I love the Mega Drive with a burning passion, but the PC Engine has to rank as my all time favourite console. I just can't get enough of that little wonder machine. It was the system that truly made me a hardcore gamer back in '89.
Apart from Bonk, I didn't really have any knowledge if the PC Engine back in the day (I don't believe it got a proper release in Europe). It's been fun learning about it from Sega Lord X and the Happy Console Gamer.
Great video man, can you do Capcom on the PC Engine next? Here i'll list all the games for you. :D * indicates games that were also released in NA Capcom games on the PC Engine/Turbo Grafx 16: 1941: Counter Attack (Supergrafx) 1943 Kai Daimakimura (Supergrafx) F1-Dream Side Arms Hyper Dine * Son Son II Street Fighter II Tiger Road * Capcom Games on PC Engine CD ROM²/Turbo Grafx CD: Adventure Quiz: Capcom World/Hatena no Daibōken Buster Bros. * Chiki Chiki Boys Fighting Street * Forgotten Worlds * Side Arm Special Strider It would be really cool if you did an episode on these games as well! Thank you!
The PC Engine version of Gain Ground looks absolutely awesome, and the music is kicking! As someone who has recently become a big Wonder Boy fan, I've always wanted to play Dragons Curse and Dynastic Hero on TurboGrafix CD. I love all the different versions the games have
I remember drooling over the Turbo Grafx 16 CD demos at the store. The color pallet and visuals blew my mind . Of course I couldn’t afford one. I had an NES and my cousin had Sega Genesis. I bought a PC engine mini recently and was very impressed. I have a good number of Sega Genesis and Super Nintendo games and have to say that I’m every bit as impressed with PC-Engine. Even more impressed with games like Castlevania Rondo of Blood. The arcade ports are phenomenal and in many cases they actually look better than the same arcade ports I own. The 16 bit era really delivered with all 3 systems in different ways.
Excellent video X. I appreciate it. I recommend though to inform people when talking about PC Engine Super CD games that they can be played on U.S. Turbo CD and Turbo Duo without any modifications or adapters due to them being region free. Keep up the great work. Thank you!
Really impressed that the sprite scaling here outdoes the Genesis. I've always thought it weird that Sega clearly intended to leverage their arcade games with the Mega Drive, launching with Space Harrier & Thunder Blade day 1. Yet they gave it no capability to actually display those games properly.
Sprite scaling hardware was way too expensive to include in a home console back in 1988. Space Harrier 2 and Thunderblade were very early and rushed games, while Afterburner 2 was an outsourced port. Almost like Sega barely even tried. NEC were just able to put more time, effort and care into their ports. I do prefer the Genesis port of Outrun though. It has better detailed graphics and more accurate FM soundtrack. Of course, nothing software spite scaling on the PC-Engine touches what was accomplished in Panorama Cotton on the MD. That game really shows what could've been is Sega took more care with the superscaler ports. I am also very curious to see M2's new Space Harrier port on the Mini 2.
@@oatmeal7818 You can blame it on extremely volatile CRAM prices around the time the design was finalized.64 colors wasn't bad for the time though. 4x time the NES and better than most micros too. All 4th gen consoles were based on compromises in some ways though. NEC did not include hardware for multiple background layers at a time when parallax scrolling established itself as one of the staples of 16-bit gaming, making a lot of their games look very colorful, but flat. The SFC had the colors, sprites and background layers for a very pretty picture, but barely enough CPU power to move everything around at a decent pace. Of course, most SFC and PCE games ran at a very annoying horizontal resolution, making games look stretched.. At least most MD games are the 4:3 NTSC standard 320x240. Well, Neo-Geo did not compromise when it came to the hardware, featuring the best aspects of all 3 consoles, but this priced it out of the range of most consumers.
How has yt never shown me one of your videos before? This was very well researched and presented. Looking forward to checking out your previous material!
Hey man..Ive been watching a load of your videos...really like them. Also particularly appreciate your calm and relaxed presentation, instead of neurotic screaming which seems the norm for a lot of youtubers around
Loved this episode, really great work. I've always found intriguing the fact that Sega licensed its games to rival consoles, more so when you see excellent ports like After Burner and Space Harrier on PC-Engine, that are clearly better than the versions on Sega's own consoles.
When I subbed to you which was fairly recently, you had a little under 10k subs, you blew up pretty quick since then and it’s well deserved. Keep it up!
@@SegaLordXfun fact: in Brazil, Wonder Boy in 2 of the games (The Dragon's Trap and Monster Land) are replaced with Monica from the successful comic series Monica's Gang. They're called No Castelo Do Dragão (The Dragon's Castle) and O Resgate (The Rescue) and both games were released here by Tec Toy.
Nice video and nice voice too! I've long considered buying a PC Engine with the CD-ROM unit for Bonanza Bros alone. The music is even better than the arcade original!
I had an uncle and a cousin on opposite ends of my family who both got the Turbografx 16 for Christmas of 89. Whenever I was visiting, I played it to death. I've always wanted one of my own but still don't have one (yet). I never played the Sega ports but was aware of some of them, but comparing it as an amazing system with a short life span like the Saturn is very accurate. That thing was amazing. The Bonk games, Military Madness, Splatterhouse, Dungeons and Dragons: Order of the Griffon, Blazing Lasers, The Legendary Axe. Whatever your style of game, it had some killer games for it.
Loved the Pc Engine, was very hard to source games though, where I lived it virtually didnt exist. But it meant I had a collection of games that no one else had and that blew friends minds when they came over. 😁 Hope they release a mini of it!
At one point I was playing through games on old 8-bit systems, and having never even known about the TG16 as a kid, I was surprised to see so many Sega games on the console! It would be cool to watch a comparison video of the different ports of some Sega classics!
It's too bad that some of these titles, like Shinobi and Space Harrier, didn't have 8 megabit ports, if not higher. The potential was so much higher, but unfortunately the expectations of the time gave us what we got.
Although this is an 8-bit console, the PCE was built from scratch in 1987 with no need for backward compatibility, so in the end it is not so surprising that it comes close to the 16-bit graphics and animation level. What is more surprising is that Sega had another year before launching the MD and didn't try to at least match PCE on-screen palettes, let alone go beyond the 512-color master palette.
