I'd imagine the devs were just tired of being asked about treasure hunter. Funny how, like you said, their answer for nearly every other question was "we have no plans for that". But for th they brought a graph with them.
Honestly I'm really glad they shared TH mechanics. I remember farming coffer keys with a group and they just had a THF AFK in exp range because they thought the THF just had to be present. Or the myth about the THF needing the killing blow. That drew out A LOT of God fights.
Ultra rare has to be Defending ring. Part of what made XI special and unreplicable is the mystery that we had behind various things. It was fun trying to figure those mysteries out and sure, we could compile drop histories to work out percentages, but who could have imagined there were rarity tiers?
As an ex-player and thief main of about 4 years (2007-2011) I am personally happy to see the direct numbers behind the mysterious "Treasure Hunter" job trait. But I'm also glad SE never released this chart until now. It was just one more thing for the community to contemplate between themselves, and "not knowing everything," added just a little bit of flavor and mystery to the game. This is roughly how I expected it worked. Obviously didn't have exact numbers, but the basics now confirm themselves. TH 0 - 1 is a giant boost for general farming, with more common item drop rates doubling. 1-2 is still a significant boost. 3 and 4 less so, but significant enough that I'd much rather be out with TH4 farming, than another job /thf (at 75.) As for rare items, it's still always beneficial to have TH. The numbers are small on paper, but still significant. .1 to .4 (TH 0 to TH 4 on an Ultra Rare, which is all we had back in the day) is still 1/1000 drop rate increased to 1/250. And with TH 14 it would be 1/67. TH 0 to TH 14 on Very rare items is 1/100 increased to 1/10.
Treasure Hunter has always been helpful, but not necessary(especially at lower levels). Of course we didn't know exactly how it worked, but I always had that sense anyways. I farmed tons of low level nm stuff without thief, and got drops back in the day. But it definitely helps on a lot of things. For example, someone posted a video about spamming lady lilith (one of the newer HTMBs) on VE, and it took them 239 runs to get all of her drops. He was doing it as NIN/WAR with no TH at all. I did it on MNK/THF with a TH+1 item(so essentially TH3), and I got all of her drops in a little over 100 runs, so just about half the amount of runs it took him. So in cases where you are doing a LOT of runs of the same thing, I think it's impact can be more easily seen, even low levels of TH. Those like extra 2% or 3% drop chances become more magnified over the course of many runs. Anyways, back in the day, I always thought TH meant rare items got extra roll chances when dropping.. not necessarily and extra item slot like you said, but items that could drop from an NM or something would get an extra roll applied to them giving them an extra %chance to drop in an inventory pool. That was how I remember it being explained to me.
Former lvl 75 TH4 (remember when that was the cap?) THF here. My theory had always been that each monster's drop had a set % chance of dropping that wasn't modified by TH at all. Instead what happened was that each time you killed a mob an invisible set of dice were rolled. Whatever number came from that roll would be matched to the the mob's drop pool and whatever threshold you cleared would determine your drop. TH then modified this by adding in additional dice rolls, thus giving you more chances to reach those higher thresholds. As for knowing the numbers behind the ability...I don't know that it really does take away the mystery. You still have the element of superstition to it too because at the end of the day we know now what we knew then...TH affects drop rate and if you don't have that /thf or you forget that TH boosting gear you'll always wonder: was that the reason I didn't get my drop? Logically we may know that the chance for certain items is still pretty low (and as you pointed out, what items fall into each category?) but that less logical sides of our brains are always gonna stop thinking after "more TH is better"...numbers be damned.
We all have to remember TH was changed fundamentally with how it's stack and applied to mobs through the proc. Do we really know if it's always been like the post originally?
@@d.redenius5639 Based on historical data collected by players, yes, it almost certainly worked the same way. The stacking tiers of TH were an easy thing to tack on, but you'll notice that the difference between TH4 and TH14 is not terribly significant.
@@argentpuck I was more alluding to the fact TH went through a significant change with procing. Did it work similar, possibly but the values could have been altered once TH stack / proc was mainstream.
I was always told the Ultra Rare (0.1%) included things like the Thief's Knife before the change to the Sozu Rogberry pop, back when the gilsellers owned the spawn exclusively. Other than that, I was told that the Perseus' Harpe I found on Xolotl was also around that drop rate (0.1%). The only people I ever knew of having it on my server besides myself all also had all the TH4 gear like myself...because that bumped the drop rate up to 0.5%.
I would agree with Perseus's Harpe being Ultra Rare. Despite have 2 thieves with TH4 farming it, we still waiting almost a year before seeing it drop the first time. Alot of Hats though!!
I've never related to anything in your videos as much as the "lucky egg" I would refuse to do ANYTHING in game without having that on me. hahaha. These videoa bring back allllll the best times grinding ffxi
Side note, I always had this internal theory of how Dynamis gear drops worked. When you opened Dynamis the loot pool would randomly select like 5-7 pieces of gear out of all possible gear that can drop from Dynamis and would only drop those 5-7 pieces for that run. So once the Dynamis was started the group was locked into the same 5-7 pieces dropping for that run and no other pieces would drop during that run. (just a theory from a amateur software programmer and a mild understanding of "random number generator").
I helped many many people get papers for the level 50 cap. I know a thf made a huge difference in that. I would assume that would be a rare or very rare item. I remember having to kill 20-30 of them to get 1 drop. I'm pretty sure the drop rates from NMs was pretty high, since getting the pop was so rare. Did they say if the thf had to get the last hit? Or just be in the party?
I saw a big shouting match while crafting yesterday about this very subject. Its interesting to see the actual chart finally. I remember doing a three hour Kirin fight way back before Aht Urgan came out. And we got one single Earth Crystal. I actually do miss those times. I dont think seeing the numbers will ruin things per se. I'm sure some ppl may say ok, after TH9 its not worth the effort to get more. But I do like the mystery. Its fun figuring things out.
So as one last guess before you get into the stats and data, I always thought it shuffled the percentage rates. Such as one item has a 40% chance and another has 60%. TH would shuffle that. Such as one proc of TH makes it go from 40 to 50, and v the other goes from 60 to 50. Then another reverses them completely to 60 and 40.
For me, originally I thought it just increased the drop rate as a flat % increase. Didn't know how it went vs. rarer drop vs. more common drops on drops that shared the same slot like Pixie Earring and Defending Ring.
It was features (or lack of them) like this that made the community communicate with each other. These days MMO's are all about the short gain parties and almost no1 interacts with each other. Gone are the days when you would grind for several hours and force conversations. These days it's literally "Queue dungeon > go in > do dungeon > GG /goodbye, never see you again > repeat." I still play FF14 with my XI friends because of the friendships we built, whereas in XIV I haven't had many interactions outside of the novice network in forever.
8:38 "Damage parsing and efficiency game." You pretty much described FFXIV. And while i've been playing since 1.0. And am still a fan. The stat stick gear system is exactly why i have less intre4sst in playing 14. More often than not its the number 1 reason i keep coming back to play 11.
I take your point about losing some of the mystery of Vana'diel, but this game is almost 20 years old. It's a classic. We can take a few looks under the hood and still enjoy the ride.
