The Origin of the Bowie Knife
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- Interview of Mr. Mcmickel by Alex McDuffie regarding the origins of the "Bowie Knife"
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battlefortexas....
/ battlefortexas
/ battlefortexas
/ battlefortexas
Finally, a scholarly presentation without the macho BS or insane drum music. This man knows his stuff, and presents it well.
+tom jackson like real history is.....it needs no fanfare.
tom jackson ,
Yes, well done indeed. As I have heard over the years; “If you can’t dazzle them with your brilliance, then baffle them with your bullshit.”
It was once said, "my gimmick is that I don't have one".
People always seem to dislike fans until they're the fans themselves.
He won't get many followers without fireworks or music. Sad but true. You must have more than a two second attention span to appreciate a scholarly lecture. Gen Z's clicked off after the first two seconds followed closely by all the other GENS with the exception of the Baby Boomers who grew up without the enabling behaviors associated with all things electronic .
A very good lesson about the influence of the province of New Spain (later Mexico) and ultimately the material culture of Spain on the origin of the famous Bowie knife. In Spain in the 18th century there was the so-called "flamenco knife", which received this name because it was used by the gypsies of southern Spain, whose main popular dance was "flamenco". I am going to leave you a link with a video of a Spanish expert on knives from our nation and empire who explains it. Best regards from Spain, from a lover of Hawken rifles.
Fascinating stuff, I could listen to this gentleman talk about history and knives all day.
We would like to hear the whole interview, and anything else this gent could teach us!
this was too short
Yepp, it was.
So the question is, where is the rest of it?
Damn that Texas Clip! What a beautiful piece
I sometimes get so happy when someone tells exactly what I was wanting to know. Thanks a lot, great piece.
Hmm, pretty interesting stuff to know, my mother got me a bowie knife for Christmas one year and while it's not the best out there it's still something very dear to me so knowing a bit more about the history of the blade type is nice.
I own a 53 year or possibly older Bowie , I was my fathers who had the handle changed to a deer bone handle . He found it when he we 14 . It had very bad gun blueing on it so I buffed it out with some zam & rouge & cleaned it up as best I could .its looks way better now cleaner , neater it dose have a brass finger guard on it . I use to have to keep it oiled with mineral oil so it would not rust but a friend told my about a metal buffing compound that you can use on it that will keep the rust away for years so I’m going to clean it with Crome & brass cleaner then clean off the oils & buff it later . It’s nice at 1-1/2 wide & 11-1/2 long handle to tip , shape as a razor & has BOWIE stamped in the blade in big bold letters .
A very good lesson about the influence of the province of New Spain (later Mexico) and ultimately the material culture of Spain on the origin of the famous Bowie knife. In Spain in the 18th century there was the so-called "flamenco knife", which received this name because it was used by the gypsies of southern Spain, whose main popular dance was "flamenco". I am going to leave you a link with a video of a Spanish expert on knives from our nation and empire who explains it. Best regards from Spain, from a lover of Hawken rifles.
In the historical context: Bowie knife = big knife. For the modern-day evolution of the bowie knife, the work of knifemakers like Bill Bagwell was critical and his book is well worth a read.
Excellent video, texasmediateam. I enjoyed your presentation a lot.
The Bowie knife has a subculture or fan base of its very own. I too, admire the Bowie knives of old and new. Thank you for your video, sir.
I love RUclips. You get all the experts weighing in on every possible subject and refuting one another. It's all so entertaining. I love being entertained!
Looking for part 2+ loved it.
Love to hear the entire interview!
Interesting history and I think pretty "spot-on". I appreciate you referring to the clip point as a "Texas Clip" and is a later style. However, I must add that his name was pronounced Boo-ie. It has Scottish origins and comes from the Scottish Gaelic word "buidh" , pronounced boo-ie, which means yellow. It was adopted as a surname in the 1600's in Scotland and no doubt originated as a physical characteristic. As Jim was from Kentucky, which had many Scots immigrants, I am certain the Scottish pronunciation was used. The pronunciation "Bow-ie" comes from the English, who couldn't, or wouldn't, pronounce Gaelic words correctly.
You are correct.
