Watch Sam's video here ruclips.net/video/Z1tvbQZ7amQ/видео.htmlsi=9m0DqIvsU9ZkMS5d Feel free to give your opinions about this matter, but please keep it civil! 🙌❤️
yeah, i've been accused of using/tracing ai because of my rendering style. if i have the slightest inconsistency in my art, some people immediately assume that it's ai-generated. i wouldn't even mind if they left a polite comment like "can i see a speedpaint?" or smth like that, but i've had to delete comments insulting me and my art. i've also received doxxing and death threats from ppl dm-ing me, all based on an assumption. i understand that the possibility of an artist's work being ai can be unsettling, but some ppl thinking it's okay to harass me and other artists like me over unbased claims is really draining my motivation. i wish they could use a different approach, because they claim to want human artists to prevail over ai, and then push them off their platforms. (sorry if my english isn't perfect ^^)
BRO IT'S SO TRUE- I am still trying to figure out my artstyle and it's more often than not inconsistent and it sent me so many accusations of it being AI traced images by my classmates. Legit had to pull out paper and pencil that I could draw 🤡
I now post all my sketchbook photos and all my process photos from different stages when I share my art. It really sucks to share my "ugly" stages. But thesedays I've almost given up on digital art because of the accusations. The depression and shame of feeling like I've put years and thousands of hours into learning digital art just to be devalued by AI. It really sucks.
@@AsterWilow key it is easier to sketch on paper because it feels better if you don’t have a screen protector and not a lot of screen protectors feel like actual paper not even paperlike I feel
@@UnicornMacAndCheese that's a great method because at least you're tracing your own work. It could even be okay to trace elements of other people's work as long as someone either credits the original artist or changes enough to have truly made their own new work.
The weirdest part of this whole AI argument, is how people are attacking real artists to defend plagiarism and theft. Like... isn't that ass backwards?!
@@Arata987 agreed. There are a bunch of whining angry hostile people in the comments who aren't artists at all. Typing prompts doesn't make someone an artist. They think they cheated their way into a club of hard workers. It's like if a band of thieves broke into a furniture warehouse with a device that could glue furniture to other furniture rapidly, and they started stealing multiple pieces of furniture and selling the Frankensteined "new" furniture pieces while calling it "original design," or "beginner carpentry!" Theft is theft.
My objection to AI art is not about artists looking for inspiration. The problem is that these companies steal art and profit from it and they don't credit or compensate the artist. That's plagiarism and theft. So, I think if an artist looks at AI for inspiration, that's one thing. But, with one for one copying or tracing, an artist might not even know what they're copying. And that puts artists at risk as well because we could get sued at any given time if we trace AI art and then try to sell our work, or post it without credit. I've been argued with on this next part, but some AI generators even include partial artist signatures sometimes. Tech bros have said that this can't happen, but it has happened many times. It happened to Loish. My advice is just be careful. If you want to study a style AI can make, okay, I guess. But, I don't recommend paying for AI. Not while they aren't paying artists. And I think you should make art your own by making large creative changes if you're dabbling in this. I'm just going to stay away from it myself.
@@Wallflowerxc thank you. It's the "two wrongs make a right defense." Even if that were the case, artists still might want to be careful with these shady companies. Recently thousands of art prints have been getting recalled from major department stores because AI watermark remnants from stolen signatures were found on the prints. The department stores bought holiday art in bulk, not knowing it would arrive with these signature fragments. They had to do recalls to prevent getting sued. The law hasn't caught up for individuals across the board yet, but regardless of how someone feels about AI, companies are starting to reject it and lawsuits are stacking up.
9:29 I don’t mind using ai as a reference/inspiration tbh. Maybe for like composition it’s fine. I saw a video where a dude referenced ai images and redrew it in a way that made sense and that was cool. Personally, AI images aren’t really good references if you wanna get better- ai is flawed, it’s generated, so some strokes or “artistic” choices aren’t gonna make sense, so it’s better to reference real images for things like lighting and all that
The only thing if you want to learn from it is rendering. Breaking down/ studying the colour and light. As you would do with any real artist if you want to emulate a certain style. But that’s it. You will struggle to take anything else from it. I agree inspo is fine
@@ca678.4 this. I’ve seen a video similar to the one OP described. I also broke down an image to study how the program is trying to render the image and composite the design. Let’s say when from afar it looks nice but up close you start to see the cracks in the piece. When I made characters based on it, I traced over it to create mannequin under drawings. then I used 3d models to recreate the pose but edited it in a way that makes sense. After that I simplified the outfit, and then draw a character in my own style. The final product doesnt even look like it was traced like the examples in the video. I don’t use the art for financial gain just to represent characters in hobbies.
5:14 I usually render like this all the time. After finishing the sketch, I make a flesh sphere layer for lighting and shading reference, then start the character rendering on a new layer on top of the sketch layer
5:18 I've actually noticed a lot of realism/hyperrealism artists do this too (even in traditional media) and it always freaks me out, like why and how do they fully render a tiny area at a time ?! But I guess some people's brains can just work that way
It’s honestly epic that we have arrived at a point that we actually have the luxury to debate art at such a level… Love the AI and Artists coming together in such a way WOOH
5:13 truth be told: i do this but lately i’m thinking of just filling in base colors for the whole sketch because i notice if i do this for only one part of the drawing it slows my process down alot 😭
If I can add on, it really helps to do all of your base colors first just to get a sense of your color balance as well. The colors around the character (shirt, hair, what kind of lighting they are in) will always play a part in the color of the shadows/highlights, even for cellshaded work. It's hard to keep that balance if you are fully rendering one part of the picture at a time on a white background. You can still have separate layers for each base color (skin, hair, shirt, etc.) and use clipping masks to render each part one at a time if that makes you more comfortable! But having all your base colors down, including background color (even if you aren't drawing a detailed background) will REALLY improve how you pick your colors and make it easier to see when things don't fit, instead of realizing so late that it becomes a time sink to fix it 💙
@@artlove9577 hi,yes I honestly do agree alot,i notice that when i do one part at a time there are minor color errors in terms of the rendering,i do color the flats on separate layers and render on top using clipping mask so yes thanks for the tips and hopefully i’ll start understanding color theory better and what to use and what not to use,thank you ♥️
I can confirm that i color face first then render the face then add colors to eye then render eyes and continue until finishing the whole thing i found myself that im more fast like this
5:15 i used to do that at a time where the face was the hardest for me and i wanted to see if i was able to do it before i put work into anything else xD
7:02 what if someone took inspiration, and broke down the ai images and used it as reference to create a new piece? 🤔 Almost photobashing the algamation?
I think most respectable artists agree that taking inspiration, or learning a style, from AI produced images is acceptable. After all, we can get inspiration from anything. People just have to realize they can't rely on it to learn fundamentals (it is learning from the images made by many, many, artists after all, and learns our mistakes as well). That said, transparency is extremely important. If someone redraws an AI image they liked, but only changed a few small details, they should tell people they used "image in question" as a direct reference, the same way they would with another artist's photograph or artwork. But if someone just references the way an AI did the lineart in a specific image, or designs their trees with the same technique, there is no reason for them to credit the AI image. That would be like....having to reference every single artist you ever got inspired by every-time you create something new. The true issue in this regard is when people just trace it 1 for 1 to make money, while claiming it is 100% their own original work. However, this has been an issue with ANY type of art. I'm not sure why "Tracing AI work" is getting such shock value and treated like this new big thing if I am being honest. It's important to remember, AI generated images aren't protected under copy-write laws, in theory they work just like free-use stock images (not including any protected IPs). So tracing over one for fun, or to learn, isn't going to land you in any kind of legal trouble, despite what some people try to say. However, YOU have to change a certain percent of the image for it to be considered as your own work, protected under copywrite! Tracing an AI generated picture for a client 1 to 1, is pretty much the same as changing the colors around on a free stock image and expecting them to pay for it. Gross. Don't get me wrong, I am against the methods in which the AI is fed information (using others work without permission), and the current effects it has on the environment. But I personally believe that AI has become such a buzzword, that people start to lose sight of why it's actually a bad thing (if they knew in the first place), and just turn it into a way of attacking others for whatever reason. I don't understand why we are panicking and putting every artist under a microscope and demanding their time-lapsed art on the regular, just to prove they are innocent, as if tracing is this new big issue. We have been fighting this problem for a VERY long time now, and those who call-out artists without proof are normally met with push back from the art community. Why does putting AI in front of it, suddenly make it okay to behave this way? From everything I have seen, this has only caused a ton of innocent artist to get shot down, killing their support even after they were proven innocent, and has caused even more to stop posting their work in general. And it's not just beginners that get this treatment either, I have seen amazing artists, who had obvious weak areas here and there, get this treatment as well. Some people have accused artists (especially those on site's like art station) because they had "AI Style", even though a lot of the prompts entered to make said popular "AI style" came from directly typing in those artists names and sites in the first place. There is always someone out there, in every field, lying to make a profit. Calling those people out AFTER it has been proven they are guilty, and warning potential clients away from being scammed is a good thing! But treating every artist that has shaky lines, muddy colors, or only just learned some parts of anatomy as if they are tracing is completely uncalled for. And the worst part is, many see it as "taking the fight to AI!", but it has absoluetly zero impact on the issue at all. TL;DR: People need to stop calling out every artist they "think" is tracing AI art. Save that for the people who have 100% traced art to gain monetary value, and there is solid proof to back it up. Putting every artist under the microscope like this doesn't combat the problematic parts of generative AI at all, instead it just pushes away new artists, shoots down old artists, and turns the art communities more toxic.
