You can still respond to the activation of cards that include an effect to Fusion Summon with cards like Solemn Warning, Magical Meltdown will simply prevent it's activation from being negated.
Giant Caliber I’ve had that happen to me before, or they crow my aliester in grave forcing me to use the invoker of madness on field for my fusion summon
You're right with Verte Anaconda. It will not be protected. The reason being is that until the card resolves, nothing in it's effect fusion summons. Yes, both players will know what the effect will become, but until the chain resolves, it is not a fusion summon, it is an effect duplication. Your opponent can solemn your Verte.
Oh Meltdown... I had a guy try to tell me that Meltdown prevented responses to his fusion monsters’ effects. The look on his face when the judge told him I could Ghost Ogre his Mechaba was priceless 😂
Last regional I got a upgraded warning (game loss). Reason: Opp drew after using Dugaress eff to draw, I pointed it out, after he shuffled his hand immediately. Judge gave us BOTH a warning. K, then. Next game I put a dice onto his deck to make sure to remind him about the not draw. Judge sees this, comes over, gives me another warning, upgrading into a game loss. Illegal note-taking. Lost me the round, going 6-2, missing out on Top 8.
@@MSTTV He was the only judge at that 90 man regional. I knew that he did this because of personal reasons (even tho we never met before) but there was literally nothing I could do about it. It would have been my first top ever.
I would cry or I would’ve been tilted and although this is the wrong response to the situation, idc that’s complete bullshit and I am angry 😤 😡 for your cause dude -Brent mayfield
Yeah, you were keeping track of game state, nothing wrong there. Just like if you were putting dice on monsters with once per turn effects to show you have used them etc. That is keeping track of game state and is actually ENCOURAGED at a regional. As for the first thing, if you caught it immediately and he shuffled his hand, you should not get the warning. Now, if you didn't realize it for later, that's a bit different
Mandatory note taking is fine if you're actually taking notes. Dice cannot be used for note taking because they can be confused as counters and they do not notate specifically what they are tracking. Julia has said this multiple times in AdjCon.
8:06 how can meltdown prevent the activation of Judgement ? I believe it just prevent solemn to Negate the actiavtion of the card not prevent the activation of solemn judgement
Some ruling about Magical Meltdown that I wish could be resolved is in the Shaddoll mirror match. Player A: Has Meltdown already active, and any extra deck monster. Player B: Uses Shaddoll Fusión to send to the grave any 2 Shaddoll monsters and then Summon Construct o any other Shaddoll Fusion monster. The question is: can Player B activate the effects of the monsters send from their deck/ hand to grave (and Construct)? Because Meltdown says that the opponent can’t activate any effect when a monster is fusion summoned Is this correct?
It seems like the Cross sheep situation. Since the effects are in the same chain as the fusion monster activating it's effect when it is summoned, I think the effects cannot be activated. I think a Shaddoll Invoked Mirror Match could be very fairly confusing.
For Dugares, I recommend the “dice counter”. Essentially you have your opponent/you place a die with a one pip wherever Dugares would skip. If you skip the draw phase, the die goes next to the deck, if you skip the battle phase, it goes to the center of the field, if you skip the main phase 1, the die goes to the bottom of their field on their side of the mat. Remove the die once the phase has been skipped. That way it’s easier for both players to keep track
someone did this at a regional and got a warning (into game loss) because of a bad judge good method, but be sure the judge allows it (they should anyway)
For that reason, I would just recommend taking their deck away from them for a turn lmao. Or just put a counter somewhere other than the top of deck. Like maybe have them put a token next to the deck. It's totally ludacrous that this encourages sneaky behavior. Tools exist to help, and turns can last 15 minutes each. What kind of bonehead came up with the idea that you have to individually stack 7-15 counters on a card rather than just having a dice. If they wanted less counters, they should just ban or Errata the cards.
Man, rulings are difficult, and I really need to learn all of the PSCT before I attend any event bigger than a locals, I am real bad at this game thanks again Tom
Don't feel like you're bad at the game just because you don't understand complicated rulings. YuGiOh isn't designed very well, and it's extremely difficult to understand what some things do because of inconsistent wordings. If you aren't sure about something, just ask a judge, that's what they're there for.
@@Majoraspersona I don't know that it's the design so much as it is the age. Unlike Magic the Gathering, Yu-Gi-Oh never got a proper "comprehensive rulebook" that covers every little detail you could hope to know, and many you couldn't. Because Yu-Gi-Oh's "law" is written all within the confines of a 30-page pamphlet, the "case law" (largely not officially documented outside of OCG) of rulings tends to hold a lot more sway, and therefore it can be a lot harder for fledgling rules lawyers to get a grip on things. Doesn't help much that reading and comprehending the particulars of some card effects can be as complicated as un-diagramming a sentence. Couple that with the general snootiness that some experienced players (especially some judges I've seen online) can have around players who don't know all the particulars, and you have a game that can be hard for new players to get into.
I am a bit late here, but I agree this is confusing especially because I don't know why they would included "activation of cards and effects" and not just "effects" (well to make it good, but not "unstoppable". This is Konami's lame way of balancing the card even if it means 99.9% of the player base would get confused). Toadally Awesome, Cyber Dragon Infinity, Baronne, Savage Dragon, and even Apoloussa do negate the Activation of effects, but Hope Harbinger, Ash, Apoloussa only negate effects, not activations of effects. The key is looking for "negate the Activation" vs "negate the effect" on the card in question. It makes sense to me now, but normally when you say "activations of cards or effects" that just covers everything. I'm torn at whether or not Meltdown is worth running since it doesn't stop Ash, but I guess it is since it stops almost everything else.
For the meltdown cross sheep ruling, summoning a monster is an action that opens a response window for activation of cards and effects. This means that *EVERY* card activated as part of the chain that is started during that response window is considered to be activated "when a card is summoned", regardless of which chain link it is. This is why you can activate a bottomless trap hole and then chain torrential tribute if you so desire (such as to deal with Light and Darkness Dragon). Magical Meltdown prevents the opponent from activating *anything at all* during this entire summon response window. It is VERY different from cards like Night Beam which only prevents the targeted card from being activated in response to Night Beam itself, or cards like Super Polymerization, which prevent any further cards from being activated during the chain. Meltdown is a block for an entire response window.
After all the "when a card is summoned" effects have been activated. If I (the one who controls meltdown) decide to chain twin twisters, is my opponent now allowed to respond?
We had different card sleeves, and my opponent activated "Exchange". Do the cards (that are exchanged) still keep their own sleeves (which make my card noticeable in your opponent hand)?
Since you mentioned Ash and Shaddoll Fusion, it's also important for people to know that you can Ash Shaddoll Fusion even if there isn't an extra deck monster on the field.
Bit of a random one: The foil imperium duelist sleeves I believe are banned from tournament play, but is it still possible to use them for just your extra deck? they're too cool a sleeve to not be able to use them
So in the cross sheep/meltdown interaction, if you chain something or multiple things to your own cross sheep, your opponent cannot still respond to any of them bcz its still the timing window in response to summon. for example if you summoned raidjin out and sheep triggered, you can also chain raidjin targeting a monster on field, and if you want chain an MST and D.D. Crow and your opponent has to sit there watch them all resolve without being abvle to do anything about any of them. Also cross sheep is not the only card protected this way. meltdown invoker and all shaddoll chains that trigger in graveyard can also be protected this way.
@MST.TV: Is Apollousa negated by Lost World? With LW all non-dino lose 500 attack. Her card to negate says "Exactly 800 atk pts" so does that mean Apo is not good for Dino Scrap deck?
under meltdown, Void imagination's placement on the field and effect's activation cannot be negated, also your opponent cannot respond when the Tierra is fusion summoned
Pretty sure that when you apply verte's effect it becomes that effect. If the effect fusion summons, then Meltdown will protect it. Edit: just checked the OCG db and it is not intended to be protected by meltdown. Tom mentions this near the end of the video. It doesn't necessarily make sense to me, but it has an OCG ruling specifically addressing this. We may get a PSCT translation that makes this ruling clear when Verte comes out.
So, Tombox, I have a question. Somebody at my locals told me that I could not activate my own card effects in response to my own fusion summons if my opponent had a Magical Meltdown. While Magical Meltdown states that the opponent of the controller of meltdown cannot activate cards and effects when a fusion monster is summoned "THIS WAY" referring to the owner of the meltdown using cards or effects that include fusion summons. He told me that I could not activate my cross sheep when I fusion summoned. I would disagree with this because it says "this way" and "your cards or effects". What would you rule it as?
This is what I want to know too did you get an answer for this ? Because I get if the owner of meltdown activates a fusion spell and successfully summons construct or whatever I can’t response but what if I fusion summon and he doesn’t I can’t respond to my own fusion summon ? Another scenario what if he activated el shaddoll fusión quick play and he resolves then I resolves, then meltdown will prevent me from responding to his fusion summon even if I have the turn priority of trigger effects 😭😭 someone help
I have a ruling question, I’m building a danger deck, and it’s fairly easy to go into rank 8’s, does #22 zombie stiens effect trigger danger effects ? It says send from your hand to the grave, it’s that considered a discard ?
