I appreciate the emphasis on Goku's Righteous Anger, as opposed to Vegeta's. Goku's anger usually stems from witnessing the suffering of others, and since death isn't as much of a consequence in their universe, it makes even more sense that their suffering is pointless. When Majin Vegeta blasts the tournament crowds, Goku isn't just furious at their pain or fear of the end, it's also the fact that Vegeta is throwing an adult-sized tantrum and they're paying for it.
The Gospel summed up 1. We have all sinned and fallen short of God's glory - 1 sin disqualifies us from heaven - 1 sin separates us from God - 1 sin is enough to send us to Helll 2. God came down to earth in human form (Jesus) - to live the perfect life for us (have a perfect record) - suffer for us leading up to the cross, on the cross, and die for us - He did this, to take the FULL punishment for ours sins 3. This means, if we believe and follow Jesus, repent of (turn away from ours sins), ask God for forgiveness, for what we have done (recieving His forgiveness) and in return forgive others of their sins (as God forgives us of our sins) - Jesus will give us His record (which is perfect and clean) instead of us having our own record (which would be full of sins) - meaning we can enter into heaven, for all eternity, instead of going to hell for all eternity Share this message with as many people as possible, so they may have a chance at salvation and have a chance at being saved
My dad died last year and so many things in this video spoke to me. We're Norwegian, growing up my dad would always hype up being a viking. I love vikings but eventually I realized I was like Vegeta, stuck in my own realm, how can people not think as highly of Vikings as I do? Etc. Similar to saiyan pride. I love and miss my dad so much. And I appreciate everything he taught me. Including the pride in my race.
Pride cometh before destruction. And near everytime Vegeta got too prideful before a battle he got royally demolished. Except for his Recoome brawl. He knew he was outclassed back then.
And it was one of the best fights in that saga as well. Vegeta got his butt whopped while also giving a good pummeling himself, he was sneaky, cunning, he knew he was facing a daunting task with 2 factions so he had to put pride on the side for a bit which is why namek saga veggie is my personal favorite beside late buu saga. Android saga being my absolute least, he was just so annoyingly arrogant.
Vegeta is one of the most prideful characters in DBZ. The guy who refuses to be second best, and trained just to surpass Goku in strength. But pride alone cost him so much in his life. Until the end of Buu Arc where he finally rids his pride, and excepts his new home.
I think Vegeta peaked at “That’s my Bulma!” The reason I said that is in that Particular Movie/Super episodes he was making a fool of himself to keep people safe from Beerus Something you’d never see Vegeta prior and that led up to him standing up to Beerus even though he knew how strong he was….before Bulma Got hit vegeta literally just admitted defeat but the moment he saw that he was willing to risk it all….but Vegeta’s character is ever developing because even though I called that the Peak he still grew a lot , by further more stomping on his Pride when he asked Whis for Training, Vegeta never before trained with anyone nor did he ever had a teacher or wanted one so that was a Huge development on his part and later down in the Goku black Arc he was never really bothered if Goku got stronger than him or not he really seemed content for the most part….so yes Vegeta is a way more interesting character than Goku it’s not even close.
Pride and arrogance will never fail you add resilience to that and nun of life’s problems will hold you down the only downsides to it is you won’t develop very many connections with people but if you want to be successful in life you have to focus on you only u and what you want and try everything possible to get what you want even if that means losing. Yourself you still got what you wanted
6:52 this is only applicable to Vegeta very early on in the series. The Pride Vegeta has in his heritage is in and of itself an acknowledgment that he can only do much of what he does because of the gifts he’s been given. As a character Vegeta has almost always put in the effort required to fully realize his potential, and even became upset when he learns that Gohan is wasting his gifts by refusing to train himself. I believe Vegeta is a bad example of pride going too far. Especially in his most modern depictions.
I like this. I hope you do more anime centered videos! I saw you’re huge into Star Wars. It’s not my cup of tea, but I subscribed anyway! This was a cool video! Thank you for posting it.
We are delighted to hear that! Star Wars is our primary pillar, but I plan to do more Dragon Ball, Z and maybe Fullmetal alchemist. I’m not a deep cuts, anime guy, but i know most of the more Americanized stuff
To dive into characters throught bible and philosophy is such a good way to make people more self aware since people often have a connection with a character of a certain fictional peace, well done, i think i will stick to your content
Hello Steven, great video! Just wanted to include that in DBZ, Vegeta breaks down, cries, and screams that he doesn’t care anymore about becoming a super sayian before the android saga (filler), but still displays him letting his pride ago initially before android 18 made him do it again. Subbed!
Im not entirely sure. I think there are cases where you are 100% sure a thing was earned and then years later you’re like oh..that just fell into my lap because x or y other person. Even taking the little time to meditate on your question might be good enough. Most people dont think about it at all.
The way I see it is if you alone were able to earn something then u earned it but if u recieved help in any way then it's not solely your accomplishment
I was thinking this exact same thing. A lot of later vegetas pride comes from the hard work he’s pushed himself to get to. He k owes what’s he’s done to get to that point.
@@Omnipulsar what about physical training, like bodybuilding? You are the one putting in the work, no doubt on that, but you were most likely taught the basics by someone, or you watched videos or even read information about it. Could you have reached these results without the work of those who came before? This reasoning works for everything, be it sports, art or science.
@@nastyjumpskills Oh we definitely touched on it. Said specifically it that it pushes him forward many times, then like with all of us, he hits a wall.
I find pride to be very important to sustaining a strong sense of being and self, trtue pride, being in ones physical,mental and emotional strength that is.
In the Granolah arc they explained what true saiyan pride is Its sticking with your convictions, and staying true to your nature; for saiyans their nature is to keep on fighting as they're a warrior race not born good nor evil, its just in their blood to fight and it depends on what they do with that nature
@@GeekyStoics Those people are lazy because they don't want to make difficult choices in life, they are complacent. Thinking "not being lazy" is a god given given trait is a negative mindset created by those who don't wanna put the effort in.
@@alatusedits either I'm not communicating clearly or you're missing what I'm saying. Discipline was not a word I used. I'm talking about drive. There are just some people who have the taste of blood in their mouth without any push. They are motivated go-getters. Discipline is a practice. So we are in agreement on this/ Vegeta does not have to discipline himself into training. He wants to be great and seen. Period.