Definitely agree. I've seen artists (esp new ones) being attacked recently purely because their skills aren't top tier yet so they're immediately called out for 'Tracing or using AI art' when.. they just had some rough edges or less than perfect anatomy. It's completely pushing away new artists or less confident artists from posting even if they are doing it for fun,, purely because they're afraid of being attacked for no reason! It's the ai that should be under fire, not artists just trying to improve or have fun
the muddy colors can happen if someone isnt good with color theory or idk but i donr rly get the render one cause i always render all the skin or face first because i psychically cant render hair and clothes so i always leave it to the end (but when i render i dont add intense shadows + lighting until the end with everything rendered) :P
As an engineer and an artist, I think AI should be used as a tool. Sometimes is hard to see what you are imagining so you can generate an AI image to get inspiration for poses, clothes, hairstyles, composition, etc. However, this shouldn't be the only source of reference because, as mentioned by many, AI images learned patterns from artists but they don't always execute them in the way the artists intended. You can get started with AI images and take pictures of the pose you liked to see how the perspective and anatomy actually should look like, and you can put the AI image in google to search similar clothes, that can lead to you finding a niche clothing style. If you like art, get curious. This is how I also use AI for coding. I get the structure and/or idea for the code from it but it inevitably doesn't understand my intention and the intricacies of what I want to do, so I pull from my mental library or start looking at tutorials and reading documentation. I get the appeal of making a quick and relatively cheap images or code to see your idea come to life when you don't have the skill, and I think this is what a lot of people want to use AI for. In a perfect world we would all get a universal income that would allow us to leave happily and we wouldn't need to worry about AI being used like this, but we don't live in an ideal world, so AI should be legislated better to not screw people over.
7:46 using reverse image search is SO EASY so imo not knowing the artist isn’t a good excuse. It takes 2 minutes tops to download an image, pop into reverse image search and find the artist that way Imo, if you’re gonna profit it from using an artists work, (like views/clout) you have a responsibility to make sure from day 1 that artist also gets the attention they deserve In my defense, I’m only harsher about giving credit cuz there are apps where folks just repost (not the same as using the art as a reference but still) art without credit and use the “I don’t know the artist” as an excuse. Google literally has a reverse image search built in where most download the image + it really isn’t that long at all, so, in this day and age, “not knowing” isn’t an excuse. Don’t know? FIND the artist THEN post, or literally just find the artist BEFORE even starting the picture
Kinda agree, but there is a little nuance on the topic since I have experienced a handful of times where I try to reverse image search something and the artist can’t be found due to the image being altered in some way by the user. Like if I’m reverse image searching a screenshot from an edit someone made on TikTok, it’s usually a little hard to find because these people use some insane filters and effects.
Disagree. As long as you dont claim ownership its fine. Public spaces are public for a reason. If we went around reverse image searching all the thousands of images we uses, people wouldnt bother to use any images and would only be pushed further into the alternative of using AI.
honestly this made me scared of even merging my layers, I usually merge layers and paint over the sketch but now I will start keeping my layers just in case
Hi there, I wanted to share some thoughts in response to your video. I completely understand the frustration around AI tools and the concerns about art theft. It's a serious issue, and you're right to feel strongly about it. But I think it's important to remember that the use of reference material, including photos, has been a part of art production for a long time. Even well-known artists like Luis Royo have used images from various sources to create finished works. The art world is full of complexities, including the fact that many artists in artist alleys sell work derived from copyrighted material. It’s not ideal, but it's also not new. I believe AI is just another tool. Like any tool, its value depends on how it's used. It can be a powerful aid for artists with strong fundamentals, or it can produce something less inspired in the hands of someone less experienced. But AI, no matter how advanced, can never replace true human creativity and the unique resonance that comes from it. I don’t know much about your art or your channel, but I trust that you’re dedicated to producing meaningful work. My hope is that instead of letting these new tools frustrate us, we can focus on our own creative paths and what we want to bring into the world. Thanks for sharing your perspective, and I’m looking forward to seeing more of your content.
Nah, I don't think it's the same thing at all. Name one other tool whose creation necessitated circumventing the legal rights of 16,000 artists' copyrighted work in order to function? Then laundering it through a codex to avoid the legal ramifications? They found the messages in a data leak. If it's not unethical, why the cloak and dagger? People in artists alley can very easily get cease and desists for drawing other Big 2 characters. The copyright holders are almost always at the same conventions, but they still reserve the right. The ways in which IP can be used is up to the holder of the IP. None of these artists have consented.
5:07 with my mono-tropism, I tend to do this as I kind of tunnel vision on the face, I make the lineart and the rendering but I completely forget about the hair and body, *(the hair is left as a sketch whilst the body and neck is nonexistent)* my mono-tropism and dyspraxia are all making it really difficult to draw, but I still enjoy it, and I'm getting better
Guys, guys hear me out. This guy copied the answer sheet to this homework assignment. Instead of printing out the answer sheet and submitting that, I’m gonna look over and hand copy the answer sheet answers onto the base paper! Whew, I’m not cheating anymore, right? That was close.
WAKE UP FUNGZAU POSTED (also I am someone who goes through completely shading one layer at a time for my more finished art works, just helps me stay motivated since I prefer shading lol)
I have always shaded one layer at a time too. I tend to start with skin, since it is the hardest, move on to clothes and accessories, then hair, and then the background if there is one.
5:10 as an artist i do only one part of the coloring at a time but i ATLEAST put the base colors to see which colors i actually want to use. This just makes no sense
5:14 Yes, I do it every time because my ADHD brain needs to pass the ugly phase to stay motivated. But I usually have a color thumbnail to colour pich from
the thing is that although ai can look very real the mistakes the ai can make can lead to inconsistencies such as the weird anatomy like the six fingers thing feng mentioned but also different types of colors/shades making the person that traces the art very inconsistent. i would not recommend using ai art unless you want to experiment with different kinds of art styles when you just starting out since ai art uses different kinds of artists artstyles.
Guess what. I have gotten some great meaty textures I directly slap onto my unpainting (idk what to call it. It's the layer i put under the sketch idk). And I'm not going to stop. I'll do it again. Ai should be a tool for artists not a replacement for them. I dont really think it matters. I really detest the gatekeeping of being able to call themselves an "artist". They can call themselves artists if they want to. An artist creates art. I mean like are collage artists not artists? If that's the way that they go about creating their art then I don't really think it matters unless they're lying about their process. It's definitely bad practice for learning how to draw but I don't think it's a moral issue.
I used to render each part separately to answer your question. I thought it was faster and it also took less layers, but now just doing base color first is very satisfying to see XD
When I first started to dabble in digital art about 20-ish years ago, everybody was firmly in the "digital art is NOT art, it's just algorithms and computing tricks doing all the work" zone. What Henry Jenkins said - emergence of new media nobilities its predecessors.
Some artists do only render one part of the drawing a.e just the skin which they already have done way before this ai stuff was a thing just bc it looks cool, I've done it too lol it's important to look at multiple suspicious things and then put two and two together, not accuse someone bc they do one single thing that some ai people might do too
5:29 Yeah people actually do that. They sometimes render in parts(usually has base color established, paint over some parts, then hide color thumbnail layer so it'll look nice on screencaps) It's nice when you got bored easily and wanna jump into rendering early, and it looks cool.
so.. apparently I render like an AI then. I often start with skin, and then do hair on another layer, but depending on the piece i might fully render skin first and then do hair 😭
This reminds me of the beginning of "Dadaism". A guy signed a urinal and handed it in as art. I mean, if that made it to art, tracing AI lines doesn't seem so bad😅. I also think it's a good thing people can express themselves, whether it's by (partially) tracing or not. I myself use bases for tracing and other artworks for references. Why? Because I invision my oc's in a certain way and don't have the art skills to draw them how I want to on my own. I hope I will one day, but I don't have the luxury to spend all my time on learning how to draw. I also make visual novel games and that takes LOTS of time as well😅. I am, however, against making money of traced works. I will never sell my drawings or my games, since they have (partial) traced images in it. But if it weren't for tracing, I would never have been able to create a game the way I wanted to and having that outlet is important to me, since I'm making a story about some of our alters (I have DID). So to me; it's a way to give my alters a face, which I otherwise wasn't able to do. I use bases and not AI, but still... All that being said; your art is freakin amazing and I will never compare my work to that. I'm glad there are people out there like you, who can really make great art. I'm just also glad, I have the option to make somewhat decent work, by tracing or using bases for references, to get the people inside of me out there.
