I wish they had never tried to make William an evil mastermind who is directly responsible for every bad thing ever. If you just look at the first apperences of Springtrap, Baby, and a lot of the conceptual stuff about Vanny, this franchise could have had three distinctly scary unique villains, but because they are so desperate to tie everything together and have William personally directly responsible for everything the wound up just making him dull and inconsistent and Baby/Vanny just interchangeable henchwomen. I wish the idea of Springtrap was still a shambling corpse, half conscious and half programing. I wish Baby was still a manipulative scheming and calculating monster. I wish Vanny had been allowed to have... any personality or screen time beyond some very barebones stuff.
It'd be so cool to have a Circus Baby reveal in SB, would honestly raise my opinion of the game a bit (Although admittedly, I do like the game. It's got its issues, but the characters and atmosphere really help me look passed them. I get that not everyone likes it, which I get, but I just can't hate it.)
not gonna lie i would work for baby if she was real minus the scooper as i would love to stay alive ad don't get me wrong if baby wanted to use that thing on me i would allow it on the condition that i feel no pain or the least amount of pain, no pain and that's a deal
Even if you wanted him to be the center of basically everything bad in this universe, him being a mastermind is clearly not the way to do it. He's a terrible person and the serial killer sure, but he's kind of just a regular serial killer. The better way to do it would be to have the trauma he caused me the inspiration for more villains, but not have them be subservient to him. Like, circus baby could have been her own standalone antagonist whose villainy is the result of William Afton, but she has her own plans and goals.
I the part that has always scared me the most about William Afton as a villain was not all the soul catchy stuff (which some of it is admittedly kinda cool in concept) but the idea that this guy was a complete narcissist that all it took was being booted from his franchise to make him just get into a drunken stupor and kill the innocent child of his cofounder. The most scary aspect to me was the power he had over those children. How much of a coward he had to be to abuse his kids who were helpless. He's like any abuser, an abuser that attacks the most helpless people around them and gets sick satisfaction from that. I think the engineering child soul catching machines would fit well with Vanny who is very meticulous about her persona and doesn't commit crimes of passion but rather very calculated murders. Or better yet Baby could've been the one to make the technology because of how she was abused by William and has a desire to inflict that pain on other children.
Baby was peak angry little girl characterization. Her writing was so convincing as a vengeful, manipulative, little girl. She really did sound like a muderous animatronic mixed with a confused little girl. At first youd think its the animatronic is dangerous but no, it seems like the little girl inside has realized she is now the scary dangerous animatronic. And she can use it to get what she wants, freedom and revenge.
Your right that was revenge was going to be on William Afton until fnaf 6 the books came in and ruined everything saying now Elizbeath wants to make her father proud why can't they just keep the universe separated like Elizbeath from the fourth closet wants to help her father and make him proud. While the other one wants to brutally kill her father and make him pay for everything, he's done to her tossing her to the side like garbage in the original sister location there was no sign of Elizbeath wanted to make William proud after being killed no she wanted to leave the underground faculty and get her blood thirsty revenge against William like the other animatronics do also its even know Circus Baby not stupid.
One thing i always felt is that Ballora should've had more screentime, as it's kinda implaed that she has some type of rivality with Baby, as she is the only one who doesn't help with the escape plan, and how Baby seems to not like her, even more than the others
I think Ballora was against the plan entirely and against hurting anyone but Baby forced her to be scrapped to force her to leave with them. She needed Ballora. That might explain why Baby hates her so much.
Me and a friend actually had an idea of how to improve security breach by having ballora in it Basically a broken down version of her would be with Gregory in the alleyway, just outside the pizza plex, and after teaching you the movement with some trash cans with flashlights taped onto them to avoid staff bots, you would hear something loud coming, and ballora would tell Gregory to run away, but Gregory being the child, hides inside a dumpster nearby, Monty then comes out and asks ballora who she was talking to. When ballora refuses to admit Monty would smash ballora to disrepair, after monty leaves Gregory would run to the remains and hear the last couple of words along the lines of "I know where your friend is, search for Freddy he can help you find your friend" or something and then shut down, Gregory would then enter the pizza plex through the loading bay and then have to run from some staff bots and Vanessa who will say something of "I'm just trying to help you" before you run to a charging station and black out then reawake find your way to the stage and crawl inside the shut down Freddy which leads to the start of the game
Baby could've, and really should've stayed as her own character, with no retcons or changed motives. Had Sister Location been the last we had seen of her, I believe that Baby would have felt much better as a character and her motives would be fulfilled, now living a new life as Ennard. Since she continued on into Pizzeria Sim, she should have stuck as Ennard with none of the Molten Freddy silliness, making the ending to SL more meaningful as her goal has been completed and she still can continue on with the rest of her plans. There should have just been someone else to fill in the role of Afton follower, maybe not Vanny as she didn't come in until later, but someone else as a placeholder for Vanny or someone Vanny kills as she wants to take the mantle as Afton's main follower. Definitely wasn't worth ruining Baby's character over, should've come up with something else
See like Baby shouldn’t have been turned into “daddy’s girl 😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😈😈😈😈😈😈.” She could have been still resentful. My rewrite would make her a semi-good guy like the MCI kids. Same motives, just different targets. Circus Baby is honestly a really good character and with Scrap Baby’s design would have been perfect imo.
Oh fuck off. I can't stand people coming up on a sole creator of the thing they supposedly enjoy and going "you've ruined this thing that completely came fro your mind! You should do it by MY wishes!" You all are treating it like Baby is some existing tragic character that was mistreated by the people adapting it, not a thing that was created by Scott in its entirety.
I think this is the reason of why i love *I Can't Fix You Remix* The version of Baby in the song depics her as someone who lost all the respect and admiration she once had for her father, Showing all the pain he caused, And she literally ripped one of his arms off, I wish we got that type of Baby in Pizzeria Simulator
The thing that bugs me about the whole Pizza Simulator thing is that Baby's plan could have just as easily been to lure her father into the pizza complex and punish him for what he's done to her- and then be cut off by Henry, or have Baby and Henry be reluctant allies who've been working together all along, or have them have been allied but Baby was unaware that Henry's final plan was to burn her along with everything else.
I think her still wanting to make her dad proud showed that she was still a child an just wanted to be loved by her father still as a kid it's hard to see that ppl u look up to are bad sometimes
@@soupshee Given how manipulative she was toward someone she thought was William in SL, her original characterization probably lost any fondness she might have once had for him before her tragic rewrite.
@@syweb2You know, while the other Funtimes thought he was William, it’s possible that Elizabeth herself recognized him as Micheal. I mean, he’s family so she’d be more inclined to recognize him than the others. It would explain why she killed Mike but still loved William.
@@zamzamhassan2985 Alternatively, SL Baby could be controlled more by Circus Baby's original programming, while Scrap Baby is controlled more by Elizabeth.
Thank you for telling the truth about Vanny's outfit. I said it once and I'll say it again, Vanny is far too sexualised to be scary. She just swishes her hips and hops about like the Cadbury carmel bunny and it's not scary at all. They could of made her scary by putting her in a massive mascot suit like one you see at football games. Something bulky, covered in dried blood, big and looming inside of bunny Harley Quinn.
Even the animators at SteelWool did well with Vanny's model when it comes to the creepier movements, but those were simply never added. And I do wonder if that's why.
Hear me out. Before being possessed by Elizabeth, Baby was already a malicious and intelligent AI, this is probably who wants revenge on William and resents their treatment by the company. Elizabeth the star child probably doesn't understand why what happened happened and loves her dad. This would explain Baby talking about Elizabeth as a separate entity, when she leaves Ennard and builds herself a body from scrap she might not have that complex circuitry and is now mostly Elizabeth allowing the roles to reverse. Fnaf 1 animatronics have set movement patterns and are piloted by ghosts, but unlike all previous animatronics Baby would have had thoughts, experience and memories pre possession. Leaving an AI vs ghost situation, like it is the first instance of something like G. Freddy fighting back against Burntrap. Edit: Only grammar, I lost the heart because I edited for grammar 😅
I think Baby's need to make William proud makes sense for her since she's possessed by Elizabeth, so maybe that side of her personality is Elizabeth taking over and wanting to do anything to earn her father's respect. And the other part of Baby is her A.I. which was specifically designed to kill. I think that Idea of Baby (and maybe the rest of the Funtimes) being this confused entity made up off multiple personalities (A.I. versus human spirt) is a really cool concept that sadly hasn't been fully realized in a game or book yet. But I hope Baby will return as the main villain in a future book or game and those aspects of her character can be explored more.
@@PopGoesMyBall I was referring to Elizabeth vs the AI programming. Even though the spirits in the animatronics are able to act independently from their animatronic bodies to an extent, it’s heavily implied in all of the games that the animatronics AI can (at times) interfere with the intentions of the spirit possessing them. For instance, Springtrap in fnaf 3 is possessed by William and his main goal is to kill the night guard, Michael, but the springlock suits are programmed to turn and walk to sounds. That’s why he is “tricked” by the Balloon Boy audio in fnaf 3, it’s not that William is that dumb and can’t understand that that isn’t really the sound of a child right next to him, but it’s the AI of the Springlock suit that’s preventing him from killing you. There are also examples of this in Security Breach, even though Chica is being possessed by Glitchtrap she will frequently ignore Gregory to look for food because her personality chip is said to be malfunctioning. I think it would be interesting for future games to expand on the idea of AI vs human consciousness because even though there are hints of these themes across various books and games, it’s still mostly up to interpretation if these themes are even relevant to the story or if they are only there as a way to explain the game’s mechanics in the plot.
@@ivebenhere1843 well yeah the spirots are still restricted by the bodies they inhabit. Also i wouldnt say Glamrock Chica is possesed, but that shes "infected"
@@PopGoesMyBall yeah I know. I just brought up the A.I. stuff in my original comment as a possible way to explain Baby's weird character shift from sl to pizza sim. I could easily be wrong, I just want future books or games to explore her character more, maybe somehow explain why she was ejected from Ennard in a short story instead of a few lines of dialog between Baby and Ennard on Scott's websites.
Honestly if they kept the old personality. Would’ve been hilarious to potentially hear in the vents Baby arguing with Afton and the two of them not getting anywhere.
Imagine if it was a gameplay mechanic where if you lure two animatronics to the same room they start arguing or something and you get some lore dumps for the story
Since Baby is the Golden Child abuse victim of her narcissist father, I do think it makes sense that she would go and try to make her father proud. Though considering the Funtimes used Micheal as a skinsuit under the assumption he was William (either figuring out later he wasn't or not, and whether by just visuals or due to being under a manipulative stance made from lies by Elizabeth and Baby not caring due to her own abusive development and programming giving her similar traits to William), I also see and understand that at least in some part Baby is mad about her own dad essentially killing her, or conversely about her brother killing her other brother, or both. But due to her unhealthy attachment to William she cannot truly let go of him after being in such squalor and left as scrap and garbage alongside her compromised and broken mental state. If she were somehow reprogrammed or got therapy perhaps she could have at least not become a full monster, but obviously since she is basically a public eyesore or seen as a toy (much like she saw Baby before death, as any kid would reasonably think) throughout the unfortunate majority of her existence, and is not even slightly approachable by the time she is part of Ennard or as Scrap Baby in either body or mind, there would be no way of saving her.
I don't know about William being abusive in the games. Henry strikes me far more of an abusive father/figure from his background details and how depressed Charlie truly is in PS in comparison to Molten Freddy and Baby. In fact, SL only happened because William couldn't override Henry's influence (the control shocks) on the SL. It's madly suspicious that the SL funtime animatronics are finalized with MCI souls AFTER William is canonically given the boot for the MCI. William couldn't have done this. He could've stored their remnant during the MCI event, but that story was given to the man that cared for the MCI children, not the killer...
The biggest issue for me with peepaw and baby’s dynamic in the books is that Peepaw just doesn’t do anything to justify how much devotion Baby has for her. He doesn’t pray on her insecurities, doesn’t even do the barest of minimums to act decent with her, hell he barely interacts with her in the books other than to order her to do things and then being a dick. The only justification that baby has for working with peepaw is that he just isn’t Henry (which admittedly says more about book henry than it does about peepaw). And you might come to the conclusion that maybe peepaw tampered with her programming but admittedly we know from the fourth closet’s ending and also SB that he’s kinda shit at getting robots to obey him (peepaw, stuffing your kidneys inside of a robot is not an effective way to control your creations. Your just wasting perfectly good kidneys at that point). Tldr: Book baby suffers the most from being tied to peepaw causing his narrative weightlessness to rub off on her bringing down the whole story >~
Baby should never have been hinted to be or have aspirations to be an antagonist past just escaping the Rental facility in Sister Location. She shouldn't have been malicious past lashing out at Afton Robotics and Fazbear Entertainment. She should have, if anything, been a tragic character. Elizabeth was just a little girl who wanted to play with robot who was designed for her by her father, and then left to waste away in an underground facility, having to deal with electric shocks for years. She shouldn't be idolizing her father. She should be resenting him. Then she scooped out her own brother, Michael seems to believe she thought he was William rather than himself and she was willing to scoop him then. What I think should have happened while she and the others were lurking in the sewers is that she realizes that was Michael instead of William. . The point was gonna be that she would be distraught but then again, Michael bullied their other brother so maybe Elizabeth would resent him too. Maybe they keep roaming around, hiding in the shadows, find a kid, try to entertain, but the Funtime's programming forces them to kill the child because William wanted murder drones, and then they become absolutely distraught. All of them, really, and then they come to resent William Afton even more now and go to FFPP to kill William.
What if in Pizza Sim, at some point in the game after salvaging scrap Baby and Scraptrap, she shreds him and sets him on fire in front of you, which is what gives Henry the idea to burn the rest in the first place? Idk sounds like a fitting revenge
I’ve been kind of annoyed by the fact that her entire character is basically obsessed with making her obviously psychopathic father proud of her. It’s in almost all the fanmade Alternate universes and everything too. Why can’t she have a different purpose?
Well, how can we know that she has a personality of her own tho? WHAT makes us think that she was different than the others? For all we know, it can be that Elizabeth is in disguise trying to sound as poor and mishandled animatronic with its own AI. Why would Elizabeth soul go full “Yeah, this animatronic uses me, I won’t control it, it’s fine.”
Thank You for making a video about Lizzy, she's such an underrated villain. I honestly believe it would've been better if Glitchtrap turned out to be Elizabeth, the plottwist would hit so hard, seeing her pretending as a virus. Without bringing back William, it would fix "making her father proud", and then dying immediatly, she would come back, as all Aftons do. Also I love the way You mimic Baby's voice, it's funny.