@@GeekyStoics I edited it. I meant "not being lazy" isn't a god given trait. it's upto you. And drive can also be argued similarly. Because drive comes from ambition. If you genuinely want something you will have the internal desire to achieve it whatever it takes
I’ll add an edit to your final sentence. Get rid of UNEARNED pride because that’s arrogance. Pride can be incredibly useful and good, but only when it stems from genuine earned efforts. An honest pride, a humble pride, tempered by incredible work ethic and effort. I say this because not having any pride can truly be a dangerous thing for one’s psyche. I often think about Kendrick Lamar’s “U” back in his to pimp a butterfly album, where he raps about basically hating himself for being so successful while his community struggles so much. A deep seated hatred that almost feels like survivors guilt. Meanwhile in his new album GNX the song “man at the garden” an older and wiser Kendrick Lamar proudly says he deserves it all, but because he worked for it while keeping his integrity & dignity in the process.
rock n rolllll! Thank you. It all starts at geekystoics.com as a free email newsletter, and that's also where we'll be unveiling a book on these topics. come join us!
Honestly Vegeta is such a cool character in design and development. I've just been trying DBZ, and Vegeta peaks my interest so much more than any other character even though I highly respect the type of characterization Goku has. How Vegeta develops through his struggles to slowly become better as a man and a Saiyan is a cool thing. Plus he just looks cool and his theme is the bomb.
Vegeta was very helpful in the namek saga even though it was for his selfish reasons he kept Gohan and Krillin alive long enough for piccolo to come and they all kept Freiza distracted until Goku finally came to help. Now in the cell saga and start of buu saga total liability until he agreed to fuse with Goku. He mentally grew up in that moment the fact that he was willing to allow Whis to train him says everything
I like this video essay. I honestly feel like Vegeta as far as my life passions are concerned. Like him, I worry about where others are at in life. I suppose I should give myself more credit and look at what I have already.
First time finding this channel and color me impressed because you got an immediate sub! This was really inspiring I appreciate you taking time to combine three of my favorite things, God, anime, and stoicism.
Every time Vegeta has gotten a huge power boost is when he's had to humble himself or be humbled. The Zenkai boost from being beaten by Goku. The Zenkai boost from letting Krillin almost kill him. When he turned Super Saiyan on that dying planet because he didn't care about being better than Goku, or even if he lived. Even when he became Majin Vegeta, he had to let Babidi get control over him.
Ive also learned, from experience, if you don't Pply humility, you will self-destruct. You must be able to accept your shortcomings and failures and accept that you may never achieve what you see another one achieve regardless of your efforts, accepting yourself knowing this is a MAJOR hurdle.
What a lot of y'all mistake pride for is actually other traits mixing in at once, a buncha stuff that has nothing to do with pride. Vegeta was a soloer and had no one to thank. It was unhealthy from the very beginning considering all the company he had was weaker ppl around him who are more concerned about them not getting offed by Vegeta because he's stronger than them There's no dynamic of family to contain Vegeta something Goku had, and something y'all immensely forget. Goku would've turned out just like Vegeta had it not been for plot armour. Hitting your head as a kid doesn't suddenly make your entire biology reject your nature as a Saiyan. Saiyans are rebellious in nature. Not only that but Goku was never raised in his natural habitat. So he grew like a human. Ppl say Goku is this positive force but his life was so specific and out of his control that it dampens the can of mess story they wanna tell. Goku isn't these things moreso he was forced to live them. So crediting Goku for it is disingenuous. Had to overwrite a bros whole design just to fit him in that "friends nake ne strong ☝️" archetype Vegetas social dynamic unlike Goku didn't involve him getting stronger to match his peers and foes, something Goku would've been doing too had it not been for his situation. Vegeta didn't need any earthly mentor not when his own instruction gets him by. Why should he value those metrics of positivity if they aren't relevant to him or his race Vegeta never needed those earthlings to teach him how to blast a wave or how to fly or use his ki. Goku needed someone to teach him those things not Vegeta, and downplaying Vegetas skill by calling his obvious talents gifts to make it seems as if he needs to thank weaker ppl than him for them is asinine Vegeta had no one to motivate him, he had no cheesy band of lesser mortals to help him along the way. Vegeta is unable to form bonds with those lesser ppl because theres nothing of value they could provide to him. He is a warrior of higher existence whose seen and done much greater things than what they could do for him. It's no surprise he cares less for food and all the earthly things Goku does because he aint no earthling noob was he raised on them. Now just like Piccolo your pride and solitude is your new best friend. Because of this Vegeta went on to underestimating everything around him as he's stronger than everyone besides Frieza force and King Vegeta Finally gets motivation and a new glance of life after fighting someone who could challenge him and without surprise he starts to pull that same, "power thru the ppl I've faced" thinking after realizing he himself is not the only strongest and that he could get stronger 😂 This alone destroys the majority of your argument because in this moment Vegeta got the one thing he never had which was competition and a group he could fit in healthily, a gift Goku has had for eons, since we wanna talk gifts so much Why should he give credit to anybody but himself. Just as gifts are auto given, so is the texture of your soul, and Vegeta had a self guiding soul. You clearly saw him train even young. Bro was so accomplished even Frieza allowed him a chance to join the force. In fact it's even more hilarious that I'm seeing a video about pride using Vegeta as the base in my feed, when he's the most unfortunate, fortunate character of all of Dragon Ball. Your whole pride synopsis is based on pieces issues made into one, while also confusing the actual problem and underestimating the power of pride
@@GeekyStoics ive seen pride blinding people so much that it evovles through the narssisistic society which makes it impossible for someone to wake up...
As a bi person. I always found it wierd that we call gay events. "Pride." I am not proud that I am bi. I just so happen to be born this way. I did nothing to obtain it. Being bi is not who I am. It is a small piece of what I am.
Before Watching Video: I hate pride with EVERY fiber of my being all because of the flaws including but not limited to "feeling shame" when belittled by someone who hates what you're proud of. I hate pride especially when it challenges you from making progress. Too many reasons why I hate pride in every definition of the word. Bear a double-edged sword, be ready to have it turned against you. I learned that the hard way. After Watching: 0:47 - 1:01 HOLD UP, IS THAT HOW YOU SEE PRIDE? THAT DO BE ME (self-reliance aside)😭📝 Being broken down into walls is what I have been through before and after throwing down pride. Pretty much everything you brought up is something I am totally familiar with.
you are right Steven,until i met my fiance i was like like vegeta ... he vas a role model to me...but later whn i met her my pride was nothing .. im now fighting for her and my friends.. annd love is it what pushes me forwards ..