Ultra rare is like the things people still debate whether it's real or not. Like apparently during the SKCNM campaign some of them (hard to say what considering how rare) can alledgely drop things like Cat's eye, Dense Cluster and Bayld Crystal. I somewhat agree about revealing stuff... but also there is still a metric fuckton to test. Kind of why I stopped doing as much as I got overwhelmed with how much testing I wanted to do myself... and how I'd get a billion people wanting to just tear it down and not contribute at all
We can't really complain about getting something like a ~2% increase, when it means the difference between downing... maybe 33 Leaping Lizzy's, instead of 100's. Heck, I put a project in FFXI on hold, just because Jaggedy-Eared Jack, wouldn't cough up that +1 Steal necklace, that would send me off to live―I kid you not―for nearly 3 YEARS in Movalpolos, to... 'attain', something, that I saw not other way to. I apologize if it comes off a little negative, but I am indeed one of those "Abyssea destroyed my beloved FFXI!!!!1" and left, never to look back (except for that time in 2013 where I logged in during Free Logon Campaign, looked around, realizing I had nothing to come BACK to), so perosnally, I don't care if Square peels EVERYTHING back, at this point, like going: _"LOL, During Fires Day, while holding a Phoenix Feather and waiting at the top-right corner of Attohwa Chasm during a New Moon, an invisible sky-path would open up, to the top of the peak and grant you a Regain Feather if you faced Northeast, while /emoting the last lyrics of Memoro de la ŜtonoLOLOLOL!!1"._ It's like... FINE! Reveal *it all.* The game is DONE for me, but I still love and cherish the memories and legacies it left behind.
The only current 0.1% drop rate items I can think of now is Hocho and Rabbit Charm. Before the forced pop patch of Thief Knife it was another 0.1% drop rate item and possibly the Perseus’s Harpe. I’m sure at one point the Defending Ring. There are probably a lot more Super Rare drop item such as Earthern Abjuration: Body, Ridill and Striders boots before the patch that made the drop off Simurgh Rare/Exclusive. I’m thinking drops like Leaping Boots, Emperors Hairpin and Jujitsu Gi probably fell into the very rare drop category.
It's about time. So many arguments over this one ability. I always thought how it worked was, everyone else's worked and my character's was broken. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
I always subbed Thf when hunting for any drop, Never had it as main, but if something needed to drop, sub thf was always on. My mentality was "Its not going to hurt the drop rate thats for damn sure" lol, I had the egg for a while but I tossed it, inv space was more precious to me than whatever small % if any the egg gave.
Ok a few things to understand about drops in FF11. Firstly coffers IE rewards from battles like BCNMs are not as far as i know not effected in any way from TH. Secondly "either or" drops, most notably Dring and pixie earring, are also unaffected as you have a 100% drop rate but what you get is weighted. As an example you kill KB the game makes a random number and on a 001-050 you get Dring and on 051-999 you get the less rare pixie earring. This next point i may be wrong on, but i feel one of us has dramatic misunderstanding of the chart and what it means. I thought it to be an explanation of % increases from base drop value. Say you farm slimes with 12% base chance for a common and a 10% chance for a rare th3 would change the 12%s to 33% from a 175% increase for common and from 10% to 15% from a 50% increase for rare. It shows an immense disparity in diminishing returns for low tier item with high TH. It also shows how important TH is for the 2 highest tiers as each stack adds an even better bonus than the last. Anecdotally i'm skeptical i've TH14 killed fafnir like over a dozen times with no riddil in sight, sooo i may have this all wrong.
as far as im aware there are a lot of under 1% drop rate items in the game that are just specific to items. like certain scrolls that also have a much higher drop chance from a different mob
I'm surprised this wasn't data mined years ago, is that because square actually encrypts their game data? Good for them if so, wish more devs did that.
I am 60 monk currently.. working on 60 cap break. Been like 15 years since I was here doing this last. Oztroja SUCKS! oof... getting that code with no friends lol its a rough ride.
Ah Oztroja...good times. That place was a thief playground back in the day. Hunting coffer's for astral rings & stealing gold beastmen coins was how I made my money early on.
I actually think that you are reading this chart completely wrong. On common items it a little over triples the drop rate and on the highest category it makes it 15x more likely so the rarer the item you are going for the more important it is to have a higher th. Just having th1 on the very common or ultra rare basically double the drop rate but as you get rarer the higher levels of th get more valuable. Also I always assumed it was a multiplier like it ended up being but I assumed it was a flat multiplier not tiered based on rarity.
It sure felt like Dynamix-Xarcabard AF was in that 0.1% category, back in the Zilart/Promathia days. I didn't play much after the level cap was raised, it was 75 for a long time, but so many people worked for YEARS to get a drop and it never came. That's my biggest complaint about that game is how there's a decent chance that all your hard work will never be rewarded.
Because you play on both retail servers and DSP servers (Private). Treasure Hunter may not work the same on private servers as it does on retail. On some private server a Thf main can have nearly TH30 and all jobs can have TH20.
The popular private servers typically keep the experience as close to retail as possible. What you said is like saying you can get to 99 by killing 1 mob on some servers. Yeah, but that's not really the point of it.
I remember reading an explanation along the lines of “think of TH as a dice roll” if the said item was a roll of 777 each TH gave an extra roll of the dice to try and hit that 777. This graph just explains why I always thought my TH was broken lol
LOLI remember getting my Ebisu rod.I would fish on WHM... but when it came to gutting the fish in Selbina I would hop on to my lvl 60 THF for Treasure hunter. Did it work on those guttings? I dunno but I did it anyway. And Flee helped from the outpost to Selbina anyway each time. Yes.... I did get my Ebisu and used THF each time for the guttings. I dunno if they counted as "drops".Maybe,maybe not. Who knows?
Love your videos man keep up the good work. Your FFXI nostalgia videos have got me looking to join one of the private servers, Which would you recommend? Been looking at Eden or Nasomi.
I always felt that TH increased the amount of drops too. You'll get 1-3 items from an Abyssea NM without stacking TH... but then you come with TH10+ and you suddenly see 4-7 drops.
@@jamiehav0k62 That's how I always thought of it. [MOB] has 14 items to drop, with varying chance. Since the chance for each is low, you only roll success on 3 of the items. When the chance is higher, you roll success on 7 of the items.
When i was farming for my emp weapon I've notice something and so did my friend. The items you needed to farm 50 of seem to drop by 2 with treasure hunter 7 or 8. We both noticed farming them that we would always get 2 drops with one of those level's its only one of them but i forget now.
I always thought it was an incremental increase in percentages. It is interesting to find that they 7 bins of rarity that they increment at different rates. I do think it is a little problematic that you are looking at absolutes in terms of increases in percentages. An increase of 1% for a rare drop going from TH0-TH1 doesn't sound like much, but 1 is 20% of 5; the item was already rare, but any increase to that is large, relatively speaking. As far as whether or not this reveal changes or takes away the mystery of the game, I don't really think it does. If someone was hunting for a drop, and they could do it either with or without treasure hunter, they'd choose treasure hunter. The only difference I see this making would be if someone takes a look at the table, and says "knowing what it would take for me to increase my TH, would I rather risk spending that extra time farming something." This just lets them make an educated decision and decide how they want to play the game. For me, the biggest game changing reveal came some years back, when they confirmed that none of the crafting superstitions mattered. I used to have a whole +/- system; the element of the crystal used, the element of the day of the week, the phase of the moon, the elemental direction on the compass from the star charts, whether I was looking for successful synths, skillups, or HQs.
