Clean's Death Scene: What This Scene is REALLY About | Ep18 | Making Apocalypse Now
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- Опубликовано: 6 окт 2023
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In Episode 18 of Making Apocalypse Now, I’ll take you through Clean’s death scene uncovering what Francis Ford Coppola is really saying. We’ll also take a look at an early draft of the scene that seems to connect to Greek mythology, the historical connection to the experience of Black Americans in the war, as well as how important and weirdly difficult it was to film the boat passing under the tail section of a downed bomber plane.
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This video is by Tyler Knudsen.
Affiliate Links:
(Coppola) Notes on the Making of Apocalypse Now by Eleanor Coppola: amzn.to/3K9B9XH
(Cowie) The Apocalypse Now Book by Peter Cowie: amzn.to/3Zh8rZp
(Travers) Coppola's Monster Film: The Making of Apocalypse Now by Steven Travers: amzn.to/3ZybjS1
(Commentary) Apocalypse Now: The Final Cut: amzn.to/3npMry6
(Playboy)The Playboy Interviews: The Directors: amzn.to/40Ez8IO
(Martin) New Waves in Cinema by Sean Martin: amzn.to/3FSCdge
Hearts of Darkness: A Filmmaker's Apocalypse: amzn.to/40CnoGB
(Phillips) Godfather: The Intimate Francis Ford Coppola By Gene D. Phillips: amzn.to/3lCPlzj
Sources:
[Cinephilia & Beyond] Incredible collection of resources on Apocalypse Now: bit.ly/35Mvv7M
(Bouqs) Hyacinths meaning - bit.ly/3Rvgod8
Vietnam War Casualty Statistics - bit.ly/45jguIp
Music
Artlist.io 
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Probably the videos I’m always most excited to see in my subscription box. Thanks so much for working so hard to create these!
Totally echo this sentiment.
Thanks! New vid soon!
@@CinemaTyler
Yahhh... er, i mean, *OORAH*
Been keeping the light of a film projector flickering in the window. Was about to make a straw effigy of ya to gift us another video.
Saw this movie in 1983 as a 12-year old. Second run movie house that didn’t check age very diligently. Launched me on a lifelong obsession with Vietnam, up to my M.A. thesis on JFK and Vietnam and a birthday trip to Saigon, since Ho Chi Minh and I share May 19th as our birthday. Thank you for this ongoing masterpiece series of film analysis and appreciation. It has added many new layers to my relationship with this singular cinematic masterpiece. You do amazing work. Much respect from Germany.
Of all the versions of Apocalypse Now, I'd say that "Redux" is the best one: as it has other characters (French inhabitants who live in Vietnam) and scenes that were absent from the 147 minute DvD.
Almost an hour is evident in "Redux" (OK, 49 minutes) the ending where Kurtz is terminated with "extreme prejudice" ended by means of a short ASMR - no dialogue, a montage and music afterwards.
Next to The Godfather Trilogy, I'd say Mr Coppola (despite adversities here) made a movie that could never be repeated and it should be in everyone's collection of movies - I have a copy already - gets my vote.
Agreed. It was such an interesting take on how the French viewed the war from the outside, after being in the country for generations, and refusing to leave after getting defeated militarily in Phu Yen. One could say the Vietnamese were exploited, and had their land pillaged, while others would say that their standard of living, education and healthcare were never better, thanks to the French? Add a dose of Communism and American Exceptionalism, and this is the end result.
Personally I've never been a fan of the plantation scene, I remember being so excited for the redux and then when that scene happens it feels like the whole film comes to a stop and then they leave the plantation and the film starts up again. It really interrupts the flow of the river and makes it hard for the audience, well me at least, to get back to the same mindset.
Great video as always! The boat going under the downed plane was always one of my favourite scenes. I interpreted as a fallen angel because planes and helicopters are so closely associated with saviours, either when the GIs cling to its legs while it takes off from the show or when Kilgore's cavalry of helis approaching the attack are backed with angelic vocals. This emphasized the place (hell) has no return, even if some heavenly aircraft was there to take you home.
It's just a plane.
