@@weertgilders8172 the AVE was launched in 1992 and i think it already had this terrible airport-like security. Also the 2004 madrid terrorist attacks were on commuter trains where we dont have don't have those bc it would be ridiculous - almost as ridiculous as having them on high speed trains. The lobbies in stations get overcrowded because the trains are treated like airplanes and you have to go through security and also there are "embarking" times meaning that you can't just wait at the platform. Oh and because of the long queues you have to show up like half an hour before the train departs bc you might take too long to go through all that that you'll miss it and there will be no compensation on the cheapest tickets
As a Spaniard, I have to say our system is honestly kind of annoying. Yes, we have some brilliant high speed lines in a radial form, connecting Madrid to the coastal cities. But as soon as you leave that set of radial lines, you're met with these mediocre to awful lines which connect the country in a more sensible way, yet are slow and uncomfortable. I'm actually glad you showed the other side of the Spanish rail infrastructure, because people ALWAYS focus on the luxurious high speed lines, but that's certainly not the reality in all our network, and there's much more to be said about our system. I live in Salamanca, and travel to Bilbao and Madrid at least once every 2 months or so, the connections are awful and much slower than by car, and absolutely ALL the issues you pointed out are present in every single trip I've taken in these lines, from the infuriating booking, to the confusing layout of the stations. Everything you saw is also part of the reality of our network, and should not be ignored because we have a few shiny trains that go super fast, we still have an incredibly long way to go.
I understand you're claim, especially as someone from Salamanca, that without any logical justification was left out of the high speed network (probably because it's not on the European corridors so there is no EU financing in this phase, but it's not an excuse) and even the only regular line that connects you to the direction of Madrid is a single track but I think you're conclusion is incorrect. The aim of the high speed network, especially in Spain, is to connect all the autonomous communities and their central cities to the network and the service is not planned as a luxury but as the standard for any long distance travel. It is true that the up to recently the high speed lines passed through Madrid, as it is the capital but, more importantly, it is locate right in the middle of Spain, but they are building now direct connections along the Mediterranean (that is nearing completion in the next couple of ears after long years of construction) or the northern side of Spain from Barcelona and up to Asturias (and Galicia). Hopefully Salamanca will enter the high speed plans in the next phase (starting in 2025) and maybe Portugal's plan to build their first high speed line from Lisbon to Porto with a connection to Vigo, and from there through Salamanct to Madrid will help but I wouldn't count on it as Spain objects to this plan as the Eu corridor is planned to connect Portugal and Spain through Badajoz (Extremadura) and the high speed line from Madrid to Extremadura is under construction. In the end Salamanca will be connected to the high speed network and all long distance trains will be high speed (and most medium distance trains will be Avant high speed) so it won't be luxury but standard, especially with the new operators. There are also plans to improve local regional/Suburban networks and in the next few years ~520 new train sets (an investment of 5.4B€) will enter service replacing the old trains.
Miles’s dad when he already knew something before Miles because it showed up in crossword puzzles: *”I’m two parallel universes ahead of you”* ah yes, I see the Paldea Pokémon League funded the construction of a high-speed train, which is honestly better than having to rely on a taxi flown by a flock of Squawkabilly. But they get points off for no diner vibes. And I assure you, if they care about service, they’ll wait for you. When I take the diesel Montauk Branch train to Babylon, there’s always an express train to Penn Station waiting on the platform for connecting passengers, as well as a local that shows up after. It’s an effective cross-platform transfer.
4:24 They did give free headphones before, actually shitty Renfe headphones are a staple in every Spanish house, but they changed their policy so they only give them out when you ask for them 7:24 You passed by a one of a kind train. Class 443 prototype, known as Platanito "little banana", an innovative italian tilting train that didn't make it past test runs here in Spain and now sits abandoned in Castejón. A shame.
As a German, I'm always extremely jealous of the Spanish infrastructure but it seems like DB might actually somehow be better in terms of comfort and service??
People give DB way too much shit for delays and such but it's actually a great service, just in terms of convenience, frequency and cheap fares if booked far ahead. Also many of the delays come from the incredibly complicated German railway network which serves a very high amount of trains. Sure it's annoying if you're dependant on a long distance connection (the short range trains are very reliable usually) but as a tourist not in a hurry DB is actually one of the best European train companies. I would take it over Renfe, Trenitalia or SNCF every day of the week.
@@jonasbijlsma9943 yeah, it also seems buying tickets is easier, there is no security, there is wifi with integrated entertainment and plenty of info of where you are and if your train is delayed.
Dude, even parts of Amtrak are better than *that*. (Specifically the Northeast Regional and Acela) How the hell was this a European train? I love Amtrak to death, but you Europeans are supposed to be way better at this than we are.
You should do the FEVE line between Ferrol and Asturias. (The only connection between Galicia and the Cantabrian cost). 7h without a toilet ! And no stopping! A smoker would go nuts! Apart from the beautiful landscape, the trip was a nightmare.
To me, it seems like Spain has very fast and efficient high-speed services, but they're very Madrid-centric and smaller cities aren't served very well. Also, there is practically no service between Spain and Portugal, which is pretty awful. If these issues were resolved, Spain would definitely be a top tier country in terms of rail transit.
I think I read that they're working on a high speed line from Madrid to Lisbon, but it's a shame Barcelona gets nothing besides the link to Madrid - it's a MASSIVE city in its own right!
@@MilesinTransit Blame the French, they don't want to connect the high Speed railroads. And Speaking about Lisbon, we can't build POrtugal's railroad infrastructure, that connection has not be done just because Portugal's budget, not Spain.
@@Daniel-nt5gh France is building its HSL between Bordeaux-Toulouse (an axis that does not pass through Paris) and Bordeaux-Dax, then with a conventional line at 160 kph to Spain... The HSL PACA between Marseille and Nice, with the new underground station under Marseille and 30km of tunnels, will quickly follow suit (the underground station will begin work) The HSL Montpellier-Perpignan (the missing section to Barcelona) is postponed. Considered less urgent. It must be said that the TGV lines are very busy in France. The missing section probably won't start until 2035 unless the EU pays.