As for them revealing it... well, if you went to Blue Gartr or any of the FFXI forums over the years, people did a lot of testing to figure stuff out. I distinctly remember many folks being like, "Thief's Knife and Dynamis hands are unnecessary. TH2 is where the biggest boost is, and anything past that is basically placebo." Quite honestly, at this point in the game's life, the official game's life, it's almost irrelevant. They way most things seem to work in the past decade for the game is procs and like how well rates for conquest/union etc. go or whatever. Honestly though, I was always paranoid that Thief was necessary to get NM drops, and it was a large part of the reason that it was my second 75 back in the day. I even got the Dynamis - Xarcabard hands. Never got a Thief's Knife until they became common though. There were times I wished I'd dedicated myself to Thief as a job in the endgame, because on HNMs many times, the one Thief at event always got to be in the alliance so that TH3~4 would be applied. I stayed the token WAR though, and I guess my Steel Cyclones were worth it.
Omg, this is the video I've been waiting for, (looks at calendar) for 15 years! I got so tired of my shell waiting for me to kill a big hnm with my pokey dagger that I started going to events as red mage. Thankfully I could do what I wanted and could give new thieves a spot and get to be the lazy red mage. If I knew this I wouldn't have bothered with doing things as thief at all. Edit: I remember when my shell went on a first attempt on Lord of Onzozo, got the claim and held it while another member was in route to give me his thief knife. We got the drop but boy was that an insignificant bump in drop chance.
I would definitely agree with you in the fact that releasing this information takes away from some of the wonder of FFXI I have loved thf ever since the beginning of the game and not just for the TH but for Eva tanking NMs solo. I never really knew how TH worked but I thought it was more of a 1% + per TH level. Despite thinking that I have kept a lucky egg in my invintory in the off chance it really does help. NMs have always been the main thing that got me hooked into FFXI starting with the fungas bettle, But I think keeping some of that mystery alive in the game is what keeps the players around.
I can't even begin to tell you the amount of times my entire party wiped leaving me to solo things only to have people sitting there going "how are you still alive?". Seriously, a thief's evasion was absolutely insane.
I found it amusing when they released the TH charts because my understanding of it was very close to how you described it, in a nutshell I thought TH 1-3 opened up extra drop slots and 4-14 slightly increased the odds. Turns out nah, it's just an increase in %. The impression I got from friends in game is how depressing it was to see disappointment in cold hard number form with the drop rates for the rarest items. I must have done 150 runs trying to farm the platemail from Vagary and ended up giving up defeated. Turns out if only I'd done about 10 times more runs I might have had a decent chance.
As a life long Thief, I can honestly say most Thieves already knew this. Not the exact numbers, but the general feeling that TH was never a huge help. It was just a help. BTW, I also had the idea it was a debuff before they announced it was a debuff. You play the job endlessly, you can start getting ideas on how it really is. And I played THF so much, being the main THF in an endgame shell back in the heyday.
I think letting us know the % increase would be good, but not the actual %'s of the drop rate. ... in other words giving us some information while still maintaining some of the mystery.
You want to see Treasure Hunter at work, go do Odyssey. Without Thief you will be lucky if you get 10 Hides or Scales from kills. As a Thief you can net close to 50.
@@6point5 As far as I know it's always been that way. The D.ring rate itself is still trash mind you, but it's not classified in any category given as TH doesn't affect it.
@@ryuail If I recall correctly there are several items with a similar drop pattern (i.e a monster would drop either one item or an alternate item 100% of the time.) It was speculated that TH would not affect these items, but I think it's much more likely that TH still worked on the rarer drop of the two. And if the rare drop was not "chosen," the "common alternative" would drop instead. That's just speculation, and is how I would code the drops if it was up to me. With how rare some drops are it's not very practical to test. Edit: Actually, it looks like it's fairly widely accepted that there are "100% drop rate" slots that are unaffected by TH. Seems like a silly way to code it.
So anyone farming low tier items definitely want wants even just TH1 to double their drop rate, at the expense of ANY sub job since no other sub job is going to allow you to clear 100% faster. Then worst case scenario (Uncommon/Rare) with even just TH1 you get a 20% drop rate increase which is nothing to scoff at, especially with all the long respawns/scarcity of the NMs. All the formula does is tell us what we already suspected. If it is worth farming to begin with, it is worth giving up a sub job for /THF or a DPS slot for a THF/.
Ultra rare items; I’m assuming things such as the defending ring or riddle sword drop rates. I think I had to kill about at least 40 or more King Behemoths before I was able to obtain the ring, and it seems that was actually lucky. There are people whom had to kill it more than a hundred times to get it.
Always thought TH1 and TH2 added an extra roll to get an item, and TH3 and TH4 just increased the % chance ... which we see is now way off. I'm curious how TH has been coded into private servers
Well it took me about 400 tries to get a full set from Lilith on VE and am a master Thf with top tear gear , Th did nothing for me at all. I think the effects of tH have been diminished over time.
I really wish they never changed Treasure Hunter, for one I believe it was better before. I believe TH1 rerolled the item drop and every TH after increased drop rate by 1%. Also TH doesn't just work with a tag now, it needs to proc and it's pretty rare unless you do SA/TA with Feint. The mob can die with no TH applied if you're not careful.
I mean, the game is old and really only the hardcore players are left. You can shield your innocent eyes if someone wants to bring up the inner workings, but having the answer after all these years is only a benefit for the general playerbase. If your whole life was dedicated to stacking Treasure Hunter before now, you may be able to justify not capping out in place of actually contributing to the fight. "Do you want a 0.5% higher chance, or do you want the fight to be over three minutes faster?"
hehe lucky egg! my character still has that in its inventory as a staple. always want to go back but i dont want to tarnish my fond memories of a great game and experience with friends long forgotten. an amazing adventure to say the least!
My question is, how did this work back in CoP era? Is it the exact same as this chart here (just cut off after TH3), or did they just scale the effectiveness out (so the max of this chart was the same effectiveness of TH3 back in the day)... There is something both fascinating, exciting, and somehow disappointing, about seeing this info. All the years of massive community experiments with thousands of data points trying to figure these things out... and now, here it is. It feels like a sign of "the end", like we're close to permanently closing the book on this game and stripping it down for all of its secrets (like the source code of an old game finally being released into public domain after many years, laying bare all of its algorithms and programming).
PicardRiker08 I agree, why come out with probably the #1 question for a long time and just laying it all out. I mean FFXI have been around 18 years, why now come out with specific data to how it works? (I’m stilling holding onto my lucky egg)
I found an ultra rare .01%, and its the pulse sword that drops off of the tier 3 Voidwatch bird NM in sky. Sigh. Back to AMAN trove for the shiny sword.