The shot from the workprint that wasn’t used of that downed B2 was also so damn good, shame they couldn’t work with both considering only like 2 b2’s ever went down in Nam
Edit 9:27
If ya' gonna get religious on us the plane tail resembles a modified Tau cross and helicopters locusts bellowing out from h-e-double hockysticks.
Then, Werner Herzog's film "Aquirre, the Wrath of God" was a large influence on Coppola along with King Kong. See Herzog's film for take-offs.
@@liltick102 "B-52's" The B-2 is the stealth bomber.
@@TheRealNormanBates Truee
You know it's gonna be a good Saturday when you get a new Making Apocalypse Now episode
The serenity of the scene prior to Clean getting gunned down is such a brilliant calm before the storm. (Theatrical cut at least) for how briefly Clean is seen full of bullet holes, the utter brutality is so intense and heart wrenching.
It’s probably the best death scene of all time, in my opinion.
"Probably the best death scene of all Time"?.. How can you possibly be serious?
The dude is discovered to be dead, after some jump-scare action that isn't to do with him - that's not quite a death scene? That's a scene in which a character ends up dead.
As a narrative event, you're actually going to say this is a better death scene than those in 'Se7en'; 'The Green Mile'; 'Blade Runner'; 'Saving Private Ryan'; 'L.A. Confidential', '2001: ASO'; 'True Romance'; 'King Kong'; 'The Piano'; 'The Godfather'; Taxi Driver'; 'The Edge'; 'Cape Fear'.....- _better_ than any, in those?.....
I mean, it's all good to talk about a, "your opinion" - but then the question is, do you expect that opinion to be taken seriously?
'Apocalypse Now', has a lot going for it, but a time really does come to curb the over-enthusiasm - or risk ending up looking a little, you know: questionable.
Oh yes, concur, Coppolla's lead-up to the death of Mr Clean is masterfully done and another reason this film is an all-time classic in master film production.
@@lewis7515 u went about responding to the thing he said in a very mean way. it completely undercut anything you said. ya jerk.
Clean dying to the sound of his mother's recorded voice always really hit me hard. I never served, but it always made me think of my mom and then all those poor mothers who sent their boys to war and never saw them again.
Mother didn't send him. He was probably drafted like most African Americans. 11% of population but 16% drafted and mostly always sent to front line. They should have listened to Mohammad Ali.
A point about the B52 tail. The production prolly sourced a 1:72 model kit for the drawings and approaches for the carpenters to fabricate
That scene always spooked me, The bombing of Cambodia (Operation MENU) was Top Secret at the time having only started in March of 1969, about six months earlier then when the story was set. The crew must have been shocked and confused to see it and wondering if there were any units nearby large enough to have surface to air missiles powerful enough to blow the tail of a B-52 off. I have actually walked under the tail of a B-52 and it is a peculiar feeling. It is such a large object at such a close distance that it is difficult understand that it is even quite real.
I had the good fortune to see Apocalypse in theaters first run, which I did many times, including even two different Air Force theaters. And the whole scene post-Dol lung bridge scene has always impressed me as being masterfully done as it almost stands alone as the story within the story.
We see Willard opening the communique he got from Na Trang (via Carlson), which flatly informs him the little news that the guy they sent before he, Willard, was sent to kill Kurtz had instead gone native and joined Kurtz too. Meanwhile, acting as if they were off the North Carolina coast instead of hundreds of km up an enemy held river, the boat crew begin a celebration of getting the mail (which IRL really was always a joyful occasion). Chef's clipping of the bizarre real life Manson murders (which, incidentally, dates the events of this film c. 1970), half-mad Lance breaking out purple smoke, Clean playing his cassette tape from home, and all the while the music in the background is playing a tense single note, that matches our tension at Lance's childish behavior on a battlefield that might go hot at any moment, right before it actually does.
I knew Apocalypse would never win best picture or even best direction, when the fact was it should have swept the Oscars for everything from script writing to sound. Instead, 1979's best picture went to "Kramer vs Kramer" - a film you've just read about for the first time.
Kramer vs Kramer??? I thought it was mildly interesting but to hear that it beat the Apocalypse Now creation is saddening to say the least.