@@Lodai974You are making my point, France is blocking the high speed rail connection, as they blocked the medcat. It is no surprise isn't it? Of course they will always have an excuse how not to. But France blocking Spain in the EU has become a tradition.
The Barcelona Bilbao train is not exactly high speed as currently there is no high speed service for this region.. You do start on the high speed line with the Alvia (with a maximum speed of 250km) but than you change to the regular lower speed lines. The medium distance trains are more local but faster than regional trains. It is more expensive than regional but both have fixed prices and no seat sleelction (so you can even fid yourself standing if it's full). There is an equivalent high speed service for medium distance called Avant. The high speed line to Basque Country is under construction but won't be completed until around 2027/8. The line is called the Y as it has a Y shape connecting the 3 cities (Vitoria, the capital, Bilbao and San Sebastián. As for trains, there is one direct train (except for Sundays I think) from Barcelona to San Sebastián with the Alvia that takes 5h46 but, as you've seen, the site is not that great and many times and on different rout not all actual trains appears in advance. If you'll check the next few days you'll see it and if you'll check at the end of February you'll only see one train - they just tend to open schedules on some lines only a week or two in advance, usually when they do "seasonal changes" and usually only on less frequent lines (so it usually does not affect AVE trains).
07:24 The heritage train you spotted in Castejon is the "Platanito" An Italian made tilting train that Renfe tryed in the 80s. Just one unit was adquired. Arguably the first high speed train in Spain, notwithstanding the Talgos. It has been rusting there for decades😢
Renfe's website has been always a pain, or an acquired taste, if you prefer. And those x-ray controls are just security theater, you can take the train in the following station and there will be no controls.
I was just on Renfe in December so I figured I might add a little/share my own thoughts on it. They did offer us free headphones on both the Madrid-Seville, and Seville-Barcelona AVE trains, but not on the Avlia or Avant trains that we took (the gauge-changing and shorter-distance trains, respectively) In my experience, no one really cares about the assigned seats (some seats are cheaper than others, which is why they assign them. backward seats are cheaper than forward ones for example), and we changed with other people on multiple occasions. With regard to security, I think only AVE high-speed stations have security and the conventional trains do not. When we left from Madrid Chamartin Station, the High-speed trains use tracks 14-21, which are standard gauge and are behind a security checkpoint, but the commuter/conventional tracks were kinda like New York Penn Station where you can just go straight down to the tracks The Avlia and Avant trains only top out at 250 km/h or 155 mph on high-speed lines which is not much faster than the Acela's max speed though they can sustain it for far longer distances, and 200 km/h (125 mph) on conventional tracks, but you guys were probably going far slower than that, which would be comparable to the Empire Corridor with electrification at best. Only AVE and Avlo trains can go 270-310 km/h (167-192 mph) because rolling stock used on those trains is exclusive for high-speed services. Spain is still actively building on to their High-Speed network, especially in the Northern/Northwestern part of the country, so maybe a few years later there will be fast, direct trains from Madrid and Barcelona to Basque Country. Just like on Amtrak, Preferente Class on Renfe is not worth the upgrade from Turista class, and you don't even get free meals like the Acela. Yes, it's a 2x1 seat configuration, but I don't think the bigger seat and meal service (that you have to pay for) is worth the extra. The only reason we got to ride in it was because it came standard on a tour package. Also it's interesting to point out that Adif is the agency that owns the Spanish rail infrastructure, but Renfe, Ouigo, and Iryo are all technically independent operators from Adif. It's an interesting system that's also quite similar to airports/planes, though Renfe is the state-owned operator. And with regard to delays, our train back from Segovia was 15 mins late pulling in, and it seemed like all trains that day were as late or later, but the only communication seemed to be from faint station announcements only in Spanish. And our train from Seville to Barcelona was over 30 mins late but no communication or reasoning was provided (we had a 25ish-minute dwell time in Cordoba because they connect another half of the train that comes from Malaga, but it turns out that train was running late so we were just stuck there). Overall I still think it's a really good system, and I think Amtrak should learn how to provide affordable, frequent, and actually speedy high-speed services. If you pay the bare minimum (which we did for shorter trips), you get a decently-comfortable seat (not as good as Amtrak, but better than a plane), and you can get an experience cheaper and faster than Amtrak could ever hope for. It's very much like an airline, but if you don't need much, you can save a lot. Edit: And yes, being a hub-spoke type network is not great, but as an American, it’s hard to not view anything better than the sorry excuse of the NEC as a huge upgrade.
Thanks for the extra info! People were pretty adherent to the assigned seats on the Alvia part of our trip, but not at all on the medium distance one. I'm not sure what the best US comparison for Bilbao to Barcelona would be, but I'm glad the NEC at least has a bunch of train departures throughout the day...
@@MilesinTransit honestly the Barcelona-Bilbao train kinda reminds me of the Pennsylvanian. "high-speed" for the first part of the line then slow the rest of the way. Pittsburgh is also a very decently-sized city that deserves way more than a once-daily train connection to New York. probably not the best comparison but it's a comparison.
As an Italian this video will make me complain a little less about our railway system, that has many issues, but at least the train interiors look better, the stations seem more well-kept and we even have a mechanical voice on regional lines telling us when the train is late
@@MilesinTransit Yes, on both high-speed trains and regional ones (at least the ones I take frequently) there's a system that besides telling the names of the stations shortly before the arrival, usually automatically adds "the train is x minutes late" if necessary. If the delay is over 30 minutes, on regional trains it adds "Trenitalia apologizes for the inconvenience", which has become kind of a joke for Italians, as it's said to happen frequently. When approaching major stations it also indicates some possible connecting trains with the platform number and the interchanges with metro lines. If the train has stopped for some reason (waiting for another train, early arrival, etc.) it usually tells you why and when it's expected to depart, and it regularly tells some other stuff at random times, some of which is totally useless and annoying. The style, quantity and quality of the announcements changes depending on the operating company and the kind of train. High-speeds trains usually have a more realistic and happy sounding voice, regional ones operated by Trenitalia have the same voice of station announcements, which is called "Roberto" and can be downloaded somewhere for TTS softwares, so everyone make it say whatever they want.
tbh my experience with italian trains (no hsr) has been exclusively awful and that was in the northwest, where i expected good service. The shift from french to italian rail was a big shock for me.