I disagree with THIS specific topic, but I'm with you overall (such as your previous video about hidden/latent effects). The stigma surrounding TH and all that jazz was so over the top to where many times people wouldn't take on certain enemies/tasks unless there was a THF present with an appropriate TH level. It was debilitating, and knowing that TH really didn't matter as much as we thought in the grand scheme of things would have been REALLY handy info to have back when I played. Again, only for TH specifically do I think they should've spilled the beans even earlier than now. When a massive chunk of your gameplay loop revolves around dropped items from enemies, a little more transparency would be great, even just a more accurate description of what Treasure Hunter DOES
TH 1-2 were always the biggest boosts, everything after that basically did nothing. It's why they nerfed Dipper Yuly down to TH 1, even though she was a 99 THF. Because TH4-14 did basically nothing, there was no reason to bring a THF when you had a pet that did the same job and was dispoable.
Yes and no... I always herd that th just added another drop slot but if knowing bck then it increased drop rates id be more active with it.. But if a middle tier drop gaind less and high tier increased more it would be worth it.. For example a carb ruby would drop more often because uncommon vs common on that mob which is is what ud be looming for in farming but the sam nin mnk gloves in temple of yugatepth or however its spelled drop rate being rare vs ultra or very rare would be beneficial.. For the more rare gets higher returnsnwith more th ability
That chart is actually wrong when you look at the graph ... The chart starts at TH0 but when you look at the graph the same % starts at TH1! Someone needs to edit that.
As a correction to my previous comment - i't looks SE actually made the mistake with their graph as the graph goes to TH15 when the cap is 14 so the graph listing TH1 should actually be TH0!
TH Graph should have remained a mystery. It's actually fun to NOT know about everything and still have some mystacism looming over subjects in a world that has been so great already for almost 20 years at keeping the mystery alive. I'm sure SE was just tired of everyone asking about it, and most of the people asking and hounding them about it were the Players tired of going through hell to increase drop rates grinding for gear, and realizing every time, that even before SE released the graph and told us "it wasnt really worth it in the end to REQUIRE Treasure Hunter," ........ that it wasn't really worth it in the end to REQUIRE treasure hunter lol.
The game dev in me was happy about the reveal of what TH did, but the FFXI player in me was like "noooooo! that was part of the mystery!" TH back in the day was more superstition than anything else, lol. Right down to "let the THF get the last hit!", lol. Good times.
There still *are* conspiracy theories. I was just playing about 2 weeks ago and someone told me TH affects the chance to learn blue magic. I've never heard that before.
First 10 yrs playing, being from sandy, only saw him once. Then took a break, came back, spawned in ronfare got him 10min later w drop. Sandy ronfare all day son.
Unfortunately, FFXI is just spreadsheets and damage parsing in 2020. This just adds another spreadsheet to the mix. People at the top only care about min-maxing which is the nature of every game like this. Its been this way forever (SAM with their X-hit builds). When the game was still cross platform; many players couldn't swap entire sets of gear in on a whim . it used to take like 3-4 macros to WS on PS2 and Xbox 360; which was the original design limitation. Honestly, I hope the private servers use (or already have used) this data to accurately reproduce the effects of TH in their own code.
I have to disagree. I found all the mythical nonsense in FFXI (like Four-Leaf Mandragora Buds, but also things like "craft facing this direction for this effect") very tedious. It was either totally meaningless player speculation that people latched onto (which happens to be true) or the game was designed to be so obfuscating and player-hostile as to make many things pointless. FFXI in its original form was rather player-hostile, but SE wouldn't go that far... except with regards to Absolute Virtue. They went with ridiculous over-the-top obfuscation once and got burned multiple times for it. Personally, knowing that I can go out /THF45 or even just on Ranger popping Bounty Shot or Beastmaster with DipperYuly makes me much happier than being forced to drag out Thief for a nominally better chance while using a less efficient or less fun job.
![[DRAGON BALL LEGENDS REVEALS ＆ STUFF] LEGENDS FESTIVAL 2024 Special Edition Part 2](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/af0phKxitX8/mqdefault.jpg)
You have the best intro ever. Socom and FFXI cases on top of your PS2. Literally my teenage hood. Miss those days..
Thanks dude! Some of my favorite games as well, had to throw the Socom in there
@@Huntin4GamesChannel I always liked Rainbow Six 3 and Ghost Recon better than Socom, but Socom was solid too! Did you play either of those back then?
Would be even better if you pan to the TV and see FFXI on at the title screen or something.
Can still play Socom, lots of people play on ps2 emulator now.
Chris Silz Is cheating still possible? I heard about that but also heard that people still cheat.
I'd imagine the devs were just tired of being asked about treasure hunter. Funny how, like you said, their answer for nearly every other question was "we have no plans for that". But for th they brought a graph with them.
Was also a rumor that having a millionaire's desk in you MH that it would give you TH since furniture gave hidden effects
or having the lucky egg in your inventory.
THIEF LAST HIT OMG
That rabbit nm's foot from ronfaure as well. Haha
+ 4 Leaf Mandragora Bud
the 4 leaf mandy bud lol
Honestly I'm really glad they shared TH mechanics. I remember farming coffer keys with a group and they just had a THF AFK in exp range because they thought the THF just had to be present. Or the myth about the THF needing the killing blow. That drew out A LOT of God fights.
I think it’s amazing.
It’s like an old astronaut on his death bed telling us about aliens.
Ultra rare has to be Defending ring. Part of what made XI special and unreplicable is the mystery that we had behind various things. It was fun trying to figure those mysteries out and sure, we could compile drop histories to work out percentages, but who could have imagined there were rarity tiers?
As an ex-player and thief main of about 4 years (2007-2011) I am personally happy to see the direct numbers behind the mysterious "Treasure Hunter" job trait. But I'm also glad SE never released this chart until now. It was just one more thing for the community to contemplate between themselves, and "not knowing everything," added just a little bit of flavor and mystery to the game.
This is roughly how I expected it worked. Obviously didn't have exact numbers, but the basics now confirm themselves. TH 0 - 1 is a giant boost for general farming, with more common item drop rates doubling. 1-2 is still a significant boost. 3 and 4 less so, but significant enough that I'd much rather be out with TH4 farming, than another job /thf (at 75.)
As for rare items, it's still always beneficial to have TH. The numbers are small on paper, but still significant. .1 to .4 (TH 0 to TH 4 on an Ultra Rare, which is all we had back in the day) is still 1/1000 drop rate increased to 1/250. And with TH 14 it would be 1/67. TH 0 to TH 14 on Very rare items is 1/100 increased to 1/10.
Treasure Hunter has always been helpful, but not necessary(especially at lower levels). Of course we didn't know exactly how it worked, but I always had that sense anyways. I farmed tons of low level nm stuff without thief, and got drops back in the day.
But it definitely helps on a lot of things. For example, someone posted a video about spamming lady lilith (one of the newer HTMBs) on VE, and it took them 239 runs to get all of her drops. He was doing it as NIN/WAR with no TH at all. I did it on MNK/THF with a TH+1 item(so essentially TH3), and I got all of her drops in a little over 100 runs, so just about half the amount of runs it took him. So in cases where you are doing a LOT of runs of the same thing, I think it's impact can be more easily seen, even low levels of TH. Those like extra 2% or 3% drop chances become more magnified over the course of many runs.
