So far, I haven't seen an analysis that's about something that's so universal across all cultures: men's desires and the patriarchal dilemma. People have desires, the desire to be loved, the desire to own and be owned, a sense of belonging, but the problem with the whole concept of polygamous societies is the idea of collections. Women were objects to be collected as toys and not treated as human beings and the men who actually try to love multiple women at the same time, usually cannot handle the competitiveness and the constant comparisons amongst all the concubines. Which, if you see palace harem dramas, you usually see a high level of structurism where the empress always takes the lead in establishing rules and regulations in courts. It's true though that this system is better than being slut-shamed because men actually own up to feeding the women they slept with, but the common theme has always been the constant need for the women to behave accordingly, because their master owns them, therefore he can take away their powers, which eventually lead to the women eventually losing themselves behind the walls. The constant need to compare themselves with each other, the pressure the kids go through with having to deal with different courts and different relationships amongst courts, it creates a world where people are so absorbed with the lifestyle that they don't see the world beyond those walls, which in the end, can be very suffocating. And the visiting different houses creates a sense of favoritism that is constant amongst any harem dramas and the constant devastations and tragedies amongst this genre of film/television. This movies is not the first one, harem dramas existed since the start of asian dramas because period dramas talk about empires and courts and ancient societies have harems. But ever since Raise the Red Lantern came out, there are dramas that are all about palace harems and lives women then lived. Harems ever since have been seen differently ever since this movie came out (eg. Legend of Lady Yang, War and Beauty, Empress Wu, Ruyi's Love in the Palace, Empresses in the palace, etc.). And even some dramas' main focus isn't about the harem, the harem became a big factor in the story plot. There are stories that are about stop fighting for favoritism or surviving and gaining power at court in the late 90s, usually a HK or Taiwanese production that's based on a work of fiction, but Raise the Red Lantern has become a huge influence in the whole genre of harem dramas. Harem dramas of this kind don't actually show what loving multiple women means to men, you see what obsession with materialism means to women who might lose it all if she loses the house. You see an artificial admiration towards the master who only has 1/300 of love towards you but in return, you get all the artificial favoritism the day after. It looks complicated and lots of twists, but the main concept is the same: artificial love towards the master, who only gives very little of his actual love, even if it looks very real.
Thank you for taking the time to comment at such length. You raise interesting points on the artifice of admiration and vying for attention based on survivalism. Totalitarianism, even on a micro-scale is insidious.
Since the first time I watched this movie I have been Amazed by Asian Culture. I cried when they killed the opra singing concubine. Also when the new concubine came in after the old one was turned into a maid after she made the gaurds think she was the ghost.
if ur talking about songlian becoming the maid she didnt become one, she just started wearing her schoolgirl uniform u see at the start of the movie because she went insane
Never seen Red Sorghum. Accidentally stumbled upon Raise The Red Lantern on conventional TV. I loved it, didn't agree with the ending but it is what it is.
So does it mean having freedom equals to punishment eg Meishan. Even dreaming is considered breaking the rules though hopes were given but shattered due to their fate eg Yan Er, she rather died than apologise & live a fate like that. While Songlian thoughts were like I’ve sacrificed my happiness & dreams so why should others have it. Finding happiness & amusing themselves like Meishan while having a dream like Yan Er are not permitted in pre communist China. While obeying & following the rules is the proper example to follow. Even if it means being a two faced, finding other people faults & plotting against each other but pretends to be innocent & a victim like the 2nd wife. No kindness and cold blooded is example of the first wife guess that’s the only way to stay sane in life if you’re living in pre communist China. Last part shows the 5th wife presumably a new generation of confusion. With the 4th wife being crazy after witnessing a murder cause by her when she blurted out a secret when was drunk. Shows she’s not evil like 2nd wife cause 4th wife felt guilty and went insane. While 2nd wife took action against 3rd wife when she could have ignored, she looks kind but is very revengeful. And 1st wife just couldn’t be bothered. I love how they really went into each character personality on how the society treats them. The writer is a great storyteller in a way by it’s simple detailing says a lot about their characters & society are in. With director Zhang ways to directing, cinematography & natural acting skills by the actors. It’s really a splendid movie to watch & learn from.