Just a note on Gokou... Irionically it's Vegeta that realizes Gokou isn't actually driven by righteous anger, but endless challenge. Gokou could go from 'fighting' a drunkard to a god and be thankful and humble for the opportunity. This is what Vegeta realizes is the real difference between him and Gokou. Gokou doesn't fight for honor, greed, pride, protection, prestige or anything other than for the joy of the fight itself. Which is why he never really fights to kill, he'd rather spare his strong foes for the chance to maybe fight them again one day. Nor is he afraid of losing his life fighting a potentially stronger foe, he'd just be thankful for having had the opportunity. Vegeta says he tried fighting to protect his family to see if it would close the gap between Gokou and himself, but it didn't. Neither did going back to being ruthless as Majin Vegeta. The one thing Vegeta never did (up until that point, anyway) was fight for the sheer love and respect of it. Very similar to Ryu from Street Fighter in that way.
Vegeta's character growth in Dragon Ball Super is one of my favorites. He starts to replace that personal pride with a deep protective instinct of this family.
I liked your philosophical take on pride and how it’s important to not let it define who you are and to practice humility. However, I partially disagree on your take on how pride is affecting society. There are definitely those who hide behind it was a privilege and skew the message but I believe empowerment (ex: sexual minorities as you depicted in the video) holds to a different kind of pride because historical prejudice and societal acceptance. This is something a character like Vegeta may have benefited from in his early stages of life as a part of Frieza’s empire and coping with racism and the genocide of his people. In juxtaposition, Goku was able to live with acceptance despite his differences because he grew up with the love of his family and friends as you stated at the end of the essay. Vegeta, of course learned to overcome his pride in the end with his internal conflict as a person juggling with a corrupted upbringing. IRL pride at its core, for example is not the same. I’m not saying it’s bad criticize these kinds of movements for its flaws, but the basis is still righteous in their own right. Not trying to start a culture war here. Just critical discourse on this topic.
@@Warfan-sg7pu this is a great comment and very wise. I think societal notions of “Pride” have eclipsed their usefulness to make up for discrimination and needless shame. Thats what we are in now, the pendulum swinging back on shame. It is definitely turning toxic. I wonder what the proper medium is? - stephen
I disagree with you. Empowerment and pride are conditional. Vegeta's upbringing and circumstances growing up led him to live a lie (being the most powerful of his race). Goku lived in truth. Here truth is the key as to whether pride and empowerment are realistic or not. Pride as stated must come from inner truth; service, duty, self-awareness, etc. otherwise it becomes anti-God, resentful and misery. Essentially it becomes the source of a slave morality. This is why objective truth is valued and relativism leads essentially to live in lies.
"Pride is a sin because a man reckons that he is more than he really is, thus, he wishes to be put ahead of others and cannot suffer one to be higher than him or equal to him." ST. ROBERT BELLARMINE
I feel like i was born to serve. i dont want a life like that, so i won't use the gift. Staying true to yourself means nothing to me. Authenticity is meaningless to me.
More often than not, people tend to argue that "pride" has a light side to it in the form of being "proud" of someone or something. But no, the two are polar opposite of each other. Being proud of someone or something is rooted in gratitude and humility, especially towards God's role in your life. Pride on the other hand, is over the top self exaltation by constantly making comparison with complete disregard to others including God, and pride leads to anger when that self exaltation is not satisfied.
Listen, you wanna brag about your pride, then be stronger than anybody else so that yo ass can brag about it, otherwise listen and learn from the vidio
I am a rajput Raj - King Put - Son So I kinda relate to vegeta but I think the ones who are born in upper families should have more pride than others it's like what separates them from the other .Pride either makes a man or brakes him but dying with pride will always be superior than living with fear
First time finding your channel and its so cool to see someone using our fictional media and even real life events to give meaningful biblical/christian based sermons/messages, and it made me thoroughly enjoy this video. :) I'll be subscribing now for sure. I saw them say in the comments that you loat a fanily member. Im sorry, i onow how painful it is to lose loved ones. I'll be praying for you and your family. I tend to try to find God in all media i consume. I tend to find a lot of things i can relate to it all from time to time. I'd suggest giving Kingdom Hearts series a look one day, even if just the cutscenes from the game. You may find a lot you can pull from there for the future. (Disney may be all on it, but its made by square enix in japan, Disney just gives apporvals for stuff mainly.) God bless you, and have a great sir.
Welcome to the family, and thank you for your prayer. It's been a hard time. Try out our newsletter community at geekystoics.com -- best way to get in touch and know what's coming
His pride was also unfounded. He only got strong enough to face Frieza from all the zenkais he got. Which is times he lost but someone else saved him, giving him time to recover. On Earth, Krillin was going to kill him, but Goku asked him to spare Vegeta. Thats the first zenkai he lost. Then he lost to Zarbon, who would have killed him, but Frieza commanded him to spare Vegeta, so they could question him about his Dragon Ball. Then he would've been killed by Racoome, but Goku saved him. That zenkai gave him the strength to fight Frieza in his first form. Then he got another boost from lowering his power where Krillin blasted him. Up until the android saga, none of the strength he was so proud of was even his own, it was from fighting, losing, and being saved by others.
Haven't once thought about this till recently due to the disparity I see between me and others. It's clear as day; Tallent, high i q, physical appearance, tolerance to illness, and the list goes on, is not of our own doing. We simply are given tools, and some are from the dollar store, while others are industrial grade. If someone pulls girls easier than you; he's 6'2" full hair, attractive face, and you're 5'7" balding, and meh face, why are you proud of that? Being proud of stuff you DIDN'T HAVE ANY SAY IN THE MATTER IS A JOKE.
"muh pride" Vegeta didnt emerge until artificial humans arc /android , before he was happy both Goku and Frieza were dead and being the best by mutual elimination of the two. We also see how cunning and tactical Vegeta is on Namek and wont refuse to work with others by reaching his main goal. Its like Toriyama wrote a different Vegeta from android saga to buu saga , only to make him better after getting his ass kicked by buu , their plan backfired and had to rely on the Genkidama which is outside their own strenght, this was a correction on their ignorance of destroying the earrings , they were both stupid because Buu's power wasnt that big but ignored his abilities and hax to put him down for good.