Sega chose to focus on other aspects of the overall performance and graphics, getting decent bulk deal on the fancy M68000 16-bit CPU and packing things like 3 background layers, crazy amount of sprites per line and ability to combine multiple sprites to form larger sprites in the GPU. Very flexible GPU in general, with a crazy fast system bus access. Took the devs a while to learn the hardware but by the end of the 16-bit gen, Genesis was putting out effects that the PCE and even the SNES could only dream of (e.g.: Red Zone, Toy Story, Panorama Cotton, Batman and Robin).
I get that, but in terms of the attractiveness of games and system perception from the public, colors were a factor which mattered in the 16-bit wars. A 4096-color palette was pretty standard by the late 80's, even the Lynx which was a finished prototype in 1987 featured one. Only the best game developers would make good use of the MD's palette in their limited time, when we got games like Thunder Force IV, Ranger X, Flink and... Toy Story of course! That said, the MD was and still is my favorite console, so Sega must have done something right with their design choices as you described ;)
@@jbmaru I read that the MD/Genesis' limited color palette had something to do with the volatile prices of VRAM, which really spiked exactly at the time when they were finalizing the design. At least, MD/Genesis had a really good default 512 color palette. The whole Genesis hardware architecture was designed by arcade board jockeys and not with ease of development in mind. It did take some talent to get good graphics and sound out of the machine. Luckily, this made only the average and crappy games look and sound mediocre. Because generally, the guys who could design a game worth a damn, were also capable of pushing the hardware in the right direction. When Sonic came out, it was more colorful, fast, smoother and better sounding that anything else out there.
@@Prizrak-hv6qk Yes the first Sonic really was something else when it came out, I was stunned when I saw the first level! What you said made me think of an example of an "early" & not-so-good-looking game; I wonder what constrained the developers of Midnight Resistance to use 16 onscreen colors only, I know it was their first game on the platform but still! Maybe that made it less CPU-intensive or RAM-hungry, like the 1-player-only gameplay. They definitely mastered their subject when they released Chelnov a year later though.
First of all, I just want to say GREAT VIDEO! I'm a long time subscriber and love your videos. This narrative that the PCE/TG was an "8bit" console is old and tired. I honestly can't believe we're still having this conversation. The PCE/TG had an overclocked 8bit CPU, but had dual 16bit GPUs. Not to mention the massive colour gamut. More to the point, the 8bit CPU was set to read 16bit code. That's why the PCE/TG was able to pump out comparable, if not better, ports than their rivals. I'm sorry, but the 16bit narrative is completely subjective. Who ever said that 16bit meant the CPU? In any case, even if you want to call it an 8bit console, that just makes the Genny and SNES look bad in comparison. Personally, the TG/PCE was part of the 16bit rivalry. It didn't make huge ground in North America, but it was the champ for a long time in Japan.
It was the entire narrative during the life of the console. Consoles were defined by the CPU for a very long time, and the TG16 was often lambasted in the media for its "weak" 8-bit CPU. Ultimately the bits of your hardware don't matter nearly as much as what else it has under the hood, but I don't think calling the TG16 8-bit is derogatory. If anything, it showed the sheer power of the unit that despite its rather unimpressive CPU, it could still pump out the games it did.
@@SegaLordX See, I disagree. The CPU was impressive. The SNES's CPU was ridiculously slow in comparison. The SNES's CPU had other superpowers, but speed was not one of them. And the narrative in North America was literally a narrative. It was based on marketing, and nothing else. The same debate wasn't had in Japan. Anyway, I edited my first comment because I wanted to let you know I love your content. But let me say it here in case you don't catch it. I really do enjoy your content and keep coming back to it. To be honest, I relish having these 16bit debates. 😆 Keep up the great work, brother!
All good bro. I appreciate the civilized response despite not seeing things eye to eye. It's refreshing to see an actual adult act like an adult in this circumstance.
The only game here that’s truly awful is the vaguely Golden Axe looking thing. Space Harrier isn’t bad, streets ahead of any other home version (except the X68000 version which is also by Dempa and is the PC engine version with better sound and more detail) until the 32X and Saturn versions arrived a few years later. I’m not sure if Outrun is any better than the MD version but the colour pallete is much more faithful to the arcade which does make quite a difference.
@12:24 The real draw of Thunder Blade in the arcade was the rad deluxe sit-down cabinet with the control stick that moved the whole thing from side to side
Calling the PC Engine/ TurboGraphX 16 an 8 bit system really does an amazing job of demonstrating how dubious the whole idea of classifying systems by 'bitness' actually is, especially when you start asking about the technicalities. The TurboGraphX 16 has an 8 bit cpu and 16 bit graphics chip. The 65816 CPU seen in the SNES and Apple IIGS performs 16 bit calculations but has an 8 bit data bus. The 68000 has a 16 bit data bus, but in spite of this accesses data at half the speed of a 65816 of the same clock speed. (making the distinction on bus size seem weirder), it's also capable of performing 32 bit instructions, even though it's poorly suited to them. The original 8086 CPU in the first PC's shares the same problem - 16 bit instruction set with an 8 bit data bus. The n64 does indeed have a 64 bit CPU (two of them in fact, given that the graphics chip contains it's own processor with roughly the same instruction set as the main CPU), but it's main bus is 32 bits, it's memory bus is 9 bits (yes, 9), the cartridge bus is 16 bit, and in spite of having 64 bit instructions, the vast majority of game code is 32 bit instructions. The Gameboy Advance's ARM/THUMB chip is similar - a 32 bit CPU with lots of 16 bit instructions, almost exclusively used in 16 bit mode by actual games. Meanwhile, on a different tack, both the Atari VCS and PC Engine are 8 bit systems, and even have the same CPU architecture, but you'd never mistake the games for one of these for the other in a million years... Kinda makes that classification seem kinda moot. In my Mind the TG16 is a 16 bit system since that's where it fits in best, when you compare games and how things look... Or, in different terms it's a 4th generation console, like the Mega Drive and SNES.... (first gen is Pong consoles. 2nd gen is the Atari VCS/2600. 3rd gen is Atari 5200,NES, Master System, etc.)
