Blizzard does not have the creative capacity they once did. They don't have the competence or work ethic either. I truly believe that Blizzard is now incapable of generating anything new and worthwhile.
10+ years ago Blizzard had hundreds of people working on wow. Today it's like 2 people reskinning old content and throwing poo at a wall and seeing what sticks.
As someone who has been raiding mythic since early 2020, this might have been true a couple years ago, but the Retail game has gotten better and better the more time goes on. It’s definitely a much different game design then classic wow, with different rewards structures and different target audiences as a whole, but blizz is still designing great content these days. now, if you’re talking about blizzard, designing good classic plus content I wouldn’t hold my breath either. I’d have to see it to believe it.
People talk about wrath to cata being the end of "classic" and into the more "future retail" version of the game, but after playing so much era and then trying wrath, wrath feels a lot like modern retail to me,
Yeah it was absolutely a process of change which arguably started as early as TBC with the renewed focus on endgame above all other content, and the introduction of flying mounts. Wrath was a major part of that change; heirlooms, LFD, removal of skills, catch-up mechanics to get into the endgame without progression etc. But Cataclysm cemented it. At least in Wrath, the world you're in is the same one as Vanilla. By Cataclysm, the experience is different literally from level 1.
All of this would be meaningless without a classic plus system. Add everything you suggested + make it run on the TBC prepatch class talents. Vanilla has to eventually stop being world of warriorcraft if it intends to have life.
as a returning player, i am enjoying wotlk classic a lot, but i know its the nostalgia because that was the last expansion i played before stopping playing wow.
It's a shame it would be a risk to your channel to highlight Turtle WoW or other private servers here, even if they are putting out an arguably better product than Blizzard at this point. I get that. If you ever want to play on Turtle WoW just for fun, however, cameras off, we'd be thrilled to have you!
I would love to play it in my downtime, maybe we'll see once the vanilla playthrough is completed. I barely have enough time to keep the channel going right now unfortunately so I can't play more than one version of WoW at the moment. Hopefully if things go well with the channel though, that will change and I'll have more time!
I'm just gonna stick to the classic era. I tried Wotlk for a good amount of time, and it just didn't hit the same. It's probably because everyone was just level boosted to TBC. My limited time classic era has been the best for me because I can play it without FOMO, and it's just has enjoyable zones. Besides STV, that place is a nightmare. I don't think I've been killed by Alliance as many times as I have when I stepped into STV. It's a bloodbath. Everything else has been very fun 😂. I also like not having level boost in classic era. It allows me to find parties for elite quest so easily in vanilla compared to current wotlk. I hope they never implement it into classic era.
One of the next episodes in the Vanilla series is going to be about my experience in Badlands and STV this week...I actually am considering re-speccing to sub/assassination because of how bad it's gotten hahaha
Me and my cousins are all playing vanilla again and tbh its great. Tonnes of people 24/7 and no stupid cash shop, NO WOW TOKEN!!!!!! :) or boostie BOTS destroying the eco because they paid x dollars and are max lvl farming reagents. 1-40 there has always been ppl to do quest and dungeons with. I stopped leveling at 40 weeks ago just so I can enjoy the midgame pvp :) I have been able to kill 60's with my lvl 40 rouge which to me is alot of fun :)
@@ghouliet If you enter red ridge, STV, hillsbrad, burning steppes, wetlands, tanaris ect ect Be ready to fight for your life, even at 3am server time. There are so many people questing/lvling and there are groups of hired goons to protect and or gank some areas as well.
How the fuck does someone else purchasing a level boost somehow affect you so much that it removes your ability to judge a game objectively? You do realize you don’t need to buy a boost and that leveling is a joke rigjt? This isn’t vanilla - leveling is a minor part of wotlk. Just something you do to get to 80 asap and start enjoying the actual game. I’ve never once seen a good player complain about level boosts. It’s always the type of person whose experience of “having fun” in wow consists of leveling a character to lvl 18, doing DM or WC once, then remaking a new toon. I mean FFS you’re concerned with “not finding groups for quests while leveling”, which says all I need to know about you. You aren’t a serious player, you’re a casual who just levels and does no end game Content.
*Final Fantasy 14* *No BETA's, No Datamining, No Spoilers, Everything is Fair and Blind for all.* *No Daily Chores or Mandatory Grind, Super casual friendly with a big Community.* *No Gambling Mechanics, No Pay2Win and the Hardest Endgame Raids in all MMORPGs.*
Thanks man, its great to see you here! it's funny because I dont really have much of an interest in comedy outside of this, I just like telling stories and combining that with a more unfiltered approach, in line with how everyone in mmos talks to each other haha.
I hope you're enjoying it mate! I think ultimately they will always only care about profits, which is why Classic started in the first place - due to the demand from players. That can be used to our advantage, we'll just have to see how things go.
I can understand why private servers are such a hush hush deal at least for WoW in particular and why some even ban streaming since that keeps private servers private aside from the fact that they are publicly available and easy to find if you know what to look for. As we have learned from Escape from Tarkov, EULAs don't hold up in court and I heard Blizzard tried to shut down Turtle WoW early this year but couldn't because it's different enough so as not to violate trademark or copyright. As for Classic Plus, I think it would take a good while to make a Classic Plus of reasonable quality and definitely hard to replicate what the original devs made. Classic made sense from a money perspective because it's a lot easier to rerelease an existing game and port it to a newer engine than it is to make something new. Old Blizzard took huge risks and crunched to even make WoW and W3 in the first place and even as big as Blizzard are now, I still doubt they have the budget for Classic Plus anytime soon. It would probably also take an even bigger team than Classic got initially.
I agree about the time taken to make Classic Plus if we are talking about new zones, raids etc. But theres no reason for it to start that big. They could begin with simple class enhancements which would improve gameplay significantly, for example
Personally believe cataclysm was the end of classic and it should not move forward past wotlk having said than if they did go ahead with classic + I think they should keep the same content but with higher difficulty maybe add transmog
Playing expansion by expansion over again is unnecessary. “Classic vanilla WoW +“ should be implemented at this point instead of maintaining classic servers for each expansion.
I feel like wrath was the end of that classic era already. It felt like raid logging was cranked up from 6/10 to 9/10 from tbc, and the “feel” within raids and heroics completely lost their classic sense to them. The difficulty of wrath raids are better for gamers who like to push through challenges, but terrible if you like any thing else about a mmo.
Yeah, also the "difficulty" of Wrath is nothing compared to modern WoW, so it really isn't a challenge for many players who want challenging content and have experienced any retail raiding outside of LFR in the last 10 years. I mean, even during the actual days of Wrath in 2008, all raiding content was cleared within 48 hours of initial release. Players got really good, real quickly. Designing the game around endgame instanced content was a mistake.
