USA PRICE CORRECTIONS: iPad Pro 12.9” 128GB - $1,099 iPad Pro 12.9” 256GB - $1,199 iPad Pro 12.9” 1TB - $1,799 Apple Pencil - $129 Apple Magic Keyboard - $349 Not sure what happened there - sorry. Though, you can get better prices like those listed in the video by using the Amazon links in the description, or at places like Target, B&H and Best Buy.
@@TheMrawesomest I really wanted this. I could ditched my Macbook M1 Pro 16. Those who doesn’t agree never even use OSX on daily basis or just mere gamers.
Just a great balanced review that thoroughly checks the pros and cons of both sides without the usual bias from too-cool RUclips tech kids. Thank you - subscribed
Brilliant as always. You are so thorough in balancing the two tablets against each other, like having a pair of scales and giving and taking away from each side. You’re right about competition and choice and I think we are very lucky to have this. Lucky, also, that we have you to help us evaluate the pros and cons. Thank you. Always enjoyable and although the numbers confound me, I get the gist and it’s helpful.
I'm a motorcycle traveller and a software engineer. I use Amazon Workspaces to log into my work and thought I could use my Android tablet. While definitely usable, it's nowhere near capable and easy. And I also record videos of my travel and just transferring files from the gopro to an external hard disk is a pita. I am now tempted to buy a Surface.
I was in the position of making this choice, I used to have a Surface Pro through my work but due to needing to do more stylus and pen design work I went with the iPad Pro, now months later I have to say I made the wrong choice, for the functions and uses I need the device for Apple OS limits me far too much, I can't run the programs or even find apps with similar functions. So most of the time my iPad now sits idle doing very little and instead I go back to using my desktop PC. So from my experience and usage, the Surface Pro would have been a far better choice I now feel. Very nice video and comparison.
well reviewed and excellent comparison.. my pick is surface pro 9 also. It is a well made device and you can manage battery life per usage. Full external monitor support due to windows and kickstand beats IPAD, which you have to have M1 or M2 and some type of case, and it cannot work in clamshell mode when connected to an external display with stage manager etc.. Its obvious that ipad is artificially limiting some things. Speakers from pro 5 have definitely improved and SSD can be upgraded easily. Pro 9 also has WiFi 6E.
A very fair and honest video, kudos. I have the iPad Pro 12.9 5th gen and it okay for fun and light work task. But I need a real computer that operates full desktop. So I probably will purchase the surface pro 9 like the one you have. I am debating on the ram because I want to future proof it. Which sounds crazy because something better will be coming out next year.
@@frostybe3r I have used both Macbook and Surface Pro and I have to say there are certain little things Windows has that I love which MacOS does not have. The biggest for me is the Snap Assist. The second biggest is the inkability -- I could annotate directly my screenshots whenever i need to explain something over chat -- and of course, being able to use the Whiteboard whenever I present something via zoom/teams directly from my main work machine -- without having to switch over from say, Macbook to iPad (to utilize inking scribbling over video calls).
Well, okay. I have a SurfaceBook, 2 Suface Pros, 3 iPads (2Pros) and a MacBook. Get a Mac to go with your iPad so you don't lose your mind. just sayin'
What I take from this video is that they’re both great tablets with pros and cons, it’s about what’s important to you and what works better with your workflow and the iPad works better for me and my ecosystem, but Great review!!!
I cannot stress how important it is on the Surface Pro 9 to make sure 120Hz mode is enabled! MS has way to many jitters at 60Hz for Windows 11 on the Surface Pro 9. Even Dynamic Mode is half-baked and still jittery (small spikes in lag ) on some of the menus for the Windows 11 OS.
Thanks for the tip I’ll have to try it out. I recently bought my first surface ever. Coming from all Apple stuff. Set it up and have it in auto 60/120 and notice some screen glitches every now and then. Hopefully it might be this setting and not a defect.
I just got my first ever Surface device, the Surface Pro 9 in Forest Green...hope this computer lives long enough and is worthy to live alongside the M1 Air ....
flexible!. that's the word i'm looking for because my surface is running windows 11 / MacOS catalina in VM / android and can do whatever I need it to do
Well done. I completely agree with your review. As usual, everything boils down to what you do with these devices. The Surface is a full fledged computer and also a decent tablet, whereas the iPad is a very good tablet, but it is not a computer replacement. It is conceived to be a mac companion and a wallet emptier.
You can also use an iPad as a computer, just with limitations on software and hardware compatibility, which arguably is true with every OS and computer
@@ghost-user559 Using a device as a computer doesn't mean you have a keyboard and multiple windows. You need a real file system and desktop class applications.
I prefer my Tablet to be a Tablet. Only a few vocal numnuts purchase a Tablet and think it's a Laptop. But, yeah the iPad is too good for itself. iPad is an artists device, a student's device, a consumer's device, and small business. Millions purchase them because they want a Tablet. Ease of use, powerful, and highly portable. And don't forget, it's just a Tablet.
@@UJB123 But why can't tablet be fully functional desktop/laptop replacement? What's wrong with wanting it all in one sleek package? Surface Pro is the closest thing that combines the power of desktop class software, tablets and laptops. As an artist and programmer, I couldn't use iPad. It simply lacks the professional software I need, it's way too limited. Great as a media consumption toy and for hobbyists sketching though.
@@PhazonBlaxorI hear you, I'm also an artist and wish for the mac alternative of a 2 in 1. I have an iPad Pro 12.9, but it rarely gets used due to the limiting software choice and frustrating app based file manager. My MacBook Pro and pen tablet is a better solution for my art and freedom to run apps like blender.
Surface Pro 9 easily. It offers a full operating system, WSL, Intel 12 generation "U" CPU for better battery, and better for traveling sales or analysts using PowerPoint or Power BI. Also, adjustable SSD. A person can start with 256GB and switch to 1TB SSD for $99.
Nobody is talking about it, but the charger you need for surface is bigger, similar to the MacBook, it needs 65w. Where as iPad Pro can be charged with your iPhone charger (change the cable to usb c). Small, handy and cheap. All in all, of course, surface is a better device for all office work. For ex, try to compare folder and file contents of two folders, good luck w that on an iPad and count how many clicks and switches you need for this simple task
well, the fact it run windows is a big plus, but still can be used for multi function daily driver, as a gamer, ROG Flow z13 is the ideal one, since it also capable of gaming
Thanks to a few side jobs the last few weeks, I was able to have both. The Ipad is wonderful, but I'm with you; if I had to pick only one it would be the Surface. I support 140 of them in a corporate environment, along with dock and dual monitors which is a nightmare. I've developed a hatred of the Surface because of this but used stand-alone it really is a no-brainer to go with the Surface. Very solid review!!
