I bought one in 1984 as my first new car. I still own it to this day with only 77k miles on it. White SE (similar to the one in the picture, but with a sunroof.) Mine was actually manufactured in October of 1983.
@williamsteele That was the car I learned about regional differences. 1986 iron Duke engine shipped to the Midwest only got 13 inch steal wheels. 5 speed manual had no speed control. Rebuilding the retractable headlights became a cottage industry
The parts bin aspect of it always blew me away. They used a lot of parts that already existed, usef on other cars, to build something that a lot of people thought was an attractive car without spending a lot of money
Christmas 1983 I got an about 1/16 scale New Bright remote control Fiero, everything opened and all the lights including the pop-up headlights worked. Guzzled batteries and light shone through the plastic "body" panels (including the backs of the headlights) but it was an awesome toy at age 9.
Sometimes I wish I could go back and experience my early 80s Christmases again. Atari, hot wheels, RC cars, small TV for my room, cassettes with my favorite music for my Walkman, etc, etc. I had a Richard Petty NASCAR RC car that was fun, and I took the rubber tires off the wheels so it would slide around on the kitchen floor (like it was supposed to at those speeds).
I rear-ended a Fiero on the way home in the mid 80's. The driver came out and was having a hissy-fit. I explained that I was fully insured and calmed him down. Helping him pick up at least 4 body panels, he explained to me he had just purchased the car that morning. Thanks
My wife fell in love with them. We subsequently bought an 88 model year. Must have been something wrong with it because everyone else was complaining of theirs breaking down and other reliability issues and that car lasted and lasted without any heavy duty issues. It was fun to drive and quick if not overall fast. I'm of the belief that GM cancelled that car too soon. With quality issues behind them and finally putting in a banger of an engine with that V6 and adding a special c-pillar design for the GT the car was hot.
Still have and drive my 1987 Pontiac Fiero. This was my first new car back in the day. The Fiero has always been a sharp looking car. I’m glad there are many people today that take an interest in them.❤
I remember a review of the GT saying how the heavier V6 reduced the ideal near 50/50 weight balance, something Toyota MR2 got around by adding a turbo.
I don’t believe they “rotated” the X car cradle 180 degrees to make the P car but rather brought it straight back to the rear of the vehicle. The drive belts are on the passenger side of both the front drive cars and the rear drive Fiero.
This is the 2nd time Adam has stated this incorrect fact. He also mentioned it in his 1st Fiero video, and was corrected by many in the comments. This 180-degree rumor has been around since the car was new. Adam, you are smarter than this! 😊
You are correct; the engine and its cradle were not turned around when placed in the Fiero. The difference is, on the Fiero, it has the rest of the car ahead of the engine instead of behind it. Water pump on the right, transmission on the left, etc. The other major issue with the video is the comment about the "Lotus" suspension. The '88 Fiero actually uses the original designed-by-Pontiac suspension design which was shelved for a few years in order to cut costs. The "Suspension by Lotus" rumor is exactly that - a rumor.
I always thought that the Oldsmobile Quad 4, that came out in 1987 would have been the best engine for the Fiero. Being a 4 cyl it would have been more compact than the 2.8 V6 and at 180 hp., it beat the 100 hp Iron Duke and the 150 hp V6. I suspect that, once again, GM was concerned that another division was threatening the Corvette.
The Quad4 looked good on paper, but because GM wouldn’t spring for balance shafts most people hated it in reality. So it would have turned the Fiero into a slightly faster tractor.
The Quad Four was a problematic engine in a number of ways. Of course it suffered the typical new engine reliability problems. But it also wasn't a very compact engine. The 60 degree V6 may have been a more compact engine. It also suffered from having a number of sub systems in none standard positions. GM tried putting them in a special run Pontiac model, only to discover that there was no way to remove the oil filter when it needed to be changed. I have a friend that spent a summer opening up the passenger side foot well and installing an access hatch to remove the oil filter. All those cars had white interiors, and the oil filter had to be passed through the passenger foot well to remove. I wonder how much warranty work GM did to replace stained carpet?
Me and my Mechanics teacher built an 88 GT. We use a 3.0L Pontiac Super Duty, with a DOHC head we got out of the US. It had Bosch mechanical fuel injection, with 4 throttle bodies, and a header that dumped in to 4 Supertrap mufflers to keep it quiet. We were pushing over 300HP at the rear wheels.
@@Glasscitycarnerd You see what's left of it every time you see one of the cab forward 90s Camaro/Firebirds. Coincidentally, there was a rare Camaro of that generation named the Callaway C8.
2:44. The early Fieros wouldn't have disappointed if Pontiac had been allowed to offer the Super Duty version of the 4 cylinder. I believe I've read about a 2.7 and a 3.0 they built, one of them produced 300 HP if memory serves me right. A magnesium block at one point. 🤘 hell yeah, Pontiac engineers could always do amazing things, if allowed to, with what they had to work with
Friend's dad built one with a 3.4 dohc engine/transmission out of a Z34 Lumina. Was a beast. Also built a 3.3 liter Camry/Solara powered 2nd gen MR2. Instilled a love of mid engined cars in me. Have a 914 and will own a Renault Alpine some day...
The Super Duty 4 is still an impressive engine even by today's standards. IIRC a detuned version was used in the actual Fiero pace car, and but was able to handle 500 HP out of the box.
@@HAL-dm1eh I know😂,in the 80s, it was like, GM told Pontiac : you're not building V8s anymore, and the Pontiac guys said, we're not just quitting as far as performance. (I've got a lot of old HPP mags)
@@marko7843 It was based on the Iron Duke 2.5L 4 that was in the original Fiero. It was an amazingly built block/head that accepted all original Iron Duke parts, but could rev to 10,000 rpm's with solid lifters, living all day at 8K. GM allowed Pontiac to put four of them in the actual Fiero pace cars (said to have around 232 hp), but GM then took and keeps those pace cars under tight wraps to this day, and wouldn't let Pontiac offer any in production vehicles. That amount of hp wasn't half of what the engine could do, and those Fieros still made jokes out of Chevy's 205 hp/5.7L front engine Corvettes. The blocks et al were subsequently produced and sold to racers and enthusiasts only, who happily paid top dollar for them and had lots of fun with turbos and nitrous, and some just building them to 200-300 hp in street Fieros. But the engines still remained rare and you'd be lucky to find one today.
The "fake black plastic" behind the doors that kind of looks like a window reminds me of the hatchback Mustang's from the late-80's. Those do have some actual light pass-through but a lot of that was just glass in front of the C-pillar.
Yep, as a Fox-body Mustang owner I came looking for this. There was actually glass back there but then a plastic sail panel to make the C-pillar look smaller than it was. On later versions the panel and window were one piece of glass.
