Police Reveal A Frightening Look Inside The Moscow Murder Home
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 8 фев 2025
- What’s up #STSNation,
In this episode, we discuss the very latest on the newly released Probable Cause Affidavit with the #BestGuests in #TrueCrime:
Dr. Shiloh is a forensic and police psychologist.
She began her professional career as a police officer with a small Southern California agency. She primarily conducted patrol duties, but also worked as a background investigator and was the department’s Terrorism Liaison Officer, often training with the FBI’s Joint Terrorism Task Force.
While working as an officer, she earned her graduate degrees and began training law enforcement throughout the country on forensic psychology topics, such as PTSD in Critical Incidents and the Psychology of Sex Offenders.
She hosts the very popular podcast: LA Not So Confidential
--
John Muffler, Principal of Aequitas Global Security, LLC, is an accomplished law enforcement professional with more than 28-years experience in the field with an emphasis on leadership and high-level security matters.
He holds the distinction of being certified in threat management by the Association of Threat Assessment Professionals.
John served the United States Marshals Service as the Administrator of the National Center for Judicial Security.
--
Dale Carson, son of former Jacksonville Sheriff Dale Carson, had a distinguished career in law enforcement as a Miami-Dade County police officer and as a special agent of the FBI.
In the FBI, Dale served as an instructor in interrogation and sex crimes at the famed FBI academy at Quantico, Va. He also served as a member of the FBI Special Weapons and Tactics (SWAT) Team.
Dale earned his Juris Doctor degree from Florida Coastal School of Law in 2000 and has built a successful practice in criminal defense.
He is also the author of Arrest-Proof Yourself, the indispensable guide to avoiding unnecessary arrests and interactions with police.
--
Let us never forget those young lives lost way too soon: Madison Mogen, 21, Kaylee Goncalves, 21, Xana Kernodle, 20, and Ethan Chapin, 20.
WE WANT TO REMIND EVERYONE THAT BRYAN KOHBERGER IS PRESUMED INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IN A COURT OF LAW
#IdahoStudentMurders #TrueCrime #Idaho4 #IdahoStudentsTrueCrime #IdahoLatest #IdahoToday #MoscowMurders #TrueCrime #BryanKohberger
For Ad-Free & BTS Content ...
Support the show ❤️
/ survivingthesurvivor
The affidavit does NOT say that Dylan and the alleged killer made eye contact. It says that she saw him; it says nothing about him seeing her.
She described him as having bushy eyebrows. You have to make eye contact to see eyebrows
Also, he covered part of his face.
@@janwormuth9739 you could see eyebrows from side view, especially bushy ones, but we may never know exact details
@@janwormuth9739 SHE saw him…that does not mean that he saw her and eye contact between the two were made. They were talking in this video about why the killer saw her and left her alive. We don’t know that he ever saw her.
Also, I think that the mask was probably a surgical mask; with the lazy days of the pandemic, it would not seem so strange or out of place.
I was so impressed with this panel. They demonstrated competence and the highest degree of compassion and professionalism.
All are good, but Dr. Shiloh is the BEST.
Me too... Hats off to all of them
I agree. Excellent panel.
I agree, all 3 were VERY knowledgeable in their prospective field. You definitely should have them on future episodes as this case progresses.
omg thats why im here...soooo much better than the garden variety crime shows which are incredibly stupid, slow, immature and silly
When I saw my husband dead, even though I already suspected something bad had happened to him, my brain initially thought he was a mannequin. The brain does very interesting things in processing traumatic situations.
those of us who have experienced trauma, understand.
Our brains try very hard to protect us from overwhelming horror.
I found my mom dead. My first instinct was to call my husband and tell him I thought my mom was dead. My heart knew it but my head didn't make the connection. I'm sure EM and LE thought I was crazy. One minute I was bawling and the next I was smiling and conversing normally with the coroner. Afterwards, my best friend ( who showed up because she was driving by and saw ambulances at my house) said I was making absolutely no sense..I DO know that I probably couldn't have told you my name during that time. Worst day of my life..( my mom had had a massive heart ) ❤️
Why think its a mannequin when you know you didnt have one in the house. Ive found my Mom deceased, but I knew it could only be her. Just trying to understand.
@@cacola_3373 because, as she said, brains do odd things during trauma. Yours happened to not in that situation (and I'm sorry you went through that), other people's can and do try anything possible to deny what you just saw
WOW. What a panel!! This was so informative- I learned so much! I also appreciate everyone emphasizing how crucial it is to treat Dylan with respect and understanding. I do worry about her and how brutal one can be treated and judged online…🙏🙏🙏
DYLAN IS A LYING POS. SHE WAS IN ON IT.
I had a friend pass away at a Party from natural cause and got harassed to the point of guns in my head on a dirt road..It was Crazy.People get crazy when they loose a friend.
I read The gift of fear years ago, and constantly quote that book to my daughter! My mom gave it to me. The best panel discussion I’ve seen so far.
The contents of this affidavit is truly shocking and even more devastating than anyone originally thought 😢
Can I ask do you know where I could read the entire PCA? I’ve just been hearing bits & pieces.
@@Parrrish You Tube doesn't allow links generally, but put a period where I have put spaces, and take out the spaces before the / and this will take you there: drive google com /file /d /1DiqIp8hH7kz1nyW7JFOCIW-b62NqxHjA /view
@@Parrrish you can also get it from the latah county clerk website
It is! It really is! This guy is not very smart. They didn't find bridge guy for 5 years and he was right under their nose.
@@Dusty_Den Thank You for responding. I find it. So hard to read!
This was one of the best panels I've ever watched on this topic. Thank you all for your humanity and thoughtfulness when discussing this horrific murder.
no dr brucato?no ty
Was that blue tie GRUMPY GUY?
I completely agree with Lisa above. I laterally can’t wait to see a new episode every morning. Love this show, the guests, the hosts, and I love that you focus on the victims. It’s so important. Thank you for such great coverage.
I watch getting ready for work every morning. It's becoming a thing. 😂
liney..don't show your face....real creeps monitor this site...keep clear of giving out your picture on line....
Such informative guests..this case is so shocking......nice to hear intelligent perspective....Thank you so much👍👍👍
Me too once I found it jve only watched this about the idaho murders.
@@paulshaddix5290 thanks, just changed it. It was tied to my Google account.
This was a great panel. I hope you get them on again discussing this case!
This is the absolute best video on this case I’ve ever seen and I’ve seen them all a year today later. ❤ It’s amazing how spot on these three guests were two months after the murders. Wow!
I think the fear that this killer evokes inside us, speaks to our inner child.. who was scared of the dark and scared of monsters under the bed or hiding in the cupboard. It's like a real life version of that nightmare.