As a quick follow-up, I can also use ALL of my Adobe CS 6 apps in Win 11 while Apple essentially disabled ALL of those apps in Mac OS some years ago, which is an Apple killer for me going forward . . .
The thing is, an ipad is an upscaled mobile device that CAN be used as a computer if needed But something like a surface is more like a pc laptop with a detachable keyboard
@@slicks8152 That's just not true. I am a game developer and graphics designer. iPad doesn't even run the full version of Photoshop, let alone ANY version of Unreal or Unity. It's quite ironic that I'm using a competing tablet to develop games for iPad, because it itself cannot do that.
@@PhazonBlaxor well ig you have a point but, for me personally, the ipad is perfect for everything i use it for (games, watching media, and mainly work)
@@slicks8152 Great it works for you. It's the best device as a pure tablet, hands down. I switched from MB Pro to Surface Pro mainly because I needed touch for drawing and mobile game testing. Unfortunately neither Macs nor iPads fit the bill. If iPad could run all the MacOS software, it would've been quite hard decision betwen iPad and SP for me.
That was a wonderful review my friend I have to say that I own an iPad pro 12.9 the latest generation with 512 gigs and I also own a surface book 2 which is not exactly what you're reviewing here but they're very similar and I have to say that I will keep the Microsoft Windows machine as my daily driver any day of the year because of the software experience and of course the hardware because that machine even though it may be slower than the iPad is no slouch and I love them both but I would prefer the surface product over though iPad pro
I have and LOVE my SP-X but I will not be going to the SP 9 because it doesn't offer wifi AND cellular like my SPX. You just can't be completely mobile without both connections. My SPX is always on and always ready to go. I don't have to look for a WiFi connection to do things. Plus now it's like $600 to start.
@@ConstantGeekery I recommend you legitimately plug the podcast a bit more here and put the podcast into your “channels” tab and not only buried in the About tab. I wouldn’t even know it existed or have been able to find it had you not mentioned it previously. You truly have a unique perspective and with your small business focus and technical knowledge it truly shines. Between Pete and Erin you all have a very good chemistry and very interesting technical perspectives and personal experience. I think it’s a significant display of your personalities as opposed to the necessary (but otherwise common on the platform) product reviews found here. Please keep doing it! But do yourselves justice and plug it a bit more. I’m not sure people can easily find it or even know it exists outside of those who already listen to it. You all have made a very polished and competent podcast. Don’t give up on it or let it get buried in the algorithm.
Absolutely excellent video. Really useful comparison, and your insights are very helpful. However. There were two things, kind of, missing. You touched upon them, but they are of greater importance than I first thought. 1. Ecosystem. 2. Use Case If you are already in the Apple Ecosystem - there is little point entertaining the Surface. Really - nothing will make an apple user get a surface device. It is not as good a companion to a MacBook, and as a full do-it-all computer, it would try to compete with it, while an iPad would not compete with a MacBook but would complement it very well. The performance comparisons mean nothing and would not form part of the equation. If you are already a windows user, getting an iPad will leave a person who needs windows on their PC, very dissatisfied. Also, for windows users., a portable PC is still a PC. That was on of the things which killed the Surface RT. It is ALMOST everything. PC users want something that WILL do everything not almost everything - especially if it does actually run windows. Needing windows on the go means you need x86 apps, and they will need ton run on windows. Some may run on iOS, but the typical windows user will want to have something they can know will work for them. The cost of these devices means that if you are getting it - you need it. There are many many cheap alternatives to these machines. unlike in the apple ecosystem, the PC ecosystem has many devices, full windows PCs, brand new at£300-400 which will do all they want. If they are getting a tablet sized machine - it is because that form factor makes sense for them. The gains here and there from an iPad M2 chip will be negligible in their impact on your decision. ONE caveat to that is battery life. The iPad will probably have close to twice or a third more battery life. The average user would want an all-day machine. That translates to having 25-30% at the end of a 7-8 hour day of mixed-use. All-day use is not about battery life but about the user's comfort. The user needs to feel that they are still delicate and have several hours available, so they don't need to go and get that adaptor. If you are 5 hours in and are at 40% - you start to feel like you will need the adaptor. The iPad will not give you that nervousness but the Surface will. This is quickly sorted with an excellent 60-100W PD charger (about £100) which will double the battery life. Thus a person can get that 10-12 hour battery life feeling when they want it. Once they get to 40%...a charge from the battery pack will boost back to 80% relatively quickly, and they can crack on. There is obviously a challenge to the portability, but it is not fatal and can easily be included in the workflow. The other area is the use case. You touched on this. If a person wants to run full desktop apps - the iPad is not even in the running. None of its features and benefits is involved in the choice, and it does not exist. If you are running iOS apps, then the Surface is not a choice because the touch interface on Windows and on the Surface is absolutely NOT a priority. It is not optimised in any way. Microsoft has, in fact, gone backwards. They made real strides in Windows 8, but since then, the touch interface has, as you said, actually been REMOVED. The touch device sold as a tablet has removed its touch interface. Haha. It is almost exclusively useable only with a keyboard and mouse. It is totally usable with only a house, which is a great way to use windows, actually - ...with a mouse and using only the screen keyboard when needed - just like an iPad now can with its magic keyboard. However, the iPad magic keyboard is not supposed to be the primary interface for the device (or they would have put the function keys on it). They were left out on purpose. Let's not entertain the idea that Apple "just couldn't get the fn keys on the keyboard" as they have on EVERYn MOTHER KEYBOARD THEY HAVE EVER PRODUCED. No - the keyboard is hobbled because it is NOT meant to be the primary interface. The finger first, and the pen second. And the keyboard third. The surface keyboard is supposed to be the primary input device for the Surface - then the pen and then the finger - primarily for scrolling. (Don't forget the dial, haha) Use case and Ecosystem have a more significant impact on selection than any of the incredible specs you pointed out and to pains to describe. Full disclosure. I have an SP9. I got the SP8 first, and it was great - I saw a pre-order deal for only a little more, so I returned the SP8 and got a similarly spec'd SP9. I would only have done that if I knew that the SP9 would have very little better than the SP8. The only saving grace is the button placement. NOTHING else makes a difference. None of the things I do with it would tax even an SP6, so I don't get the difference at the edges of performance. The SP8 can be got for great deals at the moment and will go down again in the new year. I recommend people wait and get that, then look to upgrade to the SP10 or 11 later down the line. The form factor is fantastic, and the versatility is astounding. The iPad is exceptional, and there is no tablet like it - including the Surface Pro ...BUT ... youjnahve to want to have an iPad. I didn't and didn't, so I have a Surface. Of course there are people for whom the ecosystem and use case still leave both as real options and so performance (outside battery life) is a real consideration , however I suspect that this a a smaller group of people. THe majority of people will either be in iOS or need windows and that will drive how they spend £12000-£1400 on a device of this type. I'd love to know your thoughts on my hypothesis and anyone else's. Haha. Once again - great video. Best, most comprehensive and level headed review I have seen so far. Some that try to do this have been completely unhinged - yoyurs was so useful because youmade it more real-world. Really appreciated that. Thanks.