Blizzard should start small with Classic+. Add things that did not break wow. Guild bank, Armory, new professions capped at 300 (jewelcrafting, inscription, archaeology). Then try something more ambitious but still proven... like porting Karazhan as a 10-man raid to Classic, itemized around AQ or Naxx level with drops that help balance uder-itemized classes (Ret pallies, Ferals, etc). Add other proven 5-mans to Caverns of Time capped at 60 (Culling of Strat, etc). But no increase in level cap or new continents.
Yes and No. You can't just add something simple as "Guild Bank" right off the bat. You have to make it fit the style of Classic and old school. This is how I would have done in the case of a Guild Bank. 1. A Guild Bank is unlocked as a reward for your guild for killing the last boss in the first raid. Atleast (lets say) 25 players in your guild have to be present during this kill. 2. A new tab in the Guild Bank will be unlocked as a reward for killing a new last boss in a raid; MC, Onyxia, ZG, BWL, AQ40...(no point in having Naxx here) 3. You can always withdraw items from a Guild Bank. If the guild disbands, you can still withdraw the items. 4. You can only deposit items into a Guild Bank if your guild has atleast 25 members. To make it basically impossible to have your own bank alt... Why this system? 1. To avoid botters and bank alts to create Guild Banks. 2. The guild bank should feel like a reward for the guild in which they can store flasks and items etc for the current and next raids. I just made this up on top of my mind; this is why Classic is fun. It's slow and rewarding and nothing should be free.
If they move ahead with a Cata Classic, I won't be playing it. Chiefly for the reasons you go over in the vid. However, I hope to God, they establish TBC/Wrath servers for those of that want to remain in the true Classic experience. They have to recognize that many people will not want to lose old Azeroth for the revamp and allow us the option of moving to different servers locked in the Wrath era.
How difficult is it, for Blizzard(Activision), to run Wow Vanilla Classic, And TBC Classic and WotLK Classic???? ???? Too hard i guess...:( I find the first three of WoW's the most fun and really really really good games actually. Masterpieces, all three. What's the difficulty in mediation / middle way / hosting those ???? Why not leave the LvLCap at 60 in Vanilla, at 70 in TBC and at 80 in WotLK??? [Sometimes, not to act, will be the best of choices.]
Honestly Retail and Classic are 2 very different games, same story... Classic is mostly a traditional MMO, while retail is more of a single player story with multiplayer aspects.
Hey Vulgrin, I like that Asmongold covered one of your videos. Some people shit on bigger streamers doing react content but for me I see that as opening an audience to people like your self I never came across on years of youtube! Nice to get so many different views on this game especially also as its one I've played for 15 years off and on. Keep up the content dude and wish you continue to grow in audience views and subs
Thanks man, I really appreciate your support and I agree re: Asmon. I'm immensely grateful for him and others who have helped share my videos so that others get to see them, it really does encourage smaller channels to work hard and grow.
@@vulgrin9573We are the #AsmonArmy and you are a friend! Our literally god react to you! Its a honor and we will follow Asmon on any part! Nice video dude!
Had a guild mate suggest they open it up for player development. Content mods, effectively. might be rife with problems but i like playing fan-made content too, even when true Vanilla has been my biggest love affair.
You're actually delusional if you think Blizzard would write one line of new code for Classic. Classic is meant to be a low cost thing Blizzard can do to juice the numbers for their investors.
I really hope they don't touch classic wow, or at least make + optional. If they force me into plus I'm simply done wasting time on this game I play purely for nostalgia.
Vanilla Wow was an incredible experience but let's be honest, it was also insanely addictive and life ruining for many people. I know I wasn't alone in having crippling issues with playing too much. As much as I hate what WoW has become, I'm glad that the game went to shit and I was able to quit during Cataclysm. The game really messed up my dopamine for a long time like no other game has. The world is better off without MMOs.
An opinion I heard many times when I still played Wrath was 'persistent Wrath servers' instead of moving to Cata, similar to how we have Classic era. More options are always good and it'd be great if TBC weaves its way into that as well, right? Well.... it is as you said with 'developers from 20 years ago'. Vanilla was still developed until the end when 2000s Blizzard decided to make those changes into an expansion instead. The progression path is the journey we are familiar with. There is some good and odd loot in dungeons you want and run them over and over, then you do the 20s and MC into BWL. Then you get AQ40, which requires more effort and at last Naxx. The same progression from 2004-2006 still exists in era. But TBC and WotLK were designed with easing players into end-game content in mind, creating catch-up mechanics that render old raids as pointless. Doing the 10s in TBC is enough to get you right into BT and Hyjal. Wrath seems to be even more extreme with both games also progressively nerfing raids to allow weaker guilds to clear them as well. Persistent Wrath servers wouldn't offer much with a simplified journey with lots of shortcuts to 70 and once hitting 80, get funnelled into the last raid tier by badges and dungeon drops. This is, unless a team would actively tinker with Wrath to make it work and that probably won't happen, considering that Classic was mostly just touched when bug-fixes were on the plate. It's not even just about not trusting Blizzard regarding Classic+ either, but as you mentioned as well, developing additional content with the same rough edges as 20 years ago is difficult, let alone for a team that didn't develop the initial game even. The best there can be is the creation by dedicated players. Many discontinued franchises these days were reanimated by fans making indie games or making rom hacks to keep beloved games alive. Private servers that do Classic+ are essentially nothing more than very elaborate rom hacks.
I agree with you, thanks for the really in depth discussion here. I have such fond memories of private servers because they take the idea of that niche, online world to the next level by putting the power back into the hands of players (quite an idealistic view of them but hey haha). I also agree that the challenges facing the development of Classic Plus would be great, but somewhat eased by the fact that 1.) They could use an OSRS style voting board, which would mean that these choices were decided by players, and 2.) There was so much cut content from Vanilla that they would already have a bit of a blueprint for where to go next. Thanks again, I hope you enjoyed the video!
You are absolutely delusional about vanilla being in any way difficult or requiring time and energy to complete raids. For fuck sake hardcore servers came out not even two weeks ago and players have already downed rag in full greens without a single death. Absolutely no one is wasting time doing MC who takes the game serious. They are going to harder raids and there’s nothing to stop them. We don’t want to have to do naxx 10 man when ICC is out you clown. Also, wrath has never, not once, “nerfed” any raids. All raids were released pre nerf and never got nerfed, the sole exception being algalon’ one hour time being removed in the current patch (but his pre nerf difficulty remained). As for TBC, Ssc/TK we’re released pre nerf and broke a ton of guilds up at the time. They were only nerfed when the new raids came out which was a GOOD idea. They let people have a crack at the pre nerf content for a few months and then nerfed the final bosses when Hyjal/BT came out, as coordinating four raids a week would have been a nightmare. And unlike wrath, TBC still had one of the relics of vanilla wow, that being that certain items such as the Lady Vashj belt, were full game or near full game bis despite being phase 2 content, forcing guilds to have to go back and do raids for one piece of loot. What players like you don’t seem to get is that audiences are different. People who play Wrath and TBC don’t want to spend hours having to level an alt and they don’t want to do three phase old content that they have already done to death, just to gear an alt. Which is why the catch up mechanics are welcomed by all.