I grew up playing video games. All kinds of games like fighting games, FPS games, Adventure games etc I play a ton of stuff. But I wanna focus on that FPS and Fighting game bit. Maybe it’s because I grew up on it, but it seems like there’s this “need” to prove yourself “better” then others in PvP games. The need to win as that is the entire point. But honestly as I’ve grown up, I’ve become tired of this constant need to “win”. I spend a lot of time practicing to learn everything I can and obviously as with all things, you still lose sometimes. And this hurts. All that time practicing and learning for what? Just to lose? And it’s this exact mentality that’s killing me dude. I’m tired of always competing to win. You get this over inflated ego that gets hurt when you know “you can win” but don’t. What pains me the most is that in games such as these (PvP games) there’s no gain except more ego inflammation. There’s no plus side to meaningless fighting. What do I gain, some stupid little title next to my name? A bit of hatemail from my opponents? An ego boost to further reinforce the useless belief that “I’m better”? There is no gain…atleast I haven’t found any outside of personal ego stroking. Which is useless. In real life for me personally I would only ever use fighting and shooting guns for self defense. So I don’t understand why I take it so seriously in game. Regardless, I’ve come to know that Pride honestly will only lead to me chasing fake, meaningless titles with no value. Who gives af about rank? Who gives a damn about my wins? Who do I have to show this to? No one. So honestly…I’m over the competition rn. The pride from winning isn’t worth it. I don’t the think it ever was. For a while now I’ve been thinking hard about “should I even?” And honestly no, I shouldn’t. I still play those games especially fighting games because I enjoy the process of getting better. No more meaningless pride, no more fake titles. Practice because you like to. Play because you like to. Not from a self imposed “need” for victory.
4:05 No, we SHOULD, because all of THOSE traits are a HUGE part of what we are. YOU forgoing all of that for yourself and convincing others to do so will only end with everyone going on a dead-end path to nothingness with no knowledge of the rich history that made them exist in the first place. You NEED to cherish your ROOTS, or else you'll be a NOWHERE MAN
Yeah but Vegeta is naturally bold so being humble is tough because it goes against his natural state..... he's never going to be as humble as people want, Frankly I like his arrogance sometimes 😅
"Pride is not the opposite of shame but its source. True humility is the only antidote to shame" - Iroh
oooo im so glad you mentioned this
🗣🔥🔥🔥
@@GeekyStoics my condolences to you and your family over your old mans passing.
@@EclipseHedgehog thank you for that
You forgot to say uncle! He’s all of our uncle’s not just zuko’s
I appreciate the emphasis on Goku's Righteous Anger, as opposed to Vegeta's. Goku's anger usually stems from witnessing the suffering of others, and since death isn't as much of a consequence in their universe, it makes even more sense that their suffering is pointless. When Majin Vegeta blasts the tournament crowds, Goku isn't just furious at their pain or fear of the end, it's also the fact that Vegeta is throwing an adult-sized tantrum and they're paying for it.
YES YES YES thank you for catching that
@GeekyStoics The honor is all mine. I'm glad there's likeminded people who look deeper into dragonball beyond the spectacle.
The Gospel summed up
1. We have all sinned and fallen short of God's glory
- 1 sin disqualifies us from heaven
- 1 sin separates us from God
- 1 sin is enough to send us to Helll
2. God came down to earth in human form (Jesus)
- to live the perfect life for us (have a perfect record)
- suffer for us leading up to the cross, on the cross, and die for us
- He did this, to take the FULL punishment for ours sins
3. This means, if we believe and follow Jesus, repent of (turn away from ours sins), ask God for forgiveness, for what we have done (recieving His forgiveness) and in return forgive others of their sins (as God forgives us of our sins)
- Jesus will give us His record (which is perfect and clean) instead of us having our own record (which would be full of sins)
- meaning we can enter into heaven, for all eternity, instead of going to hell for all eternity
Share this message with as many people as possible, so they may have a chance at salvation and have a chance at being saved
Zuko’s pride lead to the reason Aang was electrocuted by Azula and Iroh arrested in book 2 earth
Ooooo
My dad died last year and so many things in this video spoke to me. We're Norwegian, growing up my dad would always hype up being a viking. I love vikings but eventually I realized I was like Vegeta, stuck in my own realm, how can people not think as highly of Vikings as I do? Etc. Similar to saiyan pride. I love and miss my dad so much. And I appreciate everything he taught me. Including the pride in my race.
cheers to you both
Pride cometh before destruction. And near everytime Vegeta got too prideful before a battle he got royally demolished. Except for his Recoome brawl. He knew he was outclassed back then.
Amen ,
Lord that was brutal
And it was one of the best fights in that saga as well. Vegeta got his butt whopped while also giving a good pummeling himself, he was sneaky, cunning, he knew he was facing a daunting task with 2 factions so he had to put pride on the side for a bit which is why namek saga veggie is my personal favorite beside late buu saga. Android saga being my absolute least, he was just so annoyingly arrogant.
@@EclipseHedgehogVegeta was like: "Hmm, I know you're playing me but it's working, proceed"
@@EclipseHedgehog
he was much enthusiast for becoming super sayan😁
"virtue is comprised of two components: reflection and conduct" - Seneca
I'm really sorry to hear about your dad man, I pray that you and your family can find some peace. God bless.
@@TheThirdKng thank you for that
My man really delivered on his promise. Great video, just what I needed right now
Lets goooo
Love what this channel is about. God bless you brother
@@alphalamda545 welcome to the family!! Consider the newsletter so you join our little community
Vegeta is one of the most prideful characters in DBZ. The guy who refuses to be second best, and trained just to surpass Goku in strength. But pride alone cost him so much in his life. Until the end of Buu Arc where he finally rids his pride, and excepts his new home.
@Mankey619 and then super happened. Honesty I'd leave that over taking it.
@@EclipseHedgehog his current pride is a lot different than the Z Vegeta.
Most of his battles he could’ve won if he had put his ego in check.