Another spaniard’s experience (from Zaragoza this time) Renfe (and high speed rail in Spain in general because of OUIGO and IRYO) is pretty good, but it still has a long way to go, a really long one. First of all, the fare structure, it makes no sense. There is a trick I use to get cheaper tickets in the Madrid-Barcelona line because sometimes it’s too expensive, with 2nd class tickets starting at around 50€ for the trains around 6pm, but if you book the first train of the day in first class you pay the same, change your train to the latter one for no extra cost and you get lounge access, better seats and food on board. As for the rural lines, it’s awful, many lines closing (notably Madrid-Cuenca just last year while they opened 3 new high speed lines in the same year), and many rural lines not having good service, being from Zaragoza it’s much easier for me to get to Madrid or Barcelona as to get to Teruel, the third city in my region. Also the Barcelona-Sevilla Ave is a mess too because it’s always fully booked and there’s only two trains a day. Also security is even more inconsistent when you realise it’s only for AVE services, so in Tardienta, a village with barely 1000 people passengers need to get their luggage checked, even for MD and Regional services, while in Bilbao-Abando, a massive station they don’t. Anyways to sum up, you didn’t talk enough about my station and I didn’t even know you were in Spain. Anyways can’t give you many tips since this video is really old, because the San Sebastián station is closed to (hopefully) receive high speed by 2026 with the controversial Basque-Y project. Also your opinions are completely valid, it’s pretty much exactly what I think about Renfe, and you are not being completely positive because we are the 2nd country with the most high speed rail in the world
@@MilesinTransit yeah, the basque y is set to open in 2028, with the new San Sebastián station opening in 2024 (right now there’s a provisional station right next to it), the project will be built in standard gauge and with a max passenger speed of 220km/h or around 135mph (120km/h for freight). From there it will have connections to France via Irún and gauge changing services to Madrid until the 100km stretch of high speed standard gauge track from Burgos to Vitoria-Gasteiz gets finished, then the full AVE connection will get finished (there’s a gauge changing ave train in testing with lots of delays (talgo avril)). There are also plans to connect it with Pamplona and Zaragoza (and ultimately Barcelona and Valencia) with standard gauge and at least partly high speed. There are some embankments and viaducts built already but it’s very far from being finished, and the connection with the Basque Y is still not planned.
I forgot to introduce the basque y so I’m writing a new comment. The basque Y will be a high speed standard gauge railway that will connect all three basque capitals, Bilbao, San Sebastián and Vitoria in a roughly Y shape. This will reduce significantly travel times between those cities, and it will also enhance the links with other Spanish cities through the high speed lines I’ve mentioned in the comment above. All three stations will be completely refurbished, and San Sebastián being the easiest project started first, in Bilbao you will have to change trains on opening because the central station won’t be opened, with a station further away from the city serving it temporarily instead, this will be the largest refurbishment of all.
I just found out that there's a park in Greenfield, MA, right next to the train station that's all train-themed, has a building that looks like the old B&M station, and looks really cute. It's on Miles Street, so I thought of you :D
Hi miles thank you for a Euro trip. Did you ever try 'monsey trailes' in the east coast? I know they run a line from Baltimore to Brooklyn NYC 2-3 times a week. and they run commuter services between Monsey NY to Manhatten. And Lakewood NJ to Brooklyn. I think they are still a pay cash as you get on the bus.
@@MilesinTransit I guess because this company has sign's in English and Yiddish (a Jewish language) and that they leave from places that are not classic.
I never checked out the AVE BOO-FAY Car as I usually got to Atocha an hour early and either got something at the station or ate breakfast at my host's apartment. I tried something on SNCF, but didn't like it
I went AVLO Madrid-Barcelona (only stopped in Zaragoza), AVE Barcelona-Madrid (stopped in Tarragona, Zaragoza, and a few smaller towns) and round trip from Zaragoza (both were non-stop), then I did the OG to/from Sevilla (way down was in the quiet car and the way back was an Avila only stopping in Cordoba en route [way down had more stops] and never noticed a speed change unless the gauge change was near a station or something so it didn't feel wrong)
We took the train to Bilbao afterwards! We were in San Sebastian for about a week and mostly just hung out, but I do have a video about riding its "metro" system: ruclips.net/video/Q5HZ_iDt_FI/видео.html
The trains are designed by Talgo (A spanish train manufacturer) to do that. They can change gauges at speeds up to 70kmph if I do that. New gauge changing trains called Avril are about to start service before the end of the year.
The way the Spanish high speed rail network is designed, means that all the high speed lines start at the edges of Spain, and travel to the center of Spain (Madrid). Basically, all high speed lines in Spain lead to Madrid. I've used the line from Madrid to Malaga, the line from Madrid to Valencia, and Madrid to Valladolid, all with comfortable, quick, cheap and frequent service. It seems that Renfe is putting all the effort in the high speed services starting and terminating in Madrid, leaving all around worse service for other routes (from what I notice). From what I understand, it is similar in France where all high speed lines lead to Paris.
The difference is that going from a city in france to another that isnt paris is still extremily fast even with a transfer in paris, in Spain it is not. And in general french regional trains are also just a lot better and faster.
Spain does have a habit of building fantastic infrastructure then running hardly any trains on it. Visiting Jerez, airport station has 5 trains per day.. Jerez to Seville, booking the day before - no availability! Ended up buying a bus ticket instead. High speed line Barcelona to Perpignan in France - 2x trains per day. Crazy.
I'd agree with you, they are actually from the 90s, the coaches were loco-hauled series VI talgo and the power cars were added later. They are being refurbished right now and the new interiors look much nicer.