Yep. Apple made the MK the same as the onboard keyboard. Frankly, it's because you don't really need it & they probably think it's hilarious. iPad is a Tablet. Why buy a keyboard for a portable touch device? Okay, well, pay $300, lol. SP is nice but the pen/touch is well, not for the artistic to say the least. Not much pen support, not even in NotePad sadly & its iffy in OneNote. But Win has always been a Business platform and does that well.
I think it really is a personal choice. If you were to ask me maybe a decade ago I would've said I'm fine with the ipad pro being a design and illustration student, My needs would just be to organise some files, notes, and a good sketching experience which I still think procreate is superior. Now however I've gotten into coding since then, with implementations like WSL and maybe better android apps support, a surface pro is fast becoming a very attractive product.
with the surface dock the surface is a full blown PC with a power that is more than enough for most people. and surface users had this for 10 years now. the iPad is still just a tablet and you'll always need an full Computer for certain tasks.
Great review and glad to see someone reviewing these, actually stating with "12th Gen i7" is being reviewed, as there are a few i7's being used in the SP line up. For example, your reviewed an i7-1255u (2PC+8EC/12T @ 3.5/4.7GHz), your US hyper-link is to an I7-2640M (2C/4T @ 2.8/3.5GHz), a noticeably less powerful variant for "work" tasks. And there is also an I7-1265U (2PC+8EC/12T @ 3.6/4.8GHz) variant. The difference may seem small.. but it's actually relevant to the intend software use.. esp. if intended to use as closer to a laptop solution Also note, there is a powerful older SP8 with an i7-1185G7 - 4C/8T @ 3.0/4.7GHz), that you may want to take a look at.
Thank you for the great video! What about Samsung Galaxy Tab S8? Have you sold it? Do you consider it as the good alternative for both of these devices? Moreover, its lifecycle is over soon and it sells with the good discount now I guess...
I still have the S8 and use it. I’m planning to do a follow up video soon, but yes, I think it’s a good tablet. The problem is that it can’t compete with the iPad on performance. Does that matter in the real world to the majority of users? Probably not.
@@ConstantGeekery Ok, looking forward for your using experience update on this device! Except for cost-cutting TFT display, Tab S8 still looks like a descent Android tablet that is enough for a majority of users.
I certainly hope it’s battery will not bulge over time and push the screen from it seams as my Surface Pro 3 did. After that I never touched another Microsoft Pro device.
Great review. i've been looking at the Surface Pro as a possible Laptop/work station with tablet like capabilities when I have to go into the field. The ability to use in tablet mode is way more useful than walkig around with a laptop and having to find somewhere to rest it to use it (when mbile). I've tried Android options but the available apps don't provide the functionality that my Windows based apps do. Which leads me to this question.. Is software installation on the Surface Pro a similar experience to an actual laptop, meaning you could install from a flash drive, cloud storage, etc.. or is it "Pay/Windows store" based?
Thank you for a good video. The task to compare this two devices is not easy, but I think you did a good job and show pros cons and compromises well. To cohos the right device is not so easy. But I think I'll agree with you. Windows is offer more then the ipad os. :)
In my opinion: Surface Pro is the better option. Using iPadOS is too limited, you don’t really have the possibilities of a fully integrated mobile operating system.
I've had an iPad for @ 6 years and just ordered the Surface Pro 9. The reason is the software (and ESPECIALLY Apple's walled ecosystem). The iPad is more of a toy/accessory while the Surface Pro will be much more useful for EVERYTHING I need to do. (I also have a MacBook Pro and a Mac Pro) as well as an HP Workstation.
iPad Pro by far for my needs and hardware stability. I tried using the Surface Pro 9 and I just couldn't deal with a tablet that runs hot and fans ablazin' watching RUclips videos. It works much better in laptop form though the design isn't meant for lap use as the stand is not stable enough and works mainly on solid, flat surfaces. In theory it's a good concept but until they fix the heat and fans going off noisily it won't be on my list until then.
Had it not because of my company’s stupid mandate on its apps exclusivity on iPadOS only, i would’ve comfortably chosen Surface Pro. No questions asked.
The ipad pro has always been pointless. Massively overpriced and a the dreadful magic keyboard which is an awful typing experience for an absurd price. Also the Surface has a professional operating system.
I love my antient iPad. I really love apple mobile devices and I have a lot of software for them. I do however make my living from a MS infrastructure, so I just decided to go surface pro.
my personal opinion is surface pro +keyboard, IPAD 11 + pencil. i bought the pencil slim 2 but i never use it with surface pro, i bought the ipad keyboard but i never use it with ipad, i wish i saved my money. for tablet use ( books, PDFs) go for ipad, office applications go for surface pro.
OK I have to admit I had a dabble with the M2 iPad and it was OK but I have such a lot of money invested in MS/ windows software, I found I was having to move between my tablet and my win 11 desktop to achieve the creative outcomes I needed. So I am biting the bullet and going back to windows. I had thought the intro of the M2 signalled a move by Apple into a new format such as Mac OS on iPad, but alas not. Apple are running out of inspiration
If you are using a tablet as a computer (screen + keyboard) why not just buy an Apple Air or a notebook PC? (I don't understand why people buy tablets instead).