I would love a classic plus where they add in the new models and animations, smooth out the UI, and go all in on adding new content without compromising the vision of the original game. This could be the "WoW 2" everyone keeps talking about, and most would love it.
Honestly even if Blizzard still had their more competant employees working there, I think it's hard to say if Blizzard would be able to create new Vanilla content that perfectly fits in. One example of this is that any new zone that is added would need to have chain quests that take you out of the zone and vice versa. And unfortunately, I think this is easier said than done. Even TBC, which was essentially made by the classic team failed to do this, making outland the first of many theme park expansions which really felt disconnected from the Vanilla zones.
If I were Blizzard, the good one that we all have been experienced, I would just rather sell (or open source it for non-profits) the code and services rather than releasing another level boost + wow coin scheme. So that some other people can develop the classic as their own way if they are brave enough to do so. My expectation is to see a WoW that has horizontal progress rather than steep vertical model which is what we have now. And a new lore that actually fits that horizontal scheme. For example, a WoW that runs like the Black Desert Online or EVE online. Well, just my 2 cents... I know Blizz will just sell more WoW tokens with level boost lol.
In no way do I support a Classic Plus release unless they do it separately from Classic. I don’t trust Blizzard not to screw up Classic. Just leave it the hell alone.
You honestly want Blizzard to do classic+? Full of bots, GDKP, selling gold? Thanks, but no thanks. You have TWoW now and it's free of bots and all the other crap that completely ruined WoW. There's no hope for the company that has been proved many times over they are icompetent to handle bots, let alone the gold selling. Why would you want this cesspool of a "Classic+"? Turtle just recently hit 11k, and it's going to 12k. It's so crazy, that they have to do something. Ppl want "QUALITY", not quantity and this is why turtle is blooming, and ppl are in awe becuase of that.
That is all true regarding blizz and trust with us as classic enthusiasts, but doesn't that make us the perfect and easiest customers to satisfy ? A little show of good faith would go a long way with all of since, since we all want it bad. As much as we might fight ourselves on it due to distrust, we all want it and want to be wrong about it.
They cant even add alerts like the Hardcore addon has on the Hardcore Wow Server - they didnt put any achievements etc. I dont think they will be able to do Classic + - you can already see they didnt put much work into Hardcore wow at all. They cant even put anti cheat into classic...or want....
dropping this comment early and then coming back to it after the video too see what changes in my mind but this is my thoughts on classic and wrath from my perspective. Playing warrior through out the first iteration was really fun, i got to do the worldbuff meta and other fun raiding stuff. After not really knowing what was my new class for a good time through Classic TBC and first half of WotLK ive now landed on Paladin (Holy to be precise) and im getting a similar feeling to how i felt in classic. WotLK soon being over is kind of sad because i really like how holy palas play in this current phase of classic. Im looking forward to cata in a way that its refreshing my spec. Classic+ would be so much fun but i wonder how much more fun it would be with some of WotLKs class balance and spells inside of vanilla but with twists. Id for sure play that game. back to the video to see if we share some thoughts! so far great vid man! after vid, Classic+ sounds fantastic, private servers is something ive been playing since the end of orignial WotLK. one thing thats been sad about them is keeping my progress. my trust in blizzard is low but i do think the Classic team has good people on it so i hope they get boosted in tp better positions where they can actually change things
Thanks for taking your time to really digest the video mate! I like your optimistic view on the possibilities, and I'm glad to hear you're having a blast with Holy Paladin. We can only hope you're right in regards to Classic Plus, I have to hope that some folks on the dev team realise that doing additional content for Vanilla in the right way means abandoning the modern philosophy behind retail and current Blizzard!
@@vulgrin9573that is so true, they need to separate themselves from the retail team. Play to the strengths of Vanilla and not push it to “engagement is bis” that retail currently is. Letting my trust in Microsoft, who’s already known to be the graveyard of game studios, is laughable and maybe PS is going to be my home once again.
Does anybody really want current day blizzard to attempt classic plus? I certainly don't, shit I want blizzard to move on and finally let the poor abused warcraft franchise die. Turtle WoW also isn't exactly perfect, especially with the creatures in charge banning people over the smallest of things.
Same, ultimately they will always keep untouched Classic servers because that is no extra work. It would be good to see what they could come up with - though outside of a OSRS style voting system, I have no idea how they could properly implement it!
Agree 1 billion percent! Duskhaven is by far the greatest vanilla era realm. I tried turtle wow but it's so awful, the slow leveling plus the time it takes just to kill a mob when you miss every other attack or spell just feels bad. Vanilla content on a wrath client is hands down the best experience. Plus all the custom stuff they added is farrrr superior to any other vanilla server.
@@vulgrin9573 very worth while. Demon hunters, Scarlet monestary monks, Shaman Tanks, Wogren, Tinkers, so many custom classes, and theyre all getting revamped to be not as janky
I feel bad for classic wow players. I get that you love vanilla wow but at a certain point you need to accept classic + won't be a thing and to just enjoy the classic era as a time capsule of better times. If you want a new game go out and play something else.
@@nickmiltenburg3699 it's different though for multiple reasons. For one Jagax isn't creatively bankrupt like Blizzard. Also runescape 3 was never nearly as popular as osrs. Unlike with wow where despite having players dropping off of retail, classic wow is still a smaller chunk of the community. Also wow's quality of graphics, game mechanics, and story are a lot more complex than runscape 3 and osrs. Osrs development is most likely not nearly as resource intense as adding content to classic wow
@@brohogany9920 not true. Dont forget OSRS was gone for a while just like classic wow moved on the retail. Many People didnt like Runescape 3 though Cause of demand of playerbase they restarted OSRS, and now that is the most popular version. Jaggexx are boss with costumer/community support though, thats true... public polls for new content is something we could only dream of at any Blizzard game.. And resource intense? Highly doubt it.... the whole body is allready formed, just needs to re-do some stuff.... private servers like turtle and duskhaven manage to do it, so am sure a multi billion dollar company can...
I belive they should balance the class abilities better, by starting at 19, then working their way up. This could have some problems sure. But it would be something.
I mean, add a taunt to a Paladin ability. ANY paladin ability, preferably a low level one, and then do something similar for Shamans! In every version, WoW needs more tanks, and the fact that they didn't give these two classes a genuine Taunt is absurd. While they're at it, they should help out Druids bear-form aggro abilities, too. Add more dungeons and raids across all levels. Consider adding modes allowing the lower level dungeons to be played at 60. Consider adding any of the races and classes in the original Warcraft games to WoW Classic.
