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Lego Is Pressuring 3D Printing. Time to Fight Back!
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2019
- Has our beloved interlocking brick gone too far? Does LEGO realize that their recent rash of take-downs against the 3D printing community is doing their brand more damage than good?
I was wrong. it's time to fight back.
3D Printing News Report: 3dprintingindu...
Lego's own Fair Play guidelines: www.lego.com/e...
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In others IPs that I'm violating, did you know I made the Genie from Aladdin on twitch? www.3dpprofessor.com/2019/10/02/lego-take-down-fight-back-video/
That would be Awesome for a D&D game.
If you print a Lego part you have to buy Lego parts to fit and do other printers advertising legs-go
You realize RUclips is a huge violator of this takedown for no reason. Also, just upload your files to a site that will not take it down.
@@SpeedDeamon95 Films4You was Taken DOWN for posting 5 Truths about DWP Deaths to Google Plus
@@SpeedDeamon95 dailymotion video site
If Lego doesn't want people designing for their products, everyone should repost as "Megablock compatible" and give the competitor some attention.
I could do that I got so many ideas
Or "Xingbao" or "Cada" compatible. Better sets anyway...
Capitalism at work.
Shit you right
I don't like Megablocks but do support this message :)
There is a german RUclipsr called "Herr der Steine" (Lord of the bricks). He always was (and still is) a big fan of Lego and made video reviews of thier latest sets. He also runs a shop where you can buy Lego stuff (legally under licence). He received a "Cease and desist" from Lego, because he used a blue 4 by 4 Brick as Logo. Lego totally goes wild atm. The RUclipsr now decided to also review and sell build sets from china and changed his logo.
I've once liked Lego, but now I think they're pretty lame...
Little correction: It's "Held der Steine" (Hero of Bricks) ruclips.net/channel/UC_EZd3lsmxudu3IQzpTzOgw
A cool guy. But he ether won't do any law stuff - so like said he changed simply his logo. He sells not only china sets - not LEPIN! - he's also selling f. ex. "cobi". They produce and sell in europe (poland), and LEGO can't do anything aganst it (but they try :P). They don't use the red brick logo and also the figures. So all fine.
You mean "Held der Steine" ruclips.net/user/HeldderSteine
Not totaly right. "Held der Steine" registered his logo as trademark and Lego complained against this registration as it was to near to their trademark. They did not forbit to use the logo, only to use and Register it as trademark.
But the communication from Lego to HdS was a No-Go.
@@oleurgast730 I know, i just didn't go into details ;)
Lego is way over the line. A search on "lego looses" brings up many instances proven court that they can not claim IP ownership to the basic block so lego's lawyers have no excuse. They know they are in the wrong. Now they are attacking fans directly. Recycle your Lego into filament!
Not so easy, inyection molding abs is not the same as the abd used for 3D printing. It has additives that help in inyection molding but that would not work with 3D printing otherwise we would all be printing with recycled fiber glass reinforced abd from printers and monitors.
You could send all your LEGO Sets to me. I‘ll happily pay for the shipment. 😄
Lego didn't invent their blocks. They "borrowed" the idea from a British toy maker called Kiddicraft.
They lied in their animated origin story?
A long line of “infringement”...
ruclips.net/video/iFELcl75CiY/видео.html
... according to this video. I have seen this previously, but this is all that I found quickly.
So their like Disney with the whole borrow ideas from other creators then?
16:19 3DPProf says it here
As a LEGO fan, one of the unspoken rules has always been “don’t mix LEGO with unbranded or other toys.”
With the advent of 3D printing I can see where some applications of LEGO compatible bricks could be useful (Like in robotics and using Arduino integrations... etc). Yes this could “hurt” LEGO sales but... very minimally.
3D printing will never replace my bulk stock of LEGO parts. This, should not be considered a threat to their sales or image.
Conclusion:
Partial integration of home made 3D printed LEGO compatible parts with name brand LEGO parts actually empowers LEGO buyers to accomplish more (creations and real life applications) ultimately driving LEGO sales to a continued growth direction.
Apple used to charge for iPhone (iOS) updates. When the App Store began taking off they not only offered the updates for free but in-powered third party creators to make apps. They provided the platform, the playground... the same way LEGO provides the foundations. (They won’t loose that). If they inpowered MOCs and the sharing there of and the sharing of 3rd party tools they would only grow stronger.
My opinion.
insideHARDWARE best thing is that they even don't sell bricks alone anymore.
If they would sell stl's for old, no longer available to buy sets. Some Space sets from 80's for example. I would buy it for reasonable price. I think they miss an opportunity for expanding to new market.
Lego tried to sue people years ago over use of their brick design, and the courts determined that they couldn't trademark the brick design because it's too simple, so they have no legal right to take down anything as long as you don't use their name to falsely represent it as an official thing. Some designs like their minifig's are protected under trademarks, and possibly their flower design, but apart from that's they can't force you to remove your stuff
I think the 3d printing community should start an open-source alternative to the lego brick design. Come up with a unique brick-connecting standard pieces and build community around it.
lets call it the Ego bricks
Call it Laygo...mwahahaha
MakerBrick
X on top instead of O, Ego Blox compatible.
this^^ yes! this gets around *all long term road BLOCKS.*
There definitely needs to be some transparency. We're with you!