I was 10 years old and had a choice: Genesis or TG16. I chose TG16. I certainly loved it, but there were times I regretted it also and wish I chose the Genesis.
You're right about the TG16 being underrated. I got a Duo in 2001, while they were still available for a decent price. Amazing system, deserved more of a shot.
Do we have an official explanation for why some Sega games appeared on other platforms? I get PC, Sega might not have seen it as a competitor to their console business. But did Sega port some games because they thought "These are console sellers, so why not just port it to another system to make a bit more money"?
I think the intention was to get third parties to make Sega games on other platforms so they can reach a new audience and to hopefully convert them onto Sega hardware where the best home ports would be developed in-house.
@@InputArchive Yeah, I'm conflicted on Sega's handling of it's IP back then, on the one hand I'm sure it brought them money licensing them to third parties and these ports didn't always show up when the Sega home version did, but on the other hand you don't get customers buying your hardware platforms if they can just get the game on something they already own. There is also the quality factor which SLX mentioned, a bad port on another system isn't going to necessarily have them seeking a 'better' version on the Sega console, you might just leave the customer thinking 'this is not a very good game'.
Lazarus Hernandez You could argue Sega was definitely more known for its arcade titles rather than its console exclusive titles. Experience Sega's biggest arcade titles on your PC Engine, but to get arcade quality in your home, buy a MegaDrive. I mean I could be wrong with that line of thinking, but if they wanted the best ports on other systems, surely they would have done it in-house? At the end of the day what it did do was expose more people to Sega franchises.
@@InputArchive Back then Sega was definitely known for it's arcade titles more than the console exclusives and both the Master System and Genesis leveraged this for their library. Although the SMS spawned some exclusives like Alex Kidd, and Phantasy Star, it was the Genesis that came into it's own for console exclusives. I'm pretty sure you are right with the line of thinking, after all one of the game companies of an earlier generation did this very thing; Coleco would make/port games for various consoles at the time (Atari 2600, Intellivision, and Colecovision) but inevitably their consoles version looked/played the best or was the most complete/faithful to the original. The practice excluded the Atari 5200 which was on par graphically with the Colecovision. Likewise Atari stopped porting some of its games on Colecovision. My conflict is whether this was a good idea for Sega or would it have been better for them if they were a bit more guarded with their IP, like Nintendo is. Sega end up doing both, licensing out some of their games for port duty (a great deal of arcade titles), while certain games (Sonic, Streets of Rage, Alex Kidd) didn't grace competitors platforms until much later if at all.
There was no talk of two games, the Space Fantasy Zone parody and the supposedly canceled version of Galaxy Force that was originally supposed to be released on PC Engine but was transported to Supergrafx as 'Galaxy Force II' but with the failure of that system was permanently archived.
Before the megadrive, there was the pc engine as an alternative to port games on, eventrough the cpu of the pce was 8bit,but it’s speed was insane and it also contained 2 16bit gpu chips, so the pce was more then just an ordinary 8bitter.
Columns looks great, I never knew about that. I loved Columns on the Genesis until I could master it.. Actually, I still loved it even then but I dubbed it inferior to Tetris on NES.
Thankfully, a few (not all unfortunately) of the Wonder Boy/Monster World games are on the Monster World Sega Vintage Collection that I purchased and downloaded on the Xbox 360 digital marketplace a while back (the collection comes with 3 games), otherwise I wouldn't be able to buy these games on the Turbo Grafx or any of the other retro Sega consoles due to how expensive they are in retro gaming shops, not to mention that they're also super hard to find. Compilation re-releases (either digital or disc) are mans best friend. Thank goodness for emulation.
2:40 What da bleep!?!?!? You quit the Afterburner sample at the exact moment the lead guitar is about to kick in! It is the only port that has this quintessential part of the soundtrack!
The PC Engine has my vote as the most underappreciated console ever. Other people will vote for more unique and rare consoles but you cannot beat the PC Engine's quality and game library.
it's actually kinda overrated (just look at some comments, yours included :P) and there are still some misconceptions going on about it no, the pc engine is not a "8-bit console" but a 4th gen console instead (i.e. a "16-bit console" for those who want to talk in good ol' and misleading "bit fashion") but yes, you can beat the pc engine quality and library. the mega drive and snes did and easily for the most part and even older hardwares of the same generation such as the atari st and commodore amiga did in some ways (just look the racing games or compare jim power on pc engine and amiga) also the pc engine has some weird design choices such as no rgb natively or only one controller port overall it's a decent console in terms of hardware but which has a very good library with a strong personality which, IMO, is the best thing about it. pc kid, bomberman, far east of eden... some very cool and distinctive games
I agree. And same here. It's on play_roms.com Can play right off the browser with a contoller. Fantastic game. Same with Thunder Blade. They are just as good as Genesis but have their own great feel.
it's a tour de force given the pc engine limitations but the mega drive version is about as good (despite being rushed but while it has less detailed graphics and less content, it also has better gameplay and better sound) and the x68000 version is better than both (but it's rushed as well, both md and x68000 were made by dempa who went a bit lazy there)
Megadrive is more challenging imo. But both pc engine and megadrive lack a maneuver necessary to win in the arcade. In the arcade/32x/saturn version when an enemy comes from behind you "just like the scene in top gun" you speed up to get em chasing you, then immediately slow down for em to fly ahead of you to lock on and kill. In the 16 bit ports all you have to do is outrun the enemy like you would a missle. I actually like just being able to simply outrun the enemy and focus more on the planes ahead of me, but it definetly takes away a certain dynamic. I've never played the x68000. The original afterburner actually had no enemies chasing you from behind at all, it wasn't until afterburner 2 that was introduced.
I see your point, guys. But I really hoped more from Mega Drive port. They are Sega, they had the obligation to create something very close to Arcade, like Golden Axe did. In Mega Drive the landing scenes has gone. It might not be a big deal, but it charged personality. The PC Engine version, on the other hand, brought all those stuff. Moreover, the melody version of the songs has born there and became very famous (I really don't thing that it was necessary, but it's a remarkable fact).