Yup
You are are very right
And that is what he evoked in the roomate
Yes - he became the very bogeyman he would have feared himself..
You've articulated it perfectly in a way I haven't put words to yet. Thank you.
A friend gave me The Gift of Fear when it came out in late 90s. I travel for work. The book gave me permission to say no thanks when creepy people ask to help me. Love it. Give it often to high school kids graduating.
Best book ever!!!!! Every needs to read that.
Essential for girls! Good gift for college graduates moving out on their own. I live in a very small safe New England college town & our kids tend to lack street smarts in general & are thus easy to manipulate in situations that prey on their “niceness”.
That book is incredible. Taught me to trust my gut. If I was wrong and acted I'd be alive to feel acute embarrassment. If i was right and didnt act, id be dead. ..if I'm right and act on it, I'll be alive...
@@theworldisavampire3346 exactly!
@@hawthorneantilles6755 yes!!
This is by far the most interesting, intelligent and informative channel on the subject of the Idaho murders. I also greatly appreciate your naming of the victims at the beginning of every episode.
Thank you. Please tell friends!
@@SurvivingTheSurvivor I will. I would humbly also suggest asking some responsible true crime youtubers like Grizzly True Crime or Hidden True Crime to appear as guests on your show. Grizzly True Crime is run by a True Crime author and Hidden True Crime is run by a journalist and her husband, a forensic psychologist. Guests like these might be mutually beneficial for growing your audience.
Surviving The Survivor is the best channel without a doubt.
Have watched STS and others, pre capture of BCK and post, and it is truly excellent, with the most highly ethical, professional and deeply knowledgeable and experienced experts.
The pre- caught profiling of the perpetrator was unbelievably accurate, but again not, due to the incredible team who work together, made up ofAnne Burgess ( of Mind Hunters fame), Victor of forensics, and a top psychologist. I apologise profusely, I have his name on the tip of my tongue but just can't remember ! Aaaarrgh!!!!
@@annabambus6572 Hi Anna, I agree that this show is by far and away the best. I didn't realize Hidden True Crime favored amber. I spent my weekends watching the trial, and am convinced that the only people who support her didn't watch the trial. The only reason I suggested bringing on Grizzly Crime, is that content creator could provide perspective on the true crime community and many Grizzly viewers would appreciate this show.
@@katieforeman7947 Unfortunately HC was pointing to JD being equally the abuser. There channel has to be more informed before doing so. There was so much evidence that this was not true, after her op-ed, but MSM and many others just ran with that, and it destroyed his life for a long time, as you know.
Actually I really like your idea of bringing GTC for the reason you have given! All for it, now that I understand.
Two years ago, I had a traumatic experience. It's so bad that I can't get into full details to my therapist. Im too scared to. All I said to my therapist was how I felt, what my body did during this, and trying to talk someone out of making a life altering decision. I couldn't go into detail because I'm afraid of what would happen. It traumatizing. Because of this experience it gave me ptsd. When you are part of something life threatening, your body and mind do unusual things. Because of this experience, I have a hard time talking about certain topics, touching a kind of surface and seeing some objects. I lost a wonderful job because of my ptsd. Your mind becomes your enemy. I feel awful for Dylan. She panicked, and maybe she had a breakdown. She probably has survivor guilt. People leave her alone. I know it hard for people to understand what Dylan did that morning. Your body does unbelievable things when under stress. I hope this young lady gets some help, moves on with her life, and finds peace of mind. I'm sad for her losing her friends. Not just one friend but four! Don't forget about the other girl in that house. I hope she moves, too. My heat goes out to the victims' families. ❤️
What about the fact that she called all her friends. If you can text, you can call 911
God bless you 💜
@@BSS900 exactly. she wasn’t traumatized , she didn’t know at that point everybody was dead. she did not call cops because that house had drugs - i’m sure most FRAT Houses do . She may of been high herself and didn’t want to call
@@BSS900 Bless your heart... ***Watching, as the point that rubbersoulgirl was very effectively making, soars blissfully over BSS's head...
Excellent coverage. As a previous student in Criminal Justice and Forensics I appreciate the professionalism your guest have. I wish more 'I know better', persons would be able to listen to this and learn facts not fiction and sensationalism.
He returned for the knife case but was scared to go back inside. 😔 What a great panel. I appreciate the Doctor's perspective.
I think he planted the sheath. Left it on purpose. He returned to see if there was any commotion yet because he had not heard and news etc.. prayers for the families🙏
This channel is spot on every time. Thank you all. This is the place for professionalism, respect, and knowledge.
From someone who is probably a career RUclips content creator watcher, esp in true crime, this is hands down the most engaging and informative panel I’ve seen discussing this case. No hype, just 100% analytical and professional speculation! ❤
Best panel of guests I’ve seen on this subject matter - hands down! And you are an amazing host. Thanks so much for putting this panel together, and hosting so professionally. I could have listened for much longer!
I've not listened to this channel previously, and it's excellent. What an amazing panel, each person with succinct and pertinent commentary. Dr. Shiloh is so informative and her knowledge base is thorough. I hope we will learn of any connections between perpetrator and victims, also what the motive might be although it isn't a necessary part of a trial. Thank you.
Surviving roommate's behavior was a combo of the bystander effect and not having a CLUE of what had actually occurred. The town was a very safe sleepy town, the house was full of healthy strong people and a dog. Unless you heard gunshots or bloodcurdling screams, no survivor would have any idea that a quadruple homicide had just happened in their house, even if they heard strange noises. It was apparently a very rowdy house with lots of people in and out, even at late hours. In a housing situation like that, you get used to hearing raucous noises, play fighting, pranking, loud yelps of laughter, accidental knocks of furniture from goofing around. She may have thought the killer was the DoorDash man, as those people sometimes wear COVID masks. And someone wearing dark clothes and a facemask going outside in the very cold 4 am weather is not that crazy of a sight, anyway. Maybe she thought it could have been a friend of Ethan's or Xana's that she didn't know. And then there's the bystander effect: I'm sure she thought that if there was some kind of problem that another roommate would have called the police. Unless you're in a dangerous city, who would imagine all 4 of your friends were murdered? Easier to imagine the more common explanations for the noises and stranger. In a quiet safe town like that no one could ever imagine unless they heard blood curdling screams or gunshots what was actually happening. And also, she knew that Ethan/Xana and Maddie/Kaylee were paired together. Who could ever in their worst nightmare think that there would be a killer in the home that would be stabbing everybody and that their friends wouldn't be safe doubled up in a room?? The reason we are all fascinated with this case is because a quadruple homicide by stabbing is so very rare, especially in a safe town. This is the exact reason the surviving roommate couldn't imagine what had actually occurred, or that someone else didn't call police if there was a problem.