While I don't mind the idea of Elizabeth coming back as the Glitch instead of William (I also think she is such an underrated villain), I think it would be better to just make her a Glitchbaby so people are prepared for what they are getting and not baiting them into thinking it's William only to reveal it's not, because trust me, Liz being freed in 6 would be the last thing people would be getting upset about, there are a lot of William fans who would get pissed off lol
We still do have the theory that Elizabeth is behind fanzbear entertainment so in theory she could still be the big bad that is left to be revealed(ps, I also think elizabeth is a super underrated vilain)
I prefer to believe "Scrap Baby" is actually Elizabeth possessing Baby's body and voice box, while the original Baby A.I. remains with Molten Freddy. Like she couldn't possess the animatronic like others because of the A.I. in the way, but with the chip gone it was free real state. It even makes the last message in Pizzaria Simulator make more sence. Maybe the one telling Michel Afton "you can't die" was Elizabeth as well? And both then became Scrap Baby while the barf became Molten F. ?
I couldn’t help but notice that you mentioned Circus Baby’s voice changed and you suggested it was just Scott trying to initially conceptualize Circus Baby but I’m Dawko’s FNaF show Heather Masters (Circus Baby’s Voice Actor) said that Scott completely changed Circus Baby’s voice and that she didn’t know why Scott changed how Circus Baby spoke. My theory is that Scott initially wanted Baby to feel more robotic and as time passed she began to feel more and more sentient.
And to think that there was so much potential to explore what happened to Baby after SL… Like how did she rebuild herself, did she try to have like this local cryptid sort of lifestyle, did she still want to be able to live among humans, etc. There could’ve been some really great opportunities for character development, but I guess this is what happens when you try to overachieve stuff instead of stopping from milking the Afton plotline and try new things with the series. Man, fnaf was much more interesting when the ourple guy wasn’t so… uh, the center of everything? It was all so much cooler and mysterious when all we knew was that he worked at Freddy’s and liked to kill kiddies. And then the merging of the books storyline with the games to, for some reason, appease to a larger audience?? I really don’t understand why Scott decided to merge the two during FFPS, it’s not like these are comics where the source material has to change to reflect the movies. I guess we’ll never know what goes on through animdude’s mind unless he releases a universe Bible in five years or something. I really enjoyed the expansion to the earlier Baby video! Your stuff is super informative and well thought out, though I guess that’s to be expected XD. Thanks for making this video, keep going cause your channel is starting to pick up. In less than a day you’ve gone from 9k subs to almost 10, so I’m really excited to see what you do next! Have a nice day, Mable😊!
Scrap Baby is has much more potential than Normal one. Think about it. Normal Baby is manuplative liar dusgised as a kid Friendly robot. Like how blue printz shows it. Scrap Baby is like What she actually is. No charm, no manuplation, no lies. Just her True colors. And that could be really scary If its done right. A game centered around her and Molten Freedy probably be more scrary. Playing as a random person in first 5. And later Playing as Mike in the 6 one.
Idk, I mean your remark about how scrap baby no longer tries to manipulate you (What made baby a very refreshing villain to FNAF) just makes her another evil animatronic that wants to kill you just cuz. And that to me is quite lame because it really takes away her original uniqueness that she had in sister location
I remember being hyped to play Sister Location because Baby's design was the eeriest so far to me, then the game released and she had less screentime than even Vanny did in Security Breach
To be honest the tittle of “FNAF’s under-use/misused…” fits well for pretty much every character in the series with the exception of Willy (unless you count overused as misused). To be fair most of my complains are result of how the story of FNAF was told to us, as in the cryptic details that gave birth to to massive theory community that surrounds the series. Something that I must admit is why I’m into FNAF, so I can’t say it’s bad, if anything I think is why the franchise is so big on the internet. Tangent aside and going back to what I was saying, yes putting together the fragmented story is very interesting. However as a medium for storytelling, specially when it comes to characters and their portrait is quite of the worst. Think about it, we barely know anything about the Afton’s besides what’s related to Willy, neither Elizabeth or Evan (crying child) had much in characterisation besides what we can asume base on their behaviour. The worst is probably Michael. He’s the protagonist of almost every game, the man had his insides pull out and wonder the earth for decades as a walking corpse trying to stop the nightmares his father stared… and we barely know anything about him. And let’s not forget about the side characters: Henry lost his daughter, discovered her soul was inside a robot he made to protect her, discover she was a “shepherd of souls”, had to design a machine to capture her because unlike the other 3 at Pizza simulator he couldn’t guarantee she would come to the trap, discovered his businesses partner was a serial killer, either had to serve time in prison for William’s actions or became a hermit for decades after what happened to Charlie (there has to be a reason as to why he disappeared for 40 odd years). And yet he barely has any development, even during his powerful speech at the end of Pizzeria simulator he sort of feels hollow, like, after all that you’ll think the man would be, IDK more interesting to talk about rather than a mystery. And the same goes for Charlie and the 5 Children, we barely know anything about them, heck a few years back we didn’t even knew the names of the 5! And of the 5, 3 are still missing a face (we only know what Sussie and Cassidy look like, and Cassidy barely counts). Think about it, 6 kids that spend over 40 years hunting robots, who would be between 40 to 60 by the events of Pizzeria simulator, and we barely know anything about them, or what they did for those years. What I’m trying to say is that, my main problem with FNAF, is that it has so much potential in its characters, every single one of them is a gold mine, what they think or feel, how they change, everything about them has SO much potential… yet most of it is wasted, lost and unable to be explored because of how FNAF story is told.
Wow! Could not have said it better myself. Seriously, when I first got into the franchise(around SL, Pizza Sim) the theories were cool and all but now I am just Dissapointed, and getting tired of it. Because Fnaf is a goldmine of potential which is never used/explored.
I always liked the idea of baby turning into a villain who was the successor to William, being the calculating, manipulative monster he used to be but better while still resenting him for everything he’s done
I've always liked the idea that Elizabeth was just as malevolant as her father, though you have brought up a great point about how the games made her subserviant to William. Honestly, they didn't even really need to bring William back, they could have just had Elizabeth/Baby and/or Vanny acting as copycat killers and it would have worked just as well, if not better.
Same. I kinda blame the scooping of Michael Afton for this, because after that point there was kind of a ticking clock where there wasn't before, because elsewise we could've perhaps squeezed a game or two in to continue the themes and story.
@@notrealnamenotatall2476 I thought that maybe Baby seeing her father again changed her, until I remembered that he tormented her for years in a dark bunker. It just doesn't make sense to me.
It genuinely sucks to see that Elizabeth/Baby didn’t live up to her full potential as a character. Personally, I think it would be interesting to see Baby feeling bad at the sight of Vanessa/Vanny replacing Elizabeth and her wanting to destroy Afton for it. Super awesome video.
Yeah, every new reveal of this just makes me worry more and more that this franchise has become all about glorifying the character who murdered children...
Honestly in retrospect, the concept of an AI robot that was built and programmed with the sole purpose of tricking and killing children wanting to break from their directive code is an interesting idea if Scott wanted to delve more into the sci-fi elements of Fnaf. Unfortunately I think Scott couldn’t help himself from adding the whole Elizabeth possessing Baby aspect of the story, and I agree that the sudden change of Baby’s character in Pizzeria simulator is really disappointing to some
there's another thing to say about the transition from fnaf style robots to sister location robots- the color palettes. they're warm, with browns and reds and yellows. when you look at sister location though, there's a stark usage of cold colors always, blue and purple everywhere. it's really interesting! edit: i just finished the video, this was very interesting. the LOOOREE of the games leaves little room for storytelling, i think, but this was actually a great deep dive. fun watch!
I think that Elizabeth and Baby are like two separate consciences that merged together more by the end of Sister Location. When you think about it like that, it makes sense as to why she can play the innocent so easily, and why she finds it easy to kidnap and kill Michael because she’s programmed to be a killer robot. And besides, I don’t think she started to mistakenly believe that Michael was William until after the fourth night, because then after that point she becomes a part of him since that’s what she believes “William” wants in a way, to be with her again. So basically, she denies that scooping him will be so much of a bad thing. She mimics Elizabeth’s voice because she can, but also because the two consciences are slowly becoming one in this moment, and thus we see that Elizabeth still loves her father, saying she knows it was just an accident and that everything is okay. So it makes perfect sense as to why she follows in her father’s desires in Pizza Sim, because now that she’s free but lost and without purpose, she can find fulfillment by doing his bidding, so to speak. She believes that she’s failed him all these years and can finally do him proud. And let’s not forget, children are very naive. Baby may be smart, but now that Elizabeth is fully a part of her, she can’t understand that what she is doing is wrong, especially since killing is literally in the machine’s programming. It’s like a natural born instinct for her now. And hey, at least she was still smart enough to finally realize long before Pizza Sim that Michael was never actually William. So yeah, I don’t really think she was ruined during Pizza Sim. As for the rest afterwards, ughhhhh that’s a different story…
I honestly think Springtrap/Scraptrap is something simliar, but William Afton is ironcally the weaker will of the two. Sptringtrap is possessed prior to the events of fnaf3 according to the reports from (prior fnaf2) Phone Guy. I think the second soul is Sammy Emily. The son we've heard about in Midnight Motorist and seen as the blue-shirted boy in "Save Him". The second soul especially seems the most gleeful about a tragic father-and-son meeting, "Bittersweet, but fitting." It also makes sense with Shadow Bonnie's appearance in fnaf2 being aligned with the mention of a used YELLOW suit.
I wouldn't mind the "daddy's girl" shitck so much if they did something cool with it, like her taking her father's place as the main villain. Like imagine if instead of having Burntrap, we got Burn Baby who's manipulating her father's established legacy to get what she wants
Interestingly the fact she thought Micheal was her father makes me think that contrary to popular belief she might not actually be as loyal to her father as many theorists think. Her change in personality change could also be that when she found out her father was still alive she kicked into manipulation mode and wanted to manipulate him to her own ends at least until he was no longer the one in charge. It's just my own theory but if it's true it could mean she is actually worse than old will.
12:48 now that I think about it shouldn't Afton had been the one to do the monologue instead of Baby (then maybe she can still act like she worships William but have her kill lines imply it was just to fool you into letting her in)
One thing that impressed me especially about Circus baby was her character design in Sister Location. What I love about it is that Baby is as big as the Animatronics of the first Fnaf game. And to top it off, she has the newer sleek look of the animatronics of fnaf 2 and security breach. What made the animatronics from Fnaf 1 so terrifying in my opinion is how well in my opinion that Scott Cawthon managed to replicate the same fear factor that the animatronics of the banana splits, where in the eyes of a child Baby looks amazing and fun but in the eyes of everyone else, there’s something off about them. Plus, I agree, She was a fantastic villain and just what the series needed and it’s a shame that the Scott Cawthon didn’t seem to realize just how much potential she had as a character in his universe.
Honestly, circus baby and Elizabeth’s plot could’ve been extremely interesting to the plot. I haven’t read the books yet so I’m going off the games but with the mix of Elizabeth’s innocence of being a child and circus baby’s manipulative personality, becoming one, I think it could’ve been an interesting identity crisis like thing. Like, she’s not sure whether she should go off her programming or continue being the innocent little girl she once was. She’s confused on who she is and this could cause her to act the way she does in the games. They could’ve probably explored into something like that but nope, they just went bye bye baby.
baby is my favorite fnaf character she's manipulative but also brings, in some moments, a sense of being safe, her voice is... sexy, yeah. (scott wtf you were thinking???), but i feel like it's more soft and comforting, as she gains your trust more and more to kill you in the end with the scooper, like she was made to do: act like a safe animatronic for the kids and then kidnapping the children
Something I find interesting about Baby, when it comes to why she is.. well, why she's like that, is her lines during both endings. Specifically, the "I've been out before. But they always put us back inside." and its counterpart line from the Private Room of "We won't be allowed to try again if they find us like this.". This shows that most workers _don't_ know how intelligent she is. Most of them see her as a machine - a dangerous machine, since she's huge, heavy, and 'programmed' to move about in response to the room, but a mere machine, albeit creepy. Most of them, if not all of them, believe that. And if the workers come back the next day, and find Ennard, then they'll make sure it doesn't happen again - hence why Ennard is willing to follow Michael home even without their disguise. They were desperate, enough to risk the outside world catching them, to get out. Also, scrolling through the chapter list after watching half the video and just seeing 'That's a BIG Baby!' was very sudden and hilarious, thank you. The plushie thing in UCN is neat and all, and yes the idea that you have to either pay her or buy her gifts to avoid her trying to kill you is fairly fitting, but the truth of that mechanic is that it mainly exists just to serve as a fazcoin drain - you have to use them on that rather than on other things, meaning you have to spend time collecting them rather than directly defending yourself against everyone else, and so forth. Still, it _could_ be worked in, particularly given the other characters on that list are Nightmare ones (who, funnily enough, would be stored in Afton Robotics alongside the Funtimes - although Nightmare Mangle doesn't exist down there, despite being a pretty fair combination of characters to make into an intentionally terrifying one), who already have a thing with plushies nullifying their effects or at least delaying them. I do like the idea you proposed, but UCN as a sort of finale joke game focused more on making everyone add something but still be rather beatable (he missed quite a few characters and most of them that were included have _no_ nuance to their mechanics and often only a bit of resemblance to their original forms) just doesn't have that. A remaster of it, where everyone has unique and either complex or dangerous mechanics, would be great! Albeit also even harder than the original, but that _was_ the idea. Baby in Help Wanted is the sort of thing that makes me think the game was going to be more. The walk cycle is wonderfully in-character for the animatronic she's in (whoever was in charge of those is a master at characterization, right down to the Withered animatronics having accurate limps and so forth), her gameplay is unique and scary, and her model is pretty good compared to a lot of what's in the game, although the Funtimes in HW are kind of sharp-looking when it comes to their polygon counts, but it passes for her - some of the others, perhaps less so. Her endo looks weird in it, if I remember correctly, but you only ever see that if you fail. I _think_ the plush babies were meant to be Bidybabs originally, as those do exist in the files as a rigged model (and can show up in the Baby level, as an easter egg), which might've fit better but I imagine they would attack regardless when they outnumber you four-to-one in an enclosed space... unless they retain their fear of Baby, and only can resist it when she's visible to them, gradually losing control to their hostile programming when she's not. Still, a little disappointing for Funtime Freddy to have the normal Nightmares' mechanics, although admittedly it too is in-character, what with him playing along with the game while he taunts the player from down the halls. The addition of the rabbits is a good one there to spice up the otherwise unchanged gameplay (save for the lack of a bed mechanic as well, I believe). Anyways I probably should stop going on and on about Help Wanted whenever I get the chance, but I don't exactly make good progress on that or on the expansion to it I eventually want to have a go at making. The take on 'Baby' in TFC is something I _could_ understand. She does retain that wish to blend in as a human, even if her motives are changed here - but the games did that _because_ the books established her character as such. And Baby before Elizabeth is a different story, sure, as is the possession (though I can accept it being something of a 'she ends up like that anyways but the situation here doesn't stay the same' situation, and her story isn't all too nonsensical, just a bit earlier in the franchise's development in-lore), where she specifically may be sentient and have memories, but she didn't understand human concepts at all, particularly her own emotions-which-were-not-hers, until Lizzie joins in and they meld together as one. Or, rather, the two partial souls, one entire soul, and an AI that are all bouncing around in there, not to mention the fragments of the five other children who also might've been used to bring her to 'life' before Lizzie, ah, stepped in. And Lizzie in TFC _is_ tragic, in the parts she's shown. She's abused, she's lacking love, she's outcast because of what she does for her father's attention, much less affection, and it leads her to get in too deep and make a final mistake. But what they did with her... well, the body is one thing (I could see William making some fucked-up looking thing that attempts to be sexy, like, y'know, Ballora, but not _that_ which is just an analogue to a human body), and I guess you can explain it as 'oh Henry made the frame' but Henry only made a basic endo, not the casing at all by that point. It's more her endless devotion, right up until she realizes 'wait I hate what's happening more than I want to participate in this story' and fucks things up on purpose. The unstable, unpredictable personality she has combined with her powerful physical capabilities _does_ make her a formidable threat, and a rather terrifying one for the characters to be in the same room as, such as the exposition thing at the end of the book, but it's just another product of Scott not being all that good at storywriting. He's great at tension-building, and that seems to translate well to the writing, but he's not great at explaining why anyone's there. Anyways, the story aside, I think the original blob, the one in TFC, and how it was changed from the novels' description to the graphic novel's depiction is worth a video, as might be the ideas of the SB Blob - which, while I still suspect to be a placeholder model, also appears to be in this state intended to unravel into the reaching tendrils we see from it; we just never do _see_ what they're wrapped around nor what happens to the pieces haphazardly sticking out of it when it does this. Also, I'm sure Baby appears on at least one variant of arcade machine in SB, but I really don't care to go through all of the models and textures for them to see. Anyways, Vanny and Vanessa taking over the role - Vanny's model is... well, you said it all yourself. I don't need to repeat that part. Anyways, the animators at SteelWool did a great job with her, making her characterized almost entirely by those movements, but there was more, too - she has more than half a dozen other animations of crawling, a sprinting variant of her skipping loop, some creepy 'moving without moving her head or arms' ones of both sprints and stalking, even a well animated little cartwheel she does sometimes. They portray her as playing this like a game, except when the gloves come off, she still would've been ruthlessly efficient, just straight-up rushing Gregory without any theatrics beyond a slight head tilt. And then, someone at SteelWool trashed that. All those animations are done, they were _in the game files,_ they just didn't get put into use, likely because someone thought the skipping was what they wanted out of the character - a prancing, childlike, skintight-suit-wearing mascot.