I agree. Sounds silly, but I've stopped playing Wrath classic as Blizzard just give it such a tiny fart of their time and energy. Even the loading screens are low resolution and wrong aspect ratio. They only released WOW classic because it was easy money, for little work.
I think they realised they could cash in on the Nostalrius hype train, and peoples genuine love for vanilla wow. It was a cynical move and I wish they had done more with the classic project
played WOW for 16 years. dabble with all 3 versions of the game. Retail is a trainwreck of too much nonsense to keep up with , Wrath feels like retail already with a bunch of hardcore raid loggers, crushes the fun never able to get an invite to anything even as a 5k GS hunter. Classic Era is best out of all 3 forsure but i think people have swipped there cards on 3rd party sites to get tons of gold to buy all there gear in end game since its always GDKPs. I hope for a classic + with extra content that they never finished after naxx and rushing TBC. i doubt they can deliver since blizzard has changed so much in a not so good way. im getting older now too and maybe that nostalgia will never be the same.
The game is still fun, I dont think age changes that, but I fully agree about the issues, including in classic era. For my part, I try to focus on what I'm doing and enjoy the game for what it is without looking always to the future. If the problems with classic grow too great, i will move to something else but for now it's a good experience still
I would love Classic+, but just look at what they did with the expansions. Monetised mounts, boosts, token(P2W). I tried to enjoy the expansions, but they just weren't as good as Vanilla, add on top of that the disgusting monetization and its a game killer. People disliked the mount/boost sales so much that Blizzard nerfed the /spit emote to defend whales etc. The company is totally lost and doesn't have a clue how to make a good game anymore. They lost the vision years ago.
I think the sad reality is that when one mainstream game opens the door to that kind of aggressive monetisation, every company will jump on it as they're all competing with each other. Whether Blizzard started it, or if they were just copying what was already being done, particularly in Eastern MMOs, the outcome was the same - a poorer experience for players, in my view at least.
I don't think they will do classic cataclysm since that was the expansion everyone rage quit wow, after that everything turned to shit. but it would be cool for something NEW but in the echo of classic
I bet the do make Cata, and I'll probably play it. I dropped off half way through it, life got in the way. Didn't try WoW again until Legion. But man Shadowlands really makes you wonder about Blizzard. Retail looks amazing but, behind the veneer it's shit. Anyway on classic. I hope the have persistent Vanilla and Wrath servers. I'll probably just play in those two versions, on and off, until WoW dies altogether.
Isn't classic plus originally just tbc 😂 look how quickly people got bored of that. You will get a new classic plus patch and will be bored after 3 months just like any other expansion
It depends how they do it. People get bored because the game is focused around endgame instances, which once completed, get dull fast. The first step would be to address class balancing, and maybe add some new zones. But hey, maybe you're right!
Blizzard doesn't exist. It died when Activision took over. Calling a company Blizzard doesn't make it Blizzard just like calling an xpac World of Warcraft doesn't make it World of Warcraft.
I think if people are prepared to play hardcore WoW, these 3rd party servers could offer the same thing without any problem, as we are prepared to loose our characters and reroll at any time. I’ve never played on a 3rd party server though to be honest, but I have to admit, it’s becoming far more appealing!!!
arent private servers even worse with corruption and pay to win shit? so why play on them? i dont want to invest alot of time in something that can just end out of nowhere, i dont get it can some one explain?
i love the idea of classic but in honesty i just cant go back. I love the world but the class design is a bit crap. Id like to see the graphics updated to modern wow level, classes updated and new content added. So yeah this wont ever happen so Im stuck in retail to feed on scraps and find my own fun
I totally get you. It's alright for me because I essentially only play Rogue and maybe Warrior if I feel like it. If I was say, a Paladin, Druid or Shaman player, I'd be lost haha
Three things blizzard needs to do to vanilla classic. Add dungon finder have class balance and make the pvp system where u can just buy the gear with honor points. This will make the grind of the game a lot less annoying and more fun.
Hopefully the future is people realizing how much of a better experience they can get in private servers, frankly. There are many amazing vanilla and better yet vanilla+ servers out there. Keep an eye on Duskhaven and Conquest of Azeroth.
delusional. people have already figured how much inferior private servers are compared to the real deal. that's why the majority of players are still willing to pay that montly sub for a 15+ y old game hosted by the devil itself no matter how "good" your or anyone's private server might be. most will not waste their time on on a not legit server for it to possibly vanish at any moment due to several issues/reasons.
Blizzard does not have the creative capacity they once did. They don't have the competence or work ethic either. I truly believe that Blizzard is now incapable of generating anything new and worthwhile.
That’s what happens when you hire to hit diversity quotas
@@nickm8882 agreed, hiring should be based in merit
10+ years ago Blizzard had hundreds of people working on wow. Today it's like 2 people reskinning old content and throwing poo at a wall and seeing what sticks.
They got Metzin again! Lol
As someone who has been raiding mythic since early 2020, this might have been true a couple years ago, but the Retail game has gotten better and better the more time goes on.
It’s definitely a much different game design then classic wow, with different rewards structures and different target audiences as a whole, but blizz is still designing great content these days.
now, if you’re talking about blizzard, designing good classic plus content I wouldn’t hold my breath either. I’d have to see it to believe it.
People talk about wrath to cata being the end of "classic" and into the more "future retail" version of the game, but after playing so much era and then trying wrath, wrath feels a lot like modern retail to me,
Yeah it was absolutely a process of change which arguably started as early as TBC with the renewed focus on endgame above all other content, and the introduction of flying mounts.
Wrath was a major part of that change; heirlooms, LFD, removal of skills, catch-up mechanics to get into the endgame without progression etc.
But Cataclysm cemented it. At least in Wrath, the world you're in is the same one as Vanilla. By Cataclysm, the experience is different literally from level 1.
I think it would be cool if they just added a dungeon or two, a new raid, and a new zone. Seems like minimal work but we know this won't happen.
Yup, it's wishful thinking sadly
It would be cool to have a raid for each elemental
All of this would be meaningless without a classic plus system. Add everything you suggested + make it run on the TBC prepatch class talents. Vanilla has to eventually stop being world of warriorcraft if it intends to have life.
@@cococock2418
Pve World of warriorcraft Pvp World or roguecraft.
I thought we payed a subscription so they had money to pay staff not shareholders
There is nothing to think about because I want to play cataclysm classic.
as a returning player, i am enjoying wotlk classic a lot, but i know its the nostalgia because that was the last expansion i played before stopping playing wow.
Classic+ sounds awesome in theory. I wouldn't trust Blizzard to develop or run it.