A friend shoehorned a 350 ci Chevy engine into his. The biggest challenge - getting the wiring correct. Good looking car, but I always thought the wheel openings were too big. I like the way the angle of the leading edge of the C pillar (just past the 'glass') leads down to about where the rear axle is. Makes for a very balanced look. Thanks for posting.
I was an architect designer at the time of the Fero. Spandrel fake glass was extremely popular as a design detail on buildings, appliances etc. So the Fero with imitation glass was normal and popular as a design choice.
I currently own an 88 Duke and an 88 Formula. The fake glass plastic area behind the side glass DID HAVE A FUNCTION!... It was the fresh air exit vent for the HVAC system.
Owned one when they came out in '84. Had another one 10 years later. Just recently bought another with 47000 original miles, garage kept its whole life. Loved these cars
These were awesome! They came out in 1984 when I graduated from high school and I wanted one bad~! (Well, that and an '82 Toyota Supra....) Dad laid down three facts to me: 1. This was a brand new car and since my college was going to be expensive, a new car was out of the question. 2. This was a first year GM product and as such it would be more than good to STAY AWAY. Let others be the "guinea pigs" 3. The very last thing that a college kid needs is a two seat car. A college student needs a minivan or a station wagon, since they move around a lot. He was completely right. What did I buy in March of 1984? A Bali green '77 Volkswagen Rabbit two door. That really was the best car for me since it had tons of room and got 40 mpg on the highway. The 9.6 second 0-60 times were entertaining too, especially when I embarrassed my friends in their big American cars, even ones with (stock, or course) 455's! But I still loved the notion of a mid engine car, and in 2018 I traded my '85 Porsche 928S2 5 speed for a Guards Red '14 Cayman S. It is a fantastic car, runs mid 12 second quarter mile times, can go 178 mph, and gets 31 mpg on the highway courtesy of the 2976 pound curb weight. Honestly, the only thing I don't like about my red Cayman is the fact that I have nothing to tinker with; With the 928 there was always something non-essential to mess with and the engine was easy to access. Honestly? If I had the garage space I would buy another 928 or a Fiero or an early MR2 just to tinker with. Great video!
Adam, LOVE your channel but you are smarter than this! 😊 - Twin bumper pads are the obvious homage to Pontiac split grill. - Powertrain slid straight back, not 180 degrees. Trans & belts are on the same respective sides as FWD cars. You also mentioned this in your last Fiero video and people corrected it in the comments. - Lotus not involved in final year suspension design. It was Pontiac’s original 1983 design that was shelved by bean counters. These urban legends have been around since the car was new and have been debunked by the Fiero design team for decades. As evidence, there are speaking events, shows, videos, interviews, books, magazines, etc… Keep up the good work, just maybe correct these items on Fieros going forward. 🙂
I had a red 86 just like the one in the initial shots back in the high school, and I felt like I was driving a Ferrari. A very slow Ferrari, mine had the Iron Duke and auto. I'd love to have an 88 GT now.
My wife had the 84 just like your first picture. Comments: No power steering means she built up good arm strength. Bad in winter with wide tires it wouldn’t turn, just plow straight ahead. Beautifully designed. Red with the tan cloth interior. Unique feature I remember is the stereo speakers in each headrest. Engine overheating issue (the TPS) caused by a late change in the engine cover to address water intrusion and what GM considered as bad aesthetics of seeing thru the vents which ultimately caused us 4 or more TPS in just a few years time. No lemon law back then, but my wife just loved that car. (Pre-kids era). Got her an 8 passenger Safari van when kids came along! Thanks again for these great videos.
I had a new red '88 GT V6 auto & man was that thing fun to drive, like a go-kart! Only kept it 4 yrs & now regret selling it! Really love that yellow BMW 2002 in the background, my uncle had a blue '69 when I was still living in Bavaria Germany 1965-1975 ✌💖☮
Bought it brand new 1984 right out of showroom window. It got more thumbs up driving than anything I've owned. It was reliable but the iron Duke 4 wheezy and slow. Rode like a lumber truck. Heavy for small car but actually fun to drive
I got a job working as a file clerk for an engineering company that had the Fiero program back in 1983. This job led into a drafting apprentice position and then pivoted back and forth between design and engineering for 38 years. I will always love the Fiero for getting me my start.
@@RareClassicCars 989 Chicago Road, Troy Mi. Part of my job was runner (inter office mail) which allowed me to network. The owner, George Millidrag and lead Engineer Hulki Adachi were kind, funny and incredibly smart. Every Friday, after lunch I was also tasked with hitting the local bars to try and talk draftsmen to return to work. The amount of on the job drinking, gambling and drug use back in those days would be unbelievable by today's standards.
What is very interesting is that the transverse 4.9 Cadillac V8 from the 1986 Sedan Deville fits in the engine bay perfectly and even uses the same frame mounts as the 2.8 V6. Plus, the engine doesn't weigh much more than the 2.8 but the V8 transforms this car into a real Corvette performer.
So fun to drive one of these, had two back in the 90's. Little hedder wrap fixed the fire issue dunno why GM could not just do a recall and fix them but they didn't.
Thank you Adam. The 1990-1996 Grand Prix sedan especially in STE trim before 1997 did not have a split grille. The 1994-1995 Pontiac Bonneville did not have a split grille either. The Cadillac CT5 has black trim like that to make the c-pillar look thinner. Thank you for the video.
Many SUVs black out the B or C pillar to make it look like more glass area. The current Suburban has a blacked out aft door window frame to make the rear window look bigger, and the C-pillars look thinner.
I drove an early base model with the "Iron Duke" and a manual transmission. Its performance was on par with other small bore sports cars. I enjoyed driving it.
Loved my 88 Fiero I bought new off the lot in late 1989… nobody wanted them by then. It only had the 2.5 4cyl but the 5 speed made it a fun commuter car.
Thanks so much for doing this one! I was in middle-school in Detroit, MI when the Fiero debuted, and remember it clearly! Too bad that Hulki Aldikacti has passed on, it would have been great to interview him on this one. I can't wait to see more on the technical aspects. I love your channel!
I had 3 Fieros (not at the same time). I had an 86 w/2.5/5-speed, which I put 100k miles on. Sold that to a guy for $2500 plus another Fiero (an 85 w/2.5/4-Speed), which I sold to my cousin for $1000. Lastly, I picked a really nice 87 GT/Auto, which had a little scoop on that side air inlet. I never noticed any noise from those. I kinda wished I could have tried out a GT 5-speed (preferably an 88), but no joy. I never had any real issues with any of them. The 87 had a hard starting issue that I resolved with a new air inlet sensor.
Awesome. I remember as a teenager when the Fiero came out, I didn’t like the C pillar (the trim piece is great, I’m talking about the whole cut off angled look. I sat down and sketched out some ideas of how I thought it should look. My sketches ended up looking remarkably similar to the direction GM went with designing the GT version! But, here we are 40 years later and I prefer the original design, lol. Looks sharp without pretentiousness.
