BUYING GEMSTONES: How to source gemstones, tips from lapidary artist and gem cutter, Mineral Rare

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  • Опубликовано: 2 авг 2024
  • OPEN TO FIND LINKS AND RESOURCES! Hi guys! Welcome to the miniseries of videos about buying gemstones. Today I will share the tips from lapidary artist and gem cutter - Mineral Rare. Magda and Darren answered our questions and shared their experience and advice! Sourcing gemstones can be tricky. How to buy gemstones that are ethically sourced? How to buy gemstones online? I will try to answer these and other questions in this video series. Enjoy watching and as always, comment below if you have any questions!
    Follow me on Instagram to chat, connect and get all the updates first hand! 😊
    / stardustmine.art
    ⭐️ MAGDA & DARREN from Mineral Rare:
    mineralrare...
    cab.o.rama...
    ⭐️ Additional resources can be found on my Patreon page: / stardustmine
    BIG THANK YOU to my amazing Patrons!
    Jarek Kaczmarczyk , Kasia Klimczak , Eva Ferro , Brice Lenz, Chanta Ly, Deb Chacon, Elisha David, Evin Guler, Kurt, Schanel Williams
    And others! You help me create!
    Find out more about becoming a Patron and ways to support the production of the videos: / stardustmine
    ⭐️ GEMSTONES RESOURCES:
    - LIST OF SELLERS (PDF to download): / list-of-gemstone-27415416
    - EXTENDED LIST OF SELLERS & suppliers:
    / extended-list-of-27415903
    / list-of-gemstone-30289794
    - LIST of additional RESOURCES for further reading (PDF to download): / list-of-gemstone-27415416
    ⭐️ GEMSTONE SERIES:
    How to find gemstone sellers? Tips from JEWELRY MAKERS: • BUYING GEMSTONES: How ...
    How to attend a gem show: • HOW TO ATTEND A GEM SH...
    How to source gemstones, tips from lapidary artist and gem cutter, Mineral Rare: • BUYING GEMSTONES: How ...
    How to source gemstones? SUMMARY & tips: • BUYING GEMSTONES: tips...
    ⭐️ TUTORIALS:
    How to make a BEZEL step by step: • SILVER BEZEL for caboc...
    How to make a RING from start to finish: • How to make a ring - f...
    How to make LABRADORITE RING: • How to make a ring wit...
    How to make EASY STACKIG RINGS: • How to make EASY STACK...
    How to make AN EASY PENDANT: • HOW TO MAKE A PENDANT ...
    How to make STUD EARRINGS: • How to make Alpaca ste...
    How to make STEAMPUNK RING: • STEAMPUNK ring - turni...
    How to make GOLD FILLED STUDS: • How to make GOLD FILLE...
    How to make SILVER GEMSTONE STUDS: • How to make silver ear...
    ⭐️ TOOLS, MATERIALS, RESOURCES:
    Metal starter pack: • BASIC METAL for silver...
    Most Basic Tools: • MOST BASIC SILVERSMITH...
    Basic silversmithing tools: • Learn silversmithing: ...
    Books to learn silversmithing: • Silversmithing BOOKS &...
    DIY workbench: • Easy DIY JEWELER'S BEN...
    Sawing for beginners part 1: • Silversmithing For Beg...
    Sawing for beginners part 2: • Silversmithing For Beg...
    Patina: • What PATINA do I use a...
    Soldering surfaces: • My SOLDERING SURFACES ...
    Rotary tool and flex shaft attachments: • Pendant motor ATTACHME...
    How to use jump ring maker: • How to make JUMP RINGS...
    How to use ring bending tool: • Pepetools RING BENDING...
    ⭐️ LET’S CONNECT!
    My website: stardustmine.art/
    Instagram: / stardustmine.art
    Facebook: / stardustminejewellery
    Pinterest: / thestardustmine
    Etsy: www.etsy.com/uk/shop/Stardust...
    MUSIC: Artlist
    #jewelrygemstones #gemstones #metalsmithing
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Комментарии • 117