Anyways, back in the day, I always thought TH meant rare items got extra roll chances when dropping.. not necessarily and extra item slot like you said, but items that could drop from an NM or something would get an extra roll applied to them giving them an extra %chance to drop in an inventory pool. That was how I remember it being explained to me.
Former lvl 75 TH4 (remember when that was the cap?) THF here. My theory had always been that each monster's drop had a set % chance of dropping that wasn't modified by TH at all. Instead what happened was that each time you killed a mob an invisible set of dice were rolled. Whatever number came from that roll would be matched to the the mob's drop pool and whatever threshold you cleared would determine your drop. TH then modified this by adding in additional dice rolls, thus giving you more chances to reach those higher thresholds.
As for knowing the numbers behind the ability...I don't know that it really does take away the mystery. You still have the element of superstition to it too because at the end of the day we know now what we knew then...TH affects drop rate and if you don't have that /thf or you forget that TH boosting gear you'll always wonder: was that the reason I didn't get my drop? Logically we may know that the chance for certain items is still pretty low (and as you pointed out, what items fall into each category?) but that less logical sides of our brains are always gonna stop thinking after "more TH is better"...numbers be damned.
We all have to remember TH was changed fundamentally with how it's stack and applied to mobs through the proc. Do we really know if it's always been like the post originally?
@@d.redenius5639 Based on historical data collected by players, yes, it almost certainly worked the same way. The stacking tiers of TH were an easy thing to tack on, but you'll notice that the difference between TH4 and TH14 is not terribly significant.
@@argentpuck I was more alluding to the fact TH went through a significant change with procing. Did it work similar, possibly but the values could have been altered once TH stack / proc was mainstream.
I was always told the Ultra Rare (0.1%) included things like the Thief's Knife before the change to the Sozu Rogberry pop, back when the gilsellers owned the spawn exclusively. Other than that, I was told that the Perseus' Harpe I found on Xolotl was also around that drop rate (0.1%). The only people I ever knew of having it on my server besides myself all also had all the TH4 gear like myself...because that bumped the drop rate up to 0.5%.
I would agree with Perseus's Harpe being Ultra Rare. Despite have 2 thieves with TH4 farming it, we still waiting almost a year before seeing it drop the first time. Alot of Hats though!!
I've never related to anything in your videos as much as the "lucky egg" I would refuse to do ANYTHING in game without having that on me. hahaha. These videoa bring back allllll the best times grinding ffxi
Redneck Jedi22 Iv kept one in my invintory for years, I’m like 99% sure it does nothing......but you never really know right?!
Haha I remember I ate it once by accident and had to go farm another one
Side note, I always had this internal theory of how Dynamis gear drops worked. When you opened Dynamis the loot pool would randomly select like 5-7 pieces of gear out of all possible gear that can drop from Dynamis and would only drop those 5-7 pieces for that run. So once the Dynamis was started the group was locked into the same 5-7 pieces dropping for that run and no other pieces would drop during that run. (just a theory from a amateur software programmer and a mild understanding of "random number generator").
Haha ya!
I helped many many people get papers for the level 50 cap. I know a thf made a huge difference in that. I would assume that would be a rare or very rare item. I remember having to kill 20-30 of them to get 1 drop. I'm pretty sure the drop rates from NMs was pretty high, since getting the pop was so rare.
Did they say if the thf had to get the last hit? Or just be in the party?
I saw a big shouting match while crafting yesterday about this very subject. Its interesting to see the actual chart finally. I remember doing a three hour Kirin fight way back before Aht Urgan came out. And we got one single Earth Crystal. I actually do miss those times. I dont think seeing the numbers will ruin things per se. I'm sure some ppl may say ok, after TH9 its not worth the effort to get more. But I do like the mystery. Its fun figuring things out.
So as one last guess before you get into the stats and data, I always thought it shuffled the percentage rates. Such as one item has a 40% chance and another has 60%. TH would shuffle that. Such as one proc of TH makes it go from 40 to 50, and v the other goes from 60 to 50. Then another reverses them completely to 60 and 40.
For me, originally I thought it just increased the drop rate as a flat % increase.
Didn't know how it went vs. rarer drop vs. more common drops on drops that shared the same slot like Pixie Earring and Defending Ring.
What's the drop rate for kraken club?
It was features (or lack of them) like this that made the community communicate with each other. These days MMO's are all about the short gain parties and almost no1 interacts with each other. Gone are the days when you would grind for several hours and force conversations. These days it's literally "Queue dungeon > go in > do dungeon > GG /goodbye, never see you again > repeat." I still play FF14 with my XI friends because of the friendships we built, whereas in XIV I haven't had many interactions outside of the novice network in forever.
Perfectly said!
8:38 "Damage parsing and efficiency game." You pretty much described FFXIV. And while i've been playing since 1.0. And am still a fan. The stat stick gear system is exactly why i have less intre4sst in playing 14. More often than not its the number 1 reason i keep coming back to play 11.
I take your point about losing some of the mystery of Vana'diel, but this game is almost 20 years old. It's a classic. We can take a few looks under the hood and still enjoy the ride.
Haha that’s a fair point, I do tend to bury my head in the sand a bit
Ultra rare is like the things people still debate whether it's real or not. Like apparently during the SKCNM campaign some of them (hard to say what considering how rare) can alledgely drop things like Cat's eye, Dense Cluster and Bayld Crystal.
I somewhat agree about revealing stuff... but also there is still a metric fuckton to test. Kind of why I stopped doing as much as I got overwhelmed with how much testing I wanted to do myself... and how I'd get a billion people wanting to just tear it down and not contribute at all
We can't really complain about getting something like a ~2% increase, when it means the difference between downing... maybe 33 Leaping Lizzy's, instead of 100's. Heck, I put a project in FFXI on hold, just because Jaggedy-Eared Jack, wouldn't cough up that +1 Steal necklace, that would send me off to live―I kid you not―for nearly 3 YEARS in Movalpolos, to... 'attain', something, that I saw not other way to.
I apologize if it comes off a little negative, but I am indeed one of those "Abyssea destroyed my beloved FFXI!!!!1" and left, never to look back (except for that time in 2013 where I logged in during Free Logon Campaign, looked around, realizing I had nothing to come BACK to), so perosnally, I don't care if Square peels EVERYTHING back, at this point, like going: _"LOL, During Fires Day, while holding a Phoenix Feather and waiting at the top-right corner of Attohwa Chasm during a New Moon, an invisible sky-path would open up, to the top of the peak and grant you a Regain Feather if you faced Northeast, while /emoting the last lyrics of Memoro de la ŜtonoLOLOLOL!!1"._ It's like... FINE! Reveal *it all.* The game is DONE for me, but I still love and cherish the memories and legacies it left behind.
My heart skipped when I saw your text of Leaping Lizzy.