It's a shame it would be a risk to your channel to highlight Turtle WoW or other private servers here, even if they are putting out an arguably better product than Blizzard at this point. I get that. If you ever want to play on Turtle WoW just for fun, however, cameras off, we'd be thrilled to have you!
I would love to play it in my downtime, maybe we'll see once the vanilla playthrough is completed. I barely have enough time to keep the channel going right now unfortunately so I can't play more than one version of WoW at the moment. Hopefully if things go well with the channel though, that will change and I'll have more time!
What makes turtle so great exactly? Haven't tuned in much myself
I'm just gonna stick to the classic era. I tried Wotlk for a good amount of time, and it just didn't hit the same. It's probably because everyone was just level boosted to TBC. My limited time classic era has been the best for me because I can play it without FOMO, and it's just has enjoyable zones. Besides STV, that place is a nightmare. I don't think I've been killed by Alliance as many times as I have when I stepped into STV. It's a bloodbath. Everything else has been very fun 😂. I also like not having level boost in classic era. It allows me to find parties for elite quest so easily in vanilla compared to current wotlk. I hope they never implement it into classic era.
sorry for your pain in STV but hearing that it is STILL a bloodbath gives me hope for classic
One of the next episodes in the Vanilla series is going to be about my experience in Badlands and STV this week...I actually am considering re-speccing to sub/assassination because of how bad it's gotten hahaha
Me and my cousins are all playing vanilla again and tbh its great.
Tonnes of people 24/7 and no stupid cash shop, NO WOW TOKEN!!!!!! :) or boostie BOTS destroying the eco because they paid x dollars and are max lvl farming reagents.
1-40 there has always been ppl to do quest and dungeons with. I stopped leveling at 40 weeks ago just so I can enjoy the midgame pvp :)
I have been able to kill 60's with my lvl 40 rouge which to me is alot of fun :)
@@ghouliet If you enter red ridge, STV, hillsbrad, burning steppes, wetlands, tanaris ect ect
Be ready to fight for your life, even at 3am server time.
There are so many people questing/lvling and there are groups of hired goons to protect and or gank some areas as well.
How the fuck does someone else purchasing a level boost somehow affect you so much that it removes your ability to judge a game objectively? You do realize you don’t need to buy a boost and that leveling is a joke rigjt? This isn’t vanilla - leveling is a minor part of wotlk. Just something you do to get to 80 asap and start enjoying the actual game.
I’ve never once seen a good player complain about level boosts. It’s always the type of person whose experience of “having fun” in wow consists of leveling a character to lvl 18, doing DM or WC once, then remaking a new toon.
I mean FFS you’re concerned with “not finding groups for quests while leveling”, which says all
I need to know about you. You aren’t a serious player, you’re a casual who just levels and does no end game Content.
Even Overwatch despite its balance flaws was such a good game when it first came out for a good bit.
best entertainment for when im eating, i would watch daily uploads
I'm glad you enjoy the videos :) If I could make good quality daily videos, I would!
Your voice sounding like WC2 footman in this video - respect
"You played the shareware, now buy the game!"
*Final Fantasy 14*
*No BETA's, No Datamining, No Spoilers, Everything is Fair and Blind for all.*
*No Daily Chores or Mandatory Grind, Super casual friendly with a big Community.*
*No Gambling Mechanics, No Pay2Win and the Hardest Endgame Raids in all MMORPGs.*
Great video. Aside from the insight into wow you could be a professional comedian with the cracks you keep coming out with.
Thanks man, its great to see you here!
it's funny because I dont really have much of an interest in comedy outside of this, I just like telling stories and combining that with a more unfiltered approach, in line with how everyone in mmos talks to each other haha.
+1 internet points for the TimeSplitters 2 music.
i started playing classic again cause of you and its fun but also depressing to see how little blizzard cares.
I hope you're enjoying it mate! I think ultimately they will always only care about profits, which is why Classic started in the first place - due to the demand from players. That can be used to our advantage, we'll just have to see how things go.
I can understand why private servers are such a hush hush deal at least for WoW in particular and why some even ban streaming since that keeps private servers private aside from the fact that they are publicly available and easy to find if you know what to look for. As we have learned from Escape from Tarkov, EULAs don't hold up in court and I heard Blizzard tried to shut down Turtle WoW early this year but couldn't because it's different enough so as not to violate trademark or copyright. As for Classic Plus, I think it would take a good while to make a Classic Plus of reasonable quality and definitely hard to replicate what the original devs made. Classic made sense from a money perspective because it's a lot easier to rerelease an existing game and port it to a newer engine than it is to make something new. Old Blizzard took huge risks and crunched to even make WoW and W3 in the first place and even as big as Blizzard are now, I still doubt they have the budget for Classic Plus anytime soon. It would probably also take an even bigger team than Classic got initially.
I agree about the time taken to make Classic Plus if we are talking about new zones, raids etc. But theres no reason for it to start that big. They could begin with simple class enhancements which would improve gameplay significantly, for example
Turtle is really good. It has its own imperfections but it is 10x betted than what Blizzard is gonna do with fresh HC servers.
Time SPlitters music
Personally believe cataclysm was the end of classic and it should not move forward past wotlk having said than if they did go ahead with classic + I think they should keep the same content but with higher difficulty maybe add transmog
Playing expansion by expansion over again is unnecessary. “Classic vanilla WoW +“ should be implemented at this point instead of maintaining classic servers for each expansion.
I feel like wrath was the end of that classic era already. It felt like raid logging was cranked up from 6/10 to 9/10 from tbc, and the “feel” within raids and heroics completely lost their classic sense to them. The difficulty of wrath raids are better for gamers who like to push through challenges, but terrible if you like any thing else about a mmo.
Yeah, also the "difficulty" of Wrath is nothing compared to modern WoW, so it really isn't a challenge for many players who want challenging content and have experienced any retail raiding outside of LFR in the last 10 years.
I mean, even during the actual days of Wrath in 2008, all raiding content was cleared within 48 hours of initial release. Players got really good, real quickly. Designing the game around endgame instanced content was a mistake.
That insta click when Mr. Vulgrin drops a new vid😉
Thanks for the support my man :)
Blizzard should start small with Classic+. Add things that did not break wow. Guild bank, Armory, new professions capped at 300 (jewelcrafting, inscription, archaeology). Then try something more ambitious but still proven... like porting Karazhan as a 10-man raid to Classic, itemized around AQ or Naxx level with drops that help balance uder-itemized classes (Ret pallies, Ferals, etc). Add other proven 5-mans to Caverns of Time capped at 60 (Culling of Strat, etc). But no increase in level cap or new continents.
Yes and No. You can't just add something simple as "Guild Bank" right off the bat. You have to make it fit the style of Classic and old school. This is how I would have done in the case of a Guild Bank.
