Why? They don't seem to be struggling to make money? One thing with music - Once somethings been done, it's been done. So musicians (well, the good ones) should be looking for something new and different. Lots of listeners don't like new and different. They want old and pretty much the same.
I'm a fan of Tears For Fears and so I know this song very well. One thing about it is that when Curt and Roland sing together you can hear them individually because they have such different voices, and that adds depth to the sound. Listening to the pitch corrected version, I can't hear that any more. They sound the same. And it ruins the song.
Yes, I noticed that as well. I was like, where is Roland? Barely noticeable. The whole point of having two people sing in unison is that their voices are slightly different, which gives it a thicker quality. I shudder at the thought of an auto-tuned choir.
Good point. It kills their vocal sound. Also, I don't think Orzabal needs it and if Curt is a little off once in a blue moon I don't mind, it adds to the vibe.
I have fond memories of singing along with The Beatles albums, developing a keen ear to pick up overdubs and harmonies. This skill led to opportunities to perform with bands, where the ability to sing harmonically without overpowering the lead singer was essential. Though not auto-tuned perfect, the harmonies between Paul, John, and George were still enjoyable to listen to decades later. progmeup said it; thicken up the sound when 2 or more folks sing together, even on the same pitch! totally agree.
Was scanning the comments during the beginning of the video. Read your comment during the first few opening notes. Thanks for saving me, not going to watch it now. Seems like a cool channel though, so off to a recommendation in the sidebar....Boston! More than a feeling!
I love the natural voice of the singer, you can hear the cries in their voices, and hear their feelings and emotions. With pitch correction, you dont hear any of that. Thank you Fil for another awesome analysis! Rock!
Elvis 1977. "Unchained Melody" done like never before. He was overweight, addicted to opiates, heart rhythm issues, no sleep, and just 2 months from death. How that man pulled that rabbit out I'll never know, but it was glorious !
Same, saw David Gilmour back in 2016 and I could hear a mistake in the guitar and he was straining his voice a little, but that honestly made it pretty special.
I'm a little torn on which is worse: The fact that tuning removes all trace of humanity, or that the tuning algorithms are still (and probably never will be) entirely perfect at generating realistic voice timbre on-pitch, and so we're stuck with digital manipulations that slice up sound and subtly shift the speed, sometimes in the time domain AND the frequency domain, leaving processing artifacts that don't sound very nice at all.
Just thought of this comparison... Natural voice is like a signature while corrected voice is like a typewriter. Sharing my random thought of the night. Keep up the great work!
Seems that the music industry is on life support, and barely surviving. I believe there is very little real music left on the pop scene any longer. I’ve been listening to music since late 50s, and have seen and heard a lot. Nothing left that interests me in 2024, except the old songs, now “oldies.”
What an amazing skill you have: "I had to re-calibrate the software to 430 Hz", but then at 14:50 "he's clearly sharp of the C4 and flat of the A#3" { casually adjusts his brain to 430 Hz and demonstrates a slightly sharp C4 followed by a slightly flat A#3 }. Most of all I love how you carry your own talent so lightly.
Yeah, that one blew my mind. I mean, not that he can mentally adjust for it, but rather that his voice's muscle memory doesn't just override what his brain is demanding from it.
MASSIVE difference between the 2 performances, tonally and emotionally. Our ears can hear and the pitch correction shows it so clearly. The original doesn't sound one bit like a robot - you can hear breathiness that is entirely missing from the Xirius version.
Fil: I've learned a great deal from all the discussions of pitch correction/autotune and totally agree that it's an unpleasant, if not outright deceptive practice. I find that I"m not watching your channel as often, though, since that has been the exclusive focus for some time now. I know you get a lot of requests for you to analyze specific releases in this regard. So possibly I'm in the minority, but I'd love to hear you add back some of the analysis/critiques of performances you used to do. Personally, I'd be happy to have you stick to older performances from the pre-autotune days. I'm always SO impressed by your knowledge, your "ear", your ability to explain, and your enthusiasm for your topics, so I will continue to watch regardless. Thanks, Fil!
Totally agree. When Fil explained a while back the skill of Sinatra’s technique of swooping into and out of notes, it deepened my appreciation of his music. More of that!
I also agree with you. I don't enjoy listening to songs that have used pitch correction and/or autotune. So why would I enjoy having to listen to them being dissected?
It seems like more of these 'reactors' are putting out more and more junk that has nothing to reacting to a singer or song. I've unsubscribed from quite a few of them.
Great video! I saw Queen live many times back in the day and one of the most memorable and thrilling aspect of Freddie's vocals was when he played around with the melody, never always pitch perfect but just fabulous. I wouldn't want to hear Freddie any other way.
Freddie was often way way off, but that very stretch made you sense his emotions almost running away with the pitch. And that was the whole point of how he sang.
Spot on Fil (as usual). I 'bonded' emotionally with this song years ago. The original vocal is so crisp, clear and original. It cuts through your day, making an impact, lifting your spirits and creating the moment. The human voice is magical. Overcorrect it, and the humanity and bond are lost.
@@constancemerwin8171 Probably a good job you didn't buy The Hurting at the time. Some great songs, but might have tipped you over the edge (Start of the Breakdown, Memories Fade).
@@constancemerwin8171 Good job you didn't buy The Hurting😉. Great album, but might have tipped you over the edge (Start of the Breakdown, Memories Fade)...
I'm starting to realize that the pitch correction is not just producers striving for perfection or to make editing easier, but also a part of the disparagement of vocalists in the recording industry. Top-notch instrumentalists are more reliable and efficient.