At a tech company I used to work for, we had a product that consisted of CPU/storage blocks that could be "plugged" together with cables. The internal code name for the product was Lego. Due to fear of the Danish company, it got renamed to "SN0". The internal code for the next product (unsurprisingly) was SN1, but orally, it was often referred to as Duplo.
A friendly correction: it's DMCA: Digital Millennium Copyright Act. Not DCMA. :)
Dang it. I never get that right.
Any while I can't blame a site for responding to a DMCA infringement claim, I consider it good form to make the claim visible from where the taken down content would be seen. Make the claimant face the public affected.
Vacuum cleaner was not Invented by Dyson, he invented the cyclone system found in many common vacuum cleaners. It was invented in 1901 simultaneously by both Hubert Cecil Booth and David T. Kennedy.
Awesome. Thanks. I hope the point was well made, though.
Correction, the cyclone dust filter used in his vacuums was in invented in 1885 by John M. Finch for use in a dust filter listed under patent number US325521A.
James Dyson came up with the idea to put it in a vacuum cleaner after having seen industrial cyclone filters operating at an industrial saw mill.
Dyson claims to have invented the multi cyclone filter, but there is an extensive list of patents from the 1955-1960s which describe and illustrate such a device, including ones with secondary and bagged filters.
Basically, he didn't invent anything, just took and existing design and ran with it. The fact he was Knighted is an embarrassment.
I thought Lego patent ran out now everyone can make Lego compatible bricks.
It did, currently LEGO is abusing the abomination of a 3D-trademark on the minifigure to to fight it's competition, the channel BlueBricks had a really thick catalogue of a lawyer on their table, which they will fight, chances are that LEGO will lose on this one.
Here is their video: ruclips.net/video/phhygp0XKFc/видео.html
Update: ruclips.net/video/_dWrcGSc6GM/видео.html
Here is the "Held Der Steine" (Hero of Bricks) opinion: ruclips.net/video/phhygp0XKFc/видео.html
10 more years and none of these companies will exist anymore as 3D printers get better. They can't get much cheaper as they are already rock bottom in price. I look forward to the near future when I can let my two boys loose to copy/design/modify/print whatever they want.
Chris Anderson actually cited the XFoL Maker support for Lego in his book Makers (admittedly about 10yrs ago). He cited Lego passively supporting it becuase it ultimately caused people to stay engaged in Lego longer and buying kits for a greater period......so much for that. I can totally understand copyright or patent infringement.....but people making things Lego does not, w/o branding such as Lego is going to be their downfall. Those Makers that were respecting their rights as designers will stop. If there was a company well suited to being made redundant by 3d printing, it is Lego. They must have the same executive team as Gibson.....
I agree with you.. They need to give a reason, let alone the fact that what they are doing is technically illegal. There is no infringement that I've seen. This has made me not want to support such a company, So now that I have a good base of lego block's I've built in blender that are accurate, AND they print very will in ABS, I'll just print my own for now on..
I'm glad you took the time to re-evaluate if your ethic rule applies to the current issue. "Beware of the beginnings" is probably applicable here as things like these could set an example for others to follow. Look at all the Go-Pro mounts on Thingiverse (actually be careful as some are rather unexpected). Or how about the hose clip for a certain washing machine? It could affect the whole concept of makers sharing their work for free.
On the other hand, should we not expect that the hosting provider is supporting us as their clients? They should have a process with reasons in place and it should be up to them to ensure that the reason holds up. Otherwise it's possibly the end for them if more and more companies blocking the designs that they didn't make.
I'm looking forward to your series about interlocking bricks. Even if my little printer won't be able to print anything that needs precision. Perhaps we should start Brick November and everybody uploads bricks to see who first gives up :).
What brand of printer do you have that you think can't be precise?
I think enough precision can be eeked out of your printer, as long as it isn't a Solidoodle 2.... (The horror it was)
@@williamforbes6919 or an M3d. Or the Geetech E180. Or the Longer Cube 2.
I've had a lot of bad experiences.
My grandkids love making things with building bricks, I have quite a few 3d Printers, and the action of the company mentioned in this video has made me decide to start printing such compatible bricks for my grandchildren, which I am sure my grandchildren will love, especially since I can print them in so many colours.
Now let me think, 2 x Prusa i3 printers printing say 20 hours a day and for 25 days out of a month, now I reckon that will equal quite a number of 'building blocks'. In fact I think the cost of the filament will work out much less than buying the similar 'building blocks' from the company referred to.
I should also point out that this video and the actions referred to by the company concerned has made my wife and I decide NOT TO BUY that companies products in future for our grandchildren (last Christmas alone between them they got over £200 of that companies products).
I can only guess the infringement is due to the use of the Lego brand name. They're in danger of losing that trademark just like aspirin...