At least they've made it so you can actually book a ticket if you don't know Spanish. The English used to end at the page where you type in your information lol
Look, we here in Europe like our railways, but anyone that rides DB, Renfe or even SNCF regularly will tell you that our own system is the worst cos [insert many petty reasons here and one big genuine deal-breaker here]
Like, I envy Americans and Amtrak, cos you're OK with the services you get and actually push for better, while here we just complain and do nothing lol
You forgot us Italians: in the more urbanized areas of the north of the country, as well as on the high-speed lines, trains are usually alright. However the more south you go, the more terrible it gets: trains get slower, older and less frequent, the infrastructure is worn down, many lines remain closed for years or decades because of minor disruptions because the local regional governments don't care about them
@@LucaPasini2I'm sorry I forgot I do apologise. I do empathise with the "the more south a project goes in Europe, the less craps given by local governments" feeling, being that I'm from Andalucía myself. I'm curious about the rest of Europeans on this comment section, tell me about your country's railway related shitshows
@@javiskii Italy is a strange country because it's itself divided, and the state of public services reflects the big differences that divide its regions culturally, linguistically but manily economically. The wealthy northern regions see themselves as part of the core of Europe: after all Milan is closer to Zurich, Lyon and Munich than to Rome, which is less than half way down the peninsula! The opening of new fast trans-alpine links is only making this part of Italy more integrated with the surrounding countries. The southern regions aren't all equal, some like Campania (Naples) and Puglia (Bari) have tried, in recent years, to recover from decades of negligence and corruption. Others, like Calabria, Sicily, Abruzzo or Molise, seem stuck in a limbo that prevents any improvement to their situation. To make just an example not too far south, Roma and Pescara are 200 km away from each other, yet the railway line that connects them is so bad it takes less to go from Rome to Milan, and there are just three direct trains per day!
The reason you couldnt use your card to buy the tickets is because when making direct purchases from out of country vendors you must first contact your bank to have them turn on spending for that country. Happened to me trying to buy a pair of skis from outside the United States.
Nah, the Renfe website just hates foreign credit cards. My card doesn't require contacting the bank when using it in other countries! (I found that out after calling them about it and it just gave me an automated voice saying it's not required to contact them about that anymore)
I love seeing another miles video in my feed! and of course bonus points because it's with your parents :)) what a fun video! also, since you were (or are) in spain, have you seen the railway de soller? it's on the island of palma, and it's this old railway running from the city of palma to sollér. it's super cool.
Whoa, it looks like it's street-running? That's AWESOME! Mallorca looks like it has far cooler trains than it has any right to - I can't believe Palma has an UNDERGROUND METRO!
I think for a future video you should take transit a relatively far distance to a theme park and then just get on the free tram or monorail for the parking lot and then just go back home, like in the Tiny Toons movie. Bring a friend who actually wants to go to the park.
Once you think about it, I'm kinda shocked that Amtrak doesn't have airport-esc security. Just for the fact that US presidents have used it before, and the NEC is the busiest route for the system. With that said a train that switches gages in motion!? That doesn't seem safe, possible derailment, but cool none the less.
Agree. My guess is since Amtrak isn’t as mainstream, and thus hasn’t been attacked yet, means that it hasn’t needed such security. Likely had high speed rail and general intercity rail become more mainstream in the US, there would have unfortunately been some sort of terror attack/attempted attack that would force Amtrak to implement a stricter security process nationwide, similar to how the FAA was forced to tighten airport security after hijackings in the 70s and especially after the events of 9/11
Miles discovering how centralistic is spain it's kinda funny. Yeah any train that does not go to madrid is pretty much shit. I went once with the same train as you and after you leave the high speed line the ride quality is shit and the frequencies are horrible aslo if the train is not from madrid. Even the train from barcelona to valencia is second quality if compared to the ones that go to madrid
@@MilesinTransit That AVE is the one that makes Madrid/Barcelona and reaches 300km/h. The train in the video reaches 200km/h. The north of Spain does not have any city connected yet with high speed.
i can’t imagine the awkwardness of recording while the people across stare back at you… true commitment
kilometres in transit??
i love the euro videos! it’s unfortunate u didnt get to ride last time u were in barcalona but its great seeing it now!
The weirdest thing about Spanish High Speed is the relatively high amount of security compared to every other European and North American country.
I think this was thanks to the 2004 Madrid attack
They've had bombings. Security theater gets added but never removed
I've experience airport-like security on Amtrak, Seattle to Portland.
Also they had a terrorist organisation called ETA for decades
@@weertgilders8172 the AVE was launched in 1992 and i think it already had this terrible airport-like security. Also the 2004 madrid terrorist attacks were on commuter trains where we dont have don't have those bc it would be ridiculous - almost as ridiculous as having them on high speed trains. The lobbies in stations get overcrowded because the trains are treated like airplanes and you have to go through security and also there are "embarking" times meaning that you can't just wait at the platform. Oh and because of the long queues you have to show up like half an hour before the train departs bc you might take too long to go through all that that you'll miss it and there will be no compensation on the cheapest tickets
As a Spaniard, I have to say our system is honestly kind of annoying. Yes, we have some brilliant high speed lines in a radial form, connecting Madrid to the coastal cities. But as soon as you leave that set of radial lines, you're met with these mediocre to awful lines which connect the country in a more sensible way, yet are slow and uncomfortable. I'm actually glad you showed the other side of the Spanish rail infrastructure, because people ALWAYS focus on the luxurious high speed lines, but that's certainly not the reality in all our network, and there's much more to be said about our system. I live in Salamanca, and travel to Bilbao and Madrid at least once every 2 months or so, the connections are awful and much slower than by car, and absolutely ALL the issues you pointed out are present in every single trip I've taken in these lines, from the infuriating booking, to the confusing layout of the stations. Everything you saw is also part of the reality of our network, and should not be ignored because we have a few shiny trains that go super fast, we still have an incredibly long way to go.
Thank you so much! I'm glad we could shine a spotlight on one of Renfe's less glossy lines.
I understand you're claim, especially as someone from Salamanca, that without any logical justification was left out of the high speed network (probably because it's not on the European corridors so there is no EU financing in this phase, but it's not an excuse) and even the only regular line that connects you to the direction of Madrid is a single track but I think you're conclusion is incorrect.