This shows a concept that I have been going by for a long time. The written music is not how you play or sing the music (unless your are in a classical orchestra), it's how you learn how to play or sing the music. There is artistic interpretation for any musical piece or performance. This is even true with classical music where the musicians really do generally try to play the music exactly as written.
Your explanation of this could not have been any better. This gives me a greater appreciation for singers without pitch correction. I really like Curt's natural voice as well as this song and Tears for Fears. Thank you Fil for sharing this video and helping us to appreciate the artists natural voices.
My elderly mom was a jazz singer in Chicago (& Al Jarreau actually opened for her once way back, then reunited at a dry cleaners in LA decades later 👀😄🤷♂️). Say that to say this … I had her watch Fil on Ronstadt first and she flipped out over him! 😅 She’s prolly his oldest fan, and it just shows how a personality as humble, earnest, & welcoming as our man here is ageless. And I love that because it’s nigh impossible today. Good ON ya, Fil! Thanks for makin my ol’ Ma smile so often. 🤟
This is one of your best posts yet! I thoroughly enjoyed it. I think humans need to have that emotional connection with the "unaided" voices/songs. It speaks to our souls ❤️🎸🙂
I was in my prime of youth when this song hit. This autotuned version sounds like a photocopy of a photocopy . I've worked in the business and many younger mixers mix with their eyes -- obsessing over pitch graphs and waveform displays. Digital recording and mixing tools have added superfluous and distracting visual dashboards to a process that should be done by ear. We are at the point where they aren't even doing it for artistic purposes, it's just a knee jerk response from mixers who think that's their job. You should do an episode on the rhythmic parallel of this issue: click tracks and tempo quantizing. A metronome-perfect tempo removes all the subtleties from the groove of a song in the same way pitch correction kills the vocals.
I saw The Who in 1979 and again, with my son, in 2013. Roger’s vocals were VERY different, but they were ROGER’s VOCALS! Fascinating analysis as always. Disturbing-but fascinating! 👍🏼❤️🫡
I grew up with Tears for Fears and still love their sound today but I could tell that there was something off with the video fairly early on, even with my older ears. I love that I grew up in a time when you really felt the personality and emotions of the singers in their music. It's a connection that doesn't fade with time.
There’s definitely something magical about this song. The whole production of it is perfection. These guys were one of the greatest bands since the Beatles, with regard to songwriting, production and overall sound. It screams 1980s for me, takes me right back, everything is fresh and new. Every album of theirs is highly listenable today, more of an overall feel of the music here that’s important, all the new electronic instrumentation. The bass and drums in this song were electronic, they definitely carved a niche for themselves that few after them did as well.
Fil, great analysis pointing out the difference between pitch correction and his natural voice ! You have taught my ears to pick up pitch correction ! You are a fantastic teacher ! Just great ! ❤❤
This is definitely their most iconic song, but “The Seeds of Love” is the Crown Jewel of their catalog and I would so much rather see them perform those songs live. Also, when you said they’re “hitting lines quite regularly” I lost it 😂. Wasn’t thinking pitch correction.
I disagree. There's three songs towards the end of that album that seem to tell a story, and Advice for the Young at Heart from early in the album... the rest of that album I do not like at all. Woman in Chains and the title track are downright obnoxious and cheesy.
And the irony is it costs money to do the pitch correction. (Even if automatically done, someone had to write the software and someone had to pay for it.)
I am a 68yo lady who experienced in full the “Garden of Eden” of what music, artists and creation was back in the days. Some years ago I stumbled on this channel and was gobsmacked by Fil’s explanations. This is precious stuff. I still check his posts and well, this one really shocked me, in a very good way shall I say! I knew that nowadays music is “bleached” by autotuning, but I didn’t really know what that meant. And now I am gutted. I wonder what Rembrandt would say if still alive and painting, if some sort of software would go over his brushe strokes and correct them! Art stands out throughout exactly the individuality of the artist… why do this to music?! Thank you Fil for explaning so well what we “buy” when listening to nowadays… 😢
Thanks Fil I can’t imagine anyone liking the pasteurized artificial sound of songs that are pitch corrected. imperfection is part of humanity … you mentioned PERSONALITY … That’s it in a nutshell 😂✌🏼
Missing the line is human, thats where we get the feeling - mood for the song from. The original recording was great why spoil it. It takes me back to mime on TOTPs. great video 👍
Just as I can hear compression of dynamics, thanks to your video I can now hear the synthesizer-like sound of pitch correction. I'm not sure whether to be thankful for that or not. ;-) (Seriously, THANK YOU.)
When you look at them singing, it looks like they were trying hard to get it right. I have a feeling the unadulterated vocal probably sounds pretty darn good. Sadly, some techno-nerd in post processing thought it would be best though to run it through the correction software to make them sound like robots.
@@JeffMTXasumo que sabes que en los 80s era normal que en los programas de TV "los obligaran" a usar playback sin importar lo magníficas que fueran las voces, el de nuestros tiempos es que igual loes condicionan , o avuerdan con sus c estas correcciones a oesar fe que sus voces cantan!!
As the intro winds down into the last few seconds before Curt starts singing, my heart starts racing in anticipation of hearing my favorite song of all time. Even after all these years. Thanks for the video.
Love this song! The isolated vocal does sound mechanical in the Sirius XM performance. I'd wonder if it was because they are older and their voices may have changed over time, but they are doing this everywhere, so probably not the reason.
I want to hear the genuine, un-"corrected" voices of the artists! Thank you Fil for analyzing this. Is this done while they are singing live, or edited in later?