  • @amandamcginnis1001
    @amandamcginnis1001 5 лет назад +17

    Im so happy to have found your channel!! My husband has been cutting turquoise for 15 years and I've been wanting to make jewelry for years. Watching your passion and knowledge of silversmith has helped me so much!!❤

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      wow, so happy to hear that Amanda!! :) Does your husband sell the turquoise online? If yes, would you like to share his site or social media with us? That would be awesome! :) And good luck to you with your jewellery making

    • @amandamcginnis1001
      @amandamcginnis1001 5 лет назад

      Thank you so much for responding! And yes he sells on Instagram @garrett.mcginnis

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      fab! Thank you so much, will check it out!

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      ohh my, these cabs! Mindblowing, love them so much! :))

    • @korneliajewelry
      @korneliajewelry 5 лет назад

      What a lovely story! I’m curious what you’ll make Amanda! Go for it, good luck 🍀

  • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
    @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +6

    It's finally here! A little series of videos to help you understand and source gemstones online and in person. What to look for? Where to find the gems? Which sellers are good? How to spot a scam? How to attend a gemshow? These and more questions will be answered in four videos from this series! Hope you'll enjoy watching! :) Today's video was made in a collaboration with Magda and Darren from Mineral Rare :)

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад

      How do you give hearts? i thought I had done it once???

    • @amccaffrey1443
      @amccaffrey1443 Год назад

      Thank you so much for this video series it is extremely helpful!! I am new to jewelry making and gemstone buying. All of your tips are things I too, have had to learn the hard way! What I wanted to know is how to determine if the seller is also the cutter? I noticed that several of the ETSY gemstone retailers call themselves gemstone manufacturers. Do you know if that typically means they are the cutter? I’m having trouble finding an answer to what that term (manufacturer) entails.
      Thank you so much for all your content. 🙏🏼

  • @Mystikj383
    @Mystikj383 5 лет назад +1

    You are amazing! Love watching you vids. They help me so much! 🤩💕

  • @supunsilva8247
    @supunsilva8247 Год назад +1

    Thanks for your explanation

  • @janefarrell1352
    @janefarrell1352 3 года назад +2

    Omg labradorite is my favourite to work with. Thank you for sharing this information.

  • @MaritsaDarman
    @MaritsaDarman Год назад +1

    Thank you for all the great information

  • @korneliajewelry
    @korneliajewelry 5 лет назад +1

    Basia, this is a great video!
    Thanks for sharing 🙏🏻

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      Thank you Karolien! :) I know some info were missing, I will be adding it in the next videos :)

  • @amccaffrey1443
    @amccaffrey1443 6 месяцев назад

    How do you know if the seller is also the cutter? If a seller claims to be the “manufacturer” does this mean they are the cutter? Do you know if there ways to check on the validity of their claims, at least with sellers on Etsy?
    Thank you so much for your videos. They’re all so informative and thorough. You are so sincere, genuine and kind. I always trust the information you provide. Thank you again. I’m so grateful for your content! And you are an incredibly talented silversmith! Wishing you nothing but success in your business.
    Kindly,
    Andrea

  • @lumiyk
    @lumiyk 5 лет назад +3

    Thank you for touching on sustainability, it’s something I want to be more mindful of. Would love a video focused on that 💕 Looking forward to the next video!

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад

      I agree, it's a very important subject. I want to get into more details too. Thanks so much for watching! :)

    • @Aziy_K_Moments
      @Aziy_K_Moments 4 года назад

      Hello
      Will you be my friend for business gems stone you interestid in stones beautiful I have cheap price available in price
      DM me on Instagram @mr.azimbillion

  • @abubakarlabaran8099
    @abubakarlabaran8099 2 года назад +1

    I am very pleased to be among the people, that watch your videos, your really amazing, because is really educating. And I don't mind in getting some vital tips that will aid me to be successful. Thanks.

