well done Scroft, you have brought the tension within the storyline to a peak and kept it going. The reality you have created with George, Beanie, Keith and tthe other characters is worthy of any maintream tv program. I have never watched 200+ episodes of anything before and yet I still look forward with anticipation to the next episode. Brilliant writing in my opinion
Definitely think that David was with Tim when they set fire to the shed as David would know where the cameras are positioned. Well done Scroft for telling the useless copper off and well done for keeping on with the farming work, showing them that they won't beat you. Another amazing Scroft.
Thanks, Michael! Appreciate the support, mate. It’s all about keeping things moving and not letting anything stop the work. Glad you’re enjoying it, and your kind words mean a lot. I’ll keep doing my best!
Crazy how one guy making up voices in his room can send emotions through a screen to thousands of people. Absolute love this series. Keep up the amazing work Scroft 👏
I love how close George and Ross have become. Scroft called it. Said they would become besties. I knew the fire would come. Didn't want to say anything. I also think David is in on it. He would know where the cameras are. Who would be better at scoping out security measures? Glad Scroft told him to scram. Probably not the best idea to tell him he knew Tim was there. Now they might all go into the wind and they'll never get proof. And it's about time Scroft let the guys know that Beanie is in on it, and she's on their side. One for all and all for one!
Well scroft and all. That was extraordinary what an episode. That david is as bent as they get he is a wrong un scroft. Beanie is the commander and chief.and the hub of it all. Keep it up mate. Cant wait for the next one
Thanks so much, mate. It means a lot to hear that the episode had such an impact, though I’m sorry to hear it brought on the tears! Fingers crossed for Keith, and I really appreciate you both watching and supporting the series.
Great episode Scroft and beanie emotions running high and low glad you all are in the plan together Scroft check out police equipment supply stores they should have a remote car that silent even with a camera on it glad you told David off know he is in on it somehow glad George is doing better hate to see a man down like that BE CAREFUL AND PRAYING 🙏 FOR KEITH
WOW! I have watched from the first video to this point of farm hand. This has been the best of all the farm sims roll play on the tube. I know everyone that watches will agree with my statement. Thank you for the hours of dedication to create this content. It is my hope and wish that you can keep going strong and maybe just maybe roll it over to farm sim 25. From the bottom of my heart thank you Scroft
Super Episode, Beanie shows, she is a strong and fine lady. She put her weigth in the Farmingbusines. I think she have realised Farming is Familybusines. Now it paid off that you Scroft was honset with her. She jumped in your boat and pull in the same direction and you can be proud of your self, because you have mentaly grown so much. You take on so much tasks to keep Georg stabil. I appreciated how you kicked out this lazzy donutkiller in uniform. Men like him achieve absolut nothing. They cowardly hide behind their regulations. I hope you idea'll work and you catch this dirty bastards. Wish you good luck.
I’ll say it again and again. Your talent really is on another level. Not once has this series felt boring. The suspense during these kind of storylines versus the fun on the more laidback episodes is just perfect.
Scroft you have done it again bud what a excellent episode tonight with everyone pulling together to help George and Keith to show the T.I.M.That your not stopping the farm work for nothing and nice one scroft for telling that DAVID what for as you and George were right he has done nothing to help you in everything that has went on with the farm and the people involved i don't think he is a copper i think he is part of the T.I.M. ........ keep up the excellent and quality work u put into all vids and episodes of the farm hand and keep the gr8 cliffhangers coming aswell as us viewers keep watching the vids and this series excellent work again scroft bud.......❤#prayforkeith....🙏👍🏻👍🏻🤟
Cheers, Paul! I’m glad you enjoyed the episode, mate. It’s all about sticking together, and George and Keith needed that support. As for David, you’re spot on - something’s off with him, and we’ll have to see how it unfolds. Your support and kind words mean the world, and I’ll definitely keep those cliffhangers coming! Thanks again, mate
this was such a good one and im slowly starting to get the bad feeling that our police officer is involved somehow somethign aint right at least you told him off Scroft in a good beeping tone serves him right cant wait for the next wpsiode
I can't wait for Tim and his friend, who is probably David, to get their comeuppance. Are we now seeing the reason that Scroft, George, and Beanie leave Court Farms? I can't wait to see how this all plays out. You have had me on the edge of my seat for weeks now with all of this T.I.M. stuff. Great episode as always Scroft. You are one in a million.