People like different things. I liked the SP, except for the kick stand when I didn't have a table to put it on. Not comfortable to leave on a lap. Even though the SP was a great travel laptop, a 2-1 works better for me when sitting on my couch.
I haven't seen anything like that on mine. Naturally, you can find the thermal limits quick if you push it, but that's no surprise given the size of the chassis. It does a pretty decent job of spinning up the fans, which aren't overly noisy (most of the time it's completely silent). The display has been fine for me.
Your US prices are INCORRECT for iPad Pro M2 8gb RAM 12.9 256gb. Wi-Fi only is $1199 w/cellular is $1399. And the 1TB is $1799 Wi-Fi only w/cellular it’s $1999. Also the US price for magic keyboard and Apple Pencil are $349 and $129 respectively. The price for these accessories have remained unchanged for years now. Apple Store was sourced for the pricing.
My apologies. I always source prices from apple.com USA at the time of preparing the video. I can’t see how I would have copied every price incorrectly, so I have no idea why this has happened, unless there was some discount for Black Friday, or maybe I’ve managed to mix up my timelines in Davinci with the placeholders my son set up in the rough edit. We usually check this stuff carefully - genuine mistake.
@@ConstantGeekery great news, just two more question, how good is the user experience for taking hand writing note on Linux? Can you recommend a hand writing notes app on Linux?
What non-artists keep _not understanding_ is how GOOD the iPad Pro and Pencil are, actually out-performing Wacom Cintiqs. The "N-Trig" tech is just not in the same league.
If that were true why then aer the major art programmes not porting the goods over to take advantage of the greatness. Without Procreate I reckon Apple would have lost 50% of its new sales. Everything else half decent is rental software. So the costs of buying an iPad is about £1500 down and plus around £1500 a year to keep using adobe software.
I have an iPad Pro 12.9 with a pencil and i still prefer a pen tablet hooked up to my MacBook Pro for the very simple reason that iPadOS is limited to running actual Pro apps in the industry. Great for ideas, but nowhere near industry standard. (PS iPadOS app based file system makes me puke also 🤣)
Ugh I wish it was available like that lol. The for sure winner for me is the Surface pro, I really tried to like the iPad but I couldn’t get past its functionality, too limited
Performance is all well and good, but to me, tablets are all about portability, weight, size and battery life. If I need desktop performance, I use a desktop.
I like the iPad a lot I’ve owned a m1 11 inch but it’s working exactly like the cheapest iPad . I’ve owned a surface pro 6 or 7 I can’t remember, it’s working like any windows laptop desktop. It’s all about what software you are using but in the end surface is the winner! Not enough gpu not a problem just hook up a external one , not enough space not a problem update the solid state. File system on mobile both android and iOS or iPad os BAD better on iPad os or iOS than android . Navigation on iPad or android better than windows in a tablet form but remember you can always turn that surface into a laptop desktop computer and then things change. Windows can run everything you want , iPad and android can’t. In the end surface win but can’t beat the easy of use of those tablets
It’s usually silent for normal office stuff. You can hear it when it spins up, especially if you are working it hard, but it’s generally very quiet. I’ve not noticed it starting up a lot either.
USA PRICE CORRECTIONS:
iPad Pro 12.9” 128GB - $1,099
iPad Pro 12.9” 256GB - $1,199
iPad Pro 12.9” 1TB - $1,799
Apple Pencil - $129
Apple Magic Keyboard - $349
Not sure what happened there - sorry. Though, you can get better prices like those listed in the video by using the Amazon links in the description, or at places like Target, B&H and Best Buy.
@Kulo kulothungan I tried that out in this video: ruclips.net/video/L8rzoPxch9M/видео.html
There is also a 512GB storage option.
If I had to make the choice I would opt for the Surface Pro simply because it runs a full desktop operating system.
An OS X ipad would be amazing. I would love to see an Apple silicone equivalent for Windows.
@@TheMrawesomest Ew. There's a reason the smallest Mac Screen is 13 in.
@@TheMrawesomest in what Classic OSX will be amazing ? Really. DOS was cool but it was the past.
@@TheMrawesomest Then Mac sales will decline
@@TheMrawesomest I really wanted this. I could ditched my Macbook M1 Pro 16.
Those who doesn’t agree never even use OSX on daily basis or just mere gamers.
Just a great balanced review that thoroughly checks the pros and cons of both sides without the usual bias from too-cool RUclips tech kids. Thank you - subscribed
Brilliant as always. You are so thorough in balancing the two tablets against each other, like having a pair of scales and giving and taking away from each side. You’re right about competition and choice and I think we are very lucky to have this. Lucky, also, that we have you to help us evaluate the pros and cons. Thank you. Always enjoyable and although the numbers confound me, I get the gist and it’s helpful.
I'm a motorcycle traveller and a software engineer. I use Amazon Workspaces to log into my work and thought I could use my Android tablet. While definitely usable, it's nowhere near capable and easy. And I also record videos of my travel and just transferring files from the gopro to an external hard disk is a pita. I am now tempted to buy a Surface.
Fantastic as always. I picked up a 2nd hand surface pro 8 as I found the iPad just too limited for laptop duties.
I like the way you speak, very calm and convincing, and a very informative video you've made, well done, keep up the good work!
I was in the position of making this choice, I used to have a Surface Pro through my work but due to needing to do more stylus and pen design work I went with the iPad Pro, now months later I have to say I made the wrong choice, for the functions and uses I need the device for Apple OS limits me far too much, I can't run the programs or even find apps with similar functions. So most of the time my iPad now sits idle doing very little and instead I go back to using my desktop PC. So from my experience and usage, the Surface Pro would have been a far better choice I now feel. Very nice video and comparison.
well reviewed and excellent comparison.. my pick is surface pro 9 also. It is a well made device and you can manage battery life per usage. Full external monitor support due to windows and kickstand beats IPAD, which you have to have M1 or M2 and some type of case, and it cannot work in clamshell mode when connected to an external display with stage manager etc.. Its obvious that ipad is artificially limiting some things. Speakers from pro 5 have definitely improved and SSD can be upgraded easily. Pro 9 also has WiFi 6E.
A superbly balanced and informative comparison. Great job!
I love this review!