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom. I consider pitch-corrected voices analogous to mirrored face halves: It is unnaturally perfect, and thus unsettling, consciously or unconsciously. A certain amount of asymmetry is what makes a face or a voice human: living flesh and blood, not a machine.
Thank you, Fil for this analysis. I saw them live back in the day. I love this song. It never gets old .You have taught me to listen. Again, I don't see why pitch correction even exists.
Hi Fil, This is a great song. Very classic 80s. Right up there with Sweet Dreams by the Eurhymics. Interesting comparison from the “live” version to the original record. Awesome analysis and so nice to revisit these cool songs from the 80s. You Are Awesome! Debbie ☮️
Amazing comparison Fil. Couldn't agree with you more about the pitch correction. I can't listen to that digitised, over-compressed Dalek-style vocal timbre on most modern recordings. It hurts my ears, as well as my sensibilities. To me it sounds like the vocal is being delivered through some kind of digital squawk box rather than emitting from human vocal chords. The studio version is head & shoulders superior to the over post-produced "live" performance. Hadn't even realised that pitch correction was a thing in live shows these days.
Old song! Time flies. 😆 My young ears experienced love at first listen when I first heard them sing & Shout. Sowing the Seeds of Love is my favorite, I think.🌻
Count me among those that can now tell that something is "wrong" with some live vocals because of your analysis videos. I don't know whether to thank you for educating me, or yell at you for educating me! 🙂 One thing is for sure - I'm soooo glad that I discovered music in the 60s, when it was pure.
This was so interesting. Fil, love your smile of delight at the real live original production. Love to hear the personality in the song . Love your comparisons. Keep on keeping on!
I think this is why I enjoy our local blues festival so much. It’s honest live music, just good musicians and singers with no alterations. The way it used to be for all music. I miss that. Great analysis Phil !
My daughter took my granddaughter to see them when she was 16 and she was so impressed at how good they were live. At 17 she took her to see Adele. Of course she couldn’t believe how good she was live. She is now 18 and their next concert is Madonna (not my cup of tea) but i wonder what that experience will be like. The three of us also saw Fleetwood Mac together and what a relief to me she liked that one also
I've always felt that Brian Ferry had such a distinctive and soulful voice. You couldn't mistake Brian's vocals for anyone else's. Likewise, for Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull). Thanks, FIL.
There used to be much discussion about musicians sounding totally different live than on the recording… And the sign of a great musician was them sounding just like the album, live.
When I left the US Army after nearly 6 years of service,, this song was on heavy radio rotation. It became my anthem as I moved from the Army to college. I hear the song and am instantly back to to days of transition and hope.
A Fantastic view Fil! Appreciate you & the work you do immensely. Lol always a blast Bro! "except when we had Cofu @ the same time!"😊 Cheers to continued success friend, Luv&Peace,💛✌🏼🤘🏼💫
I started revisiting my generation's music 3 years ago and, looking at some vids of 70s concerts, noticed that something was not quite right with music and voices I was very used to hearing. Now I know it's not my ears - you've burst my music ballon. But, being a cynical old coot, I don't mind - I'm becoming an autotune hunter and I like it.
Have loved TfF since the beginning, have loved this record since it first came out, and beyond your interesting analyses of these performances--I got such a delightful kick watching your big smile as you listened back to the original recording. 😄
Tears for Fears is one of my all time favorites of any era. The main reason for that, besides their wonderful, intelligent lyrics, is the passion and emotion they put into their songs. I'm very disappointed to see that very essence that I love so much now being removed from their songs.
@@dcallan812 Through Spotify I have lists of music from all my life... Listening is like travelling in time... Fascinating..! The Brain Works in Mysterious Ways! 💙💙💙💙💙🦩🦩🦩
Hi Fil, I could quite happily listen to a pure instrumental version of this song…it has such feeling and very well played.A great analyst.cheers,Roly🇬🇧.
Yeah, that performance sounds like a watered down version vocally. That's a bummer. It really is a great song. I feel so much nostalgia hearing the original. I still have Tears for Fears Greatest Hits on cassette tape 😊.
Perfection is boring and especially in music we need that inperfection or emotion in the singer’s voice to make us feel. Meaningful song lyrics sung with soul touch you so much more deeply. Imagine pitch correcting Janis Joplin😢
OMG Fil I went to see Tears For Fears in 1989 here in le Colisée de Québec they were a brand new band back then and I saw the announce in the journal and wondered if it was worth to go and see them heck it was one of the great show I saw in my life I am so happy you took TFF for analysing it and as usual I still learnt something new as I never thought it was auto tuned in 1989 and the auto tune was created in 1998 I love your way to analyse I just search a new manner to exprss my feeling but I begin to be out of vocabulary lol Thank you so much again for the great work you do with much love I say much love to you and \m/ Even Roland Orzabald thought me 1 french word laque pour cheveux in English Breal Cream lol
I was a fan of TforF and still like this song but dang, it does correct down to a flat affect. Thanks yet again, Fil for your interesting and educational analysis. ❤
Absolutely on point - personality and emotion (which doesn't mean a pitch corrected voice doesn't also sound great though not so unique and unmistakable). Great analyzing - and I liked and still like vocals and band. 🎶
I saw them live, the early 90s I guess, no Curt just Roland. The music sounded phenomenal. Roland mentioned he was missing a female back up singer and was going to sing her solo part in one song. He did and he sounded just like a female soul singer! Great video, thank you! PS Just ordered one of your Ts!
Ah, if you love this, then I cannot urge you enough to give a listen to Roland Orzibal's 90's album Raoul And The Kings of Spain. It's truly the best music to come out of that decade, which I realize isn't saying much, but it truly is a fantastic effort.