Hey Scroft such an emotional episode, praying for Keith he's got to pull through such a big part of the series. Well done for sticking it to David he's definitely no good. My Grandson Caleb has been playing catch-up he's hooked on the series now He's 11 and I think he's messaged you, he's on FS playing court farm now all inspired by you, well done mate.
Thanks, Andrew! Really appreciate the kind words, mate. Glad to hear Caleb’s enjoying the series as well-always great to hear when it inspires someone! FS and Court Farm are good choices too. Give Caleb a shout from me, and thanks again for all the support!
I'm caleb grandson of andrew hiskey 2628 and the last episode I was so shocked at kieth that I couldn't believe it but at the end I was so relieved love the content can't wait for many more episodes to come and on fs25 it's brilliant 😊😊😊😊
Hey Caleb, thanks so much for watching and for your support! I’m glad you’re enjoying the episodes and feeling connected to the story. It’s great to hear you're excited for more and that you’re having fun with FS too! Keep enjoying, and thanks again, mate!
I agree with that movement to find him and give him it back 10 fold. Great work Scroft and beanie this made me feel like you guy's where hurting too. 😢😢😢😢😢😡😡😡😡😡😡😈😈💀
Fabulous work to both you and Beanie Scroft, the effort and hard work you put in to bring every character to life, 100% their is nothing else out like this and the dedication to making things to the point it pulls at the heart with strong emotion
Another amazing video Scroft. You've taken a leaf from George's book and given that useless copper a good talking too. I really do believe it's David and Tim that are doing all this, and now the fellowship need to find them and do this for Keith. ❤
Totally agree ,second time we met david I thought he was a corrupt copper and the tent in the orange foliage has me thinking Tim the twerp is in the bunch of trees on the farm so he's closer than we all think
@gilesstoney4115 something is definitely off with David, when Scroft said he'd seen Tim it was like his secret had been found out. Definitely a corrupt copper. I think the 2 guys on cctv were Tim and David.
@gilesstoney4115 definitely, and when Scroft said to David he'd seen Tim, David reacted like his secret was out. I think the 2 guys on cctv was Tim and David.
@Farming_Hero_22 yeah your right about david having the secret over them but he did know the cat was out the bag as they didn't tell him they knew until tonight, I think the are is travellers and they are somewhere else
@gilesstoney4115 Yeah I think Tim is hiding nearby and it's just travellers on the site where Tim stashed the stolen tractors. Maybe Tim is stopping woth David and he's just denying he's in the area. We will have to wait and see what happens.
I hate I thought of this and I hope I'm wrong. David is Tim's handler. Tim is undercover for the police working to nab these travelers on a crime yet to be announced. Went back and watched all his deflections about Tim and his actions today, the "better leave it to the Police" line and his demeanor change after Scroft calls out his lie. The last episode I realized something too when Tim talked... I think it was Tim in the car and it was Scroft talking to himself after making the main part of the video and did that as an afterrhought while he cried with the rest of us. Reason being, I caught something that I'm mad did not see earlier and well played Scroft, the instant you had Keith utter "Tim" for The Imminent Movement, it was the perfect distraction. The Imminent Move(ment). The Imminent Move. FS25 wordplay.
Well he has got rid of the combine harvester that and also is Ford tractor would be the two things that he would always take with him so now that this happened the combine is now out of the scenario but that still leaves the Ford tractor I wonder if he knows for sure that it will be coming to FS25.
Another phenomenal episode mate. It's crazy how an event like this can truly bring people together. You nailed this one mate, telling off David like that, I said it before and I'll say it again, him and Ross are buddies and he's being shady and covering for Ross...clear as day. If the police had already been there, and David was lead on Investigation, why wasn't he there earlier when the other cops were there??? David and Tim are truly involved. This was a great episode mate, one that definitely hit home with me. Good one and again, can not wait to see where you take this series.
Worse thing i ever did was catch up on this series... Now i have to wait like the rest of the folk to see the next one!! Amazing work scroft! Should have more subs!! 👍👍
Sun will shine again on George's farm. As for Tim and the "other" guy, problems will only begin, they won't be left unpunished. This unfortunate event only strengthens the Fallowship, even with one of them in recovery, cause Keith is strong and will be back, and if those two thought that the farm and the Fallowship will crumble, they were 1000% wrong.