@@MrReymoclif714 I remember being disappointed but not at all surprised by the Oscars that year. Apocalypse won several Oscar awards for sound and photography, but not nearly the ones Coppola so richly deserved!
Oscar & Emmy Awards have always been politically motivated horse shit
love everything about this comment.
So well done, thank you for putting this up!
Tyler, you and your crew do amazing work, as always!
Always amazing, thanks so much for these.
Oh the joy of a new CinemaTyler video!
So glad this series is still going!
I'm convinced it won't end.
Love all of this, Tyler!!
7:44 I have definitely watched this film over 80 time’s - I have read the novels written by both cast members and all available material out there, by Eleanor and whoever-rewatched the workprint again and again, watched analysis and theory after theory.
Yet still, hearing that tape while looking into the Chiefs eyes- gives me chills and brings me to tears each time.
Another winning video from the amazing Cinema Tyler!
Always look forward to these episodes
Great observation about the number of black troops in the bridge scene. As soon as it's pointed out, it's obvious, but I only perceived it on a subliminal level - in total contrast to the earlier surfing scenes and barbecue. It's also interesting that the "enemy" is unseen at the bridge, as opposed to the earlier assault and slaughter in daylight with the helicopters.
Love your videos!
Best videos on the whole RUclips, thank you!
Was pleasantly surprised to see I got a shoutout in this, thanks!
Living the dream
An alternate scene of Clean’s burial was filmed and released in 1981 for the re- release. I remember the camera was at water level as Clean’s lilfeless head looms large in the foreground. It slowly rolls over to regard the audience and sink out of sight as the boat disappears around a bend out of focus while the music rises to a mournful crescendo. It is the same musical cue heard for this scene heard on the original vinyl soundtrack LPs. It was very like Chief’s burial scene later that was done with much less fanfare.
Did that cut have the French Plantation scene, or did they kind of sneak in Clean's burial and move on?
@@TheRealNormanBates No, it entirely replaces the French Plantation sequence, as far as I can tell.
Your work is top notch man. Keep it up!!
Thanks!
All your videos are just great. You really deserve way more Subscribers
good stuff. thx
Your video exemplifies excellence! - "Each challenge overcome brings you closer to success.."
Death of innocence I thought.
Great stuff my friend.
Outstanding as always. This is some of the very best film content on here. I think I've probably watched this film an additional 3 or 4 times since you started uploading these videos, just to experience it with added context. I wonder if I'm alone in liking the original cut much better than the Redux version. The extra footage is awesome and adds more to the story and film, it just drags it down a little too much for me. It's probably because I'd seen the original cut so many times before the Redux cut came out. I wish filmmaking like this was still going on somewhere out there. Maybe it is, I don't know.
Another great video! Although I was a little put off by the sight of AI images 🫤 I'm usually expecting a picture from production or a still from the movie, so seeing something made by an AI in its place is a bummer. Otherwise, captivating and informative as always!
Thanks for the feedback! AI has been quite controversial, but I'd like to embrace it and use it more. I think the trick might be to have a separate section for it (like just illustrating stuff from the script that was never filmed). It would be really fun to find a way to clone Willard's narration voice and hear some of the narration that was never recorded.
@@CinemaTyler I would dig it. I would love to see an A.I.'s interpretation of that opening of *The Psychedelic Soldier* draft. I imagine it was a brief glimpse at Kurtz and Colby (Scott Glenn), and other U.S. troops that converted to Kurtz.
@@CinemaTyler I dislike AI as well. It feels really soulless, which is already a problem in the entertainment industry, and is made worse by AI.
I guess everyone is using AI now, and it's the hot new thing, but I think it's degrading the quality of content, and making it feel more cold. The writing and voice overs are the worst, but AI is just kind of crappy in general.