Exactly. You summarized it well. All of it. That her roommates were being murdered was completely outside of her imagining.
In hindsight she can realize what she heard meant in terms of what happened but at the time I hardly think she could even fathom her doubled up roommates were being slaughtered in a matter of minutes.
This poor girl is not going to have to live with the trauma and survivor guilt but the condemnation of people who can’t possibly know her reality.
No, those young people have been raised well and were our futures.
Well Brian crack blonde lawyer wants Dylan on the stand (like now to cross) I wanna see that. She gonna make a monkey outta Dylan. Her boy walk. Shadow of a doubt for conviction.
Questioning why Dylan waited 8 hours is NOT victim-blaming. It’s common sense. I’ve been in situations where I’ve frozen and fainted from fear. But 8 hours is a LONG time not to do anything even after hearing crying and thuds. I get locking yourself in your room, but why not text one of your roommates to ask who that man was and if they’re okay?? Wait half an hour to call police? Not an entire 8 hours. She wasn’t so frozen that she couldn’t lock her door and walk herself back to her bed. Did she fall asleep right after that? Why did he ask “Was anyone else arrested?” as he was being taken out of his house? Why did he spare Dylan in a bedroom on the same floor as the two others? How did he know his way through the house? Why was food truck Jack following them THAT night? Bizarre and that’s just the REALITY of it
@MrSaltphone (above) wrote:
In light of the fact that one of the housemates saw the killer and froze in fear, it would be great to hear from someone like Gavin DeBecker who wrote the book, The Gift Of Fear, to better explain how her freezing in shock and locking herself in her room is not out of the ordinary...and likely saved her life.
Joel you are an amazing interviewer. Great questions and great listener. You let your guests be the stars.
#BestGuests
Agree! Ask the right questions & never interrupts his guest!
I like the sprinkle of humor… always timed nicely
Thanks for having Dale on the show! Feel free to tag us for more exposure on the channel!
If ever I needed a defense attorney for consultation or to defend anyone he would be the first one I would call for sure. What an unbelievable treasure of info and experience. Hopefully his defense attorney doesn’t see this.
Stellar Panelist !
Thank you
Totally impressed with Dale
dale sux
I was someone who was confused by Dylans actions and wrote comments online. I never accused her of anything or blamed her. But I was genuinely perplexed by her actions.
But after listening to Dr. Shiloh's breakdown of human defense responses, it's made me realize I was lacking information to understand the situation.
Her using the analogy of a person freezing to avoid a lion makes so much sense. So I just wanted to say sorry for not understanding the roommates actions initially.
Hopefully, more people see this important conversation. I also think it's important to point out there is a lot of details police know that we don't know. So major details about Dylans testimony could be missing. So no one should be judging her actions.
Yes in a perfect world a 911 call would have been made immediately. But let's not forget the killer is to blame, he broke into this house and shattered the world's of everyone inside. Dylan is a victim too. The killer is the monster who did wrong.
I kinda wondered if she didn’t pass out from fear after locking her door, not regaining consciousness for hours. Perhaps she went in to some kind of shock. That will all come out later.
It’s devastating for her that this was included in the affidavit. LE had to know these facts would have detrimental effects on her. I feel this revictimized her. I wouldn’t be surprised if DM & BF aren’t forced to change their names. They are probably in hiding. They’ve got to be scared to death!!
Her Tiger attack anaklogy was so self explaining and spot on. Well done. It even surprised this seasoned Florida gentleman laywer.
Peoples minds can only take so much trauma before shutting down as a coping mechanism. Everyone is different handling severe trauma
When you experience trauma it’s completely changes the way you react, before being raped I said if it ever happened to me I’d report etc. however once it happened I realised I mentally do not have the strength to report, go to trial, see my attacker etc.
I hope people start deleting their vile comments and apologise to all victims.
100% agreed
Well done. After trying to watch some of the rather amateurish and supermarket tabloid-like RUclips videos related to this crime, this is by far the best in-depth analysis I've seen so far of what is known about the crime and the suspect. You've gained a subscriber. Dr. Shiloh's thought that this is possibly a crime committed by someone entering the field of forensic police work trying to gain experience from the perspective of the perpetrator is both chilling and entirely feasible.
0
Joel you have the most amazing guests. Always so experienced, sensible and respectful of each other. You should have (and will have) 250K subscribers.
Thank you!
I know, it’s weird right? Such great guests!
Leaving a knife’s sheath with a thumbprint on its snap next to two bodies... Bryan might as well have left a confession letter behind.
Which indicates that he left it there intentionally.
@@JeremiahAlphonsus I'm wondering if he wanted to be caught and be 'famous ' or if it was a mistake?
I don’t believe he left it there intentionally. I think he killed Maddie and Kaylee, the heard the doorbell ring and panicked. The roommate heard the dog getting put in the other room where it was found. Killer likely found Ethan when Xana was getting door dash and stabbed him in his bed. Xana came back to find Ethan dead, began crying, then Killer found her in room and told her he was going to help her. Then he stabbed her to death, hence why she was on the floor. Dog was left in room and barked following the altercation between Xana and Killer and the loud thud picked up on the video. He then walked past roommate and fled.
@@Julie-si3hi Yes. “The perfect murder” for narcissists involves getting CAUGHT. See my recent video on this.
