Edit: The Speed PoB doesn't have enough accuracy without war banner stacked and placed to proc Precise Technique. See the bottom of my long ass reply under zihaojia2117's post for solutions, as well as my PoB and his PoB for comparisons with absolutely 0 conditional buffs except for maybe the Haste tech since I don't know how conditional the buff is. Looking at your "SPEED" PoB for my own use, I would drop the "Utmost Swiftness" mastery wheel and go for "Divine Fury" and take the "inverse Monster Resistance" mastery. This also gives you an extra skill point to put into something else, which you could use on the life mastery to make 15% of mana costs as life, because I still think the mana cost might be weird. But if it's not an issue you can just dump a point into the 6% life node next to "Devotion" until you get more points to grab something bigger. OR help "Alira" instead of "Oak" for the resistances, drop the "Cloth and Chain" 2 pointer, and then grab a rage wheel using those 2 points + the point freed by dropping "Utmost Swiftness". "Battle Trance" would give you 2 rage on melee hit + 10 max rage for 3 points, and I would then switch out "Rage Support" on "Molten Strike" for "Fire Penetration" support for an extra ~25 DPS. Or if you can't maintain max rage with only the "Battle Trance" node, you can use the 3 points + drop "Beef" and use the 4 points for the "Veteran's Wrath" wheel which still gives 3 rage on hit total + either 20% slower rage loss or +6 max rage. This also means that as soon as you hit get an extra skill point either for leveling up, dropping a node somewhere, OR even switching off Alira if you have the regrets, you can take the "Nearby enemies are Intimated while you have Rage" mastery on the rage wheel and drop "Belt of the Deceiver" for a rare belt with fat life/Resistances. You might also want to lifetap Snipers Mark since it takes 64 out of your 71 mana to proc it, which might be an issue or it might not because of the instant mana leech from the balls. If you need to do this I would drop the rage support from Leap Slam since its only ~6% more attack speed for Leap Slam, which seems negligible, and with the rage wheel would still generate rage on hit. Sorry for the wall of text, I got excited and kept getting ideas looking over your PoB to change it to fit my needs as a SC Trade player looking to league start it. These changes solidified my choice to league start this build since it seems good enough to run through the atlas quickly enough to make money to buy gear for Connor's more expensive versions.
Good catch, to fix non-conditional accuracy this works: pobb.in/gJSP909G9sEg I love the Divine Fury change - inversion totally skipped my mind - but would do on the main PoB because the speed one wants the Utmost Swiftness for attack speed. No need to apologize for the wall of text, I get excited about tweaks too and I'm not all surprised there's room for improvement on the rage vector! I'll give it a look and maybe put out one more PoB later incorporating the ides
@@aequus2553 Hello Man, I think i'm ready for the updated POB! You are a bridge for me between noobs and the conner "early/late" build budget . Hope it comes soon ;)
Astramentis also has a 3-piece div card. It's on some pretty awful maps, but that's something we can change with scrying so it should be more SSF friendly this league.
First, really appreciate all these discussions and new ideas. Helped a lot to make this build better. Here is my understanding of the pros and cons, please correct me if I am wrong: Conner: pros: best on-surface numbers. cons: unreliable rage resource (could be solved), more expensive items. Clearly, he is not a very good build creator for starter builds... Nightwing: pros: slightly more accessible version of Conner's (actually I don't agree with removing Iron Fortress from his build, that's a huge DPS loss, though that item could be a few divs). More consistent performance. cons: lowest numbers (still enough for most contents). Aequus: pros: most accessible build (which is the reason why you proposed this one). cons: rely on trauma stack. And relatively low attack speed (not a big deal for bossing but kinda clunky for mapping) I still think all of you guys provided valuable information on this skill. I will definitely try yours first since it is the cheapest version, then move to Nightwing or Conner's later. I know you may not be able to play but truly looking forward to some updates to this build later.
I honestly don't think it's close; I'm not advocating not using Iron Fortress, it's best in slot, but I build for SSF. Just add IF to mine and enjoy :)
I think in all the discussion the real point kind of got lost somewhere half way, aequus build is ofcourse far more superior for ssf, although i doubt the attack rate and concentrated effect are going to give you any form of decent clear but that’s beside the point. The real point was opening discussion on conner’s PoB and how it could be done more fair seeming as conner builds multiple mirror builds and we both kinda wanted to point out there were some minor problems with it that could get less experienced players stuck or have a higher expectation than what the early early game actually is. @aequus2553 thanks for reviewing my PoB, and if you do end up playing, hope you get a nice league start, best of luck :)
@@NightwingPoE If you prefer speed, try this version it has more Speed, and has a mapping gem instead of Conc effect as well as return proj while maintaining the higher EHP and DPS: pobb.in/m0uVKGec5pCR
@@aequus2553 looks like we’re getting somewhere now, this looks pretty decent. and btw for people still discussing if trauma works for the balls, it does. The damage from trauma applies to it.