  • @dinkayehuayire6729
    @dinkayehuayire6729 3 года назад +1

    Love it.

  • @nariwarihuicab5634
    @nariwarihuicab5634 3 года назад +1

    Excellent. channel. thanks for the info.

  • @sumindagemsexportltd4212
    @sumindagemsexportltd4212 4 года назад +3

    I was really happy watching this video. I'm a Sri Lankan. My job is mining and selling gems. I think this video will be very important for me to find some good buyers.

  • @ErikaHamilton1
    @ErikaHamilton1 3 года назад +1

    Amazing video👏👏👏👏👏👏

  • @idonthaveaname42
    @idonthaveaname42 2 года назад +1

    How do you know if the labradorite has oil

  • @rikazrameez7647
    @rikazrameez7647 4 года назад +11

    Hello, I am a Ceylon Saphire and precious stone dealer. i am very much interested in you youtube channel keep it up :) :) love from canada

    • @khurshidkhan3380
      @khurshidkhan3380 4 года назад

      are you interested inNephrite, jasper,quariz, jade , pleas e contact at my whatsapp +923009849963

    • @Aziy_K_Moments
      @Aziy_K_Moments 4 года назад

      Hello
      Will you be my friend for business gems stone you interestid in stones beautiful I have cheap price available in price
      DM me on Instagram @mr.azimbillion

    • @tawandamapasu6035
      @tawandamapasu6035 3 года назад +1

      I have gemstones in Zimbabwe

    • @Aziy_K_Moments
      @Aziy_K_Moments 3 года назад

      @@sacredsounds4234 please DM me on Instagram @mr.azimbillion I'm wait

    • @lilianmulwa4519
      @lilianmulwa4519 2 года назад

      Hello Rikaz, I am tanzanite stone dealer and coloured stones. We could work together. I am based in Kenya and our stones are from tannzania.

  • @martyhinnenkamp1
    @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +1

    You are doing great work, keep it up and thank you

  • @sierrahjmartinez6703
    @sierrahjmartinez6703 3 года назад +1

    I buy opals straight from Australian miners that sell on etsy or have their own Facebook. I have notice purchases i made from india came out to be treated broken packed in oil or not the actual stone. Usually its glass or a stone similar. I have also spent a good $500 on a dark crystal australian opal..
    Turned out when I held it to the light that it was smoked.. clearly see the brown smoked spot and the natural untreated side that the smoke wasnt able to get through. Australian opals are not porous unlike other opals so they can't soak in oil water and smoke. So it wasn't an Australia opal. An opal but a treated non australian opal which wasn't even forth $100.

  • @davidariamirroarkyoung
    @davidariamirroarkyoung Год назад

    If you do get stones that are soaked in mineral oil or other oils to extract the oils almost completely I have found out hem in a natural clay kitty litter and shake the box every other day at least within two to three weeks all to most of the oil should be removed unless it was infused into the stone using a vacuum method this is often a common treatment for emeralds and when they use a vacuum method the only way to remove the oils is using a vacuum method to extract oil add solvent extract again and repeat the process until you no longer can see a change in the stone then mild heat in well ventilation area to remove the remaining solvent

  • @diamondmeteoriteandotherro8507
    @diamondmeteoriteandotherro8507 3 года назад +1

    Hello there I'm. New in raw diamond selling can you give me some experience how to go about it

  • @tawandamapasu6035
    @tawandamapasu6035 3 года назад +1

    Nice

  • @JessicaSchwener
    @JessicaSchwener Год назад

    What do you do with unsettable, chipped, cracked or broken stones both facet & cabochon? Do you fix them or do they just sit in your inventory as unusable? Doing a project and want to recycle the broken stones but don't know where to buy any or know if you can buy natural broken finished pieces.