A very fair and honest video, kudos. I have the iPad Pro 12.9 5th gen and it okay for fun and light work task. But I need a real computer that operates full desktop. So I probably will purchase the surface pro 9 like the one you have. I am debating on the ram because I want to future proof it. Which sounds crazy because something better will be coming out next year.
Just get a MacBook lad
Get a Mac mini for your home desktop. You already have an expensive quality tablet. Just get a desktop computer and you have the best of both worlds
@@frostybe3r I have used both Macbook and Surface Pro and I have to say there are certain little things Windows has that I love which MacOS does not have. The biggest for me is the Snap Assist. The second biggest is the inkability -- I could annotate directly my screenshots whenever i need to explain something over chat -- and of course, being able to use the Whiteboard whenever I present something via zoom/teams directly from my main work machine -- without having to switch over from say, Macbook to iPad (to utilize inking scribbling over video calls).
Well, okay. I have a SurfaceBook, 2 Suface Pros, 3 iPads (2Pros) and a MacBook. Get a Mac to go with your iPad so you don't lose your mind. just sayin'
Yes, get a Macbook air m1 16GB RAM 512GB SSD and a second-hand iPad with an Apple Pencil
What I take from this video is that they’re both great tablets with pros and cons, it’s about what’s important to you and what works better with your workflow and the iPad works better for me and my ecosystem, but Great review!!!
I cannot stress how important it is on the Surface Pro 9 to make sure 120Hz mode is enabled! MS has way to many jitters at 60Hz for Windows 11 on the Surface Pro 9. Even Dynamic Mode is half-baked and still jittery (small spikes in lag ) on some of the menus for the Windows 11 OS.
Thanks for the tip I’ll have to try it out. I recently bought my first surface ever. Coming from all Apple stuff. Set it up and have it in auto 60/120 and notice some screen glitches every now and then. Hopefully it might be this setting and not a defect.
I just got my first ever Surface device, the Surface Pro 9 in Forest Green...hope this computer lives long enough and is worthy to live alongside the M1 Air ....
I had both the Surface Pro 2017 and the Surface Pro 7. Both were amazing devices which happen to be very flexible to my needs.
flexible!. that's the word i'm looking for
because my surface is running windows 11 / MacOS catalina in VM / android
and can do whatever I need it to do
@@azexy21 indeed. i think it was the most "naturally" flexible device -- not awkward or clunky. Except the onscreen keyboard maybe.
Well done. I completely agree with your review. As usual, everything boils down to what you do with these devices. The Surface is a full fledged computer and also a decent tablet, whereas the iPad is a very good tablet, but it is not a computer replacement. It is conceived to be a mac companion and a wallet emptier.
You can also use an iPad as a computer, just with limitations on software and hardware compatibility, which arguably is true with every OS and computer
@@ghost-user559 Using a device as a computer doesn't mean you have a keyboard and multiple windows. You need a real file system and desktop class applications.
I prefer my Tablet to be a Tablet. Only a few vocal numnuts purchase a Tablet and think it's a Laptop. But, yeah the iPad is too good for itself. iPad is an artists device, a student's device, a consumer's device, and small business. Millions purchase them because they want a Tablet. Ease of use, powerful, and highly portable.
And don't forget, it's just a Tablet.
@@UJB123 But why can't tablet be fully functional desktop/laptop replacement? What's wrong with wanting it all in one sleek package? Surface Pro is the closest thing that combines the power of desktop class software, tablets and laptops. As an artist and programmer, I couldn't use iPad. It simply lacks the professional software I need, it's way too limited. Great as a media consumption toy and for hobbyists sketching though.
@@PhazonBlaxorI hear you, I'm also an artist and wish for the mac alternative of a 2 in 1. I have an iPad Pro 12.9, but it rarely gets used due to the limiting software choice and frustrating app based file manager. My MacBook Pro and pen tablet is a better solution for my art and freedom to run apps like blender.
Surface Pro 9 easily. It offers a full operating system, WSL, Intel 12 generation "U" CPU for better battery, and better for traveling sales or analysts using PowerPoint or Power BI.
Also, adjustable SSD. A person can start with 256GB and switch to 1TB SSD for $99.
Nobody is talking about it, but the charger you need for surface is bigger, similar to the MacBook, it needs 65w. Where as iPad Pro can be charged with your iPhone charger (change the cable to usb c). Small, handy and cheap. All in all, of course, surface is a better device for all office work. For ex, try to compare folder and file contents of two folders, good luck w that on an iPad and count how many clicks and switches you need for this simple task
Nice work and comparison
Thanks 😊
well, the fact it run windows is a big plus, but still can be used for multi function daily driver, as a gamer, ROG Flow z13 is the ideal one, since it also capable of gaming
Thanks to a few side jobs the last few weeks, I was able to have both. The Ipad is wonderful, but I'm with you; if I had to pick only one it would be the Surface. I support 140 of them in a corporate environment, along with dock and dual monitors which is a nightmare. I've developed a hatred of the Surface because of this but used stand-alone it really is a no-brainer to go with the Surface. Very solid review!!
why is it a nightmare with the dock setups? I have one. and it was so incredible to have a full desktop pc in this Formfactor.
Well done. Facts and logic, with respect for viewer subjectivity thrown it.
As a quick follow-up, I can also use ALL of my Adobe CS 6 apps in Win 11 while Apple essentially disabled ALL of those apps in Mac OS some years ago, which is an Apple killer for me going forward . . .
The thing is, an ipad is an upscaled mobile device that CAN be used as a computer if needed
But something like a surface is more like a pc laptop with a detachable keyboard
Or CANNOT, depending on what you do. iPad has so limited professional software library that the "Pro" in its name is kinda a joke
@@PhazonBlaxor honestly, everything my tower pc can do , the ipad also can
@@slicks8152 That's just not true. I am a game developer and graphics designer. iPad doesn't even run the full version of Photoshop, let alone ANY version of Unreal or Unity.
It's quite ironic that I'm using a competing tablet to develop games for iPad, because it itself cannot do that.
@@PhazonBlaxor well ig you have a point but, for me personally, the ipad is perfect for everything i use it for (games, watching media, and mainly work)
@@slicks8152 Great it works for you. It's the best device as a pure tablet, hands down. I switched from MB Pro to Surface Pro mainly because I needed touch for drawing and mobile game testing. Unfortunately neither Macs nor iPads fit the bill.