Fox body Mustangs did the same trick on the C-pillar. While it did have a window, it was tiny and the remaining portion was plastic on 79-86 and a glass panel on 87-93.
My parents live across the street from the Pontiac chief executive in charge of the program at the time. Was fortunate to be able to see all the Fiero prototypes and racing versions he brought home. Never wanted one, but they could have been awesome.
The comment about The black plastic imitating the look of black glass has another function also. At one end, it curves in and openings can be seen. These openings are for the interior flow through air ventilation system that all cars have these days. This car has no hatch and the interior ends at the back of the seats. This is where the air exits the car.
The refreshed 1988 and up Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera had a prominent piece of black trim in the C pillar instead of a rear quarter window. I thought you were going to mention that.
I had a flashback when the Alliance convertible came up. The first car I ever bought at 16 years old was a garnet red one with a tan top. Not actually a bad car just a little quirky. I had to either buy my own car or drive a truck my parents owned. That was a 1968 Chevy with a “3 on the tree” and no power steering. Actually, 34 years later, the truck is still around but the Renault is long gone!
I believe that GM called the composite body panels "enduroflex". It was funny hearing the Tech 4 powerhouse in these cars. You have to be careful when racking or jacking these cars due to the poorly protected coolant pipes that ran up to the front. The dealership I worked at had to replace the lines on occasion due to improper jacking by the owner.
A 1986 base model Fiero was my first new car, and one of only two vehicles I ever bought new. It was a wonderful car, and a whopper of a deal for the price. It looked like a Ferrari, and could be bought for under $10K OTD. Mine was gold metallic. 2.5L /5 speed. It was a base model with pretty much no options. It came with plastic wheel covers. Within the first year I had it, I got the 14" alloy wheels like the ones on that red one, and had the oem luggage rack installed on the rear lid. The Fiero was actually a very high quality car, the SMC body panels fit and lined up perfectly, due to the Space Frame design. The steering and suspension was nothing special, the front came from the Chevette, the rear suspension, along with the engine, transmission, and rear subframe came from the front wheel drive Chevy Citation, just flipped around. Driven as it was designed to be driven, as a commuter car, it was just fine. I kept that car for 9 years, and over 150,000 miles. I only got rid of it because I needed a vehicle with a rear seat. I never had a single problem with it. The interior was somewhat unique, it also looked like something you would find in an Italian exotic. It had a very high and wide center console, giving you the feeling you were in an aircraft of spaceship. It reminded me of the first generation Lotus Esprit Turbo. The gas tank was below that console, which was why it was so large. If you want pretty much all the information that is available on the Fiero, and its unique design, I suggest reading the book "Fiero: Pontiac's Potent Mid Engine Sports Car" by Gary Witzenburg.
I would say that the twin black horizontal pads on the front bumper are a "nod" to the split grill theme. Thanks for highlighting what really is an attractive and unique car!
The all-around rub strip bisecting the vehicle is also a Ferrari signature of the era. But GM can lay claim to it too, since the Stingray started the Corvette idea of a very strong character line dividing upper and lower body. I love that Pontiac designers incorporated the rub strip, both reflectors, the door handle, and the door lock in this line. I'm amazed more designers - old and new - don't try to consolidate/minimize the clutter like this. Well done. And the fake rear quarter window lives on in the Miata RF (targa) of today. Adam, I remember reading a while back there's a hidden bunker somewhere full of 1989 Fiero's that were produced then hidden when the program was cancelled. I have no idea if that's true. If anyone can find it, it's you!
My 1979 Ford Mustang (Fox body) had a similar trim behind the side windows. The Mustang’s version used a plastic matte black louvered piece as opposed to the Fiero’s glass like application. In later years, Ford changed this to more of a gloss, faux window like piece as in the Fiero. My first new car was a 79 Mustang and I recall being so impressed with those louvers. Although they didn’t serve a single functional purpose.
I had the 85 2m4 SE in silver. Aside from the lack of power, for a 6 foot driver the seats were too upright for real comfort, especially as low as the sitting position was, (Imagine a go cart), not the "fall into the car" sports car driving position. The fit and finish were typical for the time, pretty bad. My family also had a first year Citation. I recognize the dog bone engine support in both cars. As an "immobilizer" on the Fiero at least, I remember it was pretty easy to take with you the central distributor cable -if memory serves. We took it on several +100 mile road trips and had a lot of fun with it.
Test drove the first one to arrive at the dealership in Hanover PA & kept my Trans Am. Liked the Fiero ok but the seatbelt that I wasn't wearing at the time flapped in the wind with the window down & drove me nuts 😆!
Loved the fiery from the moment it came on the scene. Styling masterpiece inside and out and even 40 years later still looks modern. As a hs student when they came out, obviously couldn’t afford one, but now own a low mile 84 Indy Fiero for about 15 years now. Coming out of malaise Gm just didn’t have a proper sporting engine to equip the fiero. Thanks for helping to celebrate a great Pontiac achievement
I worked at Pontiac dealer as tech, when these were new. Absolute nightmare of problems. Cracked blocks, clutch failures, parking brake stuck,drive-ability issues, check engine lights, oil leaks trans problems. And of course the famous fire recall. I still have memories of all 12 bays in the shop with red Fieros on every lift. We would have so many apart at the same time, that we had to mark the boxes of disassembled engines with customers name. On a brighter side of things, it paid for my first house!
I worked in the design department of GM’s small car group. The most impressive part of the Fiero IMO was the drill/mill fixture that located all the panel fastener holes. The welded space frame was located in the fixture with a mix of datum’s and then all the holes were drilled and the surface around those holes were milled to provide a “pad” that the sheet molded compound panels rested on when mounted. Absolutely state of the art precision and repeatability. Also, since the body panels have little structural duty, the car allowed for rapid styling changes without any impact to the vehicle’s structural integrity. A great concept but watered down to satisfy the bean counters that ran things back then. Automotive companies should be managed by engineers and designers, not accountants…
I visited a Pontiac dealership when the Fiero first came out that had the most amazing seat covering. It was beautiful curly sheepskin in the center of the seat and back with a fabric/suede on the side. Now that is something I would like to see come back.
I was one of 2 Pontiac mechanics at a multiple brand dealership back in the late 80's-to the late 90's when we sold the brand. I still have nightmares...
1984 Indianapolis "500" Mile Race Pace Car...driven by John Callies, who worked for Pontiac Motor Division of GM for 21 years. His last 12 years with Pontiac was in the Pontiac Motor Sports section as manager. The Indy race pacing with the "Fiero" was, I guess, a challenge due to the engine size in the pace car. The front row of that "500" race had two out of three veteran drivers: Pole sitter, Tom Sneva; Rick Mears next to him, just "itchin' to get it on" and wondering: "Is this pace car fast enough to get out of our way at the start?" I was there at that race and thought, the pace car looks neat in style. (Rick Mears got that car among all his prizes and money...Wonder if he still has it after 40 years of winning the "500"?)