Hey Tombox -- I have a card question...Does Moisture Creature include tributes from both sides of the field? The card text states "If you tribute Summon this monster by Tributing 3 monsters on the field..." Since lately card texts are explicit on which side of the field, does this apply to Moisture Creature? Thanks and SUBSCRIBED.
Tributing automatically implies your own side of the field, decode talker is the reference. Even if it points to the oppoents monster u can't tribute it under normal circumstances. This card does not state it can use your opponent's monster as a tribute so you cannot.
Wanted to bring this up. Nidhogg does not negate summons by fusion spells. It is not a true solemn warning ef, more like black horn of heaven. I know Generaiders are getting support going into MR5. It concerns me the number rulings I've had to field regarding this, admittedly at locals level.
Hey there Tombox, quick question. Say Meltdown is on field and you fusion summon using Hedgehog. Hedge's effect will add a monster of course. Your opponent cannot droll you at that moment because the adding and fusion summon happened simultaneously, correct?
Also, on Meltdown it doesn't say just the activation can't be negated. It also says the effects of cards that fusion summon cannot be negated. So that would mean ash cannot negate because it still includes the effect of negating the effect.
Thank you Tombox. Im glad I final have an accredited reference for the whole Magical Meltdown/ Ash / Shaddoll Fusion ruling. When I would tell them that Ash works (bc I play Invoked Shaddolls) they would always dispute. Thank you😁
*Answered* Thanks guys ! Hi, I recently have been looking to back into yu gi oh and I didn’t know the ruling el shaddoll construct. When it uses it affect during the battle phase and destroy’s an opponent’s special summoned monster, does it get to replay/Direct it’s attack to a different monster or attack directly??
No, construct specifically states at the start of the damage step, if it said on deceleration then yes you could redeclare your attack but as soon as your opponent agrees to damage step you cannot redeclare the attack if the game state changes. The only effects that activate in damage step are effects that list it specifically, effects that change attack/defence stats (forbidden chalice, lost wind etc...) And negate activations like borroload savage or judgement but things that negate effects like ash blossom or called by the grave cannot
@@woopersquirtle1422 yeah anything that negates activation works in the damage step whereas if something negates effects it doesn't work in the damage step.
A replay is only accepted if field status changes during attack declaration. Doesn't matter who's field changes or why. But, basically, any time it says the word "damage" then the attack is already considered to be successfully resolving.
what happens u have “apollousa” equipped with the spell card “united we stand”... does this mean apollousa have unlimited negates? my logic is apollousa’s attack can never reach 0 because it “gains 800 attack for each face up monster you control (united we stand effect)”
So with the shaddoll hype and everything. (Not really the invoked variant) what would your thoughts be on teching in world legacy in shadows? The first 2 effects really don't matter for the deck but the third effect is pretty spicy I think.
wow someone actually got me with the Dugares, I didn't really read the effect and kinda trusted my opponent to not cheat and he just said "Draw 2 and then return 1" and I said Ok but he never mentioned how he has to skip his next draw phase and i'm pretty sure he still drew a card and I lost. People summoning Apolusa WAYYY too easily.
So boomer player coming back can you confirm if player a has meltdown and player b activates shaddoll fusion does the meltdown negate the effects of shaddoll monsters used for fusion summon ?
No it does not. Farfa had a video about the top 4 Invoked Shaddoll deck at YCS Utrecht and the guy piloting it mentioned something like this, but that is not how Meltdown works at all. You can read the card and it's pretty clear it wouldn't work that way, so IDK why the judge ruled it like that. If you have Meltdown, it will not negate your opponents Shaddoll effects when they fusion summon (or any variation of that). Just like in this video, it's very specifically because of the "this way" in the clause. Your opponents fusion summons are not considered to have happened "this way".
So so at locals i had world legacy secret set with a indingo in grave my opp has meltdown and summoned construct i couldnt hv activated the trap right ?
You should cover Plunder Patroll Rulings next. Such as; *Cl1 Gizmek Orochi to banish Whitebeard Cl2 Whitebeard to special an ED Plunder. *Cl1 Whitebeard to special an ED Plunder Cl2 Ghost Ogre. *Explain why Thunder King Rai-Oh can't negate Booty and why you can't solemn Warning the effect of an already face-up Booty. I have seen a lot of people get these wrong and maybe a video by yourself can help.
Regarding Magical meltdown and Cross-sheep. If I special summon an el shaddoll construct to a zone Cross-sheep is pointing to and I set my cl1 as construct cl2 as cross-sheep does that mean at that point my opponent cannot respond at all?
I've had judges miss rule on Meltdown vs an already resolved set Impermanence in the same column which was still faceup at resolution. This is gonna make life SO MUCH easier
Does Nebula Dragon negate the effects of the itself and the monster when they are summoned or after they are summoned (basically asking if negates any special summon restrictions like Blue-Eyes Alternative or Chaos Dragon)
So, a practical question: I have Meltdown and Cross-Sheep on the field and summon out an El Shaddoll Construct with Shaddoll Fusion, using Shaddoll Dragon and Wendi from my deck, how could those chains be interacted with? 1. Cl1-4: Cross-Sheep, Construct, Wendi, Dragon 2. Cl1-4: Cross-Sheep, Construct, Dragon, Wendi 3. Cl1-4: Construct, Wendi, Dragon, Cross-Sheep Can my opponent use Impermanence in any of those examples? Or Ghost Ogre? I know that D.D. Crow is still live, as is Lancea as they don't respond to anything, but just get chained on. I'm asking because people say Meltdown would prevent any kind of interaction in that chain as it was the same response Window as the Construct that chained on it's own fusion summon.
From what I can tell as long as the effects are in response to the summon of construct (all of the ones you listed are), you can structure the chain in any way and the opponent cannot respond. As long as the construct was fusion summoned by an effect that fusion summons a fusion monster, such as shaddoll fusion, el shaddoll fusion, and invocation. Originally I thought sheep needed to be the last eff in the chain but I do not believe that is the case because all 4 of your effects are in response to the fusion summon, to which your opponent cannot activate cards or effects according to meltdown. This would include DD crow and lancea because meltdown does not state “respond”, it says your opponent cannot activate cards or effects.
Referring to the cross sheep ruling, since my opponent can't respond to cross sheep as chain link 1 (for example). Let's say I activate twin twisters as chain link 2. Is my opponent allowed to respond to twin twisters or is this whole chain link unrespondable to?
Can i use "king of the swamp" like a especific material for a fusion from the deck? Why effects like "eternal soul" to destroy all monster you control doesnt trigger if it is shuffle to the deck from the field? But effects like Dark sage, or fusion substitute to be count like "polymerization" work even from the deck.
1-Fusion Substitute Monsters cannot be used as such in the Deck or while they are banished. 2-Because you cannot activate an effect from the Deck, and that effect of Eternal Soul activates. Dark Sage has a Summoning Condition, therefore it applies in the Deck (especially regarding the restriction on how you can Special Summon it), and it says that it can be Special Summoned from the Deck, so it can. Fusion Substitute has also a condition on its name (those are usually, if not always since the advent of PSCT, in parentheses) that makes it being treated as "Polymerization" under any circumstances. A condition cannot be negated, and because it's always treated as Poly, you cannot play 2 Poly and 2 Substitues for example, as you would be playing 4 cards named exactly "Polymerization" in your Deck, which is illegal.
@@TheMInecraftKeskas Indeed, but only because it allows you to, effects do ignore rules if they have to in order to exist, but for 99.9% of effects in the game, you cannot activate them from the Deck.
Hey, last time I was at my locals, some tried to summon Crusadia Equimax (link-3) using a Crusadia Equimax and a DD Crow. I pointed it out but the judge ruled that the summon was valid. I still don't believe it was valid. Could someone explain the reason more in depth?
random question. I missed wind up format (and ash didnt exist) Does Factory activate at the resolution of the other wind up monster or does it start a chain and resolve factory then monster (lets say rat for the other monster)
Trigger and trigger-like effects that meet their trigger will wait until the next available chain to activate. Wind-up Factory is the latter and will wait until the chain where the Wind-up monster(s) effects have resolved before activating. This means that if the monster's activation is negated by something like Solemn Strike, Factory can't activate.
@@Sterl500 I always get confused by these things. I remember Magician still allowing you to special after using a negated shark changing level but maybe Factory is different?
@@karnliberated8891 the wholly depends on how shark was being negated. I am speaking of activation negation. When an activation of a card or the activation of a card effect is negated, it's like that chain link never existed in the first place. If Shark was simply veilered, Effect Veiler does not prevent activations so Magician would still be allowed to special summon a Wind-up from the deck. Generally straight forward, though exceptions to these rules are likely to exist.
so if I fusion summon el shaddoll construct when meltdown is on the field, does that mean all the effects that comes with el shaddoll construct: including cross sheep, construct’s own effect, trick clown, squamata can’t be responded at all, because they are all happening in a same chain.
Once the Fusion Monster is successfully Fusion Summoned and is on the field, your opponent can activate cards & effects. If you have effects that triggered during the Fusion Summon, you build your chain, then they can respond/add to.
I did manage to catch someone on the appolousa thing but instead it was them trying to make a Skull Dread. It was danger Darkworld and he had no follow up plays so I basically won from there.