Circus Baby in “The Fourth Closet” is a concoction of pain, rage, and depression is a masterpiece. Baby’s skeleton built by Henry’s rage and emotions from Elizabeth Afton’s abuse from William is a huge concoction of villainy.
I think one thing FNAF6 really misses out on are character interactions. You have these 4 characters that all know each other, and fucking despise each other.. but they never interact? I would've had voice lines that you can hear echoing throughout the vents, not only would it have gave them more of a prescense but it also helps them be more of a character. You could have Molten Freddy screaming at William for abandoning them, or cursing out Baby. William would probably be disgusted at what his creations became, but proud of his daughter And that's without getting into Lefty/The Puppet. Whilst the rest of them are confused on who this guy is (Molten Freddy would probably call them a copycat whilst Baby is jealous of how new they look).. William knows. William knows exactly whose in there, and despite what his lines suggest, he's fucking terrified of them. FNAF6 is one of my favourite FBAF games, it's just a shame it's ideas weren't used to the fullest.
This made me relize something Not only are the Scrap Animatronics NEVER explained in universe why they look like that (besides Lefty) but also their personalities Lefty/Puppet-went from protector to mentally scared and sounds weak while Puppet sounds high and mighty due to his power Scraptrap- went from suffering as a possed animatronic and dying a grusome death to loving being undead ScrapBaby-went from hating being an animatronic to also loving being an animatronic since she sees it as a way of pleasing her dad Molten Freddy-went from stupid henchman to cunning leader who has gone made
Well,logically we are speaking,fnaf sl takes place closer to fnaf 1. So its almost like 30 year. Its not hard to think why they became what they are in Fnaf 6. Scrap Baby-Baby Ai became broken due to do turning into ennard and later rejected. So Elizabeths dezires and control got a hold of her. Scraptrap-We never get any hints that he is hating beign Springtrap. I think he hates the program,and this is why he is so much suffering in the first place. Once he removed it,he enjoyed beign Scraptrap. Pupet/Lefty:She is so done after this point. Like almost 50 years we are talking about. So its actually make sense why she became much more scared. She do not know how all of this will going to end. Molten Freedy-He probably forcefully absorbed the other 2. So its not hard to think why he is basically same. He did not changed much. Still the same maniac. The problem is,they never explained or showed it in the games. Or give us any hints. I mean it is abovius how they are turned out like thst. But still,established it in the games.
I found Vanny's posing to be extremely unnerving and thought that was the intention rather than just sex appeal. It's especially creepy when you think about her being possessed by Afton and then the posing is how he thinks a woman would act
If that was part of the story then I would be behind it. Alice: Madness Returns did something similar- in a different way- and it can be done if with purpose.
honestly with state of security breach it's hard to decide wether vanny poses for simps or they wanted to go arkham series way and have camera shots look like posters and comicbook panels going too far with second option? well there are literal comics as endings so it either was planned or they just had to rush some endings
i feel like in pizza sim it really should have gone in a direction where baby was trying to manipulate afton back, all of her manipulation of others coming around to her finally successfully manipulating her horrible father who got her killed in the first place. make it a whole big act over the games narrative and then when the time comes at the end, have her pull the rug on Both william and henry in the end. this could result in the same ending we got, the location being burned down with everyone inside, which just so happened to be henry's end goal as well.
I really like the idea of, what were, her learned behaviors of being in such a toxic environment spiraling into her general distrust of, seemingly, anyone and everyone; which leads her further into her manipulative tendencies because she feels she is owed that after all the pain and suffering she has been through. It's really neat stuff. Sorry, was writing about an oddly similar character to Baby and happened to bump into this video. Fantastic work!
a part of me thinks that the baby reveal in fnaf world was scott saying that they ran out of story to tell and didnt know what to do(especially after fnaf world tanked) so they put together a new story which was headed by baby, the character dying there representing his original story dying
I think it was extremely bold of them to have Baby featured so heavily in the marketing and the story of Sister Location - but realizing that her animatronic self was already a shell and out of the story. You don't truly encounter her until the VR games. Remember when one of the trailers showed her glitching and going kinda crazy? Big shame we never got to see that in game.
I honestly think Baby could’ve been a better antagonist than Burnttrap for SB. I think Baby subverting the narrative by actually killing William for revenge in SB and 1 up him by converting Vanny and Gregory, the Glamrock versions, slowly take the mantle, showing how the Afton bloodline will be doomed to repeat itself. Or Baby just trying to break the curse and finally let her and the Afton bloodline rot into memories would be so much better
The actual worst part of so many characters being shafted in favor of Afton is. Them being the major antagonists ACTUALLY paints Afton's actions in a more horrid light. Vanessa being a potential fan inspired by him, his actions directly creating Baby, and indirectly Puppet as well, it'd still show him as being the Big Bad of the series via his shit causing OTHER people to do bad things long term too.
honestly I really think the scrap baby character shift COULDVE been really cool if Scott focused on how the failure of her plan and forced removal from ennard somewhat "broke" her, leading to less manipulation and more anguished violence. not just to the player but everyone tbh (INCLUDING AFTON). really capture that "fall from grace" but in an INTENTIONAL way besides, I don't think she'd be very successful at portraying herself to be innocent like in SL with a huge claw on her hand
I know i already commented in this video, but i find myself back again in the fnaf rabbit whole and have been watching my favorite videos and well i watched this one again and felt as strongly about it once again because you really did something not much people do with circus baby which was actually speak about her being a deep character and i wanted to further on the topic of circus baby refering to Elizabeth as a third person and why i think it deepens her character although it isn't really me saying it's what happened rather why i think its that way, i personally believe that Elizabeth and circus baby are technically the same in the sense that not only is Elizabeth possessing baby, but part of the reason circus baby does what she does and feels what she feels is because of Elizabeth, circus baby has the manipulative, murderous tendencies without Elizabeth, but the isolation and desire for escape and a life of neglect and pain come from Elizabeth's physique, and how you mentioned the curious thing about her is that she is the only animatronic that does not act like an animal or a blind spirit, Cassidy is also a spirit seeking revenge, but acts more like a raged dog, and i believe Circus baby's humanity comes from Elizabeth's own trauma and personality because even if Elizabeth isn't characterized outside of circus baby and probably scott didn't intend it, i believe Elizabeth went through the feelings circus baby goes through in the underground facility in a more small escale when she was alive, Elizabeth was abused in the book by william and even if the submission to him fucking sucks i think in the game she was also abused and neglected, specially because micheal and evan were always fighting mostly micheal abusing evan that it makes since william wouldn't even put attention to Elizabeth, it is further kind of proved by the fact that he didnt keep an eye on her and brought her to the pizzeria, if he wanted her to not get close to circus baby it doesn't make since that he would even bring her and just let her roam around without looking out for her, if anything his concerns over her dying were more about how thay would look on his reputation and wallet than an actual concern over her well being, it also doesn't help that technically William just kinda sent her underground to forget about her once she died instead of idk, retreaving her corpse or something like he sends his son to find her instead of going down himself when he send her there in the first place, so it wouldn't be an understatement to assume Elizabeth was an abused child that suffered a chronical loneliness and given the violent nature of her own father and circus baby it only makes since for her to slowly resort to actual murder to acomplish her goals, adding the fact to the man she killed (but actually didn't kill) was a man she truly despised, although im curious why you claim she thought it was William, I'm not saying it isn't the case in fact it makes a lot of sense she thought it was william, but some say she always knew that it was micheal, and if she knew it was micheal i feel she would have gone through her plan anyway, there is not really much characterization of how micheal and Elizabeth were with each other, but given the fact micheal bullied evan i cant really see there being a good siblings relationship with Elizabeth either. It doesn't also help Elizabeth was the only child that died in the hands of the robot she possesed, instead of being killed by william and stuffed inside later, and Elizabeth before dying was an unwanted version of circus baby, circus baby is the personification of Elizabeth's desires to be perfect and be fixed because she feels like she isn't enough since she literally has no one and has had no one ever to count on, it makes since she doesn't care about her band mates, they aren't like her, and she doesn't have any reason to trust them. Also all the other kids have wach other while Elizabeth is literally alone I feel circus baby's creepy childish behavior can sometimes actually be part of Elizabeth, as mature as she wants to be shes technically still a child even circus baby is molded after her which is even worse, circus baby IS Elizabeth, at least the ideal version that William unconsciously planted on Elizabeth's brain, that is why i feel that Elizabeth is not passive on circus baby, i feel she makes the reason why baby is so human like, because she's a human and also it would be cool because it means that Elizabeth is smart and i stand that Elizabeth deserves more as a character than the whole "she was Williams favorite" stupid headcanon Also i agree Elizabeth never actually loved william at all and always hated or recented him, i hated they went for her being obssesed with him and submitting to him, she was like you said smart and cunning and had her motivations and personality and was a perfect opportunity for an actual villain that wasn't william, because even william isn't really a good character we are never explained why he killed kids, its only vaguely insinueaded, most of it its just fan speculation, he just is fucking insane which isn't bad in it on itself, but i think the games want to pretend william was actually a good deep villain and i think that only is so for the first three games, after that william just become hateable i don't understand the appeal of him as a character in the fandom, the man abused his children, was a shit friend to henry, murder kids and gods knows what he did to his wife if he had one with no explicit explained motivations, he doesn't even have good qualities and you can't say its because he's attractive because the only canon visual designs of his human self are in the book and well i feel i dont need to speak for that Also this might sound weird but i dont think Circus Baby is lying fully in her monologues, i think that even though she was always doing it for her inner motives, i also believe she thought she was fully doing the right thing, i think she didn't actually think what she was doing was fucked up, there are moments in the dialogues in the alternative ending where she says that she doesn't understand how could you not trust her when she really needs him to leave and that he wont die it will hurt momentarily which i think adds up to her child likeness, i think obviously she was pretending but i also believe she was suffering and desperate and was being genuine in the since that she needs to escape and she wants the player or micheal to empathize with her, to understand what she will do so they dont get mad. like a child explaining to their parents so they wont punish them later I feel when she narrates the scooping of Elizabeth she's being half genuine, i don't think she fully felt regret for murdering Elizabeth but moreso a kind of sadness because of what she is, after all she technically IS Elizabeth already so it's in a way Elizabeth narrating Also this is purely a headcanon of mine but i always felt that the reason she spoke of Elizabeth in third person was because she wanted to distance herself from Elizabeth, or from herself that is, i think she saw Elizabeth as her unperfect self and felt the need to erase who she used to be because that was not good enough and now that she was circus baby, she felt the need to distance herself from an identity that was the reason she is dead in the first place and the reason she's being isolated, abused and tortured underground, i mean killing Elizabeth its what send her there in the first place so she wouldn't be to fond in her past self Anyways i will always treasure this video deeply for speaking nothing but pure facts on why we should hire you to write fnaf and it's female characters who are always treated like shit
I have never read any of the fnaf books. But why the fuck did they redesign circus baby to look attractive? I would prefer if she was just a 7 ft 2 inch tall 583 lb robot clown. The sexy circus baby design seems something straight out of a fanfiction 💀. I love it when you quote something circus baby directly says. I can feel the anger radiating.