If iPad could run all the MacOS software, it would've been quite hard decision betwen iPad and SP for me.
i agree with you *.*.. surface pro 9 and intel have leveled the field. now all intel needs is to boost up there iris graphics ...
Excellent video, one of your best. THANK YOU 👍👍
Excellent comparison. Thank you!
That was a wonderful review my friend I have to say that I own an iPad pro 12.9 the latest generation with 512 gigs and I also own a surface book 2 which is not exactly what you're reviewing here but they're very similar and I have to say that I will keep the Microsoft Windows machine as my daily driver any day of the year because of the software experience and of course the hardware because that machine even though it may be slower than the iPad is no slouch and I love them both but I would prefer the surface product over though iPad pro
Excelente comparision!!
I have and LOVE my SP-X but I will not be going to the SP 9 because it doesn't offer wifi AND cellular like my SPX. You just can't be completely mobile without both connections. My SPX is always on and always ready to go. I don't have to look for a WiFi connection to do things. Plus now it's like $600 to start.
Nice video thanks. Has the podcast been discontinued?
We’re still evaluating what to do next. Business has been demanding of late, so we haven’t had any time unfortunately.
@@ConstantGeekery I recommend you legitimately plug the podcast a bit more here and put the podcast into your “channels” tab and not only buried in the About tab. I wouldn’t even know it existed or have been able to find it had you not mentioned it previously. You truly have a unique perspective and with your small business focus and technical knowledge it truly shines.
Between Pete and Erin you all have a very good chemistry and very interesting technical perspectives and personal experience. I think it’s a significant display of your personalities as opposed to the necessary (but otherwise common on the platform) product reviews found here.
Please keep doing it! But do yourselves justice and plug it a bit more. I’m not sure people can easily find it or even know it exists outside of those who already listen to it. You all have made a very polished and competent podcast. Don’t give up on it or let it get buried in the algorithm.
Absolutely excellent video. Really useful comparison, and your insights are very helpful.
However.
There were two things, kind of, missing.
You touched upon them, but they are of greater importance than I first thought.
1. Ecosystem.
2. Use Case
If you are already in the Apple Ecosystem - there is little point entertaining the Surface. Really - nothing will make an apple user get a surface device.
It is not as good a companion to a MacBook, and as a full do-it-all computer, it would try to compete with it, while an iPad would not compete with a MacBook but would complement it very well.
The performance comparisons mean nothing and would not form part of the equation.
If you are already a windows user, getting an iPad will leave a person who needs windows on their PC, very dissatisfied.
Also, for windows users., a portable PC is still a PC. That was on of the things which killed the Surface RT. It is ALMOST everything. PC users want something that WILL do everything not almost everything - especially if it does actually run windows.
Needing windows on the go means you need x86 apps, and they will need ton run on windows. Some may run on iOS, but the typical windows user will want to have something they can know will work for them. The cost of these devices means that if you are getting it - you need it. There are many many cheap alternatives to these machines. unlike in the apple ecosystem, the PC ecosystem has many devices, full windows PCs, brand new at£300-400 which will do all they want. If they are getting a tablet sized machine - it is because that form factor makes sense for them. The gains here and there from an iPad M2 chip will be negligible in their impact on your decision.
ONE caveat to that is battery life. The iPad will probably have close to twice or a third more battery life. The average user would want an all-day machine. That translates to having 25-30% at the end of a 7-8 hour day of mixed-use. All-day use is not about battery life but about the user's comfort. The user needs to feel that they are still delicate and have several hours available, so they don't need to go and get that adaptor. If you are 5 hours in and are at 40% - you start to feel like you will need the adaptor. The iPad will not give you that nervousness but the Surface will.
This is quickly sorted with an excellent 60-100W PD charger (about £100) which will double the battery life. Thus a person can get that 10-12 hour battery life feeling when they want it. Once they get to 40%...a charge from the battery pack will boost back to 80% relatively quickly, and they can crack on. There is obviously a challenge to the portability, but it is not fatal and can easily be included in the workflow.
The other area is the use case.
You touched on this.
If a person wants to run full desktop apps - the iPad is not even in the running. None of its features and benefits is involved in the choice, and it does not exist.
If you are running iOS apps, then the Surface is not a choice because the touch interface on Windows and on the Surface is absolutely NOT a priority. It is not optimised in any way. Microsoft has, in fact, gone backwards. They made real strides in Windows 8, but since then, the touch interface has, as you said, actually been REMOVED. The touch device sold as a tablet has removed its touch interface. Haha. It is almost exclusively useable only with a keyboard and mouse.
It is totally usable with only a house, which is a great way to use windows, actually - ...with a mouse and using only the screen keyboard when needed - just like an iPad now can with its magic keyboard.
However, the iPad magic keyboard is not supposed to be the primary interface for the device (or they would have put the function keys on it). They were left out on purpose. Let's not entertain the idea that Apple "just couldn't get the fn keys on the keyboard" as they have on EVERYn MOTHER KEYBOARD THEY HAVE EVER PRODUCED. No - the keyboard is hobbled because it is NOT meant to be the primary interface. The finger first, and the pen second. And the keyboard third.
The surface keyboard is supposed to be the primary input device for the Surface - then the pen and then the finger - primarily for scrolling. (Don't forget the dial, haha)
Use case and Ecosystem have a more significant impact on selection than any of the incredible specs you pointed out and to pains to describe.
Full disclosure. I have an SP9.
I got the SP8 first, and it was great - I saw a pre-order deal for only a little more, so I returned the SP8 and got a similarly spec'd SP9.
I would only have done that if I knew that the SP9 would have very little better than the SP8.
The only saving grace is the button placement.
NOTHING else makes a difference.
None of the things I do with it would tax even an SP6, so I don't get the difference at the edges of performance.
The SP8 can be got for great deals at the moment and will go down again in the new year.
I recommend people wait and get that, then look to upgrade to the SP10 or 11 later down the line.
The form factor is fantastic, and the versatility is astounding.
The iPad is exceptional, and there is no tablet like it - including the Surface Pro ...BUT ... youjnahve to want to have an iPad.
I didn't and didn't, so I have a Surface.
Of course there are people for whom the ecosystem and use case still leave both as real options and so performance (outside battery life) is a real consideration , however I suspect that this a a smaller group of people. THe majority of people will either be in iOS or need windows and that will drive how they spend £12000-£1400 on a device of this type.
I'd love to know your thoughts on my hypothesis and anyone else's. Haha.