So if I activate fusion cards then meltdown safes my card activations from being negated and if I am using an effect of a card which would fusions summon or special summon a fusionmonster then my card is not protected from my opponents cards. Did I got that right?
the first part is correct only if the fusion card fusion summons, the second part: if the card you activated fusion summons, your opponent can't negate the activation, if it just special summons a fusion monster (not fusion summon) its activation is not protected
Hey MST, it would be good if you could explain the ruling of Hyper Blaze, since it confuses a lot of people. Day 356 of waiting for New Volcanic Support to arrive
@@Venorpion Many peple were debating if it could summon an Uria from the grave that was not properly summoned. I get it that you can't summon him like that, but many people make a mistake because of the "ignoring the summoning conditions" part.
If anyone can confirm this for me I have a question about shaddoll Winda, her effect allows us to special summon once per turn can a opponent with a pendulum deck special summon their monsters all at once does that count as one time special summon
Kevin Solis yes it counts as one summon. You can Pendulum as many monsters as you wish. Winda does not restrict the number of monsters you want to summon via Pendulum summon.
So it makes no sense that effects can be negated with ash blossom and hope harbinger, if they negate your activation you can just simply activate another one if you have it and done. Of course you don't want those pesky ash blossoms trying to negate your effect
So let me reaffirm. If meltdown is currently on my field and I fusion summon chimeratech rampage dragon. I can target and destroy backrow and my opponent can’t respond to the targeting?
If that effect happens in the same response window that one would use something like torrential tribute then yes, the opponent would not be able to respond to it at all.
so you wanna say that cobra doesn't summon a fussion monster with an effect? How else does it summon it? :D I mean meltdown clearly states that card activations and effects cannot be negated. no reason to make it overly complicated. A no is a no :D
Since Construct’s effect is mandatory, it will always be the first to trigger. Eater of Millions is optional. The way it resolves is this: Eater will banish Construct, then Construct destroys Eater. Regardless of who is turn player, Construct will always be Chain Link 1 no matter what.
Hey tombox, i have ruling question to subterror Guru. Situation: Player A has face up Guru on field. Player B summons Tornado dragon. Player A activates final battle to prevent negations and chains Guru effect to book Guru und Tornado dragon. Player B activates Tornado dragons effect and targets backrow. Player A chains fiendess to Negate Tornado dragon and books Guru. Question: the activation of Tornado dragon is negated but will the Guru still book himself and the Tornado dragon? Thanks So far :)
From my understanding of the chain of events, and how guru is worded, both targets must be face up to resolve the effect to book both targets. so Tornado Dragon under this pretense would remain face up.
As a Guru Main, Yes. Guru's effect activated by targeting the opponent's monster, therefore he does not need to be face up when his chain would resolve. Tornado Dragon will in fact be flipped facedown
I'm going to be mentioning this to a lot of high-end Yu-Gi-Oh, because I am trying to figure out, how the F.A field spells work lol does the level increase, remain permanently on the F.A monster or does the F.A monster only gained the level increase well it's on the field or is it permanent level increase gain? just curious because I want to be playing the deck right lol it's just a fun deck I know but still, love my sports cars lol
Solemn Judgment and Warning can still be activated on the activation of a fusion spell. There is nothing stopping the activation of the Solemn. They still pay cost on the activation of the Fusion spell but it resolves without effect.
That to my knowledge isn't true. Your opponent must declare which effect they are using for Dugares upon activation. Since the effect was declared during resolution there is either a guarantee that it will draw or won't draw. If there is a guarantee there won't be and adding of cards or summon from deck you should not be able to activate Ash in response. Looking at knightmare co-link rules, if they activates during co-link they can draw so you can Ash their entire effect. But if they activated when they aren't co-link, you cannot Ash a knightmare monsters entire effect.
@@MSTTV What about Time Thief Redoer? AFAIK his effect can be Ash'ed, even if you're not detaching spells. Is that right? Also, what's the difference between his effect and the Knightmares?
@@Orfeh9999 I dont mean in response to anaconda dumping but the effect of the shaddoll fusion that allows a player to send cards from the deck as material
@@meetRS268 ash cannot be responded to this effect because the cards effect has already resolved, in which case the sending of the monster from the deck cannot be affected by ash due to no activation of an effect applied. (At least to my fullest understanding)
Question, if u fusion summon with meltdown does priority pass straight back to that player or is there a window before where the opponent can respond after the fusion summon in like an open gamestate?
Wait but it says activation of your cards and effects. So if the effect for Shadoll fusion is to send and summon it cannot be negated. The wording is clear as day.
like it litterally says that card activation and the effects that involve a fussion summon cannot be negated. The way the sentence is constructed definetly means that you cannot negate the effect.
The activation of you cards and effects means: activation of your cards and the activation of your effects. For example: Dark contract with the swamp king is a continous spell that has an effect to fusion summon one per turn. When Meltdown is on the field, the activation of that effect can not be negated. But the effect itself can be negated by cards like Hot red dragon archfiend abyss for example. If the wording of Meltdown was: activation and effects of your cards can not be negated, then that would be a different story.
@@Majoraspersona if something is for cost it is before the ; anything after is an effect. For example magicians souls says to send a level6+ Spellcaster to grave; special summon it, meaning it sends for cost. Cards like fusion destiny, shaddoll fusion, neos fusion can be ashed yes.
@@JacobKendrick Thanks, this explains a lot! But it's still pretty confusing in the case Shaddoll Fusion since that card doesn't have any Semi-Colons. It specifically says "you can also use monsters in your Deck as Fusion Material" which would make me infer that it's sending something for cost (in this case material for a Fusion Summon). Or maybe using materials for a summon are different?
I still think that ruling on magical meltdown is false since the card reads “ the activation of your cards and effects that include an effect that fusion summons” so shaddoll fusion can’t be responded to by ash even if it stops the effect since meltdown states that.
But the card is basically read as the activation of cards and activation of effects. (Polymerizarion is a card activation) (Lunalight wolf pendulum scale effect is an effect activation that fusion summon.) The activations cannot be negated.
Magical meltdown only prevents the activation of cards and the activation of effects from being negated. Because of this ash can negate due to it only negating the effect and not the activation.
@@MSTTV you are paraphrasing card there in a way that changes meaning. That is not right. IF there was specifically mentioned "activation of effects" then you would be right. But it is not. So the effect is not negated. The Meltdown is worded properly so it would serve it's purpose as protector for the mentioned summons. If Meltdown is there you cannot interact. Period.
@@mcELINER Read my comment and you will understand that meltdowns effect only prevents cards activation and the activation of effects from being negated. It does not prevent the effect from being negated.
The activations of (cards and effects) should be read like that. Poly is a card activation.. Lunalight Wolf scale effect is an effect that fusion summon. Other wise it would state: The "activated" effects that include fusion summon cannot be negated. Think Infernoid negation they negate activation of spell/traps card and effects. (That effect only refers to activation spell and trap effects)
Magical meltdown only prevents the activation of cards and the activation of effects from being negated. Because of this ash can negate due to it only negating the effect and not the activation.
Simultaneous effects go on chain right? Cross sheep would become chain link 2 or 3 because it’s effect activates AFTER the fusion summon. So even with meltdowns effect active, Cross sheep is not a fusion monster and being the last activation of the chain, it can be responded to. Don’t get sharked huh?
Magical meltdown is a protection protects a full timing window, continuous-like effect. It doesn't activate. These effects aren't that simultaneous. 1. Activate a fusion spell, 2. Resolve chain, fusion summon. Current timing: Monster was just fusion summoned. Magical meltdown does not allow any response from your opponent during this timing. Think droll and lock bird, it can activate in any part of the chain where on resolution where someone added a card. TIMING: monster was fusion summon, (meltdown prevents response) Cross sheep activates in this fusion summon timing ( it is still the fusion summon timing, no response allowed), if meltdown controller activates more cards in that same chain, still not respondable (timing is still monster was fusion summoned) It's similar to why you can activate trickstar reincarnation then droll as chain link 3 after the resolution of a card being added.
Sheep activates during the successful fusion summon as it's trigger. It's the same timing. Meltdown. Cross sheep isn't fusion summoning, but it is the resolution of the previous fusion summon that is still blocking interaction. As it is still a successful fusion summon. Fusion summon triggers cross sheep. The timing which a fusion summon occurs cannot be responded to. Therefore everything that activates in that chain cannot be responded to since it's still a response to the fusion summon.
purposefully letting your opponent make an illegal move BEFORE calling the judge so that the game state cant be repaired andv your opponent gets a game loss
Im confused about the cross sheep with meltdown ruling. Doesnt cross sheep start a separate chain after the summon was successful? Meaning wouldn't it be separate from the fusion summon?
Cross sheeps effect activates at the same time that a fusion summon has successfully happened. This would be the same time you'd be able to activate cards such as torrential tribute or bottomless trap hole. Because of magical meltdown though, you may not use such effects in response. This means you cannot respond to cross sheeps effect.