I played WonderBoyIII and Dragon's curse on original SMS/TG16 hardware many times in the 90s. Both are great and incredibly similar. More of a case where the SMS version looks as good as many 16 bit titles.
Fantastic video.. I will always love retro gaming above all, up to and including PS2/Gamecube as the highest system, and only for the plethora of 2D games on PS2 anyway.
Squeek I love, have on iPhone and Atari Lynx boxed- reminds me of my 1st Genesis game I bought, Zoom! Same style! Lot of odd ones Face or Namco made, like Honey in the Sky (then there's road sequel!) + Bravo Man. Then some real good Japanese only SHMUPs like Mr. Heli (still cheap CIB), Battle Lode Runner, Star Parodier, Rabio Lepus, Metal Stoker, Dead Moon, Ordyne, Somer Assault, man list is huge! Theres 2 more Hu cards I really want instead of just emulating, Liquid Kids (Mizbaku Daiken) and that Hana Taaka Daka you nicely mentioned! Word of mouth and videos like this are so important for this console, as it didn't have the attention back in day or even recently as other retro consoles.
Always thought this would make a fantastic subject for a video. Thank you for making it happen! Gain Ground SX is also my favorite of the Sega ports. I can’t bring myself to buy that awful Golden Axe port. It’s cheap, but I know I will never play it. It just sucks because if they had given it the same treatment as the others got, you know it would have probably been awesome.
I'm amazed how far in depth you went re: the Wonderboy series... Maybe you could throw a video out on which platform is the go-to version for each WB game? Had Wonderboy in Monsterland on the Amiga, was great fun.
Wonder Boy is such a confusing set of games. The way it was released and licensed. The way the names changed. The way it split off into different games. It'd make for a decent topic though.
Wow, the PC engine caused even more confusion with the Wonder Boy / Monster World / Adventure Island games, but now I think I have everything on note, literally
I had a PC Engine with Shinobi. I used to feel disappointed at what the game lacked compared to the arcade, but now I just think it was a solid game anyway, and hands down the best port at the time.
Fun video. I think I mentioned it as a topic once, so it was definitely one I was happy to see. I forget where it was, but I saw someone claim Golden Axe for PCE was decent. I already knew better than that. I don't know what that guy was thinking. I think he turned the system off after seeing the title screen. It would be interesting to see a good version of Golden Axe with PCE's features and limitations. A real shame about Shinobi, especially since it was the only console version that retained the arcade game play. The real disappointment is that it's well done and looks great, but it's missing too much due to the constraints of a tiny Hu-Card. A typical four-megabit ROM might have been all they needed. The missing stage is unfortunate, but the missing melee attacks are the biggest loss for me as they factored into the game play in the arcade version. Not having them made certain areas harder. That's why my favorite of the console ports remains the version on the Master System.
Nice video. I was wondering where Forgotten Worlds was and remembered that it was a Capcom game, oops! A video comparing Genesis, Turbo and SNES games would be nice. By the way Monster Lair was a regular CD, not Super CD.
the only games that surprised me in PC engine that saw a PC engine over graphics over MD were Afterburner, Thunder blue, without in these times that type of algorithm use PCE in Afterburner to create that Scaling dek boat or gasoline plane.
Man I don't know how you keep finding topics but you're killing it.
the libraries of retro game systems were huge
It's just passion
From 2022 - he’s still killing it lol
@@justinm6392 right?! All these years later and he STILL has plenty of topics and ideas!
I thought he’s been doing really well 🤷🏻
Though not a Sega game, the PC Engine's version of Street Fighter II is an amazing achievement.
Bithead1000 says it's the version of the game that plays the best on any home console from that generation.
it is indeed.
Agreed
@@TheRealJPhillips How dare you, sir!
@@Septer_Sever just kidding. He just always has a cold.
I love the Mega Drive with a burning passion, but the PC Engine has to rank as my all time favourite console. I just can't get enough of that little wonder machine. It was the system that truly made me a hardcore gamer back in '89.
TG16 was so cool/different back then, I'm glad my friend Chris had one so I could experience it on the weekends. Very cool video!
Apart from Bonk, I didn't really have any knowledge if the PC Engine back in the day (I don't believe it got a proper release in Europe). It's been fun learning about it from Sega Lord X and the Happy Console Gamer.
Great video man, can you do Capcom on the PC Engine next?
Here i'll list all the games for you. :D
* indicates games that were also released in NA
Capcom games on the PC Engine/Turbo Grafx 16:
1941: Counter Attack (Supergrafx)
1943 Kai
Daimakimura (Supergrafx)
F1-Dream
Side Arms Hyper Dine *
Son Son II
Street Fighter II
Tiger Road *
Capcom Games on PC Engine CD ROM²/Turbo Grafx CD:
Adventure Quiz: Capcom World/Hatena no Daibōken
Buster Bros. *
Chiki Chiki Boys
Fighting Street *
Forgotten Worlds *
Side Arm Special
Strider
It would be really cool if you did an episode on these games as well! Thank you!
The PC Engine version of Gain Ground looks absolutely awesome, and the music is kicking!
As someone who has recently become a big Wonder Boy fan, I've always wanted to play Dragons Curse and Dynastic Hero on TurboGrafix CD. I love all the different versions the games have
I remember drooling over the Turbo Grafx 16 CD demos at the store. The color pallet and visuals blew my mind . Of course I couldn’t afford one. I had an NES and my cousin had Sega Genesis. I bought a PC engine mini recently and was very impressed. I have a good number of Sega Genesis and Super Nintendo games and have to say that I’m every bit as impressed with PC-Engine. Even more impressed with games like Castlevania Rondo of Blood. The arcade ports are phenomenal and in many cases they actually look better than the same arcade ports I own. The 16 bit era really delivered with all 3 systems in different ways.
Another day, another video from Sega Lord X. Life is good!
What an excellent episode. I feel appreciated by it. Thanks a lot, mate.
Love your vids man! Keep on and hope you grow to 25k
I really like your videos, they always sound like a friend talking about games, not silly jokes, nor too serious. Kudos to you!
If you are a fan of shoot em ups, genesis and pc engine is both amazing platforms for the genre!