I didn't particularly like Tears for Fears back in the day, whether in studio or live. But I did recognize them for how damned good they were. Thanks for helping me recall Tears for Fears, and for helping me appreciate them all over again
Isnt is so nice to identify and recognize amazing talent, while not having to like the sound. Whilst I was a Tears for Fears fane, there were plenty of other bands that were clearly exceptional, I just didn't groove with them.
The great thing about TFF is that they didn't stand still. A song like War of Attrition with its grungy guitars or the flamenco Sketches of Pain couldn't be further from this.
It's a great song Fil, and the production is excellent. I worked with an engineer who worked with Tears For Fears and as a guitarist I'm sure you'll appreciate this. We were talking about the guitar solo, and I said it was very clever and unusual playing - as in how he moves very quickly between the low and high lines. He told me the solo was a series of edits!
Who ARE these people that are doing this to our music? Why are they doing this to our music? Is it because that is what they have taught us to expect, like red tasteless tomatoes? Phil, it would be very entertaining for you to interview an engineer that is responsible for this practice. I would love to know why.....really, why?
I very much have to agree with you. If I listen to my favourite bands from my favourite era when I was most into music, there was absolutely no mistaking Howard Devoto, Julian Cope, Ian Curtis, Siouxsie Sioux, Ian McCulloch - a single note would do it. None of them were Pavarotti, but boy did they have personality.
Just an amazing episode and demonstration that you've presented here that almost had me in tears seeing how crazy the present world seeks cookie-cutter perfection instead of soul and personality. Hearing the Tears For Fears comparison makes me think way back to all of those vinyl and CD purchases I made of older songs that turned out to be re-recordings because of label issues or whatever. They just didn't sound right. They lost their sincere expression and urgency.
The Wings of Pegasus channel should be a mandatory watching requirement for the entire music industry today.
Amen to that!
Why? They don't seem to be struggling to make money? One thing with music - Once somethings been done, it's been done. So musicians (well, the good ones) should be looking for something new and different. Lots of listeners don't like new and different. They want old and pretty much the same.
I wholeheartedly agree!!
INDEED!!!
Not really. He's quite clueless really. It's a lot of tripe.
Everybody Wants to Tune the World.
Too sad and true. Though, there are a few exceptions out there.
This parody cover needs to happen
@@cateblighDo the whole Cher autotune, Waring blender treatment.
@@jimshorts6751 haha yes, and it would be a big hit! Because the melody and lyrics are so good, even destroyed it would probably chart haha
well said... erm sung?
I'm a fan of Tears For Fears and so I know this song very well. One thing about it is that when Curt and Roland sing together you can hear them individually because they have such different voices, and that adds depth to the sound. Listening to the pitch corrected version, I can't hear that any more. They sound the same. And it ruins the song.
Yes, I noticed that as well. I was like, where is Roland? Barely noticeable. The whole point of having two people sing in unison is that their voices are slightly different, which gives it a thicker quality. I shudder at the thought of an auto-tuned choir.
Exactly, pitch tuned makes it impossible to naturally match notes.
Good point. It kills their vocal sound. Also, I don't think Orzabal needs it and if Curt is a little off once in a blue moon I don't mind, it adds to the vibe.
I have fond memories of singing along
with The Beatles albums, developing a
keen ear to pick up overdubs and harmonies.
This skill led to opportunities to perform
with bands, where the ability to sing
harmonically without overpowering
the lead singer was essential. Though
not auto-tuned perfect, the harmonies
between Paul, John, and George were
still enjoyable to listen to decades later.
progmeup said it; thicken up the sound when 2 or more folks sing together, even on the same pitch! totally agree.
Was scanning the comments during the beginning of the video. Read your comment during the first few opening notes. Thanks for saving me, not going to watch it now. Seems like a cool channel though, so off to a recommendation in the sidebar....Boston! More than a feeling!
I love the natural voice of the singer, you can hear the cries in their voices, and hear their feelings and emotions. With pitch correction, you dont hear any of that. Thank you Fil for another awesome analysis! Rock!
I've heard great singers described as 'opening the wound'.
They were & are "supernatural".
Elvis 1977. "Unchained Melody" done like never before. He was overweight, addicted to opiates, heart rhythm issues, no sleep, and just 2 months from death. How that man pulled that rabbit out I'll never know, but it was glorious !
@@jimshorts6751 a lifetime of training 😀
Steve Perry with Journey, 81 Houston concert "Mother, Father."
Wow. Just wow.
Curt's voice is like butter. He sings like everything's a lullaby. I'm sorry to hear the corrections applied.
Curt's voice is like butter... now they have made it margarine.
I'm so depressed. What a travesty. Curt deserves better.
WTF I hate butter
I can't believe it's not butter.
@@dathorndike4908I think he probably wants it that way.
I'm quite all right with a little bit of imperfection in a live performance. I prefer it that way!
It's not really an imperfection thing. It's humans making music for humans to hear and feel.
That’s the human aspect of it.
Same, saw David Gilmour back in 2016 and I could hear a mistake in the guitar and he was straining his voice a little, but that honestly made it pretty special.
When you listen to the isolated vocal it just sounds like a machine. So sad.
I'm a little torn on which is worse: The fact that tuning removes all trace of humanity, or that the tuning algorithms are still (and probably never will be) entirely perfect at generating realistic voice timbre on-pitch, and so we're stuck with digital manipulations that slice up sound and subtly shift the speed, sometimes in the time domain AND the frequency domain, leaving processing artifacts that don't sound very nice at all.