@@jesseguertin1158
Given the approximately four hour delay between the girls sorority being called and then arriving at the house and the 911 call finally being placed to report that someone was unconscious in their house which incidentally no amount of reasoning will ever make that make sense to me , we can’t really be confident that the crime scene the police finally saw almost eight hours after the fact was the way the killer(s) left it but for the record Ethan was not found in bed . He was near the bedroom door. Partially in the hallway and appeared to have been killed by a different weapon. The police took Ethans golf clubs as evidence btw.Kailey was found in the sitting position against the wall so she wasn’t killed in her sleep either and Xanas injuries show that she put up a hell of a fight that was anything but quick and silent. She would’ve been screaming for more than a few seconds from her injuries if not to attract attention and confront her killer. Mandy is the only one who was found in a position that could be indicative of being killed while asleep. Seems odd that the lone killer killed four people with at least two different weapons in three different ways in a relatively short time given that he had to figure out which two doors out of a house full of doors in a house he’d never been in lead to his intended targets. Then walk upstairs and murder two people via several wounds then walk downstairs after checking all the other doors upstairs and not finding the other two victims open more doors , then fight with Ethan before killing him then immediately fight with Xana and ultimately kill her as well. Then this lone killer who managed to walk all around a house and murder four people without leaving any DNA despite struggling with at least two people leaves his knife sheath which is intended to be worn on a belt and is a well known knife and sheath to literally millions of people including every US Marine for decades without losing the sheath and it has a thumb print on it which indicates that he carried the knife in the sheath but didn’t use the sheath then removed it after he entered the room containing the first two victims , leaving a thumb print so presumably wasn’t wearing gloves , dropped the sheath and left exactly zero additional evidence afterwards including when he opened the door he exited from . Incidentally, I would bet that every individual who has ever gone somewhere intending to kill several people with a knife whore gloves because it doesn’t take much imagination to recognize that if you aren’t wearing appropriate gloves you’re gonna have one hell of a time maintaining a grip on your knife after their covered in the blood from several inflicted wounds out of around 100 total. One last little point. Back in the day as an active Marine then later as a civilian and before I discovered far superior cutting edge tools I carried the knife that is reputed to be the murder weapon . It’s got a stacked leather rings handle that once wet is very difficult to maintain a grip on and according to the police there was so much blood at this crime scene that the” acrid smell from copious amounts of blood was difficult to handle” not to mention the blood that made its way under the baseboard , through drywall to the exterior plywood then down the concrete wall and this individual , despite the odds , not once stepped in any of the large pools of blood and subsequently leave even a single footstep on the floor . Im sorry but my experience and common sense cannot process all those facts alone and make them add up to what we’re being told . P.S
I can’t accept the word of two people who brought several people into the scene of four of their best friends murder and remain for several hours and compromising the scene which would necessarily make it more difficult to solve the case then finally make a call to 911 and tell them that someone was unconscious in their house after all of the people invited that day almost certainly saw the bloody bodies, walls and floors , smelled the foul stench of death and blood not to mention rigor mortis and everything a dog will do in a room it’s been sitting quietly in for hours and never barking in distress due to the violence involving its master and three others and trying to get someone to let it 🎉out so it can do its thing outdoors
In light of the fact that one of the housemates saw the killer and froze in fear, it would be great to hear from someone like Gavin DeBecker who wrote the book, The Gift Of Fear, to better explain how her freezing in shock and locking herself in her room is not out of the ordinary...and likely saved her life.
It's like shock can protect as in grief. Those girls didn't know too much about the house I think, they'd only lived there a few months I think.
She knew the killer and was left unharmed maybe? That's a better explanation than "I was frozen stiff for a while then went to sleep, woke up, took a bong and then decided to call 911. 😂
Being frozen in shock for several hours seems unusual.
He left her on purpose. He went back at 9 that morning. He wanted to watch the police. In my opinion.
I just don't think it would have been fear from knowing the scope of what just happened. I don't think she knew what actually happened. Then i think in the morning she saw Xana on the floor from a ways away, and was too afraid to go check, hence the call about an unconcious person. All in my opinion!
This is a super fantastic video. For me, it’s your very best one. Thank you for bringing these 3 guests together in this video. It’s really amazing!
What a great panel. This is by far the best discussion and information I have heard so far. I could listen to you all for hours. Thank you !
These guests! Lisa is so intelligent. They all are of course but she is clear, informed and interesting. Thanks for bringing us another great episode!
#BestGuests
@@SurvivingTheSurvivor yes....I don't know how you do it BUT it works well.....growth of your channel is inevitable..... may become a monster..... many of your shows/guests can be used for educational purposes in university settings as well as LE academies..... proving to be remarkable (just opinion of this old man....lol)
@Jay Thomas Reset Also, I can't help but wonder what exceptional conversations like this do to help and advise criminals.
@@bewell4743 that may be possibility .... but criminals already access everything anyway
Love her!
For the roommate who saw the killer and locked herself in the bedroom, hours could seem like minutes to her in this moment of fear.
A line from a very famous song, Does anyone know where the love of God goes when the minutes turn into hours..
Also, doesn't fear and anxiety sometimes make you sleepy and you can pass out just from stress and anxiety?
YES!!!!! Thank you! When he walked past her he had to have been full of blood. How terrifying!
And she probably was afraid to come out of her room because she didn’t know if the person was still in the house…. Glad that she got back in her room and locked her door and stay quiet..
Why didn’t she text someone to call the police for her to check the house ?
LOVE the color of that blue tie. Handsome guy too. Fantastic guests. Great content.
Its shocking he was able to kill four people so violently in house full of people and some of the victims only being asleep for minutes before the attack or even awake at the time. Its insane, so many things had to fall in place for him to succeed in this atrocity.
i think that the victims were in 2 bedrooms, rather than 4 bedrooms, made it very different.
The truly tragic takeaway from this horrific crime is that apparently these house mates never or rarely locked those sliding glass doors. How different might this all have played out if the killer hadn't been able to freely walk without hesitation into that residence and go undetected straight to his unsuspecting victims. Would he have just turned and walked away or attempted to kick down those doors or break open a window drawing immediate attention to himself? Sadly, we will never know the answer.
Agree. That he did the crimes extremely quickly says that the sheer shock to the victims made them more vulnerable.
@@Daylily23 Each one had the one strike that was fatal so even if he was in a frenzy he knew the one that would do the job. Could have even looked it up online. (Altho some aren't hard to figure out.)
@@Daylily23 And the partying. Drugs and alcohol don't exactly speed up your reflexes..
The 8 hour delay before LE was informed is unbelievable !
I think D heard much more than is mentioned in the affidavit. A camera OUTSIDE and 50 away picked up noise. D was directly under the room where K & M were killed. And she was on the same floor as where X & E were killed. I bet she heard much horror, much more than mentioned in the affidavit but which will come out later.
She knew well enough to lock her door but not call the cops. Terrible.
She may have forgotten some of it.
@@davidsantacarla It’s been rumored that her phone was in the kitchen. Since nobody knows everything yet it seems reasonable to hold such harsh judgement until there’s more info.
But, that could definitely send you into extreme shock surely, where you would not be able to believe what you saw and heard.....you might tense up on the bed and think she must have imagined it all, please God!! You could be in a terrified state and want to carry on as if life is just normal.....because your mind cannot process that kind of a reality!!
@@davidsantacarla No - it’s your comment that is terrible, David. You are just an amateur, Hardy Boy wannabe keyboard sleuth - you know nothing except what the LA has shared in this document, which is a precursor. She could have left her phone in the kitchen or bathroom, or somewhere in her darkened room when she locked the door and turned out the light - terrified that he wld come to get her if she turned lights on to find it, or spoke to 911. Trauma is ‘petrifying' in multiple senses of that word. As an in-home rape victim I can attest to that. I shivered for hours in a room before venturing out as I was terrified he was still there. Theirs was a creaky wooden house and she was on one of two easy entry levels. So even if he left he could have come back if he’d heard her - hell they even say he DID the next morning! The next morning. How dare you pre-judge a young victim terrified for her life and presume that you know more re her situation than she did, and more re the evidence than the LA did. You are a disgrace.