When I was a kid I got a turbo express, still have the thing but I didn't know all these Sega games were released on the PC Engine
I'd buy it!
Another great video man. I appreciate the OG knowledge.✌
bro your videos are money. keep doing what youre doing. sega forever.
Great guide to the Sega library on the PC Engine. Thanks!
These videos are great. There is definitely some binge worthy content on this channel.
Excellent video X. I appreciate it. I recommend though to inform people when talking about PC Engine Super CD games that they can be played on U.S. Turbo CD and Turbo Duo without any modifications or adapters due to them being region free. Keep up the great work. Thank you!
Yeah, I could have slipped that in there at some point.
Sega Lord X it's all good man. Your coverage of Sega's past more than makes up for that 😉😅.
Really impressed that the sprite scaling here outdoes the Genesis. I've always thought it weird that Sega clearly intended to leverage their arcade games with the Mega Drive, launching with Space Harrier & Thunder Blade day 1. Yet they gave it no capability to actually display those games properly.
Sega and Planning don't really go hand in hand.
Sprite scaling hardware was way too expensive to include in a home console back in 1988. Space Harrier 2 and Thunderblade were very early and rushed games, while Afterburner 2 was an outsourced port. Almost like Sega barely even tried. NEC were just able to put more time, effort and care into their ports. I do prefer the Genesis port of Outrun though. It has better detailed graphics and more accurate FM soundtrack. Of course, nothing software spite scaling on the PC-Engine touches what was accomplished in Panorama Cotton on the MD. That game really shows what could've been is Sega took more care with the superscaler ports. I am also very curious to see M2's new Space Harrier port on the Mini 2.
Worst them sprite scaling are the terrible lack of suficient simultaneous color in mega drive
@@oatmeal7818 You can blame it on extremely volatile CRAM prices around the time the design was finalized.64 colors wasn't bad for the time though. 4x time the NES and better than most micros too. All 4th gen consoles were based on compromises in some ways though. NEC did not include hardware for multiple background layers at a time when parallax scrolling established itself as one of the staples of 16-bit gaming, making a lot of their games look very colorful, but flat. The SFC had the colors, sprites and background layers for a very pretty picture, but barely enough CPU power to move everything around at a decent pace. Of course, most SFC and PCE
games ran at a very annoying horizontal resolution, making games look stretched.. At least most MD games are the 4:3 NTSC standard 320x240. Well, Neo-Geo did not compromise when it came to the hardware, featuring the best aspects of all 3 consoles, but this priced it out of the range of most consumers.
How has yt never shown me one of your videos before? This was very well researched and presented. Looking forward to checking out your previous material!
I love this channel. Love your work and keep these awesome videos coming!
Hey man..Ive been watching a load of your videos...really like them. Also particularly appreciate your calm and relaxed presentation, instead of neurotic screaming which seems the norm for a lot of youtubers around
Loved this episode, really great work. I've always found intriguing the fact that Sega licensed its games to rival consoles, more so when you see excellent ports like After Burner and Space Harrier on PC-Engine, that are clearly better than the versions on Sega's own consoles.
When I subbed to you which was fairly recently, you had a little under 10k subs, you blew up pretty quick since then and it’s well deserved. Keep it up!
Thank you. Glad you still happy with the content.
@@SegaLordXfun fact: in Brazil, Wonder Boy in 2 of the games (The Dragon's Trap and Monster Land) are replaced with Monica from the successful comic series Monica's Gang. They're called No Castelo Do Dragão (The Dragon's Castle) and O Resgate (The Rescue) and both games were released here by Tec Toy.
Another great video! I've been exploring the TurboGrafx a bit lately and really having fun doing so.
Nice video and nice voice too! I've long considered buying a PC Engine with the CD-ROM unit for Bonanza Bros alone. The music is even better than the arcade original!
That after burner port is one of the best ports of a super scaler game on non-scaling hardware ive ever seen.
I had an uncle and a cousin on opposite ends of my family who both got the Turbografx 16 for Christmas of 89. Whenever I was visiting, I played it to death. I've always wanted one of my own but still don't have one (yet). I never played the Sega ports but was aware of some of them, but comparing it as an amazing system with a short life span like the Saturn is very accurate. That thing was amazing. The Bonk games, Military Madness, Splatterhouse, Dungeons and Dragons: Order of the Griffon, Blazing Lasers, The Legendary Axe. Whatever your style of game, it had some killer games for it.
As much as I hate exclusives, I think Sega's porting generosity! in the 90's spelled doom for their console business.
Loved the Pc Engine, was very hard to source games though, where I lived it virtually didnt exist. But it meant I had a collection of games that no one else had and that blew friends minds when they came over. 😁
Hope they release a mini of it!
PC Engine was a great home for their Super Scalers imo
Really fantastic episode.
Great video! Never realized all those sega games were released on the pc engine. Some great versions too. Keep up the good work Sega Lord X!
At one point I was playing through games on old 8-bit systems, and having never even known about the TG16 as a kid, I was surprised to see so many Sega games on the console!
It would be cool to watch a comparison video of the different ports of some Sega classics!
In all my years watching RUclips I never seen a vid unique like this Sega vs. PC engine
Great episodes. I love hearing everything about Sega
I never had a turbo but i can emulate my 1990 childhood.
It's too bad that some of these titles, like Shinobi and Space Harrier, didn't have 8 megabit ports, if not higher. The potential was so much higher, but unfortunately the expectations of the time gave us what we got.
Wow I am legit blown away by Afterburner! Outrun looks great too!
Turbo Lord X? lol, great episode
Although this is an 8-bit console, the PCE was built from scratch in 1987 with no need for backward compatibility, so in the end it is not so surprising that it comes close to the 16-bit graphics and animation level.
What is more surprising is that Sega had another year before launching the MD and didn't try to at least match PCE on-screen palettes, let alone go beyond the 512-color master palette.
Sega chose to focus on other aspects of the overall performance and graphics, getting decent bulk deal on the fancy M68000 16-bit CPU and packing things like 3 background layers, crazy amount of sprites per line and ability to combine multiple sprites to form larger sprites in the GPU. Very flexible GPU in general, with a crazy fast system bus access. Took the devs a while to learn the hardware but by the end of the 16-bit gen, Genesis was putting out effects that the PCE and even the SNES could only dream of (e.g.: Red Zone, Toy Story, Panorama Cotton, Batman and Robin).