I think Vegeta peaked at “That’s my Bulma!” The reason I said that is in that Particular Movie/Super episodes he was making a fool of himself to keep people safe from Beerus Something you’d never see Vegeta prior and that led up to him standing up to Beerus even though he knew how strong he was….before Bulma Got hit vegeta literally just admitted defeat but the moment he saw that he was willing to risk it all….but Vegeta’s character is ever developing because even though I called that the Peak he still grew a lot , by further more stomping on his Pride when he asked Whis for Training, Vegeta never before trained with anyone nor did he ever had a teacher or wanted one so that was a Huge development on his part and later down in the Goku black Arc he was never really bothered if Goku got stronger than him or not he really seemed content for the most part….so yes Vegeta is a way more interesting character than Goku it’s not even close.
@@DaChristianYute agree >9000!!
Your channel is GOLD! Excellent content brother! 👍👍
@@lostwarrior09 hey thank you!! Welcome aboard
Pride doesn't fail you. Arrogance is and many people mix these 2 together
Pride and arrogance will never fail you add resilience to that and nun of life’s problems will hold you down the only downsides to it is you won’t develop very many connections with people but if you want to be successful in life you have to focus on you only u and what you want and try everything possible to get what you want even if that means losing. Yourself you still got what you wanted
This is one of the deepest videos I've ever watched. Thank you, I've learned so much about life in just a few minutes.
hey thanks! come join us at geekystoics.com so we can get better acquainted!
6:52 this is only applicable to Vegeta very early on in the series. The Pride Vegeta has in his heritage is in and of itself an acknowledgment that he can only do much of what he does because of the gifts he’s been given. As a character Vegeta has almost always put in the effort required to fully realize his potential, and even became upset when he learns that Gohan is wasting his gifts by refusing to train himself.
I believe Vegeta is a bad example of pride going too far. Especially in his most modern depictions.
fair enough! appreciate the comment
Real
Vegeta is a great example of pride going too far throughout all of Z.
First! I 100% agree with this video. You did an incredible job!
Hazaa!!
I like this. I hope you do more anime centered videos! I saw you’re huge into Star Wars. It’s not my cup of tea, but I subscribed anyway! This was a cool video! Thank you for posting it.
We are delighted to hear that! Star Wars is our primary pillar, but I plan to do more Dragon Ball, Z and maybe Fullmetal alchemist. I’m not a deep cuts, anime guy, but i know most of the more Americanized stuff
To dive into characters throught bible and philosophy is such a good way to make people more self aware since people often have a connection with a character of a certain fictional peace, well done, i think i will stick to your content
@@Guesstaker welcome to the fam!
Hello Steven, great video! Just wanted to include that in DBZ, Vegeta breaks down, cries, and screams that he doesn’t care anymore about becoming a super sayian before the android saga (filler), but still displays him letting his pride ago initially before android 18 made him do it again. Subbed!
love Vegeta's peaks and valleys! thanks Professor
I actually love Gokus philosophy on life, it’s so simple, but it breeds so much complexity
This was awesome, I’m subscribing.
God bless you.
hey thank you! welcome
While I do agree with most of the video, I have one question: how do we discern what was gifted to us from what we earned ourselves?
Im not entirely sure. I think there are cases where you are 100% sure a thing was earned and then years later you’re like oh..that just fell into my lap because x or y other person. Even taking the little time to meditate on your question might be good enough. Most people dont think about it at all.
The way I see it is if you alone were able to earn something then u earned it but if u recieved help in any way then it's not solely your accomplishment
I was thinking this exact same thing. A lot of later vegetas pride comes from the hard work he’s pushed himself to get to. He k owes what’s he’s done to get to that point.
@@Omnipulsar what about physical training, like bodybuilding? You are the one putting in the work, no doubt on that, but you were most likely taught the basics by someone, or you watched videos or even read information about it.
Could you have reached these results without the work of those who came before?
This reasoning works for everything, be it sports, art or science.
Biology
Given that he's always just a step behind Goku, it's not entirely useless.
A step behind means lost battles and misery in their world 🤷♂️
@@nastyjumpskills Oh we definitely touched on it. Said specifically it that it pushes him forward many times, then like with all of us, he hits a wall.
He is second best sayian warrior ever, so not really. Pride is good for Vegeta. @@GeekyStoics
@@nastyjumpskills His pride makes him seeing only being second to goku makes him nothing.
Really well made video bro!
Thanks!
I'm glad youtube recomended this great video please dont stop
We wont! Come join us at geekystoics.com ?
Hmmm maybe avoid pride of gifts but cultivate pride of action
Food for thought
I hadn't thought about "God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble" in light of Vegeta and Goku until now. Thanks!
I find pride to be very important to sustaining a strong sense of being and self, trtue pride, being in ones physical,mental and emotional strength that is.
In the Granolah arc they explained what true saiyan pride is
Its sticking with your convictions, and staying true to your nature; for saiyans their nature is to keep on fighting as they're a warrior race not born good nor evil, its just in their blood to fight and it depends on what they do with that nature
4:40 You're wrong about the fact that being determined, and not being lazy is a gift. Vegeta earned these traits due to his hard life choices.
I disagree. Some people are lazy and unmotivated and others just are. You don't earn that trait. You manage its upkeep, but you start with it.
@@GeekyStoics Those people are lazy because they don't want to make difficult choices in life, they are complacent. Thinking "not being lazy" is a god given given trait is a negative mindset created by those who don't wanna put the effort in.
@@alatusedits either I'm not communicating clearly or you're missing what I'm saying. Discipline was not a word I used. I'm talking about drive. There are just some people who have the taste of blood in their mouth without any push. They are motivated go-getters. Discipline is a practice. So we are in agreement on this/ Vegeta does not have to discipline himself into training. He wants to be great and seen. Period.
@@GeekyStoics I edited it. I meant "not being lazy" isn't a god given trait. it's upto you.
And drive can also be argued similarly. Because drive comes from ambition. If you genuinely want something you will have the internal desire to achieve it whatever it takes
@@alatusedits Most people are lazy erven at desires they have
I’ll add an edit to your final sentence. Get rid of UNEARNED pride because that’s arrogance. Pride can be incredibly useful and good, but only when it stems from genuine earned efforts. An honest pride, a humble pride, tempered by incredible work ethic and effort. I say this because not having any pride can truly be a dangerous thing for one’s psyche.