Baby is my favorite character in two senses. The specific character from sister location (dead Elizabeth) and the general Circus Baby animatronic character separated from that aspect. I wish we could get like… Glamrock and Rockstar versions of characters like her instead of only just the main trio. I would have killed for Glamrock Baby.
i feel like baby had so much potential especially with the idea of her as an amalgamation of a murdered child and a sentient robot that have been forced together to form something unique and tragic. her motivation was infinitely more complex than any other character in the series but then it was just simplified towards her loving afton for some reason ? it makes no sense and she became an entirely one dimensional character
Circus Baby was definitely one of the greatest villains FNAF could have continued with. She was similar to William Afton but they could have taken her to the next level. It is true when her personality was just erased since she was resentful to her father to then joining her father. I hope she becomes and gets a major role in the future. I’m not sure what FNAF is going for but if they were to continue, they should give it to Baby. The end of the William Afton Era and the beginning of new era! That would be amazing to do and I hope it does come true!
Circus baby should be vengeful when she finds her father had officialy ended and wants revenge on who has made him go bye bye and wants to carry on his legacy
Baby is genuinely a very epic villian. I do wish she could be more of her own character, though, rather than just william aftons daughter. But since the good part of the story ended in the 6th game, she wasnt able to. But i also have some disagreement. I think it could be argued that Baby in pizzaria sim has sort of "dropped the act" in that game, as she may perhaps be acting far more drastically given her new circumstance. Maybe she doesnt think manipulation is going to work as well now, so she resorts to being more aggressive. And MAYBE Afton really did tell her something really epic??? Although, because it was never stated what happened, there is no way o know what he could've possibly said. And ultimately, i wouldve preferred her to be independent from him.
William Afton: You are my true successor. Kill me, and you can take my legacy wherever you want. You are my daughter, and I am proud of you, Elizabeth Circus Baby: Elizabeth… that is my name… (regains memories)… you know… killing you isn’t fun anymore.
I think the security breach ruin dlc could fix baby's character entirely by showing that she was actually glitchtrap all along and she's the one who's been pulling the strings but she masqueraded as William Afton to shift the blame onto a dead man.
In Pizzeria Sim, I never read it as Baby being subservient to Afton. I interpreted it as her finding out her father’s legacy and wanting to follow in his footsteps. She’s impressed with his work and wants to take up the mantle
Every time The Fourth Closet is brought up, I have a thought that I, well, want to write down. There was potential in the idea of having a series of replacement goldfish where, because the system that was managing them had been in disrepair, one of them activated early and didn't receive the previous one's memories correctly. Have young adult Charlie activate before she was supposed to and teenager Charlie not deactivate, but instead of YA Charlie just being evil because "dad was angry when he was making me", have it be because the system regulating them was breaking down. Make it a reflection of how little their father cared about the consequences of his work; we've got an example of a mess he made that would have (or at least _should_ have) hit close to home for the guy if he was still alive. Instead, we get a lame exposition dump coming from a shallow villain who's mostly there to be eye candy.
12:10 if I'm remembering correctly didn't Heather (the woman voicing her) record both her SL lines and FNaF 6 lines around the same time wouldn't that mean that Baby was destined to become William worshiper
Really? I never heard about that before; that's kinda interesting. Where did this come from? Was it the Dawko "FNAF Show" interview with Heather Masters?
Removing the little chip in her arm might have something to do with her sudden character change. I truly believe that little chip was the mimic 1 program which would explain Henry feeling guilt about creating her AND her just suddenly becoming less intelligent
I'm pretty sure the reason why Scrap Baby's personality was like that was a result of her descent into madness. Elizabeth is overtaking Baby more and more, the trauma that Elizabeth's soul was possibly going through after she died along with the murderous programming of Circus Baby fighting for control eventually caused them to become one after the long period of time between Sister Location and Pizzeria Simulator. Plus, remember, when the Funtime animatronics were still Ennard, Baby and Funtime Freddy got into an argument which caused Freddy to overthrow Baby and become the leader eventually becoming Molten Freddy, so Baby being pissed about this, having to be on her own and crudely rebuild herself probably didn't help. Keep in mind, while we don't have an exact timeframe as to when Pizzeria Simulator takes place, it's implied that both games take place decades apart from each other with Sister Location heavily implying to be the 80s, so that gave Elizabeth more time to take over Baby and more time to go insane corrupting her soul. This makes Elizabeth's character even more tragic.
I left this fandom in like 2020 and came back this year bc of how much anniversary content i saw. Baby has been my favorite character since Sister Locations release and SL has always been my favorite game too. it really sucks the way they just threw a character with good ass writing to the side and ultimately “scraped” baby.
I LOVED Baby at first, she was manipulative, scheming and at first, although I had my doubts, I did started trusting her so I was genuinely surprised when she betrayed us. Also, I like the idea of her being this girl who even after being kicked out of the group is able to pick up her pieces (both figuratively and literally) and keep going with what she had in mind, I wish she was kept that way. Also as a sidenote, she being this omniscient voice that tell us what to do and how to do it while we're going around an underground facility solving puzzles and challenges for dear life and that we know is going to try and kill us in the end, gave me MAJOR GLaDOS vibes and I was all for it, imagine Baby cracking some sick sarcastic jokes at us sometimes.
I have a headcanon and theory that you might like. İt would be so good ıf they revealed that Baby and William actually "survived" the fire. I am saying "survived". Like,both actually died. And their souls gone to the afterlife.But the agony keep their remains alive. Agony of Elizabeth(the only soul other than William that wants to not burn. Even souls in Molten Freedy wants to beign burned) keep Circus Baby program active. And when fazbear inc used parts from Baby,they accidently Turned her into Glitchtrap. Meanwhile Burntrap is the Springbonnie program that possesed by Aftons agony. Remember that old fnaf 3 theory where we are not sure who was in control over Springtrap. William Or the suit? Yeah that theory. I took that theory,and modified it a bit. This also explains why Burntrap has no personality. And why has no dialoge with Vanny. And Mimic is also there for some reason. But lets face it. İts new model ruined every theories about him beign Burntrap or Baby. And ı think they will going to scrap that chracter later.
I see some similarities between what happened to Baby and what happened to Metal Sonic. Back in the early 90's, there were a few robotic Sonic doppelgangers that served as bosses, but when Metal Sonic appeared in Sonic CD, there was something about him that left an impression, as he was the one that stuck around. His boss fight left a lot to be desired though, as when you finish racing him he runs into a door and isn't seen from the rest of the game. Luckily, Metal Sonic would have a real moment to shine with Sonic Heroes. Before, he didn't have a lot of characterization to speak of, aside from being cold and lifeless. But after Sonic had beaten him so easily in Sonic CD, he seemed to be afraid of being nothing more than an interior copy. For his grand plan to prove that he was the superior hedgehog, he adopts a new form(Neo Metal Sonic), holds Eggman prisoner, and scans the data of all the playable characters(except the Chaotix) after fighting them in order to become the Metal Overlord. Of course, this plan fails, as Sonic and the gang beat him with the superpower of teamwork, leaving Metal Sonic to wonder why he can never win. After Metal Sonic's characterization in Sonic Heroes, he became more lifeless than ever. He basically went from being the potentially best rival for Sonic to being fodder for Eggman to throw at him on occasion. Kinda unfortunate after his role in Sonic Heroes, but I heard that the IDW comics did a good job at making him a good villain again, so there's that.
“New model introduced” the creators: “alright let’s make Glamrock circus baby” literally just another version of that look that was given to Vanny and the last Charlie.
I think that the reason Elizabeth warms up to William in FNAF6 is because she thought William made the new Freddy Fazbear's for her to do what she was created to do in a way showing her that he's proud of her but idk
I also think she warmed up bc sh is still a child and when your a child it can be hard to se people you trust turn bad k think in the end she was just someone who wanted to be a child again abdbe loved
15:29 As somebody named Elizabeth With parents who felt they could be as cruel as they were to me, but buy me over and buy my silence with gifts and material objects I feel called out
I dont mind the Circus Baby to Scrap Baby thing,and I didnt even notice it. Baby was desprate and was pretending beacuse she wanted to escape. Now that she escaped,she tries to make her daddy and her brother a minion to her beacuse they think she is nice. She was agressive to Mike to escape,but now that she escaped she tries to repair their bond so Mike will do this for Lizzy. It also adds to the "child that has everything" role that Elizabeth had.
Vanny could have been a new villain who was inspired by William & seeks to gain greater infamy than him or even make the legend real by becoming the real purple guy since security breach seems to be in a timeline where all the former games are just myths made up my people. Have her real name by Vanya & the name Venessa is used to hide her true identity. Gregory could have been her little brother who she tricked into getting locked inside so that she could kill him in the same way the crying child died, hence leaving glamrock Freddy unscathed, oh & have her hijacked glamrock Bonny so that he could replace the bunny suit, instead have her use him as a mech suit kinda like how Freddy & Greg team up. Maybe Bonnie wants to rid of the other animatronic out of jealousy or envy & has a “if I can’t have it no one can!” Attitude.
My best theory for the massive character change between SL and FFPS in-lore is that Baby's programming eventually broke, and the Elizabeth side got 100% control. R.I.P real Baby you were pretty cool
In fact, I think my favorite thing about Baby is that I believed for a LONG time that she was innocent, that she could not be blamed, that she was to be pitied. Whereas the more you think about it, she's such a WH*RE. I love it. (I'm talking about the whole franchise and the current game canon not just in Sister Location)
“We see her slouched over and unmoving so it’s not that creepy of an introduction.” Yeah, dude, I’m looking at a robot with no eyes that, for all I know, could he playing dead in order to unexpectedly kill me in a game built on jump scares.
Every villain in FNaF has their own kind of ways to manipulate things. With Afton granted with immortality, always coming back more powerful than ever, and Vanny... well, just look at her behavior in the game, she definitely has superpowers. And then there's Baby, Afton's daughter who was tragically killed by her father's creation, been kept in a basement for what sounds like a longass time, AND if that wasn't bad enough she had to deal with getting shocked on a daily basis if she doesn't behave. And overtime in that dark basement she learned something special, how to pretend. She used that power to get herself out. She also did the exact same thing in the books, she pretended to be Charlie only this time quite literally using the mind control disc (which is like her favorite toy to play with for very obvious reasons), she also pretended to be various characters in the Fazbear Frights series with the heart shaped pendant. Baby is the type of character you don't need to set a motive or a goal for, her backstory and personality is enough to be a terrifying villain.
Baby would have been such an interesting character if they made sister location just to show what afton really did. Sister location shows because of afton's faults. His entire family is dead. CC died, Liz died, and then Liz kills her brother Michael. She could have been an interesting misunderstood villian.
I will say that Baby’s sudden shift in loyalty isn’t too off-putting to me bc pretending to be supportive of someone you initially tried to backstab is a pretty well known two-faced tactic, but having it come about just to make Afton look cooler is kinda lame
Good stuff. I love this kind of content for FNAF. I stopped following the series quite a while ago, right around the VR days, but I’ll always prefer these types of videos that focus on discussing the quality and consistency of the story given to us instead of just the endless theorizing about the future and the many unanswered questions. Pretty good Baby impression by the way!
Omg, what? This video actually made me like--dare I say love?--Circus Baby. Everything was explained especially well in my opinion, and I feel like this content creator and this video should get more attention!
You know, the shame in FNAF the games and the fandom, especially the fandom, they throw everything on William. Why is CB/SB evil? Oh it's William who is brain washing her. Why is vanny like that? Oh it's William. Who created the bite of 83? William created the animatronics so it's William.(even though it was clear in the books Henry created the animatronics) Is William the only bad person in FNAF? Yes! Who is the reason for everything? William. Everything is William William William 😭
I like the idea of Baby not caring about the other funtimes and only used them for her benefit to escape
Like father like daughter.
@@jingerjoy6760 daaaaaaamn
In which the other Funtimes later kicked her out of Ennard because of this-
Ngl i could totally see her doing this
That's cringe. Why does she have to be completely evil?
I wish they had never tried to make William an evil mastermind who is directly responsible for every bad thing ever. If you just look at the first apperences of Springtrap, Baby, and a lot of the conceptual stuff about Vanny, this franchise could have had three distinctly scary unique villains, but because they are so desperate to tie everything together and have William personally directly responsible for everything the wound up just making him dull and inconsistent and Baby/Vanny just interchangeable henchwomen.
I wish the idea of Springtrap was still a shambling corpse, half conscious and half programing. I wish Baby was still a manipulative scheming and calculating monster. I wish Vanny had been allowed to have... any personality or screen time beyond some very barebones stuff.
My headcanon is that Glitchtrap is not William but rather Circus Baby who goes on to posses Vanessa... Not perfect but I thought it works
It'd be so cool to have a Circus Baby reveal in SB, would honestly raise my opinion of the game a bit (Although admittedly, I do like the game. It's got its issues, but the characters and atmosphere really help me look passed them. I get that not everyone likes it, which I get, but I just can't hate it.)
not gonna lie
i would work for baby if she was real
minus the scooper as i would love to stay alive ad don't get me wrong if baby wanted to use that thing on me i would allow it on the condition that i feel no pain or the least amount of pain, no pain and that's a deal
Even if you wanted him to be the center of basically everything bad in this universe, him being a mastermind is clearly not the way to do it.
He's a terrible person and the serial killer sure, but he's kind of just a regular serial killer. The better way to do it would be to have the trauma he caused me the inspiration for more villains, but not have them be subservient to him. Like, circus baby could have been her own standalone antagonist whose villainy is the result of William Afton, but she has her own plans and goals.
I the part that has always scared me the most about William Afton as a villain was not all the soul catchy stuff (which some of it is admittedly kinda cool in concept) but the idea that this guy was a complete narcissist that all it took was being booted from his franchise to make him just get into a drunken stupor and kill the innocent child of his cofounder. The most scary aspect to me was the power he had over those children. How much of a coward he had to be to abuse his kids who were helpless. He's like any abuser, an abuser that attacks the most helpless people around them and gets sick satisfaction from that.
I think the engineering child soul catching machines would fit well with Vanny who is very meticulous about her persona and doesn't commit crimes of passion but rather very calculated murders. Or better yet Baby could've been the one to make the technology because of how she was abused by William and has a desire to inflict that pain on other children.
Baby was peak angry little girl characterization. Her writing was so convincing as a vengeful, manipulative, little girl. She really did sound like a muderous animatronic mixed with a confused little girl. At first youd think its the animatronic is dangerous but no, it seems like the little girl inside has realized she is now the scary dangerous animatronic. And she can use it to get what she wants, freedom and revenge.
Your right that was revenge was going to be on William Afton until fnaf 6 the books came in and ruined everything saying now Elizbeath wants to make her father proud why can't they just keep the universe separated like Elizbeath from the fourth closet wants to help her father and make him proud. While the other one wants to brutally kill her father and make him pay for everything, he's done to her tossing her to the side like garbage in the original sister location there was no sign of Elizbeath wanted to make William proud after being killed no she wanted to leave the underground faculty and get her blood thirsty revenge against William like the other animatronics do also its even know Circus Baby not stupid.
