great video as always, the keikaku reference near killed me. And that song... genuinely amazing, would love to hear more if you ever pursue that.
thats pretty goood for your first midi
I was impressed by your little tune :-) not really surprised though, you primed me talking about that awful ride cymbal ; if you know your way around a drumkit surely you can compose music hahaha
On the Amstrad PPC512/640, I have a working one and they are around in the UK/Europe. They're actually designed as a portable machine and can run off battery power or 12v DC from a car, hence the integrated LCD. 🙂
Awesome video, love these weird form factors!
Dude, that tracker song you composed was awesome! Great job!
That's a pretty banging tune dude.
I like that you've kinda made this half way to your own cyberdeck with all the mods, the jank and the custom ad lib tracker song.
It's got its own character now with all the jank going on.
Your original song? Pretty damned great :)
Hey, that song you wrote was actually pretty good! Took a little to warm up but then it really popped off!
Fair to say if we were teleported back to the 90s as our younger selves, we would have been pretty impressed by it.
oh awesome. I have one of these but it proved to be the MOST ANNOYING FUCKER I've ever used. Like, I couldn't identify any 1 component that was bad, all the caps seemed fine, nothing was getting too hot, but it would only ever run for like 10 minutes at a time at best. I spent weeks trying to repair it into something like functionality, and completely failed.
and thank you for mentioning the Tandy. the whole time you were listing the other wedges I was like TANDY! TANDY! GRAVIS DIDN'T I BUY OR SELL A TANDY 1000 OFF YOU?
oh fusb me, you mention me and my terrible machine later in the video
also I was totally about to go "hey you know cybernet kept making this until at least the pentium 4 era" before you mentioned it. well done on the research!
That song for a first composition is not bad at all honestly. Giving a PC a specific function keeps thing interesting. Thanks for sharing once more!
More original music please!!
"expandandability, something a wedge can't offer"
Cries in Amiga 1200
I'd be curious if the visual artifacts would be resolved with running your own video card. Some of those old video chips were real crap.
Wouldn't trust that daughter card above the graphics chip either. It's old, unshielded, and the device itself probably wasn't built with top shelf components, so there's a good chance that the electronics in it are dying/bad, screwing up the voltage rails its making or even creating EMI.
Just an educated guess, and I can't really rewind to correct my assessment since YT doesn't like to save comment replies on mobile.
The distortion of the advert for the sidewinder was kind of amazing.
"This is literally the first song I have ever written" = : Literally better than the melodies and beats on current pop radio.
Man that 'first song' was great! Would love to hear more.
Wedge PCs need to make a comeback.
Enjoying you doing the extra mile, again. Also you are pleasant to listen to.
I believe the only keyboard integrated PC which is produced nowadays is the raspberry pi one.
In the early 2010's there were some of those with netbook like specs. With those awful Atom processors which were too slow to run windows 7.
Love my pi one
I have always been fascinated by the CyberNet PCs! The Jefferson County Public Libraries in Colorado had these in use for YEARS after they were relevant for looking up book locations, and the Pentium 4 machines were used for free web access. I remember being a 10 year old boy who was BEGGING his mother to buy him one of these MMX machines off of eBay for Christmas
The computer "POISK" was created in the USSR. Modern Ukraine, which appeared in 1992, has nothing to do with the creation of this computer, which was created in the Ukrainian SSR. Modern Ukraine, completely and completely denies everything that was created during the USSR. So you are being misled.
Scrolled down to see if one of the mad lads from your Patreon magically knew why the graphics were rippling, but everyone was (rightfully!) talking about your lovely music. I'll have to wait for the sudden thrilling conclusion you may discover in $TIME! What a mystery! I think it's sweet that you'll just "let it be weird." If only all of us could be granted such grace in our lives.
The last wedge PC? What about the Raspberry Pi-400 ? Still a cool video, thanks!
Not a PC? Doesn't have an x86 processor.
Big points, that composition is really solid stuff, especially for working in adlib constrictions! What a fun little machine, having an adlib player feels like something that'd come in handy.
The screen issue sounds more like a shielding issue which could be in the VGA cable or with the VGA port and path shielding. I used to see this with cheap crappy VGA extension cables in data centres back in the day, which then confuses the hell out of modern monitors as they are digital and don’t really understand analogue signals, which is what VGA is. Had you had this on an old school CRT, it would likely have also shown up as ghosting with interference from pretty much anything causing screen artifices of one form or another.
Oh, and Jan Hammer is pronounced as Yan Hammer, worked alongside him once when I was setting up the computer systems at a live performance once. Nice guy and increasingly talented musician.
First ever song? Bro that's pretty damn decent! I'd listen to that again for sure. Well done! You may have a hidden talent here.
That song is a SOLID, era/hardware appropriate jam! You work well within whatever limits you face, well done!
6:58 - I'm not sure what you mean here - most professional typists were touch-typists back in the typewriter days.