The only current 0.1% drop rate items I can think of now is Hocho and Rabbit Charm. Before the forced pop patch of Thief Knife it was another 0.1% drop rate item and possibly the Perseus’s Harpe. I’m sure at one point the Defending Ring. There are probably a lot more Super Rare drop item such as Earthern Abjuration: Body, Ridill and Striders boots before the patch that made the drop off Simurgh Rare/Exclusive. I’m thinking drops like Leaping Boots, Emperors Hairpin and Jujitsu Gi probably fell into the very rare drop category.
Haha was just thinking that damn Rabbit Charm....
Ig - Alima
It's about time. So many arguments over this one ability.
I always thought how it worked was, everyone else's worked and my character's was broken. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
I always subbed Thf when hunting for any drop, Never had it as main, but if something needed to drop, sub thf was always on. My mentality was "Its not going to hurt the drop rate thats for damn sure" lol, I had the egg for a while but I tossed it, inv space was more precious to me than whatever small % if any the egg gave.
I think the ultra rare items are those Pulse weapons - they have an awful drop rate, which is why they put in so many other avenues to get one.
Ok a few things to understand about drops in FF11. Firstly coffers IE rewards from battles like BCNMs are not as far as i know not effected in any way from TH. Secondly "either or" drops, most notably Dring and pixie earring, are also unaffected as you have a 100% drop rate but what you get is weighted. As an example you kill KB the game makes a random number and on a 001-050 you get Dring and on 051-999 you get the less rare pixie earring.
This next point i may be wrong on, but i feel one of us has dramatic misunderstanding of the chart and what it means. I thought it to be an explanation of % increases from base drop value. Say you farm slimes with 12% base chance for a common and a 10% chance for a rare th3 would change the 12%s to 33% from a 175% increase for common and from 10% to 15% from a 50% increase for rare. It shows an immense disparity in diminishing returns for low tier item with high TH. It also shows how important TH is for the 2 highest tiers as each stack adds an even better bonus than the last. Anecdotally i'm skeptical i've TH14 killed fafnir like over a dozen times with no riddil in sight, sooo i may have this all wrong.
as far as im aware there are a lot of under 1% drop rate items in the game that are just specific to items. like certain scrolls that also have a much higher drop chance from a different mob
I'm surprised this wasn't data mined years ago, is that because square actually encrypts their game data? Good for them if so, wish more devs did that.
The .1% drop rate is an exclusive category for Pulse Weapons.
I always had a theory that stacking extra +Light elemental resistance helped because under job traits its a light based ability. Obviously wrong lol
I am 60 monk currently.. working on 60 cap break. Been like 15 years since I was here doing this last.
Oztroja SUCKS! oof... getting that code with no friends lol its a rough ride.
Ah Oztroja...good times. That place was a thief playground back in the day. Hunting coffer's for astral rings & stealing gold beastmen coins was how I made my money early on.
I came back after 8 years and just cleared Oztroja and the Orc stronghold. Now that was a pain! But it can be done!!
I actually think that you are reading this chart completely wrong. On common items it a little over triples the drop rate and on the highest category it makes it 15x more likely so the rarer the item you are going for the more important it is to have a higher th. Just having th1 on the very common or ultra rare basically double the drop rate but as you get rarer the higher levels of th get more valuable.
Also I always assumed it was a multiplier like it ended up being but I assumed it was a flat multiplier not tiered based on rarity.
That’s fair, it definitely is a huge benefit for common items for sure
3:07
The Thief’s Knife, Kraken’s Club & Ridill?
This sounds perfect
Cassie's earring?
Used to farm silk and onions. Two items I found with low drop rates were peacock charm and defending ring.
I would assume bee chips are common and silk is uncommon.
D ring isnt affected by TH or drop rate. It shares a slot with pixie earring and one of the items is 100% drop.
Tyler Shifman I dunno how many stupid shanks I served that lion and no ring drop I just gave up .
It sure felt like Dynamix-Xarcabard AF was in that 0.1% category, back in the Zilart/Promathia days. I didn't play much after the level cap was raised, it was 75 for a long time, but so many people worked for YEARS to get a drop and it never came. That's my biggest complaint about that game is how there's a decent chance that all your hard work will never be rewarded.
Because you play on both retail servers and DSP servers (Private). Treasure Hunter may not work the same on private servers as it does on retail. On some private server a Thf main can have nearly TH30 and all jobs can have TH20.
The popular private servers typically keep the experience as close to retail as possible. What you said is like saying you can get to 99 by killing 1 mob on some servers. Yeah, but that's not really the point of it.
I remember reading an explanation along the lines of “think of TH as a dice roll” if the said item was a roll of 777 each TH gave an extra roll of the dice to try and hit that 777. This graph just explains why I always thought my TH was broken lol
LOLI remember getting my Ebisu rod.I would fish on WHM... but when it came to gutting the fish in Selbina I would hop on to my lvl 60 THF for Treasure hunter. Did it work on those guttings? I dunno but I did it anyway. And Flee helped from the outpost to Selbina anyway each time. Yes.... I did get my Ebisu and used THF each time for the guttings. I dunno if they counted as "drops".Maybe,maybe not. Who knows?
Love your videos man keep up the good work. Your FFXI nostalgia videos have got me looking to join one of the private servers, Which would you recommend? Been looking at Eden or Nasomi.
Been loving Eden myself! Thanks dude!
I always felt that TH increased the amount of drops too. You'll get 1-3 items from an Abyssea NM without stacking TH... but then you come with TH10+ and you suddenly see 4-7 drops.
well yeah if Abyssea nms have a lot of drop slots to begin with, increasing the% of each drop increases the amount of drops...
@@jamiehav0k62 That's how I always thought of it. [MOB] has 14 items to drop, with varying chance. Since the chance for each is low, you only roll success on 3 of the items. When the chance is higher, you roll success on 7 of the items.
When i was farming for my emp weapon I've notice something and so did my friend. The items you needed to farm 50 of seem to drop by 2 with treasure hunter 7 or 8. We both noticed farming them that we would always get 2 drops with one of those level's its only one of them but i forget now.
I always thought it was an incremental increase in percentages. It is interesting to find that they 7 bins of rarity that they increment at different rates. I do think it is a little problematic that you are looking at absolutes in terms of increases in percentages. An increase of 1% for a rare drop going from TH0-TH1 doesn't sound like much, but 1 is 20% of 5; the item was already rare, but any increase to that is large, relatively speaking. As far as whether or not this reveal changes or takes away the mystery of the game, I don't really think it does. If someone was hunting for a drop, and they could do it either with or without treasure hunter, they'd choose treasure hunter. The only difference I see this making would be if someone takes a look at the table, and says "knowing what it would take for me to increase my TH, would I rather risk spending that extra time farming something." This just lets them make an educated decision and decide how they want to play the game. For me, the biggest game changing reveal came some years back, when they confirmed that none of the crafting superstitions mattered. I used to have a whole +/- system; the element of the crystal used, the element of the day of the week, the phase of the moon, the elemental direction on the compass from the star charts, whether I was looking for successful synths, skillups, or HQs.
As for them revealing it... well, if you went to Blue Gartr or any of the FFXI forums over the years, people did a lot of testing to figure stuff out. I distinctly remember many folks being like, "Thief's Knife and Dynamis hands are unnecessary. TH2 is where the biggest boost is, and anything past that is basically placebo."