“BOO-wee”
One of Jim’s ancestors told me that the name was mis-pronounced even back in Jim’s time.
@@arctodussimus6198 you mean Jims descendants
@@chrishansen8806 LOL
I had a Scottish teacher at school...Mr Bowie (pronounced "Bow-ee"). Just saying.
Finally, someone who pronounces Bowie properly on this site.
Actually the original purpose of the Bowie notch is still up in the air,
the stripping meat from the bone explanation just makes the most sense IMO.
I'm from Texas. My daughter goes to James Bowie High. We pronounce his name Boo-wie.
Boowee created the Bowie knife
I’m from around Bowie Texas too! Go jackrabbits
You are correct.
One of Jim’s ancestors told me that their name was mis-pronounced even back in Jim’s time.
What became the "classic" Bowie knife was as much a creation of the Sheffield craftsmen as anyone in North America.
Yeah, heard all sorts of stuff about American frontier knife history but truth is most of these things came from Sheffield.
I love my Sheffield razors, I've only gotten one razor sharper ever (and it's Swedish). Sheffield made/makes great edged steels.
A lot of them were, Although there were quite a fair number of early Bowie knives such as 'Bowie No 1' and the Musso Bowie
and the Juan Seguin Bowie that had no Sheffield influence.
Not really
Interesting comment because it actually could have been the other way around. The battle at the Alamo was fought in Feb 1835 and the Texas blade existed before that so it could be that the Sheffield knife was patterned after the Texas blade. Was Sheffield making this style blade prior to 1835?
Most of them before and after the time of the Alamo were made in Sheffield, England. They were shipped to the US in their thousands in the 19th century.
Northern Englander There were quite a fair number of historic Bowie’s that were made in America such as the Musso Bowie and ‘Bowie Number 1’ not to mention the Original Sam Houston Bowie and the Seguin Bowie among others. Personally I like some of the Sheffield Bowie’s but some of their designs are too fancy and thin for my taste.
Great information to share with my children. They don't have much knowledge of their relative and background of knife.
I would question the origin of those two knives as being Mexican. I would think they rather came from Spain where they had milennia old blacksmith tradition and they have engraved their knives very beautifully. Then again, there is a Mexican blacksmith in Oaxaca that claims descent from a Toledo blacksmith. So, there is a small chance. To me it is more likely those knives were produced in Albacete, Spain. The history of knives in my country is very obscure. The goverment has made sure of that, ever trying to destroy the law-abiding weapon culture in Mexico which is why nowadays only three blacksmithing houses remain: The Aragon in Oaxaca who used to make swords for Porfirio Diaz, the Aguilar who is not as widely known but he is the one who claims his tradition came from Spain and the Ojeda group in Jalisco who are relatively modern. Other than those and a few amateurs that is all that remains. What I knew from history is that Mexican blacksmiths were skilled at refurbishing older sword blades made in Spain rather than producing new works. That is what prompted the evolution of the Espada Ancha which was locally produced. Those blades were never too ornate and ultimately evolved to become indistinguishable from machetes. That is why I question those two knives you show were produced in Mexico. Not only that, many Spanish knives are labeled Mexican by ignorant owners. That is how I bought a very beautiful antique Albacete dagger at an antique shop. The idiots called it "Mexican Knife" and undervalued it Lol.
Spanish tradition in mexico is like English tradition in Australia....alive and well till recently.
I have a small, Albacete-made navaja with a buffalo horn grip. Beautiful little folding knife.
I have one that's been in my father's collection. The handle since rotten off. I restored it back with a Japanese polishing stone as it was pit rusting. I would love to know more about it
I know this is an older vid, but I just love it. Great history of my favorite knife type. I'm a fixed blade collector, & I'm just now getting into the Bowie-arc in my evolution as a collector/lover. Love these knives for their size, the aggressive blade shaping, & the American history...but I also really dig the influences that other cultures have had on the Bowie knife - perhaps my favorite being the Mexican styling - I love the flow that the Mexicans introduced to the Bowie - thank you sir for this great vid! Scott Sherman
Great vid..Very informative. Best on this subject. Thank You
The Bowie knife is classic Americana and that Texas clip point has its roots in Spanish (and, therefore, Arab) design: e.g., navaja, shamshir, talwar, jambiya. The long, curved cutting edge and belly to the blade was shown centuries ago by the Mamluks of North Africa to be effective instruments of decapitation.