"do people do this?" MY ADHD BRAIN DOES. I sometimes render parts of a drawing or already start coloring some parts before i even finished the whole outline 😭😭😭 because my brain just wants to JUMP to the next step already, I already want to be FURTHER. ... so sometimes i just give in and render some stuff, because the alternative would be throwing my tablet away and stopping 😂 gotta please the brain to keep motivation high. This is also why I don't like recording my drawing procress because it is ALL OVER THE PLACE
Very legit concern about traced AI.... however, not a good way to deal with the problem. Someone thinks they've figured it out and now they're "spreading the wisdom" - but really just generalizing and thinking narrowly about the art process, probably basing the whole thing on a couple of anecdotes. If applied, this would just lead to a ton of "false-positives" and real artists will be accused of having traced AI for their legit, genuine art in which they've put genuine effort and imagination. What is worse than missing the culprit of a crime? Convicting someone innocent of a crime they did not commit. Even worse if they are still novice, still learning - this can outright turn people away from learning and push them into cheating their way around because they are literally shown their genuine effort is meaningless and people accuse them of faking it anyway. Makes me think again of that one post I saw on tumblr: The worst thing about AI generated images is that now every time I see a beautiful artwork on the internet, instead of childlike wonder I experience suspicion. That, too, is damage to art, to artists, to the relationships between artists and art, viewers and art, and between artists themselves. I'm not blaming people for trying to figure out how to distinguish the fake "art". But not at just any cost.
I render one part of the drawing because I like keeping the colors organized, but I do refine more after is full rendered I might render more the drawing, but I render first the skin, then eyes, then the clothes from top to bottom and lastly hair, but if it has complex BG, then I do the BG first and the the person
to answer the question in your video, the one that where people draw and render it but left other part to the sketch. yes i do that since uggghhhh it's lazy to finish all and it end up hitting the mountain
9:10 I'm a baby beginner that started drawing at the start of 2022. I improved a lot in my first year practicing every day, doing challenges, having people review my work, and others. My biggest training wheels here were so many grid lines to help me get things in place. The following years however, AI really started to take off during my journey, and now it's sorta become a part of my process. Sometimes I'll have a vague thought of a character with certain characteristics I want, and I'll generate a bunch of images in AI and see what comes out. I'll try to draw a piece if there's anything I like. And in other scenarios, I'll do a rough quick drawing of a character, put on some quick color, and if it feels wrong or off, I'll run my drawing through AI to see what comes out with it. If there is anything that looks good, I'll make changes to my drawing. Am I really learning anything doing this? No, not at all. It's a bad habit, and I'm only becoming better at copying exactly what I see instead of things that would make me a better artist. I don't want to exactly self diagnose but I do feel like I'm on the spectrum of aphantasia little bit. Images in my mind are very vague and blurry at best, I've never had a vivid imagination, so that's probably why I ended up doing this. Do I profit or do anything with my work? No, it's just for fun.
I did't hear about that condition before so I had to google it, It's very interesting. I can't imagine my mind without images. I don't think using ai as inspiration is bad. Mayby you can use the ai image as inspiration without traicing and use real images as reference to study. Something what really hepls me is trying to understand how the thing I'm drawing works. For example looking at bat wings images helped me to understand how the bones are placed in wings in general and how similar they are to human hands with very very long fingers. Sorry for possible English mistakes, it's not my first language.
i think the issue with tracing or even copying/referencing ai images of art is that it is inherently unethical. if you're tracing, you're just re-stealing other artists work, not to mention that the ai art isnt very good to begin with. if you're referencing, that's just not good. ai art is not a good reference. if you're intentionally copying, you're essentially making fanart of ai images, which is supporting something that steals from real artists. if you're inspired by an ai image and want to make something similar but of your own design and made purely with your own skills, that is fine! but no matter how you try to twist it, tracing/copying/very closely referencing ai will always land between somewhat shady and entirely unethical. many people have this well intended but very misguided idea that stealing or tracing ai art is a good way to retaliate against ai, but it's not. it's just adding fuel to the fire that threatens to burn us to death. i will add that if you are using ai models that use **stock photos** as its reference images, THAT IS OKAY!! in some cases (such as using it to generate faces for arg projects) it's actually more ethical than using real images! also, if you are using ai as a reference, it will only help if you're already rather skilled and know what specifically you can take and what you have to fix. if you're a beginner, you're better off just referencing off of a regular artist whose art you admire. tracing, copying, and closely referencing to practice is perfectly okay as long as you are completely open about it and do not try to turn a profit off of it!
As a traditional artist i'm amazed by the amounts of circlejerks in the digital art community. So many artists caring too much about what others have to say about their process. Meanwhile i am just painting and that's it.
I personally think that we should degrade those images bc humans haven't even gotten advanced enough to make ACTUAL AI. Those are just a image generative algorithm. (IGA for short?) Technically if those WERE actual AI, they would technically be on the same level as human or a learning human since art is human expression. But they are not actual AI, they are a bot that takes in images and is just mushing it together and vomiting it out to people who use them. I think that (this my personal opinion so...) we should protect our own art, degrade their art and ignore those images. We should not trace their images since it's someone else's art and using it as inspiration or reference is still giving it attention in some way and someone is still using it. There are A LOT of photos, actual photos or other images that are NOT made from those image generators and those can help with mood boards or inspiration. "AI" images are not actual artworks that are original or even actual AI so we should treat it and reveal it as such. We should not treat those images as something that is actually having a human soul. Using those images or generators gives profit and attention and validation to the ones making it. People can see mistakes and those generators are getting better bc (funny enough) PEOPLE point out the mistakes and makes the bot fix them. It's best to have some type of protective layer like NightShade over it, don't reveal you are protecting it and just degrading what those things actually are. They are not AI, they are not AI art, they are not real original art, they are simply stolen work put into a bot that does not have human understanding and jumbled all together and thrown up. Don't support companies who use those images, spread information about it and also when the time comes and the AI bros are done with this, they'll just move on to something else and terrorize another community. We should keep the actual PEOPLE behind those generators accountable and call them what they are, thieves and losers. Tracing can be used as a practice thing and honestly, doing it not to profit or to study is good but passing it off as your own hard work is bad. KIDS tracing and coloring for fun shouldn't be shamed but should be taught about the ethics and about what they are doing. Beginner artists should be taught, EVERYONE should be taught and educated instead of shamed and only when they understand or refuse to understand and continue to harm and try to steal someone elses' hard work, then you simply ignore them, block them, spread the truth and don't send hate. Most of these dudes are doing this for attention. Maybe they never had actual love from their parents or something but real artists turn that into actual art lol, instead of going to a bot.
I’ve always put a prompt in ai, take the ai. Sketch out the final changes of what I want to do and then take that sketch and do line art on digital. Is that still stealing? Even though I changed the entire design and kept the pose or base?
Bro, inconsistencies describe my art. I normally give up at the end. Like I made this thing and by time I reached the clothes I just used a completely dif brush and yeeted it, and it looks like garbage but that's okay 😅 Also, I do lineless/thin line art :] Wait, yall, I forgot to show the sketch alot :(((((( I think using ai for refrence can be good in some cases, but you should definitely learn without *TRACING* it! Only referencing (sometimes).
Hello, I haven't started the video yet but I have a question. Is tracing body parts of people I find in Pinterest okay? I'm a beginner artist and I so badly wanna post them but I'm afraid that people will hate me for it...
Wtf if nobody knows about that than what's the point of asking PERMISSION to draw it(im talking about your comment about using photos as a reference) 🤯 people nowadays are so sensitive it's crazy like you don't hurt anyone
You’re just tracing for anatomy purposes so I don’t think it needs to be stated? I literally have to trace my own hands because I suck at them but they’re MY hands, so it would be odd to disclose
Tracing is ALWAYS okay. The issue is posting or using that traced art when you are done. Just ensure people know what is and isn't traced and what your traced from if you choose to post the image.
Ai generated images is what I like to call it. When we have fully sentient androids who paint like humans, maybe that'll be art, but these lazy images generated in 3 seconds are not art.
I render one part at a time, it isn't typical, but i've always done it. I call it tunneling, I'm trying to learn to do under paintings, but I tend to just sketch-> fully render in a little area at a time
Im currently in the process of learning Art by drawing with references from Pinterest. I’m not the best spotter but it’s likely that many of the artworks I’ve referenced are AI I’m not posting or anything Hope that’s fine
If an artist gets involved with AI, then there is a possibility that this artist will not learn or forget the motivation and excitement of real art because he/she sees that with AI you can get results faster. At some point, this artist asks himself whether it still makes sense to draw himself. That's the problem, and the sooner it starts, the more likely you won't have the discipline to learn real art. This happens more and more often and eventually becomes normal and real art no longer exists a generation later. It's like ... yes, getting people into the habit of drugs instead of real joy. Then you forget what your heart really thinks because the drug simulates a false feeling, you become empty and lifeless.
with point number 3-i occasionally do this when i randomly lose the motivation do do everything else or just straight up hyperfixate on that particular part of the drawing lol
I do render just one part of my art and leave the rest in sketch... It just helps me confuse more on the what I'm painting right now instead of getting distracted by "ooh I can make the hair more shiny" or "eh her clothes need more bling" I can just color the face in peace
I guess artist should be educated about what is AI in first place: Ai basically works as human it needs ti learn a bulk of information to produce new ones ! so inorder to understand art , it lust basically , learn from otehr pictures !and by that it learns colors pattern artstyles and many other things! the problem resides in being able to benefit free from someone else's work ! like prompting artwork of this scene with this x user style ! other people may not know he is the owner and commission him which harms the orignal artist! sometimes AI ! isn't capable enough so basically could give u an image of an existing character in another style and colors ! which also looks like plagiarism!
5:25 well actually yeah, sometimes depending on whether or not I feel like everything at once, but I realize it’s better to just render everything at once to avoid inconsistency
I sometimes use ai for poses, perspective, clothing folds etc. Sometimes you just can't find a reference that will fit what you have in mind, and ai can generate it for you.