I often think about Kendrick Lamar’s “U” back in his to pimp a butterfly album, where he raps about basically hating himself for being so successful while his community struggles so much. A deep seated hatred that almost feels like survivors guilt. Meanwhile in his new album GNX the song “man at the garden” an older and wiser Kendrick Lamar proudly says he deserves it all, but because he worked for it while keeping his integrity & dignity in the process.
Well said!
Never thought I would see Dragon Ball and C.S. Lewis in the same video. I dig it. Sharing this with all my friends.😀
rock n rolllll! Thank you. It all starts at geekystoics.com as a free email newsletter, and that's also where we'll be unveiling a book on these topics. come join us!
This video is amazing. Wow. Glad to have stumbled on this channel, w RUclips algorithm
welcome to the family!
This is an absolute masterpiece ❤️
mission accomplished!
Honestly Vegeta is such a cool character in design and development. I've just been trying DBZ, and Vegeta peaks my interest so much more than any other character even though I highly respect the type of characterization Goku has. How Vegeta develops through his struggles to slowly become better as a man and a Saiyan is a cool thing. Plus he just looks cool and his theme is the bomb.
Vegeta was very helpful in the namek saga even though it was for his selfish reasons he kept Gohan and Krillin alive long enough for piccolo to come and they all kept Freiza distracted until Goku finally came to help. Now in the cell saga and start of buu saga total liability until he agreed to fuse with Goku. He mentally grew up in that moment the fact that he was willing to allow Whis to train him says everything
Vegeta is my all time favourite fictional character, followed by Guts.
Yes, Son Goku is my avatar, but I just love the goofy face 😂
I like this video essay. I honestly feel like Vegeta as far as my life passions are concerned. Like him, I worry about where others are at in life. I suppose I should give myself more credit and look at what I have already.
First time finding this channel and color me impressed because you got an immediate sub! This was really inspiring I appreciate you taking time to combine three of my favorite things, God, anime, and stoicism.
@@theone4532 so glad you found us!! Big stuff on the way. Be sure to join the email at geekystoics.com so you’re in the loop
Every time Vegeta has gotten a huge power boost is when he's had to humble himself or be humbled.
The Zenkai boost from being beaten by Goku.
The Zenkai boost from letting Krillin almost kill him.
When he turned Super Saiyan on that dying planet because he didn't care about being better than Goku, or even if he lived.
Even when he became Majin Vegeta, he had to let Babidi get control over him.
Ive also learned, from experience, if you don't Pply humility, you will self-destruct. You must be able to accept your shortcomings and failures and accept that you may never achieve what you see another one achieve regardless of your efforts, accepting yourself knowing this is a MAJOR hurdle.
What a lot of y'all mistake pride for is actually other traits mixing in at once, a buncha stuff that has nothing to do with pride. Vegeta was a soloer and had no one to thank. It was unhealthy from the very beginning considering all the company he had was weaker ppl around him who are more concerned about them not getting offed by Vegeta because he's stronger than them
There's no dynamic of family to contain Vegeta something Goku had, and something y'all immensely forget. Goku would've turned out just like Vegeta had it not been for plot armour. Hitting your head as a kid doesn't suddenly make your entire biology reject your nature as a Saiyan. Saiyans are rebellious in nature. Not only that but Goku was never raised in his natural habitat. So he grew like a human. Ppl say Goku is this positive force but his life was so specific and out of his control that it dampens the can of mess story they wanna tell. Goku isn't these things moreso he was forced to live them. So crediting Goku for it is disingenuous. Had to overwrite a bros whole design just to fit him in that "friends nake ne strong ☝️" archetype
Vegetas social dynamic unlike Goku didn't involve him getting stronger to match his peers and foes, something Goku would've been doing too had it not been for his situation. Vegeta didn't need any earthly mentor not when his own instruction gets him by. Why should he value those metrics of positivity if they aren't relevant to him or his race
Vegeta never needed those earthlings to teach him how to blast a wave or how to fly or use his ki. Goku needed someone to teach him those things not Vegeta, and downplaying Vegetas skill by calling his obvious talents gifts to make it seems as if he needs to thank weaker ppl than him for them is asinine
Vegeta had no one to motivate him, he had no cheesy band of lesser mortals to help him along the way. Vegeta is unable to form bonds with those lesser ppl because theres nothing of value they could provide to him. He is a warrior of higher existence whose seen and done much greater things than what they could do for him. It's no surprise he cares less for food and all the earthly things Goku does because he aint no earthling noob was he raised on them. Now just like Piccolo your pride and solitude is your new best friend. Because of this Vegeta went on to underestimating everything around him as he's stronger than everyone besides Frieza force and King Vegeta
Finally gets motivation and a new glance of life after fighting someone who could challenge him and without surprise he starts to pull that same, "power thru the ppl I've faced" thinking after realizing he himself is not the only strongest and that he could get stronger
😂 This alone destroys the majority of your argument because in this moment Vegeta got the one thing he never had which was competition and a group he could fit in healthily, a gift Goku has had for eons, since we wanna talk gifts so much
Why should he give credit to anybody but himself. Just as gifts are auto given, so is the texture of your soul, and Vegeta had a self guiding soul. You clearly saw him train even young. Bro was so accomplished even Frieza allowed him a chance to join the force. In fact it's even more hilarious that I'm seeing a video about pride using Vegeta as the base in my feed, when he's the most unfortunate, fortunate character of all of Dragon Ball. Your whole pride synopsis is based on pieces issues made into one, while also confusing the actual problem and underestimating the power of pride
Amen. I am a really big dbz fan
great work !!
Thanks a lot!
@@GeekyStoics ive seen pride blinding people so much that it evovles through the narssisistic society which makes it impossible for someone to wake up...
I kinda agree. Vegeta becomes more complex character. He didn't get rid of his pride. His pride evolved.
exactly! it became based on something more real
As a bi person. I always found it wierd that we call gay events. "Pride." I am not proud that I am bi. I just so happen to be born this way. I did nothing to obtain it. Being bi is not who I am. It is a small piece of what I am.