One thing i always felt is that Ballora should've had more screentime, as it's kinda implaed that she has some type of rivality with Baby, as she is the only one who doesn't help with the escape plan, and how Baby seems to not like her, even more than the others
Omg ballora deserved so much better wish we got to see a scarp version of her or something in fnaf 6
I think Ballora was against the plan entirely and against hurting anyone but Baby forced her to be scrapped to force her to leave with them. She needed Ballora. That might explain why Baby hates her so much.
Imagine if after a while they kicked out lizzie ballora kicked herself out as well-
Me and a friend actually had an idea of how to improve security breach by having ballora in it
Basically a broken down version of her would be with Gregory in the alleyway, just outside the pizza plex, and after teaching you the movement with some trash cans with flashlights taped onto them to avoid staff bots, you would hear something loud coming, and ballora would tell Gregory to run away, but Gregory being the child, hides inside a dumpster nearby, Monty then comes out and asks ballora who she was talking to. When ballora refuses to admit Monty would smash ballora to disrepair, after monty leaves Gregory would run to the remains and hear the last couple of words along the lines of "I know where your friend is, search for Freddy he can help you find your friend" or something and then shut down, Gregory would then enter the pizza plex through the loading bay and then have to run from some staff bots and Vanessa who will say something of "I'm just trying to help you" before you run to a charging station and black out then reawake find your way to the stage and crawl inside the shut down Freddy which leads to the start of the game
Having Ballora have something against Circus Baby could be amazing to have!
Baby could've, and really should've stayed as her own character, with no retcons or changed motives. Had Sister Location been the last we had seen of her, I believe that Baby would have felt much better as a character and her motives would be fulfilled, now living a new life as Ennard. Since she continued on into Pizzeria Sim, she should have stuck as Ennard with none of the Molten Freddy silliness, making the ending to SL more meaningful as her goal has been completed and she still can continue on with the rest of her plans. There should have just been someone else to fill in the role of Afton follower, maybe not Vanny as she didn't come in until later, but someone else as a placeholder for Vanny or someone Vanny kills as she wants to take the mantle as Afton's main follower. Definitely wasn't worth ruining Baby's character over, should've come up with something else
There was no retcons with baby
Sometimes if feels like i´m the only one who really digs the idea of Ennard
See like Baby shouldn’t have been turned into “daddy’s girl 😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😈😈😈😈😈😈.” She could have been still resentful. My rewrite would make her a semi-good guy like the MCI kids. Same motives, just different targets. Circus Baby is honestly a really good character and with Scrap Baby’s design would have been perfect imo.
@@skeletor4436 Her entire personality was retconned.
Oh fuck off. I can't stand people coming up on a sole creator of the thing they supposedly enjoy and going "you've ruined this thing that completely came fro your mind! You should do it by MY wishes!"
You all are treating it like Baby is some existing tragic character that was mistreated by the people adapting it, not a thing that was created by Scott in its entirety.
I think this is the reason of why i love *I Can't Fix You Remix*
The version of Baby in the song depics her as someone who lost all the respect and admiration she once had for her father, Showing all the pain he caused, And she literally ripped one of his arms off, I wish we got that type of Baby in Pizzeria Simulator
What time is that at when baby rips of aftons arm
Instead we got the “we can do it together, daddy.” Baby. Completely disgraced
@@morganthematerialgirl6226 It's in the last verse on the Cg5 remix of *I Can't Fix You*
Thats how shes potrayed in Fourth Closet to an extent
@@corey4370 Harley Quinn but in reverse (and it´s not just because she´s a clown)
The thing that bugs me about the whole Pizza Simulator thing is that Baby's plan could have just as easily been to lure her father into the pizza complex and punish him for what he's done to her- and then be cut off by Henry, or have Baby and Henry be reluctant allies who've been working together all along, or have them have been allied but Baby was unaware that Henry's final plan was to burn her along with everything else.
I think her still wanting to make her dad proud showed that she was still a child an just wanted to be loved by her father still as a kid it's hard to see that ppl u look up to are bad sometimes
@@soupshee Given how manipulative she was toward someone she thought was William in SL, her original characterization probably lost any fondness she might have once had for him before her tragic rewrite.
@@syweb2You know, while the other Funtimes thought he was William, it’s possible that Elizabeth herself recognized him as Micheal. I mean, he’s family so she’d be more inclined to recognize him than the others.
It would explain why she killed Mike but still loved William.
@@zamzamhassan2985 Alternatively, SL Baby could be controlled more by Circus Baby's original programming, while Scrap Baby is controlled more by Elizabeth.
@@syweb2 That also makes sense.
Thank you for telling the truth about Vanny's outfit. I said it once and I'll say it again, Vanny is far too sexualised to be scary. She just swishes her hips and hops about like the Cadbury carmel bunny and it's not scary at all. They could of made her scary by putting her in a massive mascot suit like one you see at football games. Something bulky, covered in dried blood, big and looming inside of bunny Harley Quinn.
@@PopGoesMyBall I am a woman, mate
@@PopGoesMyBall you got wooshed
Vanny is designed for fangirls to cosplay and obsess over. Man, if they put this out back when tumblr was at its peak, it would've been huge.
Even the animators at SteelWool did well with Vanny's model when it comes to the creepier movements, but those were simply never added. And I do wonder if that's why.
@@ultmateragnarok8376 Game was rushed, and Vanny was already bugged.
Hear me out.
Before being possessed by Elizabeth, Baby was already a malicious and intelligent AI, this is probably who wants revenge on William and resents their treatment by the company.
Elizabeth the star child probably doesn't understand why what happened happened and loves her dad.
This would explain Baby talking about Elizabeth as a separate entity, when she leaves Ennard and builds herself a body from scrap she might not have that complex circuitry and is now mostly Elizabeth allowing the roles to reverse.
Fnaf 1 animatronics have set movement patterns and are piloted by ghosts, but unlike all previous animatronics Baby would have had thoughts, experience and memories pre possession.
Leaving an AI vs ghost situation, like it is the first instance of something like G. Freddy fighting back against Burntrap.
Edit: Only grammar, I lost the heart because I edited for grammar 😅
I completely agree
@@PopGoesMyBall ☺️
I also agree
@@PokeX14 Yay, validation 😂
Ty ty.
and fnaf 2 is a prequel thank you for watch
I think Baby's need to make William proud makes sense for her since she's possessed by Elizabeth, so maybe that side of her personality is Elizabeth taking over and wanting to do anything to earn her father's respect. And the other part of Baby is her A.I. which was specifically designed to kill. I think that Idea of Baby (and maybe the rest of the Funtimes) being this confused entity made up off multiple personalities (A.I. versus human spirt) is a really cool concept that sadly hasn't been fully realized in a game or book yet. But I hope Baby will return as the main villain in a future book or game and those aspects of her character can be explored more.
Baby is shown as having one personality and mind though, not multiple, same with rest of the funtimes
@@PopGoesMyBall I was referring to Elizabeth vs the AI programming. Even though the spirits in the animatronics are able to act independently from their animatronic bodies to an extent, it’s heavily implied in all of the games that the animatronics AI can (at times) interfere with the intentions of the spirit possessing them. For instance, Springtrap in fnaf 3 is possessed by William and his main goal is to kill the night guard, Michael, but the springlock suits are programmed to turn and walk to sounds. That’s why he is “tricked” by the Balloon Boy audio in fnaf 3, it’s not that William is that dumb and can’t understand that that isn’t really the sound of a child right next to him, but it’s the AI of the Springlock suit that’s preventing him from killing you. There are also examples of this in Security Breach, even though Chica is being possessed by Glitchtrap she will frequently ignore Gregory to look for food because her personality chip is said to be malfunctioning. I think it would be interesting for future games to expand on the idea of AI vs human consciousness because even though there are hints of these themes across various books and games, it’s still mostly up to interpretation if these themes are even relevant to the story or if they are only there as a way to explain the game’s mechanics in the plot.
@@ivebenhere1843 well yeah the spirots are still restricted by the bodies they inhabit. Also i wouldnt say Glamrock Chica is possesed, but that shes "infected"
@@PopGoesMyBall yeah I know. I just brought up the A.I. stuff in my original comment as a possible way to explain Baby's weird character shift from sl to pizza sim. I could easily be wrong, I just want future books or games to explore her character more, maybe somehow explain why she was ejected from Ennard in a short story instead of a few lines of dialog between Baby and Ennard on Scott's websites.
@@ivebenhere1843 I agree! I really love Babys character (and ennards too)
Honestly if they kept the old personality.
Would’ve been hilarious to potentially hear in the vents Baby arguing with Afton and the two of them not getting anywhere.
Imagine if it was a gameplay mechanic where if you lure two animatronics to the same room they start arguing or something and you get some lore dumps for the story
@@garlicamvs6235 ORVILLE!!!! IM NOT GETTING YOU ANY MORE BREAD!!!
She would prob kill her dad for getting her stuck, she’s aware of the real world outside the pizzeria in her voice lines, she wants to be free
@@neneenenejrkerre1828
Mr. Hippo: Orville, you need an intervention.
what if she fakes being subservient to afton to try to get him killed
Since Baby is the Golden Child abuse victim of her narcissist father, I do think it makes sense that she would go and try to make her father proud. Though considering the Funtimes used Micheal as a skinsuit under the assumption he was William (either figuring out later he wasn't or not, and whether by just visuals or due to being under a manipulative stance made from lies by Elizabeth and Baby not caring due to her own abusive development and programming giving her similar traits to William), I also see and understand that at least in some part Baby is mad about her own dad essentially killing her, or conversely about her brother killing her other brother, or both. But due to her unhealthy attachment to William she cannot truly let go of him after being in such squalor and left as scrap and garbage alongside her compromised and broken mental state. If she were somehow reprogrammed or got therapy perhaps she could have at least not become a full monster, but obviously since she is basically a public eyesore or seen as a toy (much like she saw Baby before death, as any kid would reasonably think) throughout the unfortunate majority of her existence, and is not even slightly approachable by the time she is part of Ennard or as Scrap Baby in either body or mind, there would be no way of saving her.
I don't know about William being abusive in the games. Henry strikes me far more of an abusive father/figure from his background details and how depressed Charlie truly is in PS in comparison to Molten Freddy and Baby. In fact, SL only happened because William couldn't override Henry's influence (the control shocks) on the SL. It's madly suspicious that the SL funtime animatronics are finalized with MCI souls AFTER William is canonically given the boot for the MCI. William couldn't have done this. He could've stored their remnant during the MCI event, but that story was given to the man that cared for the MCI children, not the killer...
The biggest issue for me with peepaw and baby’s dynamic in the books is that Peepaw just doesn’t do anything to justify how much devotion Baby has for her. He doesn’t pray on her insecurities, doesn’t even do the barest of minimums to act decent with her, hell he barely interacts with her in the books other than to order her to do things and then being a dick. The only justification that baby has for working with peepaw is that he just isn’t Henry (which admittedly says more about book henry than it does about peepaw). And you might come to the conclusion that maybe peepaw tampered with her programming but admittedly we know from the fourth closet’s ending and also SB that he’s kinda shit at getting robots to obey him (peepaw, stuffing your kidneys inside of a robot is not an effective way to control your creations. Your just wasting perfectly good kidneys at that point). Tldr: Book baby suffers the most from being tied to peepaw causing his narrative weightlessness to rub off on her bringing down the whole story >~
It's probably becuase william is her dad 🗿 you're overthinking it
Baby should never have been hinted to be or have aspirations to be an antagonist past just escaping the Rental facility in Sister Location.
She shouldn't have been malicious past lashing out at Afton Robotics and Fazbear Entertainment.
She should have, if anything, been a tragic character.
Elizabeth was just a little girl who wanted to play with robot who was designed for her by her father, and then left to waste away in an underground facility, having to deal with electric shocks for years.
She shouldn't be idolizing her father. She should be resenting him.
Then she scooped out her own brother, Michael seems to believe she thought he was William rather than himself and she was willing to scoop him then. What I think should have happened while she and the others were lurking in the sewers is that she realizes that was Michael instead of William. . The point was gonna be that she would be distraught but then again, Michael bullied their other brother so maybe Elizabeth would resent him too.
Maybe they keep roaming around, hiding in the shadows, find a kid, try to entertain, but the Funtime's programming forces them to kill the child because William wanted murder drones, and then they become absolutely distraught. All of them, really, and then they come to resent William Afton even more now and go to FFPP to kill William.
ooooo youre making me wanna write a fix-it fic so bad where this is canon
What if in Pizza Sim, at some point in the game after salvaging scrap Baby and Scraptrap, she shreds him and sets him on fire in front of you, which is what gives Henry the idea to burn the rest in the first place? Idk sounds like a fitting revenge
I’ve been kind of annoyed by the fact that her entire character is basically obsessed with making her obviously psychopathic father proud of her. It’s in almost all the fanmade Alternate universes and everything too. Why can’t she have a different purpose?
Well, how can we know that she has a personality of her own tho? WHAT makes us think that she was different than the others? For all we know, it can be that Elizabeth is in disguise trying to sound as poor and mishandled animatronic with its own AI. Why would Elizabeth soul go full “Yeah, this animatronic uses me, I won’t control it, it’s fine.”
Thank You for making a video about Lizzy, she's such an underrated villain. I honestly believe it would've been better if Glitchtrap turned out to be Elizabeth, the plottwist would hit so hard, seeing her pretending as a virus. Without bringing back William, it would fix "making her father proud", and then dying immediatly, she would come back, as all Aftons do.
Also I love the way You mimic Baby's voice, it's funny.
Thank you. XD
Yeah but like... imagine the reveal that Glitchtrap is _Elizabeth._ That'd be such a _"wtf?"_ moment XD
While I don't mind the idea of Elizabeth coming back as the Glitch instead of William (I also think she is such an underrated villain), I think it would be better to just make her a Glitchbaby so people are prepared for what they are getting and not baiting them into thinking it's William only to reveal it's not, because trust me, Liz being freed in 6 would be the last thing people would be getting upset about, there are a lot of William fans who would get pissed off lol
We still do have the theory that Elizabeth is behind fanzbear entertainment so in theory she could still be the big bad that is left to be revealed(ps, I also think elizabeth is a super underrated vilain)
@@theftking oh shit it’s that weird dog thing
this video better explained the parallels between elizabeth and vanessa than any theory video claiming that they're literally the same person.
Thank you!