Saw an AI image of Levi Ackerman. I was shocked of how accurate the emblem was, the face, it looked like a real art piece. But then again, the "replace image" button exists, so who knows.
You all may not know this, but creating ai have a really bad impact on the environment the same way NFTs do, and having even just for inspo, is still a demand to create more of it... And if an artist got inspired by an AI, that person shouldn't diaclouse the peace at all ... AI can be controlled or have legislation in the future but if we used indiscriminately that would take longer and more artist will suffer from theft and livelihood could be at risk Sorry if there is any mistake english is really hard😢
So I myself I get super distracted and have an issue with getting ever little detail so I usually do the sketch the do the full thing like the eye even the freaking shading before like adding bass color🤷🏼♂️ (also ya I don't just do the skin I litteraly do it by piece)
i remember tracing ai art a while ago, when ai art was still very very new, and looked horrible. im still not sure what to feel about it as since ai was so horrible there was no visible facial features on people and all that, so i would trace it and add the faces myself( note: i was still an amateur at the time) :p
The olny claims ive seen from people tracing Over ai is because "ai isnt copyrighted and there nothing that the prompt guy can do about it" and that theyre "replacing the replacers" which in my opinion as an artist its the stupidest reason to defend tracing, because you're still tracing Over an amalgomation of stolen art
it is not a amalgamation of stolen art. Granted, if it were, collaging and photobashing have been around forever and are not unethical or stealing in the least, but it's not that. It is not an amalgamation at all.
I know artists from back in the day who did this all the time, the only difference is that it's "AI art", you can say it's not their work but at the end of the day some people have bills to pay and in a professional setting what matters is getting results.
When I was in grade school, well over 20 years ago, I once never fucked woth tracing at all. My step dad taught me how tracing wasn't necessarily a bad thing as most animation studios actually have to adapt the original artist art style and then trace over and animate it. Theres levels to tracing, and if you deliberately create your own characters for a story then use ai to visually create them as close to your description, then you could trace over them if you want. BUT, I will say to redraw them in your style and edit the character as much as possible. Then thats ok to me... but im talking about printing out a picture and drawing traditionally. Digital art is dying due to ai art now. Fortunately for those that are traditional artist, we cant be affected since we dont post up.
I usually do this by completely re-rendering certain parts instead of going all the way through the drawing. I mean, most of the time I do the background first to figure out where my lights are, followed by the base colors. From there I re-render each part one at a time, usually following: skin, hair, clothes, eyes, and mouth. Lastly I add the lighting. In general, I feel more confident when I see the final results and know that I'm doing something I like.
AI provides good composition. And you have to give many prompts and inputs to get something that feels okay. Well, before that it was google searching .. The only issue is, when basing the composition on actual artist you know who they are, you czn credit them. In AI you don't.
using ai pics as an inspiration or to trace of, is in a way legitimizing ai and letting it slide. it's not a valid excuse. anything ai generated comes from unethical place and is actually really bad for the environment, and imo we(especially artists) should absolutely avoid any sort of encouraging it
Honestly, this is my take. If trying to make the design better in their own way (with their style) then I don't mind it but tracing I do agree with you on that.
Straight after watching your video I got an ad for Kittl "...and if you can't find an illustration you like then you can use our AI-powered design tools to create one". These Etsy t-shirt sellers are just cutting out the artist altogether. This is what the AI image generators were made for! 🤮
The main problem here is just realising U are Tracing from stolen work. And U can live with that, realise that if U make cush from Tracing stolen work, Ur also stealing 😂. That's all man.. what's with all the THINGS happening?
this is a little chat that only exists in the bubble of those who hate AI without even learning how to use the tools properly, yes you can throw together a prompt and have any unintentional image with AI but you can also have a careful and intentional work, the artist just has to put in the effort
10:54 because if I trace over a real picture of myself, I’m not stealing from anyone but myself. And you can’t steal from yourself. Artists who trace their own work or themselves don’t have to disclose it because their pictures and art belong to nobody but them. If you trace over a picture of a drawing from a magazine, you need to credit the artist.
I mean, I have no complaints. If AI can do it and get no consequences why can't we? I don't support AI replacing artists so this is just hilarious to me
Because the prerequisite for tracing from AI is financially supporting the people who stole all these artists' work in the first place and whose literal intention is to monetize the death of commercial art as a career. There was a data leak with Midjourney guys talking about ways to circumvent the legal IP of 16,000 artists. Making a Midjourney (or equivalent) account in the first place is literally "supporting AI replacing artists."
Now I will be constantly concerned that my artwork, as a beginner, might appear as if I used AI tracing, even though I am simply a novice who is still learning to draw precise lines. This worry could potentially affect my mindset while drawing and lead me to give up.😞
I recommend having a read of "AI and Artists’ IP: Exploring Copyright Infringement Allegations in Andersen v. Stability AI Ltd. February 26, 2024" by Center for art law. It's actually quite an interesting read if you have some free time.
5:18 I do this, I sometimes get bored of linearting and don't know if the piece will look like once I am done, so I start initial coloring on the already linearted parts- ie, if I have a sketch and start linearting, and I already linearted head, I sometimes color the head before coming back to linearting rest of the body. Prolly weird take but hey, it works for me. Ofc by coloring I mean more like, flat colors and perhaps initial shading and not full on render, I usually come back to the colored parts after I am done with lineart and coloring the whole thing, sometimes I change the shadow and light placement too, but yeah XD I am not an advanced artist though and I have a very short span of attention, that's why coloring mid linearting process kind of allows me to focus on the piece lol. Does that make sense?
5:19 Can definitely be a sign, but I know someone who does this cause it motivates them, like if the face is good it encourages them to finish the piece of art
I also do always render one part of the drawing first and then the rest, but I do that with everything, how I clean my room, how I study, maybe that’s a me thing 😢😂
I only render parts after parts if I already have a ref sheet of my character (I never jump into a project whitout planning), AND I'm about to animate the separated parts later in any possible ways. After a layer of the composition in my head blocked out with CSP-s 3d models and a somewhat detailed blue sketch. Real thing, because cutting an existing artwork into overlapping layers for animating is much more painful.😂 Also seeing full ready parts is calming me down that I'm on the right path I visualised at the beginning.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Watch Sam's video here ruclips.net/video/Z1tvbQZ7amQ/видео.htmlsi=9m0DqIvsU9ZkMS5d
Feel free to give your opinions about this matter, but please keep it civil! 🙌❤️
Btw I referenced this Jimin photoshoot pin.it/2LY67k2HT
how do you watch the video, when your just staring at us?
Well ai started it first they stolen art from people aka koolen
the thing is, i also really hate those “how to spot tracing” posts as they are usually just witch hunts and make artists paranoid
True
yeah, i've been accused of using/tracing ai because of my rendering style. if i have the slightest inconsistency in my art, some people immediately assume that it's ai-generated.
i wouldn't even mind if they left a polite comment like "can i see a speedpaint?" or smth like that, but i've had to delete comments insulting me and my art. i've also received doxxing and death threats from ppl dm-ing me, all based on an assumption.
i understand that the possibility of an artist's work being ai can be unsettling, but some ppl thinking it's okay to harass me and other artists like me over unbased claims is really draining my motivation. i wish they could use a different approach, because they claim to want human artists to prevail over ai, and then push them off their platforms.
(sorry if my english isn't perfect ^^)
BRO IT'S SO TRUE- I am still trying to figure out my artstyle and it's more often than not inconsistent and it sent me so many accusations of it being AI traced images by my classmates. Legit had to pull out paper and pencil that I could draw 🤡
OK... if you have a better way of dealing with this issue, then I'm all ears.
I now post all my sketchbook photos and all my process photos from different stages when I share my art. It really sucks to share my "ugly" stages. But thesedays I've almost given up on digital art because of the accusations. The depression and shame of feeling like I've put years and thousands of hours into learning digital art just to be devalued by AI. It really sucks.
Personally, I sometimes don't know how to start a digital drawing so I sketch it on a piece of paper, take a photo, and then trace it on my phone 😅😅
i think a lot of people do that, i say its so much easier to sketch stuff out on paper so its a useful thing to do
@@AsterWilow key it is easier to sketch on paper because it feels better if you don’t have a screen protector and not a lot of screen protectors feel like actual paper not even paperlike I feel
I do that, too!! I draw my art on paper and take a picture
Tracing your own art is fine! Its very different
@@UnicornMacAndCheese that's a great method because at least you're tracing your own work. It could even be okay to trace elements of other people's work as long as someone either credits the original artist or changes enough to have truly made their own new work.
The weirdest part of this whole AI argument, is how people are attacking real artists to defend plagiarism and theft.
Like... isn't that ass backwards?!
❤
@@Arata987 agreed. There are a bunch of whining angry hostile people in the comments who aren't artists at all. Typing prompts doesn't make someone an artist. They think they cheated their way into a club of hard workers. It's like if a band of thieves broke into a furniture warehouse with a device that could glue furniture to other furniture rapidly, and they started stealing multiple pieces of furniture and selling the Frankensteined "new" furniture pieces while calling it "original design," or "beginner carpentry!" Theft is theft.
Like...if a person kidnaps a baby and puts a wig and an extra fake hand on it, that doesn't make it a new baby.
@@tubsy. Is that supposed to be a joke?
@@tubsy. Misinformation. Reported.