I worked a used car lot back in the 80's We had a 84 Fiero with a check engine light on. It cost me a large pizza to find out where the diagnostic connector was at. (You have to look it up for your self, or, I will tell you for a pizza!
Came here to say that. They kept the pre-facelift (2012-'14) XV50's doors but wanted to make it less obvious. Almost certainly the most widespread (in the sense of number produced) case of "DLO FAIL," to use Hagerty contributor Sajeev Mehta's term.
Pontiac similarly added a black plastic piece to the C-pillar of the 1989-1991 6000's (the very one shown in the video @2:20) when they gave it a less angular appearance.
I’m pretty sure the Camry is just black paint, not plastic. The black paint idea was used on the later GM A-bodies, and then much later, the Camry as you mention. It looked awful in both of those cases.
I loved these cars when I was a kid. I remember my aunt telling me they broke in half and would catch fire in a crash.... and me thinking, just don't crash it 😁 I'd still love to have an 88 GT at some point. Maybe a V8 Archie car.
I owned a 1982 S-10 pickup. It had the 2.8L V-6. It was relatively reliable, but was sorely lacking in HP. The engine blew a rod somewhere around 89,000 miles. I had a rebuilt one put in and it lasted till the rest of the truck rusted away and all the peripheral hydraulic lines, gas line, vacuum lines etc... all began leaking. 80's were not a good decade for GM vehicles generally speaking.
To my knowledge that black plastic trim was also used on the GM A-body 4 door sedan rooflines when they were all updated for 1989, except for the Celebrity. Black plastic trim replaced the small windows behind the rear doors
The first-generation Volt did something like that with black paint around the windows (and on the roof) to make the vehicle look more glassy than it actually was.
Would love to hear more about the Fiero: - The engineering problems with the shortened Iron Duke oil pan. - The crazy number of fires. - Getting killed because the redesign handled better than the Vette. - The last Pontiac produced in Pontiac.
Aw11 mr2's were like that. The whole rear subframe was a FWD Corolla crossmember with control arms and all. Tie rods were even there, they just didn't go to a steering rack lol
i was working at burns Pontiac in new jersey when it first came out as a entry level mechanic two years in. as i got experience and was a flat rate tech, there were many engines i replaced on them. but being a GM (goofy mothers) mechanic you did at least one engine a week on all the models and brands. during the malaise era. brand new transams were being pushed off the car carriers with rods sticking through the side of the blocks. unions were behind a lot of the car issues. across the shop my cousin was a honda tech. he never did engines. did mostly cash service work. and made money. at least if he did do engine work it wasnt warranty repair. hondas were mostly cash repairs. where you would make money on the flat rate hour. but Hondas was about every 2 months you did an engine. the fiero wasn't a bad car at the time they had over heating problems if you didnt change or when adding coolant correctly because the engine was in the rear and rad. was in the front. you opened the cap at the rad and added the coolant in the rear till it over flowed at the front then put the caps on. other that that there wasn't a lot going wrong. except the engine issues. the blocks they were leaking coolant. and catching fire. calling for a major campaign to replace the engine. i not soon after went to work for honda. a difference from day to night. i eventually got out of the car business but i enjoyed it. just no long term future
Always thought it was the competition to the Triumph TR my Dad had a car lot for 35yrs both the Feiro and Triumph would come back for repairs, mostly head gaskets.
12th gen (2008-14) F-150 (single cab only) also had the fake glass plastic thing too. You can see it on the Wikipedia article specifically for the 12th gen
Regarding the "fake" rear side windows - Ford used something similar on their 1979-86 Mustangs and Capris behind their rear side glass - they had fake louvers there, and on some trims this was painted black to help minimize the size of the C-pillars. Weirdly, on other trims it was body colored. BTW: My "dream" car is a 1985 Fiero 2M4/SE with a sunroof, and a Pontiac LT3 2.0L Turbo engine swap and a 5 speed manual. Someday, I'll make it!
I remember reading MT when the Fiero was launched. They explained that division in the black rub strip in the front was done as a nod to Pontiac's split grille.
Take a shot every time GM kneecaps a car because it might hypothetically compete with the Corvette..
Especially if it was Pontiac idea.
I tried this and am now blind please send help
Are you trying to get us killed? 🤣
@@sterlinsilver thats from masturbating too much
Take me drink, I think I'm home~
I bought one in 1984 as my first new car. I still own it to this day with only 77k miles on it. White SE (similar to the one in the picture, but with a sunroof.) Mine was actually manufactured in October of 1983.
Sir, love it like it's your wife. No, wait! NO, love it like it's you!
13 inch Rims????
@@2148aa No, mine is an SE, so it has the cast aluminum 14" wheels like the red one in the video.
@williamsteele That was the car I learned about regional differences. 1986 iron Duke engine shipped to the Midwest only got 13 inch steal wheels. 5 speed manual had no speed control. Rebuilding the retractable headlights became a cottage industry
when you die can I have it?
These were awesome. I remember when they came out.
The parts bin aspect of it always blew me away. They used a lot of parts that already existed, usef on other cars, to build something that a lot of people thought was an attractive car without spending a lot of money
I've owned an 87 Fiero GT for 15 years, it never fails to make me smile.
Christmas 1983 I got an about 1/16 scale New Bright remote control Fiero, everything opened and all the lights including the pop-up headlights worked. Guzzled batteries and light shone through the plastic "body" panels (including the backs of the headlights) but it was an awesome toy at age 9.
Sometimes I wish I could go back and experience my early 80s Christmases again. Atari, hot wheels, RC cars, small TV for my room, cassettes with my favorite music for my Walkman, etc, etc.
I had a Richard Petty NASCAR RC car that was fun, and I took the rubber tires off the wheels so it would slide around on the kitchen floor (like it was supposed to at those speeds).
Cancelled just after GM sorted it out. Looked the business.
That seems like GM's operational doctrine.
"Sir we fixed the auto-ignition issue"
"Good, now CANCEL IT"
GM being GM.
Typical GM, dropping cars the year they become ‘right’
Typical of GM, unfortunately.
I rear-ended a Fiero on the way home in the mid 80's. The driver came out and was having a hissy-fit. I explained that I was fully insured and calmed him down.
Helping him pick up at least 4 body panels, he explained to me he had just purchased the car that morning.
Thanks
I don't blame him either , he had a right to have a dummy spit !
Catching fire 🔥 will dwindle sales !
First model year only and it didn’t happen often.
My wife fell in love with them. We subsequently bought an 88 model year. Must have been something wrong with it because everyone else was complaining of theirs breaking down and other reliability issues and that car lasted and lasted without any heavy duty issues. It was fun to drive and quick if not overall fast. I'm of the belief that GM cancelled that car too soon. With quality issues behind them and finally putting in a banger of an engine with that V6 and adding a special c-pillar design for the GT the car was hot.