Quite honestly, at this point in the game's life, the official game's life, it's almost irrelevant. They way most things seem to work in the past decade for the game is procs and like how well rates for conquest/union etc. go or whatever.
Honestly though, I was always paranoid that Thief was necessary to get NM drops, and it was a large part of the reason that it was my second 75 back in the day. I even got the Dynamis - Xarcabard hands. Never got a Thief's Knife until they became common though.
There were times I wished I'd dedicated myself to Thief as a job in the endgame, because on HNMs many times, the one Thief at event always got to be in the alliance so that TH3~4 would be applied. I stayed the token WAR though, and I guess my Steel Cyclones were worth it.
Duuude. This came at the perfect time! Just hit 119 and working on boosting TH to its max.
Omg, this is the video I've been waiting for, (looks at calendar) for 15 years! I got so tired of my shell waiting for me to kill a big hnm with my pokey dagger that I started going to events as red mage. Thankfully I could do what I wanted and could give new thieves a spot and get to be the lazy red mage.
If I knew this I wouldn't have bothered with doing things as thief at all.
Edit: I remember when my shell went on a first attempt on Lord of Onzozo, got the claim and held it while another member was in route to give me his thief knife. We got the drop but boy was that an insignificant bump in drop chance.
Isn’t it hilarious now looking back??
If you didn’t have a wild rarab tail and a lucky egg in your inventory, you weren’t treasure hunting right.
Brilliant comment about the Lucky Egg! That was me! 😂
my friend swore by the 4 leaf mandragora bud in his mog house
Lol I used the 4 leaf bud also, never really thought it did any thing.
Hahah and me
Yes the mandy leaf trick whenever you farmed/xp'd them lmao
Evasion +10 Hp +10 😂
I would say defending ring would be ultra rare, as well as Kclub etc.
I think K club too, not sure tho. I know I had a 3some that did it at least 20x each and never got it. 0/60+
Fkin bcnms
Yup, that’s a magic find chart, looks pretty similar to the diablo 2 one
I would definitely agree with you in the fact that releasing this information takes away from some of the wonder of FFXI
I have loved thf ever since the beginning of the game and not just for the TH but for Eva tanking NMs solo. I never really knew how TH worked but I thought it was more of a 1% + per TH level. Despite thinking that I have kept a lucky egg in my invintory in the off chance it really does help.
NMs have always been the main thing that got me hooked into FFXI starting with the fungas bettle, But I think keeping some of that mystery alive in the game is what keeps the players around.
Well said!
I can't even begin to tell you the amount of times my entire party wiped leaving me to solo things only to have people sitting there going "how are you still alive?". Seriously, a thief's evasion was absolutely insane.
I found it amusing when they released the TH charts because my understanding of it was very close to how you described it, in a nutshell I thought TH 1-3 opened up extra drop slots and 4-14 slightly increased the odds. Turns out nah, it's just an increase in %. The impression I got from friends in game is how depressing it was to see disappointment in cold hard number form with the drop rates for the rarest items. I must have done 150 runs trying to farm the platemail from Vagary and ended up giving up defeated. Turns out if only I'd done about 10 times more runs I might have had a decent chance.
As a life long Thief, I can honestly say most Thieves already knew this. Not the exact numbers, but the general feeling that TH was never a huge help. It was just a help.
BTW, I also had the idea it was a debuff before they announced it was a debuff. You play the job endlessly, you can start getting ideas on how it really is. And I played THF so much, being the main THF in an endgame shell back in the heyday.
I think letting us know the % increase would be good, but not the actual %'s of the drop rate. ... in other words giving us some information while still maintaining some of the mystery.
What about the effect of having Carbuncles Ruby, four leaf mandragora bud and the Wild Rabbit Tail along with TH1?!
I thought, and still think, luck items help for drop rate. I still carry lucky egg, rabbit foot and 4 leaf mandragon
You want to see Treasure Hunter at work, go do Odyssey.
Without Thief you will be lucky if you get 10 Hides or Scales from kills. As a Thief you can net close to 50.
Ochiodo's Kote had THE crappiest drop rate. I camped mee deggi the punisher 100s of times and only got the drop once
Charles Dziedziech Agreed and that because Treasure Hunter doesn’t apply to this 2 NMs.
We all did!
Ultra rare is def d.ring. I'd say things like Byakkos Haidate would be in very/super rare.. but yeah, that's not going to be defined.
D.ring & Pixie Earring are 100% drop rate. One or the other will always drop when killing King B, so it's not even on the rarity spectrum!
@@ryuail is that a new thing? as in new in the past 10 years, lol.. Back when I played, only a few ppl on Alexander server had a d.ring.
@@6point5 As far as I know it's always been that way. The D.ring rate itself is still trash mind you, but it's not classified in any category given as TH doesn't affect it.
@@ryuail If I recall correctly there are several items with a similar drop pattern (i.e a monster would drop either one item or an alternate item 100% of the time.) It was speculated that TH would not affect these items, but I think it's much more likely that TH still worked on the rarer drop of the two. And if the rare drop was not "chosen," the "common alternative" would drop instead.
That's just speculation, and is how I would code the drops if it was up to me. With how rare some drops are it's not very practical to test.
Edit: Actually, it looks like it's fairly widely accepted that there are "100% drop rate" slots that are unaffected by TH. Seems like a silly way to code it.
So anyone farming low tier items definitely want wants even just TH1 to double their drop rate, at the expense of ANY sub job since no other sub job is going to allow you to clear 100% faster. Then worst case scenario (Uncommon/Rare) with even just TH1 you get a 20% drop rate increase which is nothing to scoff at, especially with all the long respawns/scarcity of the NMs. All the formula does is tell us what we already suspected. If it is worth farming to begin with, it is worth giving up a sub job for /THF or a DPS slot for a THF/.
Ultra rare items; I’m assuming things such as the defending ring or riddle sword drop rates. I think I had to kill about at least 40 or more King Behemoths before I was able to obtain the ring, and it seems that was actually lucky. There are people whom had to kill it more than a hundred times to get it.
I assumed the .1% stuff was your "Spawn once a week" NM drops. Been YEARS so I'm shooting in the dark.
Always thought TH1 and TH2 added an extra roll to get an item, and TH3 and TH4 just increased the % chance ... which we see is now way off. I'm curious how TH has been coded into private servers
the way you mentioned.
eden corrected this and applied the real formula and people complained.....
I love this idea, that they changed as it got deeper into the traits
Haha people will always complain, but i was curious what Edens implementation was
Well it took me about 400 tries to get a full set from Lilith on VE and am a master Thf with top tear gear , Th did nothing for me at all. I think the effects of tH have been diminished over time.
I really wish they never changed Treasure Hunter, for one I believe it was better before. I believe TH1 rerolled the item drop and every TH after increased drop rate by 1%. Also TH doesn't just work with a tag now, it needs to proc and it's pretty rare unless you do SA/TA with Feint. The mob can die with no TH applied if you're not careful.