I don't know whether it's coincidence or what! but, my 'She Who Must Be Obeyed' always seems to be peeling onions when certain episodes are on RUclips.😢
George I'm here for you mate right not alone mate I'm very sorry but your combine harvester asana I'm sorry about your wife passing I've always watched this program scruffed and you always have respect you the person and George you know how long mate I was here I text you on this dude channel everyday make sure you're ok
Amazing video. David is definitely in on it, good job telling him off! I sure hope Keith makes it. Scroft, you should write books in your spare time. You are an amazing story teller. You are definitely not allowed to give up the farm hand though. Lol. I can't wait until thje next episode.
Scroft can you please put up a shed from British grain sheds were the burt shed is and get a class Tucano 440 combine with stickers saying suezana and if you do can you have the team saying thanks for the idea
Omg what an amazing series this is had me and my partner in floods of 😢 loved it from the beginning it gets better every episode it should be on telly or a book at least spot on scroft 😢 my Mrs is hooked on this like corri lol
Your videos need to be on the BBC! Excellent quality, made perfect by an amazing storyteller and story line!! Absolutely breathtaking, and tell David to stop faffing and find Tim!
Me and George are both DAM proud of the way you handled that crooked cop scroft. Cheers mate.
well done Scroft, you have brought the tension within the storyline to a peak and kept it going. The reality you have created with George, Beanie, Keith and tthe other characters is worthy of any maintream tv program. I have never watched 200+ episodes of anything before and yet I still look forward with anticipation to the next episode. Brilliant writing in my opinion
For Keith!
Scroft telling David to bugger off felt awesome!
Gloves off, let's get those SOB's
Definitely think that David was with Tim when they set fire to the shed as David would know where the cameras are positioned. Well done Scroft for telling the useless copper off and well done for keeping on with the farming work, showing them that they won't beat you. Another amazing Scroft.
That's a good one I like it
Definitely dodgy Dave. I reckon, he's Tim's brother or lover
Thanks, Michael! Appreciate the support, mate. It’s all about keeping things moving and not letting anything stop the work. Glad you’re enjoying it, and your kind words mean a lot. I’ll keep doing my best!
Crazy how one guy making up voices in his room can send emotions through a screen to thousands of people. Absolute love this series. Keep up the amazing work Scroft 👏
I love how close George and Ross have become. Scroft called it. Said they would become besties. I knew the fire would come. Didn't want to say anything. I also think David is in on it. He would know where the cameras are. Who would be better at scoping out security measures? Glad Scroft told him to scram. Probably not the best idea to tell him he knew Tim was there. Now they might all go into the wind and they'll never get proof. And it's about time Scroft let the guys know that Beanie is in on it, and she's on their side. One for all and all for one!
I'm not crying, you're crying! Seriously, the emotion that you and Beanie put into these characters is amazingly well done!
Hope George gets to lay hands on Tim. Use that old man strength to break him.
Well scroft and all. That was extraordinary what an episode. That david is as bent as they get he is a wrong un scroft. Beanie is the commander and chief.and the hub of it all. Keep it up mate. Cant wait for the next one
Bloody hell scroft wifes in tears here. Absolutely brilliant episode once again. Really hope Keith makes it
Thanks so much, mate. It means a lot to hear that the episode had such an impact, though I’m sorry to hear it brought on the tears! Fingers crossed for Keith, and I really appreciate you both watching and supporting the series.
Bloody story line and a half this is mate so in intense so brilliant at the same time loving the farm hand all the way
Great episode Scroft and beanie emotions running high and low glad you all are in the plan together Scroft check out police equipment supply stores they should have a remote car that silent even with a camera on it glad you told David off know he is in on it somehow glad George is doing better hate to see a man down like that BE CAREFUL AND PRAYING 🙏 FOR KEITH
wow think this must be the first time i have tears in my eyes watching this video. Incredibly good series you two make.
Never miss an episode, even the wife asks if the new ones out. Shame it cant be made into a tv series wi plenty of Yorkshire tea.