Still have and drive my 1987 Pontiac Fiero. This was my first new car back in the day. The Fiero has always been a sharp looking car. I’m glad there are many people today that take an interest in them.❤
Those are still some of my favorite wheels.
Once they got them sorted out they were very good cars but once they sorted them out they discontinued them.
GM did that to soooo many cars.
I remember a review of the GT saying how the heavier V6 reduced the ideal near 50/50 weight balance, something Toyota MR2 got around by adding a turbo.
I don’t believe they “rotated” the X car cradle 180 degrees to make the P car but rather brought it straight back to the rear of the vehicle. The drive belts are on the passenger side of both the front drive cars and the rear drive Fiero.
That's right. Not rotated, straight back.
That's what I was thinking, because rotating it would have required a different transmission.
This is the 2nd time Adam has stated this incorrect fact. He also mentioned it in his 1st Fiero video, and was corrected by many in the comments. This 180-degree rumor has been around since the car was new.
Adam, you are smarter than this! 😊
Agree
You are correct; the engine and its cradle were not turned around when placed in the Fiero. The difference is, on the Fiero, it has the rest of the car ahead of the engine instead of behind it. Water pump on the right, transmission on the left, etc. The other major issue with the video is the comment about the "Lotus" suspension. The '88 Fiero actually uses the original designed-by-Pontiac suspension design which was shelved for a few years in order to cut costs. The "Suspension by Lotus" rumor is exactly that - a rumor.
I always thought that the Oldsmobile Quad 4, that came out in 1987 would have been the best engine for the Fiero. Being a 4 cyl it would have been more compact than the 2.8 V6 and at 180 hp., it beat the 100 hp Iron Duke and the 150 hp V6. I suspect that, once again, GM was concerned that another division was threatening the Corvette.
Sales just went down. It was time to move on. That’s all.
@@HunterB738 Toyota MR2 more or less killed Fiero...when people notice how much better MR2 was.
The Quad4 looked good on paper, but because GM wouldn’t spring for balance shafts most people hated it in reality. So it would have turned the Fiero into a slightly faster tractor.
hell yea, my brother had a Grand Am GT with the Quad 4 & it was a reat little runner
The Quad Four was a problematic engine in a number of ways. Of course it suffered the typical new engine reliability problems. But it also wasn't a very compact engine. The 60 degree V6 may have been a more compact engine. It also suffered from having a number of sub systems in none standard positions. GM tried putting them in a special run Pontiac model, only to discover that there was no way to remove the oil filter when it needed to be changed. I have a friend that spent a summer opening up the passenger side foot well and installing an access hatch to remove the oil filter. All those cars had white interiors, and the oil filter had to be passed through the passenger foot well to remove. I wonder how much warranty work GM did to replace stained carpet?
C8 Corvette also has a fake plastic piece mimicking glass although much smaller. Miata hard top also has the same.
Me and my Mechanics teacher built an 88 GT. We use a 3.0L Pontiac Super Duty, with a DOHC head we got out of the US. It had Bosch mechanical fuel injection, with 4 throttle bodies, and a header that dumped in to 4 Supertrap mufflers to keep it quiet. We were pushing over 300HP at the rear wheels.
@@cmdrclassified Sounds wicked
The rear trim idea is still being used on my C8. It works!
You mean 2nd gen Fiero.
@jeffmellow kinda sorta!
@@jeffmellow actually there WAS a second gen Fiero, but they never built it. Good subject for a video…….😉😂
@@Glasscitycarnerd You see what's left of it every time you see one of the cab forward 90s Camaro/Firebirds. Coincidentally, there was a rare Camaro of that generation named the Callaway C8.
2:44. The early Fieros wouldn't have disappointed if Pontiac had been allowed to offer the Super Duty version of the 4 cylinder. I believe I've read about a 2.7 and a 3.0 they built, one of them produced 300 HP if memory serves me right. A magnesium block at one point. 🤘 hell yeah, Pontiac engineers could always do amazing things, if allowed to, with what they had to work with
Friend's dad built one with a 3.4 dohc engine/transmission out of a Z34 Lumina. Was a beast. Also built a 3.3 liter Camry/Solara powered 2nd gen MR2.
Instilled a love of mid engined cars in me. Have a 914 and will own a Renault Alpine some day...
The Super Duty 4 is still an impressive engine even by today's standards. IIRC a detuned version was used in the actual Fiero pace car, and but was able to handle 500 HP out of the box.
@@HAL-dm1eh I know😂,in the 80s, it was like, GM told Pontiac : you're not building V8s anymore, and the Pontiac guys said, we're not just quitting as far as performance. (I've got a lot of old HPP mags)
I've never even heard of a super duty 4... What was it based on?
@@marko7843 It was based on the Iron Duke 2.5L 4 that was in the original Fiero. It was an amazingly built block/head that accepted all original Iron Duke parts, but could rev to 10,000 rpm's with solid lifters, living all day at 8K.
GM allowed Pontiac to put four of them in the actual Fiero pace cars (said to have around 232 hp), but GM then took and keeps those pace cars under tight wraps to this day, and wouldn't let Pontiac offer any in production vehicles.
That amount of hp wasn't half of what the engine could do, and those Fieros still made jokes out of Chevy's 205 hp/5.7L front engine Corvettes.
The blocks et al were subsequently produced and sold to racers and enthusiasts only, who happily paid top dollar for them and had lots of fun with turbos and nitrous, and some just building them to 200-300 hp in street Fieros.
But the engines still remained rare and you'd be lucky to find one today.
I had one for several years and loved it. The power was definitely the biggest complaint. And only one i can think of
The "fake black plastic" behind the doors that kind of looks like a window reminds me of the hatchback Mustang's from the late-80's. Those do have some actual light pass-through but a lot of that was just glass in front of the C-pillar.
I came here to say the same thing. Also the earlier fox-body Mustangs had fake louvers prior to the black glass.
Fun fact: That "black plastic trim" triangle was made of actual glass on the '84 models.
And plenty of hood scoops back in the day were completely non-functiinal. Lots of trim in cars is used to improve the look.
Yep, as a Fox-body Mustang owner I came looking for this. There was actually glass back there but then a plastic sail panel to make the C-pillar look smaller than it was. On later versions the panel and window were one piece of glass.
@@jamesalexander5246 Fake vents are back in style. The Civic is one of the worst offenders.
A friend shoehorned a 350 ci Chevy engine into his. The biggest challenge - getting the wiring correct. Good looking car, but I always thought the wheel openings were too big. I like the way the angle of the leading edge of the C pillar (just past the 'glass') leads down to about where the rear axle is. Makes for a very balanced look. Thanks for posting.
I was an architect designer at the time of the Fero. Spandrel fake glass was extremely popular as a design detail on buildings, appliances etc. So the Fero with imitation glass was normal and popular as a design choice.