Not so long ago Lego was near bankruptcy. Then they started licensing IP and releasing licensed figures -- based on movies, based on third party characters. They came out from the abyss of the business completely folding by linking their brand to third party creations -- no their own. It was a smart play, and the result is a thriving company making movies based on their and the third party IP. What they're doing now is dragging their name through the mud -- my only assumption is that they have 3D printing play in the works and will create some sort of a market place (where they get a cut) for lego compatible 3D printable models. The first part of the play is to clean up the internet of existing lego compatible models -- the problem with this play is it's doomed to failure, what incentive will creators have to contribute to whatever Lego comes out with after being told to go pound sand. I wish I could stop buying their bricks, and maybe I will. My kids enjoy playing with them, but there are other build block style toys that are available. If they want to sabotage their own good name -- let them, I guess they forgot how close to being completely gone and forgotten they were.
Next thing you know we'll have a website like Napster but for 3D prints (if it doesn't exist already). They don't even have a legal case and they're trying to do what the music industry did when they did have a case. Also, way to piss off a big chunk of your customer base. Lego is an entire sub-section of the maker community and being able to make your own or others custom bricks takes it to the next level. I thought Lego was all about creativity and making things, apparently not if they don't have a monopoly over it. Mass produced Lego will always be cheaper than 3D printed blocks, this is a kneejerk reaction from corporate management who don't understand the maker community at all.
@@Bordpie I think they have a business plan to leverage 3d printing in some fashion, and they have their lawyers go on a purge spree with no regard to the blowback. Obviously based on the response of the maker community whatever Lego plans to do with 3d printing will not be met with open arms. Imagine them going to a RUclipsr to review a new service for printing custom parts - with Lego stamp of guarantee the parts will fit their existing bricks - any RUclipsr who signs up for that gig is signing their own maker community death warrant.
Bordpie
There already is one, the pirate bay. Just go to the physibles category.....you are asking for another napster when we already have torrents dude.
@@laharl2k Yeah I guessed it already existed, I was just using napster as an analogy
So was it Lego that pulled it or Thingiverse in this case? My take is that this is sadly like you say, Thingiverse is afraid of legal action destroying them, i.e. bullying. I fully agree with your sentiments, but I feel your arguments really should differentiate public policy concepts such as "without representation" which is a government requirement, as opposed to private hosting that can make a judgement call. Just nuances, but helps us to really define what is the issue and how to iron out solutions.
This reminds me of many other legal tactics, throw a blanket legal threat all over and see what sticks. When a company sued me for debt (for instantce) that wasn't valid, they put in around 5,000 filings in our county alone, overloading the system and hoping that even 1% of those stick. You're very correct, that's not a communication, it's a threat to steal money.
IMHO having watched so many successes out there that don't require intellectual property claims, i'm often wondering if milking the IP warchests and cash cows is really beneficial in the modern day, especially seeing how vague and spitballed the whole IP world is. It's more profitable to put out vague patents for unknown inventions then have fun trying to make legal war enforcing those. Many tell me that to start a business that involves patents, you're looking at making sure you have a million extra to protect yourself. Talk about stifling creativity and innovation.
Thingiverse pulled in response to a infringement claim by Lego.
Now, you're right that a private repository has the right to do whatever they want. But Lego should not have threatened legal action over this in the first place, and it is the law's job to protect us from those who have money to burn.
@@3dpprofessor I've had a lot of interesting conversations with many lawyers, and for the most part the law is more of a system that tries to bring the perception that there are protections than actually protecting us. I won't get too political, but this is a political/government rabbit hole that shows us the symptoms of some big problems. It's like testing edge cases in software development: the places you actually can see the problems.
I should also point out your use of an interesting word that always triggers taking a second thought, if not a third fourth fifth, etc... And that is "should". Just like people should not do many things and still do.
If i have a part on my printer that isn't working, I fix it or replace it. Yet the more we add and modify a printer, often we find that we get stuck in many catch 22's. At what point is IP doing more harm overall than good, especially if it leaves sites dedicated to innovation and education quaking in fear and ultimately knowing they will lose regardless of what is right and who is supposed to protect them?
Like other social pushes, regardless of the side taking of right and wrong around it, gay marriage can be looked at similarly. It wasn't really the law that did anything good, but the law ended up following the greater consensus of what the people pushed for over time. The sentiments towards it changed as people talked about it openly and weighed out the realities given context of their own lives. Again, not saying for or against, but pointing out that until most people stop accepting IP as it stands and all the abuses thereof, (rounded corners anyone?) this is going to continue to happen, regardless of what we might erroneously believe law does vs what actually happens around legal matters. I'm impressed so far at what the maker movement of the modern day has accomplished, yet I fear what happens as the quality and ease of use grow in 3d printing and other technologies.
Welcome to the club of people who have been the victims of "protection" that the law provides. At least your situation was not an expensive loss, but it still saddens me to see it happen to good people.
@@JeffreyAnthony I can't help but wonder, tho, if the law couldn't be... amended. Adjusted so that if they wanted to do a take down, they're required to tell people why, or risk consequences. Like, what if we said that a take down must be accompanied with the legal reason what was out of compliance, how they could be put back into compliance, and how the decision can be appealed. That puts a burden on public repositories like thingiverse, which I regret, but it would also protect the people who I am still naive enough (even after your explanation) to believe the law should be protecting.
@@3dpprofessor This is just my opinion, but in my experience, trust is key. For those who have intent to abuse the systems as opposed to building their practices through mutually beneficial agreements and partnerships, there is only so far you can keep bullies and abusers from doing what they do best.