This criminal event is so scary and horrifying. I appreciate your panel and helping make sense of it. If I put myself in the survivors shoes, I can’t! There is no way to determine the fear and trauma. It is a first hand experience unique to her. I am sorry for everyone.
You can't force your body to respond when you're extremely frightened. It's such a primal reaction, most people have not experienced this level of fear and don't understand what really happens.
I feel very sorry for Dylan. I hope she can recover from this.
Another incredible panel & discussion today. Thank you all!
Joel, your panels are always stellar. I was riveted from beginning to end. I always learn a lot from your esteemed guests. There is no other crime channel to compare to yours. Thank you!
Room mate went back to sleep and then woke up many hours later. I don’t think she realised the horrors upstairs. Shared house, pll coming and going she wasn’t to know. Very sad. Great show. Intelligent conversations.
Great guests again. This case is trully schocking, I am following it since beginning and with each further level it goes even more terryfying.
I just hope this will lead young women to be a little more careful with what they post as well as who they let in and out of their house. I get it’s college life and yes it should be the time of their life but, this is a crazy world we live in. And most of all don’t leave doors unlocked! Prayers to the families of these beautiful souls. May they Rest In Peace 🙏
My brother had Aspbergers, OCD and anxiety. He had an IQ of 140, What he didn't have was a lick of common sense. He had a devious side for which my parents were obliged to pay all his Attorneys fees.
That's not her.
So sad about your brother and all your parents had to go through because of him.
I know people that are super intelligent and have a dark side.
Well said
That’s a great point! A lot of high IQ people lack “street smarts/common sense”!
A woman who really tried to befriend Bryan in high school, and who had hours long conversations with him, said she just thought he was very sheltered because he had absolutely no social skills, and was totally clueless about very basic human interaction, human nature, interpreting clues, etc.
Another person that was bullied in school. Bullying needs to be stopped.
This woman is incredible how she explains things.
INVALUABLE INFORMATION! The brilliance of your guest and their timely appearance is just wonderful. Keep up the good work!
Kaylee screaming and fighting caused killer to panic. From that point forward he was paranoid. He forgot the sheath entirely. He left Dylan and Bethany alive. He left footprint. He drove back to crime scene. Etc.
Oj left footprints. On them ugly ass shoes. He is in Florida. At this very moment at the golf course looking for the murderer & weapon 🔪!!
There’s no reporting that Kaylee was screaming
The affidavit does not suggest that Kaylee was “screaming and shouting,” it merely states that the two girls were sleeping in a single bed.
Dylan thought she heard Xana crying, but she had her boyfriend with her. She could have been crying over a million things and her boyfriend was comforting her.
From all accounts from people who knew that “party house,” people were coming and going 24/7. Dylan may have been startled at seeing someone she didn’t immediately recognise but that doesn’t mean that she was in complete shock. In that case, she did the sensible thing. She locked her door and went to sleep. It was after 4am. She was probably tired.
@@enigma_-_79you’re missing it. She first was awoke by what sounded like her roommate Kaylee playing with her dog on the third floor. Kaylee and her dogs shrieks and the horsing around was actually not playful and Kaylee was in trouble and Murphy trying to get to her 😢
@@juleshiggins-ellicott2222 They likely left that out of this report as they'd gathered enough evidence and wanted to protect DM from 'internet haters' fir not calling 911 .
On the Reddit forums Bryan himself said a victim screamed (K probably) so he fought her harder and threw her on top of M . Then left in a hurry. LE proved that his reddit account is linked ti his proven email. I've been following case on reddit. Reddit has removed all his posts and given to LE. You can verify this info.
Another professional amazing show with Joel & his guests. Thank you
This panel, with their expertise, was just astounding to watch.
Your moderation, so intricate to each speaker, each given their space, not to mention their respect for each other --BRILLIANT.
Thank you all.
So impactful!!!
Best I've seen.
How chilling and how horrid that DM heard the killer say, “don’t worry I’m going to help you” she was absolutely terrified in that moment. It was confirmation from her hearing one of the roommates say, “someone’s in the house“ I believe she heard Xana actually being killed or seriously hurt. She definitely knew something terrible was happening. Hence only cracking the door that third time. Unbeknownst to her that she would actually see the killer dressed in all black, masked walk right by her. She froze in a state of shock. She absolutely locked herself in her room. She didn’t know if the killer would come back to finish her. That might have actually saved her life. The suspect definitely didn’t see her. They did not make eye contact? He walked right past her. If he would have seen her he would have killed her. 💯 It’s likely after seeing him, she fainted. After what she heard/then saw. It’s likely that DM had been drinking or under the influence as well. I think when she came too, she called a friend to in-fact confirm and look around the house to see if she heard/saw or if she dreamed it.. I think DM was unconscious and came too, and probably was so traumatized she had the friend call 911. We will absolutely hear more details about the victim and what actually happened. Police didn’t put everything in the affidavit, just a summation for the arrest, for safety of the victims.
The gentleman guest in the upper right hand corner of the screen makes an interesting point about the potential for “pre-operational surveillance “ from the property overlooking the house. While there is no current information supporting this, it’s a helpful comment nevertheless. People/women can be remarkably oblivious to potential people peering in. He actually brought to mind something I’d forgotten from when I was living in a 3rd floor apartment during my clinical internship, and one afternoon unintentionally saw a woman in the house next door changing into a sports bra and then taking several bong hits- which cracked me up.
Fortunately I’m female and not a creeper- but man, I wasn’t even trying to see her. Self awareness shouldn’t end when you walk into your house.
If the police have evidence that Brian Khoberger had visited the area where the victims lived 12 times since June 22, then it seems he had targeted one or all of them. When or where is to be determined. It may be possible he was the stalker that Kaylee had referred to friends and family and also the owner of a vapor/coffee shop in Moscow, Idaho. He called police to give his recount of a particular time 4 or five of the girls came into his shop quiet often and he said that Maddie had said they traveled in a group because one of them was being stalked and when she said this he said Maddie motioned toward Kaylee.
Who knows when the alleged suspect encounter one or all of these students. Maybe on social media. Someone said that the alleged suspect was a follower of one or maybe more of the victims and had made the comment to either Kaylee or Maddie he liked her picture.
I would encourage anyone that must or wants to be on social media just remember you are putting yourself out there for the whole world to see you and make contact with you. Does that mean they have the right to stalk, threaten intimidate or harass you? No, but we live in a world where there are so many sick, mentally ill and just plain crazy people.