The aim of the high speed network, especially in Spain, is to connect all the autonomous communities and their central cities to the network and the service is not planned as a luxury but as the standard for any long distance travel. It is true that the up to recently the high speed lines passed through Madrid, as it is the capital but, more importantly, it is locate right in the middle of Spain, but they are building now direct connections along the Mediterranean (that is nearing completion in the next couple of ears after long years of construction) or the northern side of Spain from Barcelona and up to Asturias (and Galicia).
Hopefully Salamanca will enter the high speed plans in the next phase (starting in 2025) and maybe Portugal's plan to build their first high speed line from Lisbon to Porto with a connection to Vigo, and from there through Salamanct to Madrid will help but I wouldn't count on it as Spain objects to this plan as the Eu corridor is planned to connect Portugal and Spain through Badajoz (Extremadura) and the high speed line from Madrid to Extremadura is under construction.
In the end Salamanca will be connected to the high speed network and all long distance trains will be high speed (and most medium distance trains will be Avant high speed) so it won't be luxury but standard, especially with the new operators.
There are also plans to improve local regional/Suburban networks and in the next few years ~520 new train sets (an investment of 5.4B€) will enter service replacing the old trains.
Am I right in saying its also poorly connected to Portugal?
Seeing you traversing the dark and grimy underpass of Vitoria-Gasteiz station (MY HOMETOWN) was amaaaazing
Miles’s dad when he already knew something before Miles because it showed up in crossword puzzles: *”I’m two parallel universes ahead of you”* ah yes, I see the Paldea Pokémon League funded the construction of a high-speed train, which is honestly better than having to rely on a taxi flown by a flock of Squawkabilly. But they get points off for no diner vibes. And I assure you, if they care about service, they’ll wait for you. When I take the diesel Montauk Branch train to Babylon, there’s always an express train to Penn Station waiting on the platform for connecting passengers, as well as a local that shows up after. It’s an effective cross-platform transfer.
ofc you watch this channel
Thanks!
Thank you so much!
4:24 They did give free headphones before, actually shitty Renfe headphones are a staple in every Spanish house, but they changed their policy so they only give them out when you ask for them
7:24 You passed by a one of a kind train. Class 443 prototype, known as Platanito "little banana", an innovative italian tilting train that didn't make it past test runs here in Spain and now sits abandoned in Castejón. A shame.
sick details bud! thanks for sharing, that's so interesting
Whoa, if I had known the Platanito was so important, I would've tried to get a better shot of it! That's awesome!
As a German, I'm always extremely jealous of the Spanish infrastructure but it seems like DB might actually somehow be better in terms of comfort and service??
People give DB way too much shit for delays and such but it's actually a great service, just in terms of convenience, frequency and cheap fares if booked far ahead. Also many of the delays come from the incredibly complicated German railway network which serves a very high amount of trains. Sure it's annoying if you're dependant on a long distance connection (the short range trains are very reliable usually) but as a tourist not in a hurry DB is actually one of the best European train companies. I would take it over Renfe, Trenitalia or SNCF every day of the week.
Oh and also they'll at least announce why the train is late in (broken) English
@@jonasbijlsma9943 yeah, it also seems buying tickets is easier, there is no security, there is wifi with integrated entertainment and plenty of info of where you are and if your train is delayed.
Dude, even parts of Amtrak are better than *that*. (Specifically the Northeast Regional and Acela) How the hell was this a European train? I love Amtrak to death, but you Europeans are supposed to be way better at this than we are.
DB and Renfe, we are on the two faces of the same coin 😂
You should do the FEVE line between Ferrol and Asturias. (The only connection between Galicia and the Cantabrian cost). 7h without a toilet ! And no stopping! A smoker would go nuts! Apart from the beautiful landscape, the trip was a nightmare.
To me, it seems like Spain has very fast and efficient high-speed services, but they're very Madrid-centric and smaller cities aren't served very well. Also, there is practically no service between Spain and Portugal, which is pretty awful. If these issues were resolved, Spain would definitely be a top tier country in terms of rail transit.
Well, this the capitol so it makes a lot of sense
I think I read that they're working on a high speed line from Madrid to Lisbon, but it's a shame Barcelona gets nothing besides the link to Madrid - it's a MASSIVE city in its own right!
@@MilesinTransit Blame the French, they don't want to connect the high Speed railroads. And Speaking about Lisbon, we can't build POrtugal's railroad infrastructure, that connection has not be done just because Portugal's budget, not Spain.
@@Daniel-nt5gh France is building its HSL between Bordeaux-Toulouse (an axis that does not pass through Paris) and Bordeaux-Dax, then with a conventional line at 160 kph to Spain...
The HSL PACA between Marseille and Nice, with the new underground station under Marseille and 30km of tunnels, will quickly follow suit (the underground station will begin work)
The HSL Montpellier-Perpignan (the missing section to Barcelona) is postponed. Considered less urgent. It must be said that the TGV lines are very busy in France.
The missing section probably won't start until 2035 unless the EU pays.
@@Lodai974You are making my point, France is blocking the high speed rail connection, as they blocked the medcat. It is no surprise isn't it? Of course they will always have an excuse how not to.
But France blocking Spain in the EU has become a tradition.
The Barcelona Bilbao train is not exactly high speed as currently there is no high speed service for this region.. You do start on the high speed line with the Alvia (with a maximum speed of 250km) but than you change to the regular lower speed lines. The medium distance trains are more local but faster than regional trains. It is more expensive than regional but both have fixed prices and no seat sleelction (so you can even fid yourself standing if it's full). There is an equivalent high speed service for medium distance called Avant. The high speed line to Basque Country is under construction but won't be completed until around 2027/8. The line is called the Y as it has a Y shape connecting the 3 cities (Vitoria, the capital, Bilbao and San Sebastián.