  • @reannahpadilla6905
    @reannahpadilla6905 2 года назад

    Do you have any labradories you would suggest or refer people to to buy gemstones

  • @amccaffrey1443
    @amccaffrey1443 Год назад

    Hopefully you see this comment as this video series is a few months old now. Unfortunately, I just discovered them.
    I wanted to Thank you so much for all the great information! I really appreciate you sharing your hard-won knowledge. I have a question about accessing your list of recommended gemstone sellers on pattern. I opened your link from the videos but it seems like you have to be a Patreon member to open the list.? Is that correct? I may not have done it right. I’m not familiar with Patreon. Does one have to donate on Patreon in order to see the list of sellers?

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  Год назад

      Hi! I'm very happy this series is helpful 💕 I will be making another video soon, where I will discus some gemstone sellers and recommend a few places. The main list should be free, it's on Patreon, because that's where I was able to make a post with a safe downloadable file. Other extended lists are indeed for Patreons only (it's a subscription-based service where you pay $5 for a month and you get access to all of the content I have made and shared so far. You can cancel anytime you like). I've checked and the first list I've shared has a free access, please try this link: www.patreon.com/posts/list-of-gemstone-27415416

  • @martyhinnenkamp1
    @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +1

    good morning and I hope you don't mind I don't have many subscribers but I used your video as a card for the Lucien Variscite video I did. I thought it would blend in perfectly with yours

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  4 года назад +2

      Hi Marty! I don't mind at all, thank you for linking my video, I appreciate it!

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +1

      @@TheArtOfMetalsmithing You are very welcome

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +1

      @@TheArtOfMetalsmithing Thank you, you do great work!

  • @MaritsaDarman
    @MaritsaDarman Год назад +1

    I have a question- I have a ring with many citrine stones and one fell out. I’m starting to see that the facets/prongs are weak. And a silversmith convert or pour over a bezel setting to secure the prongs or do they need to remove all the stones and start new

    • @stephencoster9532
      @stephencoster9532 Год назад

      Hiya, as far as I can see they would have to start anew. Pouring on metal would probably cause the stones to crack from the heat. You could remove the stones and replace the prongs, or as you said start again, but there is little you can do to an existing ring like that.
      Stay safe, Steve...

  • @-neuro
    @-neuro 2 года назад

    Hi. Do you think there's any money to be made (as a side hobby) by buying and flipping gemstones at online auctions? I am new to gemstones but it seems like it'd make for a cool hobby to start collecting and get into the gem market. Maybe buying rough specimens and getting them cut and everything to resell for a profit? Any help is highly appreciated! :)

  • @user-ob1yv3gy7h
    @user-ob1yv3gy7h Год назад

    please how I can show you my uncut gemeston to sell

  • @gemsinsrilank7147
    @gemsinsrilank7147 3 года назад

    Hi Do your have good buyers for Rear expensive Master pics Gem.
    It's an Alexandrite nearly 40ct Top Gem pics. Thanks

  • @GloriaWanjiku-ez3fs
    @GloriaWanjiku-ez3fs 10 месяцев назад

    I have gemstones and gold but I don't now where to sell them,am in Kenya,mombasa

  • @johnmorgan6536
    @johnmorgan6536 Год назад

    Hi nice to meet you I seen you on the bus.

  • @martyhinnenkamp1
    @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +2

    Great video Howlite is another knock off for Turquoise unscrupulous people dye them so beware. Thanks for putting out such a great educational video

    • @ElizabethMBoyd
      @ElizabethMBoyd 3 года назад

      Yep i make jewlery and manage a gallery in new Mexico the best fake that fools people

  • @201kesi
    @201kesi 4 года назад

    Very interesting. I was passionate of gemstones since I was a little kid, digging for them. You reckon I could make a living out moving them between Australia and Canada. (Opals / Ammolite)??

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад

      Do gemstones have a higher market value in Canada than they do in Australia?