@@morgangoldsmith3781 that wouldn't matter because the fusion summon isn't successful until after the card resolves and everything on the chain resolves. So if a card fusion summons as cl2, cards that would respond to it like bottomless cannot respond yet until cl1 has finished. With meltdown on the field they wouldn't be able to even with the fusion card being cl2 or higher.
So if I fusion summon into Cross sheep with magical meltdown in my field zone cross sheep can’t be responded too? Even though its a when effect on magical meltdown not an If. because it sounds like cross sheep ef is responding to the fusion summon so now i can respond to cross sheep. 🤔
But meltdown says “your opponents cards and effects can not activate when a monster is fusion summoned this way” cross sheep is my monster that activated in the fusion summon window, as well as something like aliester the invoker of madness, since it’s still in that window you cannot activate effects to respond to anything in that window.
But what you could do preemptively is stuff like respond to the invocation itself with lancea, or banishing their aliester with called or d.d. Crow, ect. Since invocation doesn’t have a cost and and everything happens on resolution. I’ve had people crow my aliester in grave forcing me to use the invoker of madness on board, or forcing me to go into a shaddoll fusion I didn’t want to go into because I must perform the fusion if I can.
since construct and cross sheep (and any shaddoll you send, or trick clown) happen in the same chain I think you can get yourself to the conclusion that no, your opponent cannot respond
When I take a opponent Sleeper with my Borreload and I use Sleeper effect to destroy. Witch field would destroy the Sleeper after being destroy by his effect??
The player who originally owned the sleeper I would assume. I kinda see it as what would happen if you set rotation out skystriker area zero to your opponents field and then use something like mst to pop the a0 you gave them, you would be the one that would summon raye from deck since it would activate in your grave.
Magical meltdown only prevents the activation of cards and the activation of effects from being negated. Because of this ash can negate due to it only negating the effect and not the activation of the effect.
You can abuse that “no response” window from Magical Meltdown by saving cards like Twin Twister until you successfully Fusion Summon a monster then activating the card on summon. Alternatively, if your playing against a deck like Draco, or if you want to play around Waking the Dragon, you can chain Twin to the activation of your Fusion spell while Meltdown is on field, and the Draco spells/traps/WTD you destroy cannot trigger
The Draco spells/traps/WTD would still be able to trigger because they would activate in a new chain after being destroyed which comes after the successful fusion summon of the monster. What cannot happen is the opponent in response to Twin Twisters activation chain any of the targeted cards.
James Cunningham. If Meltdown is on the field and I activate Invocation CL1, Twin Twisters CL2, how do the Draco cards activate in the grave after they’re destroyed if they would have normally triggered in the same window as an effect such as Cross-Sheep?
No, your interpretation of Meltdown is wrong. “The [activation of cards] and [effects] that fusion...” It would maybe be different if there was a cost side to cards like Shaddoll Fusion, but there isn’t. If the activation goes through, the effect goes through. They’re the same thing.
This interpretation of meltdown isn't something new, in fact it's just really old rulings I had to bring back to the forefront. Meltdown doesn't protect the effects themseles from being negated during resolution. As it states the "activation of" your cards and effects. now compare with altergeist protocol a card that does protect both types of negation. "The activation and effects of Altergeist cards activated on your field cannot be negated." Vs "The activation of (cards and effects)" that's the difference. Otherwise it would make sense to just use the altergeist protocol wording. Wording makes all the difference when it comes to psct. Like how Infernoid Onuncu can negate spell/trap (cards or effects) activations. The effects is only spell/trap effects not including monster effects.
MST.TV How is this an actual ruling. The words themselves in the card don’t make any sense with that ruling. It all comes down to if Konami meant for there to be a comma here: “cards, and effects,” I guess?
Meltdown activate on my field. Opponents activate branded opening, i chain branded in red using tragedy and libitum and fuse into masquerade. Oppo discards tragedy and SS jester. New chain, i resolve tragedy and libitum. He can use his tragedy and jester? Meltdown is on my field... I think he can't activates effects cause I SS masquerade
You fusion summon your masquerade..., And then they summon out aluber and sent tragedy... The last thing to happen is the summon of aluber and not your fusion summon. Therefore your meltdown's no response effect is not applying at this time.
Tournament players winning cause cheating is no surprise. I've played against so many people who i caught cheating during our match. It got so annoying that stopped playing with them.
Damn I'm sad i wanted to build shaddoll invoke long time ago with the new stuff and now that it tops without the new stuff i meed to get everithyng fast or it will get more expensive and here i thought it was going to be a fun deck with a "good chance" to be competitive i need to get my cards fast xD
since construct and cross sheep (and any shaddoll you send, or trick clown) happen in the same chain I think you can get yourself to the conclusion that no, your opponent cannot respond
But if the oponent has the meltdown on the field and i activate the effect of shaddoll fusion, construct will resolve or i cant activate because of meltdown?
Maxo Meltdown’s effect is only applied to its controller. If your opponent is the one controlling Meltdown, and you’re the one fusión summoning, then Meltdown “protection” has nothing to do with your fusión summon. You Mayra activate Construct’s effect and you opponent Mayra respond to it
You can still respond to the activation of cards that include an effect to Fusion Summon with cards like Solemn Warning, Magical Meltdown will simply prevent it's activation from being negated.
Reegar lol easy way for you to make your opponent waste cards
chain lancea force them to use their hand lol
Giant Caliber I’ve had that happen to me before, or they crow my aliester in grave forcing me to use the invoker of madness on field for my fusion summon
@@GiantCaliber or it will just fizzle
@@ScorpioneOrzion Fizzle. Don't suppose you caught that video Tombox did complaining about that phrase and others.
You're right with Verte Anaconda. It will not be protected. The reason being is that until the card resolves, nothing in it's effect fusion summons. Yes, both players will know what the effect will become, but until the chain resolves, it is not a fusion summon, it is an effect duplication. Your opponent can solemn your Verte.
Worth pointing out that Ghost Belle also cannot negate Invocation under Metldown because it negates the activation unlike Ash.
Oh Meltdown... I had a guy try to tell me that Meltdown prevented responses to his fusion monsters’ effects. The look on his face when the judge told him I could Ghost Ogre his Mechaba was priceless 😂
Last regional I got a upgraded warning (game loss). Reason: Opp drew after using Dugaress eff to draw, I pointed it out, after he shuffled his hand immediately. Judge gave us BOTH a warning. K, then.
Next game I put a dice onto his deck to make sure to remind him about the not draw. Judge sees this, comes over, gives me another warning, upgrading into a game loss. Illegal note-taking. Lost me the round, going 6-2, missing out on Top 8.
That shouldn't be illegal note taking.. it's a mandatory effect reminder... I would appeal that 100%
@@MSTTV He was the only judge at that 90 man regional. I knew that he did this because of personal reasons (even tho we never met before) but there was literally nothing I could do about it. It would have been my first top ever.
I would cry or I would’ve been tilted and although this is the wrong response to the situation, idc that’s complete bullshit and I am angry 😤 😡 for your cause dude
-Brent mayfield
Yeah, you were keeping track of game state, nothing wrong there. Just like if you were putting dice on monsters with once per turn effects to show you have used them etc. That is keeping track of game state and is actually ENCOURAGED at a regional. As for the first thing, if you caught it immediately and he shuffled his hand, you should not get the warning. Now, if you didn't realize it for later, that's a bit different
Mandatory note taking is fine if you're actually taking notes. Dice cannot be used for note taking because they can be confused as counters and they do not notate specifically what they are tracking. Julia has said this multiple times in AdjCon.
"Some people will try to shark you" Those gosh darn Italians!
Kenneth Hernandez of course. It can't be the French because they'll scoop the second you play a card.
As an italian
I say : "cazzo hai ragione"
As a harpie player I already knew about appolousa requirements. BECAUSE EVERY HARPIE IS TREATED AS HARPIE LADY!!! lol apollousa sucks in harpies
Harpies suck, that's the point
🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@gorsedh simorgh bird of kings is gonna really help the deck out. You can easy turn 1 simorgh bird kings, dark simorgh, and crystal wing
You don't have monsters with different names? Sounds like a Knightmare truly.
@@meruru1745 yeah but it's not that big of a board
"conveniently" forgetting rulings seem to be a reoccurring theme in the yugioh community.
Yes.. it is a problem especially if things aren't immediate.
Jokingly
@@Dotfoxmike J O K I N G L Y
Well, when the meta players play for prizes rather than FUN wins...
@@TrianglePants so you want tourneys to not have cash prizes?
8:06 how can meltdown prevent the activation of Judgement ? I believe it just prevent solemn to Negate the actiavtion of the card not prevent the activation of solemn judgement
Making apollousa with 3 Super Agents POGGERS
Some ruling about Magical Meltdown that I wish could be resolved is in the Shaddoll mirror match.
Player A: Has Meltdown already active, and any extra deck monster.
Player B: Uses Shaddoll Fusión to send to the grave any 2 Shaddoll monsters and then Summon Construct o any other Shaddoll Fusion monster.
The question is: can Player B activate the effects of the monsters send from their deck/ hand to grave (and Construct)?
Because Meltdown says that the opponent can’t activate any effect when a monster is fusion summoned
Is this correct?