I'm hoping you'll cover some of the outright deleted scenes like "The Tiger Cages" and that human shield baby moment from the workprint
I've always wondered about the orange banners on the shore
There's the obvious rank and branch conflict between Chief and Willard with a senior Navy enlisted bumping heads with an Army officer but I always thought there was a subliminal racial context. Chief would have spent a decade or two to get to his rank during an era when a lot of the country was still under Jim Crow and no doubt he would have bumped into his share of racist NCOs and officers. Now he's in charge of his own boat and here comes a white officer from another branch who's suppose to just hitch a ride trying to take command. And said officer's mission also led to the death of not just a sailor under Chief's command but another black sailor who he was probably trying to mentor.
It wasn't Willard's fault Clean died. That's the mission he was sent on and people get killed in war. By that logic, Chief was responsible for all the people on board the sampan getting killed because he followed procedure and stopped when it wasn't necessary and Willard told him not to. Quit with this silly virtue-signaling nonsense, trying to work some oppression angle into everything.
Theyve had a lone time to prefect the violence done by those marketed as hooligan on the Isles. Like youd really have to torture this guy into acting like he shouldnt have that happening to them for their behavior and the behavior of those theyre around.
one thing i recently learned is that the special operations teams, MACV-SOG, operating in Cambodia and laos, were heavily supplemented by the mountain people, a set of indigenous tribes that were genetically distinct from the lowlanders. there was one tribe in mountainous Viet Nam and Laos that no-one wanted to run into; not the mountain people, the Cambodians, The Laotians, nor even the Viet Cong nor NVA. These people were known as “The White People,” a tribe of sadistic, cannibalistic montaignards who were so out there, that the other mountain people would do purification rituals if they even touched some of their gear in the wild. Clearly, Kurtz has befriended the white people, which is a whole new angle on the script.
I love this series.
The music is so haunting
OMG. That Simpsons clip was so unexpected. It immediately had me doubled over laughing my ass off. It's so dark! Why am I laughing? Lol. You are one sick bastard. And I love you for it.
Nice 👍 I never realized the Mansion connection with Kurtz 😮😊
2:16 Scott Glenn
My whole life (since being mesmerized by the B-52 tail sequence as a child) I always likened the river trip as the Disney World Jungle Cruise from Hell. All of the surreal sights and sequences support this and I was pleased to hear in this episode that's exactly what the Director thought as well.
Love this series! Have to say i never cared much for the downed bomber. It just never looked like a realistic crash to me.
Good point.
babe wake up new episode of Making Apocalypse Now
What was the percentages of whites and blacks for those who volunteered?
Good question. As I have posted, 75% of those who went to Vietnam were volunteers.
Most of us were white.
African Americans were 11% of population but 16% drafted. Go figure..
Btw, the personal on the Navy PBR riverine patrol boats were *volunteers*
“The point of no return” is fairly neatly summed up by the Michael Douglas character towards the end of Falling Down. Unfortunately it’s dictated from the perspective of a delusional madman. When he polished off the proprietor of the Army Navy surplus store, he gets a glimpse of how everyone perceives HIM, and why they will never allow him to be a living part of society.
But he did what we all feel like doing (but dont) in each scene.
Martin sheen gave a speech at a prison i was employed at in Ohio, he said the opening scene of this movie when he was alone drunk in a motel room inSaigon! He said he was actually drunk for that scene, but since he was playing drunk it actually worked out!
Always feel a little down after watching Clean’s death scene, especially hearing his mother over the tape recorder.
How about the innocent family in the sampan Clean opened fire on ?
@vincentgoupil180 he was a typical young jumpy soldier and actually a sailor. He shot out of fear. Both scenes very sad.
Re your theory about racial inequities in the draft etc. Keep in mind that 75% of the soldiers who served in Vietnam were volunteers. The media and entertainment folks try to muddy that fact and make the audience believe that most of those who served were drafted and sent against their will. Draftees accounted for 30% of deaths in Vietnam. Contrast that with 66% of Americans who served in WW2 being draftees.
The questions what was the ratio at the peak of the war.
Not what was the average ratio for the entire 10 years.
Statistics only make sense if they are compared over time.
@@msp5138 Regardless, the claim that black men were forced into fighting the white man's war against their will is disingenuous. Whether averaged over 10 years or taken at the peak, the figures don't support the claim.
Make no mistake, however, I really enjoy this series of videos.