I watched this with my fiance, who grew up in mainland China. She said it is a very realistic depiction of the pre-revolution era. I'm flabbergasted at the idea that the movie is so Eastern that it's actually Western fetishism. It was made by Easterners, for Easterners, based on an Eastern book, accurately depicting Eastern architecture, clothing, and society in an era when they were less influenced by the West... And somehow people like me are still the villains? I don't know if I'm insulted or flattered at the attempts to shoehorn white males into being secretly responsible for everything. If it was Westernized, they would say it was whitewashing Eastern culture. The only Western things in the movie are the record player and the idea of a woman going to university (both of which are narrow bright spots in the story), and the idea that concubinage is bad (Christians were somewhat unique in their "one man, one woman" morality system...) Rather than Western propaganda about how the East is evil and cruel, it is a Communist parable about how capitalism and class systems are evil and cruel. Capitalism causes people to sacrifice love for wealth, selling themselves as products ("robes" or farm animals versus humans). I know you were just mentioning the criticism the movie had received, not necessarily agreeing with it.
@Keyboard Emperor This film addresses systemic oppressions by using the oppressions of women as narrative. And yet, even after watching this film, you still somehow come to the conclusion that this was somehow a better time? For who? The men? The audacity of some misogynists... If a lot of men in China are like you then I get why the divorce rate is so damn high haha.
That’s exactly where my mind went to after seeing this film for the first time. Without knowing any context on modern Chinese history, any one could come up with a thousand uncorrelated interpretation. The movie makes a very clear distinction between the rich and poor, serving as a commentary on social class. None of the women came from wealth. The master is the only man in the house who’s got everything to himself, and women are an expendable resource.
Great comment. The “criticism” that Zhang Yimou is an Orientalist is not just on its face laughably absurd but speaks much more to the cultural viciousness and hostility of narcissistic white Western progressives towards any narrative veering an iota from leftist orthodoxy. Truly they are the most loathsome and self-loathing creatures in the universe.
@@hbkfilmmediadeptfilmsvideo4589 your welcome I'm not sure if your an anime fan but if you enjoyed this movie than Belladonna of sadness will be a treat for you
I have looked for this film for some time. To those who argue that film is not art, I dare you to dismiss this masterpiece.
Not certain where you have found people who would not consider film to be art. Sounds like an either insanely pompous or ignorant view.
Nowadays, your viewpoint is used to produce the most tedious films out there with poor storytelling (aka eveyrthing eveyrhwere all at once)
So far, I haven't seen an analysis that's about something that's so universal across all cultures: men's desires and the patriarchal dilemma. People have desires, the desire to be loved, the desire to own and be owned, a sense of belonging, but the problem with the whole concept of polygamous societies is the idea of collections. Women were objects to be collected as toys and not treated as human beings and the men who actually try to love multiple women at the same time, usually cannot handle the competitiveness and the constant comparisons amongst all the concubines. Which, if you see palace harem dramas, you usually see a high level of structurism where the empress always takes the lead in establishing rules and regulations in courts. It's true though that this system is better than being slut-shamed because men actually own up to feeding the women they slept with, but the common theme has always been the constant need for the women to behave accordingly, because their master owns them, therefore he can take away their powers, which eventually lead to the women eventually losing themselves behind the walls. The constant need to compare themselves with each other, the pressure the kids go through with having to deal with different courts and different relationships amongst courts, it creates a world where people are so absorbed with the lifestyle that they don't see the world beyond those walls, which in the end, can be very suffocating. And the visiting different houses creates a sense of favoritism that is constant amongst any harem dramas and the constant devastations and tragedies amongst this genre of film/television.
This movies is not the first one, harem dramas existed since the start of asian dramas because period dramas talk about empires and courts and ancient societies have harems. But ever since Raise the Red Lantern came out, there are dramas that are all about palace harems and lives women then lived. Harems ever since have been seen differently ever since this movie came out (eg. Legend of Lady Yang, War and Beauty, Empress Wu, Ruyi's Love in the Palace, Empresses in the palace, etc.). And even some dramas' main focus isn't about the harem, the harem became a big factor in the story plot. There are stories that are about stop fighting for favoritism or surviving and gaining power at court in the late 90s, usually a HK or Taiwanese production that's based on a work of fiction, but Raise the Red Lantern has become a huge influence in the whole genre of harem dramas. Harem dramas of this kind don't actually show what loving multiple women means to men, you see what obsession with materialism means to women who might lose it all if she loses the house. You see an artificial admiration towards the master who only has 1/300 of love towards you but in return, you get all the artificial favoritism the day after. It looks complicated and lots of twists, but the main concept is the same: artificial love towards the master, who only gives very little of his actual love, even if it looks very real.