The more laws, the more loopholes and caveats that you create. Your key here is what you said in the video, the Lego company does not want to communicate. You can't come to agreements with that sort of entity, and in essence they don't want to. Laws can only be enforced so far with entities that don't wish to agree, and it is just like we have now, those that have money will generally win.
I feel your ideas on a system of compliance in the way you are describing is a good thing for working together where you have people working towards mutual benefit, much like people are trying to negotiate with RUclips at present. Yet we have to consider various dynamics of power. Thingiverse doesn't have the same clout Google does, nor are there as many financial incentives to leverage. I think they're in a vulnerable position that can't afford to take the side of the makers here even with a system in place where negotiations can be made.
One answer IMHO is what many open source software projects have tried, and they persist the best in these situations, where we have distributed systems where there's no ownership of the actual system, much like Diaspora. Yet even that is limited as a solution, and a solution that probably will be ignored by most people much like Diaspora has been.
I'm with you, i'd love to see that the law actually protects people. And occasionally it does. Yet we have far more examples to the contrary, to a point that I find it concerning that we continue to wish it could work, a situation that is strangely apolitical in that all sides of the political spectrum have seen these failures. And most of them at the cost of people that have nothing to do with the situation.
The youtube example also is a fun one to consider where we can examine a different dynamic: we have an entity that actually has a lot of money but is giving in to various takedown demands as well. Some of their pressures involve what their advertising sponsors will support, others involve legal pressures that are so big that they are unconstitutional, such as DCMA fining people 150k per infraction. Laws in our nation were originally supposed to be "punishment fits the crime".
At what point do these legal systems and law changes become so burdensome and unenforceable that they either are unfairly leveraged only in example cases, or worse, are turned against people when the insanely complex machine that is our legal system shifts? Much like people being arrested under "wiretapping" laws when taking video of police actions in public places.
More simply, murder is illegal. People are still doing it. Far more powerful is to examine why people are murdered and if there's factors encouraging it. Far less simple though.
Another thought, if you get a chance and time, watch the movie Garbage Warrior. Interesting documentary about an architect that was doing some radical things in a very maker-esque way. Half of the movie is maker brain candy... testing out new and fun ideas. The other half is watching the legal battles the guy had to go through and all the crazy that came with it all. Very interesting watch to catch a glimpse of how well meaning "protection" of the law plays out especially for people who really are simply trying to do innovative and socially positive things without harming others.
I propose we ask Mega Construx for permission to make compatible printed parts. I'd be willing to to bet they would be happy to endorse this, as it seems their official forum encourages customising blocks and sugguesting new kit ideas to their designers.
3D Printing Professor, I can assure you that Lego is a malicious actor not just to the small maker but even the British Broadcasting Corporation. We had a TV presenter build a full scale house out of Lego and they FORCED him and the BBC to tear it down even though they owned the bricks and everything.
I know it’s emotional and makes us all want to beat on somebody there, but I think we all need to vote with our wallets when we next go shopping for something like Lego. Let’s hurt them in the wallet.
so LEGO show up with a weapon or a lawful court order? cause that is the only way they could "FORCE" him and the BBC to do anything.....
It was James May they did that too, he is a god damn national treasure. Here is the Article www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1214729/James-May-size-Lego-house-wants.html
They didn’t force him to take it down. They just didn’t want to relocate it to their theme park when he wanted to get rid of it.
And, understandably, they didn’t give their ok for a non LEGO open theme park, as that would open the door for everyone to construct LEGO theme parks and make money of them.
We cone up with our own locking blocks. Why not make hexagon that fit in their circles, but their circle won't fit our hexagons.
We can Trade mark them as Eego's.
Another thing we should do is figure out the average cost of a brick brick for us vs. lego. I assume if Lego is THIS worried, they've done the math an know that their bricks are too expensive. If our cost per brick os higher, that that could actually an argument about how we are NOT a threat.
Dyson most definitely did not invent the vacuum cleaner, there were vacuum cleaners in the late victorian times and Dyson did not come along until the 90's
Hoover were the original, mass produced vacuum cleaners, I believe.
as I said vacuum cleaners were around in late victorian times( horse-drawn) and then hand pushed versions were retailed in the Edwardian period in small numbers by today's standards, the first "commercial mass-market" cleaner was by Electric Suction Sweeper Company who sold the patent to Hoover
Lego's hasn't really freaked out about printable Lego-Like bricks before because, as you said, it's _practically_ impossible to print a working brick on an FDM printer. Lego is freaking out *now* because MSL (Masked Stereo Lithography/Resin) printers just hit the sweet-spot price point of FDM printers, and they _absolutely_ can print functional bricks, just as accurately as injection molding, and rather quickly.
@Recycled Roadkill The nice thing about (at least) MSL printers is that it doesn't matter how large a layer is. One brick and a build plate full of bricks have identical build times. Not sure of the exact numbers, but I bet you could pack quite a few 2x4 bricks, placed endwise, onto a cheap MSL printer's build plate.
Corbald
You can tottaly do high presision on fdm, you just need a printer with no backlash and a 0,2 nozzle.
Sadly most cheap commercial solutions use belts which have lots of backlash so youd have to make your own with lead/ball screws instead. Maybe there are some designs on thingyverse already but in my experience thingyverse is full of shitty designs of everythig.