Please be careful what you post on social media! Be safe!
This is my first show I go to everyday...I absolutely love it. Keep up the great work 😀
Glad you enjoy it!tell friends!
This is the first video I’ve watched from this channel - are all your guests/panels THIS awesome?! WOW - this was wonderful, thoughtful professional insight. I’m now a subscriber!
YES ! Watch all of them. The one Yesterday with the real life daughter of the BTK Murderer...is the most informative, intelligent, heart rending podcast I've ever seen
Here in Sweden we say ”man ska inte förväxla utbildning med intelligens”
Please if you have young adults in your family set them down and tell them if they see something say something. It does not matter if you are drunk or high,this is 2023. You could save a life. God bless the victims and most definitely bless DM. I hope she finds peace.
How many times though have you had an emergency and in that moment you think should I call 911 or am I over reacting and in this case I think with no or little sound she probably didnt know if it was a joke or what. She probably just didnt know what to do. Maybe everything in her was screaming dont go out there and she talked herself out of it.
Maybe her phone was in a common area and she was too terrified to leave her room to get it.
You can save a life by NOT being drunk or high - likely your own! You tell kids this selfish, irresponsible, excessive hedonistic - ridiculously dangerous behavior is OK, you're signing their death warrant!
@Tara Mcgavan and at 8 30am
@@lynnd.5135 whaaat really? Are u sure?
Great video. I love when all the guests add great detail and insight to the show. Sometimes the guests don’t add anything worthwhile, not this show. Excellent show.
As a layperson in legal matters, I found this discussion very informative. Thanks!
One of the best panels ever! This podcast not only informs about a newsworthy incident, but teaches viewers relevant life information.
A show that actually let the Experts finish their train of thought. This is in an itself ground breaking interview.
I agree with the attorney. He has a narcissistic drive to be the smartest person in the room. After committing this crime he knows more than the researchers and academic experts who haven’t murdered anyone. Experience is everything. As a Professor, he’d get to relive the murders every semester and re-experience his sick thrills.
So he that smart but sheath not on a belt . All evidence will get tore up with good lawyer because it all sounds planted
You have hit BK on the nail head. Perfect description!
Some brilliant explanations of potential scenarios and body responses and Dale explaining the reason for the affidavit gave me pause for thought. It shows that they were all victims in that 4 lost their life and survivors suffered trauma not just by knowing they were in there when the murders happened, but Dylan witnessing a frightening unidentified figure, causing her to freeze on the spot. It tells us that he was walking towards her and we are assuming eye contact, but could it not be the case that he was walking with head slightly down and that's why she describes the eyebrows and possibly as he turns toward his exit. This gives insight to what the murdered victims endured before their horrific deaths. It's all very difficult to comprehend and so heartbreaking what they and their families suffered and are suffering.
Another great panel and informative, intelligent discussion. Bravo. It's great to see the panelists learning from and interacting with each other; they did this yesterday also and it was very moving.
I am so impressed with the Law Enforcement teamwork, and that all of it remained behind the scenes!
Thank you to this wonderful panel for the mature and thoughtful discussion of all the topics related to this horrendous crime!
STS is simply the best.
Thank you for bringing on an obviously good lawyer who has compassion and who brings up such important issues about camera footage and phone tower pinging. Serious pros and cons to important things that need to be brought to light.
I was listening to a few others before the suspect was caught, but very soon dropped them all, due to the sheer professionalism, extremely high level of expertise and ethics of all invited on STS, plus the great moderating. We are allowed to hear guests fully express themselves. The fact that these calibre of guests accept the invite is accolades to STS. Also love the cardboard cutout of your wife, an experienced practicing psychologist, who l am sure gives a lot of behind the scenes help.
The profiling of the suspect before capture was unbelievably accurate. In fact spot on. No one else got so close. And most important NO ONE WAS FINGERED. Obviously I can't stress this enough, due to the devastating, life destroying repercussions this has on innocent people and their families.
The ex boyfriend has been traumatized and so has his family. It's gut wrenching and sickening when an online mob braying for blood is formed. Terrifying.
I have already shared since the beginning. No one else is on the same high level of expertise and on top of that so up to date with the really important things.
Interviewing BTK's daughter was masterful, and extremely vital for the public to fully grasp the deep, life long trauma of the family of the suspect. Even friends and extended family. Too many of the public quickly become a lynch mob braying for blood. Criminal in itself.
Thank you for making each podcast a master class!!
Great show! As always! Great panel! You do have the best guests and you ask very thought provoking questions. !
This by far is the greatest panel
Wow Dr Shilo is brilliant!
Check out her podcast! She IS fabulous, as is her partner on the podcast. "L.A. Not-So-Confidential".
Dr. Shiloh is brilliant. Thanks Joel.
I can’t imagine what she felt when she woke up and opened her door. Most people are going to the bathroom first thing which would lead her right to her roommates door. Absolutely horrible. I feel sorry for her.
Obviously, men leaving in the early morning wasn’t anything unusual. It was on,y chilling to her when she realized what it all meant, and made her statement.
She will have PTSD at the very least. I hope she gets the help she will need. Prayers for her 🙏
What I don’t understand is that She opened her door 3 times the night Intruder was there. She heard crying and heard him say “Don’t worry, I’m going to help you” did he say that to a victim or did he actually said that to DM as he passed by her before committing or after committing the crimes as she stood there in the dark as he passed by her? Another thing is how could she hear and described everything if it was dark how could she see bushy eyebrows in the dark? Why she did not call anyone? It was not until 8 hours later and by then he had disposed of incriminating evidence and had jet out of town. Is this Trauma? Or we’re both Bryan and DM together on this? Did they practice their Alibi ? Did he offered to do this for DM? Did DM and Bryan knew each other? Maybe romantically involved which would explain why he was in the area often. Did she maybe complaint about the other four? Maybe jealousy, envy, how was her relationship with the other room mates? Maybe Ethan and Xana just happened to really be there at the wrong date and time. Maybe DM did not think that Bryan would actually commit the crimes But he did. Did He assured her that he would be not found and if found exonerated cause he was so good at committing the crime? DM could be a narcissist and he could have a grandiose ego. Remember the Amanda Knox case????
@@issaangel317
I just think everyone should give her the benefit of whatever doubts they’re having. I personally don’t think she was involved. If she was the cops would likely easily make the connection. Wait for more facts to come out. The police probably asked her many follow up questions not released in the affidavit that just came out.
@@DankyDankenstein that’s what I think is the truth, she didn’t know what happened yet.
This podcast was so insightful.. RUclips is full of nonsense it's hard to find experts like yourselves... Well done 👏 keep up the great work
Recommend Pat Brown and Johnny Law - they’re also ex professional FBI/profiler etc.