Excellent presentation of old knife patterns!
Outstanding
One of the Best explanation and synopsis of the Bowie Origin ! It Dispels the many often false information floating around. Love to see a continued episode 👍🇺🇸
The Texas Form I like; it's just curved enough in can help against unarmed targets or cloth/leather targets, and it's straight enough to stab. I wonder how well it would hold up to the common Bowie Knife design today.
The Original Bagwell Bowie forged by Bill Bagwell is the one to have!
bill wasnt alive when the orginal one was made
Musso is the best
Bill Bagwell made outstanding Bowie knives... his fighting technique was adopted by the Special Forces back in the 1980’s and is rumored to be unbeatable.
An excellent lecture. Thank you.
Very informative information on Jim Bowie... :)
Stiletto Jim
Thing is though there were seaxes from the viking period that had a very similar clip to the typical Bowie. Coincidence, parallel evolution or what?
Scotish Dirks yes.
The Arkansas tooth pick is another nice knife
Thanks I have done some research on the Bowie knife this video is giving me a better idea what the original like.
Very informative.
At 6:38 he shows a knife design which featured in the old B&W movie, "The most dangerous game", the knife the hero is given to defend himself again the bad guy!
“Rezin” is pronounced “Reason.” My belief is that J. Bowie’s first blade was probably shaped like the ones his brother handed out.
Another hypothesis about the origin of the "Spanish Flamenco knife" (grandfather of the Bowie knife), is that it was also manufactured in the 17th century in Flanders (now Belgium), when that territory was part of the Spanish Empire or Hispanic Monarchy. hence the name "flamenco". But the most likely hypothesis is that of its use in Spain by soldiers and especially by the gypsy community in southern Spain. Kind regards
love the Bowie, best knife in the world, ancient and modern.
Very interesting and informative.
Thanks for sharing
That goes to prove they don't need to be fancy, just tough and sharp. The more smaller the point , the easier the sticken. Very interesting interview.
I've got several modern Bowie knives, but I'm often on e-bay doing a search on
'antique Bowie knives' and just dreaming about getting a Sheffield Bowie, a Mexican Bowie or any number of other 19th century Bowies in the several thousand dollar range. Beautiful knives but too rich for my blood. :-(
mexi bowies are the coolest knives ever made
Nice video, too bad there was no visual of what the original Bowie knife may have looked like...
Fascinating insight, thanks for sharing
Is there more to this. I need another hour. It's getting really interesting.
Is this continued. Very informative.
Rezin B was quoted as saying he did not make the "improvements", as he put it, on the Bowie knife. I'd like to know who came up with the sharpened clip point. Both the Scots and the Norse sometimes made knives with long clip points, but as far as i know they were not usually sharpened.
good knife stuff
It was his darn left collar crease that gave him away as a true academic. If he were a dandy he would have had a stylist and makeup crew on set. Where is Part Deux of this and the Rambo knife?
I read that the actual knife Bowie used was a Schmidt forged knife. Have you seen this article? I didn't bookmark the article but it said for a while it was referred to as a Bowie-Schmidt or Schmidt-Bowie. I may have been reading about Gregorio Esparza who was the only one in the Alamo to be identified and buried. I'm not sure about this as fact because I was looking late at night and I didn't give it the attention it deserved. Thanks for your video. It's great. Good job!
Dogs in the background tells me this gentleman knows his stuff.
Very interesting video. I wonder what happened to the original? Somebody had to have taken it after the fall of the Alamo. Could it have ended up in Mexico?
I found your video very interesting. I love American history when it is real and not manufactured to suit their own purposes. Well done thanks again.
I just finished making a copy of the 1600 Spanish knife that was shown in your video.
Fascinating video, I'm guessing Mr McMickel when he talks about the original Bowie Knife is refering to the 'Fowler Bowie' that is on display at The Alamo and is shown on Wikipedia when you type in 'Bowie Knives', It's about 9 inches long and really resembles a butcher knife. About a year ago at a local gun & knife show, a knife dealer was selling a replica of the Folwer Bowie for just $100. I wish I could have bought it at the time.