1. A Guild Bank is unlocked as a reward for your guild for killing the last boss in the first raid. Atleast (lets say) 25 players in your guild have to be present during this kill.
2. A new tab in the Guild Bank will be unlocked as a reward for killing a new last boss in a raid; MC, Onyxia, ZG, BWL, AQ40...(no point in having Naxx here)
3. You can always withdraw items from a Guild Bank. If the guild disbands, you can still withdraw the items.
4. You can only deposit items into a Guild Bank if your guild has atleast 25 members. To make it basically impossible to have your own bank alt...
Why this system?
1. To avoid botters and bank alts to create Guild Banks.
2. The guild bank should feel like a reward for the guild in which they can store flasks and items etc for the current and next raids.
I just made this up on top of my mind; this is why Classic is fun. It's slow and rewarding and nothing should be free.
@@pancreasdragonheart9765 you can't add a feature like a guild bank and then restrict it only to guilds that raid
Barbershop is something I'd like to see added, class balance and a light for of transmog like dyeing certain armour items.
Thought provoking and packed full of integrity, thanks
Thank you mate, very kind of you to say so, cheers :)
If they move ahead with a Cata Classic, I won't be playing it. Chiefly for the reasons you go over in the vid. However, I hope to God, they establish TBC/Wrath servers for those of that want to remain in the true Classic experience. They have to recognize that many people will not want to lose old Azeroth for the revamp and allow us the option of moving to different servers locked in the Wrath era.
Old azeroth is always there in era
How difficult is it, for Blizzard(Activision), to run Wow Vanilla Classic, And TBC Classic and WotLK Classic???? ???? Too hard i guess...:(
I find the first three of WoW's the most fun and really really really good games actually. Masterpieces, all three. What's the difficulty in mediation / middle way / hosting those ???? Why not leave the LvLCap at 60 in Vanilla, at 70 in TBC and at 80 in WotLK??? [Sometimes, not to act, will be the best of choices.]
Honestly Retail and Classic are 2 very different games, same story... Classic is mostly a traditional MMO, while retail is more of a single player story with multiplayer aspects.
I hope they do the classic plus and carry on some storylines that havent been finished.
Hey Vulgrin, I like that Asmongold covered one of your videos. Some people shit on bigger streamers doing react content but for me I see that as opening an audience to people like your self I never came across on years of youtube! Nice to get so many different views on this game especially also as its one I've played for 15 years off and on. Keep up the content dude and wish you continue to grow in audience views and subs
Thanks man, I really appreciate your support and I agree re: Asmon. I'm immensely grateful for him and others who have helped share my videos so that others get to see them, it really does encourage smaller channels to work hard and grow.
@@vulgrin9573We are the #AsmonArmy and you are a friend!
Our literally god react to you! Its a honor and we will follow Asmon on any part!
Nice video dude!
Had a guild mate suggest they open it up for player development. Content mods, effectively. might be rife with problems but i like playing fan-made content too, even when true Vanilla has been my biggest love affair.
You're actually delusional if you think Blizzard would write one line of new code for Classic. Classic is meant to be a low cost thing Blizzard can do to juice the numbers for their investors.
I want to follow the natural progression like retail. Is this crazy? Idk. I liked Cata Mop Wod and Legion.
I really hope they don't touch classic wow, or at least make + optional. If they force me into plus I'm simply done wasting time on this game I play purely for nostalgia.
Vanilla Wow was an incredible experience but let's be honest, it was also insanely addictive and life ruining for many people. I know I wasn't alone in having crippling issues with playing too much. As much as I hate what WoW has become, I'm glad that the game went to shit and I was able to quit during Cataclysm. The game really messed up my dopamine for a long time like no other game has. The world is better off without MMOs.
is the background music from timesplitters? :0
Hell yeah it is!
An opinion I heard many times when I still played Wrath was 'persistent Wrath servers' instead of moving to Cata, similar to how we have Classic era. More options are always good and it'd be great if TBC weaves its way into that as well, right? Well.... it is as you said with 'developers from 20 years ago'.
Vanilla was still developed until the end when 2000s Blizzard decided to make those changes into an expansion instead. The progression path is the journey we are familiar with. There is some good and odd loot in dungeons you want and run them over and over, then you do the 20s and MC into BWL. Then you get AQ40, which requires more effort and at last Naxx. The same progression from 2004-2006 still exists in era. But TBC and WotLK were designed with easing players into end-game content in mind, creating catch-up mechanics that render old raids as pointless. Doing the 10s in TBC is enough to get you right into BT and Hyjal. Wrath seems to be even more extreme with both games also progressively nerfing raids to allow weaker guilds to clear them as well. Persistent Wrath servers wouldn't offer much with a simplified journey with lots of shortcuts to 70 and once hitting 80, get funnelled into the last raid tier by badges and dungeon drops. This is, unless a team would actively tinker with Wrath to make it work and that probably won't happen, considering that Classic was mostly just touched when bug-fixes were on the plate.
It's not even just about not trusting Blizzard regarding Classic+ either, but as you mentioned as well, developing additional content with the same rough edges as 20 years ago is difficult, let alone for a team that didn't develop the initial game even. The best there can be is the creation by dedicated players. Many discontinued franchises these days were reanimated by fans making indie games or making rom hacks to keep beloved games alive. Private servers that do Classic+ are essentially nothing more than very elaborate rom hacks.
I agree with you, thanks for the really in depth discussion here. I have such fond memories of private servers because they take the idea of that niche, online world to the next level by putting the power back into the hands of players (quite an idealistic view of them but hey haha).
I also agree that the challenges facing the development of Classic Plus would be great, but somewhat eased by the fact that 1.) They could use an OSRS style voting board, which would mean that these choices were decided by players, and 2.) There was so much cut content from Vanilla that they would already have a bit of a blueprint for where to go next.
Thanks again, I hope you enjoyed the video!
You are absolutely delusional about vanilla being in any way difficult or requiring time and energy to complete raids. For fuck sake hardcore servers came out not even two weeks ago and players have already downed rag in full greens without a single death. Absolutely no one is wasting time doing MC who takes the game serious. They are going to harder raids and there’s nothing to stop them.
We don’t want to have to do naxx 10 man when ICC is out you clown. Also, wrath has never, not once, “nerfed” any raids. All raids were released pre nerf and never got nerfed, the sole exception being algalon’ one hour time being removed in the current patch (but his pre nerf difficulty remained).
As for TBC, Ssc/TK we’re released pre nerf and broke a ton of guilds up at the time. They were only nerfed when the new raids came out which was a GOOD idea. They let people have a crack at the pre nerf content for a few months and then nerfed the final bosses when Hyjal/BT came out, as coordinating four raids a week would have been a nightmare. And unlike wrath, TBC still had one of the relics of vanilla wow, that being that certain items such as the Lady Vashj belt, were full game or near full game bis despite being phase 2 content, forcing guilds to have to go back and do raids for one piece of loot.