@@msp5138
Agree, need to look at the timeline for the ratio of enlisted to conscripted into the Vietnam "conflict", not war.
There is a few frames of footage that I find problematic: one is during the helicopter scene above the opening to the Nung, and halfway into Clean's death. Willard fires his weapon.
The more I dive into this movie, the more I believe Willard is so far removed from the war that he only takes one shot, which is the one that kills the civilian, done purely out of apathy (and convenience).
This series is amazing. I feel like I'm taking a university class on my favorite movie
Nite-Nite, Clean!
At 2:20 that is soooo Scott Glen.
4:36 Lance talks like a young child here and it's so funny.
It’s strange cause I felt that Clean got his comeuppance for wasting a boat full of Vietnamese civilians trying to save their puppy, but at the same time, I felt bad for his family who wanted a better life for him after his tour? War is hell.
Can you do Friedkin's SORCERER next
One Magnum PI episode copied Apocalypse Now use of flares for tracers when the whole gang goes back to Nam to look for POW's.
They are on some kind of small boat or Sampan traveling a river at night then suddenly tracers/flares everywhere as they are attacked on the river.
Obviously filming this scene at night added to the effect of not only the glowing tracers, but also reducing the smoke effect from the flares.
Who shot the water buffalo?
Ken Babb's Vietnam book.
Always wondered if Lance recieved another tab of Acid when he exclaims... " I've been waiting for this one!" PURPLE HAZE Indeed
pretty sure Coppola said on the redux dvd commentary that was fishburne's actual mother on the tape and she wrote her part
2:28 A huge inspiration for artist Christopher Wool (1955) whose work with an identical name sold for...USD 26,485,000 in 2013....
Mattel made model plane & jet kits too, no B-52 Hot Wheels.
Story goes Mattel made the stock and handgrip for the M16 rifle though it's disputed nowadays.
Remember being told not to use the rifle stock for hitting someone cause after they stop laughing they will finish you off.
Mattel did make a toy Marauder M16 version. And the early actual M16 was considered a joke for field use, jamming from carbon desposit in the bolt was one problem.
Note: the stock and handle grip were plastic not wood.
Remember seeing a circular with small star ridges emblem that looked similiar to the Mattel logo embossed on the stock which I thought was a joke.
Not a joke if your life depended on it. Reason G.I.s bought an AK-47 on the black market since they were more dependable. They had looser tolerances on parts so dirt or exhaust carbon particles (especially on the return bolt movement) wouldn't jam the rifle as easily as the M-16 which needed daily cleaning during patrol. Plus, the sound of a M-16 firing in Charlie's background was an open announcement to come and get you.
So, much for the McNamara's wonder weapon along with his 100,000 Folly.
The AR-16 is an improved M-16 nowadays.
This scene was so fucking sad.
Where do you address the red banner along the river written in Vietnamese? What does it say?
I do miss the days when this wasn't an Apocalypse Now channel...
Thanks for the feedback. I'm currently working on bringing back Cinema Stories for one-off vids on a variety of topics. I'm trying to get a workflow going with editors for the series so that episodes are easier to produce. I'm also still working on getting back into a productive routine now that I'm a dad. I also have more vids on Alien on the way!
@@CinemaTyler Thank you. It was due to your channel that I discovered Andrei Tarkovsky and Tatsuya Nakadai. It pains me to say this but I think I've had my fill of both Apocolypse Now and Alien behind-the-scenes trivia. And this is coming from a huge fan of both films.
Is there an explanation regarding the orange fence with Vietnamese writing by the river? (The very place where lance kills a water buffalo from the workshop edit.)
Willard trading in the fuel for the bunnies and CHief saying what happens if we get into a firefight
Print only magazine?
Did they make it with stone axes?
Keep in mind though that the percentages of US military deaths in Vietnam from 1964 to 1975 were 85.6% White, 12.4% Black, 0.6% Hispanic and American Indian and Pacific Islander each at 0.4%. Kind of puts the lie to that _China Beach_ TV episode that claimed there were more Black than White combat deaths.
Don't forget that a large portion of US dead in Vietnam was from friendly fire. Something they don't want people knowing, but it's been known and talked about by retired vets.