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  4 года назад +2

      I'm not entirely sure, but I do know natural gems, with transparent background are usually very popular :) So I think it would be worth researching :)

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад

      @@TheArtOfMetalsmithing I'm not sure if we can trade emails on here but I will give you mine and I can send you photos of my Variscite I have also just come across a box of faceted stones my friend has and will dig through them on Tuesday martyhinnenkamp1@hotmail.com. Thank you,
      Marty

  • @martyhinnenkamp1
    @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +2

    Hi, I'm Marty and I have just started a channel called Marty's Rocks and I would like to be on the lapidary side but have no idea of what I'm doing any help or advice you could give me would be appreciated. Thank you

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  4 года назад +1

      I'm afraid I don't know much about lapidary, I haven't been cutting the stones. I hope you will be able to find plenty of info, good luck! :)

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад

      @@TheArtOfMetalsmithing Thank you I think I found the answer

    • @virgeniagilay8082
      @virgeniagilay8082 4 года назад +1

      Hello i have ruby gemstone.how much the price

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад

      @@virgeniagilay8082 It all depends on the three C's and size have it appraised

  • @alexsmith4700
    @alexsmith4700 3 года назад

    hi Mam,,,im from philipines, i have Gemstone,but i dont know how to sell,and i dont have idea the price,and buyer.. pls help me..

  • @mkivy
    @mkivy 4 года назад

    Hey there! I think I mentioned I have several semi-precious stones and turquoise...I’d like to have u make my wife some jewelry with garnets I have and maybe me a ring with a blue sapphire. I’ll give u some of the stones for tasks, do u like peridots, aquamarine, etc?

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  4 года назад +1

      I love all types of gems to be honest :) All of them are amazing, vibrant and have something unique about them. I really appreciate you offer, however I can't commit to custom order at the moment, I have too much going on, sorry! If things calm down in the future, and you'd be still interested, then I would absolutely love to take your custom order! :)

  • @rrajab603
    @rrajab603 3 года назад

    hello sir tell me if you need a gem i can give it i'm from sri lanka

  • @rishemtorres1630
    @rishemtorres1630 Год назад

    hii can you help me about gems stone i have a weird stome

  • @jeremyshelton2849
    @jeremyshelton2849 4 года назад +10

    I belive I've found a real gem ;-) with you girl.

    • @martyhinnenkamp1
      @martyhinnenkamp1 4 года назад +1

      That's sweet

    • @bouphalla8108
      @bouphalla8108 4 года назад

      Nice

    • @Aziy_K_Moments
      @Aziy_K_Moments 4 года назад

      Hello
      Will you be my friend for business gems stone you interestid in stones beautiful I have cheap price available in price
      DM me on Instagram @mr.azimbillion

    • @87channels
      @87channels 3 года назад +1

      Don't be weird

    • @jeremyshelton2849
      @jeremyshelton2849 3 года назад

      @@87channels what, you didn't think she was just about as sweet of a lady that you could imagine hoping to meet one day?
      A true gem of a gal, if you ask me🙂

  • @rebelzenart1406
    @rebelzenart1406 5 лет назад +4

    Bloody hell. . I never thought about a slave trade being used in cutting stones. . Makes me so sad thinking of this. Really love this eye opening video Basia.. and thanks Magda & Darren. 😆

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +3

      Yes, it's a huge problem all over the world, especially in Asia and South East contries. The work conditions are often very poor and dangerous and pay is extremely low. Just like with the fast fashion... So it's important to do what we can to check if the sellers are fair and gems sourced sustainably :) The best way is to buy from the cutters and sellers that are transparent. Thanks so much for watching! :)

    • @flyingcheff
      @flyingcheff 5 лет назад +1

      Yes, isn't that awful? But if you think about buying a strand of 2mm faceted and highly polished (sparkly!), for sale by the "hank" for $4/strand...what else could it be? Breaks my heart too. When it comes to beads, India is a slave country, as is Indonesia, others I'm sure as well.

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      It's terrible... As long as we are educated and mindful about it, we can choose what we buy and contribute more to support good and honest sellers :)

  • @sammgreen3785
    @sammgreen3785 4 года назад +1

    How can I get in reach with u so u could help me buying one!!
    Thank u in advance

    • @inayatst2468
      @inayatst2468 4 года назад

      Can we talk through WhatsApp or some other apps? I’m doing gems stone business.