Just thought of this comparison... Natural voice is like a signature while corrected voice is like a typewriter. Sharing my random thought of the night. Keep up the great work!
replace "this comparison" with "an analogy" ... I agree.
Agree. Perfect analogy
Excellent analogy!!
Great video man, guys like you and Ric Beato might just save the music industry.
Thanks!
Seems that the music industry is on life support, and barely surviving. I believe there is very little real music left on the pop scene any longer. I’ve been listening to music since late 50s, and have seen and heard a lot. Nothing left that interests me in 2024, except the old songs, now “oldies.”
What an amazing skill you have: "I had to re-calibrate the software to 430 Hz", but then at 14:50 "he's clearly sharp of the C4 and flat of the A#3" { casually adjusts his brain to 430 Hz and demonstrates a slightly sharp C4 followed by a slightly flat A#3 }. Most of all I love how you carry your own talent so lightly.
Yeah, that one blew my mind. I mean, not that he can mentally adjust for it, but rather that his voice's muscle memory doesn't just override what his brain is demanding from it.
It's 'relative pitch' he was using intuitively.
We’ll put re carrying “talent so lightly.”
MASSIVE difference between the 2 performances, tonally and emotionally. Our ears can hear and the pitch correction shows it so clearly. The original doesn't sound one bit like a robot - you can hear breathiness that is entirely missing from the Xirius version.
Fil: I've learned a great deal from all the discussions of pitch correction/autotune and totally agree that it's an unpleasant, if not outright deceptive practice. I find that I"m not watching your channel as often, though, since that has been the exclusive focus for some time now. I know you get a lot of requests for you to analyze specific releases in this regard. So possibly I'm in the minority, but I'd love to hear you add back some of the analysis/critiques of performances you used to do. Personally, I'd be happy to have you stick to older performances from the pre-autotune days.
I'm always SO impressed by your knowledge, your "ear", your ability to explain, and your enthusiasm for your topics, so I will continue to watch regardless. Thanks, Fil!
Totally agree. When Fil explained a while back the skill of Sinatra’s technique of swooping into and out of notes, it deepened my appreciation of his music. More of that!
I agree also
Couldn’t agree more
I also agree with you. I don't enjoy listening to songs that have used pitch correction and/or autotune. So why would I enjoy having to listen to them being dissected?
It seems like more of these 'reactors' are putting out more and more junk that has nothing to reacting to a singer or song. I've unsubscribed from quite a few of them.
Great video!
I saw Queen live many times back in the day and one of the most memorable and thrilling aspect of Freddie's vocals was when he played around with the melody, never always pitch perfect but just fabulous. I wouldn't want to hear Freddie any other way.
Me either!!
Freddie was often way way off, but that very stretch made you sense his emotions almost running away with the pitch. And that was the whole point of how he sang.
@@aaronwaldersladeKeep in mind in ear monitors wasn’t a thing back then.
"People want to hear the person's voice, warts & all."
Yes & amen. Best synopsis full stop.
Spot on Fil (as usual). I 'bonded' emotionally with this song years ago. The original vocal is so crisp, clear and original. It cuts through your day, making an impact, lifting your spirits and creating the moment. The human voice is magical. Overcorrect it, and the humanity and bond are lost.
One of my favorite bands and songs. They don’t need help!!
Especially Roland 😉
I love TFF too
They don’t! So why?
Songs From the Big Chair, I love that album. I still have it and play it at least once a week. It was such a unique sounding duo back in the late 80s.
Absolute classic!...
I bought that album in the 80s too, during my divorce! It helped me escape for a bit.
@@constancemerwin8171 Probably a good job you didn't buy The Hurting at the time. Some great songs, but might have tipped you over the edge (Start of the Breakdown, Memories Fade).
@@constancemerwin8171 Good job you didn't buy The Hurting😉. Great album, but might have tipped you over the edge (Start of the Breakdown, Memories Fade)...
I loved this song and it sounds so flat in that "live" recording! Thanks for playing the original---it cleaned my palate.
I agree, I will take the original voices over those that have been tampered with all day long! It's them and we like them the way they are naturally!
@pisceananomaly That's not what we are talking about. We're talking about pitch correction specifically.
Keep up the great work. You're speaking what many of us in the industry have thought for decades now.
I'm starting to realize that the pitch correction is not just producers striving for perfection or to make editing easier, but also a part of the disparagement of vocalists in the recording industry. Top-notch instrumentalists are more reliable and efficient.
This shows a concept that I have been going by for a long time. The written music is not how you play or sing the music (unless your are in a classical orchestra), it's how you learn how to play or sing the music. There is artistic interpretation for any musical piece or performance. This is even true with classical music where the musicians really do generally try to play the music exactly as written.
Your explanation of this could not have been any better. This gives me a greater appreciation for singers without pitch correction. I really like Curt's natural voice as well as this song and Tears for Fears. Thank you Fil for sharing this video and helping us to appreciate the artists natural voices.
My elderly mom was a jazz singer in Chicago (& Al Jarreau actually opened for her once way back, then reunited at a dry cleaners in LA decades later 👀😄🤷♂️). Say that to say this …
I had her watch Fil on Ronstadt first and she flipped out over him! 😅 She’s prolly his oldest fan, and it just shows how a personality as humble, earnest, & welcoming as our man here is ageless.