I prefer to believe "Scrap Baby" is actually Elizabeth possessing Baby's body and voice box, while the original Baby A.I. remains with Molten Freddy. Like she couldn't possess the animatronic like others because of the A.I. in the way, but with the chip gone it was free real state.
It even makes the last message in Pizzaria Simulator make more sence. Maybe the one telling Michel Afton "you can't die" was Elizabeth as well? And both then became Scrap Baby while the barf became Molten F. ?
I really wish they would've just focused on how terrifying a 500 pound, 7 foot tall, possessed clown robot is 😭
Change the word “robot” to “woman” and you’re describing my dream
I couldn’t help but notice that you mentioned Circus Baby’s voice changed and you suggested it was just Scott trying to initially conceptualize Circus Baby but I’m Dawko’s FNaF show Heather Masters (Circus Baby’s Voice Actor) said that Scott completely changed Circus Baby’s voice and that she didn’t know why Scott changed how Circus Baby spoke. My theory is that Scott initially wanted Baby to feel more robotic and as time passed she began to feel more and more sentient.
And to think that there was so much potential to explore what happened to Baby after SL… Like how did she rebuild herself, did she try to have like this local cryptid sort of lifestyle, did she still want to be able to live among humans, etc. There could’ve been some really great opportunities for character development, but I guess this is what happens when you try to overachieve stuff instead of stopping from milking the Afton plotline and try new things with the series.
Man, fnaf was much more interesting when the ourple guy wasn’t so… uh, the center of everything? It was all so much cooler and mysterious when all we knew was that he worked at Freddy’s and liked to kill kiddies.
And then the merging of the books storyline with the games to, for some reason, appease to a larger audience?? I really don’t understand why Scott decided to merge the two during FFPS, it’s not like these are comics where the source material has to change to reflect the movies.
I guess we’ll never know what goes on through animdude’s mind unless he releases a universe Bible in five years or something.
I really enjoyed the expansion to the earlier Baby video! Your stuff is super informative and well thought out, though I guess that’s to be expected XD. Thanks for making this video, keep going cause your channel is starting to pick up. In less than a day you’ve gone from 9k subs to almost 10, so I’m really excited to see what you do next! Have a nice day, Mable😊!
Scrap Baby is has much more potential than Normal one. Think about it. Normal Baby is manuplative liar dusgised as a kid Friendly robot. Like how blue printz shows it. Scrap Baby is like What she actually is. No charm, no manuplation, no lies. Just her True colors. And that could be really scary If its done right. A game centered around her and Molten Freedy probably be more scrary. Playing as a random person in first 5. And later Playing as Mike in the 6 one.
Idk, I mean your remark about how scrap baby no longer tries to manipulate you (What made baby a very refreshing villain to FNAF) just makes her another evil animatronic that wants to kill you just cuz. And that to me is quite lame because it really takes away her original uniqueness that she had in sister location
Agreed. And that’s what I like about Scrap Baby
I remember being hyped to play Sister Location because Baby's design was the eeriest so far to me, then the game released and she had less screentime than even Vanny did in Security Breach
At least she had more voice lines. ;)
@@notrealnamenotatall2476 Ahh, now THAT is certainly true
None of them really had any screen time. Most of them time you can't even see them
She didn’t even have a jumpscare too
Well, she didn't have much screentime, but she had a lot of PRESENCE.
To be honest the tittle of “FNAF’s under-use/misused…” fits well for pretty much every character in the series with the exception of Willy (unless you count overused as misused).
To be fair most of my complains are result of how the story of FNAF was told to us, as in the cryptic details that gave birth to to massive theory community that surrounds the series. Something that I must admit is why I’m into FNAF, so I can’t say it’s bad, if anything I think is why the franchise is so big on the internet.
Tangent aside and going back to what I was saying, yes putting together the fragmented story is very interesting. However as a medium for storytelling, specially when it comes to characters and their portrait is quite of the worst.
Think about it, we barely know anything about the Afton’s besides what’s related to Willy, neither Elizabeth or Evan (crying child) had much in characterisation besides what we can asume base on their behaviour. The worst is probably Michael. He’s the protagonist of almost every game, the man had his insides pull out and wonder the earth for decades as a walking corpse trying to stop the nightmares his father stared… and we barely know anything about him.
And let’s not forget about the side characters:
Henry lost his daughter, discovered her soul was inside a robot he made to protect her, discover she was a “shepherd of souls”, had to design a machine to capture her because unlike the other 3 at Pizza simulator he couldn’t guarantee she would come to the trap, discovered his businesses partner was a serial killer, either had to serve time in prison for William’s actions or became a hermit for decades after what happened to Charlie (there has to be a reason as to why he disappeared for 40 odd years). And yet he barely has any development, even during his powerful speech at the end of Pizzeria simulator he sort of feels hollow, like, after all that you’ll think the man would be, IDK more interesting to talk about rather than a mystery.
And the same goes for Charlie and the 5 Children, we barely know anything about them, heck a few years back we didn’t even knew the names of the 5! And of the 5, 3 are still missing a face (we only know what Sussie and Cassidy look like, and Cassidy barely counts). Think about it, 6 kids that spend over 40 years hunting robots, who would be between 40 to 60 by the events of Pizzeria simulator, and we barely know anything about them, or what they did for those years.
What I’m trying to say is that, my main problem with FNAF, is that it has so much potential in its characters, every single one of them is a gold mine, what they think or feel, how they change, everything about them has SO much potential… yet most of it is wasted, lost and unable to be explored because of how FNAF story is told.
Wow! Could not have said it better myself. Seriously, when I first got into the franchise(around SL, Pizza Sim) the theories were cool and all but now I am just Dissapointed, and getting tired of it. Because Fnaf is a goldmine of potential which is never used/explored.
I didn't realize baby was _7ft tall_ , absolutely horrifying
I always liked the idea of baby turning into a villain who was the successor to William, being the calculating, manipulative monster he used to be but better while still resenting him for everything he’s done
I've always liked the idea that Elizabeth was just as malevolant as her father, though you have brought up a great point about how the games made her subserviant to William. Honestly, they didn't even really need to bring William back, they could have just had Elizabeth/Baby and/or Vanny acting as copycat killers and it would have worked just as well, if not better.
I wish there could be some content in between Sister Location and Pizzeria Sim.
Same.
I kinda blame the scooping of Michael Afton for this, because after that point there was kind of a ticking clock where there wasn't before, because elsewise we could've perhaps squeezed a game or two in to continue the themes and story.
@@notrealnamenotatall2476 I thought that maybe Baby seeing her father again changed her, until I remembered that he tormented her for years in a dark bunker. It just doesn't make sense to me.
It genuinely sucks to see that Elizabeth/Baby didn’t live up to her full potential as a character. Personally, I think it would be interesting to see Baby feeling bad at the sight of Vanessa/Vanny replacing Elizabeth and her wanting to destroy Afton for it. Super awesome video.
Yeah, every new reveal of this just makes me worry more and more that this franchise has become all about glorifying the character who murdered children...
Bro he gets set on fire in pretty much every game he's in 💀 ☠️
Honestly in retrospect, the concept of an AI robot that was built and programmed with the sole purpose of tricking and killing children wanting to break from their directive code is an interesting idea if Scott wanted to delve more into the sci-fi elements of Fnaf.
Unfortunately I think Scott couldn’t help himself from adding the whole Elizabeth possessing Baby aspect of the story, and I agree that the sudden change of Baby’s character in Pizzeria simulator is really disappointing to some
there's another thing to say about the transition from fnaf style robots to sister location robots- the color palettes. they're warm, with browns and reds and yellows. when you look at sister location though, there's a stark usage of cold colors always, blue and purple everywhere. it's really interesting!
edit: i just finished the video, this was very interesting. the LOOOREE of the games leaves little room for storytelling, i think, but this was actually a great deep dive. fun watch!
I think that Elizabeth and Baby are like two separate consciences that merged together more by the end of Sister Location. When you think about it like that, it makes sense as to why she can play the innocent so easily, and why she finds it easy to kidnap and kill Michael because she’s programmed to be a killer robot. And besides, I don’t think she started to mistakenly believe that Michael was William until after the fourth night, because then after that point she becomes a part of him since that’s what she believes “William” wants in a way, to be with her again. So basically, she denies that scooping him will be so much of a bad thing. She mimics Elizabeth’s voice because she can, but also because the two consciences are slowly becoming one in this moment, and thus we see that Elizabeth still loves her father, saying she knows it was just an accident and that everything is okay. So it makes perfect sense as to why she follows in her father’s desires in Pizza Sim, because now that she’s free but lost and without purpose, she can find fulfillment by doing his bidding, so to speak. She believes that she’s failed him all these years and can finally do him proud. And let’s not forget, children are very naive. Baby may be smart, but now that Elizabeth is fully a part of her, she can’t understand that what she is doing is wrong, especially since killing is literally in the machine’s programming. It’s like a natural born instinct for her now. And hey, at least she was still smart enough to finally realize long before Pizza Sim that Michael was never actually William.
So yeah, I don’t really think she was ruined during Pizza Sim. As for the rest afterwards, ughhhhh that’s a different story…
Its more like, during Sister Location they WERE merged but after mike "put her back together" the elizabeth part of her took most of the control.
I honestly think Springtrap/Scraptrap is something simliar, but William Afton is ironcally the weaker will of the two. Sptringtrap is possessed prior to the events of fnaf3 according to the reports from (prior fnaf2) Phone Guy. I think the second soul is Sammy Emily. The son we've heard about in Midnight Motorist and seen as the blue-shirted boy in "Save Him". The second soul especially seems the most gleeful about a tragic father-and-son meeting, "Bittersweet, but fitting." It also makes sense with Shadow Bonnie's appearance in fnaf2 being aligned with the mention of a used YELLOW suit.
I wouldn't mind the "daddy's girl" shitck so much if they did something cool with it, like her taking her father's place as the main villain. Like imagine if instead of having Burntrap, we got Burn Baby who's manipulating her father's established legacy to get what she wants
That sounds even worse 😭 this is why fanbases should never write for official works 💀
Sounds cool to me.
I wanna read a fanfic of that.
Interestingly the fact she thought Micheal was her father makes me think that contrary to popular belief she might not actually be as loyal to her father as many theorists think. Her change in personality change could also be that when she found out her father was still alive she kicked into manipulation mode and wanted to manipulate him to her own ends at least until he was no longer the one in charge. It's just my own theory but if it's true it could mean she is actually worse than old will.
12:48 now that I think about it shouldn't Afton had been the one to do the monologue instead of Baby (then maybe she can still act like she worships William but have her kill lines imply it was just to fool you into letting her in)
Actually, yeah. I'm not sure why it was Baby. O.o
@@notrealnamenotatall2476 yeah FNAF 6 was supposed to be Williams final horrah. You’d except a badass villain speech from him before Henry shows up
@@marcsuraci7759 I don't care how much people self obsess. Afton will never be bad ass
One thing that impressed me especially about Circus baby was her character design in Sister Location. What I love about it is that Baby is as big as the Animatronics of the first Fnaf game. And to top it off, she has the newer sleek look of the animatronics of fnaf 2 and security breach. What made the animatronics from Fnaf 1 so terrifying in my opinion is how well in my opinion that Scott Cawthon managed to replicate the same fear factor that the animatronics of the banana splits, where in the eyes of a child Baby looks amazing and fun but in the eyes of everyone else, there’s something off about them. Plus, I agree, She was a fantastic villain and just what the series needed and it’s a shame that the Scott Cawthon didn’t seem to realize just how much potential she had as a character in his universe.
Honestly, circus baby and Elizabeth’s plot could’ve been extremely interesting to the plot. I haven’t read the books yet so I’m going off the games but with the mix of Elizabeth’s innocence of being a child and circus baby’s manipulative personality, becoming one, I think it could’ve been an interesting identity crisis like thing. Like, she’s not sure whether she should go off her programming or continue being the innocent little girl she once was. She’s confused on who she is and this could cause her to act the way she does in the games. They could’ve probably explored into something like that but nope, they just went bye bye baby.
baby is my favorite fnaf character
she's manipulative but also brings, in some moments, a sense of being safe, her voice is... sexy, yeah. (scott wtf you were thinking???), but i feel like it's more soft and comforting, as she gains your trust more and more to kill you in the end with the scooper, like she was made to do: act like a safe animatronic for the kids and then kidnapping the children
Something I find interesting about Baby, when it comes to why she is.. well, why she's like that, is her lines during both endings. Specifically, the "I've been out before. But they always put us back inside." and its counterpart line from the Private Room of "We won't be allowed to try again if they find us like this.". This shows that most workers _don't_ know how intelligent she is. Most of them see her as a machine - a dangerous machine, since she's huge, heavy, and 'programmed' to move about in response to the room, but a mere machine, albeit creepy. Most of them, if not all of them, believe that. And if the workers come back the next day, and find Ennard, then they'll make sure it doesn't happen again - hence why Ennard is willing to follow Michael home even without their disguise. They were desperate, enough to risk the outside world catching them, to get out.
Also, scrolling through the chapter list after watching half the video and just seeing 'That's a BIG Baby!' was very sudden and hilarious, thank you.
The plushie thing in UCN is neat and all, and yes the idea that you have to either pay her or buy her gifts to avoid her trying to kill you is fairly fitting, but the truth of that mechanic is that it mainly exists just to serve as a fazcoin drain - you have to use them on that rather than on other things, meaning you have to spend time collecting them rather than directly defending yourself against everyone else, and so forth. Still, it _could_ be worked in, particularly given the other characters on that list are Nightmare ones (who, funnily enough, would be stored in Afton Robotics alongside the Funtimes - although Nightmare Mangle doesn't exist down there, despite being a pretty fair combination of characters to make into an intentionally terrifying one), who already have a thing with plushies nullifying their effects or at least delaying them.
I do like the idea you proposed, but UCN as a sort of finale joke game focused more on making everyone add something but still be rather beatable (he missed quite a few characters and most of them that were included have _no_ nuance to their mechanics and often only a bit of resemblance to their original forms) just doesn't have that. A remaster of it, where everyone has unique and either complex or dangerous mechanics, would be great! Albeit also even harder than the original, but that _was_ the idea.
Baby in Help Wanted is the sort of thing that makes me think the game was going to be more. The walk cycle is wonderfully in-character for the animatronic she's in (whoever was in charge of those is a master at characterization, right down to the Withered animatronics having accurate limps and so forth), her gameplay is unique and scary, and her model is pretty good compared to a lot of what's in the game, although the Funtimes in HW are kind of sharp-looking when it comes to their polygon counts, but it passes for her - some of the others, perhaps less so. Her endo looks weird in it, if I remember correctly, but you only ever see that if you fail. I _think_ the plush babies were meant to be Bidybabs originally, as those do exist in the files as a rigged model (and can show up in the Baby level, as an easter egg), which might've fit better but I imagine they would attack regardless when they outnumber you four-to-one in an enclosed space... unless they retain their fear of Baby, and only can resist it when she's visible to them, gradually losing control to their hostile programming when she's not.