I currently own an 88 Duke and an 88 Formula. The fake glass plastic area behind the side glass DID HAVE A FUNCTION!... It was the fresh air exit vent for the HVAC system.
Owned one when they came out in '84. Had another one 10 years later. Just recently bought another with 47000 original miles, garage kept its whole life. Loved these cars
These were awesome! They came out in 1984 when I graduated from high school and I wanted one bad~!
(Well, that and an '82 Toyota Supra....)
Dad laid down three facts to me: 1. This was a brand new car and since my college was going to be expensive, a new car was out of the question. 2. This was a first year GM product and as such it would be more than good to STAY AWAY. Let others be the "guinea pigs" 3. The very last thing that a college kid needs is a two seat car. A college student needs a minivan or a station wagon, since they move around a lot. He was completely right.
What did I buy in March of 1984? A Bali green '77 Volkswagen Rabbit two door. That really was the best car for me since it had tons of room and got 40 mpg on the highway. The 9.6 second 0-60 times were entertaining too, especially when I embarrassed my friends in their big American cars, even ones with (stock, or course) 455's!
But I still loved the notion of a mid engine car, and in 2018 I traded my '85 Porsche 928S2 5 speed for a Guards Red '14 Cayman S. It is a fantastic car, runs mid 12 second quarter mile times, can go 178 mph, and gets 31 mpg on the highway courtesy of the 2976 pound curb weight. Honestly, the only thing I don't like about my red Cayman is the fact that I have nothing to tinker with; With the 928 there was always something non-essential to mess with and the engine was easy to access. Honestly? If I had the garage space I would buy another 928 or a Fiero or an early MR2 just to tinker with.
Great video!
Adam, LOVE your channel but you are smarter than this! 😊
- Twin bumper pads are the obvious homage to Pontiac split grill.
- Powertrain slid straight back, not 180 degrees. Trans & belts are on the same respective sides as FWD cars. You also mentioned this in your last Fiero video and people corrected it in the comments.
- Lotus not involved in final year suspension design. It was Pontiac’s original 1983 design that was shelved by bean counters.
These urban legends have been around since the car was new and have been debunked by the Fiero design team for decades. As evidence, there are speaking events, shows, videos, interviews, books, magazines, etc…
Keep up the good work, just maybe correct these items on Fieros going forward. 🙂
I had a red 86 just like the one in the initial shots back in the high school, and I felt like I was driving a Ferrari. A very slow Ferrari, mine had the Iron Duke and auto. I'd love to have an 88 GT now.
My wife had the 84 just like your first picture. Comments: No power steering means she built up good arm strength. Bad in winter with wide tires it wouldn’t turn, just plow straight ahead. Beautifully designed. Red with the tan cloth interior. Unique feature I remember is the stereo speakers in each headrest. Engine overheating issue (the TPS) caused by a late change in the engine cover to address water intrusion and what GM considered as bad aesthetics of seeing thru the vents which ultimately caused us 4 or more TPS in just a few years time. No lemon law back then, but my wife just loved that car. (Pre-kids era). Got her an 8 passenger Safari van when kids came along! Thanks again for these great videos.
I had a new red '88 GT V6 auto & man was that thing fun to drive, like a go-kart! Only kept it 4 yrs & now regret selling it! Really love that yellow BMW 2002 in the background, my uncle had a blue '69 when I was still living in Bavaria Germany 1965-1975 ✌💖☮
I like how the strip becomes the door handle.
Bought it brand new 1984 right out of showroom window. It got more thumbs up driving than anything I've owned. It was reliable but the iron Duke 4 wheezy and slow. Rode like a lumber truck. Heavy for small car but actually fun to drive
my sister had a red four-banger with the iron duke and it was a blast to drive
Don’t believe I’d have told that😆
@@garysarratt1 see what you did there. hahaha
I got a job working as a file clerk for an engineering company that had the Fiero program back in 1983. This job led into a drafting apprentice position and then pivoted back and forth between design and engineering for 38 years. I will always love the Fiero for getting me my start.
Entech?
@@RareClassicCars 989 Chicago Road, Troy Mi. Part of my job was runner (inter office mail) which allowed me to network. The owner, George Millidrag and lead Engineer Hulki Adachi were kind, funny and incredibly smart. Every Friday, after lunch I was also tasked with hitting the local bars to try and talk draftsmen to return to work. The amount of on the job drinking, gambling and drug use back in those days would be unbelievable by today's standards.
What is very interesting is that the transverse 4.9 Cadillac V8 from the 1986 Sedan Deville fits in the engine bay perfectly and even uses the same frame mounts as the 2.8 V6. Plus, the engine doesn't weigh much more than the 2.8 but the V8 transforms this car into a real Corvette performer.
2 in one day!? The man is a machine!
I had a 1985 Fiero with a 5 speed. I loved it.
So fun to drive one of these, had two back in the 90's. Little hedder wrap fixed the fire issue dunno why GM could not just do a recall and fix them but they didn't.
Thank you Adam. The 1990-1996 Grand Prix sedan especially in STE trim before 1997 did not have a split grille. The 1994-1995 Pontiac Bonneville did not have a split grille either. The Cadillac CT5 has black trim like that to make the c-pillar look thinner. Thank you for the video.
Yes, I was going to mention the CT5 as well
Many SUVs black out the B or C pillar to make it look like more glass area. The current Suburban has a blacked out aft door window frame to make the rear window look bigger, and the C-pillars look thinner.
I loved my 85 V6 SE Fiero loaded with a 4spd in silver. She was a sweet ride for the day
“Reliability” has never been an adjective associated with Renault in general.
My 86GT was my first car in 2012. Still have it. I love that car.
I actually swapped in power 987 seats into it.
I drove an early base model with the "Iron Duke" and a manual transmission. Its performance was on par with other small bore sports cars. I enjoyed driving it.
The 1994 Impala SS had a black trim piece over the lower back corner of the rear window to give it a sleeker look.
Loved my 88 Fiero I bought new off the lot in late 1989… nobody wanted them by then. It only had the 2.5 4cyl but the 5 speed made it a fun commuter car.
My dad had an ‘85 and I got to drive it quite a few times. It was a FUN car to drive. Not fast…but cornering was a blast!
I had the '85' 2m6 model in black. Loved car, wish I still had it
Thanks so much for doing this one! I was in middle-school in Detroit, MI when the Fiero debuted, and remember it clearly! Too bad that Hulki Aldikacti has passed on, it would have been great to interview him on this one. I can't wait to see more on the technical aspects. I love your channel!
Adam may have missed the chance, but Hulki had spoken at many national Fiero events over the years. ruclips.net/video/-DbRHF1FBSE/видео.html
I had 3 Fieros (not at the same time). I had an 86 w/2.5/5-speed, which I put 100k miles on. Sold that to a guy for $2500 plus another Fiero (an 85 w/2.5/4-Speed), which I sold to my cousin for $1000. Lastly, I picked a really nice 87 GT/Auto, which had a little scoop on that side air inlet. I never noticed any noise from those. I kinda wished I could have tried out a GT 5-speed (preferably an 88), but no joy.