I need to find a knifemaker that has Texas point Bowies like that. That knife is fierce
I believe the original is the Edwin Forrest knife. As the Natchez paper stated, at the time of the sandbar fight, that big Butcher Knife carried by James Bowie .
I'm just here for all the expert opinions.
Very important information here
I've read a few old west books. Only reference I can find was of Booie using that knife in the "Sand Bar Fight" ? PS: What the hell does an Arkansaw Tooth Pick look like FFS ?
OK thanks, saw them. Lethal looking knives for sure.
good story
I didnt want this video to end
Thank you. The evolution is quite interesting. Maybe I'll explore Spanish knives,
+Mary Cahill toledo steel .
I have an old tru-vue viewmaster type Card that tells a very different story about the Bowie knife’s origin. It includes a runaway slave and wild dogs. I can’t find that story anywhere. I listed the card on eBay if you wanna see the pictures of it.
Read about the “Kentucky Long Knives”. It’s what native Americans called people from Kentucky in the late 1700s. Bowie was born in Logan County Kentucky.
Press f to inspect then spam f+r Kappa
when i imagine a western bowie, the image that pop in my head is the image of the W49 bowie, the same model that made Case XX what he is today since it their first knife and they still produce it today, that as close as owning a true original western bowie since they never stopped produce it since their beginnings
Interesting stuff. But where can we watch the rest?
please post the rest!!!
Obe thing about sword canes - most of them are not the best of weapons, because most of them had very slim and many times too flexible blades if compared to real swords.
They were also used mostly for stabbing wild dogs while on a walk on a wooded road. Not to protect yourself against a sabre wielding maniac.
Very interesting video. Did you know that sword looks like the old Indian stick knife used by the old Indian and British navy. The Spanish knife looks like the ancient Indian/ Indonesia Badik. The bird handle is known as the Garuda from the Garuda style of Martial arts going back thousands of years.
Well done sirI
I really like the texas clip design, seems really functional.
Extremely educational and fascinating. Does Mcmickel have a channel?
My dad was given a knife, that could well be the knife of Jim Bowie, which was found hidden under a house where an old restaurant, which was located on old Laredo st. This was a road and route which was used by Mexican soldiers when they traveled to the Alamo from Mexico. This knife looks like the one he was given at (7:30)into the video.
That's pretty sweet
+LightBliss keep dreaming....the house is how old...?
Its been knock down since and was around until 1980.s It was a house turned into several businesses through the years. I say way over 200 years at the time. Although the street and the location are still there.
Hi i'm interested in this story. Do you have a blog post about it somewhere?
That is a beautiful knife is thare eny chance of that Texas clip being sold? I would love some more footage and or pictures of this knife?
love that cane sword....the clockwork orange film is base on the 3 penny opera.....in the mack the knife scene ....he has one with a very thin flexible dangerouse looking razor type blade.....like a long thin ham knife....yee gads....more of a slash weapon....like a turkish or cossak yaghutan.
A karambit seems like the only medieval dagger that survived until today. WOW
Bowie's original knife was made from a file and was a plain knife, according to historical record. After getting into a fight with it, Bowie decided that the knife was a good one and took it back to the blacksmith to be improved by adding a finger guard and a better handle.
When you beat out a file on the anvil, the result of the shape becomes apparent because thinning of the metal on only one side results in a sweeping form.
.
Thank you
Say Heah, I like a Bowie Knife, but I don't have too many. But I do have the San Mai 3 Cold Steel Natchez, It sort of surprised me how it looks to one of your knivrs you were showing, long, sharp tip, curved belly, But I use my knives in the bush, and my Natchez wouldn't be too practical because it's size, But I can see it stab and slach, not something I do in the bush, But I do have a few sort of clip points and their on some of my Fav's bush knives like my Rodent 5,7,9, and on my Ratmandu which is prolly one of my Fav's, infact I have (3) of them two in the INFI and one in the SR101, Thanx for the enlightenment on the Origin of tge Bowie, I appriciated this video, and lemme be the first to Wish You a Merry Christmas, , ,
Nice presentation bro 😍😍😍😍
probably very rectangular , crude looking but functional. At that time, you needed some that worked over something that is a flashy design.