I get that, but in terms of the attractiveness of games and system perception from the public, colors were a factor which mattered in the 16-bit wars. A 4096-color palette was pretty standard by the late 80's, even the Lynx which was a finished prototype in 1987 featured one.
Only the best game developers would make good use of the MD's palette in their limited time, when we got games like Thunder Force IV, Ranger X, Flink and... Toy Story of course!
That said, the MD was and still is my favorite console, so Sega must have done something right with their design choices as you described ;)
@@jbmaru
I read that the MD/Genesis' limited color palette had something to do with the volatile prices of VRAM, which really spiked exactly at the time when they were finalizing the design. At least, MD/Genesis had a really good default 512 color palette. The whole Genesis hardware architecture was designed by arcade board jockeys and not with ease of development in mind. It did take some talent to get good graphics and sound out of the machine. Luckily, this made only the average and crappy games look and sound mediocre. Because generally, the guys who could design a game worth a damn, were also capable of pushing the hardware in the right direction. When Sonic came out, it was more colorful, fast, smoother and better sounding that anything else out there.
@@Prizrak-hv6qk Yes the first Sonic really was something else when it came out, I was stunned when I saw the first level!
What you said made me think of an example of an "early" & not-so-good-looking game; I wonder what constrained the developers of Midnight Resistance to use 16 onscreen colors only, I know it was their first game on the platform but still! Maybe that made it less CPU-intensive or RAM-hungry, like the 1-player-only gameplay. They definitely mastered their subject when they released Chelnov a year later though.
@@Prizrak-hv6qk What did the Megadrive Batman and Robin have over the snes version?
First of all, I just want to say GREAT VIDEO! I'm a long time subscriber and love your videos.
This narrative that the PCE/TG was an "8bit" console is old and tired. I honestly can't believe we're still having this conversation. The PCE/TG had an overclocked 8bit CPU, but had dual 16bit GPUs. Not to mention the massive colour gamut. More to the point, the 8bit CPU was set to read 16bit code. That's why the PCE/TG was able to pump out comparable, if not better, ports than their rivals. I'm sorry, but the 16bit narrative is completely subjective. Who ever said that 16bit meant the CPU? In any case, even if you want to call it an 8bit console, that just makes the Genny and SNES look bad in comparison. Personally, the TG/PCE was part of the 16bit rivalry. It didn't make huge ground in North America, but it was the champ for a long time in Japan.
It was the entire narrative during the life of the console. Consoles were defined by the CPU for a very long time, and the TG16 was often lambasted in the media for its "weak" 8-bit CPU. Ultimately the bits of your hardware don't matter nearly as much as what else it has under the hood, but I don't think calling the TG16 8-bit is derogatory. If anything, it showed the sheer power of the unit that despite its rather unimpressive CPU, it could still pump out the games it did.
@@SegaLordX See, I disagree. The CPU was impressive. The SNES's CPU was ridiculously slow in comparison. The SNES's CPU had other superpowers, but speed was not one of them.
And the narrative in North America was literally a narrative. It was based on marketing, and nothing else. The same debate wasn't had in Japan.
Anyway, I edited my first comment because I wanted to let you know I love your content. But let me say it here in case you don't catch it. I really do enjoy your content and keep coming back to it. To be honest, I relish having these 16bit debates. 😆
Keep up the great work, brother!
All good bro. I appreciate the civilized response despite not seeing things eye to eye. It's refreshing to see an actual adult act like an adult in this circumstance.
Loved the look and games of the PC Engine.
@TrueSinister thanks, man
great video! PCE has always been one of my favorite consoles
After Burner looks so damn good... 8bit - unbelievable!
Always awesome content!
The only game here that’s truly awful is the vaguely Golden Axe looking thing. Space Harrier isn’t bad, streets ahead of any other home version (except the X68000 version which is also by Dempa and is the PC engine version with better sound and more detail) until the 32X and Saturn versions arrived a few years later. I’m not sure if Outrun is any better than the MD version but the colour pallete is much more faithful to the arcade which does make quite a difference.
Those Afterburner and Out Run ports are black magic
Love your channel SLX, keep it up!!!!
@12:24 The real draw of Thunder Blade in the arcade was the rad deluxe sit-down cabinet with the control stick that moved the whole thing from side to side
One thing left unsaid about Gain Ground -- The replayability of this version takes a dive due to lack of a score!
Great video some of these ports where impressive!
16:20
Oh man, you really have no idea what SEGA permitted US.Gold to do in the home computing era...
Quality content!
Calling the PC Engine/ TurboGraphX 16 an 8 bit system really does an amazing job of demonstrating how dubious the whole idea of classifying systems by 'bitness' actually is, especially when you start asking about the technicalities.
The TurboGraphX 16 has an 8 bit cpu and 16 bit graphics chip.
The 65816 CPU seen in the SNES and Apple IIGS performs 16 bit calculations but has an 8 bit data bus.
The 68000 has a 16 bit data bus, but in spite of this accesses data at half the speed of a 65816 of the same clock speed. (making the distinction on bus size seem weirder), it's also capable of performing 32 bit instructions, even though it's poorly suited to them.
The original 8086 CPU in the first PC's shares the same problem - 16 bit instruction set with an 8 bit data bus.
The n64 does indeed have a 64 bit CPU (two of them in fact, given that the graphics chip contains it's own processor with roughly the same instruction set as the main CPU), but it's main bus is 32 bits, it's memory bus is 9 bits (yes, 9), the cartridge bus is 16 bit, and in spite of having 64 bit instructions, the vast majority of game code is 32 bit instructions.
The Gameboy Advance's ARM/THUMB chip is similar - a 32 bit CPU with lots of 16 bit instructions, almost exclusively used in 16 bit mode by actual games.
Meanwhile, on a different tack, both the Atari VCS and PC Engine are 8 bit systems, and even have the same CPU architecture, but you'd never mistake the games for one of these for the other in a million years...