WOW! I have watched from the first video to this point of farm hand. This has been the best of all the farm sims roll play on the tube. I know everyone that watches will agree with my statement. Thank you for the hours of dedication to create this content. It is my hope and wish that you can keep going strong and maybe just maybe roll it over to farm sim 25. From the bottom of my heart thank you Scroft
I concur 💯😊
Super Episode, Beanie shows, she is a strong and fine lady. She put her weigth in the Farmingbusines. I think she have realised Farming is Familybusines. Now it paid off that you Scroft was honset with her. She jumped in your boat and pull in the same direction and you can be proud of your self, because you have mentaly grown so much. You take on so much tasks to keep Georg stabil. I appreciated how you kicked out this lazzy donutkiller in uniform. Men like him achieve absolut nothing. They cowardly hide behind their regulations. I hope you idea'll work and you catch this dirty bastards. Wish you good luck.
You’re a true artist scroft🥰 thanks for the breakfast company🙌🙌
I’ll say it again and again. Your talent really is on another level. Not once has this series felt boring.
The suspense during these kind of storylines versus the fun on the more laidback episodes is just perfect.
For Keith, Our Working Class Hero! Let's go, let's get this done. And sod the pigeon 😂
Saturday FarmHand....can not wait for this episode. Oh man, gonna be a great one! LETS GO!!
Scroft you have done it again bud what a excellent episode tonight with everyone pulling together to help George and Keith to show the T.I.M.That your not stopping the farm work for nothing and nice one scroft for telling that DAVID what for as you and George were right he has done nothing to help you in everything that has went on with the farm and the people involved i don't think he is a copper i think he is part of the T.I.M. ........ keep up the excellent and quality work u put into all vids and episodes of the farm hand and keep the gr8 cliffhangers coming aswell as us viewers keep watching the vids and this series excellent work again scroft bud.......❤#prayforkeith....🙏👍🏻👍🏻🤟
Cheers, Paul! I’m glad you enjoyed the episode, mate. It’s all about sticking together, and George and Keith needed that support. As for David, you’re spot on - something’s off with him, and we’ll have to see how it unfolds. Your support and kind words mean the world, and I’ll definitely keep those cliffhangers coming! Thanks again, mate
Outstanding...bloody Outstanding work scroft, beanie and all involved that help scroft make it possible
why is a fs video making me all soppy haha
this was such a good one and im slowly starting to get the bad feeling that our police officer is involved somehow somethign aint right at least you told him off Scroft in a good beeping tone serves him right cant wait for the next wpsiode
Yet another fantastic episode scroft, thanks buddy, and who knows more about where camera's are located than the guy who fitted them!
I can't wait for Tim and his friend, who is probably David, to get their comeuppance.
Are we now seeing the reason that Scroft, George, and Beanie leave Court Farms? I can't wait to see how this all plays out. You have had me on the edge of my seat for weeks now with all of this T.I.M. stuff. Great episode as always Scroft. You are one in a million.
Think we still are 6 months away RL for new map, so many EP still to come from Court Farm
id imagine Ross saying something like "i got yer Imminent movement right here" *takes a dump on Tim's Golf*
Setting the bar very high scroft
Hey Scroft such an emotional episode, praying for Keith he's got to pull through such a big part of the series.
Well done for sticking it to David he's definitely no good.
My Grandson Caleb has been playing catch-up he's hooked on the series now He's 11 and I think he's messaged you, he's on FS playing court farm now all inspired by you, well done mate.
Thanks, Andrew! Really appreciate the kind words, mate. Glad to hear Caleb’s enjoying the series as well-always great to hear when it inspires someone! FS and Court Farm are good choices too. Give Caleb a shout from me, and thanks again for all the support!
Thanks will do he's currently watching the farmhand and bake off at the same time 😂😂
Tim did the fire in your survival role-play
Telling the fuzz to jog on was great! 😂 We don’t say that here in the US, so it’s was pretty damn hilarious to hear.
It should be Tim and his friend should be in hospital or jall god bless Keith & George😢 and Tim and his friend should be a shamed.
I agree
@@leegrant6840 I don't want to say this for George but if Keith dy George will kill someone
Appreciate you watching and sharing your thoughts.
I'm caleb grandson of andrew hiskey 2628 and the last episode I was so shocked at kieth that I couldn't believe it but at the end I was so relieved love the content can't wait for many more episodes to come and on fs25 it's brilliant 😊😊😊😊
Hey Caleb, thanks so much for watching and for your support! I’m glad you’re enjoying the episodes and feeling connected to the story. It’s great to hear you're excited for more and that you’re having fun with FS too! Keep enjoying, and thanks again, mate!