Thank you for taking the time to comment at such length. You raise interesting points on the artifice of admiration and vying for attention based on survivalism. Totalitarianism, even on a micro-scale is insidious.
Wonderful analysis ! Thank you for this video !
Since the first time I watched this movie I have been Amazed by Asian Culture. I cried when they killed the opra singing concubine. Also when the new concubine came in after the old one was turned into a maid after she made the gaurds think she was the ghost.
if ur talking about songlian becoming the maid she didnt become one, she just started wearing her schoolgirl uniform u see at the start of the movie because she went insane
2022 Article which mentions this film:
"Movies Which Explore the Consequences Borne by People Removed From Traditional Group Norms"
Never seen Red Sorghum. Accidentally stumbled upon Raise The Red Lantern on conventional TV. I loved it, didn't agree with the ending but it is what it is.
So does it mean having freedom equals to punishment eg Meishan. Even dreaming is considered breaking the rules though hopes were given but shattered due to their fate eg Yan Er, she rather died than apologise & live a fate like that. While Songlian thoughts were like I’ve sacrificed my happiness & dreams so why should others have it. Finding happiness & amusing themselves like Meishan while having a dream like Yan Er are not permitted in pre communist China. While obeying & following the rules is the proper example to follow. Even if it means being a two faced, finding other people faults & plotting against each other but pretends to be innocent & a victim like the 2nd wife. No kindness and cold blooded is example of the first wife guess that’s the only way to stay sane in life if you’re living in pre communist China. Last part shows the 5th wife presumably a new generation of confusion. With the 4th wife being crazy after witnessing a murder cause by her when she blurted out a secret when was drunk. Shows she’s not evil like 2nd wife cause 4th wife felt guilty and went insane. While 2nd wife took action against 3rd wife when she could have ignored, she looks kind but is very revengeful. And 1st wife just couldn’t be bothered. I love how they really went into each character personality on how the society treats them. The writer is a great storyteller in a way by it’s simple detailing says a lot about their characters & society are in. With director Zhang ways to directing, cinematography & natural acting skills by the actors. It’s really a splendid movie to watch & learn from.
Amazing analysis bro
Glad you think so!
I watched this with my fiance, who grew up in mainland China. She said it is a very realistic depiction of the pre-revolution era.
I'm flabbergasted at the idea that the movie is so Eastern that it's actually Western fetishism. It was made by Easterners, for Easterners, based on an Eastern book, accurately depicting Eastern architecture, clothing, and society in an era when they were less influenced by the West... And somehow people like me are still the villains? I don't know if I'm insulted or flattered at the attempts to shoehorn white males into being secretly responsible for everything. If it was Westernized, they would say it was whitewashing Eastern culture. The only Western things in the movie are the record player and the idea of a woman going to university (both of which are narrow bright spots in the story), and the idea that concubinage is bad (Christians were somewhat unique in their "one man, one woman" morality system...)
Rather than Western propaganda about how the East is evil and cruel, it is a Communist parable about how capitalism and class systems are evil and cruel. Capitalism causes people to sacrifice love for wealth, selling themselves as products ("robes" or farm animals versus humans).
I know you were just mentioning the criticism the movie had received, not necessarily agreeing with it.
@Keyboard Emperor This film addresses systemic oppressions by using the oppressions of women as narrative. And yet, even after watching this film, you still somehow come to the conclusion that this was somehow a better time? For who? The men? The audacity of some misogynists... If a lot of men in China are like you then I get why the divorce rate is so damn high haha.
That’s exactly where my mind went to after seeing this film for the first time. Without knowing any context on modern Chinese history, any one could come up with a thousand uncorrelated interpretation. The movie makes a very clear distinction between the rich and poor, serving as a commentary on social class. None of the women came from wealth. The master is the only man in the house who’s got everything to himself, and women are an expendable resource.
Great comment. The “criticism” that Zhang Yimou is an Orientalist is not just on its face laughably absurd but speaks much more to the cultural viciousness and hostility of narcissistic white Western progressives towards any narrative veering an iota from leftist orthodoxy. Truly they are the most loathsome and self-loathing creatures in the universe.
Have you ever seen Belladonna Of Sadness?
No, but having Googled it, I definitely should. Thanks for the tip.
@@hbkfilmmediadeptfilmsvideo4589 your welcome I'm not sure if your an anime fan but if you enjoyed this movie than Belladonna of sadness will be a treat for you
Your poor system microphone with hiss makes your fine analysis difficult to understand and follow.
This was recorded during the Covid lockdown with very limited resources.