Great comparison! Thanks so much for doing this. They all come pretty close but I think the winner is NAM when it comes to how close it gets to the real amp without any tweaks.
I had a Kemper and was a member of Kemper official forum, and whenever I tried making profiles and noticed the differences and suggested ways to improve the profiling accuracy, I got ridiculed by the zealots and they blamed me for not knowing how to profile. Well, I guess time proves me right since newer technology is just more accurate, it was never my "user error"...
People will always tribal up and hunt down people with different opinions and takes on things. Just made a video on pickups and somebody felt the necessity to call out my stupidity for spending money for what he perceived as a tiny EQ Change. Like have your opinion, but don't be a rude d*** about it. And no, it was not user error - capturing tech simply is limited. NAM is also limited, but far less than 12 year old technology - which makes sense. Thanks for checking out the video!
Awesome vid! NAM wins for me. The Kemper works but it's not nearly as detailed of a capture as the new wave of modeler tech we have now. Sidenote: I think NAM is more flexible since if you have the know-how you can capture using a custom reference signal and the epochs, etc. Wish I still owned real amps so I could dive into NAM profiles properly. cheers
The Kemper Profiler is by no means a bad product, and I think anybody who owns one does not necessarily need to jump onto the next bets thing. But if capturing your rig is your most serious concern, I think the profiler falls short against the competition. It is however idiot-proof in the way that you can't really do anything wrong - very different from NAM.
Would love to, but Ampero Stage is sold out, there seems to be a successor device in the making - possibly powered by NAM instead of Proteus, but who knows - time to wait and drink tea :-)
Very good video, Kemper is aging, and as you say, a new model is imperative; otherwise, this brand will disappear. For me, Tonex is the best value for money
I agree, for purely the money, ToneX is the best bet. But for me, the features that come with the NAM Player are really convenient, and make well up for the up-charge.
Good point, and I also tried those options, but none brought me closer to the actual reference tone unfortunately. And also, for arguments sake, I'd expect a capturing device to get it right immediately. The Kemper profiling unfortunately is, by today's standard, not consistent enough for my taste. NAM and Tracer are way more consistent and accurate to the real deal, ToneX is good but also fails a tad too often for my taste. That all said - if somebody owns the Kemper, no need to jump onto the next hype. It still remains an overall good device, with lots of additional features. But if capturing is your main concern, maybe look into the alternatives.
I like the Kemper. I don't LOVE it, but I like it. But yeah, the mosquito mid quality is a perfect example for what makes me only "liking" the Kemper, because the concept of the device is really well thought out - it's just technologically a bit behind the competition, and for what it is fairly overpriced.
Erstaunlich wie schlecht der Kemper (ist zwar alt aber sehr teuer) klingt im Vergleich zu NAM oder Tonex. Wobei im Mix der Unterschied eher nicht hörbar sein dürfte. Super informatives Video! Danke
Im Mix geht vieles unter. Und der Kemper ist nach wie vor kein partout schlechtes Gerät, schneidet aber im Vergleich zu günstigerer Hardware schlechter ab, von der reinen Profiling-Leistung. Würde ich international groß auf Tour gehen mit 100+ Shows, würde ich ggfs. trotzdem zum Kemper Rack greifen, weil jeder das kennt :-) Aber auch nur, weil es eben jeder kennt. Wenn es rein um den Sound geht, dann NAM Player all day long!
They are all snapshot players. Nothing more nothing less. The problem is: No dynamic sounds, the sound stays the same wether you play loud or soft. If you play on a real amp then you hear the difference between soft playing and hard playing: the tone changes. If you play a snapshot (doensn't matter how well profiled) the tone stays the same.