My objection to AI art is not about artists looking for inspiration. The problem is that these companies steal art and profit from it and they don't credit or compensate the artist. That's plagiarism and theft. So, I think if an artist looks at AI for inspiration, that's one thing. But, with one for one copying or tracing, an artist might not even know what they're copying. And that puts artists at risk as well because we could get sued at any given time if we trace AI art and then try to sell our work, or post it without credit.
I've been argued with on this next part, but some AI generators even include partial artist signatures sometimes. Tech bros have said that this can't happen, but it has happened many times. It happened to Loish. My advice is just be careful. If you want to study a style AI can make, okay, I guess. But, I don't recommend paying for AI. Not while they aren't paying artists. And I think you should make art your own by making large creative changes if you're dabbling in this. I'm just going to stay away from it myself.
@@solarydays not so. Companies may have done so in much smaller numbers. Not sure whether some people are aware of the scope of the problem or not.
@@solarydays I don't defend my work history to trolls. Contribute something or don't address me.
@@solarydays ok and people have also pointed this out before, how does that justify anything?
@@solarydays you're not "pointing" anything "out." You're making ad hominem attacks about people you don't know. Not interested. 😂
@@Wallflowerxc thank you. It's the "two wrongs make a right defense." Even if that were the case, artists still might want to be careful with these shady companies. Recently thousands of art prints have been getting recalled from major department stores because AI watermark remnants from stolen signatures were found on the prints. The department stores bought holiday art in bulk, not knowing it would arrive with these signature fragments. They had to do recalls to prevent getting sued. The law hasn't caught up for individuals across the board yet, but regardless of how someone feels about AI, companies are starting to reject it and lawsuits are stacking up.
9:29 I don’t mind using ai as a reference/inspiration tbh. Maybe for like composition it’s fine. I saw a video where a dude referenced ai images and redrew it in a way that made sense and that was cool.
Personally, AI images aren’t really good references if you wanna get better- ai is flawed, it’s generated, so some strokes or “artistic” choices aren’t gonna make sense, so it’s better to reference real images for things like lighting and all that
yeah you can get inspiration and references from basically anything, ai just isnt the best for those, specifically references…
I like the way you explain this! Def use it if you see something cool but don't ever use it for learning lol.
The only thing if you want to learn from it is rendering. Breaking down/ studying the colour and light. As you would do with any real artist if you want to emulate a certain style. But that’s it. You will struggle to take anything else from it. I agree inspo is fine
@@ca678.4 this. I’ve seen a video similar to the one OP described. I also broke down an image to study how the program is trying to render the image and composite the design.
Let’s say when from afar it looks nice but up close you start to see the cracks in the piece.
When I made characters based on it, I traced over it to create mannequin under drawings. then I used 3d models to recreate the pose but edited it in a way that makes sense.
After that I simplified the outfit, and then draw a character in my own style.
The final product doesnt even look like it was traced like the examples in the video.
I don’t use the art for financial gain just to represent characters in hobbies.
Yeah sure destroy the planet even more
5:14 I usually render like this all the time. After finishing the sketch, I make a flesh sphere layer for lighting and shading reference, then start the character rendering on a new layer on top of the sketch layer
yeah nobody should be nitpicking how tracers color. Imo that's stupid. The coloring is to applicable to real artists. It's the tracing that's badm
Woah flesh sphere… that’s such a good idea!
no because the way you started drawing not with rough sketches first, but with color blocking???! instant sub. 🥳👏🛐
color blocking is so good to understand the shape better i need to use it more xD
Honestly, sometimes I'm too lazy to do any sketch, colour blocking-in is just so much quicker to establish shapes and proportions.
Omg ur so annoying
5:18 I've actually noticed a lot of realism/hyperrealism artists do this too (even in traditional media) and it always freaks me out, like why and how do they fully render a tiny area at a time ?! But I guess some people's brains can just work that way
Yes, I also do this a lot when I get obssesed with datail XD
this vid: talks about tracing ai art
ad: shows ai art generating platform
wth youtube
Yeah I can't stand these ads
It’s honestly epic that we have arrived at a point that we actually have the luxury to debate art at such a level… Love the AI and Artists coming together in such a way WOOH
5:13 truth be told: i do this but lately i’m thinking of just filling in base colors for the whole sketch because i notice if i do this for only one part of the drawing it slows my process down alot 😭
Samee😭
If I can add on, it really helps to do all of your base colors first just to get a sense of your color balance as well. The colors around the character (shirt, hair, what kind of lighting they are in) will always play a part in the color of the shadows/highlights, even for cellshaded work. It's hard to keep that balance if you are fully rendering one part of the picture at a time on a white background.
You can still have separate layers for each base color (skin, hair, shirt, etc.) and use clipping masks to render each part one at a time if that makes you more comfortable! But having all your base colors down, including background color (even if you aren't drawing a detailed background) will REALLY improve how you pick your colors and make it easier to see when things don't fit, instead of realizing so late that it becomes a time sink to fix it
💙
@@artlove9577 hi,yes I honestly do agree alot,i notice that when i do one part at a time there are minor color errors in terms of the rendering,i do color the flats on separate layers and render on top using clipping mask so yes thanks for the tips and hopefully i’ll start understanding color theory better and what to use and what not to use,thank you ♥️
I can confirm that i color face first then render the face then add colors to eye then render eyes and continue until finishing the whole thing i found myself that im more fast like this
I recently started doing this and it comes out super clean
5:15 i used to do that at a time where the face was the hardest for me and i wanted to see if i was able to do it before i put work into anything else xD
Any tracing that I do is purely from poses that I've made with 3d models. It's mainly anatomy studying for me.
Fung i followed one of your art tutorials and it came out AMAZINGG took 7 hours but neuvillette looks great :3
That's awesome! ❤️
No way!? SAME!! I drew Neuvillette using her tutorial as well 😊❤
It was the one where she draws like Chinese artist where I took reference from.
@@yumeh2960 i chose the one which she made the lighting short on :)
@@yumeh2960 YES SAME AND THE LIGHTING ONE
7:02 what if someone took inspiration, and broke down the ai images and used it as reference to create a new piece? 🤔
Almost photobashing the algamation?
So...what if an artist does to AI what AI does to artists?
We waste more time than AI.@@Thedarkbunnyrabbit
@@Tsuru8688 We do take longer, this is true.
AI is not selfaware so it cant take Inspiration unless we live in the game detroit become human only Deviants can become inspired.
@@computernerd8157such a good game. 😂
Everyone else: OH NO ITS AI.
Me: Pretty pixels.
I think most respectable artists agree that taking inspiration, or learning a style, from AI produced images is acceptable. After all, we can get inspiration from anything. People just have to realize they can't rely on it to learn fundamentals (it is learning from the images made by many, many, artists after all, and learns our mistakes as well). That said, transparency is extremely important. If someone redraws an AI image they liked, but only changed a few small details, they should tell people they used "image in question" as a direct reference, the same way they would with another artist's photograph or artwork. But if someone just references the way an AI did the lineart in a specific image, or designs their trees with the same technique, there is no reason for them to credit the AI image. That would be like....having to reference every single artist you ever got inspired by every-time you create something new.
The true issue in this regard is when people just trace it 1 for 1 to make money, while claiming it is 100% their own original work. However, this has been an issue with ANY type of art. I'm not sure why "Tracing AI work" is getting such shock value and treated like this new big thing if I am being honest. It's important to remember, AI generated images aren't protected under copy-write laws, in theory they work just like free-use stock images (not including any protected IPs). So tracing over one for fun, or to learn, isn't going to land you in any kind of legal trouble, despite what some people try to say. However, YOU have to change a certain percent of the image for it to be considered as your own work, protected under copywrite! Tracing an AI generated picture for a client 1 to 1, is pretty much the same as changing the colors around on a free stock image and expecting them to pay for it. Gross.
Don't get me wrong, I am against the methods in which the AI is fed information (using others work without permission), and the current effects it has on the environment. But I personally believe that AI has become such a buzzword, that people start to lose sight of why it's actually a bad thing (if they knew in the first place), and just turn it into a way of attacking others for whatever reason. I don't understand why we are panicking and putting every artist under a microscope and demanding their time-lapsed art on the regular, just to prove they are innocent, as if tracing is this new big issue. We have been fighting this problem for a VERY long time now, and those who call-out artists without proof are normally met with push back from the art community. Why does putting AI in front of it, suddenly make it okay to behave this way? From everything I have seen, this has only caused a ton of innocent artist to get shot down, killing their support even after they were proven innocent, and has caused even more to stop posting their work in general. And it's not just beginners that get this treatment either, I have seen amazing artists, who had obvious weak areas here and there, get this treatment as well. Some people have accused artists (especially those on site's like art station) because they had "AI Style", even though a lot of the prompts entered to make said popular "AI style" came from directly typing in those artists names and sites in the first place.
There is always someone out there, in every field, lying to make a profit. Calling those people out AFTER it has been proven they are guilty, and warning potential clients away from being scammed is a good thing! But treating every artist that has shaky lines, muddy colors, or only just learned some parts of anatomy as if they are tracing is completely uncalled for. And the worst part is, many see it as "taking the fight to AI!", but it has absoluetly zero impact on the issue at all.
TL;DR: People need to stop calling out every artist they "think" is tracing AI art. Save that for the people who have 100% traced art to gain monetary value, and there is solid proof to back it up. Putting every artist under the microscope like this doesn't combat the problematic parts of generative AI at all, instead it just pushes away new artists, shoots down old artists, and turns the art communities more toxic.