What players like you don’t seem to get is that audiences are different. People who play Wrath and TBC don’t want to spend hours having to level an alt and they don’t want to do three phase old content that they have already done to death, just to gear an alt. Which is why the catch up mechanics are welcomed by all.
I would love a classic plus where they add in the new models and animations, smooth out the UI, and go all in on adding new content without compromising the vision of the original game.
This could be the "WoW 2" everyone keeps talking about, and most would love it.
And you don't think they could fuck your particularly tailored vision up? At all?
@@clarksmith494 They absolutely could, but a man can dream regardless.
Honestly even if Blizzard still had their more competant employees working there, I think it's hard to say if Blizzard would be able to create new Vanilla content that perfectly fits in.
One example of this is that any new zone that is added would need to have chain quests that take you out of the zone and vice versa. And unfortunately, I think this is easier said than done. Even TBC, which was essentially made by the classic team failed to do this, making outland the first of many theme park expansions which really felt disconnected from the Vanilla zones.
If I were Blizzard, the good one that we all have been experienced, I would just rather sell (or open source it for non-profits) the code and services rather than releasing another level boost + wow coin scheme. So that some other people can develop the classic as their own way if they are brave enough to do so.
My expectation is to see a WoW that has horizontal progress rather than steep vertical model which is what we have now. And a new lore that actually fits that horizontal scheme. For example, a WoW that runs like the Black Desert Online or EVE online.
Well, just my 2 cents... I know Blizz will just sell more WoW tokens with level boost lol.
In no way do I support a Classic Plus release unless they do it separately from Classic. I don’t trust Blizzard not to screw up Classic. Just leave it the hell alone.
You honestly want Blizzard to do classic+? Full of bots, GDKP, selling gold? Thanks, but no thanks. You have TWoW now and it's free of bots and all the other crap that completely ruined WoW. There's no hope for the company that has been proved many times over they are icompetent to handle bots, let alone the gold selling. Why would you want this cesspool of a "Classic+"?
Turtle just recently hit 11k, and it's going to 12k. It's so crazy, that they have to do something. Ppl want "QUALITY", not quantity and this is why turtle is blooming, and ppl are in awe becuase of that.
That is all true regarding blizz and trust with us as classic enthusiasts, but doesn't that make us the perfect and easiest customers to satisfy ? A little show of good faith would go a long way with all of since, since we all want it bad. As much as we might fight ourselves on it due to distrust, we all want it and want to be wrong about it.
They cant even add alerts like the Hardcore addon has on the Hardcore Wow Server - they didnt put any achievements etc. I dont think they will be able to do Classic + - you can already see they didnt put much work into Hardcore wow at all. They cant even put anti cheat into classic...or want....
dropping this comment early and then coming back to it after the video too see what changes in my mind but this is my thoughts on classic and wrath from my perspective.
Playing warrior through out the first iteration was really fun, i got to do the worldbuff meta and other fun raiding stuff. After not really knowing what was my new class for a good time through Classic TBC and first half of WotLK ive now landed on Paladin (Holy to be precise) and im getting a similar feeling to how i felt in classic. WotLK soon being over is kind of sad because i really like how holy palas play in this current phase of classic. Im looking forward to cata in a way that its refreshing my spec. Classic+ would be so much fun but i wonder how much more fun it would be with some of WotLKs class balance and spells inside of vanilla but with twists. Id for sure play that game.
back to the video to see if we share some thoughts! so far great vid man!
after vid, Classic+ sounds fantastic, private servers is something ive been playing since the end of orignial WotLK. one thing thats been sad about them is keeping my progress. my trust in blizzard is low but i do think the Classic team has good people on it so i hope they get boosted in tp better positions where they can actually change things
Thanks for taking your time to really digest the video mate! I like your optimistic view on the possibilities, and I'm glad to hear you're having a blast with Holy Paladin. We can only hope you're right in regards to Classic Plus, I have to hope that some folks on the dev team realise that doing additional content for Vanilla in the right way means abandoning the modern philosophy behind retail and current Blizzard!
@@vulgrin9573that is so true, they need to separate themselves from the retail team. Play to the strengths of Vanilla and not push it to “engagement is bis” that retail currently is.
Letting my trust in Microsoft, who’s already known to be the graveyard of game studios, is laughable and maybe PS is going to be my home once again.
Does anybody really want current day blizzard to attempt classic plus?
I certainly don't, shit I want blizzard to move on and finally let the poor abused warcraft franchise die.
Turtle WoW also isn't exactly perfect, especially with the creatures in charge banning people over the smallest of things.
Main reason to never play Turtle WoW...the people in charge of it are morons.
I think they should do anything with classic + good or bad anything Id love something new to experience
Same, ultimately they will always keep untouched Classic servers because that is no extra work. It would be good to see what they could come up with - though outside of a OSRS style voting system, I have no idea how they could properly implement it!
@@vulgrin9573 I’d love an osrs style implementation and I’d wonder how many others would vouch for it
duskhaven reforged in october for the BEST Vanilla+ experience. Custom raids, custom classes Wrath client..
Agree 1 billion percent! Duskhaven is by far the greatest vanilla era realm. I tried turtle wow but it's so awful, the slow leveling plus the time it takes just to kill a mob when you miss every other attack or spell just feels bad. Vanilla content on a wrath client is hands down the best experience. Plus all the custom stuff they added is farrrr superior to any other vanilla server.
I'll have to look into this...
@@vulgrin9573 very worth while. Demon hunters, Scarlet monestary monks, Shaman Tanks, Wogren, Tinkers, so many custom classes, and theyre all getting revamped to be not as janky
what bliz should do is classic wow but the twist should be all races should be in.. (live) and allied races included..
I feel bad for classic wow players. I get that you love vanilla wow but at a certain point you need to accept classic + won't be a thing and to just enjoy the classic era as a time capsule of better times. If you want a new game go out and play something else.
Runescape proved a community can show nostalgia is worth revamping... Oldskool Runescape by far more popular then the newer forms
@@nickmiltenburg3699 it's different though for multiple reasons. For one Jagax isn't creatively bankrupt like Blizzard. Also runescape 3 was never nearly as popular as osrs. Unlike with wow where despite having players dropping off of retail, classic wow is still a smaller chunk of the community.
Also wow's quality of graphics, game mechanics, and story are a lot more complex than runscape 3 and osrs. Osrs development is most likely not nearly as resource intense as adding content to classic wow
@@brohogany9920 not true. Dont forget OSRS was gone for a while just like classic wow moved on the retail. Many People didnt like Runescape 3 though
Cause of demand of playerbase they restarted OSRS, and now that is the most popular version.