I have to respectfully disagree - here's the reason why: Machine learning algorithms as used in these examples are meant to capture dynamics pretty well, and NAM's trainer file makes a pretty good point on that (strange wiggely stuff, sometimes loud, sometimes low volume etc.). So the dynamics are captured extremely well. It doesn't matter with what type of pickup you will confront the capture in general (no matter the technology), it will fairly well be able to match that. So also dynamics in playing are translated really well. What however is not really well translated are usage of Volume and tone pots on your guitar. Reason for that is simply because the training, when using the reamp box, is taking only a specific impedance and it's interaction with the gear into account. To be fair, if you anyways go into an high-impedance input reamping chain, then your volume will not have that much of an interaction which is not capable to be copied by NAM. But if you have like a low input impedance fuzz, which strongly interacts with your guitars volume pot, then capturing that fuzz and then using your guitars pot will eventually not match up with the real deal. But for all other scenarios, I disagree with your position, and have confidence to being in principle able to showcase this as well (unfortunately making a video is not worth it, since my tones are tailored toward hard slamming the amp with metal noise 🙂). And the special case with the input impedance could eventually be counteracted by creating a parametric NAM model, which emulates different source impedances into the fuzz and then allows to blend between these models, although this is way more work than just a regular NAM capture. But, again: absolute respectful disagreement here, and eager to be convinced otherwise. I remain totally appreciative for your comment and sharing your thoughts!
You have to sell that kemper profiler because TONEX sound quality is better than Kemper or quad cortex but NAM player sound quality is better than TONEX. it's going to be obsolete once NAM player releases its next generation of multi effects pedal.
The Kemper profiler is not my own ;-) It's from a good friend of mine. But in my opinion, although the Kemper does fall short, it's by all means not a bad unit. I think we will see 2-3 years of Kemper v1 running around, until Kemper might release something new.
@@PippPriss The case is in price range small Kaemper and QC players are still more expensive than NAM player and Tonex. Tonex allready has a software update with effacts, and NAM wil have it too. When that happens QC and Kemper will not be competetive any more.
Man I gotta say your profiles with the kemper and the ToneX are just not well done. We can clearly hear professionally created captures or even well set stock modeler runs from other users out there where you can barely or not even tell teh difference using both of those devices.
While I am thankful for you checking out and commenting, not sure if I agree there. The reason is: Do you think the NAM and Tracer profiles are well done? If so, they are made with the same reamping chain as the ToneX profile, so that should sound "the same" - if it doesn't, that's inaccuracy of the capturing tech. And the "complaint"/observation which I have about ToneX is a widespread one. If you find that the tone in general sucks which I dialed in, well then this comparison will never suit your idea of what good capturing is about and what not. On the Kemper side, what I found out after the fact is that the Refining process can improve the capture a little bit, when playing long standing, dissonant chords (basically fumblind around with nonsense chords, which are heavily played and sustained long, to capture transient response and how it trickles down tonewise). But the main criticism remains valid, the palm mutes have something "different" to them and the overall tonality is less accurate than the other options. Don't get me wrong: if you already have a Kemper, there is absolutely ZERO need to jump ship and buy anything else. If you give me that Kemper profile which I made just to be "my sound", I'd be perfectly happy. If that came out of an tube-amp by itself, I'd still say "This tube amp sounds amazing!". But if you look at the price of a Kemper, being around ~1300€, I think it falls short behind the other options, just simply in terms of accuracy of the capture itself. Budget king obviously is ToneX - being that inexpensive (for the hardware - 175€ for a ToneX ONE), hard to beat that, and the compromises on has to deal with can be easily remidied enough to not make me care! When it comes to fidelity, then NAM simply is best. And I anyways love the NAM player for other reasons than only capture fidelity (especially routing options are awesome, able to run a capture without IR and with IR from the same unit is *chef's kiss* )
Sorry but thats not true, I have owned a Kemper and I had the same issues when capturing amps as showed here, theres something wrong in the mids almost every time with Kemper. NAM is just more accurate. Kemper is still a great unit, but overpriced for the accuracy you get in 2024 compared to others.
Great comparison! Thanks so much for doing this. They all come pretty close but I think the winner is NAM when it comes to how close it gets to the real amp without any tweaks.
Thanks! I 100% agree, even the Kemper showing it's age, all of them including the Kemper do sound great.
Thank you very much for the fair review!
Thanks for the appreciation! :-)
Awesome vid man 🤘
Thank you so much for checking it out!
I had a Kemper and was a member of Kemper official forum, and whenever I tried making profiles and noticed the differences and suggested ways to improve the profiling accuracy, I got ridiculed by the zealots and they blamed me for not knowing how to profile.
Well, I guess time proves me right since newer technology is just more accurate, it was never my "user error"...