I picked up how the force can fix the world and it was great I loved it
@@zbk1129 what a delight to hear!! There is a second book being developed so be sure to join geekystoics.com (free email) so you’ll hear about it
Before Watching Video: I hate pride with EVERY fiber of my being all because of the flaws including but not limited to "feeling shame" when belittled by someone who hates what you're proud of. I hate pride especially when it challenges you from making progress. Too many reasons why I hate pride in every definition of the word. Bear a double-edged sword, be ready to have it turned against you. I learned that the hard way.
After Watching: 0:47 - 1:01 HOLD UP, IS THAT HOW YOU SEE PRIDE? THAT DO BE ME (self-reliance aside)😭📝
Being broken down into walls is what I have been through before and after throwing down pride.
Pretty much everything you brought up is something I am totally familiar with.
Wow, really glad that something here was able to connect with you in that way
@GeekyStoics I have seen your video on rage as well. And will watch more of your videos. Keep up the good work.
you are right Steven,until i met my fiance i was like like vegeta ... he vas a role model to me...but later whn i met her my pride was nothing .. im now fighting for her and my friends.. annd love is it what pushes me forwards ..
@@darkmessiah2058 good!
Just a note on Gokou... Irionically it's Vegeta that realizes Gokou isn't actually driven by righteous anger, but endless challenge. Gokou could go from 'fighting' a drunkard to a god and be thankful and humble for the opportunity. This is what Vegeta realizes is the real difference between him and Gokou. Gokou doesn't fight for honor, greed, pride, protection, prestige or anything other than for the joy of the fight itself. Which is why he never really fights to kill, he'd rather spare his strong foes for the chance to maybe fight them again one day. Nor is he afraid of losing his life fighting a potentially stronger foe, he'd just be thankful for having had the opportunity. Vegeta says he tried fighting to protect his family to see if it would close the gap between Gokou and himself, but it didn't. Neither did going back to being ruthless as Majin Vegeta. The one thing Vegeta never did (up until that point, anyway) was fight for the sheer love and respect of it. Very similar to Ryu from Street Fighter in that way.
I’m glad I found this channel. Would love to see crossover between yourself and @sage’s rain
@@ZUUL117 we’re glad you found us. Crossover could be fun!
6:05 That IS lineage too, REE
“This is a first, pride in someone else.” -TFS Vegeta
@@lsixty30 unfortunately it’s overshadowed BY ALL THIS UNYIELDING RAGE!! 😂
pride is not a virtue. Pride is the mother of all sin.
Indeed
Vegeta's character growth in Dragon Ball Super is one of my favorites. He starts to replace that personal pride with a deep protective instinct of this family.
He hasn't 'replaced' that awesome pride of his, it's still there dude 🙄One trait doesn't negate the other, this isn't a zero sum game
I liked your philosophical take on pride and how it’s important to not let it define who you are and to practice humility. However, I partially disagree on your take on how pride is affecting society. There are definitely those who hide behind it was a privilege and skew the message but I believe empowerment (ex: sexual minorities as you depicted in the video) holds to a different kind of pride because historical prejudice and societal acceptance. This is something a character like Vegeta may have benefited from in his early stages of life as a part of Frieza’s empire and coping with racism and the genocide of his people. In juxtaposition, Goku was able to live with acceptance despite his differences because he grew up with the love of his family and friends as you stated at the end of the essay. Vegeta, of course learned to overcome his pride in the end with his internal conflict as a person juggling with a corrupted upbringing. IRL pride at its core, for example is not the same. I’m not saying it’s bad criticize these kinds of movements for its flaws, but the basis is still righteous in their own right. Not trying to start a culture war here. Just critical discourse on this topic.
@@Warfan-sg7pu this is a great comment and very wise. I think societal notions of “Pride” have eclipsed their usefulness to make up for discrimination and needless shame. Thats what we are in now, the pendulum swinging back on shame. It is definitely turning toxic. I wonder what the proper medium is? - stephen
And we do 100 percent appreciate the critical discourse and good faith comment.
I disagree with you. Empowerment and pride are conditional. Vegeta's upbringing and circumstances growing up led him to live a lie (being the most powerful of his race). Goku lived in truth. Here truth is the key as to whether pride and empowerment are realistic or not. Pride as stated must come from inner truth; service, duty, self-awareness, etc. otherwise it becomes anti-God, resentful and misery. Essentially it becomes the source of a slave morality. This is why objective truth is valued and relativism leads essentially to live in lies.
I didn't expect this to be Biblically based it being a random youtube recommendation and all, very impressed!
glad you enjoyed it!
Vegeta is the living embodiment of “WE WUZ KANGZ AN SHIT” 😅😅😅
No 🙄Your point fails just as much as the uploader's point
In real life Vegeta will whoop Goku's ass and in real life you can apply Vegeta's philosophy over Goku's 💯💪🏾
6:40 Says you, REE
"Pride is a sin because a man reckons that he is more than he really is, thus, he wishes to be put ahead of others and cannot suffer one to be higher than him or equal to him." ST. ROBERT BELLARMINE
There’s a line between self confidence and self belief and arrogance and self delusion
I think vampire hunter d bloodlust would be a fantastic video idea/analysis
BTW, great video. More need this message including me.
@@Shallowdarkpit thank you!
The title is wrong. Pride doesn't fail you it betrays you.
well put!
If Vegeta saw this video, he'd ascend past what Akira Toriyama ever intended him to be out of spite.
Boooo
Luckily for me my pride has been shattered for the past 2 years
What happened?
@ I let them win.
I fw this content
My mom was watching a NCIS marathon, I thought you were the actor who plays Dr. Palmer.
I feel like i was born to serve. i dont want a life like that, so i won't use the gift. Staying true to yourself means nothing to me. Authenticity is meaningless to me.
More often than not, people tend to argue that "pride" has a light side to it in the form of being "proud" of someone or something. But no, the two are polar opposite of each other.
Being proud of someone or something is rooted in gratitude and humility, especially towards God's role in your life. Pride on the other hand, is over the top self exaltation by constantly making comparison with complete disregard to others including God, and pride leads to anger when that self exaltation is not satisfied.
I love your video! and I love how you incorporate important Christian values into your video. God bless and glory be to Him.
thank you! come join us on the main website. Great community =)
What did you take pride in and why do you no longer take pride in it?
Listen, you wanna brag about your pride, then be stronger than anybody else so that yo ass can brag about it, otherwise listen and learn from the vidio
I just rang the bell
I guess Tien was right... Saiyan Pride Parade.