“Its for when we figure out the actual value of everything and institute it by ending the waste,” a slave.
Its a story they couldn’t figure it out until it happened and then (probably) never verify it.
That's because whites are the majority population. 11% black population but 16% from the 11% were sent to battle so there's a clear disproportionate number of blacks sent there if you look at the African American population in general. I never understood why they didn't follow Mohammad Ali's good example. No viet Cong never called him N****r
@@signoresantinoburnett1169and that "friendly fire" could easily be directed at those they don't like.
Has everyone seen "Heart's of Darkness:: A Filmmakers Apocalypse".by Eleanor Coppola.
Clean's death is always hard to watch.
Why didn't they just drop Willard off at the bridge to begin with? I love this movie, but I kinda dont understand why he started his journey waaaay further away then he had to.
Tyler
Congratulations !
After which director is the kid named ?
FRANCE MENTIONNED LETS GOOOO
"Hellish version of France"
Just calling it France would have sufficed
_Next Time: Alas, this isle of the Lotus-eaters_
6:04. Well. He should of left it in there…
I never realized that Lance was LBJ until right now.
Violent hippie! 😳
They made a big mistake : all B 52 shot down were on NORTH Vietnam, whereas here they were supposed to be in SOUTH Vietnam near the cambodian border, WHERE NO B52 was ever shot down
"Morpheus should've taken the Blue pill."
Maybe the director was reflecting on the CIA's influence viz Manson and Kurtz (and by direct extension of Willard's superiors).
Please don’t use AI in your videos, they make it look cheap
Glad someone else was bothered by that.
👍
A spear.
These videos should be the basis of a PhD. You deserve a doctorate Man.
You are too kind!
I dont not like videos explaining what a scene is a bout. I appreciate this series, but you should leave things to interpretation. I'm more interested to hear about how the film was made and thoughts from the filmmakers, but not a direct explanation of what a film/scene means, which will ultimately have some subjective elements to it.
I used to think this when I took literature classes in college. It also reminds me of the scene in the Woody Allen film where some guy is pontificating about Kurt Vonnegut and Allen grabs Vonnegut who tells the man that his interpretation is not what Vonnegut had in mind at all. However for ppl like me who don’t necessarily see all the deeper meanings and interpretations, I now appreciate hearing ways of interpreting art because often there is stuff that I missed, either because I lacked knowledge about something, or simply overlooked it. The only thing that bothers me is anyone but the author declaring their interpretations as the “correct” one.
2:00 his name is LBJ?
I felt that Clean had to die as compensation for starting the Sam Pan massacre. It might also play into a theme running through *Star Trek II,* with the idea of the young dying for the older generation's agendas.
👍👍👍👍👍
Alright motherfuckers let's go.
2 issues for $40?
I still ponder how George Lucas would have crafted this
Irony alert. We are shown Civil War movies where the fact that Black men were not allowed to engage in front-line service at the time was considered racist. now it seems by the Vietnam War the fact that they were so engaged and in a slightly increased proportion is also regarded as racist. You can't have it both ways. Could the truth be that racism actually had almost nothing to do with both situations than some seem to want to so desperately believe? Could the main reason be that most Black men did not want to fight in the Civil War and the top brass knew it? Could it be the simple fact that more white guys were attending college than black guys back in the 60s, and that a career in the army at that time suited these guys' present and future needs better? Why do some people strive so hard to find racism in everything when this may not have been the actual reason at all?
Since when did the needs and wants of black in antebellum slavery times in civil war america was actually considered?? a Federal law dating from 1792 barred Negroes from bearing arms for the U.S. army. After President Abraham Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation, Jan. 1, 1863, Black Soldiers were officially allowed to participate in the war. Black Soldiers distinguished themselves in battle on numerous occasions.
How is racism not a factor here??