Kaylee's comment "there's someone here" likely referred to the DoorDash deliverer at 4:00am approx.
Just incredibly distinguished and quality guests every time, Bravo!
I wonder if the male voice saying “It’s ok. I’m going to help you” was Ethan speaking to Xana. Also, the affidavit does not say there was eye contact between Dylan & Kohberger.
First and foremost, love and prayers for the victims' families and those who also loved them. Outstanding show, as usual. #BestGuests is 100% accurate. Just ordered a copy of "The Gift of Fear" for myself and my family. Thank you, Joel, for all you do.
Superb show and participants. Thank You!
For him to tell Zana "it's okay I'm here to help you" is so freaking chilling knowing he was looking into her eyes I mean just so frightening. I think she was absolutely awesome she made it hard for him and made so much noise that he had to leave. She may have saved 2 lives.
If the killer said that then it's a new layer of evil I couldn't have imagined before this case
What?
@@mischaraine1645 yes we do u sliced the dude up first that poor girl prolly woke up and knew it was her time next
@@mischaraine1645 well I'm pretty sure there wasn't anybody else in there but I'm no genius like u
It's XANA. ffs...have some respect.
I can't help but think these murders were Bryan's introductory murders to becoming a serial killer..
I agree
Brilliant mix of guests today. I could listen to Dr Shiloh and Mr Carson discuss this case for hours.
Wonderful panel, very thoughtful in articulating their opinions.
You really have the best guests!! 🍀
This Channel hosts very thoughtful, intelligent, and experienced guests. Very informative...
Thanks!
Glad you think so! Please tell friends
@@SurvivingTheSurvivor Definitely! "Liked and Subscribed"!
You always have the best guests. Thank you
First I want to thank all police, FBI, DNA experts and everyone else involved in catching this killer. I'm so glad that he forgot the sheath for the knife! In his frenzied attacks, he forgot the thing that caught him. Thank you again to all law enforcement people. My prayers go out to the families of the students.
I think he dropped it & didn't know where. He probably thought he shoved it in a pocket, & didnt realize it wasnt there till he'd left the scene; couldnt go back.
And I also Thank God for leading the agents.
@@liberty8424 I think he immediately went up stairs when he entered the home through the sliding door, an closed it quietly behind him, (I believe based on the timing of events, he arrived in the home around 4:05, 5 minutes after the door dash, as he was pinged at the house, at 4:04, probably took a minute to walk from his car to the door) as he realized there was a bedroom right there where he entered, I believe he hurried up the stairs as to not get caught by Xana, and Ethan, who he could hear wide awake!!! I believe that the loud stairs, gave him away anyway, to the 3 students awake, but he didn't realize it!! (As it has been reported by others who lived there, you could hear when someone went, up and down the stairs) I'm assuming that's when Dylan opened her door the first time, an heard Xana whisper loudly, (I'm assuming it was just loud enough for Xana to hear from across the hall) that someone was there, probably thought nothing of it at the time, an just assumed the girl's invited someone over, so she closed her door, an tried to go to sleep, as she was still intoxicated!! Meanwhile Xana an Ethan probably went back into her room after as well, finished eating, and scrolling tiktoc, most likely had there guards up, an was listening from below, and didn't like the noises they were hearing, all of a sudden!! (The girl's were most likely gone within minutes of him getting upstair's, as they were asleep in the same bed, they didn't have a chance to see what was coming!)😭I'm guessing he got a little loud, doing whatever he was doing to there body's after, for 4,5 minutes, an Xana, and Ethan could hear him!! They most likely thought he had his way with one of the girls, or both, and Ethan was prepared to confront him, when he came down!! (I think he was cleaning up in the upstairs bathroom after, around 4:12, for about 4,5 minutes, give or take a minute) the same time Xana got off of TikTok, as they heard something that startled them!! (Probably took a good 5 minutes, cleaning himself up, then went back to take one last look before, preparing to get ready, and run up out the house) I'm guessing he decided to rearrange them real quick, (they were found on top of each other in bed) and when he dropped her down on the other girl, that was the thud all 3 heard, including the dog in the other room, and a near by door camera!! (The thud, an dog barking happened at 4:17) I think that's when Dylan opened her door the second time, and told her roommate's to shut up!! She thought Kaylee was upstairs playing with her dog!!😩 Closed her door and proceeded to try to go to sleep, as she was probably starting to feel the side effects of the alcohol, before she closed her door she could hear Ethan, (most likely)tell Xana he would help her, an hearing her crying!! (I'm guessing she was scared of the person in the house, an Ethan wanted to confront him, and that's why she was scared crying, an probably said what if he comes after me, and he said it's ok I'll help you!! (What Xana confirmed hearing, most likely she took it as the two was fighting) Mean while the perp upstairs, had just brought attention to himself, an knew the people below heard the loud thud, as he heard Dylan yell shut up!! (Most likely thought it was the one's awake in the other room, when he snuck in) He probably lost his sleuth leaning over the two, when he dropped one of the girls on the other, an didn't realize it, as he was in panic mode at that point, (It was around 4:17) an didn't want the cops called!! I think he ran down stairs, in a hurry to leave, but was confronted by Ethan in the door way of Xana's room, and before he could say anything else he stabbed him quick, as he most likely didn't see it coming, then went for Xana!! Xana might have let out a little cry scream, an begged for her life, he shut her up pretty quickly, but she still fought for her life, as she knew what was coming!!😭😭 I think it was all done in 4, 5 minutes tops!! 4:17-4:22 (He finished in Xana's room 😭)when I believe Devyn opened the bedroom door for the 3rd time, an seen the guy run past her to the sliding door, and he turned around shocked to see someone else in the house, they locked eyes with each other, Devyn froze in fear at the sight of him, but he kept going, (They pinged his vehicle leaving the scene around 4:24) as he probably thought she called the cops!! He then went somewhere to dispose of his clothes, and things, as he didn't get home until 5:30, a hr later, it's a 10-12 minute drive back to his apartment!! Was home 3hrs, and drove back to the scene around 9something, wondering why no police yet, scoped it out for 10-12 minutes and went back to his apartment!!! Dylan eventually went back into her room, locked her door as she didn't trust this guy, he scared her but had no clue what just happened, eventually fell asleep as to sober up, an sleep off that alcohol!! Around 11:30-11:45 the roommate downstairs on the first floor, came up stairs, Dylan heard her, and called her into her room, she probably asked her if she knew what happened last night, as the two went out together?? They then probably proceeded to walk to the kitchen together, and that's when they seen Ethan laying on the floor, and ran out of the house screaming, an yelling the neighbors who were friends of there's came running to there aide, in the yard, a long with others who gathered in the front yard, as spectators do!! Dylan probably made the call to 911, but froze up, and couldn't talk, she was probably starting to go into shock, as she remembers the scary guy, an thinking he probably did something to Ethan, and passed out unconscious!! (One of the neighbors picked up the phone, and said she had just passed out cold, that was the initial unconscious person reported) the other room mate was talking gibberish, as she hadn't a clue of anything, an didn't understand why this was happening!! I'm guessing at that point One of the neighbors went in to check the situation out, to see if he could help Ethan, in anyway, an ran back out after seeing the severity of the situation!!! I think they waited for Law enforcement, an they were the one's who found the girls on the 3rd floor!!! He did this all in 18-20minutes!!! (I'm guessing based on the affidavit, and timeline, that something along those lines it was occurred)
@@Slapshot4567 you've detailed this very nicely. But for the big difference on floors. Dillon was Downstairs in a bedroom. The other bedroom on the 2nd floor was vacant. Whoever was paying rent was gone from that room, so the interview went. And Xana's bedroom door opened into the kitchen, not by the sliders, from the diagrams I've seen posted. Maybe the diagrams were wrong & you're right? Guess we'll find out from court.