I am a rajput
Raj - King
Put - Son
So I kinda relate to vegeta but I think the ones who are born in upper families should have more pride than others it's like what separates them from the other .Pride either makes a man or brakes him but dying with pride will always be superior than living with fear
First time finding your channel and its so cool to see someone using our fictional media and even real life events to give meaningful biblical/christian based sermons/messages, and it made me thoroughly enjoy this video. :) I'll be subscribing now for sure.
I saw them say in the comments that you loat a fanily member. Im sorry, i onow how painful it is to lose loved ones. I'll be praying for you and your family.
I tend to try to find God in all media i consume. I tend to find a lot of things i can relate to it all from time to time. I'd suggest giving Kingdom Hearts series a look one day, even if just the cutscenes from the game. You may find a lot you can pull from there for the future. (Disney may be all on it, but its made by square enix in japan, Disney just gives apporvals for stuff mainly.)
God bless you, and have a great sir.
Welcome to the family, and thank you for your prayer. It's been a hard time. Try out our newsletter community at geekystoics.com -- best way to get in touch and know what's coming
Argh typos. I meant have a great day sir. Sorry.
His pride was also unfounded. He only got strong enough to face Frieza from all the zenkais he got. Which is times he lost but someone else saved him, giving him time to recover. On Earth, Krillin was going to kill him, but Goku asked him to spare Vegeta. Thats the first zenkai he lost. Then he lost to Zarbon, who would have killed him, but Frieza commanded him to spare Vegeta, so they could question him about his Dragon Ball. Then he would've been killed by Racoome, but Goku saved him. That zenkai gave him the strength to fight Frieza in his first form. Then he got another boost from lowering his power where Krillin blasted him. Up until the android saga, none of the strength he was so proud of was even his own, it was from fighting, losing, and being saved by others.
"His pride was also unfounded." Wrong
Haven't once thought about this till recently due to the disparity I see between me and others. It's clear as day; Tallent, high i q, physical appearance, tolerance to illness, and the list goes on, is not of our own doing. We simply are given tools, and some are from the dollar store, while others are industrial grade. If someone pulls girls easier than you; he's 6'2" full hair, attractive face, and you're 5'7" balding, and meh face, why are you proud of that? Being proud of stuff you DIDN'T HAVE ANY SAY IN THE MATTER IS A JOKE.
1:15 okay wait a minute, that's not exactly the kind of pride Vegeta has in him. I'm like 60% confident my boy isn't a f****t
Lol yeah we know. But both spins on pride are an obsession with self and glorification of me me me.
Pride comes before a fall
"muh pride" Vegeta didnt emerge until artificial humans arc /android , before he was happy both Goku and Frieza were dead and being the best by mutual elimination of the two.
We also see how cunning and tactical Vegeta is on Namek and wont refuse to work with others by reaching his main goal.
Its like Toriyama wrote a different Vegeta from android saga to buu saga , only to make him better after getting his ass kicked by buu , their plan backfired and had to rely on the Genkidama which is outside their own strenght, this was a correction on their ignorance of destroying the earrings , they were both stupid because Buu's power wasnt that big but ignored his abilities and hax to put him down for good.
Great video.
Thank you!
Hope you grow
Is the ability to exhibit humility and genuine self confidence from birth not a gift for Goku?
Pride will fail you because it's one of the 7 deadly sins
Too much pride is bad. But you need some it or you won’t have any dignity or self respect.
An actual conversation about stoicism? very refreshing from the regurgitated ai statues I am used to
@@GTGAMERZ so tired of those AI statues lol
@GeekyStoics at least its a decent time intro to stoicism
I grew up playing video games. All kinds of games like fighting games, FPS games, Adventure games etc I play a ton of stuff. But I wanna focus on that FPS and Fighting game bit.
Maybe it’s because I grew up on it, but it seems like there’s this “need” to prove yourself “better” then others in PvP games. The need to win as that is the entire point. But honestly as I’ve grown up, I’ve become tired of this constant need to “win”. I spend a lot of time practicing to learn everything I can and obviously as with all things, you still lose sometimes. And this hurts. All that time practicing and learning for what? Just to lose? And it’s this exact mentality that’s killing me dude. I’m tired of always competing to win. You get this over inflated ego that gets hurt when you know “you can win” but don’t. What pains me the most is that in games such as these (PvP games) there’s no gain except more ego inflammation. There’s no plus side to meaningless fighting. What do I gain, some stupid little title next to my name? A bit of hatemail from my opponents? An ego boost to further reinforce the useless belief that “I’m better”? There is no gain…atleast I haven’t found any outside of personal ego stroking. Which is useless.
In real life for me personally I would only ever use fighting and shooting guns for self defense. So I don’t understand why I take it so seriously in game. Regardless, I’ve come to know that Pride honestly will only lead to me chasing fake, meaningless titles with no value. Who gives af about rank? Who gives a damn about my wins? Who do I have to show this to? No one. So honestly…I’m over the competition rn. The pride from winning isn’t worth it. I don’t the think it ever was.
For a while now I’ve been thinking hard about “should I even?” And honestly no, I shouldn’t. I still play those games especially fighting games because I enjoy the process of getting better. No more meaningless pride, no more fake titles. Practice because you like to. Play because you like to. Not from a self imposed “need” for victory.
honestly you should get more replies you make a very good valid point
Athleticism can be earned though
A shoutout from Glenn Beck was not what I was expecting from a random nerd video.
KEEPIN IT WEIRD
4:05 No, we SHOULD, because all of THOSE traits are a HUGE part of what we are. YOU forgoing all of that for yourself and convincing others to do so will only end with everyone going on a dead-end path to nothingness with no knowledge of the rich history that made them exist in the first place. You NEED to cherish your ROOTS, or else you'll be a NOWHERE MAN
Philosophy equals cool and interesting
*pseudo-philosophy
Yeah but Vegeta is naturally bold so being humble is tough because it goes against his natural state..... he's never going to be as humble as people want, Frankly I like his arrogance sometimes 😅
Amen 🙏
Feels like Jesus told us this too
@@thecoldquest feels like that
Qadarra Allah wa masha a’fa al
childhood: watch dbz episodes
teen yrs: watch dbz clips
middle aged now: watch dbz philosophy musing 🧘♀️
its a good life
There's a reason it's called a deadly sin