I should clarify my discussion of octatonic scales. I said in the video that, instead of twelve of them (as there are of each of the diatonic scale types), there are only four. But my description of octatonic scales was of a particular type - the alternating half steps and whole steps that Rimsky-Korsakov pioneered and which has been described as "string of pearls" - and I neglected to mention the other type. The fact is that there are only three such scales (the ones on E, F, and F♯ - the one on G being the same as the one on E, and so forth), and since I neglected to mention the other, my statement requires further explanation. While any eight-note scale is by definition an octatonic scale, just as any 7-note scale is a septatonic scale, there are distinct types in both cases (the diatonic scale and the Indonesian pelog scale, in the case of the latter), I have two specific types of octatonic scale in mind, the first being the one I've already described, and the second consisting of two diatonic tetrachords linked by a half step; for example, C, D, E, F, F♯, G♯, A♯, B. An important feature of both this scale and the one earlier described, is that the pattern is continuous through however many octaves you care to imagine, and one may begin that scale at either its first degree or its fourth and end up with pretty much the same result. As with the whole-tone scale, there are only two of them. You may have noticed that I used major-quality tetrachords in setting up this explanation, and it might have occurred to you that the use of minor-quality tetrachord would seem to yield a different pattern (so there must be more than two of them). But one could not use this scale for composing tonal music, for a P5 above the "tonic" is unavailable, so it is more appropriate to think in set-theoretical terms in this case. If you grant that, and invert the scale, you'll see the same pattern as in the major-quality hexachords. (In case you're wondering about such a scale being constructed on Phrygian-quality hexachords, I certainly recognize it as being among Messiaen's "modes of limited transposition", but it lacks the elegance of either of the other two octatonic scales I've described, so I don't bother with it.) Just thought I should clear that up.
Hello David, new subscriber here. Greetings from Grimsby on the east coast of the UK. I discovered your channel quite by chance and so far this is the only video I've watched. I have long admired the music of Stravinsky. It always seems to remain fresh. I can only attribute this quality to it's complete lack of self indulgence. I thoroughly enjoyed this video. It has made me want to listen to the Symphony again with new ears. Take care and all best wishes.
What a masterpiece that is.. Such a magical touch to have the subject A of the second movement purified at the end! The opening of movement three is so beautiful! Only human voice is provided harmonic and minor notes to the open fifths. Seems like it’s human being polluting and creating meaning for the world! So magical throughout the piece. I won’t imagine the composer of Rites of Springs can write like this if I was his contemporaries. Octatonic Scale… Remember that book by Van den Toorn… Such a difficult read… Schubert did occasionally use that scale, particularly in his last String Quartet, but not as usual as the Russian composers. Thank you for making this. Looking forward to the next big project!
@@David_Goza WOW REALLY!! I remember reading Van den Toorn's "Stravinsky and the Rite of Spring" for a course exclusively on the Rites. That's painful for me then, but now it should be easier to read. That's an essential reading, even though I don't agree some of his points. I find the three collection of octatonic scales quite rigid. I regard there's a freer use in Stravinsky's music: other than to be considered as an octatonic scale, it should be regarded as two [0134] set (or DSCH set?) within a whole tone range, since in his music there's also the use of the [0134] set not necessarily followed by another one a whole tone up as indicated by the octatonic theory.
@@henryng0725 The 2nd movement of the Octet is a good example of what you're talking about, I believe. Some have described that as the juxtaposition of D minor and the octatonic scale on D, resulting in an "extended diatonic" collection.
After listening to your comments regarding the octatonic scale, it strikes me that the music of Stravinsky's so called neo-classical period is much more closely related to his Russian period than I previously thought.
I should clarify my discussion of octatonic scales. I said in the video that, instead of twelve of them (as there are of each of the diatonic scale types), there are only four. But my description of octatonic scales was of a particular type - the alternating half steps and whole steps that Rimsky-Korsakov pioneered and which has been described as "string of pearls" - and I neglected to mention the other type. The fact is that there are only three such scales (the ones on E, F, and F♯ - the one on G being the same as the one on E, and so forth), and since I neglected to mention the other, my statement requires further explanation.