@@melaniearant5810 Yes, I always thank the good Lord. When the agents caught BK, I prayed and thanked God.
Great panel; fabulous discussion & insights. Very powerful- thanks
Best, most eloquent panel I've heard in a long time. Kudos!
Great discussion. As they pointed out toward the end, we were first told that all of the victims were killed in their sleep. Now it sounds as if they were all awake. That's even worse! I hope that justice is served for these victims and their loved ones!
I would LOVE to see Gavin deBecker on your podcast!
Love this show .....most informative.....yup.....and we should not forget this show is the MOST ACCURATE information anywhere....yup
Let me get this straight..... I could probably show 200 people whose phones ping DAILY close to crime scene.. .soooo he is guilty if his phone pings near location and he is guilty if his phone DOESN'T PING near location because "he probably turned it off"......based on that they may convict everyone in Moscow.....geeeez .....I understand there's lots more evidence BUT forensics started on crime scene AFTER 4 p.m. AT THE SCENE....lots of holes already appearing....very intriguing case....lots of surprises coming..... captivating.....was knife sheath "planted"(I would claim that it was)
Thanks Jay!
This group of guests are outstanding accomplished people who have years of service and experience. Very much appreciate this interview.
Interviewer is excellent and helpful in enhancing communication.
I want to follow Dale’s career, and know more about him. He had very interesting opinions. I felt he would have a wealth of information and be a great teacher.
I encourage my teen grandkids to never post pics of yourself on internet as this is why. You could have good intensions but you never know who will get fixation on you and it's very dangerous.
Hi Dale! I hired you June of 2016! I HIGHLY recommend calling his firm if you get in trouble in Fl. My charge was dropped and then expunged!! Thanks Mr Carson
This is the best explanation about the roommates reaction I've heard it explains the moment...BUT doesn't explain waiting over 6 hrs to call someone, that's way past that moment
It’s possible she calmed down and felt whoever that was had left. She didn’t know people were murdered. All she knew was some guy in black was walking through the house that she didn’t recognize. She’s exhausted, goes to sleep, and doesn’t wake up until around noon. We need more information. I’m sure they asked her every question imaginable.
The last place someones mind would go to is murder. It was a party house, people were awake, and while it was weird, she probably thought it was a burglar at best
I wondered if she was so frightened that she couldn’t move until she heard the other roommate stirring. I also hear that people fall asleep after intense fear. I keep thinking about her window. Did she fear she might be seen if she moved? She might not have known if he was watching the house or if he was alone.
I still think a lot more will come out about her story. They kept this info quiet until the affidavit. I think we are all surprised.
Kaylee’s dad said in one of his first interviews that getting immediate medical help would still not have saved them. I wonder if D was struggling in hindsight with her reaction and that’s why he said that. 😔
Well there must have been some sleeping in that period of time. A 6 h hours sleep is rather common if not on the short side.
I love this channel! Good information.
Fantastic panel of esteemed guests, in particular Mr Dale Carson seems like such a polarising character. He seems like such an interesting man. He even wears it on his face. Would love to know that man. I bet he is endlessly fascinating.
Your channel is one of the best there is on youtube. Thank you very much for the great guests and your input.
found you through Grizzly True Crime. What an excellent panel bringing great points and insights to this horrific crime. Subscribed.
This proves, no one, ever, under circumstances, NO PERSON can be trusted.
Excellent panel and discussion. The human behavior insight by Dr. Shiloh was an excellent explanation for ANY traumatized person. That house seemed to be a free for all for many weekends.
IMO the connection to the girls is The Mad Greek restaurant. Two of the girls worked there, M + K. He’s got a reputation of being overly aggressive in other establishments. The girls may have dismissed or rebuked his advances and possibly he picked them for his crime.
@FRAn Kie Actually, Xana & Maddie worked there.
@@camiburchett9602 , oh thank you. My mistake...I thought I heard it differently,
@@frankie5354 You’re welcome. I had always thought that it was K & M, as well.
@@camiburchett9602 so much information has come about this case, it is hard to keep straight. I only can pray this gets sorted out properly and the perp or perps responsible are held accountable to this horrific crime.
@@frankie5354 I agree! May God bring justice to these young students and their families.
The high traffic in and out and the partying at this house really put them at risk. Dylan’s response, or lack of response, to having seen someone in the house may have been based on the history of frequent activity. Also, there may have been a hesitancy to call police due to illegal substances on the premises and prior warnings of fines.
Their parents either ignored their lifestyle or rationalized it as normal college behavior. It doesn't have to be to that excess.
Astute observations. The kids liked the limelight. Kaylee's father seems to as well.
Combined with normal 4;00am grogginess and disorientation. She may have been leary of a stranger or unknown person wondering around or leaving at 4;00am. But, not necessarily fearful; much less jump to thoughts of a possible homicide somewhere.
She didn't even suspect they had been robbed. Why? Perhaps because of past acrivies in the home. Plausible.
@@annemccarron2281 And??🙄Show more compassion,I hope you are never in Steve Goncalve's shoes and are judged by people like you.Good for him for being in the media,fighting for her daughter!
@@margaretlee-reed814 then why freeze in shock?
Thank you, Joel for consistently having the best in the field on your channel! The affidavit is quite disturbing to read. I would like to ask Dr. Shiloh what are her thoughts on the words BK said to Xana.
Wow. This was unbelievable. The Best guests! Appreciate all of the discussion from varying perspectives.
Great commentary ❤love the channel 👏❤