@@laharl2k Agreed, but meant in the sub-$300 range. I have a nice, fully custom FDM printer, based on the old Tevo Tarantula, sitting next to me right now that can manage Legos, but only just, and I have >$600 in the machine.
@Corbald
Backlash is the main culprit, you cant really do pieces with
@@laharl2k While I agree that it is very difficult, it's not impossible on FDM. I've had some luck even with a .4mm nozzle on mine. My point is that it's now, with cheap SLA/MSL, practically trivial to make a substantial amount, at a considerable savings, at home. Even the Technic stuff.
Lego is right to panic. There's nothing they can do about it, from a legal standpoint. Their patents have expired.
Once the Lego and/or 3d printing communities realize that you can now mass-produce Lego-like blocks/machines, at very little cost, and even custom blocks from the internet or your own mind, the communities will merge and grow. "Makes infinite Legos..." will be a new bullet point for 3d printing. Lego will die, but it's legocy will live on.
Not sure their concern, I would think that 3d printed brick accessories would enhance their product, not displace it. 3d printed bricks will never meet the quality standards that they have in their factories/the years of material R&D behind them. Their massive competitors can't even get their bricks into the same league in regards to quality, and it makes all the difference in the world.
I wish I could like this more than once. Amazing that interlocking bricks are still so powerfully fought over. Now, I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure you can patent different blocks and block types, so long as the block is not overly similar to another. I.E., you could make a block with square or hex pegs that are small enough to fit Lego's round sockets, and could use round sockets to be "compatible with other building blocks". This results in a brick distinct from, but usable with, Lego, Kiddicraft, Megablocks, and others. Forgive me if this was posited before, I just wanted to throw in my two cents and support.
Keep creating, keep printing, and keep sharing!
If Dyson came up with the first vacuum cleaner I guess that means Tesla invented the car.
Hubert Cecil Booth invented the vacuum cleaner...
Actually women invented the first vacumm cleaner but thats a sexist joke so i wont say it.
My Arduino Lego compatible mount was taken down too. Thing:1165072. It was completely unique other than being able to use the peg and hole style of connection they use in Technics.
Thanks for getting more attention to this! It seems remarkably common for big brands to try and protect themselves in a way that does more damage than the original problem, Nintendo and Ikea are two that jump to mind.
Could you use some polls though RUclips, show Lego that working with their fans is a much better way of doing business? The idea they have intellectual property over the cylinder shape, even if somehow legal, seems like it might be difficult for most people to stomach?
Lego's patent on the stud system has run out already. Who did this takedown and why? This appears handled even worse than RUclips, and they handle it terribly.
By the way, extremely early Lego bricks had a similar notch... probably because they were a cloned design in the first place. I think Lego's was slightly wider than kid craft's, though. The slot was used to fit window panes.
The early Lego bricks were straight up copied from Kiddicraft bricks.
www.brightontoymuseum.co.uk/index/Category:Self-Locking_Building_Bricks_(Kiddicraft)
@@jefflove3049 there where like 7 other kinds of interlocking bricks before lego came in the picture, but lego was a great innovator so thats good, i feel like they are wrong for being so entitled doh, they became too expensive anyway
CEOs of large companies don’t understand consumer 3D printing. Plus I think they need something for their lawyers to do. After all, they’re paying for their legal services. 😀
It's also the platform fault, which accepts an incomplete claim. Much like Google does.
Something similar happened a while ago on Thingiverse, I think the problem, partly, is that Thingiverse is just lazy!! They get a legitimate concern brought to their attention,about A design,and they don't actually look to compare the reported problem,. they do a blanket sweep of the site and gun down anything that is somewhat like the item that brought them negative attention. This is partially the reason that Prusa started a design sharing site as well, because Thingiverse doesn't communicate well with its members. They get a complaint of some kind and just go down the line, turning off designs, probably for the same reasons that you mentioned, a large company like LEGO could bully and bankrupt a smaller company. The only push-back against LEGO is just to get the message out re: their bullying tactics, and get as many people as you can reach, to switch to similar products, and boycott them. (Nearly impossible with the following they have)
They (Lego) complained about my one post on Thingiverse, and got it taken down.
You can't fight this... Alone. Protest together. Organize pickets at toy stores.
Per your request on Twitter: I publish things for free for numerous reasons. 1) I don't feel like my models are worth selling. 2) Even if I did, selling them can be a hassle. 3) Say #2 is a non-issue, I still have to consider that the CAD software I use has very restrictive terms on how much I can earn with models I create unless I want to pay an expensive license.
So, in short, it's mostly due to simplicity (with a little altruism sprinkled in) that I release models for free.
Im thinking lego being a random ad on building block videos which are not their products are going after the platform and return the platforms are taking down videos because they can't control the randomness of the ads. The ads go by tagged titles like "building blocks" once it notices the tagged words it puts a ad that the viewer is connected to, since they are watching the same style as the advertisement is portraying. Which in return basically states that lego is approving the ad placement, which clearly lego is not approving the ad placements. It's not your fault it's the platforms ad placements
Anybody else catch the IRONY at 11:17 ??? check out the background picture and get a giggle.
Is this a similar thing to what is happening on RUclips? People's videos getting copyright strikes without any proof? Anyone for any reason can just claim it is their content?