Once again - great video.
Best, most comprehensive and level headed review I have seen so far.
Some that try to do this have been completely unhinged - yoyurs was so useful because youmade it more real-world. Really appreciated that. Thanks.
Great comment
Yep. Apple made the MK the same as the onboard keyboard. Frankly, it's because you don't really need it & they probably think it's hilarious. iPad is a Tablet. Why buy a keyboard for a portable touch device? Okay, well, pay $300, lol.
SP is nice but the pen/touch is well, not for the artistic to say the least. Not much pen support, not even in NotePad sadly & its iffy in OneNote. But Win has always been a Business platform and does that well.
I think it really is a personal choice. If you were to ask me maybe a decade ago I would've said I'm fine with the ipad pro being a design and illustration student, My needs would just be to organise some files, notes, and a good sketching experience which I still think procreate is superior. Now however I've gotten into coding since then, with implementations like WSL and maybe better android apps support, a surface pro is fast becoming a very attractive product.
I'm also into grapichs and programming. Surface was the clear choice, iPad simply doesn't run the apps I need.
Gaming on surface pro is on whole another level since it runs windows
Lack of AUX port is a huge shame and a good reason to get the Pro 8 instead.
with the surface dock the surface is a full blown PC with a power that is more than enough for most people. and surface users had this for 10 years now. the iPad is still just a tablet and you'll always need an full Computer for certain tasks.
great review!👌
Good comparison video. Thank you bro
Wonderful review, I have a question - can I use Pro 9 like my regular windows laptop?
Thanks - yes it is a full Windows PC.
Very good job on this review. Thanks
Excellent review, incredibly informative and insightful, and allows the viewer to make the right choice for their circumstances.
This is a good review esp for those looking for alternatives
It's been an iPad beater since V1. It has a full featured OS.
This is the most honest review I have seen on RUclips
Heyyy welcome back. Miss you guys and gals.
Great review. Thx
Great review and glad to see someone reviewing these, actually stating with "12th Gen i7" is being reviewed, as there are a few i7's being used in the SP line up.
For example, your reviewed an i7-1255u (2PC+8EC/12T @ 3.5/4.7GHz),
your US hyper-link is to an I7-2640M (2C/4T @ 2.8/3.5GHz), a noticeably less powerful variant for "work" tasks.
And there is also an I7-1265U (2PC+8EC/12T @ 3.6/4.8GHz) variant.
The difference may seem small.. but it's actually relevant to the intend software use.. esp. if intended to use as closer to a laptop solution
Also note, there is a powerful older SP8 with an i7-1185G7 - 4C/8T @ 3.0/4.7GHz), that you may want to take a look at.
Excellent video! Now I know which computer to buy, SURFACE PRO 9. Thank you! 👍
I have a Surface Pro 8 i5 16 GB, and I love it. But it would be nice to be able to switch off the fan, so you get completely silent device if needed.
Thank you for the great video! What about Samsung Galaxy Tab S8? Have you sold it? Do you consider it as the good alternative for both of these devices? Moreover, its lifecycle is over soon and it sells with the good discount now I guess...
I still have the S8 and use it. I’m planning to do a follow up video soon, but yes, I think it’s a good tablet. The problem is that it can’t compete with the iPad on performance. Does that matter in the real world to the majority of users? Probably not.
@@ConstantGeekery Ok, looking forward for your using experience update on this device! Except for cost-cutting TFT display, Tab S8 still looks like a descent Android tablet that is enough for a majority of users.
Some iOS Developers will be making their Apps available for Android soon. That will be a plus.
I certainly hope it’s battery will not bulge over time and push the screen from it seams as my Surface Pro 3 did. After that I never touched another Microsoft Pro device.
I had an old black macbook that did that, they did replace it though. A battery is a battery at the end of the day.
Great review.
i've been looking at the Surface Pro as a possible Laptop/work station with tablet like capabilities when I have to go into the field.
The ability to use in tablet mode is way more useful than walkig around with a laptop and having to find somewhere to rest it to use it (when mbile).
I've tried Android options but the available apps don't provide the functionality that my Windows based apps do.
Which leads me to this question.. Is software installation on the Surface Pro a similar experience to an actual laptop, meaning you could install from a flash drive, cloud storage, etc.. or is it "Pay/Windows store" based?
It is the full version of Windows, so you install software however you like. 👍🏻
Thank you for a good video. The task to compare this two devices is not easy, but I think you did a good job and show pros cons and compromises well. To cohos the right device is not so easy. But I think I'll agree with you. Windows is offer more then the ipad os. :)
Thanks 😊 glad you enjoyed it
Is there a huge performance difference between i7 and i5?
It’s a pretty small performance gap. Probably not even noticeable in day-to-day use.
In my opinion: Surface Pro is the better option. Using iPadOS is too limited, you don’t really have the possibilities of a fully integrated mobile operating system.
Just the fact that you can run Android (blue stacks or memu) and windows on it which is the same apps as iOS beats a iPad hands down
Great video
I'm debating on getting a SP9 i7 from US Amazon for $1,049. Thank you for this video!
I've had an iPad for @ 6 years and just ordered the Surface Pro 9. The reason is the software (and ESPECIALLY Apple's walled ecosystem). The iPad is more of a toy/accessory while the Surface Pro will be much more useful for EVERYTHING I need to do. (I also have a MacBook Pro and a Mac Pro) as well as an HP Workstation.
iPad Pro by far for my needs and hardware stability. I tried using the Surface Pro 9 and I just couldn't deal with a tablet that runs hot and fans ablazin' watching RUclips videos. It works much better in laptop form though the design isn't meant for lap use as the stand is not stable enough and works mainly on solid, flat surfaces. In theory it's a good concept but until they fix the heat and fans going off noisily it won't be on my list until then.
Yea I want it, I tried the iPad Pro with Magic Keyboard & Mouse 😢😩
The battery life span also depends on how bright you keep the display. The brighter the less charge time
Great review.
Had it not because of my company’s stupid mandate on its apps exclusivity on iPadOS only, i would’ve comfortably chosen Surface Pro. No questions asked.
The ipad pro has always been pointless. Massively overpriced and a the dreadful magic keyboard which is an awful typing experience for an absurd price. Also the Surface has a professional operating system.
Can you please make video ues egpu on microsoft surface pro 9
I tested both.