Definitely agree. I've seen artists (esp new ones) being attacked recently purely because their skills aren't top tier yet so they're immediately called out for 'Tracing or using AI art' when.. they just had some rough edges or less than perfect anatomy. It's completely pushing away new artists or less confident artists from posting even if they are doing it for fun,, purely because they're afraid of being attacked for no reason! It's the ai that should be under fire, not artists just trying to improve or have fun
the muddy colors can happen if someone isnt good with color theory or idk but i donr rly get the render one cause i always render all the skin or face first because i psychically cant render hair and clothes so i always leave it to the end (but when i render i dont add intense shadows + lighting until the end with everything rendered) :P
As an engineer and an artist, I think AI should be used as a tool. Sometimes is hard to see what you are imagining so you can generate an AI image to get inspiration for poses, clothes, hairstyles, composition, etc. However, this shouldn't be the only source of reference because, as mentioned by many, AI images learned patterns from artists but they don't always execute them in the way the artists intended. You can get started with AI images and take pictures of the pose you liked to see how the perspective and anatomy actually should look like, and you can put the AI image in google to search similar clothes, that can lead to you finding a niche clothing style. If you like art, get curious.
This is how I also use AI for coding. I get the structure and/or idea for the code from it but it inevitably doesn't understand my intention and the intricacies of what I want to do, so I pull from my mental library or start looking at tutorials and reading documentation.
I get the appeal of making a quick and relatively cheap images or code to see your idea come to life when you don't have the skill, and I think this is what a lot of people want to use AI for. In a perfect world we would all get a universal income that would allow us to leave happily and we wouldn't need to worry about AI being used like this, but we don't live in an ideal world, so AI should be legislated better to not screw people over.
7:46 using reverse image search is SO EASY so imo not knowing the artist isn’t a good excuse. It takes 2 minutes tops to download an image, pop into reverse image search and find the artist that way
Imo, if you’re gonna profit it from using an artists work, (like views/clout) you have a responsibility to make sure from day 1 that artist also gets the attention they deserve
In my defense, I’m only harsher about giving credit cuz there are apps where folks just repost (not the same as using the art as a reference but still) art without credit and use the “I don’t know the artist” as an excuse. Google literally has a reverse image search built in where most download the image + it really isn’t that long at all, so, in this day and age, “not knowing” isn’t an excuse. Don’t know? FIND the artist THEN post, or literally just find the artist BEFORE even starting the picture
I hate when people on Pinterest are like "Not mine" THEN WHO'S IS IT??
@@asillygoofygooberOmg THIS!!! especially when they cut off the source or clearly obscure the credit signature
@@asillygoofygoober or "credits to the real artist" WHO IS IT
Kinda agree, but there is a little nuance on the topic since I have experienced a handful of times where I try to reverse image search something and the artist can’t be found due to the image being altered in some way by the user. Like if I’m reverse image searching a screenshot from an edit someone made on TikTok, it’s usually a little hard to find because these people use some insane filters and effects.
Disagree. As long as you dont claim ownership its fine. Public spaces are public for a reason. If we went around reverse image searching all the thousands of images we uses, people wouldnt bother to use any images and would only be pushed further into the alternative of using AI.
BRO, why Kaeya look like my character sooo much ??? 😭
Girl I love you art style, that's so pretty!!
yea it’s spelt kaeya :))
@@Cheesling thx I always get confused 😅
@@-Gogo.25 yw lol :))
honestly this made me scared of even merging my layers, I usually merge layers and paint over the sketch but now I will start keeping my layers just in case
Hi there,
I wanted to share some thoughts in response to your video. I completely understand the frustration around AI tools and the concerns about art theft. It's a serious issue, and you're right to feel strongly about it. But I think it's important to remember that the use of reference material, including photos, has been a part of art production for a long time. Even well-known artists like Luis Royo have used images from various sources to create finished works.
The art world is full of complexities, including the fact that many artists in artist alleys sell work derived from copyrighted material. It’s not ideal, but it's also not new.
I believe AI is just another tool. Like any tool, its value depends on how it's used. It can be a powerful aid for artists with strong fundamentals, or it can produce something less inspired in the hands of someone less experienced. But AI, no matter how advanced, can never replace true human creativity and the unique resonance that comes from it.
I don’t know much about your art or your channel, but I trust that you’re dedicated to producing meaningful work. My hope is that instead of letting these new tools frustrate us, we can focus on our own creative paths and what we want to bring into the world.
Thanks for sharing your perspective, and I’m looking forward to seeing more of your content.
Especially since this entire discussion has happened before when digital art came to be
Nah, I don't think it's the same thing at all. Name one other tool whose creation necessitated circumventing the legal rights of 16,000 artists' copyrighted work in order to function? Then laundering it through a codex to avoid the legal ramifications? They found the messages in a data leak. If it's not unethical, why the cloak and dagger?
People in artists alley can very easily get cease and desists for drawing other Big 2 characters. The copyright holders are almost always at the same conventions, but they still reserve the right. The ways in which IP can be used is up to the holder of the IP. None of these artists have consented.
5:07 with my mono-tropism, I tend to do this as I kind of tunnel vision on the face, I make the lineart and the rendering but I completely forget about the hair and body, *(the hair is left as a sketch whilst the body and neck is nonexistent)* my mono-tropism and dyspraxia are all making it really difficult to draw, but I still enjoy it, and I'm getting better
Guys, guys hear me out. This guy copied the answer sheet to this homework assignment. Instead of printing out the answer sheet and submitting that, I’m gonna look over and hand copy the answer sheet answers onto the base paper! Whew, I’m not cheating anymore, right? That was close.
WAKE UP FUNGZAU POSTED (also I am someone who goes through completely shading one layer at a time for my more finished art works, just helps me stay motivated since I prefer shading lol)
I have always shaded one layer at a time too. I tend to start with skin, since it is the hardest, move on to clothes and accessories, then hair, and then the background if there is one.
5:10 as an artist i do only one part of the coloring at a time but i ATLEAST put the base colors to see which colors i actually want to use. This just makes no sense
I enjoy this so much! Amazing content, best wishes to you and your future projects! 🌻
5:14
Yes, I do it every time because my ADHD brain needs to pass the ugly phase to stay motivated. But I usually have a color thumbnail to colour pich from
the thing is that although ai can look very real the mistakes the ai can make can lead to inconsistencies such as the weird anatomy like the six fingers thing feng mentioned but also different types of colors/shades making the person that traces the art very inconsistent. i would not recommend using ai art unless you want to experiment with different kinds of art styles when you just starting out since ai art uses different kinds of artists artstyles.
Guess what. I have gotten some great meaty textures I directly slap onto my unpainting (idk what to call it. It's the layer i put under the sketch idk). And I'm not going to stop. I'll do it again.
Ai should be a tool for artists not a replacement for them. I dont really think it matters.
I really detest the gatekeeping of being able to call themselves an "artist". They can call themselves artists if they want to. An artist creates art. I mean like are collage artists not artists? If that's the way that they go about creating their art then I don't really think it matters unless they're lying about their process.
It's definitely bad practice for learning how to draw but I don't think it's a moral issue.
I used to render each part separately to answer your question. I thought it was faster and it also took less layers, but now just doing base color first is very satisfying to see XD
When I first started to dabble in digital art about 20-ish years ago, everybody was firmly in the "digital art is NOT art, it's just algorithms and computing tricks doing all the work" zone. What Henry Jenkins said - emergence of new media nobilities its predecessors.
Some artists do only render one part of the drawing a.e just the skin which they already have done way before this ai stuff was a thing just bc it looks cool, I've done it too lol it's important to look at multiple suspicious things and then put two and two together, not accuse someone bc they do one single thing that some ai people might do too
5:29 Yeah people actually do that. They sometimes render in parts(usually has base color established, paint over some parts, then hide color thumbnail layer so it'll look nice on screencaps) It's nice when you got bored easily and wanna jump into rendering early, and it looks cool.
so.. apparently I render like an AI then. I often start with skin, and then do hair on another layer, but depending on the piece i might fully render skin first and then do hair 😭
This reminds me of the beginning of "Dadaism". A guy signed a urinal and handed it in as art. I mean, if that made it to art, tracing AI lines doesn't seem so bad😅.
I also think it's a good thing people can express themselves, whether it's by (partially) tracing or not. I myself use bases for tracing and other artworks for references. Why? Because I invision my oc's in a certain way and don't have the art skills to draw them how I want to on my own. I hope I will one day, but I don't have the luxury to spend all my time on learning how to draw. I also make visual novel games and that takes LOTS of time as well😅.
I am, however, against making money of traced works. I will never sell my drawings or my games, since they have (partial) traced images in it. But if it weren't for tracing, I would never have been able to create a game the way I wanted to and having that outlet is important to me, since I'm making a story about some of our alters (I have DID). So to me; it's a way to give my alters a face, which I otherwise wasn't able to do. I use bases and not AI, but still...
All that being said; your art is freakin amazing and I will never compare my work to that. I'm glad there are people out there like you, who can really make great art.
I'm just also glad, I have the option to make somewhat decent work, by tracing or using bases for references, to get the people inside of me out there.