People will always tribal up and hunt down people with different opinions and takes on things. Just made a video on pickups and somebody felt the necessity to call out my stupidity for spending money for what he perceived as a tiny EQ Change. Like have your opinion, but don't be a rude d*** about it.
And no, it was not user error - capturing tech simply is limited. NAM is also limited, but far less than 12 year old technology - which makes sense.
Thanks for checking out the video!
Well done, great video. Thanks for the comparison ! NAM is indeed impressive. Thank you so much for all your sharing.
Thanks for commenting and watching, appreciate it! Without people watching it, I am just a weird dude making noises in his man cave. 🙂
Awesome vid! NAM wins for me. The Kemper works but it's not nearly as detailed of a capture as the new wave of modeler tech we have now.
Sidenote: I think NAM is more flexible since if you have the know-how you can capture using a custom reference signal and the epochs, etc. Wish I still owned real amps so I could dive into NAM profiles properly.
cheers
The Kemper Profiler is by no means a bad product, and I think anybody who owns one does not necessarily need to jump onto the next bets thing. But if capturing your rig is your most serious concern, I think the profiler falls short against the competition. It is however idiot-proof in the way that you can't really do anything wrong - very different from NAM.
Great video
Thanks!
great video!
Thank you so much!
Kemper is history. NAM is a clear winner. Tonex One is the best price/quality ratio. You should try Ampero Stage.
Would love to, but Ampero Stage is sold out, there seems to be a successor device in the making - possibly powered by NAM instead of Proteus, but who knows - time to wait and drink tea :-)
Very good video, Kemper is aging, and as you say, a new model is imperative; otherwise, this brand will disappear. For me, Tonex is the best value for money
I agree, for purely the money, ToneX is the best bet. But for me, the features that come with the NAM Player are really convenient, and make well up for the up-charge.
Kemper requires you to also adjust the inbuilt amp parameters (e.g., Definition) for fine tuning.
Good point, and I also tried those options, but none brought me closer to the actual reference tone unfortunately. And also, for arguments sake, I'd expect a capturing device to get it right immediately. The Kemper profiling unfortunately is, by today's standard, not consistent enough for my taste. NAM and Tracer are way more consistent and accurate to the real deal, ToneX is good but also fails a tad too often for my taste.
That all said - if somebody owns the Kemper, no need to jump onto the next hype. It still remains an overall good device, with lots of additional features. But if capturing is your main concern, maybe look into the alternatives.
NAM all the way
ALL 'dem tonez belong to NAM!
Kemper has that famous mosquito mid quality to it. It's one of the reasons I sold mine years ago. Pretty good for its age though and even otherwise.
I like the Kemper. I don't LOVE it, but I like it. But yeah, the mosquito mid quality is a perfect example for what makes me only "liking" the Kemper, because the concept of the device is really well thought out - it's just technologically a bit behind the competition, and for what it is fairly overpriced.
If Dimehead comes out with a stereo NAM player pedal with a few extra “NAM blocks” that’s going to beat all contenders.
I think it already beats all contenders. But more than 2 NAM blocks is unlikely in the near future. Technology has to ramp up substantially for more.
the best one for me is whatever I can afford
Then NAM is your thing! 100% free and offers a ton of awesome captures!
Erstaunlich wie schlecht der Kemper (ist zwar alt aber sehr teuer) klingt im Vergleich zu NAM oder Tonex. Wobei im Mix der Unterschied eher nicht hörbar sein dürfte. Super informatives Video! Danke
Im Mix geht vieles unter. Und der Kemper ist nach wie vor kein partout schlechtes Gerät, schneidet aber im Vergleich zu günstigerer Hardware schlechter ab, von der reinen Profiling-Leistung. Würde ich international groß auf Tour gehen mit 100+ Shows, würde ich ggfs. trotzdem zum Kemper Rack greifen, weil jeder das kennt :-) Aber auch nur, weil es eben jeder kennt. Wenn es rein um den Sound geht, dann NAM Player all day long!
They are all snapshot players. Nothing more nothing less. The problem is: No dynamic sounds, the sound stays the same wether you play loud or soft. If you play on a real amp then you hear the difference between soft playing and hard playing: the tone changes. If you play a snapshot (doensn't matter how well profiled) the tone stays the same.