Yup.
Rescale everything, they can't claim every size of square !
8:17
Fight the good fight. Describing the infringement should be the the low bar. Not "We have money so do as we say".
Lego lost this war ages ago, which is why we have Mega Blocks and a few other similar bricks. As with so many other cases of shotgun takedown notices, I'm going to bet it's some IP management firm using "ctrl+f Lego" and a little "that looks like a brick". The former case is actually alright by me, since "Lego" is under trademark. The latter's bollocks, because you can trademark a plastic brick with pips no more than you can an actual brick. You can use it as part of a logo and have protection there, but it doesn't suddenly halt production of plastic cuboids.
We should all start by writing complaint emails to lego and telling them we are unhappy and demand a statement
I'm a Grandfather. Guess what my Grand-kids WON'T be getting for their upcoming birthdays and Christmas...
Get them a 3d printer. Infinite interlocking bricks.
Guys! In case none of you have picked up on this already, we should simply change the names from Lego bricks to automatic binding bricks or some other alternative, so that way we can avoid Lego's copyright bullshit altogether.
Someone did print all the parts for the Millenium Falcon 75192 ! Legal and commercial teams of Lego are very territoriale. They win thanks to fear ...
This makes no sense why they're going after makers uploading building block compatible pieces when you can buy knock off Legos at Walmart they're called Max blocks so I don't understand
I allready tried printing several different kinds of bricks with my cheap ender 3 printer and was truely surprised by the practicality of them even a custom ball joint (coinsidentally fiting on legos "ball part"), used to drive an rc car, did not fail on me even after rough hours of driving.
This take down without representation thing is Thingiverse or any other hosting site's fault. If their rules require details as to what's being infringed upon, it's at least we will know why the take-down is happening. Simple? Unfortunately, not really.
just printed one lego block took 35 mins , let’s see to print a 150 piece set would take 87 hours .
robby rust
Well if it took you 35mim your printer is shit or you are a noob and dont know how to configure it.
Mine dont take 35min to print things bigger than a lego brick.
@@laharl2k I was being sarcastic you Asshole.... But thanks for showing how smart you are .
It depends on what kind of printer that is used. I have a DLP printer and a Lego brick would take almost an hour to print. Granted I can print more than one at the same time and it would still only take an hour.
@robby rust
So what if you were being sarcastic? what i said still holds true. If your ffm printer takes 35min to print a lego brick then you are a noob or your printer is shit.
3d printing internet tough guy? Perhaps using a default setting and going for very high accuracy, precision, and quality isn't a bad thing? I just designed and printed a replacement part for my robot vac yesterday, took 30 minutes and it's about the size of a 4x2 block on its side. Cool flex though bro, you obviously spent more time mastering 3d printing argument methods then you have the English language.
Lego lost their copyright claim against mega blocks in Canada in 2005 and U.K in 2010. so there is president in your favour
My first guess would be it the takedown happened solely based on the fact you put Lego in the thing's name. But without giving a reason for the takedown, we obviously can't know for sure, so i'm with you on that one.
But if that's true, then why are there so many LEGO things still on thingiverse? It doesn't make sense.
@@3dpprofessor Unfortunately unfair takedowns like that happen all the time on automated sites like RUclips. I'm not sure to what degree thingiverse is automated but I would imagine that it does have some automation to scan the information that you post. I would try posting the same files with the word Lego taken out everywhere, like the title, description, filenames, etc. and see if it still gets taken down.
@@3dpprofessor To be honest, i didn't check for that, i just assumed they took everything down that had Lego in it's name. Like they do in customs, when you for example order something from buildingtoystore, they check the package for lego or it's trademarks, but not if the content is lego compatible. If theres any trace of a trademark, the parcel gets destroyed (at least in german customs).
Guess we'll have to wait for the answers that thingiverse hopefully will provide.
I would bet that the Lego company is most likely not ran by the original designer(s). I suspect the origin of the takedown is from Lego's Shareholders, because keeping the market clean is in their best interest. Remember Nintendo's gold seal of quality?
From the technical side of the takedown on Thingiverse. They're most likely trying to avoid being liable for damages, and used keywords to flag uploads on their site.
I'm sure if the community avoids using Lego's terminology, they could continue to share D. I. Y building blocks.
I'll stay tuned for those future videos!
Lego trying to protect their own IP is pretty rich, given their own blocks began as bootlegs of Kiddicraft bricks.
Which is part of why Kiddicraft went under, and their bricks are now public domain.
They have 0 brain with this. Imagine how much they would earn by being part of the community. Just seeing what people want and collaborate with makers in terms of design. It's clear 3d printed legos will not work perfect, the injection molded ones will win anytime. Very bad of lego...
Tinkering with Stuff
Its like trying to play pokemon cards with photocopied card. Its lame and low quality, the exact same opposite of why youd buy legos vs other brands. No one would ever show off with 3D printed legos
@@laharl2k I'm starting to think china may not be all that bad
Patent would have ran out long ago.
In the USA, 20 years after patent applied for.
Wiki says Legos were invented in 1932, so it's 13 years short of a century now.
The Lego patent would have to be expired before we were even born.