@@NightwingPoE I made a separate post on the video about some changes, but wanted to drop my PoB version here if you want to take a look at mine vs specifically the speed PoB he linked. I will be using this in SC trade league start so it is built for that. One thing to note is I have removed EVERY conditional buff in both my PoB and his PoB that I will link with what I believe to be the same configs as mine. THIS INCLUDES the FAT damage increase from War Banner which at 50 stacks is ~100 more DPS because the PoB's actually DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH ACCURACY TO USE PRECISE TECHNIQUE which I just noticed right before posting this so that HAS TO BE SOLVED. Molten Shell isn't checked, Enduring Cry isn't checked. The one thing I am unsure on is Haste + Guardian Blessing + Herald of Purity since I haven't used it, so I left it there on both PoB's but may be conditional idk. My DPS increase WILL be even bigger than the PoB initially says at the start, both because my max rage is 41 but i have set it to 35 for just in case I can't hit that consistently and to show that even without the extra max rage my DPS is still significantly better. AND because I THINK PoB calculates his Momentum support as the average of the attack speed increase if he uses it perfectly. As in he sits there and gets max stacks of momentum with 5 attacks and then moves, which also means this will lower his max trauma charges and thus DPS if you aren't doing the 5 attacks perfectly standing still. But whether all that matters is up to you or depends on if I am right about PoB momentum calculation. My PoB is changed to just put faster attacks as a substitute because I 100% know I will NOT bother to keep track of my momentum stacks and I want basically 0 padding in the PoB's I look at as much as possible, but also keeps the attack speed somewhat similiar. Note that I removed the 20% quality from all gems except Zenith so faster attacks would be even more damage comparatively since it increases attack speed with quality which would also double dip with max trauma stacks, whereas Momentum quality only increases the movespeed duration. Last is my PoB has a config for +20% elemental resistance to show max hit, which would be cheating but my belt is literally just a life roll and that's it, so getting those resists would be incredibly easy. Especially if you use a Stygian Vise with a jewel instead of a Leather belt like I have put in the PoB, so I feel while it's technically cheating, it's just for convenience because you could get those in many places. This would also let you get chaos res easily too on the belt which you wouldn't with Deceiver belt. Edit: realized I linked his PoB twice. This should be my actual one. My PoB: pobb.in/Epq-_eDRLXRU His Speed PoB: pobb.in/SZN0SSGDQiR7 AGAIN, THE ACCURACY WITHOUT WAR BANNER NEEDS TO BE SOLVED TO PROC PRECISE TECHNIQUE WITH THESE PoB's!!!!! I would take the "Eagle Eye" wheel which solves that problem completely, but I dont wanna go through and change the tree more, but just know for 4 points taken from anywhere on the tree that would fix the issue completely forever. Whether you wanna drop Some of the defense/life nodes or some damage nodes is up to you. With the exact PoB I linked, You could just drop a couple life nodes and take Versatility for 2 points as well, but it feels like cheating to do that in PoB as it's only llke 100 accuracy over the life so any extra life rolls or leveling up could ruin it so I will leave the choice up to whoever wants the PoB to make that choice for themselves.
If we start nickpicking T2 or what ever uniques, molten strike of zenith is not in the shop so... it's not a league starter anyway . Dunno why u even flexing with one atnother to be honest. It's not like people will build this to play early game for 2 weeks, connors build is mostly for not mortal players and for endgame so ... i guess he said it himself that he don;t make leveling guides or builds in his latest video
Look at the comments you got. People just are not in the clear what conners build is about. They don't seem to comprehend that its not about how difficult it is to get the gem, its about a build that gets exponentially stronger, where it does not feel good until you sink in your first 100 divs.
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check ur banner condition. i wont say more ur basing ur whole thing on a conditional buff.
Thanks for the reviews. New melee player so your comments offer good insight into pros and cons on diff nodes.
Glad to help, you're welcome
Edit: The Speed PoB doesn't have enough accuracy without war banner stacked and placed to proc Precise Technique. See the bottom of my long ass reply under zihaojia2117's post for solutions, as well as my PoB and his PoB for comparisons with absolutely 0 conditional buffs except for maybe the Haste tech since I don't know how conditional the buff is.
Looking at your "SPEED" PoB for my own use, I would drop the "Utmost Swiftness" mastery wheel and go for "Divine Fury" and take the "inverse Monster Resistance" mastery. This also gives you an extra skill point to put into something else, which you could use on the life mastery to make 15% of mana costs as life, because I still think the mana cost might be weird. But if it's not an issue you can just dump a point into the 6% life node next to "Devotion" until you get more points to grab something bigger.