It seems like the Cross sheep situation. Since the effects are in the same chain as the fusion monster activating it's effect when it is summoned, I think the effects cannot be activated. I think a Shaddoll Invoked Mirror Match could be very fairly confusing.
For Dugares, I recommend the “dice counter”. Essentially you have your opponent/you place a die with a one pip wherever Dugares would skip. If you skip the draw phase, the die goes next to the deck, if you skip the battle phase, it goes to the center of the field, if you skip the main phase 1, the die goes to the bottom of their field on their side of the mat. Remove the die once the phase has been skipped. That way it’s easier for both players to keep track
someone did this at a regional and got a warning (into game loss) because of a bad judge
good method, but be sure the judge allows it (they should anyway)
For that reason, I would just recommend taking their deck away from them for a turn lmao.
Or just put a counter somewhere other than the top of deck. Like maybe have them put a token next to the deck. It's totally ludacrous that this encourages sneaky behavior. Tools exist to help, and turns can last 15 minutes each. What kind of bonehead came up with the idea that you have to individually stack 7-15 counters on a card rather than just having a dice.
If they wanted less counters, they should just ban or Errata the cards.
I wasnt with you on the predaplant ruling until you pointed out “this way”. Crazy how that’s so important
Man, rulings are difficult, and I really need to learn all of the PSCT before I attend any event bigger than a locals, I am real bad at this game thanks again Tom
Don't feel like you're bad at the game just because you don't understand complicated rulings. YuGiOh isn't designed very well, and it's extremely difficult to understand what some things do because of inconsistent wordings. If you aren't sure about something, just ask a judge, that's what they're there for.
@@Majoraspersona I don't know that it's the design so much as it is the age. Unlike Magic the Gathering, Yu-Gi-Oh never got a proper "comprehensive rulebook" that covers every little detail you could hope to know, and many you couldn't. Because Yu-Gi-Oh's "law" is written all within the confines of a 30-page pamphlet, the "case law" (largely not officially documented outside of OCG) of rulings tends to hold a lot more sway, and therefore it can be a lot harder for fledgling rules lawyers to get a grip on things. Doesn't help much that reading and comprehending the particulars of some card effects can be as complicated as un-diagramming a sentence. Couple that with the general snootiness that some experienced players (especially some judges I've seen online) can have around players who don't know all the particulars, and you have a game that can be hard for new players to get into.
I am a bit late here, but I agree this is confusing especially because I don't know why they would included "activation of cards and effects" and not just "effects" (well to make it good, but not "unstoppable". This is Konami's lame way of balancing the card even if it means 99.9% of the player base would get confused).
Toadally Awesome, Cyber Dragon Infinity, Baronne, Savage Dragon, and even Apoloussa do negate the Activation of effects, but Hope Harbinger, Ash, Apoloussa only negate effects, not activations of effects. The key is looking for "negate the Activation" vs "negate the effect" on the card in question.
It makes sense to me now, but normally when you say "activations of cards or effects" that just covers everything. I'm torn at whether or not Meltdown is worth running since it doesn't stop Ash, but I guess it is since it stops almost everything else.
For the meltdown cross sheep ruling, summoning a monster is an action that opens a response window for activation of cards and effects. This means that *EVERY* card activated as part of the chain that is started during that response window is considered to be activated "when a card is summoned", regardless of which chain link it is. This is why you can activate a bottomless trap hole and then chain torrential tribute if you so desire (such as to deal with Light and Darkness Dragon). Magical Meltdown prevents the opponent from activating *anything at all* during this entire summon response window. It is VERY different from cards like Night Beam which only prevents the targeted card from being activated in response to Night Beam itself, or cards like Super Polymerization, which prevent any further cards from being activated during the chain. Meltdown is a block for an entire response window.
After all the "when a card is summoned" effects have been activated. If I (the one who controls meltdown) decide to chain twin twisters, is my opponent now allowed to respond?
We had different card sleeves, and my opponent activated "Exchange". Do the cards (that are exchanged) still keep their own sleeves (which make my card noticeable in your opponent hand)?
Yea
Absolutely
7:26
OH, i know where this is going... cuz Anaconda doesn't have the "Fusion summon clause" in its card text.
10:37
yea, makes sense.
Love these segments. Thank you for these videos. Keep them coming.
Thank you so much for all the effort you put in your videos!
Since you mentioned Ash and Shaddoll Fusion, it's also important for people to know that you can Ash Shaddoll Fusion even if there isn't an extra deck monster on the field.
What about super Polymerization
@@blueyekaibaman1238 no you can do anything if your opponent actives super poly
Even through Meltdown i cannot escape the forehead.
Yeah that thing could use some more PSCT as i had no idea 38 could negate fusion under meltdown.
Bit of a random one: The foil imperium duelist sleeves I believe are banned from tournament play, but is it still possible to use them for just your extra deck? they're too cool a sleeve to not be able to use them
if the sleeve has any kind of decoration on the front part, is illegal for use entirely, be it for extra, main or side deck
So in the cross sheep/meltdown interaction, if you chain something or multiple things to your own cross sheep, your opponent cannot still respond to any of them bcz its still the timing window in response to summon. for example if you summoned raidjin out and sheep triggered, you can also chain raidjin targeting a monster on field, and if you want chain an MST and D.D. Crow and your opponent has to sit there watch them all resolve without being abvle to do anything about any of them. Also cross sheep is not the only card protected this way. meltdown invoker and all shaddoll chains that trigger in graveyard can also be protected this way.
@MST.TV: Is Apollousa negated by Lost World? With LW all non-dino lose 500 attack. Her card to negate says "Exactly 800 atk pts" so does that mean Apo is not good for Dino Scrap deck?
Can you do a video on the interactions between void imagination and meltdown?
under meltdown, Void imagination's placement on the field and effect's activation cannot be negated, also your opponent cannot respond when the Tierra is fusion summoned
Verte Anaconda doesn't Fusion Summon so Magical Meltdown wouldn't prevent your opponent from activating cards or effects in response anyway, right?
Pretty sure that when you apply verte's effect it becomes that effect. If the effect fusion summons, then Meltdown will protect it.
Edit: just checked the OCG db and it is not intended to be protected by meltdown. Tom mentions this near the end of the video. It doesn't necessarily make sense to me, but it has an OCG ruling specifically addressing this. We may get a PSCT translation that makes this ruling clear when Verte comes out.
Meltdown won’t protect it because it’s not an effect that fusion summons
can i use the effect of crosssheep in the opponents turn ? when i go for winda in a linked zone ?
Yeah you can but not with winda bc that uses your special summon (winda lockdown on special summoning)
So, Tombox, I have a question. Somebody at my locals told me that I could not activate my own card effects in response to my own fusion summons if my opponent had a Magical Meltdown.
While Magical Meltdown states that the opponent of the controller of meltdown cannot activate cards and effects when a fusion monster is summoned "THIS WAY" referring to the owner of the meltdown using cards or effects that include fusion summons. He told me that I could not activate my cross sheep when I fusion summoned. I would disagree with this because it says "this way" and "your cards or effects".
What would you rule it as?
This is what I want to know too did you get an answer for this ? Because I get if the owner of meltdown activates a fusion spell and successfully summons construct or whatever I can’t response but what if I fusion summon and he doesn’t I can’t respond to my own fusion summon ?
Another scenario what if he activated el shaddoll fusión quick play and he resolves then I resolves, then meltdown will prevent me from responding to his fusion summon even if I have the turn priority of trigger effects 😭😭 someone help
For future games I have a question if you ash blossom the shaddoll fusion I can still use cards in hand right?
I have a ruling question, I’m building a danger deck, and it’s fairly easy to go into rank 8’s, does #22 zombie stiens effect trigger danger effects ? It says send from your hand to the grave, it’s that considered a discard ?
Sending is not the same as discarding and will not trigger discard effects.
Hey Tombox -- I have a card question...Does Moisture Creature include tributes from both sides of the field? The card text states "If you tribute Summon this monster by Tributing 3 monsters on the field..." Since lately card texts are explicit on which side of the field, does this apply to Moisture Creature? Thanks and SUBSCRIBED.
Tributing automatically implies your own side of the field, decode talker is the reference. Even if it points to the oppoents monster u can't tribute it under normal circumstances.
This card does not state it can use your opponent's monster as a tribute so you cannot.
Wanted to bring this up. Nidhogg does not negate summons by fusion spells. It is not a true solemn warning ef, more like black horn of heaven. I know Generaiders are getting support going into MR5. It concerns me the number rulings I've had to field regarding this, admittedly at locals level.
so you have meldown and opponent summons construct. would they be able to activate constructs effect? i mean the field zone affects both players?
And it says your "opponent's cards and effect cannot activate..." So construct and everything used to summon can activate
@@MSTTV ah i am so mind fucked so when opponent summons construct you, the player, cant respond?
Hey there Tombox, quick question. Say Meltdown is on field and you fusion summon using Hedgehog. Hedge's effect will add a monster of course. Your opponent cannot droll you at that moment because the adding and fusion summon happened simultaneously, correct?
Also, on Meltdown it doesn't say just the activation can't be negated. It also says the effects of cards that fusion summon cannot be negated. So that would mean ash cannot negate because it still includes the effect of negating the effect.