"do people do this?" MY ADHD BRAIN DOES. I sometimes render parts of a drawing or already start coloring some parts before i even finished the whole outline 😭😭😭 because my brain just wants to JUMP to the next step already, I already want to be FURTHER. ... so sometimes i just give in and render some stuff, because the alternative would be throwing my tablet away and stopping 😂 gotta please the brain to keep motivation high. This is also why I don't like recording my drawing procress because it is ALL OVER THE PLACE
Very legit concern about traced AI.... however, not a good way to deal with the problem. Someone thinks they've figured it out and now they're "spreading the wisdom" - but really just generalizing and thinking narrowly about the art process, probably basing the whole thing on a couple of anecdotes. If applied, this would just lead to a ton of "false-positives" and real artists will be accused of having traced AI for their legit, genuine art in which they've put genuine effort and imagination. What is worse than missing the culprit of a crime? Convicting someone innocent of a crime they did not commit. Even worse if they are still novice, still learning - this can outright turn people away from learning and push them into cheating their way around because they are literally shown their genuine effort is meaningless and people accuse them of faking it anyway.
Makes me think again of that one post I saw on tumblr: The worst thing about AI generated images is that now every time I see a beautiful artwork on the internet, instead of childlike wonder I experience suspicion. That, too, is damage to art, to artists, to the relationships between artists and art, viewers and art, and between artists themselves. I'm not blaming people for trying to figure out how to distinguish the fake "art". But not at just any cost.
I render one part of the drawing because I like keeping the colors organized, but I do refine more after is full rendered I might render more the drawing, but I render first the skin, then eyes, then the clothes from top to bottom and lastly hair, but if it has complex BG, then I do the BG first and the the person
to answer the question in your video, the one that where people draw and render it but left other part to the sketch. yes i do that since uggghhhh it's lazy to finish all and it end up hitting the mountain
9:10 I'm a baby beginner that started drawing at the start of 2022. I improved a lot in my first year practicing every day, doing challenges, having people review my work, and others. My biggest training wheels here were so many grid lines to help me get things in place. The following years however, AI really started to take off during my journey, and now it's sorta become a part of my process. Sometimes I'll have a vague thought of a character with certain characteristics I want, and I'll generate a bunch of images in AI and see what comes out. I'll try to draw a piece if there's anything I like. And in other scenarios, I'll do a rough quick drawing of a character, put on some quick color, and if it feels wrong or off, I'll run my drawing through AI to see what comes out with it. If there is anything that looks good, I'll make changes to my drawing.
Am I really learning anything doing this? No, not at all. It's a bad habit, and I'm only becoming better at copying exactly what I see instead of things that would make me a better artist. I don't want to exactly self diagnose but I do feel like I'm on the spectrum of aphantasia little bit. Images in my mind are very vague and blurry at best, I've never had a vivid imagination, so that's probably why I ended up doing this. Do I profit or do anything with my work? No, it's just for fun.
I did't hear about that condition before so I had to google it, It's very interesting. I can't imagine my mind without images.
I don't think using ai as inspiration is bad. Mayby you can use the ai image as inspiration without traicing and use real images as reference to study. Something what really hepls me is trying to understand how the thing I'm drawing works. For example looking at bat wings images helped me to understand how the bones are placed in wings in general and how similar they are to human hands with very very long fingers.
Sorry for possible English mistakes, it's not my first language.
i think the issue with tracing or even copying/referencing ai images of art is that it is inherently unethical. if you're tracing, you're just re-stealing other artists work, not to mention that the ai art isnt very good to begin with. if you're referencing, that's just not good. ai art is not a good reference. if you're intentionally copying, you're essentially making fanart of ai images, which is supporting something that steals from real artists. if you're inspired by an ai image and want to make something similar but of your own design and made purely with your own skills, that is fine! but no matter how you try to twist it, tracing/copying/very closely referencing ai will always land between somewhat shady and entirely unethical. many people have this well intended but very misguided idea that stealing or tracing ai art is a good way to retaliate against ai, but it's not. it's just adding fuel to the fire that threatens to burn us to death.
i will add that if you are using ai models that use **stock photos** as its reference images, THAT IS OKAY!! in some cases (such as using it to generate faces for arg projects) it's actually more ethical than using real images! also, if you are using ai as a reference, it will only help if you're already rather skilled and know what specifically you can take and what you have to fix. if you're a beginner, you're better off just referencing off of a regular artist whose art you admire. tracing, copying, and closely referencing to practice is perfectly okay as long as you are completely open about it and do not try to turn a profit off of it!
As a traditional artist i'm amazed by the amounts of circlejerks in the digital art community. So many artists caring too much about what others have to say about their process. Meanwhile i am just painting and that's it.
As much as I hate Ai, sometimes it gives poses that you just can’t find anywhere else 😔
Those that are physically impossible?
At the beginning fung , ur so real for living under a rock lol (that’s why I’m here bc idk what’s going on)
I personally think that we should degrade those images bc humans haven't even gotten advanced enough to make ACTUAL AI. Those are just a image generative algorithm. (IGA for short?) Technically if those WERE actual AI, they would technically be on the same level as human or a learning human since art is human expression. But they are not actual AI, they are a bot that takes in images and is just mushing it together and vomiting it out to people who use them.
I think that (this my personal opinion so...) we should protect our own art, degrade their art and ignore those images. We should not trace their images since it's someone else's art and using it as inspiration or reference is still giving it attention in some way and someone is still using it.
There are A LOT of photos, actual photos or other images that are NOT made from those image generators and those can help with mood boards or inspiration. "AI" images are not actual artworks that are original or even actual AI so we should treat it and reveal it as such.
We should not treat those images as something that is actually having a human soul. Using those images or generators gives profit and attention and validation to the ones making it. People can see mistakes and those generators are getting better bc (funny enough) PEOPLE point out the mistakes and makes the bot fix them. It's best to have some type of protective layer like NightShade over it, don't reveal you are protecting it and just degrading what those things actually are.
They are not AI, they are not AI art, they are not real original art, they are simply stolen work put into a bot that does not have human understanding and jumbled all together and thrown up. Don't support companies who use those images, spread information about it and also when the time comes and the AI bros are done with this, they'll just move on to something else and terrorize another community. We should keep the actual PEOPLE behind those generators accountable and call them what they are, thieves and losers.
Tracing can be used as a practice thing and honestly, doing it not to profit or to study is good but passing it off as your own hard work is bad. KIDS tracing and coloring for fun shouldn't be shamed but should be taught about the ethics and about what they are doing. Beginner artists should be taught, EVERYONE should be taught and educated instead of shamed and only when they understand or refuse to understand and continue to harm and try to steal someone elses' hard work, then you simply ignore them, block them, spread the truth and don't send hate.
Most of these dudes are doing this for attention. Maybe they never had actual love from their parents or something but real artists turn that into actual art lol, instead of going to a bot.
5:20 I seen artists doing that, it was before AI
I’ve always put a prompt in ai, take the ai. Sketch out the final changes of what I want to do and then take that sketch and do line art on digital. Is that still stealing?
Even though I changed the entire design and kept the pose or base?
I heart Kaeya... I need this art sm
For me , The tip u gave of drawing silhouettes Works best !
Bro, inconsistencies describe my art. I normally give up at the end. Like I made this thing and by time I reached the clothes I just used a completely dif brush and yeeted it, and it looks like garbage but that's okay 😅
Also, I do lineless/thin line art :]
Wait, yall, I forgot to show the sketch alot :((((((
I think using ai for refrence can be good in some cases, but you should definitely learn without *TRACING* it! Only referencing (sometimes).
ahh can someone help me find the artist at 14:12 ? I love the art style but i'm not sure how to find them..
Hello, I haven't started the video yet but I have a question. Is tracing body parts of people I find in Pinterest okay? I'm a beginner artist and I so badly wanna post them but I'm afraid that people will hate me for it...
Hi! Personally I think it's okay as long as it's for a study (especially if u're a beginner) and you disclose it! 🙌
@@fungzau THANK GOODNESS!! I WAS SO AFRAID I CAN'T USE IT OR USE IT AS A REFERENCE😭
Wtf if nobody knows about that than what's the point of asking PERMISSION to draw it(im talking about your comment about using photos as a reference) 🤯 people nowadays are so sensitive it's crazy like you don't hurt anyone
You’re just tracing for anatomy purposes so I don’t think it needs to be stated? I literally have to trace my own hands because I suck at them but they’re MY hands, so it would be odd to disclose
Tracing is ALWAYS okay. The issue is posting or using that traced art when you are done. Just ensure people know what is and isn't traced and what your traced from if you choose to post the image.
can A.I. be literally anything except art?? pls
Ai reference. Not Art
Art is Art bro Humans Copy Each Other that's why me and you have a Device and Internet only thing that's difference is that Ai is Copy Humans
Ai generated images is what I like to call it. When we have fully sentient androids who paint like humans, maybe that'll be art, but these lazy images generated in 3 seconds are not art.
@@ClashMasterStudios2 not the sharpest tool in the shed are you?
well theres also AI music and its pretty gross how good it is.
I render one part at a time, it isn't typical, but i've always done it. I call it tunneling, I'm trying to learn to do under paintings, but I tend to just sketch-> fully render in a little area at a time
Fung your art is beautiful as always
Im currently in the process of learning Art by drawing with references from Pinterest.