I mean, the game is old and really only the hardcore players are left. You can shield your innocent eyes if someone wants to bring up the inner workings, but having the answer after all these years is only a benefit for the general playerbase. If your whole life was dedicated to stacking Treasure Hunter before now, you may be able to justify not capping out in place of actually contributing to the fight. "Do you want a 0.5% higher chance, or do you want the fight to be over three minutes faster?"
I can't read the chart. Can you pos it somewhere, please, and provide a link in the descri[tion?
hehe lucky egg! my character still has that in its inventory as a staple. always want to go back but i dont want to tarnish my fond memories of a great game and experience with friends long forgotten. an amazing adventure to say the least!
.1% drop rate? Hello Defender Ring? Lol
Did the THF need to get the last hit in order to get the TH perk activate? Or just be in hate list? Or just be in the party?
My question is, how did this work back in CoP era? Is it the exact same as this chart here (just cut off after TH3), or did they just scale the effectiveness out (so the max of this chart was the same effectiveness of TH3 back in the day)... There is something both fascinating, exciting, and somehow disappointing, about seeing this info. All the years of massive community experiments with thousands of data points trying to figure these things out... and now, here it is. It feels like a sign of "the end", like we're close to permanently closing the book on this game and stripping it down for all of its secrets (like the source code of an old game finally being released into public domain after many years, laying bare all of its algorithms and programming).
PicardRiker08 I agree, why come out with probably the #1 question for a long time and just laying it all out. I mean FFXI have been around 18 years, why now come out with specific data to how it works? (I’m stilling holding onto my lucky egg)
Very curious myself if it was ever different! They did add the visual number indicator and proccing system, so it’s possible it was different
I found an ultra rare .01%, and its the pulse sword that drops off of the tier 3 Voidwatch bird NM in sky. Sigh. Back to AMAN trove for the shiny sword.
I disagree with THIS specific topic, but I'm with you overall (such as your previous video about hidden/latent effects). The stigma surrounding TH and all that jazz was so over the top to where many times people wouldn't take on certain enemies/tasks unless there was a THF present with an appropriate TH level. It was debilitating, and knowing that TH really didn't matter as much as we thought in the grand scheme of things would have been REALLY handy info to have back when I played.
Again, only for TH specifically do I think they should've spilled the beans even earlier than now. When a massive chunk of your gameplay loop revolves around dropped items from enemies, a little more transparency would be great, even just a more accurate description of what Treasure Hunter DOES
An interesting take! Like where your heads at
TIL there are FOURTEEN levels to Treasure Hunter.
TH 1-2 were always the biggest boosts, everything after that basically did nothing. It's why they nerfed Dipper Yuly down to TH 1, even though she was a 99 THF. Because TH4-14 did basically nothing, there was no reason to bring a THF when you had a pet that did the same job and was dispoable.
The main thing I remember about TH back in the day was that TH1 only worked for non rare or ex items, this was FACT back in the day lol.
iirc they also mentioned position doesnt matter on crafting no?
I do believe that’s been confirmed :’( not sure I’ll stop
Do you have a link for this interview with Square Enix? I can't seem to find it.
forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/56550
Huntin 4 Games thanks ^^
Am I the only one who wants to know what operating system he’s running? Or how his game looks so HD and the animations look so up to date and awesome?
Is the audio the actual audio in the clip? It looks like the footage is ''lipsinking'' to the audio.
Yes and no...
I always herd that th just added another drop slot but if knowing bck then it increased drop rates id be more active with it..
But if a middle tier drop gaind less and high tier increased more it would be worth it..
For example a carb ruby would drop more often because uncommon vs common on that mob which is is what ud be looming for in farming but the sam nin mnk gloves in temple of yugatepth or however its spelled drop rate being rare vs ultra or very rare would be beneficial.. For the more rare gets higher returnsnwith more th ability
Lovely intro for yar video!
That chart is actually wrong when you look at the graph ... The chart starts at TH0 but when you look at the graph the same % starts at TH1! Someone needs to edit that.
As a correction to my previous comment - i't looks SE actually made the mistake with their graph as the graph goes to TH15 when the cap is 14 so the graph listing TH1 should actually be TH0!
TH Graph should have remained a mystery. It's actually fun to NOT know about everything and still have some mystacism looming over subjects in a world that has been so great already for almost 20 years at keeping the mystery alive. I'm sure SE was just tired of everyone asking about it, and most of the people asking and hounding them about it were the Players tired of going through hell to increase drop rates grinding for gear, and realizing every time, that even before SE released the graph and told us "it wasnt really worth it in the end to REQUIRE Treasure Hunter," ........ that it wasn't really worth it in the end to REQUIRE treasure hunter lol.
Defending Ring for sure has a horrendous drop rate
I thought it was amazing and great at first, but you might have a point, that it's kind of a waste.
The game dev in me was happy about the reveal of what TH did, but the FFXI player in me was like "noooooo! that was part of the mystery!" TH back in the day was more superstition than anything else, lol. Right down to "let the THF get the last hit!", lol. Good times.
Thank you for bringing math to the children who can't go to school
Love this video, there were so many conspiracy theories about TH back in the day it was so funny.
There still *are* conspiracy theories. I was just playing about 2 weeks ago and someone told me TH affects the chance to learn blue magic. I've never heard that before.
Great video maker and commentary. Needs wider audience.
.1% drop?
::laughs in Jaggedy Eared Jack::
First 10 yrs playing, being from sandy, only saw him once. Then took a break, came back, spawned in ronfare got him 10min later w drop. Sandy ronfare all day son.
Unfortunately, FFXI is just spreadsheets and damage parsing in 2020. This just adds another spreadsheet to the mix. People at the top only care about min-maxing which is the nature of every game like this. Its been this way forever (SAM with their X-hit builds). When the game was still cross platform; many players couldn't swap entire sets of gear in on a whim . it used to take like 3-4 macros to WS on PS2 and Xbox 360; which was the original design limitation. Honestly, I hope the private servers use (or already have used) this data to accurately reproduce the effects of TH in their own code.
What was the ultra rare item? K club?
I'm curious, with is ultra rare drop rate. Are there things that have simply never dropped? Things that might even be worthless now in today's game.
I just want a Ridill for my extremely outdated WAR/NIN so I can spam Rampage on random mobs with NPCs.
oof, the audio is just ever so slightly odd, but none the less love the video
Two of the best from ps2 generation FF XI and Socom love them.
make a discord , would love to chat more about this and several other mechanics of the game
I like the mystery like you do.
I have to disagree. I found all the mythical nonsense in FFXI (like Four-Leaf Mandragora Buds, but also things like "craft facing this direction for this effect") very tedious. It was either totally meaningless player speculation that people latched onto (which happens to be true) or the game was designed to be so obfuscating and player-hostile as to make many things pointless. FFXI in its original form was rather player-hostile, but SE wouldn't go that far... except with regards to Absolute Virtue. They went with ridiculous over-the-top obfuscation once and got burned multiple times for it.
Personally, knowing that I can go out /THF45 or even just on Ranger popping Bounty Shot or Beastmaster with DipperYuly makes me much happier than being forced to drag out Thief for a nominally better chance while using a less efficient or less fun job.
Fair point!