I never had any real issues with any of them. The 87 had a hard starting issue that I resolved with a new air inlet sensor.
Awesome. I remember as a teenager when the Fiero came out, I didn’t like the C pillar (the trim piece is great, I’m talking about the whole cut off angled look. I sat down and sketched out some ideas of how I thought it should look. My sketches ended up looking remarkably similar to the direction GM went with designing the GT version! But, here we are 40 years later and I prefer the original design, lol. Looks sharp without pretentiousness.
Fox body Mustangs did the same trick on the C-pillar. While it did have a window, it was tiny and the remaining portion was plastic on 79-86 and a glass panel on 87-93.
Wasn't enthusiastic about them at the time ... but time has made them awesome.
My parents live across the street from the Pontiac chief executive in charge of the program at the time. Was fortunate to be able to see all the Fiero prototypes and racing versions he brought home. Never wanted one, but they could have been awesome.
The comment about The black plastic imitating the look of black glass has another function also. At one end, it curves in and openings can be seen. These openings are for the interior flow through air ventilation system that all cars have these days. This car has no hatch and the interior ends at the back of the seats. This is where the air exits the car.
The refreshed 1988 and up Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera had a prominent piece of black trim in the C pillar instead of a rear quarter window. I thought you were going to mention that.
I had a flashback when the Alliance convertible came up. The first car I ever bought at 16 years old was a garnet red one with a tan top. Not actually a bad car just a little quirky. I had to either buy my own car or drive a truck my parents owned. That was a 1968 Chevy with a “3 on the tree” and no power steering. Actually, 34 years later, the truck is still around but the Renault is long gone!
We all need to learn painful lessons when we are young with the hope we will put them to use in our maturity. 😉
I've had a few Fieros. Mine were pretty reliable cars. Fun to drive.
I believe that GM called the composite body panels "enduroflex". It was funny hearing the Tech 4 powerhouse in these cars. You have to be careful when racking or jacking these cars due to the poorly protected coolant pipes that ran up to the front. The dealership I worked at had to replace the lines on occasion due to improper jacking by the owner.
A 1986 base model Fiero was my first new car, and one of only two vehicles I ever bought new. It was a wonderful car, and a whopper of a deal for the price. It looked like a Ferrari, and could be bought for under $10K OTD. Mine was gold metallic. 2.5L /5 speed. It was a base model with pretty much no options. It came with plastic wheel covers. Within the first year I had it, I got the 14" alloy wheels like the ones on that red one, and had the oem luggage rack installed on the rear lid. The Fiero was actually a very high quality car, the SMC body panels fit and lined up perfectly, due to the Space Frame design. The steering and suspension was nothing special, the front came from the Chevette, the rear suspension, along with the engine, transmission, and rear subframe came from the front wheel drive Chevy Citation, just flipped around. Driven as it was designed to be driven, as a commuter car, it was just fine. I kept that car for 9 years, and over 150,000 miles. I only got rid of it because I needed a vehicle with a rear seat. I never had a single problem with it. The interior was somewhat unique, it also looked like something you would find in an Italian exotic. It had a very high and wide center console, giving you the feeling you were in an aircraft of spaceship. It reminded me of the first generation Lotus Esprit Turbo. The gas tank was below that console, which was why it was so large. If you want pretty much all the information that is available on the Fiero, and its unique design, I suggest reading the book "Fiero: Pontiac's Potent Mid Engine Sports Car" by Gary Witzenburg.
I would say that the twin black horizontal pads on the front bumper are a "nod" to the split grill theme. Thanks for highlighting what really is an attractive and unique car!
Right on time, I just bought one last week!
The all-around rub strip bisecting the vehicle is also a Ferrari signature of the era. But GM can lay claim to it too, since the Stingray started the Corvette idea of a very strong character line dividing upper and lower body.
I love that Pontiac designers incorporated the rub strip, both reflectors, the door handle, and the door lock in this line. I'm amazed more designers - old and new - don't try to consolidate/minimize the clutter like this. Well done.
And the fake rear quarter window lives on in the Miata RF (targa) of today.
Adam, I remember reading a while back there's a hidden bunker somewhere full of 1989 Fiero's that were produced then hidden when the program was cancelled. I have no idea if that's true. If anyone can find it, it's you!
You had an 88 Fiero gt! I also had an 88 Fiero GT! Such a fun little car to own and drive
A former boss had a 1985 or 1986 GT with a 4-speed manual. It was a lot of fun to drive, so quick!
Miata ND retractable hardtop as well
My Dad bought one of these new when they first came out. I was a kid and loved riding in that car.
There cant be too many nice ones around with the 6 cyl , collectability wise thinking a fun entry level car that appreciates in value { maybe } 🤔.
My 1979 Ford Mustang (Fox body) had a similar trim behind the side windows. The Mustang’s version used a plastic matte black louvered piece as opposed to the Fiero’s glass like application. In later years, Ford changed this to more of a gloss, faux window like piece as in the Fiero. My first new car was a 79 Mustang and I recall being so impressed with those louvers. Although they didn’t serve a single functional purpose.
I had the 85 2m4 SE in silver. Aside from the lack of power, for a 6 foot driver the seats were too upright for real comfort, especially as low as the sitting position was, (Imagine a go cart), not the "fall into the car" sports car driving position. The fit and finish were typical for the time, pretty bad. My family also had a first year Citation. I recognize the dog bone engine support in both cars. As an "immobilizer" on the Fiero at least, I remember it was pretty easy to take with you the central distributor cable -if memory serves. We took it on several +100 mile road trips and had a lot of fun with it.
6:40 It's commonly called a sail panel, because it looks like a sail on a ship. The 84's had glass ones, later years were plastic.
I call this the “mother” of the C8 corvette
I wanted one of these so badly when they were new.
Test drove the first one to arrive at the dealership in Hanover PA & kept my Trans Am. Liked the Fiero ok but the seatbelt that I wasn't wearing at the time flapped in the wind with the window down & drove me nuts 😆!
Loved the fiery from the moment it came on the scene. Styling masterpiece inside and out and even 40 years later still looks modern. As a hs student when they came out, obviously couldn’t afford one, but now own a low mile 84 Indy Fiero for about 15 years now. Coming out of malaise Gm just didn’t have a proper sporting engine to equip the fiero. Thanks for helping to celebrate a great Pontiac achievement
I worked at Pontiac dealer as tech, when these were new. Absolute nightmare of problems. Cracked blocks, clutch failures, parking brake stuck,drive-ability issues, check engine lights, oil leaks trans problems. And of course the famous fire recall. I still have memories of all 12 bays in the shop with red Fieros on every lift. We would have so many apart at the same time, that we had to mark the boxes of disassembled engines with customers name. On a brighter side of things, it paid for my first house!