I'd really love to buy that Fleiderman (sp) book,
But only if it's still affordable and not an e-Bay item going for around $100 or more.
*****
Thanks for the link, I appreciate it.
I always thought the original was the Fowler knife, which resembles a butcher knife and is on display at the Alamo (and on wiki's) page on Bowie Knives, Bowie supposedly had several knives in his lifetime though, all of which were labeled "Bowie Knives"
Another possible canidate for one of James Bowie's early knives IMHO is the
'Bowie No 1' knife on display in the Arkansas State Museum.
GREAT WORK!
I wonder if the actual "Bowie Knife" carried by Jim Bowie at the Alamo will ever surface
There is a knife that is currently being debated. It was found in a river that Santa Anna's army crossed. The silver had been stripped from it leading historians to question if the soldier who captured it from Bowie tore off the valuable metal and threw it away.
It's one of those words you can say either way, like data. I personally say "boo-e" just because that is how I heard it being said in Alamo movies.
"Boo-e" is the correct pronunciation.
I prefer the model that had a 15 inch blade; 5 inch handle, and the clip point blade that had the copper sleeve running 3/4 the length of top of the blade. I had one in Nam that I greased a few dinks with, and still have.
In a book i read as a child about 50 years ago the bowie knife was made from a broken sword true or not i remember very distinctly reading it in the early sixties about the alamo...
Not bowies and sword not mske much of a bowie knife or anything like it. They dic make knives out broke swords or natives had
I have studied Bowie knives since I was a kid in the 50's and the movie The Iron Mistress seems to be most accurate. There was also a Franklin Mint "duplicate" which was sold according to the many descriptions and had an unusual pommel. The other more accurate design was also made for the movie The Alamo(1960) with John Wayne and Richard Widmark as James Bowie which seems to be the other more accurate design. I have also visited the Alamo in San Antonio and there was no real "sample" to view.(1962) Legend claims the Knife was tossed over board in the Mississippi.Others claim it was found and returned to the Family.You can get a nice Replica for about $100 or less.Many were made, but only a few by the makers of the knife for the movie The Alamo.(1960)
Could it be that when referring to the blade used by Bowie as a "Butcher knife", in reality they were talking at a knife being made by W. & S. Butcher of Sheffield? who actually made many big knives like the actual Bowie type in the same period of time.
I believe it's called the Primitive Bowie now, as that's the closest one I've seen to it.
where can I find the full interview?
The Pinuti has a long thin blade, The Bowie has a short thick one.
The Bowie also has a swedge on it and a curve, The Pinuti doesn't. Not to mention the Bowie knotch which was likely used for stripping meat from the bone.
Also the Pinuti Sword was originally a farming implement, The Bowie Knife has always been a one handed hunting knife.
Sorry but IMHO the Pinuti / Bowie connection is about like claiming that the Bowie Knife is related to the Kukri Knife.
the only story iv heard is jim bowie was killed at the alemo? if that sounds right? he was killed and his body was burnt, one of the soldiers that was the kept the knife as a momento or something and went into debt to some family and to pay off his debt he gave the family the knife and as far as I know they family still has the knife down the track. im not saying that is it but that's the story ive heard
Great bit.
Ive got a book on medieval weapons and it has a Seax, or Scramasax or whatever u wanna call it, but the thing is from jolly old england and looks exactly like a modern day bowie knife. same size and all.
Was the design of them ever influenced by Seax designs???
+Richard Morrey you are on the money soney....brittish folk all had em'.
+Scott Awaywithit
It's fast become my second favourite type of knife, mostly because I have several bowie knives, but haven't raised the funds for a good seax just yet.......soon enough.
I did a bunch of research on them, and I really love the Langeseax that the viking spearmen used!
+Scott Awaywithit
My dad's English and I was just in England literally two months ago for a week. The average commoner used it as his 'everyday' weapon for defense, tool, eating utensil etc etc. The sword was worth a fortune for all of history, so people carried them instead, correct?