Kinda makes that classification seem kinda moot.
In my Mind the TG16 is a 16 bit system since that's where it fits in best, when you compare games and how things look...
Or, in different terms it's a 4th generation console, like the Mega Drive and SNES....
(first gen is Pong consoles. 2nd gen is the Atari VCS/2600. 3rd gen is Atari 5200,NES, Master System, etc.)
Just think about the Jaguar, it was "64 bit" but that didn't mean anything...
Nice explanation
Big ups for the correct pronunciation of "Westone."
A VERY cool episode!
I was 10 years old and had a choice: Genesis or TG16. I chose TG16. I certainly loved it, but there were times I regretted it also and wish I chose the Genesis.
Yea, that's a win -win situation
You're right about the TG16 being underrated. I got a Duo in 2001, while they were still available for a decent price. Amazing system, deserved more of a shot.
Is it wrong to hit the thumbs up before even watching the video? Love the PC engine!! Batman NES music is awesome!!!
17:30 Whoa, hold up. That's Gigan right there. What an unexpected cameo.
Do we have an official explanation for why some Sega games appeared on other platforms? I get PC, Sega might not have seen it as a competitor to their console business. But did Sega port some games because they thought "These are console sellers, so why not just port it to another system to make a bit more money"?
I think the intention was to get third parties to make Sega games on other platforms so they can reach a new audience and to hopefully convert them onto Sega hardware where the best home ports would be developed in-house.
@@InputArchive Yeah, I'm conflicted on Sega's handling of it's IP back then, on the one hand I'm sure it brought them money licensing them to third parties and these ports didn't always show up when the Sega home version did, but on the other hand you don't get customers buying your hardware platforms if they can just get the game on something they already own. There is also the quality factor which SLX mentioned, a bad port on another system isn't going to necessarily have them seeking a 'better' version on the Sega console, you might just leave the customer thinking 'this is not a very good game'.
Lazarus Hernandez You could argue Sega was definitely more known for its arcade titles rather than its console exclusive titles. Experience Sega's biggest arcade titles on your PC Engine, but to get arcade quality in your home, buy a MegaDrive. I mean I could be wrong with that line of thinking, but if they wanted the best ports on other systems, surely they would have done it in-house? At the end of the day what it did do was expose more people to Sega franchises.
@@InputArchive
Back then Sega was definitely known for it's arcade titles more than the console exclusives and both the Master System and Genesis leveraged this for their library.
Although the SMS spawned some exclusives like Alex Kidd, and Phantasy Star, it was the Genesis that came into it's own for console exclusives.
I'm pretty sure you are right with the line of thinking, after all one of the game companies of an earlier generation did this very thing; Coleco would make/port games for various consoles at the time (Atari 2600, Intellivision, and Colecovision) but inevitably their consoles version looked/played the best or was the most complete/faithful to the original. The practice excluded the Atari 5200 which was on par graphically with the Colecovision. Likewise Atari stopped porting some of its games on Colecovision.
My conflict is whether this was a good idea for Sega or would it have been better for them if they were a bit more guarded with their IP, like Nintendo is.
Sega end up doing both, licensing out some of their games for port duty (a great deal of arcade titles), while certain games (Sonic, Streets of Rage, Alex Kidd) didn't grace competitors platforms until much later if at all.
Idea for a future topic: SEGA UFO claw catchers and Gacha
Doing that topic and not mentioning Yakuza series :)
There was no talk of two games, the Space Fantasy Zone parody and the supposedly canceled version of Galaxy Force that was originally supposed to be released on PC Engine but was transported to Supergrafx as 'Galaxy Force II' but with the failure of that system was permanently archived.
I was just thinking this is the lineup of Sonics Sega Arcade collection for playstation 3!!! ITS FANTASTIC BC ITS ALL THE ARCADE VERSIONS!! ❤❤❤
great vid, wish i had a chance to try PCE
Before the megadrive, there was the pc engine as an alternative to port games on, eventrough the cpu of the pce was 8bit,but it’s speed was insane and it also contained 2 16bit gpu chips, so the pce was more then just an ordinary 8bitter.
Interesting tech info, I was wondering how the hell it was running after burner so well.
Is the opening "segaaa"from a game or did get some girl to sign it?
It's from the Sega Saturn game Astal.
Columns looks great, I never knew about that. I loved Columns on the Genesis until I could master it.. Actually, I still loved it even then but I dubbed it inferior to Tetris on NES.
Another great video 😊😊😊😊
Seeing the NEC port of Altered Beast was freaky. The dragon mode attacks were particularly bizarre.
And you will catch me next time.
I never owned the TurboGrafx-16/PC Engine. My mother owned it back when I was a kid. Her favorite game was Bonk.
Thankfully, a few (not all unfortunately) of the Wonder Boy/Monster World games are on the Monster World Sega Vintage Collection that I purchased and downloaded on the Xbox 360 digital marketplace a while back (the collection comes with 3 games), otherwise I wouldn't be able to buy these games on the Turbo Grafx or any of the other retro Sega consoles due to how expensive they are in retro gaming shops, not to mention that they're also super hard to find. Compilation re-releases (either digital or disc) are mans best friend. Thank goodness for emulation.
the turbografx-16/duo was and is still my favorite system. gain ground is a great game on this system. i love watching these videos.....old and new.
for 8 bit it had some damn close arcade ports
Good video bro
2:40 What da bleep!?!?!? You quit the Afterburner sample at the exact moment the lead guitar is about to kick in! It is the only port that has this quintessential part of the soundtrack!
Aw man, that gain ground sound track! Yes!
Another great video...thanks!