Its a sentence the activation, not the effects cant be read separately afaik.
Thank you Tombox. Im glad I final have an accredited reference for the whole Magical Meltdown/ Ash / Shaddoll Fusion ruling. When I would tell them that Ash works (bc I play Invoked Shaddolls) they would always dispute. Thank you😁
*Answered* Thanks guys !
Hi, I recently have been looking to back into yu gi oh and I didn’t know the ruling el shaddoll construct. When it uses it affect during the battle phase and destroy’s an opponent’s special summoned monster, does it get to replay/Direct it’s attack to a different monster or attack directly??
No, construct specifically states at the start of the damage step, if it said on deceleration then yes you could redeclare your attack but as soon as your opponent agrees to damage step you cannot redeclare the attack if the game state changes.
The only effects that activate in damage step are effects that list it specifically, effects that change attack/defence stats (forbidden chalice, lost wind etc...) And negate activations like borroload savage or judgement but things that negate effects like ash blossom or called by the grave cannot
nope. it activates at the Start of the dmg step and then there is no replay.
@@JacobKendrick I never knew that Aavage could work in the damage step. Also, I think all Counter Traps work in the damage step.
@@woopersquirtle1422 yeah anything that negates activation works in the damage step whereas if something negates effects it doesn't work in the damage step.
A replay is only accepted if field status changes during attack declaration. Doesn't matter who's field changes or why. But, basically, any time it says the word "damage" then the attack is already considered to be successfully resolving.
what happens u have “apollousa” equipped with the spell card “united we stand”... does this mean apollousa have unlimited negates? my logic is apollousa’s attack can never reach 0 because it “gains 800 attack for each face up monster you control (united we stand effect)”
So with the shaddoll hype and everything. (Not really the invoked variant) what would your thoughts be on teching in world legacy in shadows? The first 2 effects really don't matter for the deck but the third effect is pretty spicy I think.
can you make the same ruling video for the dytron field spell plis, its works the same as magical meltown or not ?
Damn, i was just watching spyrals ones
:D Thanks for the rulings infoooooooos
wow someone actually got me with the Dugares, I didn't really read the effect and kinda trusted my opponent to not cheat and he just said "Draw 2 and then return 1" and I said Ok but he never mentioned how he has to skip his next draw phase and i'm pretty sure he still drew a card and I lost. People summoning Apolusa WAYYY too easily.
I admit I'm guilty of forgetting to skip my draw, but the opponent doesn't even realize either
So boomer player coming back can you confirm if player a has meltdown and player b activates shaddoll fusion does the meltdown negate the effects of shaddoll monsters used for fusion summon ?
No it does not. Farfa had a video about the top 4 Invoked Shaddoll deck at YCS Utrecht and the guy piloting it mentioned something like this, but that is not how Meltdown works at all. You can read the card and it's pretty clear it wouldn't work that way, so IDK why the judge ruled it like that. If you have Meltdown, it will not negate your opponents Shaddoll effects when they fusion summon (or any variation of that). Just like in this video, it's very specifically because of the "this way" in the clause. Your opponents fusion summons are not considered to have happened "this way".
So so at locals i had world legacy secret set with a indingo in grave my opp has meltdown and summoned construct i couldnt hv activated the trap right ?
You should cover Plunder Patroll Rulings next. Such as;
*Cl1 Gizmek Orochi to banish Whitebeard Cl2 Whitebeard to special an ED Plunder.
*Cl1 Whitebeard to special an ED Plunder Cl2 Ghost Ogre.
*Explain why Thunder King Rai-Oh can't negate Booty and why you can't solemn Warning the effect of an already face-up Booty.
I have seen a lot of people get these wrong and maybe a video by yourself can help.
Regarding Magical meltdown and Cross-sheep. If I special summon an el shaddoll construct to a zone Cross-sheep is pointing to and I set my cl1 as construct cl2 as cross-sheep does that mean at that point my opponent cannot respond at all?
This would be correct.
I've had judges miss rule on Meltdown vs an already resolved set Impermanence in the same column which was still faceup at resolution. This is gonna make life SO MUCH easier
so you had impermanence set in extra deck zone? :D
@@mcELINER I'm not sure that you've ever read Meltdown or if you're being cheeky.
Wait, I'm confused. Are you saying that magical meltdown was in the same column as impermenance? How is that possible?
@@HashSlingingSlasher539 I'm saying Invocation was
@@NickCamokidVisneski Yeah, that's not what you said, but we understand now.
Does Nebula Dragon negate the effects of the itself and the monster when they are summoned or after they are summoned (basically asking if negates any special summon restrictions like Blue-Eyes Alternative or Chaos Dragon)
Negated effect is when they are summoned they are already negated.
It doesn't negate special summon restriction.... Those are summon conditions and they do not count as effects.
@@MSTTV alright thanks man
So, a practical question: I have Meltdown and Cross-Sheep on the field and summon out an El Shaddoll Construct with Shaddoll Fusion, using Shaddoll Dragon and Wendi from my deck, how could those chains be interacted with?
1. Cl1-4: Cross-Sheep, Construct, Wendi, Dragon
2. Cl1-4: Cross-Sheep, Construct, Dragon, Wendi
3. Cl1-4: Construct, Wendi, Dragon, Cross-Sheep
Can my opponent use Impermanence in any of those examples? Or Ghost Ogre? I know that D.D. Crow is still live, as is Lancea as they don't respond to anything, but just get chained on. I'm asking because people say Meltdown would prevent any kind of interaction in that chain as it was the same response Window as the Construct that chained on it's own fusion summon.
From what I can tell as long as the effects are in response to the summon of construct (all of the ones you listed are), you can structure the chain in any way and the opponent cannot respond. As long as the construct was fusion summoned by an effect that fusion summons a fusion monster, such as shaddoll fusion, el shaddoll fusion, and invocation. Originally I thought sheep needed to be the last eff in the chain but I do not believe that is the case because all 4 of your effects are in response to the fusion summon, to which your opponent cannot activate cards or effects according to meltdown. This would include DD crow and lancea because meltdown does not state “respond”, it says your opponent cannot activate cards or effects.
Don't forget "Called by the Grave" that can eat up one of those discarded monsters.
Referring to the cross sheep ruling, since my opponent can't respond to cross sheep as chain link 1 (for example). Let's say I activate twin twisters as chain link 2. Is my opponent allowed to respond to twin twisters or is this whole chain link unrespondable to?
You can't activate twin twisters to begin with.
@@yomireal7570 why not? meltdown only says your opponent cant activate cards or effects
Can i use "king of the swamp" like a especific material for a fusion from the deck?
Why effects like "eternal soul" to destroy all monster you control doesnt trigger if it is shuffle to the deck from the field?
But effects like Dark sage, or fusion substitute to be count like "polymerization" work even from the deck.
1-Fusion Substitute Monsters cannot be used as such in the Deck or while they are banished.
2-Because you cannot activate an effect from the Deck, and that effect of Eternal Soul activates.
Dark Sage has a Summoning Condition, therefore it applies in the Deck (especially regarding the restriction on how you can Special Summon it), and it says that it can be Special Summoned from the Deck, so it can.
Fusion Substitute
has also a condition on its name (those are usually, if not always since the advent of PSCT, in parentheses) that makes it being treated as "Polymerization" under any circumstances. A condition cannot be negated, and because it's always treated as Poly, you cannot play 2 Poly and 2 Substitues for example, as you would be playing 4 cards named exactly "Polymerization" in your Deck, which is illegal.
@@Joerisama You can activate effects from the deck, example: Serpentine Princess.
@@TheMInecraftKeskas Indeed, but only because it allows you to, effects do ignore rules if they have to in order to exist, but for 99.9% of effects in the game, you cannot activate them from the Deck.
Hey, last time I was at my locals, some tried to summon Crusadia Equimax (link-3) using a Crusadia Equimax and a DD Crow. I pointed it out but the judge ruled that the summon was valid. I still don't believe it was valid. Could someone explain the reason more in depth?
it was not since its a link 3. a link can only be used as its link rating is or link 1.
random question. I missed wind up format (and ash didnt exist) Does Factory activate at the resolution of the other wind up monster or does it start a chain and resolve factory then monster (lets say rat for the other monster)
Trigger and trigger-like effects that meet their trigger will wait until the next available chain to activate. Wind-up Factory is the latter and will wait until the chain where the Wind-up monster(s) effects have resolved before activating. This means that if the monster's activation is negated by something like Solemn Strike, Factory can't activate.
@@Sterl500 I always get confused by these things. I remember Magician still allowing you to special after using a negated shark changing level but maybe Factory is different?
@@karnliberated8891 the wholly depends on how shark was being negated. I am speaking of activation negation. When an activation of a card or the activation of a card effect is negated, it's like that chain link never existed in the first place. If Shark was simply veilered, Effect Veiler does not prevent activations so Magician would still be allowed to special summon a Wind-up from the deck.
Generally straight forward, though exceptions to these rules are likely to exist.
so if I fusion summon el shaddoll construct when meltdown is on the field, does that mean all the effects that comes with el shaddoll construct: including cross sheep, construct’s own effect, trick clown, squamata can’t be responded at all, because they are all happening in a same chain.
yes
Once the Fusion Monster is successfully Fusion Summoned and is on the field, your opponent can activate cards & effects. If you have effects that triggered during the Fusion Summon, you build your chain, then they can respond/add to.