Servicemen's Readjustment Act of 1944, the G.I. Bill 's language did not specifically exclude African-American veterans from its benefits, it was structured in a way that ultimately shut doors for the 1.2 million Black veterans who had bravely served their country during World War II, in segregated ranks. The original GI Bill ended in July 1956. By that time, nearly 8 million World War II veterans had received education or training, and 4.3 million home loans worth $33 billion had been handed out. But most Black veterans had been left behind. As employment, college attendance and wealth surged for whites, disparities with their Black counterparts not only continued but widened. No greater instrument for widening an already huge racial gap in postwar America than the GI Bill.
Maybe the reason for lack of college attendance stems from this? And theres no doubt that blacks used the military as a stepping stone to higher education. But its hard to make a case that race isnt a factor in jim crow era america.
Not one of your better ones
Manson was not a cult leader. He was a criminal and an opportunist who was wrongfully convicted of something he was innocent of. I hate when people just buy into the propaganda without thinking for themselves. Humanity is fkd.
he conspired to commit murder..legally conspiring is as bad as committing the murders themselves
what was he innocent of?
So everybody is just going to forget that Clean murdered an innocent family in cold blood?
Every single soldier murdered innocent families in cold blood. That's their job. It was a tense scene and he thought he was saving the crew. At 17 I wonder how many hours training they gave him? He definitely had no experience.
please dont use AI generated images it looks bad it distract
Wow, there are some people here easily triggered by history.
Some people are very tired of the lies about "too many blacks" in that war.
Aw man, midjorney? This is supposed to be about art, man, thanks for disclosing it but. Not a fan of the choice to use that, it'd be so much cooler to have a visual aid someone put... time, effort into. Especially with the people who write & act these movies on strike, against this exact technology. You'd be amazed how little some artists would charge for a sketch, man, think about it next time.
With all the "man!" in there, I read this in Dennis Hopper's Apocalypse Now voice.
Can’t stop the progress unfortunately. Can’t put the genie back in the bottle. I’m with you though
LOL. This is a guy on RUclips, not a tv network. He's not getting rich.
What's with the hate on A.I? I'm an artist myself and I embrace it. It's a different form of art, far more reliant on technology, but it's art regardless. The complexity involved deserves merit, my dude. The images it can generate look beautiful regardless. A.I is not gonna replace the human element, so there's no need to be scared or pissed off lol. Chill.
@@joaosantos5503maybe you’re just a bad artist?
As far as the draft, if you had money or were going to going college you could get out of the draft. Black Americans didn't have the same resources that some White Americans did. Their were still plenty of White men in that war
Poor white men and career military personnel who actually believed in their duty. Plus a ton of rear echelon ticket punchers climbing up the ranks to staff positions.
the civil rights act was 1964 so no segregation then. The vietnam war was March 1965 to May 1975. So it was not legal to treat blacks differently except for affirmative action.....
Naive much?
Ohh yeah! It wasn't legal to treat blacks badly, and that's why racism ended the year after. We forgot !...
@@givemeabreak100 No one ever said racism was gone. learn to fucking read
The commentary about black men being overdrafted by a country that didn't treat them well is SO fucking disrespectful to the black men who fought for their right to fight in World War 2 for this same country. What the actual fuck.
How so? The over representation is bad because the generals, most of whom were white, used black Americans as cannon fodder in Vietnam. You cannot compare the Vietnam war to WW2. Two totally different conflicts.
@@kayzeaza What Nachgeben is getting at is that there is a tendency, particularly in today's culture, to turn people into victims. Generals didn't set quotas for the draft etc - that was local politicians on the draft boards. The commentary is seen as disrespectful because it patronizes black males and treats them as less intelligent, poor suffering victims who wound up in Vietnam because whitey forced them. It doesn't take into account that black men can volunteer too and many would be proud to serve their country. To make it all sound like a racist plot is insulting to them.
As I already posted, 75% of those who served in Vietnam were volunteers. As another commentor asked, I wonder what % of the volunteers were black? Was it easier for rich or middle class white kids to get a college deferment or use family connections to avoid going? Probably. But let's not turn this into a race issue as so often happens these days.
What’s your actual point?
@@PaulMcElligott I'm merely correcting kayzeaza's understanding of another post.
They still were not and are not treated well even sent to the most dangerous battles just because their black so their lives didn't matter. Think about why these facts trigger you.