From my personal experience, i choose Microsoft Surface Pro 9...
Probably sending my SP9 back, ridiculous battery life
Nice review and I agree with your choice even as I am deep into the Apple ecosystem.
Thanks 👍🏻
the exchangeable ssd is also so much easier for data recovery if the device dies.
I love my antient iPad. I really love apple mobile devices and I have a lot of software for them. I do however make my living from a MS infrastructure, so I just decided to go surface pro.
my personal opinion is surface pro +keyboard, IPAD 11 + pencil. i bought the pencil slim 2 but i never use it with surface pro, i bought the ipad keyboard but i never use it with ipad, i wish i saved my money.
for tablet use ( books, PDFs) go for ipad, office applications go for surface pro.
What about the S pen? Do you have to press and hold the button for it to draw/write once it gets in contact with the screen?
No need to hold the button.
I7 have npu coprocesor! Its calld dl boost.
OK I have to admit I had a dabble with the M2 iPad and it was OK but I have such a lot of money invested in MS/ windows software, I found I was having to move between my tablet and my win 11 desktop to achieve the creative outcomes I needed. So I am biting the bullet and going back to windows. I had thought the intro of the M2 signalled a move by Apple into a new format such as Mac OS on iPad, but alas not. Apple are running out of inspiration
If you are using a tablet as a computer (screen + keyboard) why not just buy an Apple Air or a notebook PC? (I don't understand why people buy tablets instead).
What happens when you want to use it as a tablet again? It's not for everybody, but some folks want a tablet and notebook in one.
People like different things. I liked the SP, except for the kick stand when I didn't have a table to put it on. Not comfortable to leave on a lap.
Even though the SP was a great travel laptop, a 2-1 works better for me when sitting on my couch.
Do you have ghosting and overheating problem with it?
I haven't seen anything like that on mine. Naturally, you can find the thermal limits quick if you push it, but that's no surprise given the size of the chassis. It does a pretty decent job of spinning up the fans, which aren't overly noisy (most of the time it's completely silent). The display has been fine for me.
I choose surface pro as well but still waiting for when it will be on sales😂
I recently purchased the i7 version, 16gb ram but i have i7-1265u cpu not i7-1255u as you say...???
Stealth upgrade - nice! It’s still listed as shipping with 1255u on the Surface website. Enjoy your extra 100MHz 😁👍🏻
Your US prices are INCORRECT for iPad Pro M2 8gb RAM 12.9 256gb. Wi-Fi only is $1199 w/cellular is $1399. And the 1TB is $1799 Wi-Fi only w/cellular it’s $1999. Also the US price for magic keyboard and Apple Pencil are $349 and $129 respectively. The price for these accessories have remained unchanged for years now. Apple Store was sourced for the pricing.
My apologies. I always source prices from apple.com USA at the time of preparing the video. I can’t see how I would have copied every price incorrectly, so I have no idea why this has happened, unless there was some discount for Black Friday, or maybe I’ve managed to mix up my timelines in Davinci with the placeholders my son set up in the rough edit. We usually check this stuff carefully - genuine mistake.
iPad Pro 12.9 can i use it for Matlab
¿Can it run Linux?
Yes. The community has produced a Linux kernel for Surface devices.
@@ConstantGeekery great news, just two more question, how good is the user experience for taking hand writing note on Linux? Can you recommend a hand writing notes app on Linux?
@@EdgarVillegasG I haven’t personally tried it so I’m not able to help there. Sorry.
@@ConstantGeekery Thanks for your kind response
Lovely vid, always thaught iPad Pro was so let down by its software, all that horsepower wasted.
Also, are we getting the podcast back? :)
We’re rethinking the podcast format at the moment. Not completely decided yet.
One is a COMPUTER, and the other is a wannabe COMPUTER 😊
Very good job
Thanks 😊
What non-artists keep _not understanding_ is how GOOD the iPad Pro and Pencil are, actually out-performing Wacom Cintiqs. The "N-Trig" tech is just not in the same league.
If that were true why then aer the major art programmes not porting the goods over to take advantage of the greatness. Without Procreate I reckon Apple would have lost 50% of its new sales. Everything else half decent is rental software. So the costs of buying an iPad is about £1500 down and plus around £1500 a year to keep using adobe software.
I have an iPad Pro 12.9 with a pencil and i still prefer a pen tablet hooked up to my MacBook Pro for the very simple reason that iPadOS is limited to running actual Pro apps in the industry. Great for ideas, but nowhere near industry standard. (PS iPadOS app based file system makes me puke also 🤣)
I beleive on surface pro u can change colour profile to enhanced.
There is no comparing needed , one is expensive tablet , one is a computer running Windows
My iPad Pro battery drains fast, I get about 7-8 hours.
Mine is about the same with typical use.
Great video, Thank you for the detailed comparison!
Very, very well done as usual! Always enjoy your content.
Thanks 😊
Great comparison... Lets go MS Pro 9.
Damn i got the i5 version
if the surface is sold with an m2 chip it will literally be the best computer on the planet. too bad x86 is really holding it down.
Ugh I wish it was available like that lol. The for sure winner for me is the Surface pro, I really tried to like the iPad but I couldn’t get past its functionality, too limited
Performance is all well and good, but to me, tablets are all about portability, weight, size and battery life. If I need desktop performance, I use a desktop.
Awesome
You so for real brother
I like the iPad a lot I’ve owned a m1 11 inch but it’s working exactly like the cheapest iPad . I’ve owned a surface pro 6 or 7 I can’t remember, it’s working like any windows laptop desktop. It’s all about what software you are using but in the end surface is the winner! Not enough gpu not a problem just hook up a external one , not enough space not a problem update the solid state. File system on mobile both android and iOS or iPad os BAD better on iPad os or iOS than android . Navigation on iPad or android better than windows in a tablet form but remember you can always turn that surface into a laptop desktop computer and then things change. Windows can run everything you want , iPad and android can’t. In the end surface win but can’t beat the easy of use of those tablets
If Android start running good in surface it’ll be a game changer
Great video, thanks! Can you comment on the fan noise of the SP9 i7 16gb ram? Does it start up a lot or is it annoyingly loud under normal office use?
It’s usually silent for normal office stuff. You can hear it when it spins up, especially if you are working it hard, but it’s generally very quiet. I’ve not noticed it starting up a lot either.
@@ConstantGeekery thanks!