As for trains, there is one direct train (except for Sundays I think) from Barcelona to San Sebastián with the Alvia that takes 5h46 but, as you've seen, the site is not that great and many times and on different rout not all actual trains appears in advance. If you'll check the next few days you'll see it and if you'll check at the end of February you'll only see one train - they just tend to open schedules on some lines only a week or two in advance, usually when they do "seasonal changes" and usually only on less frequent lines (so it usually does not affect AVE trains).
Ah, I see that direct train! That's annoying you can't book it in advance, though...
07:24 The heritage train you spotted in Castejon is the "Platanito"
An Italian made tilting train that Renfe tryed in the 80s. Just one unit was adquired. Arguably the first high speed train in Spain, notwithstanding the Talgos. It has been rusting there for decades😢
what else to say other than another banger, keep up the great videos
Thanks Cameron!
I hadn't come across this, I had no idea you went to Europe already lol. I hope you had a great time alongside your filming
It was wonderful!
4:57 Clippy makes a surprise cameo!
Renfe's website has been always a pain, or an acquired taste, if you prefer. And those x-ray controls are just security theater, you can take the train in the following station and there will be no controls.
babe wake up, new miles in transit just dropped. and it's another cute family ep!
I was just on Renfe in December so I figured I might add a little/share my own thoughts on it.
They did offer us free headphones on both the Madrid-Seville, and Seville-Barcelona AVE trains, but not on the Avlia or Avant trains that we took (the gauge-changing and shorter-distance trains, respectively)
In my experience, no one really cares about the assigned seats (some seats are cheaper than others, which is why they assign them. backward seats are cheaper than forward ones for example), and we changed with other people on multiple occasions.
With regard to security, I think only AVE high-speed stations have security and the conventional trains do not. When we left from Madrid Chamartin Station, the High-speed trains use tracks 14-21, which are standard gauge and are behind a security checkpoint, but the commuter/conventional tracks were kinda like New York Penn Station where you can just go straight down to the tracks
The Avlia and Avant trains only top out at 250 km/h or 155 mph on high-speed lines which is not much faster than the Acela's max speed though they can sustain it for far longer distances, and 200 km/h (125 mph) on conventional tracks, but you guys were probably going far slower than that, which would be comparable to the Empire Corridor with electrification at best. Only AVE and Avlo trains can go 270-310 km/h (167-192 mph) because rolling stock used on those trains is exclusive for high-speed services.
Spain is still actively building on to their High-Speed network, especially in the Northern/Northwestern part of the country, so maybe a few years later there will be fast, direct trains from Madrid and Barcelona to Basque Country.
Just like on Amtrak, Preferente Class on Renfe is not worth the upgrade from Turista class, and you don't even get free meals like the Acela. Yes, it's a 2x1 seat configuration, but I don't think the bigger seat and meal service (that you have to pay for) is worth the extra. The only reason we got to ride in it was because it came standard on a tour package.
Also it's interesting to point out that Adif is the agency that owns the Spanish rail infrastructure, but Renfe, Ouigo, and Iryo are all technically independent operators from Adif. It's an interesting system that's also quite similar to airports/planes, though Renfe is the state-owned operator.
And with regard to delays, our train back from Segovia was 15 mins late pulling in, and it seemed like all trains that day were as late or later, but the only communication seemed to be from faint station announcements only in Spanish. And our train from Seville to Barcelona was over 30 mins late but no communication or reasoning was provided (we had a 25ish-minute dwell time in Cordoba because they connect another half of the train that comes from Malaga, but it turns out that train was running late so we were just stuck there).
Overall I still think it's a really good system, and I think Amtrak should learn how to provide affordable, frequent, and actually speedy high-speed services. If you pay the bare minimum (which we did for shorter trips), you get a decently-comfortable seat (not as good as Amtrak, but better than a plane), and you can get an experience cheaper and faster than Amtrak could ever hope for. It's very much like an airline, but if you don't need much, you can save a lot.
Edit: And yes, being a hub-spoke type network is not great, but as an American, it’s hard to not view anything better than the sorry excuse of the NEC as a huge upgrade.
Thanks for the extra info! People were pretty adherent to the assigned seats on the Alvia part of our trip, but not at all on the medium distance one. I'm not sure what the best US comparison for Bilbao to Barcelona would be, but I'm glad the NEC at least has a bunch of train departures throughout the day...
@@MilesinTransit honestly the Barcelona-Bilbao train kinda reminds me of the Pennsylvanian. "high-speed" for the first part of the line then slow the rest of the way. Pittsburgh is also a very decently-sized city that deserves way more than a once-daily train connection to New York. probably not the best comparison but it's a comparison.
As an Italian this video will make me complain a little less about our railway system, that has many issues, but at least the train interiors look better, the stations seem more well-kept and we even have a mechanical voice on regional lines telling us when the train is late
Oh wow, automated announcements? All the announcements on these trains came from the conductors, and they were hard to hear/understand!
@@MilesinTransit Yes, on both high-speed trains and regional ones (at least the ones I take frequently) there's a system that besides telling the names of the stations shortly before the arrival, usually automatically adds "the train is x minutes late" if necessary. If the delay is over 30 minutes, on regional trains it adds "Trenitalia apologizes for the inconvenience", which has become kind of a joke for Italians, as it's said to happen frequently.
When approaching major stations it also indicates some possible connecting trains with the platform number and the interchanges with metro lines. If the train has stopped for some reason (waiting for another train, early arrival, etc.) it usually tells you why and when it's expected to depart, and it regularly tells some other stuff at random times, some of which is totally useless and annoying.
The style, quantity and quality of the announcements changes depending on the operating company and the kind of train. High-speeds trains usually have a more realistic and happy sounding voice, regional ones operated by Trenitalia have the same voice of station announcements, which is called "Roberto" and can be downloaded somewhere for TTS softwares, so everyone make it say whatever they want.
tbh my experience with italian trains (no hsr) has been exclusively awful and that was in the northwest, where i expected good service. The shift from french to italian rail was a big shock for me.
4:20 they do that on express AVE service too!