I worked in the design department of GM’s small car group. The most impressive part of the Fiero IMO was the drill/mill fixture that located all the panel fastener holes. The welded space frame was located in the fixture with a mix of datum’s and then all the holes were drilled and the surface around those holes were milled to provide a “pad” that the sheet molded compound panels rested on when mounted. Absolutely state of the art precision and repeatability. Also, since the body panels have little structural duty, the car allowed for rapid styling changes without any impact to the vehicle’s structural integrity. A great concept but watered down to satisfy the bean counters that ran things back then.
Automotive companies should be managed by engineers and designers, not accountants…
I visited a Pontiac dealership when the Fiero first came out that had the most amazing seat covering. It was beautiful curly sheepskin in the center of the seat and back with a fabric/suede on the side. Now that is something I would like to see come back.
I was one of 2 Pontiac mechanics at a multiple brand dealership back in the late 80's-to the late 90's when we sold the brand. I still have nightmares...
Me too!! What a pile these were. Did pay for my first house!
I got an 85 Fiero with a carseat in the middle broken down on the interstate. I'm a lowlife and I'm lovin' it.....
1984 Indianapolis "500" Mile Race Pace Car...driven by John Callies, who worked for Pontiac Motor Division of GM for 21 years. His last 12 years with Pontiac was in the Pontiac Motor Sports section as manager.
The Indy race pacing with the "Fiero" was, I guess, a challenge due to the engine size in the pace car. The front row of that "500" race had two out of three veteran drivers: Pole sitter, Tom Sneva; Rick Mears next to him, just "itchin' to get it on" and wondering: "Is this pace car fast enough to get out of our way at the start?"
I was there at that race and thought, the pace car looks neat in style. (Rick Mears got that car among all his prizes and money...Wonder if he still has it after 40 years of winning the "500"?)
I worked a used car lot back in the 80's We had a 84 Fiero with a check engine light on. It cost me a large pizza to find out where the diagnostic connector was at. (You have to look it up for your self, or, I will tell you for a pizza!
Under ashtray or cigar lighter panel within centre console.
Interesting 🧐
I know where it is.... What a PIA to plug in the scanner!
The 2015 Toyota Camry has similar black plastic trim to mask the shape/size of the c-pillar.
Came here to say that. They kept the pre-facelift (2012-'14) XV50's doors but wanted to make it less obvious. Almost certainly the most widespread (in the sense of number produced) case of "DLO FAIL," to use Hagerty contributor Sajeev Mehta's term.
@@tomanderson6335I had forgotten all about DLO fail. Good call out!
Pontiac similarly added a black plastic piece to the C-pillar of the 1989-1991 6000's (the very one shown in the video @2:20) when they gave it a less angular appearance.
I’m pretty sure the Camry is just black paint, not plastic. The black paint idea was used on the later GM A-bodies, and then much later, the Camry as you mention. It looked awful in both of those cases.
Love this video. Very informative. I have mine ('84 black SE) on Hemmings right now if you want to see a nice, low mileage example. Thanks.
I loved these cars when I was a kid. I remember my aunt telling me they broke in half and would catch fire in a crash.... and me thinking, just don't crash it 😁 I'd still love to have an 88 GT at some point. Maybe a V8 Archie car.
The 1987-93 Mustang also used that C pillar black out. Sort of. The window had a sizeable blacked out area to make that C pillar look smaller.
I owned a 1982 S-10 pickup. It had the 2.8L V-6. It was relatively reliable, but was sorely lacking in HP. The engine blew a rod somewhere around 89,000 miles. I had a rebuilt one put in and it lasted till the rest of the truck rusted away and all the peripheral hydraulic lines, gas line, vacuum lines etc... all began leaking. 80's were not a good decade for GM vehicles generally speaking.
GM did that plastic glass imitation here in Europe too. Opel Rekord E2 has that on C-pillar to look more classy.
To my knowledge that black plastic trim was also used on the GM A-body 4 door sedan rooflines when they were all updated for 1989, except for the Celebrity. Black plastic trim replaced the small windows behind the rear doors
The first-generation Volt did something like that with black paint around the windows (and on the roof) to make the vehicle look more glassy than it actually was.
The 2017 Opel Insignia/Buick Regal also has a black panel.
Would love to hear more about the Fiero:
- The engineering problems with the shortened Iron Duke oil pan.
- The crazy number of fires.
- Getting killed because the redesign handled better than the Vette.
- The last Pontiac produced in Pontiac.
Aw11 mr2's were like that. The whole rear subframe was a FWD Corolla crossmember with control arms and all. Tie rods were even there, they just didn't go to a steering rack lol
I loved that car!
i was working at burns Pontiac in new jersey when it first came out as a entry level mechanic two years in. as i got experience and was a flat rate tech, there were many engines i replaced on them. but being a GM (goofy mothers) mechanic you did at least one engine a week on all the models and brands. during the malaise era. brand new transams were being pushed off the car carriers with rods sticking through the side of the blocks. unions were behind a lot of the car issues. across the shop my cousin was a honda tech. he never did engines. did mostly cash service work. and made money. at least if he did do engine work it wasnt warranty repair. hondas were mostly cash repairs. where you would make money on the flat rate hour. but Hondas was about every 2 months you did an engine. the fiero wasn't a bad car at the time they had over heating problems if you didnt change or when adding coolant correctly because the engine was in the rear and rad. was in the front. you opened the cap at the rad and added the coolant in the rear till it over flowed at the front then put the caps on. other that that there wasn't a lot going wrong. except the engine issues. the blocks they were leaking coolant. and catching fire. calling for a major campaign to replace the engine. i not soon after went to work for honda. a difference from day to night. i eventually got out of the car business but i enjoyed it. just no long term future
I've seen recent Toyota Camrys that gave a piece of black trim that makes the shape of the rear door / fixed window look bigger.
Always thought it was the competition to the Triumph TR my Dad had a car lot for 35yrs both the Feiro and Triumph would come back for repairs, mostly head gaskets.
12th gen (2008-14) F-150 (single cab only) also had the fake glass plastic thing too. You can see it on the Wikipedia article specifically for the 12th gen
Regarding the "fake" rear side windows - Ford used something similar on their 1979-86 Mustangs and Capris behind their rear side glass - they had fake louvers there, and on some trims this was painted black to help minimize the size of the C-pillars. Weirdly, on other trims it was body colored.
BTW: My "dream" car is a 1985 Fiero 2M4/SE with a sunroof, and a Pontiac LT3 2.0L Turbo engine swap and a 5 speed manual. Someday, I'll make it!
the '84 model year as shown had the best front in end add the fast back of the later years and the design is nearly perfect.
I remember reading MT when the Fiero was launched. They explained that division in the black rub strip in the front was done as a nod to Pontiac's split grille.