    • @chochvix
      @chochvix 3 года назад

      We have natural gemstones

  • @drsaab420
    @drsaab420 3 года назад

    Hello dear ..
    I have gem stone but how can i sell it online any website or any person? Pleade guide me

  • @maydrury7887
    @maydrury7887 3 года назад +1

    What do you mean by middlemen? Are sellers on Etsy who sells stones the 'middle men's?

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  3 года назад +1

      Some are. It's usually easy to tell if you're buying from the lapidary or just from someone who's reselling (check out their "about", all descriptions and if they have social media and/or sites linked).

  • @wheelyb26
    @wheelyb26 4 года назад

    I really appreciate the video but have found the list of sellers you gave are middle men. Do you have any contact details for people i can buy wholesale from in bulk who are the source. Really appreciate it thanks

    • @yousaf1053
      @yousaf1053 3 года назад

      Hello, sir we have bulk gemstones . Contact us on WhatsApp +393533203035

    • @chochvix
      @chochvix 3 года назад

      I have natural gemstones

    • @plouplou1136
      @plouplou1136 3 года назад

      Hi, if you are still interested in please contact me we are in business of it for long time

  • @mr.c526
    @mr.c526 5 лет назад +1

    I have a gemstone I found hiking up a river in B.C. it is very beautiful, my camera is not the greatest for close ups but anyways check it out if your interested the video is on my page

  • @rebelzenart1406
    @rebelzenart1406 5 лет назад +1

    Oh yes and Labradorite. . Shit.. I had no idea about the oil thing.. and them discolouring and showing flaws over time.. makes me wonder now about all those cabs from Wish app.. I was going to buy some from there.. but now I kinda wonder if they are slave trade or bad quality...

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      Me too! It's so bad but also, good to know about it and always do a little background check on the seller. There's many to choose from and sometimes it's better to pay more but be sure that the ston comes from a good place and will last over time! :)

    • @Aziy_K_Moments
      @Aziy_K_Moments 4 года назад

      Hello
      Will you be my friend for business gems stone you interestid in stones beautiful I have cheap price available in price
      DM me on Instagram @mr.azimbillion

  • @rosemarynsepe6896
    @rosemarynsepe6896 5 лет назад

    Where can I get good stones online

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад

      Hi Rosemary, stay tuned for the third video, where I will share some resources :)

    • @lapidarydave
      @lapidarydave 5 лет назад +1

      From Lapidary Dave of course, anything you need cut or sourced custom design and more!

    • @Aziy_K_Moments
      @Aziy_K_Moments 4 года назад

      Hello
      Will you be my friend for business gems stone you interestid in stones beautiful I have cheap price available in price
      DM me on Instagram @mr.azimbillion

    • @shyamsunder4583
      @shyamsunder4583 3 года назад

      Dear you can contact with me on my whatsapp +918968229679

    • @chochvix
      @chochvix 3 года назад

      Hi we have natural gemstones

  • @zacharycessna3382
    @zacharycessna3382 3 года назад

    And

  • @edalmd1173
    @edalmd1173 Год назад

    Lovely face and smile

  • @peanut924
    @peanut924 3 года назад

    Can't find "turquoise obsession" anywhere.

  • @Luxelock
    @Luxelock 5 лет назад

    Thank you so much for this series! What a fantastic beginning to it. Bummer to hear about the labradorite since it is a favorite but happy to have new knowledge about it. 🖤🖤🖤

    • @TheArtOfMetalsmithing
      @TheArtOfMetalsmithing  5 лет назад +1

      Thank you Angelica! So happy you've enjoyed it :)) Thank you for watching! Yes, I was a bit disappointed to learn this info about Labradorite too, but better to be informed :) There's still many gorgeous, quality Labradorite cabs available!

    • @khansafi5583
      @khansafi5583 4 года назад

      U can start it