Another spaniard’s experience (from Zaragoza this time) Renfe (and high speed rail in Spain in general because of OUIGO and IRYO) is pretty good, but it still has a long way to go, a really long one. First of all, the fare structure, it makes no sense. There is a trick I use to get cheaper tickets in the Madrid-Barcelona line because sometimes it’s too expensive, with 2nd class tickets starting at around 50€ for the trains around 6pm, but if you book the first train of the day in first class you pay the same, change your train to the latter one for no extra cost and you get lounge access, better seats and food on board. As for the rural lines, it’s awful, many lines closing (notably Madrid-Cuenca just last year while they opened 3 new high speed lines in the same year), and many rural lines not having good service, being from Zaragoza it’s much easier for me to get to Madrid or Barcelona as to get to Teruel, the third city in my region. Also the Barcelona-Sevilla Ave is a mess too because it’s always fully booked and there’s only two trains a day. Also security is even more inconsistent when you realise it’s only for AVE services, so in Tardienta, a village with barely 1000 people passengers need to get their luggage checked, even for MD and Regional services, while in Bilbao-Abando, a massive station they don’t.
Anyways to sum up, you didn’t talk enough about my station and I didn’t even know you were in Spain. Anyways can’t give you many tips since this video is really old, because the San Sebastián station is closed to (hopefully) receive high speed by 2026 with the controversial Basque-Y project.
Also your opinions are completely valid, it’s pretty much exactly what I think about Renfe, and you are not being completely positive because we are the 2nd country with the most high speed rail in the world
Thank you! I didn't realize they closed San Sebastián Station since we were there - would that be high speed rail to Madrid?
@@MilesinTransit yeah, the basque y is set to open in 2028, with the new San Sebastián station opening in 2024 (right now there’s a provisional station right next to it), the project will be built in standard gauge and with a max passenger speed of 220km/h or around 135mph (120km/h for freight). From there it will have connections to France via Irún and gauge changing services to Madrid until the 100km stretch of high speed standard gauge track from Burgos to Vitoria-Gasteiz gets finished, then the full AVE connection will get finished (there’s a gauge changing ave train in testing with lots of delays (talgo avril)). There are also plans to connect it with Pamplona and Zaragoza (and ultimately Barcelona and Valencia) with standard gauge and at least partly high speed. There are some embankments and viaducts built already but it’s very far from being finished, and the connection with the Basque Y is still not planned.
I forgot to introduce the basque y so I’m writing a new comment. The basque Y will be a high speed standard gauge railway that will connect all three basque capitals, Bilbao, San Sebastián and Vitoria in a roughly Y shape. This will reduce significantly travel times between those cities, and it will also enhance the links with other Spanish cities through the high speed lines I’ve mentioned in the comment above. All three stations will be completely refurbished, and San Sebastián being the easiest project started first, in Bilbao you will have to change trains on opening because the central station won’t be opened, with a station further away from the city serving it temporarily instead, this will be the largest refurbishment of all.
So the first train was a Talgo with the ability to change its track gauge. Amtrak Cascades calls the cafe car a “Bistro”.
and i thought boarding Amtrak at NYP was theatrical lol
The gauge change sounds interesting tho 🤔
9:40 looks like the avelia liberty
I just found out that there's a park in Greenfield, MA, right next to the train station that's all train-themed, has a building that looks like the old B&M station, and looks really cute. It's on Miles Street, so I thought of you :D
Whoa, that's awesome!
Hi miles thank you for a Euro trip.
Did you ever try 'monsey trailes' in the east coast?
I know they run a line from Baltimore to Brooklyn NYC 2-3 times a week.
and they run commuter services between Monsey NY to Manhatten.
And Lakewood NJ to Brooklyn.
I think they are still a pay cash as you get on the bus.
I've heard of them! What makes them worth checking out? I do see they go to Kiryas Joel, which is pretty cool.
@@MilesinTransit I guess because this company has sign's in English and Yiddish (a Jewish language) and that they leave from places that are not classic.
how many miles have u transited so far?
Too many to count!!
6:29 Love that awesome jingle there...did u sing it?
Jackson and I sung it! It's from The Diner Video.
I'm looking at the Spanish landscape and just looks like California
Thinking of taking train from Bcn to San Sebastián ? Is the view good? Def cheaper . But is it worth 5 hours ? It’s way cheaper def .
Cheaper than what? But yeah, the views are great!
Let's pretend we're dancing in the streeeeeeeets...in 1:29
I NEED MORE AATR
More to come, both in Spain and in the US!
@@MilesinTransit Moreeeee
I never checked out the AVE BOO-FAY Car as I usually got to Atocha an hour early and either got something at the station or ate breakfast at my host's apartment. I tried something on SNCF, but didn't like it
I went AVLO Madrid-Barcelona (only stopped in Zaragoza), AVE Barcelona-Madrid (stopped in Tarragona, Zaragoza, and a few smaller towns) and round trip from Zaragoza (both were non-stop), then I did the OG to/from Sevilla (way down was in the quiet car and the way back was an Avila only stopping in Cordoba en route [way down had more stops] and never noticed a speed change unless the gauge change was near a station or something so it didn't feel wrong)
Did you take the train back from San Sebastian to Barcelona by any chance? What did you explore in San Sebastian?
We took the train to Bilbao afterwards! We were in San Sebastian for about a week and mostly just hung out, but I do have a video about riding its "metro" system: ruclips.net/video/Q5HZ_iDt_FI/видео.html
Im Covid time the BAR is close!
"Microsoft Word, I guess?" Hehehe
I pray to thee, miles in transit
Ah an infamous talgo train, if my eyes do not deceive me
wait they CHANGE GAUGES?!
Yes!!
@@MilesinTransit wow that's crazy! How do they do that?
(my first thought in response to this was eBart)
The trains are designed by Talgo (A spanish train manufacturer) to do that. They can change gauges at speeds up to 70kmph if I do that. New gauge changing trains called Avril are about to start service before the end of the year.
The way the Spanish high speed rail network is designed, means that all the high speed lines start at the edges of Spain, and travel to the center of Spain (Madrid). Basically, all high speed lines in Spain lead to Madrid.