And I love that because it’s nigh impossible today. Good ON ya, Fil! Thanks for makin my ol’ Ma smile so often. 🤟
This is one of your best posts yet! I thoroughly enjoyed it. I think humans need to have that emotional connection with the "unaided" voices/songs. It speaks to our souls ❤️🎸🙂
I was in my prime of youth when this song hit. This autotuned version sounds like a photocopy of a photocopy . I've worked in the business and many younger mixers mix with their eyes -- obsessing over pitch graphs and waveform displays. Digital recording and mixing tools have added superfluous and distracting visual dashboards to a process that should be done by ear.
We are at the point where they aren't even doing it for artistic purposes, it's just a knee jerk response from mixers who think that's their job.
You should do an episode on the rhythmic parallel of this issue: click tracks and tempo quantizing. A metronome-perfect tempo removes all the subtleties from the groove of a song in the same way pitch correction kills the vocals.
Thanks again, Fil. Another great video! I feel lucky to have grown up with the ‘60s, ‘70’s and ‘80’s music.
So do I 😃🎶
I saw The Who in 1979 and again, with my son, in 2013. Roger’s vocals were VERY different, but they were ROGER’s VOCALS! Fascinating analysis as always. Disturbing-but fascinating! 👍🏼❤️🫡
I grew up with Tears for Fears and still love their sound today but I could tell that there was something off with the video fairly early on, even with my older ears. I love that I grew up in a time when you really felt the personality and emotions of the singers in their music. It's a connection that doesn't fade with time.
If people are noticing pitch correction more, I think it's thanks to you , Fil. Nobody else is calling out these "corrected" performances.
Rick Beato does.
OK, I thought Rick only reviewed guitarists@@trinitytoo
Best moment ...driving on rt 9 from San Jose to Santa Cruz with my buds..and this song ruled the world !
Takes me back to a convertible, driving through the mountains down south. My last carefree year before graduation.
There’s definitely something magical about this song. The whole production of it is perfection. These guys were one of the greatest bands since the Beatles, with regard to songwriting, production and overall sound. It screams 1980s for me, takes me right back, everything is fresh and new. Every album of theirs is highly listenable today, more of an overall feel of the music here that’s important, all the new electronic instrumentation. The bass and drums in this song were electronic, they definitely carved a niche for themselves that few after them did as well.
That’s illegal BTW. You are not allowed to wear any devices that impede your hearing whilst driving a car in CA. Be warned.
Sounds like a lovely memory
I love to watch Phil's knowledge and passion for the subject.
Fil, great analysis pointing out the difference between pitch correction and his natural voice ! You have taught my ears to pick up pitch correction ! You are a fantastic teacher ! Just great ! ❤❤
This is definitely their most iconic song, but “The Seeds of Love” is the Crown Jewel of their catalog and I would so much rather see them perform those songs live.
Also, when you said they’re “hitting lines quite regularly” I lost it 😂. Wasn’t thinking pitch correction.
I disagree. There's three songs towards the end of that album that seem to tell a story, and Advice for the Young at Heart from early in the album... the rest of that album I do not like at all. Woman in Chains and the title track are downright obnoxious and cheesy.
Accuracy at the expense of soul.
My words while I watched this exactly! Heart & soul removed.... Dead music.
If I went to see live, I want live
Sigh..
Excellent description of this abomination called pitch correction.
Yes!!
And the irony is it costs money to do the pitch correction. (Even if automatically done, someone had to write the software and someone had to pay for it.)
It's like Pringles compared to real potato chips.
It's like teleprompter-addicted Joe Biden compared to a President who can talk extemporaneously.
Excellent analogy.
"Shots fired! I repeat, shots fired!" :P
I call that compressed saw dust
Pringles are good.
I saw TFF here in the US in 2022. They were amazing. 100% I would pay to see them again.
I am a 68yo lady who experienced in full the “Garden of Eden” of what music, artists and creation was back in the days. Some years ago I stumbled on this channel and was gobsmacked by Fil’s explanations. This is precious stuff. I still check his posts and well, this one really shocked me, in a very good way shall I say! I knew that nowadays music is “bleached” by autotuning, but I didn’t really know what that meant. And now I am gutted. I wonder what Rembrandt would say if still alive and painting, if some sort of software would go over his brushe strokes and correct them! Art stands out throughout exactly the individuality of the artist… why do this to music?! Thank you Fil for explaning so well what we “buy” when listening to nowadays… 😢
Thanks Fil I can’t imagine anyone liking the pasteurized artificial sound of songs that are pitch corrected. imperfection is part of humanity … you mentioned PERSONALITY … That’s it in a nutshell 😂✌🏼
Missing the line is human, thats where we get the feeling - mood for the song from. The original recording was great why spoil it. It takes me back to mime on TOTPs. great video 👍
Just as I can hear compression of dynamics, thanks to your video I can now hear the synthesizer-like sound of pitch correction.
I'm not sure whether to be thankful for that or not. ;-)
(Seriously, THANK YOU.)
When you look at them singing, it looks like they were trying hard to get it right. I have a feeling the unadulterated vocal probably sounds pretty darn good. Sadly, some techno-nerd in post processing thought it would be best though to run it through the correction software to make them sound like robots.
They had to have agreed to it. Breaks my heart. Tom petty would wag his head and slowly walk away.
@@JeffMTXasumo que sabes que en los 80s era normal que en los programas de TV "los obligaran" a usar playback sin importar lo magníficas que fueran las voces, el de nuestros tiempos es que igual loes condicionan , o avuerdan con sus c estas correcciones a oesar fe que sus voces cantan!!
As the intro winds down into the last few seconds before Curt starts singing, my heart starts racing in anticipation of hearing my favorite song of all time. Even after all these years.
Thanks for the video.