Thanks for the replay btw and you keep enjoying to
Damn good job I could blame the onions today... thank you scroft for making this
Not gonna lie scroft this is better than Eastenders lol amazing story line amazing acting well done buddy 👏 👍
I agree with that movement to find him and give him it back 10 fold. Great work Scroft and beanie this made me feel like you guy's where hurting too. 😢😢😢😢😢😡😡😡😡😡😡😈😈💀
Fabulous work to both you and Beanie Scroft, the effort and hard work you put in to bring every character to life, 100% their is nothing else out like this and the dedication to making things to the point it pulls at the heart with strong emotion
Hi scroft thank you for another fantastic episode keep them up and hope Keith pulls through
Scroft I think that David could have something to do with tim
Brilliant Episode Scroft ..
Good for you sticking your ground Beanie! ❤
Your amazing at these videos I can't wait for the next one that's david poilce officer is definitely Tim's brother
It’s David he’s in on it
@@Charles-z3n got to be they know where the cameras r and everything David is defo in on it
I’m literally in tears poor George. I’m routings for Keith.😿
Bloody hell Scroft that one got me, ts deffo tim and david i hope the fellowship catch them and put them in hospital keep up the good work buddy
great work had a tear in my eye when george was talking to the nurse you make fs feel like real world
I can count on my hand how many times i’ve cried in the last couple years and most of them are from you scrocft, best one yet
Another amazing video Scroft. You've taken a leaf from George's book and given that useless copper a good talking too. I really do believe it's David and Tim that are doing all this, and now the fellowship need to find them and do this for Keith. ❤
Totally agree ,second time we met david I thought he was a corrupt copper and the tent in the orange foliage has me thinking Tim the twerp is in the bunch of trees on the farm so he's closer than we all think
@gilesstoney4115 something is definitely off with David, when Scroft said he'd seen Tim it was like his secret had been found out. Definitely a corrupt copper. I think the 2 guys on cctv were Tim and David.
@gilesstoney4115 definitely, and when Scroft said to David he'd seen Tim, David reacted like his secret was out. I think the 2 guys on cctv was Tim and David.
@Farming_Hero_22 yeah your right about david having the secret over them but he did know the cat was out the bag as they didn't tell him they knew until tonight, I think the are is travellers and they are somewhere else
@gilesstoney4115 Yeah I think Tim is hiding nearby and it's just travellers on the site where Tim stashed the stolen tractors. Maybe Tim is stopping woth David and he's just denying he's in the area. We will have to wait and see what happens.
Just started to watch this whole farm hand storyline right from the start and enjoying it
Wow another great episode can't wait until the next one
I hate I thought of this and I hope I'm wrong. David is Tim's handler. Tim is undercover for the police working to nab these travelers on a crime yet to be announced. Went back and watched all his deflections about Tim and his actions today, the "better leave it to the Police" line and his demeanor change after Scroft calls out his lie. The last episode I realized something too when Tim talked... I think it was Tim in the car and it was Scroft talking to himself after making the main part of the video and did that as an afterrhought while he cried with the rest of us. Reason being, I caught something that I'm mad did not see earlier and well played Scroft, the instant you had Keith utter "Tim" for The Imminent Movement, it was the perfect distraction. The Imminent Move(ment). The Imminent Move. FS25 wordplay.
Well he has got rid of the combine harvester that and also is Ford tractor would be the two things that he would always take with him so now that this happened the combine is now out of the scenario but that still leaves the Ford tractor I wonder if he knows for sure that it will be coming to FS25.
Christ. This one hits hard 😢
Another phenomenal episode mate. It's crazy how an event like this can truly bring people together. You nailed this one mate, telling off David like that, I said it before and I'll say it again, him and Ross are buddies and he's being shady and covering for Ross...clear as day. If the police had already been there, and David was lead on Investigation, why wasn't he there earlier when the other cops were there??? David and Tim are truly involved.
This was a great episode mate, one that definitely hit home with me. Good one and again, can not wait to see where you take this series.
This was spot on scroft you can write a whole movie from this
bloody hell scroft. im crying my eyes out here. your a bloody mastermind. amazing episode as always!