Still, a little disappointing for Funtime Freddy to have the normal Nightmares' mechanics, although admittedly it too is in-character, what with him playing along with the game while he taunts the player from down the halls. The addition of the rabbits is a good one there to spice up the otherwise unchanged gameplay (save for the lack of a bed mechanic as well, I believe). Anyways I probably should stop going on and on about Help Wanted whenever I get the chance, but I don't exactly make good progress on that or on the expansion to it I eventually want to have a go at making.
The take on 'Baby' in TFC is something I _could_ understand. She does retain that wish to blend in as a human, even if her motives are changed here - but the games did that _because_ the books established her character as such. And Baby before Elizabeth is a different story, sure, as is the possession (though I can accept it being something of a 'she ends up like that anyways but the situation here doesn't stay the same' situation, and her story isn't all too nonsensical, just a bit earlier in the franchise's development in-lore), where she specifically may be sentient and have memories, but she didn't understand human concepts at all, particularly her own emotions-which-were-not-hers, until Lizzie joins in and they meld together as one. Or, rather, the two partial souls, one entire soul, and an AI that are all bouncing around in there, not to mention the fragments of the five other children who also might've been used to bring her to 'life' before Lizzie, ah, stepped in. And Lizzie in TFC _is_ tragic, in the parts she's shown. She's abused, she's lacking love, she's outcast because of what she does for her father's attention, much less affection, and it leads her to get in too deep and make a final mistake. But what they did with her... well, the body is one thing (I could see William making some fucked-up looking thing that attempts to be sexy, like, y'know, Ballora, but not _that_ which is just an analogue to a human body), and I guess you can explain it as 'oh Henry made the frame' but Henry only made a basic endo, not the casing at all by that point. It's more her endless devotion, right up until she realizes 'wait I hate what's happening more than I want to participate in this story' and fucks things up on purpose. The unstable, unpredictable personality she has combined with her powerful physical capabilities _does_ make her a formidable threat, and a rather terrifying one for the characters to be in the same room as, such as the exposition thing at the end of the book, but it's just another product of Scott not being all that good at storywriting. He's great at tension-building, and that seems to translate well to the writing, but he's not great at explaining why anyone's there.
Anyways, the story aside, I think the original blob, the one in TFC, and how it was changed from the novels' description to the graphic novel's depiction is worth a video, as might be the ideas of the SB Blob - which, while I still suspect to be a placeholder model, also appears to be in this state intended to unravel into the reaching tendrils we see from it; we just never do _see_ what they're wrapped around nor what happens to the pieces haphazardly sticking out of it when it does this.
Also, I'm sure Baby appears on at least one variant of arcade machine in SB, but I really don't care to go through all of the models and textures for them to see.
Anyways, Vanny and Vanessa taking over the role - Vanny's model is... well, you said it all yourself. I don't need to repeat that part. Anyways, the animators at SteelWool did a great job with her, making her characterized almost entirely by those movements, but there was more, too - she has more than half a dozen other animations of crawling, a sprinting variant of her skipping loop, some creepy 'moving without moving her head or arms' ones of both sprints and stalking, even a well animated little cartwheel she does sometimes. They portray her as playing this like a game, except when the gloves come off, she still would've been ruthlessly efficient, just straight-up rushing Gregory without any theatrics beyond a slight head tilt. And then, someone at SteelWool trashed that. All those animations are done, they were _in the game files,_ they just didn't get put into use, likely because someone thought the skipping was what they wanted out of the character - a prancing, childlike, skintight-suit-wearing mascot.
Circus Baby in “The Fourth Closet” is a concoction of pain, rage, and depression is a masterpiece. Baby’s skeleton built by Henry’s rage and emotions from Elizabeth Afton’s abuse from William is a huge concoction of villainy.
I loved Baby because she had very personal goals and motivations. She was an absolute power player
Fun fact: Baby has been in every main series game since her debut
I think one thing FNAF6 really misses out on are character interactions.
You have these 4 characters that all know each other, and fucking despise each other.. but they never interact? I would've had voice lines that you can hear echoing throughout the vents, not only would it have gave them more of a prescense but it also helps them be more of a character.
You could have Molten Freddy screaming at William for abandoning them, or cursing out Baby. William would probably be disgusted at what his creations became, but proud of his daughter
And that's without getting into Lefty/The Puppet. Whilst the rest of them are confused on who this guy is (Molten Freddy would probably call them a copycat whilst Baby is jealous of how new they look).. William knows. William knows exactly whose in there, and despite what his lines suggest, he's fucking terrified of them.
FNAF6 is one of my favourite FBAF games, it's just a shame it's ideas weren't used to the fullest.
This made me relize something
Not only are the Scrap Animatronics NEVER explained in universe why they look like that (besides Lefty) but also their personalities
Lefty/Puppet-went from protector to mentally scared and sounds weak while Puppet sounds high and mighty due to his power
Scraptrap- went from suffering as a possed animatronic and dying a grusome death to loving being undead
ScrapBaby-went from hating being an animatronic to also loving being an animatronic since she sees it as a way of pleasing her dad
Molten Freddy-went from stupid henchman to cunning leader who has gone made
Well,logically we are speaking,fnaf sl takes place closer to fnaf 1. So its almost like 30 year. Its not hard to think why they became what they are in Fnaf 6.
Scrap Baby-Baby Ai became broken due to do turning into ennard and later rejected. So Elizabeths dezires and control got a hold of her.
Scraptrap-We never get any hints that he is hating beign Springtrap. I think he hates the program,and this is why he is so much suffering in the first place. Once he removed it,he enjoyed beign Scraptrap.
Pupet/Lefty:She is so done after this point. Like almost 50 years we are talking about. So its actually make sense why she became much more scared. She do not know how all of this will going to end.
Molten Freedy-He probably forcefully absorbed the other 2. So its not hard to think why he is basically same. He did not changed much. Still the same maniac.
The problem is,they never explained or showed it in the games. Or give us any hints. I mean it is abovius how they are turned out like thst. But still,established it in the games.
@@Vilgax00 I still love the Scrap animatronics but my only problem is that they are never explained why they look and act like that
I found Vanny's posing to be extremely unnerving and thought that was the intention rather than just sex appeal. It's especially creepy when you think about her being possessed by Afton and then the posing is how he thinks a woman would act
If that was part of the story then I would be behind it. Alice: Madness Returns did something similar- in a different way- and it can be done if with purpose.
honestly with state of security breach it's hard to decide wether vanny poses for simps
or they wanted to go arkham series way and have camera shots look like posters and comicbook panels
going too far with second option? well there are literal comics as endings so it either was planned or they just had to rush some endings
i feel like in pizza sim it really should have gone in a direction where baby was trying to manipulate afton back, all of her manipulation of others coming around to her finally successfully manipulating her horrible father who got her killed in the first place. make it a whole big act over the games narrative and then when the time comes at the end, have her pull the rug on Both william and henry in the end. this could result in the same ending we got, the location being burned down with everyone inside, which just so happened to be henry's end goal as well.
I really like the idea of, what were, her learned behaviors of being in such a toxic environment spiraling into her general distrust of, seemingly, anyone and everyone; which leads her further into her manipulative tendencies because she feels she is owed that after all the pain and suffering she has been through. It's really neat stuff.
Sorry, was writing about an oddly similar character to Baby and happened to bump into this video. Fantastic work!
Can we just talk about how *TALL* AND *HEAVY* BABY IS! 7.2ft IS TALL! 585lbs too! (I don’t know how heavy that is lol)
a part of me thinks that the baby reveal in fnaf world was scott saying that they ran out of story to tell and didnt know what to do(especially after fnaf world tanked) so they put together a new story which was headed by baby, the character dying there representing his original story dying
I think it was extremely bold of them to have Baby featured so heavily in the marketing and the story of Sister Location - but realizing that her animatronic self was already a shell and out of the story. You don't truly encounter her until the VR games. Remember when one of the trailers showed her glitching and going kinda crazy? Big shame we never got to see that in game.
I honestly think Baby could’ve been a better antagonist than Burnttrap for SB. I think Baby subverting the narrative by actually killing William for revenge in SB and 1 up him by converting Vanny and Gregory, the Glamrock versions, slowly take the mantle, showing how the Afton bloodline will be doomed to repeat itself. Or Baby just trying to break the curse and finally let her and the Afton bloodline rot into memories would be so much better
The actual worst part of so many characters being shafted in favor of Afton is.
Them being the major antagonists ACTUALLY paints Afton's actions in a more horrid light.
Vanessa being a potential fan inspired by him, his actions directly creating Baby, and indirectly Puppet as well, it'd still show him as being the Big Bad of the series via his shit causing OTHER people to do bad things long term too.
honestly I really think the scrap baby character shift COULDVE been really cool if Scott focused on how the failure of her plan and forced removal from ennard somewhat "broke" her, leading to less manipulation and more anguished violence. not just to the player but everyone tbh (INCLUDING AFTON). really capture that "fall from grace" but in an INTENTIONAL way
besides, I don't think she'd be very successful at portraying herself to be innocent like in SL with a huge claw on her hand
I know i already commented in this video, but i find myself back again in the fnaf rabbit whole and have been watching my favorite videos and well i watched this one again and felt as strongly about it once again because you really did something not much people do with circus baby which was actually speak about her being a deep character and i wanted to further on the topic of circus baby refering to Elizabeth as a third person and why i think it deepens her character although it isn't really me saying it's what happened rather why i think its that way, i personally believe that Elizabeth and circus baby are technically the same in the sense that not only is Elizabeth possessing baby, but part of the reason circus baby does what she does and feels what she feels is because of Elizabeth, circus baby has the manipulative, murderous tendencies without Elizabeth, but the isolation and desire for escape and a life of neglect and pain come from Elizabeth's physique, and how you mentioned the curious thing about her is that she is the only animatronic that does not act like an animal or a blind spirit, Cassidy is also a spirit seeking revenge, but acts more like a raged dog, and i believe Circus baby's humanity comes from Elizabeth's own trauma and personality because even if Elizabeth isn't characterized outside of circus baby and probably scott didn't intend it, i believe Elizabeth went through the feelings circus baby goes through in the underground facility in a more small escale when she was alive, Elizabeth was abused in the book by william and even if the submission to him fucking sucks i think in the game she was also abused and neglected, specially because micheal and evan were always fighting mostly micheal abusing evan that it makes since william wouldn't even put attention to Elizabeth, it is further kind of proved by the fact that he didnt keep an eye on her and brought her to the pizzeria, if he wanted her to not get close to circus baby it doesn't make since that he would even bring her and just let her roam around without looking out for her, if anything his concerns over her dying were more about how thay would look on his reputation and wallet than an actual concern over her well being, it also doesn't help that technically William just kinda sent her underground to forget about her once she died instead of idk, retreaving her corpse or something like he sends his son to find her instead of going down himself when he send her there in the first place, so it wouldn't be an understatement to assume Elizabeth was an abused child that suffered a chronical loneliness and given the violent nature of her own father and circus baby it only makes since for her to slowly resort to actual murder to acomplish her goals, adding the fact to the man she killed (but actually didn't kill) was a man she truly despised, although im curious why you claim she thought it was William, I'm not saying it isn't the case in fact it makes a lot of sense she thought it was william, but some say she always knew that it was micheal, and if she knew it was micheal i feel she would have gone through her plan anyway, there is not really much characterization of how micheal and Elizabeth were with each other, but given the fact micheal bullied evan i cant really see there being a good siblings relationship with Elizabeth either.
It doesn't also help Elizabeth was the only child that died in the hands of the robot she possesed, instead of being killed by william and stuffed inside later, and Elizabeth before dying was an unwanted version of circus baby, circus baby is the personification of Elizabeth's desires to be perfect and be fixed because she feels like she isn't enough since she literally has no one and has had no one ever to count on, it makes since she doesn't care about her band mates, they aren't like her, and she doesn't have any reason to trust them. Also all the other kids have wach other while Elizabeth is literally alone
I feel circus baby's creepy childish behavior can sometimes actually be part of Elizabeth, as mature as she wants to be shes technically still a child even circus baby is molded after her which is even worse, circus baby IS Elizabeth, at least the ideal version that William unconsciously planted on Elizabeth's brain, that is why i feel that Elizabeth is not passive on circus baby, i feel she makes the reason why baby is so human like, because she's a human and also it would be cool because it means that Elizabeth is smart and i stand that Elizabeth deserves more as a character than the whole "she was Williams favorite" stupid headcanon
Also i agree Elizabeth never actually loved william at all and always hated or recented him, i hated they went for her being obssesed with him and submitting to him, she was like you said smart and cunning and had her motivations and personality and was a perfect opportunity for an actual villain that wasn't william, because even william isn't really a good character we are never explained why he killed kids, its only vaguely insinueaded, most of it its just fan speculation, he just is fucking insane which isn't bad in it on itself, but i think the games want to pretend william was actually a good deep villain and i think that only is so for the first three games, after that william just become hateable i don't understand the appeal of him as a character in the fandom, the man abused his children, was a shit friend to henry, murder kids and gods knows what he did to his wife if he had one with no explicit explained motivations, he doesn't even have good qualities and you can't say its because he's attractive because the only canon visual designs of his human self are in the book and well i feel i dont need to speak for that
Also this might sound weird but i dont think Circus Baby is lying fully in her monologues, i think that even though she was always doing it for her inner motives, i also believe she thought she was fully doing the right thing, i think she didn't actually think what she was doing was fucked up, there are moments in the dialogues in the alternative ending where she says that she doesn't understand how could you not trust her when she really needs him to leave and that he wont die it will hurt momentarily which i think adds up to her child likeness, i think obviously she was pretending but i also believe she was suffering and desperate and was being genuine in the since that she needs to escape and she wants the player or micheal to empathize with her, to understand what she will do so they dont get mad. like a child explaining to their parents so they wont punish them later
I feel when she narrates the scooping of Elizabeth she's being half genuine, i don't think she fully felt regret for murdering Elizabeth but moreso a kind of sadness because of what she is, after all she technically IS Elizabeth already so it's in a way Elizabeth narrating
Also this is purely a headcanon of mine but i always felt that the reason she spoke of Elizabeth in third person was because she wanted to distance herself from Elizabeth, or from herself that is, i think she saw Elizabeth as her unperfect self and felt the need to erase who she used to be because that was not good enough and now that she was circus baby, she felt the need to distance herself from an identity that was the reason she is dead in the first place and the reason she's being isolated, abused and tortured underground, i mean killing Elizabeth its what send her there in the first place so she wouldn't be to fond in her past self
Anyways i will always treasure this video deeply for speaking nothing but pure facts on why we should hire you to write fnaf and it's female characters who are always treated like shit
I swear, every time I see or hear about something from the novels, I'm like "Wow, I'm really glad I didn't read the novels. That sounds awful"
I have never read any of the fnaf books. But why the fuck did they redesign circus baby to look attractive? I would prefer if she was just a 7 ft 2 inch tall 583 lb robot clown. The sexy circus baby design seems something straight out of a fanfiction 💀. I love it when you quote something circus baby directly says. I can feel the anger radiating.