I have to respectfully disagree - here's the reason why:
Machine learning algorithms as used in these examples are meant to capture dynamics pretty well, and NAM's trainer file makes a pretty good point on that (strange wiggely stuff, sometimes loud, sometimes low volume etc.). So the dynamics are captured extremely well. It doesn't matter with what type of pickup you will confront the capture in general (no matter the technology), it will fairly well be able to match that. So also dynamics in playing are translated really well.
What however is not really well translated are usage of Volume and tone pots on your guitar. Reason for that is simply because the training, when using the reamp box, is taking only a specific impedance and it's interaction with the gear into account.
To be fair, if you anyways go into an high-impedance input reamping chain, then your volume will not have that much of an interaction which is not capable to be copied by NAM. But if you have like a low input impedance fuzz, which strongly interacts with your guitars volume pot, then capturing that fuzz and then using your guitars pot will eventually not match up with the real deal.
But for all other scenarios, I disagree with your position, and have confidence to being in principle able to showcase this as well (unfortunately making a video is not worth it, since my tones are tailored toward hard slamming the amp with metal noise 🙂). And the special case with the input impedance could eventually be counteracted by creating a parametric NAM model, which emulates different source impedances into the fuzz and then allows to blend between these models, although this is way more work than just a regular NAM capture.
But, again: absolute respectful disagreement here, and eager to be convinced otherwise. I remain totally appreciative for your comment and sharing your thoughts!
No.
You have to sell that kemper profiler because TONEX sound quality is better than Kemper or quad cortex but NAM player sound quality is better than TONEX. it's going to be obsolete once NAM player releases its next generation of multi effects pedal.
The Kemper profiler is not my own ;-) It's from a good friend of mine. But in my opinion, although the Kemper does fall short, it's by all means not a bad unit. I think we will see 2-3 years of Kemper v1 running around, until Kemper might release something new.
@@PippPriss The case is in price range small Kaemper and QC players are still more expensive than NAM player and Tonex. Tonex allready has a software update with effacts, and NAM wil have it too. When that happens QC and Kemper will not be competetive any more.
Man I gotta say your profiles with the kemper and the ToneX are just not well done. We can clearly hear professionally created captures or even well set stock modeler runs from other users out there where you can barely or not even tell teh difference using both of those devices.
While I am thankful for you checking out and commenting, not sure if I agree there.
The reason is: Do you think the NAM and Tracer profiles are well done? If so, they are made with the same reamping chain as the ToneX profile, so that should sound "the same" - if it doesn't, that's inaccuracy of the capturing tech. And the "complaint"/observation which I have about ToneX is a widespread one.
If you find that the tone in general sucks which I dialed in, well then this comparison will never suit your idea of what good capturing is about and what not.
On the Kemper side, what I found out after the fact is that the Refining process can improve the capture a little bit, when playing long standing, dissonant chords (basically fumblind around with nonsense chords, which are heavily played and sustained long, to capture transient response and how it trickles down tonewise). But the main criticism remains valid, the palm mutes have something "different" to them and the overall tonality is less accurate than the other options.
Don't get me wrong: if you already have a Kemper, there is absolutely ZERO need to jump ship and buy anything else. If you give me that Kemper profile which I made just to be "my sound", I'd be perfectly happy. If that came out of an tube-amp by itself, I'd still say "This tube amp sounds amazing!".
But if you look at the price of a Kemper, being around ~1300€, I think it falls short behind the other options, just simply in terms of accuracy of the capture itself.
Budget king obviously is ToneX - being that inexpensive (for the hardware - 175€ for a ToneX ONE), hard to beat that, and the compromises on has to deal with can be easily remidied enough to not make me care!
When it comes to fidelity, then NAM simply is best. And I anyways love the NAM player for other reasons than only capture fidelity (especially routing options are awesome, able to run a capture without IR and with IR from the same unit is *chef's kiss* )
Sorry but thats not true, I have owned a Kemper and I had the same issues when capturing amps as showed here, theres something wrong in the mids almost every time with Kemper.
NAM is just more accurate.
Kemper is still a great unit, but overpriced for the accuracy you get in 2024 compared to others.
If you have to polish it to be good, then it'll be just a shiny turd - no amount of coping out will change this.