This is the way corps are trying to create a new bubble of law for 3D printing. THE FOREVER PATIENT. this has been tried in the past.
That article is nice - they didn't use the LEGO logo but made a 'LAWGO' :)
Another 3D channel got a cease and decease order for using the word "Slinky" and I guess the springy thing isn't copyright protected but the word is protected by the trademark, etc. So he uses the word "Springo" which he coined and he has a bunch of different variations and he seems good as long as he doesn't use the word "Slinky"
That Devin from make anything. Stiff
Sub if you're not.
Let's just make an open source plastic brick. "MakerBrick" don't tag any of the companies. We could make guidelines of how to package and sell them. You just have to put the designs name on the box and MakerBricks. I bet some manufacturers would pick up the designs. Get someone to make some assembly software, you could design and sell your own kits.
I think Hoover might have more claim to vacuum cleaners than Dyson. Ad they probably didn't invent them either.
Lego will never receive a dime from me ever again due to this. Lets just redesign the "lego" (interlocking geometry) and call it a day. They're over priced and outdated anyways.
My "Giant Lego Batman" was also flagged/removed from Thingiverse. Doesn't even come up in the search.
The more add-ons that people make that will work with LEGO would help their sales.. The only logical way of thinking, is that LEGO's competitors are playing dirty.. Write to LEGO, and ask for help...
I feel the whole take down is so that they don't get any infringements from us designers when we come up with the design or idea of something that they don't have yet. Ie they don't have a space ship like yours but they might want to make one in the future....and they don't want you to be going up against them when they steal yours and others ideas... Just a thought.
their patent rights are gone. take any product that was say made back in the sixty and another manufacturer made a product to enhance the usefulness. what right does the original company have to say noway. it like Chevy saying you have no right to put manifold or an exhaust kit on the car.what about a lawnmower. do you have the right to put a leaf bag on it, once you buy something it is yours.
guess I will start making my own blocks that fit certain other blocks .......
Hmm, no one is going to print all the legos for a Millenium Falcon? I just did a search, "lego" on Thingiverse, and there's plenty of lego things. Some by a designer that are 3D files for complete Lego Star Wars sets, Death Star II, Darth Maul bust, and Yoda Set. They also have an image of the box are and the bright red lego logo. How are these still up and your's aren't.
I'll put words in to Lego's mouth " cause we are greedy and want all your money " just like other company's out there
I love how soft spoken you are... This is like unintentional ASMR
Could it be a design patent on the specific dimensions of the interlocking elements? (So a patent issue, vs copyright)
Lego's patent on the brick have long since expired.
Hmmm? You posted a model on thingiverse you never printed. Good on you. :)
But, otherwise I agree with your arguments.
It was a long time ago. I didn't even have a 3d printer at the time.
Most of stuff there was never printed.
@@MichalKaczorowski Heh, the original post accused me of being part of the problem with thingiverse because I posted an unprinted model. They edited it.
Trademark and patent laws were put into place to protect the original designer. If the originator of the new design wants to fight the law file a worldwide utility patent for their designs.
Way too much IP and trademark losses have happened because of Lazy lawyers. Think Kleenex, Channel Lox, Xerox,
!!!!!!!!also I got an idea, everywhere all of these blocks are missing something important, why not make kid craft blocks that have quad attaching, meaning by instead of just having top and bottom having it able to connect on all sides, then maybe a simple flat piece that attaches to the the kid crafts.. if you want more ideas that what I thought up here in a minute and let me know then I will come up with so many ideas it will blow everyones minds..
Also design a block that has a bearing in it, now we can make rc cars. ect ect
I would think, original designs would only encourage people to go out and buy the rest of the legos to build the rest of their scenes.
Ip protection is so important and a lot of people with 3d printers need to respect it.
Ultimately the websites offering the models are in breach
Except that in this case, Lego has no IP to protect _except_ their name, their logo, and the copyright on their printed material. The shape of their bricks, how they interlock, the exact dimensions, etc, are no longer protected by patent, are not protectable with copyright. Lego has no legal leg to stand on.
@3D Printing Professor lego protected many variations to help protect their brand. I am sure they can/have renewed their copywrite/ip.protectiom and besides, they have every right to claim.
I mean imagine copying lego and complaining that they are sueing you...
@@jaront4922 Even Lego's legal team has admitted the only thing they have is the trademark on the name and logo and copyright on the printed material. The shape of a legos is in the public domain.
Protection on ideas expire after a time. That's by design. That's necessary for innovation. If that weren't the case then every 3d printer would need to be licensed through 3d Systems or Stratasys (depending on the technology). Legos have been around since 1932. Their protections expired decades ago.
Now, the design of the Lego person was patented in 1979, which means even it its expired by now.
@@3dpprofessor you are comparing technology with lego... a toy.
Branding is very different to technology and innovation.
If you think the average person has a right to copy something that someone else has made (especially when it is one of the most recognised brands in the world) then you have no regard for ip protection and sustaining businesses for the long term.
It is a toy, not tech and they have every right to be allowed to prevent others from making it. Monopolising on someone elses idea is silly, especially when it comes to toys.
Just because you ha e a 3d printer it does not mean you can just create and sell what you want.
@@jaront4922 I'm afraid it's the same whether it's technology or a toy.