I believe that is how it would work, yeah
I did manage to catch someone on the appolousa thing but instead it was them trying to make a Skull Dread. It was danger Darkworld and he had no follow up plays so I basically won from there.
So if I activate fusion cards then meltdown safes my card activations from being negated and if I am using an effect of a card which would fusions summon or special summon a fusionmonster then my card is not protected from my opponents cards. Did I got that right?
the first part is correct only if the fusion card fusion summons, the second part: if the card you activated fusion summons, your opponent can't negate the activation, if it just special summons a fusion monster (not fusion summon) its activation is not protected
Hey MST, it would be good if you could explain the ruling of Hyper Blaze, since it confuses a lot of people.
Day 356 of waiting for New Volcanic Support to arrive
Payne 96 9 more days.
lol wait what, it just came in the ocg, what's confusing about it?
@@Venorpion Many peple were debating if it could summon an Uria from the grave that was not properly summoned. I get it that you can't summon him like that, but many people make a mistake because of the "ignoring the summoning conditions" part.
Wow I can already see the cross sheep ruling coming up at locals. I guess I'll just save the link to this video then for easy access
Does harbringer able to negate the effect of dark ruler no more? or super polymerization?
No
Monster effects cannot activate in response to their activation
If anyone can confirm this for me I have a question about shaddoll Winda, her effect allows us to special summon once per turn can a opponent with a pendulum deck special summon their monsters all at once does that count as one time special summon
Kevin Solis yes it counts as one summon. You can Pendulum as many monsters as you wish. Winda does not restrict the number of monsters you want to summon via Pendulum summon.
You and distantcoder should do a judge videoooo
We should totally collab
So it makes no sense that effects can be negated with ash blossom and hope harbinger, if they negate your activation you can just simply activate another one if you have it and done. Of course you don't want those pesky ash blossoms trying to negate your effect
So let me reaffirm. If meltdown is currently on my field and I fusion summon chimeratech rampage dragon. I can target and destroy backrow and my opponent can’t respond to the targeting?
Only if it is an on summon effect.
Rampage's pop effect is on summon, so extrapolating from Tombox's explanations, the opponent should not be able respond to his summon.
If that effect happens in the same response window that one would use something like torrential tribute then yes, the opponent would not be able to respond to it at all.
so you wanna say that cobra doesn't summon a fussion monster with an effect? How else does it summon it? :D I mean meltdown clearly states that card activations and effects cannot be negated. no reason to make it overly complicated. A no is a no :D
Hi how's it going big fan. I'm trying to build a time Lord Deck Do you have any suggestionsAnd good tipsInto building the Deck .
Lord deck as in dark lord archlord?
@@MSTTV I think he said Timelords
"Ritual Sanctuary" combines with "time maiden", once per turn you can shuffle a spell from the GY to reborn time maiden, that should help.
When Shaddoll Construct attack a Eater of Million or vice versa, witch one will trigger first?
The player who commenced the attack id assume
the turn player's effect activates first, then the remaining effect is chained
Since Construct’s effect is mandatory, it will always be the first to trigger. Eater of Millions is optional. The way it resolves is this: Eater will banish Construct, then Construct destroys Eater. Regardless of who is turn player, Construct will always be Chain Link 1 no matter what.
Nice hair cut!
Tyty!
Hey tombox, i have ruling question to subterror Guru. Situation: Player A has face up Guru on field. Player B summons Tornado dragon. Player A activates final battle to prevent negations and chains Guru effect to book Guru und Tornado dragon. Player B activates Tornado dragons effect and targets backrow. Player A chains fiendess to Negate Tornado dragon and books Guru.
Question: the activation of Tornado dragon is negated but will the Guru still book himself and the Tornado dragon?
Thanks So far :)
From my understanding of the chain of events, and how guru is worded, both targets must be face up to resolve the effect to book both targets. so Tornado Dragon under this pretense would remain face up.
As a Guru Main, Yes. Guru's effect activated by targeting the opponent's monster, therefore he does not need to be face up when his chain would resolve. Tornado Dragon will in fact be flipped facedown
I'm going to be mentioning this to a lot of high-end Yu-Gi-Oh, because I am trying to figure out, how the F.A field spells work lol does the level increase, remain permanently on the F.A monster or does the F.A monster only gained the level increase well it's on the field or is it permanent level increase gain? just curious because I want to be playing the deck right lol it's just a fun deck I know but still, love my sports cars lol
Only while it is on the field
@@LordHeishin thank u so much for the help and can't what to see your new stuff bud and happy hiatus to u buddy
So when i have magical meltdown on my field, void imagination's fusion effect cannot be negated by something like borreload savage dragon, right?
Hung Huynh Kim that’s correct
I didn't even think of that and it's very important information to me lol
Solemn Judgment and Warning can still be activated on the activation of a fusion spell. There is nothing stopping the activation of the Solemn. They still pay cost on the activation of the Fusion spell but it resolves without effect.
U can ash dugares regardless of effect right?
That to my knowledge isn't true.
Your opponent must declare which effect they are using for Dugares upon activation.
Since the effect was declared during resolution there is either a guarantee that it will draw or won't draw. If there is a guarantee there won't be and adding of cards or summon from deck you should not be able to activate Ash in response.
Looking at knightmare co-link rules, if they activates during co-link they can draw so you can Ash their entire effect. But if they activated when they aren't co-link, you cannot Ash a knightmare monsters entire effect.
@@MSTTV What about Time Thief Redoer? AFAIK his effect can be Ash'ed, even if you're not detaching spells. Is that right? Also, what's the difference between his effect and the Knightmares?
rocking new haircut! nice! looking good
with the verte anaconda does that mean if anaconda sends shaddoll fusion, then you can't use ash blossom either?
you cannot use Ash vs Anaconda anytime because it sends as cost
@@Orfeh9999 I dont mean in response to anaconda dumping but the effect of the shaddoll fusion that allows a player to send cards from the deck as material
@@meetRS268 ash cannot be responded to this effect because the cards effect has already resolved, in which case the sending of the monster from the deck cannot be affected by ash due to no activation of an effect applied. (At least to my fullest understanding)
@@meetRS268 sending the monsters is part of the resolution of the effect, you can only use Ash in chain to an effect that is activating
Question, if u fusion summon with meltdown does priority pass straight back to that player or is there a window before where the opponent can respond after the fusion summon in like an open gamestate?
That's right, forgot about that with Apollousa. Degurass easy way to cheat cause most people just forget.
Can you ghost belle invocation with meltdown on the field?
Ghost Belle negates activation it won't actually negate anything... U can chain and during resolution invocation will continue to resolve unhindered.
Wait but it says activation of your cards and effects. So if the effect for Shadoll fusion is to send and summon it cannot be negated. The wording is clear as day.
like it litterally says that card activation and the effects that involve a fussion summon cannot be negated. The way the sentence is constructed definetly means that you cannot negate the effect.
The activation of you cards and effects means: activation of your cards and the activation of your effects. For example: Dark contract with the swamp king is a continous spell that has an effect to fusion summon one per turn. When Meltdown is on the field, the activation of that effect can not be negated. But the effect itself can be negated by cards like Hot red dragon archfiend abyss for example.
If the wording of Meltdown was: activation and effects of your cards can not be negated, then that would be a different story.
What are examples of fusion effects that can be negated by Ash Blossom? Basically and card that sends stuff from the deck to the graveyard?
Yes.
Nearly any effect that touches the deck in any way that isn't a cost. Drawing, sending, milling, summoning etc
@@darkvictory21 In that case how do you tell an effect is using something for cost? Can you ash Shadoll Fusion for instance?
@@Majoraspersona if something is for cost it is before the ; anything after is an effect. For example magicians souls says to send a level6+ Spellcaster to grave; special summon it, meaning it sends for cost. Cards like fusion destiny, shaddoll fusion, neos fusion can be ashed yes.
@@JacobKendrick Thanks, this explains a lot! But it's still pretty confusing in the case Shaddoll Fusion since that card doesn't have any Semi-Colons. It specifically says "you can also use monsters in your Deck as Fusion Material" which would make me infer that it's sending something for cost (in this case material for a Fusion Summon). Or maybe using materials for a summon are different?
I still think that ruling on magical meltdown is false since the card reads “ the activation of your cards and effects that include an effect that fusion summons” so shaddoll fusion can’t be responded to by ash even if it stops the effect since meltdown states that.
But the card is basically read as the activation of cards and activation of effects.
(Polymerizarion is a card activation)
(Lunalight wolf pendulum scale effect is an effect activation that fusion summon.) The activations cannot be negated.
Magical meltdown only prevents the activation of cards and the activation of effects from being negated. Because of this ash can negate due to it only negating the effect and not the activation.
@@MSTTV you are paraphrasing card there in a way that changes meaning. That is not right. IF there was specifically mentioned "activation of effects" then you would be right. But it is not. So the effect is not negated. The Meltdown is worded properly so it would serve it's purpose as protector for the mentioned summons. If Meltdown is there you cannot interact. Period.