I almost missed the CWU stencil, lol. I've worked there for over 20 years now, started out as a student assistant in the "microcomputer" lab in the library... Surplus sales to die for! Glad to see our old hardware getting new life from RE-PC. Graet content keep up the great work.
I remember the first "wedge PC" I ever made (and it was the last, fortunately). These steps work best in about 1999: First, get a Compaq Armada laptop. Then, set it on top of a rack mounted server you're working on while it's slid out on its rails. Then, from the back, slide the server back into the cabinet while forgetting your laptop is on top. Pick the laptop up off the floor. Now, while you're waiting for a replacement for your destroyed display, just remove it, and you have a Wedge PC until the new monitor arrives! (Fortunately the HDD and everything else still worked!)
I'm going to bet this board was manufactured by Advantech. The SIS5571 and the "LCD/CRT" video output point to this being an industrial/kiosk motherboard. The internal layout of the computer could easily follow the board requirements.
i don't know why but your long videos just don't get boring, happy you switched to making these full time :)
Sick tunes man, that was a real bop. You should make some more. Maybe you could offer them up to other people to use for sound demos so they too can avoid the content id
Wow! For your first composition this is shockingly competently done. I have been teaching about music production, and I don't take any of the composition skills for granted, and your intuition is really good here. I think you could really make some nice music, consider exploring this more if it was fun, and I assume it was :)
I remember Zero Footprint PC ads from my dad's old issues of Wired magazine. What a blast from the past! Great tunes, Gravis! You could moonlight as a chiptune musician.
I know I’m joining in with others saying that tracker tune was decent, but hell yeah, that was definitely decent!
You started with the fourths on the bassline, and the melody was guided by that! You didn’t try to do anything too complex, just a straightforward little bop. The moments of tension and increased rhythm section were effective, and overall it stayed in its lane. Well done!
It’s simple enough that I actually kinda want to cover it and improvise a more complex melody over the top haha
Best first song ever that I've heard in my life nokap. Maybe you should be writing more music with this software, eh?
If it's one thing I always wonder about retro tech collectors, its 'what do you actually do with the devices you own?' so hearing your story of how you repurposed it along with a study of the oddities of this machine was super interesting.
Plenty of devices I'm sure are just museum pieces but actually seeing how, even if you must modify the system a bit first, you've found a way to keep it useful for a task (such as making really good music! :D Well done!) or for fun as a MIDI jukebox and 'DOS game-console'. A much better way for a computer in its 'retirement' to find purpose than just slowly going bad on a shelf, before eventually being recycled or worst, becoming e-waste.
Yeah! I think about this constantly - "okay, I have this stuff, it's neat, but how can I actually do something with it?" Much of the time... I basically can't, hah.
From what I've seen second hand, hospitals used these a lot. The two I have are both from different hospitals anyways.
I like this form factor, idk exactly why, I have a WinXP version (D5) with a trackpad in place of a Numpad and it is extremely handy for the odd time I need XP for something and I don't have to settle for a laptop screen from 20 years ago or its battery. I also have the H6 variant with Windows 7, I put a larger HDD in there and since it has a DVD drive with HDMI I can play stuff I have loaded on the internal drive, streaming sites work perfectly and it plays discs. And it's so much faster and easier to use than an HDMI stick streaming device. Everything is built in.
Your first song ever rocks. Sounds like the title screen for an obscure Space Wizard game
I feel so centered while watching this. Thank you for calming my spirit with a great tech video.
Love the song you composed!
That little board next to the CPU is essentially just a VRM (voltage regulator module) so that the system can use a CPU with different voltages than the board design otherwise provides. --- I'm not sure why a regular 3.5" IDE hard drive wouldn't work right out of the box, but the inability to use a CD drive is likely explained by the way the system supports a drive out of the box at all. That was after all an era when hard drives were either not standard or had only recently become so. --- The SiS 5571 chipset used apparently incorporates a hard disk controller, but it's entirely possible that it only supports PIO (parallel IO) modes (no DMA or UltraDMA/UDMA. I would be willing to bet that it only supports regular ATA (AT Attachment) and does NOT support ATAPI (aka 'ATA Packet Interface'). The latter is actually an extension to ATA that enables the use of other storage media than a hard drive on the same bus/controller. Not exactly sure your floppy drive is connected, perhaps there is a dedicated FDC (floppy drive controller) chip on the back side of the board,
I think the grievances you have with chunky keyboards is that you do actually rest your wrists down at an angle when typing. That's how you get RSI. Even on modern chicklet keyboards like those from Apple, you're supposed to hover your wrists off the desk keeping them level with your palms. Those foam wrist rests are just for that, resting between flurries of typing. Look at anything regarding office ergonomics, ergonomic keyboards or even a good quality typing tutor like Mavis Beacon; keep the bend in your wrist to an absolute minimum.