I've used the line from Madrid to Malaga, the line from Madrid to Valencia, and Madrid to Valladolid, all with comfortable, quick, cheap and frequent service.
It seems that Renfe is putting all the effort in the high speed services starting and terminating in Madrid, leaving all around worse service for other routes (from what I notice).
From what I understand, it is similar in France where all high speed lines lead to Paris.
I agree with that. I was trying to get from Málaga to Granada by train last year but the connections were so bad that it was quicker to get the bus!
The difference is that going from a city in france to another that isnt paris is still extremily fast even with a transfer in paris, in Spain it is not. And in general french regional trains are also just a lot better and faster.
Spain does have a habit of building fantastic infrastructure then running hardly any trains on it. Visiting Jerez, airport station has 5 trains per day.. Jerez to Seville, booking the day before - no availability! Ended up buying a bus ticket instead. High speed line Barcelona to Perpignan in France - 2x trains per day. Crazy.
Quite an unimpressive service. Those trains look agressively dated. Like a to go cup from a 90s pizza shop
I'd agree with you, they are actually from the 90s, the coaches were loco-hauled series VI talgo and the power cars were added later. They are being refurbished right now and the new interiors look much nicer.
At least they've made it so you can actually book a ticket if you don't know Spanish. The English used to end at the page where you type in your information lol
Eek, I didn't know that! There's definitely still a lot of room for improvement on that website...
Look, we here in Europe like our railways, but anyone that rides DB, Renfe or even SNCF regularly will tell you that our own system is the worst cos [insert many petty reasons here and one big genuine deal-breaker here]
Like, I envy Americans and Amtrak, cos you're OK with the services you get and actually push for better, while here we just complain and do nothing lol
You forgot us Italians: in the more urbanized areas of the north of the country, as well as on the high-speed lines, trains are usually alright. However the more south you go, the more terrible it gets: trains get slower, older and less frequent, the infrastructure is worn down, many lines remain closed for years or decades because of minor disruptions because the local regional governments don't care about them
@@LucaPasini2I'm sorry I forgot I do apologise. I do empathise with the "the more south a project goes in Europe, the less craps given by local governments" feeling, being that I'm from Andalucía myself.
I'm curious about the rest of Europeans on this comment section, tell me about your country's railway related shitshows
@@javiskii Italy is a strange country because it's itself divided, and the state of public services reflects the big differences that divide its regions culturally, linguistically but manily economically. The wealthy northern regions see themselves as part of the core of Europe: after all Milan is closer to Zurich, Lyon and Munich than to Rome, which is less than half way down the peninsula! The opening of new fast trans-alpine links is only making this part of Italy more integrated with the surrounding countries.
The southern regions aren't all equal, some like Campania (Naples) and Puglia (Bari) have tried, in recent years, to recover from decades of negligence and corruption. Others, like Calabria, Sicily, Abruzzo or Molise, seem stuck in a limbo that prevents any improvement to their situation.
To make just an example not too far south, Roma and Pescara are 200 km away from each other, yet the railway line that connects them is so bad it takes less to go from Rome to Milan, and there are just three direct trains per day!
The reason you couldnt use your card to buy the tickets is because when making direct purchases from out of country vendors you must first contact your bank to have them turn on spending for that country. Happened to me trying to buy a pair of skis from outside the United States.
Nah, the Renfe website just hates foreign credit cards. My card doesn't require contacting the bank when using it in other countries! (I found that out after calling them about it and it just gave me an automated voice saying it's not required to contact them about that anymore)
9:36 somebody is not amused
youre my Messias
any DINER action in spain on this trip?
Not on this trip, but if I ever end up in Madrid, there's a 1948 Fodero diner tucked away at a drive-in movie theater over there!
its kinda weird as a washintonian seeing the same weird talgo cars in another country
I love seeing another miles video in my feed! and of course bonus points because it's with your parents :)) what a fun video!
also, since you were (or are) in spain, have you seen the railway de soller? it's on the island of palma, and it's this old railway running from the city of palma to sollér. it's super cool.
Whoa, it looks like it's street-running? That's AWESOME! Mallorca looks like it has far cooler trains than it has any right to - I can't believe Palma has an UNDERGROUND METRO!
I think for a future video you should take transit a relatively far distance to a theme park and then just get on the free tram or monorail for the parking lot and then just go back home, like in the Tiny Toons movie. Bring a friend who actually wants to go to the park.
I've definitely got viewers who are into theme parks that would probably love a video like that!
hi miles 😘
Hi 😍😍😘😘
hi
If you really like tsa style security at train stations, come to Israel.
It's fun and the trains never arrive.
Once you think about it, I'm kinda shocked that Amtrak doesn't have airport-esc security. Just for the fact that US presidents have used it before, and the NEC is the busiest route for the system. With that said a train that switches gages in motion!? That doesn't seem safe, possible derailment, but cool none the less.
its very safe
Agree. My guess is since Amtrak isn’t as mainstream, and thus hasn’t been attacked yet, means that it hasn’t needed such security. Likely had high speed rail and general intercity rail become more mainstream in the US, there would have unfortunately been some sort of terror attack/attempted attack that would force Amtrak to implement a stricter security process nationwide, similar to how the FAA was forced to tighten airport security after hijackings in the 70s and especially after the events of 9/11
Miles discovering how centralistic is spain it's kinda funny. Yeah any train that does not go to madrid is pretty much shit. I went once with the same train as you and after you leave the high speed line the ride quality is shit and the frequencies are horrible aslo if the train is not from madrid. Even the train from barcelona to valencia is second quality if compared to the ones that go to madrid
Size of toilet is because EU makes it so, have to have room for wheelchair in new trains...
first
Nvm
According to RUclips Studio, you were actually first!
That train is not considered high speed in Spain.
And yet the AVE trains that run on the exact same tracks at the exact same speeds from Barcelona to Zaragoza are?
@@MilesinTransit That AVE is the one that makes Madrid/Barcelona and reaches 300km/h. The train in the video reaches 200km/h.
The north of Spain does not have any city connected yet with high speed.
R
You are moving the camera too fast and too often.
Okay.