@@mcELINER nope it says only that the activation of cards and effects can't be negated, doesn't say that the actual effect can't be.
@@mcELINER Read my comment and you will understand that meltdowns effect only prevents cards activation and the activation of effects from being negated. It does not prevent the effect from being negated.
Confusing cus meltdown said u cant negate activations AND effects
The activations of (cards and effects) should be read like that.
Poly is a card activation..
Lunalight Wolf scale effect is an effect that fusion summon.
Other wise it would state: The "activated" effects that include fusion summon cannot be negated.
Think Infernoid negation they negate activation of spell/traps card and effects. (That effect only refers to activation spell and trap effects)
Magical meltdown only prevents the activation of cards and the activation of effects from being negated. Because of this ash can negate due to it only negating the effect and not the activation.
Simultaneous effects go on chain right? Cross sheep would become chain link 2 or 3 because it’s effect activates AFTER the fusion summon. So even with meltdowns effect active, Cross sheep is not a fusion monster and being the last activation of the chain, it can be responded to. Don’t get sharked huh?
Magical meltdown is a protection protects a full timing window, continuous-like effect. It doesn't activate.
These effects aren't that simultaneous.
1. Activate a fusion spell,
2. Resolve chain, fusion summon.
Current timing: Monster was just fusion summoned.
Magical meltdown does not allow any response from your opponent during this timing.
Think droll and lock bird, it can activate in any part of the chain where on resolution where someone added a card.
TIMING: monster was fusion summon, (meltdown prevents response)
Cross sheep activates in this fusion summon timing ( it is still the fusion summon timing, no response allowed), if meltdown controller activates more cards in that same chain, still not respondable (timing is still monster was fusion summoned)
It's similar to why you can activate trickstar reincarnation then droll as chain link 3 after the resolution of a card being added.
Sheep activates during the successful fusion summon as it's trigger. It's the same timing. Meltdown.
Cross sheep isn't fusion summoning, but it is the resolution of the previous fusion summon that is still blocking interaction.
As it is still a successful fusion summon.
Fusion summon triggers cross sheep.
The timing which a fusion summon occurs cannot be responded to.
Therefore everything that activates in that chain cannot be responded to since it's still a response to the fusion summon.
What does sharking mean?
purposefully letting your opponent make an illegal move BEFORE calling the judge so that the game state cant be repaired andv your opponent gets a game loss
That’s a nice hoodie
That is a nice hoodie
Im confused about the cross sheep with meltdown ruling. Doesnt cross sheep start a separate chain after the summon was successful? Meaning wouldn't it be separate from the fusion summon?
Cross sheeps effect activates at the same time that a fusion summon has successfully happened. This would be the same time you'd be able to activate cards such as torrential tribute or bottomless trap hole. Because of magical meltdown though, you may not use such effects in response. This means you cannot respond to cross sheeps effect.
@@jamescunningham.8294 what if the card to conduct the fusion summon is cl2
@@morgangoldsmith3781 that wouldn't matter because the fusion summon isn't successful until after the card resolves and everything on the chain resolves. So if a card fusion summons as cl2, cards that would respond to it like bottomless cannot respond yet until cl1 has finished. With meltdown on the field they wouldn't be able to even with the fusion card being cl2 or higher.
So if I fusion summon into Cross sheep with magical meltdown in my field zone cross sheep can’t be responded too? Even though its a when effect on magical meltdown not an If. because it sounds like cross sheep ef is responding to the fusion summon so now i can respond to cross sheep. 🤔
The whole chain is responding to the fusion, you can't respond to cross
But meltdown says “your opponents cards and effects can not activate when a monster is fusion summoned this way” cross sheep is my monster that activated in the fusion summon window, as well as something like aliester the invoker of madness, since it’s still in that window you cannot activate effects to respond to anything in that window.
But what you could do preemptively is stuff like respond to the invocation itself with lancea, or banishing their aliester with called or d.d. Crow, ect. Since invocation doesn’t have a cost and and everything happens on resolution. I’ve had people crow my aliester in grave forcing me to use the invoker of madness on board, or forcing me to go into a shaddoll fusion I didn’t want to go into because I must perform the fusion if I can.
Meltdown isn't a trigger, it's continuous like..
thanks for helping me understand guys
So when meltdown is active and I summon Construct and wanna use the effect to send on summon, my opponent can't respond?
since construct and cross sheep (and any shaddoll you send, or trick clown) happen in the same chain
I think you can get yourself to the conclusion that no, your opponent cannot respond
When I take a opponent Sleeper with my Borreload and I use Sleeper effect to destroy. Witch field would destroy the Sleeper after being destroy by his effect??
The player who's graveyard it activates in
The player who originally owned the sleeper I would assume. I kinda see it as what would happen if you set rotation out skystriker area zero to your opponents field and then use something like mst to pop the a0 you gave them, you would be the one that would summon raye from deck since it would activate in your grave.
Meltdown says your opp cant neg the activation or EFFECT of card that would summon a fusion monster
It's not OR effect, it's AND effect. So it's the actvation of an effect.
Magical meltdown only prevents the activation of cards and the activation of effects from being negated. Because of this ash can negate due to it only negating the effect and not the activation of the effect.
You can abuse that “no response” window from Magical Meltdown by saving cards like Twin Twister until you successfully Fusion Summon a monster then activating the card on summon. Alternatively, if your playing against a deck like Draco, or if you want to play around Waking the Dragon, you can chain Twin to the activation of your Fusion spell while Meltdown is on field, and the Draco spells/traps/WTD you destroy cannot trigger
The Draco spells/traps/WTD would still be able to trigger because they would activate in a new chain after being destroyed which comes after the successful fusion summon of the monster. What cannot happen is the opponent in response to Twin Twisters activation chain any of the targeted cards.
James Cunningham. If Meltdown is on the field and I activate Invocation CL1, Twin Twisters CL2, how do the Draco cards activate in the grave after they’re destroyed if they would have normally triggered in the same window as an effect such as Cross-Sheep?
@@WillieRayPR they are activated in a different chain, after the chain started with the fusion summon, so, they can be activated
No, your interpretation of Meltdown is wrong. “The [activation of cards] and [effects] that fusion...” It would maybe be different if there was a cost side to cards like Shaddoll Fusion, but there isn’t. If the activation goes through, the effect goes through. They’re the same thing.
This interpretation of meltdown isn't something new, in fact it's just really old rulings I had to bring back to the forefront.
Meltdown doesn't protect the effects themseles from being negated during resolution. As it states the "activation of" your cards and effects.
now compare with altergeist protocol a card that does protect both types of negation.
"The activation and effects of Altergeist cards activated on your field cannot be negated."
Vs
"The activation of (cards and effects)" that's the difference. Otherwise it would make sense to just use the altergeist protocol wording. Wording makes all the difference when it comes to psct. Like how Infernoid Onuncu can negate spell/trap (cards or effects) activations. The effects is only spell/trap effects not including monster effects.
MST.TV How is this an actual ruling. The words themselves in the card don’t make any sense with that ruling. It all comes down to if Konami meant for there to be a comma here: “cards, and effects,” I guess?
In any case you can always appeal to the head judge and see what they say.
Yeah so many people were getting game wins because I forgot number 60 at locals. I still won though
Flex 1000
Meltdown activate on my field. Opponents activate branded opening, i chain branded in red using tragedy and libitum and fuse into masquerade. Oppo discards tragedy and SS jester.
New chain, i resolve tragedy and libitum. He can use his tragedy and jester? Meltdown is on my field... I think he can't activates effects cause I SS masquerade
He can use his cards. Because he is chain link 1 on branded opening and ur fusion effect is in chain link 2.
You fusion summon your masquerade..., And then they summon out aluber and sent tragedy...
The last thing to happen is the summon of aluber and not your fusion summon.
Therefore your meltdown's no response effect is not applying at this time.
Since they are not responding to your fusion summon anymore... So yah their cards will activate.
Strange how a continuous eff can lose timing lol
Tournament players winning cause cheating is no surprise. I've played against so many people who i caught cheating during our match. It got so annoying that stopped playing with them.
Damn I'm sad i wanted to build shaddoll invoke long time ago with the new stuff and now that it tops without the new stuff i meed to get everithyng fast or it will get more expensive and here i thought it was going to be a fun deck with a "good chance" to be competitive i need to get my cards fast xD
Is he an official judge? Becuase I thought he is.
Game for children btw
So when meltdown is active and I summon Construct and wanna use the effect to send on summon, my opponent can't respond?
david rodriguez Im curious to this as well
since construct and cross sheep (and any shaddoll you send, or trick clown) happen in the same chain
I think you can get yourself to the conclusion that no, your opponent cannot respond
As long as you’re Fusion summoning Construct... Yes, your opponent can’t respond
But if the oponent has the meltdown on the field and i activate the effect of shaddoll fusion, construct will resolve or i cant activate because of meltdown?
Maxo Meltdown’s effect is only applied to its controller. If your opponent is the one controlling Meltdown, and you’re the one fusión summoning, then Meltdown “protection” has nothing to do with your fusión summon. You Mayra activate Construct’s effect and you opponent Mayra respond to it