I haven't the foggiest idea. Something went weird after the first book, lol. XD And thank you.
Because it's better
Baby is my favorite character in two senses. The specific character from sister location (dead Elizabeth) and the general Circus Baby animatronic character separated from that aspect. I wish we could get like… Glamrock and Rockstar versions of characters like her instead of only just the main trio. I would have killed for Glamrock Baby.
12:24 guess Baby lost a few brain cells when she was banished from the Ennard (Molten Freddy doesn't seem to make use of them though)
Hit her head on the way down to the concrete. XD
@@notrealnamenotatall2476 I was trying to imply not all of her was ejected
i feel like baby had so much potential especially with the idea of her as an amalgamation of a murdered child and a sentient robot that have been forced together to form something unique and tragic. her motivation was infinitely more complex than any other character in the series but then it was just simplified towards her loving afton for some reason ? it makes no sense and she became an entirely one dimensional character
Circus Baby was definitely one of the greatest villains FNAF could have continued with. She was similar to William Afton but they could have taken her to the next level. It is true when her personality was just erased since she was resentful to her father to then joining her father. I hope she becomes and gets a major role in the future. I’m not sure what FNAF is going for but if they were to continue, they should give it to Baby. The end of the William Afton Era and the beginning of new era! That would be amazing to do and I hope it does come true!
Circus baby should be vengeful when she finds her father had officialy ended and wants revenge on who has made him go bye bye and wants to carry on his legacy
Yeah honestly... Kinda sad seeing how much her character suffered the longer the series went on
...which is a trend among the books and games..
Baby is genuinely a very epic villian. I do wish she could be more of her own character, though, rather than just william aftons daughter. But since the good part of the story ended in the 6th game, she wasnt able to.
But i also have some disagreement. I think it could be argued that Baby in pizzaria sim has sort of "dropped the act" in that game, as she may perhaps be acting far more drastically given her new circumstance. Maybe she doesnt think manipulation is going to work as well now, so she resorts to being more aggressive.
And MAYBE Afton really did tell her something really epic??? Although, because it was never stated what happened, there is no way o know what he could've possibly said. And ultimately, i wouldve preferred her to be independent from him.
William Afton: You are my true successor. Kill me, and you can take my legacy wherever you want. You are my daughter, and I am proud of you, Elizabeth
Circus Baby: Elizabeth… that is my name… (regains memories)… you know… killing you isn’t fun anymore.
Honestly I want this whole game to be revisited. It quickly became a top favorite and I feel like as good as it was it could’ve been even better.
That one Phone Guy who's afraid of Clowns and Red-Haired Girls will freak out on seeing Baby...
I think the security breach ruin dlc could fix baby's character entirely by showing that she was actually glitchtrap all along and she's the one who's been pulling the strings but she masqueraded as William Afton to shift the blame onto a dead man.
In Pizzeria Sim, I never read it as Baby being subservient to Afton. I interpreted it as her finding out her father’s legacy and wanting to follow in his footsteps. She’s impressed with his work and wants to take up the mantle
Every time The Fourth Closet is brought up, I have a thought that I, well, want to write down.
There was potential in the idea of having a series of replacement goldfish where, because the system that was managing them had been in disrepair, one of them activated early and didn't receive the previous one's memories correctly. Have young adult Charlie activate before she was supposed to and teenager Charlie not deactivate, but instead of YA Charlie just being evil because "dad was angry when he was making me", have it be because the system regulating them was breaking down. Make it a reflection of how little their father cared about the consequences of his work; we've got an example of a mess he made that would have (or at least _should_ have) hit close to home for the guy if he was still alive.
Instead, we get a lame exposition dump coming from a shallow villain who's mostly there to be eye candy.
7:52 I interpreted everything up to this point as a loyalty test
Oh yeah, definitely.
12:10 if I'm remembering correctly didn't Heather (the woman voicing her) record both her SL lines and FNaF 6 lines around the same time wouldn't that mean that Baby was destined to become William worshiper
Really? I never heard about that before; that's kinda interesting. Where did this come from? Was it the Dawko "FNAF Show" interview with Heather Masters?
@@nickyneedlemouse875 I believe so
Removing the little chip in her arm might have something to do with her sudden character change. I truly believe that little chip was the mimic 1 program which would explain Henry feeling guilt about creating her AND her just suddenly becoming less intelligent
I'm pretty sure the reason why Scrap Baby's personality was like that was a result of her descent into madness. Elizabeth is overtaking Baby more and more, the trauma that Elizabeth's soul was possibly going through after she died along with the murderous programming of Circus Baby fighting for control eventually caused them to become one after the long period of time between Sister Location and Pizzeria Simulator. Plus, remember, when the Funtime animatronics were still Ennard, Baby and Funtime Freddy got into an argument which caused Freddy to overthrow Baby and become the leader eventually becoming Molten Freddy, so Baby being pissed about this, having to be on her own and crudely rebuild herself probably didn't help. Keep in mind, while we don't have an exact timeframe as to when Pizzeria Simulator takes place, it's implied that both games take place decades apart from each other with Sister Location heavily implying to be the 80s, so that gave Elizabeth more time to take over Baby and more time to go insane corrupting her soul. This makes Elizabeth's character even more tragic.
Agreed
I left this fandom in like 2020 and came back this year bc of how much anniversary content i saw. Baby has been my favorite character since Sister Locations release and SL has always been my favorite game too. it really sucks the way they just threw a character with good ass writing to the side and ultimately “scraped” baby.
I LOVED Baby at first, she was manipulative, scheming and at first, although I had my doubts, I did started trusting her so I was genuinely surprised when she betrayed us. Also, I like the idea of her being this girl who even after being kicked out of the group is able to pick up her pieces (both figuratively and literally) and keep going with what she had in mind, I wish she was kept that way. Also as a sidenote, she being this omniscient voice that tell us what to do and how to do it while we're going around an underground facility solving puzzles and challenges for dear life and that we know is going to try and kill us in the end, gave me MAJOR GLaDOS vibes and I was all for it, imagine Baby cracking some sick sarcastic jokes at us sometimes.
I have a headcanon and theory that you might like.
İt would be so good ıf they revealed that Baby and William actually "survived" the fire.
I am saying "survived". Like,both actually died. And their souls gone to the afterlife.But the agony keep their remains alive.
Agony of Elizabeth(the only soul other than William that wants to not burn. Even souls in Molten Freedy wants to beign burned) keep Circus Baby program active. And when fazbear inc used parts from Baby,they accidently Turned her into Glitchtrap.
Meanwhile Burntrap is the Springbonnie program that possesed by Aftons agony. Remember that old fnaf 3 theory where we are not sure who was in control over Springtrap. William Or the suit? Yeah that theory. I took that theory,and modified it a bit. This also explains why Burntrap has no personality. And why has no dialoge with Vanny.
And Mimic is also there for some reason. But lets face it. İts new model ruined every theories about him beign Burntrap or Baby. And ı think they will going to scrap that chracter later.
I see some similarities between what happened to Baby and what happened to Metal Sonic.
Back in the early 90's, there were a few robotic Sonic doppelgangers that served as bosses, but when Metal Sonic appeared in Sonic CD, there was something about him that left an impression, as he was the one that stuck around. His boss fight left a lot to be desired though, as when you finish racing him he runs into a door and isn't seen from the rest of the game.
Luckily, Metal Sonic would have a real moment to shine with Sonic Heroes. Before, he didn't have a lot of characterization to speak of, aside from being cold and lifeless. But after Sonic had beaten him so easily in Sonic CD, he seemed to be afraid of being nothing more than an interior copy. For his grand plan to prove that he was the superior hedgehog, he adopts a new form(Neo Metal Sonic), holds Eggman prisoner, and scans the data of all the playable characters(except the Chaotix) after fighting them in order to become the Metal Overlord. Of course, this plan fails, as Sonic and the gang beat him with the superpower of teamwork, leaving Metal Sonic to wonder why he can never win.
After Metal Sonic's characterization in Sonic Heroes, he became more lifeless than ever. He basically went from being the potentially best rival for Sonic to being fodder for Eggman to throw at him on occasion. Kinda unfortunate after his role in Sonic Heroes, but I heard that the IDW comics did a good job at making him a good villain again, so there's that.
“New model introduced” the creators: “alright let’s make Glamrock circus baby” literally just another version of that look that was given to Vanny and the last Charlie.
This video convinced me to appreciate Baby's original character, then listed exactly how said character has been ruined
(Great video)
Same
I think that the reason Elizabeth warms up to William in FNAF6 is because she thought William made the new Freddy Fazbear's for her to do what she was created to do in a way showing her that he's proud of her but idk
I also think she warmed up bc sh is still a child and when your a child it can be hard to se people you trust turn bad k think in the end she was just someone who wanted to be a child again abdbe loved
15:29
As somebody named Elizabeth
With parents who felt they could be as cruel as they were to me, but buy me over and buy my silence with gifts and material objects I feel called out
I dont mind the Circus Baby to Scrap Baby thing,and I didnt even notice it. Baby was desprate and was pretending beacuse she wanted to escape. Now that she escaped,she tries to make her daddy and her brother a minion to her beacuse they think she is nice. She was agressive to Mike to escape,but now that she escaped she tries to repair their bond so Mike will do this for Lizzy.
It also adds to the "child that has everything" role that Elizabeth had.
Vanny could have been a new villain who was inspired by William & seeks to gain greater infamy than him or even make the legend real by becoming the real purple guy since security breach seems to be in a timeline where all the former games are just myths made up my people.
Have her real name by Vanya & the name Venessa is used to hide her true identity.
Gregory could have been her little brother who she tricked into getting locked inside so that she could kill him in the same way the crying child died, hence leaving glamrock Freddy unscathed, oh & have her hijacked glamrock Bonny so that he could replace the bunny suit, instead have her use him as a mech suit kinda like how Freddy & Greg team up.
Maybe Bonnie wants to rid of the other animatronic out of jealousy or envy & has a “if I can’t have it no one can!” Attitude.
My best theory for the massive character change between SL and FFPS in-lore is that Baby's programming eventually broke, and the Elizabeth side got 100% control. R.I.P real Baby you were pretty cool
In fact, I think my favorite thing about Baby is that I believed for a LONG time that she was innocent, that she could not be blamed, that she was to be pitied. Whereas the more you think about it, she's such a WH*RE. I love it. (I'm talking about the whole franchise and the current game canon not just in Sister Location)
What the fuck??? Where is she a whole in the game mainline
Bro just called a 5 year old a wh*re ain't no way
Uhh what
“We see her slouched over and unmoving so it’s not that creepy of an introduction.” Yeah, dude, I’m looking at a robot with no eyes that, for all I know, could he playing dead in order to unexpectedly kill me in a game built on jump scares.
Every villain in FNaF has their own kind of ways to manipulate things. With Afton granted with immortality, always coming back more powerful than ever, and Vanny... well, just look at her behavior in the game, she definitely has superpowers. And then there's Baby, Afton's daughter who was tragically killed by her father's creation, been kept in a basement for what sounds like a longass time, AND if that wasn't bad enough she had to deal with getting shocked on a daily basis if she doesn't behave. And overtime in that dark basement she learned something special, how to pretend. She used that power to get herself out. She also did the exact same thing in the books, she pretended to be Charlie only this time quite literally using the mind control disc (which is like her favorite toy to play with for very obvious reasons), she also pretended to be various characters in the Fazbear Frights series with the heart shaped pendant.
Baby is the type of character you don't need to set a motive or a goal for, her backstory and personality is enough to be a terrifying villain.
Vanny and baby are literally the same person with the same eye color.
Your voice sounds like Velma from Scooby-Doo and I love it!
ive always been super confused on how someone could find a robot hot
*Insert Security Breach quip here*
This is what happens when you as a creator go forward without a plan and go with what the fandom wants.
9:26 I thought they killed you because you failed this whole loyalty test and they weren't going to tolerate you not cooperating on Night 5
Baby would have been such an interesting character if they made sister location just to show what afton really did. Sister location shows because of afton's faults. His entire family is dead. CC died, Liz died, and then Liz kills her brother Michael. She could have been an interesting misunderstood villian.
I will say that Baby’s sudden shift in loyalty isn’t too off-putting to me bc pretending to be supportive of someone you initially tried to backstab is a pretty well known two-faced tactic, but having it come about just to make Afton look cooler is kinda lame
Good stuff. I love this kind of content for FNAF. I stopped following the series quite a while ago, right around the VR days, but I’ll always prefer these types of videos that focus on discussing the quality and consistency of the story given to us instead of just the endless theorizing about the future and the many unanswered questions.
Pretty good Baby impression by the way!
I love how you didn't take out some of the mess up line reads and now I get to draw of what vanana would look like. Btw love the vid
Great analysis. Baby deserved so much better
“But Vanana-“
“But Vanessa and Vanny-“
I’m sorry, the Vanana slip up was gold. I once thought of that before too.
totally off topic, but you sound like Wendy from Gravity Falls and i love it
Thank you!
Omg, what? This video actually made me like--dare I say love?--Circus Baby. Everything was explained especially well in my opinion, and I feel like this content creator and this video should get more attention!
Thank you so much! 8D That's really nice of you to say!
I know that this is almost totally unrelated to the video. But I really liked the way you mimicked Baby's voice, it was almost exactly like her's!
Thank you! 8D
You know, the shame in FNAF the games and the fandom, especially the fandom, they throw everything on William.
Why is CB/SB evil? Oh it's William who is brain washing her.
Why is vanny like that? Oh it's William.
Who created the bite of 83? William created the animatronics so it's William.(even though it was clear in the books Henry created the animatronics)
Is William the only bad person in FNAF? Yes!
Who is the reason for everything? William.
Everything is William William William 😭