Its amazing that Sega let their top tier arcade games be ported to the PC-Engine. Some of these are even better than the Genesis versions
The PC Engine has my vote as the most underappreciated console ever. Other people will vote for more unique and rare consoles but you cannot beat the PC Engine's quality and game library.
it's actually kinda overrated (just look at some comments, yours included :P) and there are still some misconceptions going on about it
no, the pc engine is not a "8-bit console" but a 4th gen console instead (i.e. a "16-bit console" for those who want to talk in good ol' and misleading "bit fashion")
but yes, you can beat the pc engine quality and library. the mega drive and snes did and easily for the most part and even older hardwares of the same generation such as the atari st and commodore amiga did in some ways (just look the racing games or compare jim power on pc engine and amiga)
also the pc engine has some weird design choices such as no rgb natively or only one controller port
overall it's a decent console in terms of hardware but which has a very good library with a strong personality which, IMO, is the best thing about it. pc kid, bomberman, far east of eden... some very cool and distinctive games
I think you’re right. It’s the most overlooked console. A lost gem
After Burner in PC Engine is the best among the 8 / 16 bit, in my opinnion. And I just saw it through emulators!
I agree. And same here. It's on play_roms.com Can play right off the browser with a contoller. Fantastic game. Same with Thunder Blade. They are just as good as Genesis but have their own great feel.
it's a tour de force given the pc engine limitations but the mega drive version is about as good (despite being rushed but while it has less detailed graphics and less content, it also has better gameplay and better sound) and the x68000 version is better than both (but it's rushed as well, both md and x68000 were made by dempa who went a bit lazy there)
Megadrive is more challenging imo. But both pc engine and megadrive lack a maneuver necessary to win in the arcade. In the arcade/32x/saturn version when an enemy comes from behind you "just like the scene in top gun" you speed up to get em chasing you, then immediately slow down for em to fly ahead of you to lock on and kill. In the 16 bit ports all you have to do is outrun the enemy like you would a missle. I actually like just being able to simply outrun the enemy and focus more on the planes ahead of me, but it definetly takes away a certain dynamic. I've never played the x68000. The original afterburner actually had no enemies chasing you from behind at all, it wasn't until afterburner 2 that was introduced.
I see your point, guys. But I really hoped more from Mega Drive port. They are Sega, they had the obligation to create something very close to Arcade, like Golden Axe did. In Mega Drive the landing scenes has gone. It might not be a big deal, but it charged personality. The PC Engine version, on the other hand, brought all those stuff. Moreover, the melody version of the songs has born there and became very famous (I really don't thing that it was necessary, but it's a remarkable fact).
Who here's loves Sony Playstation And Pce Engine And Sega games🎮
I was just thinking this is the lineup of Sonics Sega Arcade collection for playstation 3!!! ITS FANTASTIC BC ITS ALL THE ARCADE VERSIONS!! ❤❤❤
PC-Engine and TG-16 don't get enough love.
I played WonderBoyIII and Dragon's curse on original SMS/TG16 hardware many times in the 90s. Both are great and incredibly similar. More of a case where the SMS version looks as good as many 16 bit titles.
Fantastic video.. I will always love retro gaming above all, up to and including PS2/Gamecube as the highest system, and only for the plethora of 2D games on PS2 anyway.
Squeek I love, have on iPhone and Atari Lynx boxed- reminds me of my 1st Genesis game I bought, Zoom! Same style! Lot of odd ones Face or Namco made, like Honey in the Sky (then there's road sequel!) + Bravo Man. Then some real good Japanese only SHMUPs like Mr. Heli (still cheap CIB), Battle Lode Runner, Star Parodier, Rabio Lepus, Metal Stoker, Dead Moon, Ordyne, Somer Assault, man list is huge! Theres 2 more Hu cards I really want instead of just emulating, Liquid Kids (Mizbaku Daiken) and that Hana Taaka Daka you nicely mentioned! Word of mouth and videos like this are so important for this console, as it didn't have the attention back in day or even recently as other retro consoles.
Thunder Blade was from the Sega X Board, a sprite-scaling arcade board system by Sega.
Always thought this would make a fantastic subject for a video. Thank you for making it happen! Gain Ground SX is also my favorite of the Sega ports. I can’t bring myself to buy that awful Golden Axe port. It’s cheap, but I know I will never play it. It just sucks because if they had given it the same treatment as the others got, you know it would have probably been awesome.
Jesus Afterburner, the NES would have caught on fire if it tried to play that. Was it ever put on Amiga?
Well there is five years difference between the two.
I love your video!
I'm amazed how far in depth you went re: the Wonderboy series... Maybe you could throw a video out on which platform is the go-to version for each WB game? Had Wonderboy in Monsterland on the Amiga, was great fun.
Wonder Boy is such a confusing set of games. The way it was released and licensed. The way the names changed. The way it split off into different games. It'd make for a decent topic though.
I was fully aware of it when it came out however it was just too expensive. It was the console of dreams back in the day.
You are referring to the NEO GEO
the PC ENGINE was not overly expensive
@@teen_laqueefa It was in the U.K. Or at least it was out of my price range.
Wow, the PC engine caused even more confusion with the Wonder Boy / Monster World / Adventure Island games, but now I think I have everything on note, literally
I had a PC Engine with Shinobi. I used to feel disappointed at what the game lacked compared to the arcade, but now I just think it was a solid game anyway, and hands down the best port at the time.
Fun video. I think I mentioned it as a topic once, so it was definitely one I was happy to see.
I forget where it was, but I saw someone claim Golden Axe for PCE was decent. I already knew better than that. I don't know what that guy was thinking. I think he turned the system off after seeing the title screen. It would be interesting to see a good version of Golden Axe with PCE's features and limitations.
A real shame about Shinobi, especially since it was the only console version that retained the arcade game play. The real disappointment is that it's well done and looks great, but it's missing too much due to the constraints of a tiny Hu-Card. A typical four-megabit ROM might have been all they needed. The missing stage is unfortunate, but the missing melee attacks are the biggest loss for me as they factored into the game play in the arcade version. Not having them made certain areas harder. That's why my favorite of the console ports remains the version on the Master System.
I'd agree. The missing melee attacks hurt Shinobi more than anything. It made the game much harder.
Great Video the PC Engine for me is the greatest :)
Nice video. I was wondering where Forgotten Worlds was and remembered that it was a Capcom game, oops! A video comparing Genesis, Turbo and SNES games would be nice. By the way Monster Lair was a regular CD, not Super CD.
the only games that surprised me in PC engine that saw a PC engine over graphics over MD were Afterburner, Thunder blue, without in these times that type of algorithm use PCE in Afterburner to create that Scaling dek boat or gasoline plane.