I’m not the best spotter but it’s likely that many of the artworks I’ve referenced are AI
I’m not posting or anything
Hope that’s fine
12:58 (timestamp to the picture of the AI guy) am i tweaking or does bro have 3 hands😭
If an artist gets involved with AI, then there is a possibility that this artist will not learn or forget the motivation and excitement of real art because he/she sees that with AI you can get results faster. At some point, this artist asks himself whether it still makes sense to draw himself.
That's the problem, and the sooner it starts, the more likely you won't have the discipline to learn real art. This happens more and more often and eventually becomes normal and real art no longer exists a generation later.
It's like ... yes, getting people into the habit of drugs instead of real joy.
Then you forget what your heart really thinks because the drug simulates a false feeling, you become empty and lifeless.
with point number 3-i occasionally do this when i randomly lose the motivation do do everything else or just straight up hyperfixate on that particular part of the drawing lol
I do render just one part of my art and leave the rest in sketch... It just helps me confuse more on the what I'm painting right now instead of getting distracted by "ooh I can make the hair more shiny" or "eh her clothes need more bling" I can just color the face in peace
I guess artist should be educated about what is AI in first place:
Ai basically works as human it needs ti learn a bulk of information to produce new ones ! so inorder to understand art , it lust basically , learn from otehr pictures !and by that it learns colors pattern artstyles and many other things! the problem resides in being able to benefit free from someone else's work ! like prompting artwork of this scene with this x user style ! other people may not know he is the owner and commission him which harms the orignal artist! sometimes AI ! isn't capable enough so basically could give u an image of an existing character in another style and colors ! which also looks like plagiarism!
5:25 well actually yeah, sometimes depending on whether or not I feel like everything at once, but I realize it’s better to just render everything at once to avoid inconsistency
I sometimes use ai for poses, perspective, clothing folds etc.
Sometimes you just can't find a reference that will fit what you have in mind, and ai can generate it for you.
Saw an AI image of Levi Ackerman. I was shocked of how accurate the emblem was, the face, it looked like a real art piece.
But then again, the "replace image" button exists, so who knows.
We need an update of how do u draw bodies and faces PLEASEEEE 😰 I need to know how to draw guys
You all may not know this, but creating ai have a really bad impact on the environment the same way NFTs do, and having even just for inspo, is still a demand to create more of it...
And if an artist got inspired by an AI, that person shouldn't diaclouse the peace at all ... AI can be controlled or have legislation in the future but if we used indiscriminately that would take longer and more artist will suffer from theft and livelihood could be at risk
Sorry if there is any mistake english is really hard😢
So I myself I get super distracted and have an issue with getting ever little detail so I usually do the sketch the do the full thing like the eye even the freaking shading before like adding bass color🤷🏼♂️ (also ya I don't just do the skin I litteraly do it by piece)
5:13 Lol I do this sometimes when I get obsesed with detail in the eyes or the face and leave everything else for later 🤣
I sometimes render the skin first but not always only because I don't like doing clothes or hair ngl
i remember tracing ai art a while ago, when ai art was still very very new, and looked horrible. im still not sure what to feel about it as since ai was so horrible there was no visible facial features on people and all that, so i would trace it and add the faces myself( note: i was still an amateur at the time) :p
The olny claims ive seen from people tracing Over ai is because "ai isnt copyrighted and there nothing that the prompt guy can do about it" and that theyre "replacing the replacers" which in my opinion as an artist its the stupidest reason to defend tracing, because you're still tracing Over an amalgomation of stolen art
it is not a amalgamation of stolen art. Granted, if it were, collaging and photobashing have been around forever and are not unethical or stealing in the least, but it's not that. It is not an amalgamation at all.
I know artists from back in the day who did this all the time, the only difference is that it's "AI art", you can say it's not their work but at the end of the day some people have bills to pay and in a professional setting what matters is getting results.
When I was in grade school, well over 20 years ago, I once never fucked woth tracing at all. My step dad taught me how tracing wasn't necessarily a bad thing as most animation studios actually have to adapt the original artist art style and then trace over and animate it. Theres levels to tracing, and if you deliberately create your own characters for a story then use ai to visually create them as close to your description, then you could trace over them if you want. BUT, I will say to redraw them in your style and edit the character as much as possible. Then thats ok to me... but im talking about printing out a picture and drawing traditionally.
Digital art is dying due to ai art now. Fortunately for those that are traditional artist, we cant be affected since we dont post up.
As someone with slightly shaky hands my line art is not always perfectly smooth.
But i use the default brush...💀
I usually do this by completely re-rendering certain parts instead of going all the way through the drawing. I mean, most of the time I do the background first to figure out where my lights are, followed by the base colors. From there I re-render each part one at a time, usually following: skin, hair, clothes, eyes, and mouth. Lastly I add the lighting. In general, I feel more confident when I see the final results and know that I'm doing something I like.
I somehow read it wrong and thought that this video was about how it’s normal for people to steal designs from AI..
Awesome art btw
5:14 I sometimes render the eyes first then plaster it onto the coloured drawing, however the rest of the drawing is usually base colours…so no
AI provides good composition. And you have to give many prompts and inputs to get something that feels okay. Well, before that it was google searching ..
The only issue is, when basing the composition on actual artist you know who they are, you czn credit them. In AI you don't.
using ai pics as an inspiration or to trace of, is in a way legitimizing ai and letting it slide. it's not a valid excuse. anything ai generated comes from unethical place and is actually really bad for the environment, and imo we(especially artists) should absolutely avoid any sort of encouraging it
finally someone actually having a good take, i could not have worded this better and im tired of people acting like its ok to use ai art in any way.
Honestly, this is my take. If trying to make the design better in their own way (with their style) then I don't mind it but tracing I do agree with you on that.
this is wrong on literally every point, please do research outside of ai hate subs that perpetuate debunked lies.
@@Legend-io4pz disagree because thats still "using ai" under all definitions.
Everything is we do is bad for the environment sadly
Straight after watching your video I got an ad for Kittl "...and if you can't find an illustration you like then you can use our AI-powered design tools to create one". These Etsy t-shirt sellers are just cutting out the artist altogether. This is what the AI image generators were made for! 🤮
Yknow I just randomly came upon Ur shii. And I goatta say, I just love this chic
The main problem here is just realising U are Tracing from stolen work. And U can live with that, realise that if U make cush from Tracing stolen work, Ur also stealing 😂. That's all man.. what's with all the THINGS happening?
I subbed btw
this is a little chat that only exists in the bubble of those who hate AI without even learning how to use the tools properly, yes you can throw together a prompt and have any unintentional image with AI but you can also have a careful and intentional work, the artist just has to put in the effort
10:54 because if I trace over a real picture of myself, I’m not stealing from anyone but myself. And you can’t steal from yourself. Artists who trace their own work or themselves don’t have to disclose it because their pictures and art belong to nobody but them. If you trace over a picture of a drawing from a magazine, you need to credit the artist.
I mean, I have no complaints. If AI can do it and get no consequences why can't we? I don't support AI replacing artists so this is just hilarious to me
Because the prerequisite for tracing from AI is financially supporting the people who stole all these artists' work in the first place and whose literal intention is to monetize the death of commercial art as a career. There was a data leak with Midjourney guys talking about ways to circumvent the legal IP of 16,000 artists. Making a Midjourney (or equivalent) account in the first place is literally "supporting AI replacing artists."
What if you're tracing from already-made images without making an account or anything?
Now I will be constantly concerned that my artwork, as a beginner, might appear as if I used AI tracing, even though I am simply a novice who is still learning to draw precise lines. This worry could potentially affect my mindset while drawing and lead me to give up.😞
Having boundaries in morals is as pointless as trying to put boundaries between red and orange. WHO WILL DETERMINE THAT??
I recommend having a read of "AI and Artists’ IP: Exploring Copyright Infringement Allegations in Andersen v. Stability AI Ltd. February 26, 2024" by Center for art law. It's actually quite an interesting read if you have some free time.
5:18 I do this, I sometimes get bored of linearting and don't know if the piece will look like once I am done, so I start initial coloring on the already linearted parts- ie, if I have a sketch and start linearting, and I already linearted head, I sometimes color the head before coming back to linearting rest of the body. Prolly weird take but hey, it works for me. Ofc by coloring I mean more like, flat colors and perhaps initial shading and not full on render, I usually come back to the colored parts after I am done with lineart and coloring the whole thing, sometimes I change the shadow and light placement too, but yeah XD I am not an advanced artist though and I have a very short span of attention, that's why coloring mid linearting process kind of allows me to focus on the piece lol. Does that make sense?
5:19 Can definitely be a sign, but I know someone who does this cause it motivates them, like if the face is good it encourages them to finish the piece of art
I also do always render one part of the drawing first and then the rest, but I do that with everything, how I clean my room, how I study, maybe that’s a me thing 😢😂
The further away I can get from "Ai" art the better and happier I am.
I only render parts after parts if I already have a ref sheet of my character (I never jump into a project whitout planning), AND I'm about to animate the separated parts later in any possible ways. After a layer of the composition in my head blocked out with CSP-s 3d models and a somewhat detailed blue sketch. Real thing, because cutting an existing artwork into overlapping layers for animating is much more painful.😂 Also seeing full ready parts is calming me down that I'm on the right path I visualised at the beginning.
Yes i fully render the face b4 putting any other flat colours on other parts cause I wanna see something pretty
Your art is so pretty :O
Off topic but how’d you get the little image box to appear in the corner? I have to use the notes app and put images in there lol