Jaggexx are boss with costumer/community support though, thats true... public polls for new content is something we could only dream of at any Blizzard game..
And resource intense? Highly doubt it.... the whole body is allready formed, just needs to re-do some stuff.... private servers like turtle and duskhaven manage to do it, so am sure a multi billion dollar company can...
I belive they should balance the class abilities better, by starting at 19, then working their way up.
This could have some problems sure.
But it would be something.
I mean, add a taunt to a Paladin ability. ANY paladin ability, preferably a low level one, and then do something similar for Shamans! In every version, WoW needs more tanks, and the fact that they didn't give these two classes a genuine Taunt is absurd. While they're at it, they should help out Druids bear-form aggro abilities, too.
Add more dungeons and raids across all levels. Consider adding modes allowing the lower level dungeons to be played at 60.
Consider adding any of the races and classes in the original Warcraft games to WoW Classic.
Great video as always!
Thanks mate :)
I'd rather play with 1900 Chinese players who can't even communicate over paying blizzard for a sub par experience
One can hope
I agree. Sounds silly, but I've stopped playing Wrath classic as Blizzard just give it such a tiny fart of their time and energy. Even the loading screens are low resolution and wrong aspect ratio.
They only released WOW classic because it was easy money, for little work.
I think they realised they could cash in on the Nostalrius hype train, and peoples genuine love for vanilla wow. It was a cynical move and I wish they had done more with the classic project
All honesty, besides the subscription, if you're paying blizzard for anything else, you deserve what blizzard is giving you
played WOW for 16 years. dabble with all 3 versions of the game. Retail is a trainwreck of too much nonsense to keep up with , Wrath feels like retail already with a bunch of hardcore raid loggers, crushes the fun never able to get an invite to anything even as a 5k GS hunter. Classic Era is best out of all 3 forsure but i think people have swipped there cards on 3rd party sites to get tons of gold to buy all there gear in end game since its always GDKPs. I hope for a classic + with extra content that they never finished after naxx and rushing TBC. i doubt they can deliver since blizzard has changed so much in a not so good way. im getting older now too and maybe that nostalgia will never be the same.
The game is still fun, I dont think age changes that, but I fully agree about the issues, including in classic era. For my part, I try to focus on what I'm doing and enjoy the game for what it is without looking always to the future. If the problems with classic grow too great, i will move to something else but for now it's a good experience still
Vanilla wow and even up into wrath had this slow pacing... that i dont think blizzard can emulate again. I hope they keep wrath servers open.
I think they will, I hope they do too - even though I prefer Vanilla
Blizzard has like 95% of their dev team focused on Retail and most of the population would rather just play Classic Era 💀
Classic isn't as profitable without a cash shop :/
I would love Classic+, but just look at what they did with the expansions. Monetised mounts, boosts, token(P2W). I tried to enjoy the expansions, but they just weren't as good as Vanilla, add on top of that the disgusting monetization and its a game killer. People disliked the mount/boost sales so much that Blizzard nerfed the /spit emote to defend whales etc.
The company is totally lost and doesn't have a clue how to make a good game anymore. They lost the vision years ago.
I think the sad reality is that when one mainstream game opens the door to that kind of aggressive monetisation, every company will jump on it as they're all competing with each other. Whether Blizzard started it, or if they were just copying what was already being done, particularly in Eastern MMOs, the outcome was the same - a poorer experience for players, in my view at least.
cata was some of the most fun to level in from 1-60, but thats about it. lol
I don't think they will do classic cataclysm since that was the expansion everyone rage quit wow, after that everything turned to shit. but it would be cool for something NEW but in the echo of classic
I bet the do make Cata, and I'll probably play it. I dropped off half way through it, life got in the way. Didn't try WoW again until Legion. But man Shadowlands really makes you wonder about Blizzard. Retail looks amazing but, behind the veneer it's shit. Anyway on classic. I hope the have persistent Vanilla and Wrath servers. I'll probably just play in those two versions, on and off, until WoW dies altogether.
Blizzard just could turn back the essence of vanilla and boost the graphic qol and ui, stop bulls*tting with the micro trnasaction and bolm
Profit
Isn't classic plus originally just tbc 😂 look how quickly people got bored of that. You will get a new classic plus patch and will be bored after 3 months just like any other expansion
It depends how they do it. People get bored because the game is focused around endgame instances, which once completed, get dull fast. The first step would be to address class balancing, and maybe add some new zones. But hey, maybe you're right!
I cant wait for duskhaven to reboot. Greatest vanilla+ server
Yeah I want current Blizzard to stay as far away from Classic as possible.
Blizzard doesn't exist. It died when Activision took over. Calling a company Blizzard doesn't make it Blizzard just like calling an xpac World of Warcraft doesn't make it World of Warcraft.
Won't be playing SOFTcore servers.
I think if people are prepared to play hardcore WoW, these 3rd party servers could offer the same thing without any problem, as we are prepared to loose our characters and reroll at any time.
I’ve never played on a 3rd party server though to be honest, but I have to admit, it’s becoming far more appealing!!!
Bots, cheats, wow tokens and monetization are the future of Classic WoW.
arent private servers even worse with corruption and pay to win shit? so why play on them? i dont want to invest alot of time in something that can just end out of nowhere, i dont get it can some one explain?
Get on TurtleWow
They made great games....25 years ago....now milk them for every nostalgia buck $ they can, people need to stop supporting this
I’m so hyped for cata. I’m not interested in classic+ because the whole reason I’m playing this game is to relive the older content.
Cataclysm best.
Shadowlands classic coming soon.
Choose your covenant now!
vulgrin
i love the idea of classic but in honesty i just cant go back. I love the world but the class design is a bit crap. Id like to see the graphics updated to modern wow level, classes updated and new content added. So yeah this wont ever happen so Im stuck in retail to feed on scraps and find my own fun
I totally get you. It's alright for me because I essentially only play Rogue and maybe Warrior if I feel like it. If I was say, a Paladin, Druid or Shaman player, I'd be lost haha
for me, turtle remains the better
turtle for life!
Did you ever try duskhaven? Imo turtle is too slow and not enough good changes to classes
Three things blizzard needs to do to vanilla classic. Add dungon finder have class balance and make the pvp system where u can just buy the gear with honor points. This will make the grind of the game a lot less annoying and more fun.
No....just no.
im hype for cata
Hopefully the future is people realizing how much of a better experience they can get in private servers, frankly. There are many amazing vanilla and better yet vanilla+ servers out there. Keep an eye on Duskhaven and Conquest of Azeroth.
delusional. people have already figured how much inferior private servers are compared to the real deal.
that's why the majority of players are still willing to pay that montly sub for a 15+ y old game hosted by the devil itself
no matter how "good" your or anyone's private server might be. most will not waste their time on on a not legit server for it to possibly vanish at any moment due to several issues/reasons.