Best show on TV. You're doing a great job there, Scroft.
Why are these episodes so dang good?! Every new one that you put out makes me want the next one like 3 days ago. Keep it up Scroft! ❤
Oohhh….im rubbing my hands together for this one! 😊
awesome episode I'm totally hooked better than real TV.
Subper beanie you sound like a professional doctor great job
Worse thing i ever did was catch up on this series... Now i have to wait like the rest of the folk to see the next one!! Amazing work scroft! Should have more subs!! 👍👍
Well done scroft. David is involved in this, excellent work. Its getting better and better. Keep up the great work
Amazing just bloody amazing ❤❤❤❤
I'm so pent up with rage at Tim and that bloody David I`ll bet you he's the number two Man ugh . Good one again scroft
Sun will shine again on George's farm. As for Tim and the "other" guy, problems will only begin, they won't be left unpunished. This unfortunate event only strengthens the Fallowship, even with one of them in recovery, cause Keith is strong and will be back, and if those two thought that the farm and the Fallowship will crumble, they were 1000% wrong.
Watched the last episode and got so emotional how low tim would go too do that but love the farm hand no doubt
I definitely think it’s Tim and David
This should be a series on Netflix.
The Fellowship will get their men and bring them to their knees. Hope Keith pulls through. As George said he's a fighter.
cant wait for the next
showed there was something strange about that policeman
Everything in my mind:he won’t die.
I don't know whether it's coincidence or what! but, my 'She Who Must Be Obeyed' always seems to be peeling onions when certain episodes are on RUclips.😢
😂😂😂
Same mate, same. Problem is "she who must be obeyed" doesn't peel or cut onions. I usually cook, but if she cooks then I do the prep.
Oh man I’m using that title next time she hits me with the honey-do list, that’s awesome
🤣🤣😅😅
Love the video. Had me nearly crying come on Keith
For Keith!
This actually passed me off in real life I feel like grabbing me pitch fork!!!
Ross tho amazing character
Wow, another emotional one, fantastic stuff scroft. The fight back is coming, everyone got a fire in their belly now. Brilliant stuff
Dodgy Dave. I reckon he's Tim's brother or lover!
Awesome work Scroft, keep up the good work.
Ps. Can i join the fellowship?
Bloody hell fire, amazing episode scroft, you could bring a tear to a glass eye😢
George I'm here for you mate right not alone mate I'm very sorry but your combine harvester asana I'm sorry about your wife passing I've always watched this program scruffed and you always have respect you the person and George you know how long mate I was here I text you on this dude channel everyday make sure you're ok
Amazing video. David is definitely in on it, good job telling him off! I sure hope Keith makes it. Scroft, you should write books in your spare time. You are an amazing story teller. You are definitely not allowed to give up the farm hand though. Lol. I can't wait until thje next episode.
George is gonna go IDF on Tim now no question.
Fantastic episode Scroft!
Hi Scroft There is only one word to sum up your videos and that is BRILLIANT 👍
Another great episode. This is kind of giving me anxiety tho. I hope you get them soon
Well done scroft another grate Video Hope Keath pulls trough and there a nutter going to broadmoor and another in Wakefield jail .
Please, let Ross train some pigeon… just for fun.Amazing piece of work as always .
Scroft can you please put up a shed from British grain sheds were the burt shed is and get a class Tucano 440 combine with stickers saying suezana and if you do can you have the team saying thanks for the idea
Oh man I’ve been anticipating this episode
Scroft you buggar tears are running like a tap
Omg what an amazing series this is had me and my partner in floods of 😢 loved it from the beginning it gets better every episode it should be on telly or a book at least spot on scroft 😢 my Mrs is hooked on this like corri lol
Ps.. the Mrs says beanie needs a ring on it 😂
heavy new farm hand video. big family have goerge. hope keith is doing soon better
#Preyforkeith
God it's so upsetting seeing george like this
Sept. 28, 2024 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏 For Mr. Keith💜💜💜💜💜
A mazing cart waited for for the next one keep them going on mate
Bloddy hell fire
Howdy scroft! Keep up the good work mate!
Your videos need to be on the BBC! Excellent quality, made perfect by an amazing storyteller and story line!! Absolutely breathtaking, and tell David to stop faffing and find Tim!
What a masterpiece ❤
Another great episode!
I now think David is involved somehow