Another great analysis, thanks! I guess "live" doesn't mean what it used to, unfortunately.
I just love the Original! Fil, you are the master! So much respect!!! 💜
Love this song! The isolated vocal does sound mechanical in the Sirius XM performance. I'd wonder if it was because they are older and their voices may have changed over time, but they are doing this everywhere, so probably not the reason.
Heard them live on tour last summer. Absolutely every bit as good as they ever were...maybe even better?
Thank you Fil. I also am learning a lot about why I like the singers and performances that I do and why some don't sound quite normal.
I want to hear the genuine, un-"corrected" voices of the artists! Thank you Fil for analyzing this.
Is this done while they are singing live, or edited in later?
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom. I consider pitch-corrected voices analogous to mirrored face halves: It is unnaturally perfect, and thus unsettling, consciously or unconsciously. A certain amount of asymmetry is what makes a face or a voice human: living flesh and blood, not a machine.
Thank you, Fil for this analysis. I saw them live back in the day. I love this song. It never gets old .You have taught me to listen. Again, I don't see why pitch correction even exists.
Hi Fil,
This is a great song. Very classic 80s. Right up there with Sweet Dreams by the Eurhymics. Interesting comparison from the “live” version to the original record. Awesome analysis and so nice to revisit these cool songs from the 80s. You Are Awesome! Debbie ☮️
What a great observation, and I think it's spot on! Just bought this Tears for Fears record on vinyl last week, because I still love it so much.
Amazing comparison Fil. Couldn't agree with you more about the pitch correction. I can't listen to that digitised, over-compressed Dalek-style vocal timbre on most modern recordings. It hurts my ears, as well as my sensibilities. To me it sounds like the vocal is being delivered through some kind of digital squawk box rather than emitting from human vocal chords. The studio version is head & shoulders superior to the over post-produced "live" performance. Hadn't even realised that pitch correction was a thing in live shows these days.
I love the sharp last guitar note. It’s intentional.
Old song! Time flies. 😆 My young ears experienced love at first listen when I first heard them sing & Shout. Sowing the Seeds of Love is my favorite, I think.🌻
I used to love singing along to 'Shout' in my working days,but my favorite song by far is"Woman in Chains".
Absolutely love this song! Thanks for covering it Fil.
Count me among those that can now tell that something is "wrong" with some live vocals because of your analysis videos. I don't know whether to thank you for educating me, or yell at you for educating me! 🙂 One thing is for sure - I'm soooo glad that I discovered music in the 60s, when it was pure.
This was so interesting. Fil, love your smile of delight at the real live original production. Love to hear the personality in the song . Love your comparisons. Keep on keeping on!
I definitely like no pitch correction more
Not me. I like pitch correction
@@nina1963dec to each their own
@@bttrflygal It was a joke, of course I hate it!
@@nina1963dec didn't know :)
Well analyzed! Very informative, and now its one of those "I can't unhear" things. I *think* that's a good thing :-)
That’s the best song of the 80s IMO and the video is great. They didn’t need to alter it. Thanks, Fil. I thoroughly enjoyed this analysis.
Great song but there’s so many better songs from the 80s. In my opinion of course.
Where the streets have no name
I think this is why I enjoy our local blues festival so much. It’s honest live music, just good musicians and singers with no alterations. The way it used to be for all music. I miss that. Great analysis Phil !
My daughter took my granddaughter to see them when she was 16 and she was so impressed at how good they were live. At 17 she took her to see Adele. Of course she couldn’t believe how good she was live. She is now 18 and their next concert is Madonna (not my cup of tea) but i wonder what that experience will be like. The three of us also saw Fleetwood Mac together and what a relief to me she liked that one also
I read that Adele refused to let them autotune her music. Although I think it's done unknowing without the artist consent sometimes.
Waste of money.
I've always felt that Brian Ferry had such a distinctive and soulful voice. You couldn't mistake Brian's vocals for anyone else's. Likewise, for Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull). Thanks, FIL.
There used to be much discussion about musicians sounding totally different live than on the recording… And the sign of a great musician was them sounding just like the album, live.
Bee Gees were great at that.😊
It never gets old. LOVE them.
Thank YOU, Fil 🖤🤘🏽
When I left the US Army after nearly 6 years of service,, this song was on heavy radio rotation. It became my anthem as I moved from the Army to college. I hear the song and am instantly back to to days of transition and hope.
One of my favs from 1985.
Thank you so much Fil! I appreciate you explaining these things so well with passion.
The natural human voice is the most beautiful instrument
A Fantastic view Fil! Appreciate you & the work you do immensely. Lol always a blast Bro! "except when we had Cofu @ the same time!"😊 Cheers to continued success friend, Luv&Peace,💛✌🏼🤘🏼💫
I started revisiting my generation's music 3 years ago and, looking at some vids of 70s concerts, noticed that something was not quite right with music and voices I was very used to hearing. Now I know it's not my ears - you've burst my music ballon. But, being a cynical old coot, I don't mind - I'm becoming an autotune hunter and I like it.
Have loved TfF since the beginning, have loved this record since it first came out, and beyond your interesting analyses of these performances--I got such a delightful kick watching your big smile as you listened back to the original recording. 😄
Thanks for doing this great old song I still sing along to it on the oldies channel
Thx Fil for this breakdown. Everyone looked & sounded different back then & that was the point!
Tears for Fears is one of my all time favorites of any era. The main reason for that, besides their wonderful, intelligent lyrics, is the passion and emotion they put into their songs. I'm very disappointed to see that very essence that I love so much now being removed from their songs.