I can tell that you really _want_ Lego to be untouchable here. Did you watch my previous video? ruclips.net/video/CTwAzhlJ7qk/видео.html
I wanted to just let Lego have this one at first, too. But I had to learn that I was wrong about that. That the protection of ideas must expire for innovation to flourish and that Lego's protections have long since expired. That's why Lepin, Kre-O, MEGA BLOKS, and a handful of other companies can, legally, make Legos and sell them in the same markets as Lego without recourse.
"Just because you have a 3d printer it does not mean you can just create and sell what you want.
" This is true (even though lots of people are doing exactly that anyways). But in the case of Legos that's more because cheap 3D printers don't do the necessary level of accuracy and the deposition processes making it weak in all the wrong places, more than Lego having any protections.
The fart at 5:48
I'm with you! What's next? If Lego continues this non-documented approach and is successful it seems reasonable other companies will follow. This could be bad for the maker community. Highly unlikely any of this could actually affect the bottom line for any of these companies and will only hurt their perception and negatively affect them. Seems quite crazy!
It's DMCA, not DCMA. The first is a bill, the second is a district court in Massachusetts.
I can never get that right.
They are attacking the little guy. They also prey on the premise that other interlocking bricks may not interlock with theirs. Over here we have Blox lol.
Thingverse should have defended their users but they chickened out.
It’s not just Thingiverse it’s Cults and Myminifactory as well
MMF has stood firm so far. But thingiverse, especially lately, has taken a policy of taking the easy way out no matter what.
Glock took down a prop gun I had on thingiverse. No explanation. After talking on Facebook to other makers I guess it's because it had their logo. Re-uploaded without logos. Yes I would have liked to have been told that so I could have made the design conform to their request but they gave me no reason for the take down. That should change.
Few bad apples will lobby some law through for this. After all it sucks if you can fix your fridge door and get few extra years with it.
I wonder if these interlocking bricks you mention are also Nintendo N&B compatible... :)
Reminds me of John Deere and their repair issue. Sounds like some mid-level executive got scared and said take out everything with the L word in it. I am very interested in learning that type of precision.
It's not easy, but it's not impossible.
ruclips.net/video/GUz4YCnuNOQ/видео.html
I agree with you about lego been wrong on the copy right claim.
I don't agree about some one invention been forced to go on public domain just because a arbitrary time span someone else just think is good.
Of course you are allowed to develop your on self locking bricks if you wanna and if you can do it without rip off.
Peer to Peer, and just use the network like Napster. Fuck these old-guard companies, I can't wait till 3d printing flips the table.
Betting if you reposted it as lepin compatible, lepin wouldnt say a word, might use it in future products, but wouldnt say a word
I think you'd need to convince Thingiverse for actually acting responsible instead of blindly. They need to understand that they are hurting themselves in the long, because the relevance of the site will go down for creators aswell as for downloades, with every piece taken down.
His missguided. The issue is with Thingaverse, not Lego.
U.S. legal system: innocent until proven guilty. If there is a claim that you infringed on the law, you are innocent until proven guilty. It is therefore not right to infringe on your rights by taking down the challenged item until the case has been resolved to show either there was an infringement (in which case, the item is taken down) or that the claimant was wrong (in which case, the claimant can be sued for legal fees arising from the unjustified claim).
They also took down printabrick.org, which was like the best website ever. They’ve gone too far.
Well, printabrick was reposing copyrighted materials. Scans of box art and assembly instructions that Lego still had a valid copyright on. Printabrick might have had it coming on that one.
Yeah, I guess thats true. Still is a bummer though. I’m only left with the models I have downloaded now.
@@kosine8714 well, this is the internet. Nothing is truly gone.
Asking on one of your vids again, could somebody hopefully share your files, I cannot find most of them sadly :/
These ones are so shamefully untested and out of spec that they probably won't actually work. Give me a bit, I'll recreate a tested set that I can be sure will work.
I up-voted. Fight the good fight. Thank you for not rolling over and giving up. You tube is great but their system of take down sucks. I didn't know thingiverse was doing the same.
I think that is some most stupid thing from big company that I have Been keeping on great value. I think that I have been buing more Legos after my 3d printer than before. Maybe I need to start to buy cheaper Chinese building blocks.
Does not seem like this will end well no matter what. Curious what your thoughts are about “fan art” 3D models of popular comics/movie/TV characters being sold behind Patreon paywalls, private FB groups, etc. For the most part the 3DP community has been left alone by IP holders as there wasn’t $$$ involved. That isn’t always the case anymore, is that starting to come back to bite us?
Maybe. Personally I try not to sell 3d designs based on other peoples IP... anymore. But I can't claim my hands are clean on that front. Many a roll of filament was purchased with Doctor Who rings sold on Etsy. Like I said, I don't do it anymore, but I can't claim the moral high ground here. However, that's why I came up with Chibimals. i wanted something original-ish.
The problem is, things that people recognize get more attention. We want Hellboy and Ironman. So people who make that get the attention. But they're building their house on someone else's land. So how long they get to live there isn't up to them. It may be years, or it may be a few months until they get noticed. And the more successful they get, the more likely they'll be to get the rug pulled out from under them.
They did tell all the customers to shut up and just but their bricks. It was obvious in their statement or page you showed.