While any eight-note scale is by definition an octatonic scale, just as any 7-note scale is a septatonic scale, there are distinct types in both cases (the diatonic scale and the Indonesian pelog scale, in the case of the latter), I have two specific types of octatonic scale in mind, the first being the one I've already described, and the second consisting of two diatonic tetrachords linked by a half step; for example, C, D, E, F, F♯, G♯, A♯, B. An important feature of both this scale and the one earlier described, is that the pattern is continuous through however many octaves you care to imagine, and one may begin that scale at either its first degree or its fourth and end up with pretty much the same result. As with the whole-tone scale, there are only two of them.
You may have noticed that I used major-quality tetrachords in setting up this explanation, and it might have occurred to you that the use of minor-quality tetrachord would seem to yield a different pattern (so there must be more than two of them). But one could not use this scale for composing tonal music, for a P5 above the "tonic" is unavailable, so it is more appropriate to think in set-theoretical terms in this case. If you grant that, and invert the scale, you'll see the same pattern as in the major-quality hexachords.
(In case you're wondering about such a scale being constructed on Phrygian-quality hexachords, I certainly recognize it as being among Messiaen's "modes of limited transposition", but it lacks the elegance of either of the other two octatonic scales I've described, so I don't bother with it.)
Just thought I should clear that up.
Hello David, new subscriber here.
Greetings from Grimsby on the east coast of the UK.
I discovered your channel quite by chance and so far this is the only video I've watched.
I have long admired the music of Stravinsky. It always seems to remain fresh. I can only attribute this quality to it's complete lack of self indulgence.
I thoroughly enjoyed this video. It has made me want to listen to the Symphony again with new ears.
Take care and all best wishes.
Fantastic and very insightful analysis. Kudos
Writing a paper on this piece right now. Great video!!
4:44" 1st mvt. Theory
6:30" 2nd mvt. Theory
9:33" 3rd mvt. Theory
16:14" 1st mvt. Score
19:39" 2vd mvt. Score
26:20" 3rd mvt. Score
What a masterpiece that is.. Such a magical touch to have the subject A of the second movement purified at the end! The opening of movement three is so beautiful! Only human voice is provided harmonic and minor notes to the open fifths. Seems like it’s human being polluting and creating meaning for the world! So magical throughout the piece. I won’t imagine the composer of Rites of Springs can write like this if I was his contemporaries.
Octatonic Scale… Remember that book by Van den Toorn… Such a difficult read… Schubert did occasionally use that scale, particularly in his last String Quartet, but not as usual as the Russian composers.
Thank you for making this. Looking forward to the next big project!
I made a trip through Van den Toorn during my 2nd master's program, and did indeed find it to be a difficult (but fascinating) read!
@@David_Goza WOW REALLY!!
I remember reading Van den Toorn's "Stravinsky and the Rite of Spring" for a course exclusively on the Rites. That's painful for me then, but now it should be easier to read. That's an essential reading, even though I don't agree some of his points. I find the three collection of octatonic scales quite rigid. I regard there's a freer use in Stravinsky's music: other than to be considered as an octatonic scale, it should be regarded as two [0134] set (or DSCH set?) within a whole tone range, since in his music there's also the use of the [0134] set not necessarily followed by another one a whole tone up as indicated by the octatonic theory.
@@henryng0725 The 2nd movement of the Octet is a good example of what you're talking about, I believe. Some have described that as the juxtaposition of D minor and the octatonic scale on D, resulting in an "extended diatonic" collection.
Was waiting for it! Cant wait to watch it🙂
After listening to your comments regarding the octatonic scale, it strikes me that the music of Stravinsky's so called neo-classical period is much more closely related to his Russian period than I previously thought.
hey man, great job