Great song and analysis and appreciate both vocals on screen for comparison. 🙂🎸🎵
They sound so good I could cry. This song has always been a favorite of mine.
There is a very good cover by Brothertiger!💙💙💙💙💙🦩
@@DonnaGisellaTranchel
I agree.
reminds me of some may things that were going on in my life when it came out.
@@dcallan812 Through Spotify I have lists of music from all my life... Listening is like travelling in time... Fascinating..! The Brain Works in Mysterious Ways! 💙💙💙💙💙🦩🦩🦩
If you like instrumental stuff . Kent nishimura does a fabulous finger pick guitar version of ths song
Hi Fil, I could quite happily listen to a pure instrumental version of this song…it has such feeling and very well played.A great analyst.cheers,Roly🇬🇧.
There is an instrumental version on Spotify. It's on the Super Deluxe version of the album.
Yeah, that performance sounds like a watered down version vocally. That's a bummer. It really is a great song. I feel so much nostalgia hearing the original. I still have Tears for Fears Greatest Hits on cassette tape 😊.
Perfection is boring and especially in music we need that inperfection or emotion in the singer’s voice to make us feel. Meaningful song lyrics sung with soul touch you so much more deeply. Imagine pitch correcting Janis Joplin😢
I'm really enjoying your analysis videos ❤
OMG Fil I went to see Tears For Fears in 1989 here in le Colisée de Québec they were a brand new band back then and I saw the announce in the journal and wondered if it was worth to go and see them heck it was one of the great show I saw in my life I am so happy you took TFF for analysing it and as usual I still learnt something new as I never thought it was auto tuned in 1989 and the auto tune was created in 1998 I love your way to analyse I just search a new manner to exprss my feeling but I begin to be out of vocabulary lol Thank you so much again for the great work you do with much love I say much love to you and \m/ Even Roland Orzabald thought me 1 french word laque pour cheveux in English Breal Cream lol
I was a fan of TforF and still like this song but dang, it does correct down to a flat affect. Thanks yet again, Fil for your interesting and educational analysis. ❤
"Old"!?
Now I really feel old...😂😂😂
😂 Pre 1997 to be more precise!
@@wingsofpegasus 1997 being 4 yrs after I left Uni....urghh
I KNOW! I just made basically the same comment, LOL!
VERY "pre". LOL! You are too kind, Fil!@@wingsofpegasus
😂
Your example of a pitch corrected voice at 4:56 was spot on.
* read title *
"old songs"
* realizes I am GenX and am... officially old.
LOL! I look forward to watching this one when I'm done with work stuff!
Another great reaction, Fil. Thank you
Emotions do sound way better then pitch correction songs. Thank you for sharing. 😎
Absolutely on point - personality and emotion (which doesn't mean a pitch corrected voice doesn't also sound great though not so unique and unmistakable). Great analyzing - and I liked and still like vocals and band. 🎶
I've seen them live several times recently and they sounded amazing. Not sure why someone felt the need to pitch correct like this.
I saw them live, the early 90s I guess, no Curt just Roland. The music sounded phenomenal. Roland mentioned he was missing a female back up singer and was going to sing her solo part in one song. He did and he sounded just like a female soul singer! Great video, thank you! PS Just ordered one of your Ts!
Ah, if you love this, then I cannot urge you enough to give a listen to Roland Orzibal's 90's album Raoul And The Kings of Spain. It's truly the best music to come out of that decade, which I realize isn't saying much, but it truly is a fantastic effort.
Great song and great analysis! Love Tears for Fears, so good!
I didn't particularly like Tears for Fears back in the day, whether in studio or live.
But I did recognize them for how damned good they were.
Thanks for helping me recall Tears for Fears, and for helping me appreciate them all over again
Isnt is so nice to identify and recognize amazing talent, while not having to like the sound. Whilst I was a Tears for Fears fane, there were plenty of other bands that were clearly exceptional, I just didn't groove with them.
The great thing about TFF is that they didn't stand still. A song like War of Attrition with its grungy guitars or the flamenco Sketches of Pain couldn't be further from this.
It's a great song Fil, and the production is excellent. I worked with an engineer who worked with Tears For Fears and as a guitarist I'm sure you'll appreciate this. We were talking about the guitar solo, and I said it was very clever and unusual playing - as in how he moves very quickly between the low and high lines. He told me the solo was a series of edits!
I would like to add a request that you react to Ren and Chinchilla singing Chalk Outline live!
Yes! One of my favourite performances ever!
Love this song ❤️. The lyrics are timeless. Enjoyed this one Fil. 🙂💯
Who ARE these people that are doing this to our music? Why are they doing this to our music? Is it because that is what they have taught us to expect, like red tasteless tomatoes? Phil, it would be very entertaining for you to interview an engineer that is responsible for this practice. I would love to know why.....really, why?
Thanks for explaining what I've instinctively heard for many years , but couldn't quite figure out
I very much have to agree with you. If I listen to my favourite bands from my favourite era when I was most into music, there was absolutely no mistaking Howard Devoto, Julian Cope, Ian Curtis, Siouxsie Sioux, Ian McCulloch - a single note would do it. None of them were Pavarotti, but boy did they have personality.
Just an amazing episode and demonstration that you've presented here that almost had me in tears seeing how crazy the present world seeks cookie-cutter perfection instead of soul and personality. Hearing the Tears For Fears comparison makes me think way back to all of those vinyl and CD purchases I made of older songs that turned out to be re-recordings because of label issues or whatever. They just didn't sound right. They lost their sincere expression and urgency.
The OLD songs sounded better ... BECAUSE THEY WERE BETTER !