OR help "Alira" instead of "Oak" for the resistances, drop the "Cloth and Chain" 2 pointer, and then grab a rage wheel using those 2 points + the point freed by dropping "Utmost Swiftness". "Battle Trance" would give you 2 rage on melee hit + 10 max rage for 3 points, and I would then switch out "Rage Support" on "Molten Strike" for "Fire Penetration" support for an extra ~25 DPS. Or if you can't maintain max rage with only the "Battle Trance" node, you can use the 3 points + drop "Beef" and use the 4 points for the "Veteran's Wrath" wheel which still gives 3 rage on hit total + either 20% slower rage loss or +6 max rage.
This also means that as soon as you hit get an extra skill point either for leveling up, dropping a node somewhere, OR even switching off Alira if you have the regrets, you can take the "Nearby enemies are Intimated while you have Rage" mastery on the rage wheel and drop "Belt of the Deceiver" for a rare belt with fat life/Resistances.
You might also want to lifetap Snipers Mark since it takes 64 out of your 71 mana to proc it, which might be an issue or it might not because of the instant mana leech from the balls. If you need to do this I would drop the rage support from Leap Slam since its only ~6% more attack speed for Leap Slam, which seems negligible, and with the rage wheel would still generate rage on hit.
Sorry for the wall of text, I got excited and kept getting ideas looking over your PoB to change it to fit my needs as a SC Trade player looking to league start it. These changes solidified my choice to league start this build since it seems good enough to run through the atlas quickly enough to make money to buy gear for Connor's more expensive versions.
Good catch, to fix non-conditional accuracy this works: pobb.in/gJSP909G9sEg
I love the Divine Fury change - inversion totally skipped my mind - but would do on the main PoB because the speed one wants the Utmost Swiftness for attack speed. No need to apologize for the wall of text, I get excited about tweaks too and I'm not all surprised there's room for improvement on the rage vector! I'll give it a look and maybe put out one more PoB later incorporating the ides
@@aequus2553 Hello Man, I think i'm ready for the updated POB! You are a bridge for me between noobs and the conner "early/late" build budget . Hope it comes soon ;)
Astramentis also has a 3-piece div card. It's on some pretty awful maps, but that's something we can change with scrying so it should be more SSF friendly this league.
Did you actually check that trauma works on the projectile part of the dmg? Else it would brick. As far as I remember this part is most unclear here.
Yes, it works fine
@@aequus2553 awsome, thanks!
First, really appreciate all these discussions and new ideas. Helped a lot to make this build better.
Here is my understanding of the pros and cons, please correct me if I am wrong:
Conner:
pros: best on-surface numbers. cons: unreliable rage resource (could be solved), more expensive items. Clearly, he is not a very good build creator for starter builds...
Nightwing:
pros: slightly more accessible version of Conner's (actually I don't agree with removing Iron Fortress from his build, that's a huge DPS loss, though that item could be a few divs). More consistent performance. cons: lowest numbers (still enough for most contents).
Aequus:
pros: most accessible build (which is the reason why you proposed this one). cons: rely on trauma stack. And relatively low attack speed (not a big deal for bossing but kinda clunky for mapping)
I still think all of you guys provided valuable information on this skill. I will definitely try yours first since it is the cheapest version, then move to Nightwing or Conner's later. I know you may not be able to play but truly looking forward to some updates to this build later.
I honestly don't think it's close; I'm not advocating not using Iron Fortress, it's best in slot, but I build for SSF. Just add IF to mine and enjoy :)
I think in all the discussion the real point kind of got lost somewhere half way, aequus build is ofcourse far more superior for ssf, although i doubt the attack rate and concentrated effect are going to give you any form of decent clear but that’s beside the point.
The real point was opening discussion on conner’s PoB and how it could be done more fair seeming as conner builds multiple mirror builds and we both kinda wanted to point out there were some minor problems with it that could get less experienced players stuck or have a higher expectation than what the early early game actually is.
@aequus2553 thanks for reviewing my PoB, and if you do end up playing, hope you get a nice league start, best of luck :)
@@NightwingPoE If you prefer speed, try this version it has more Speed, and has a mapping gem instead of Conc effect as well as return proj while maintaining the higher EHP and DPS: pobb.in/m0uVKGec5pCR
@@aequus2553 looks like we’re getting somewhere now, this looks pretty decent. and btw for people still discussing if trauma works for the balls, it does. The damage from trauma applies to it.
@@NightwingPoE I made a separate post on the video about some changes, but wanted to drop my PoB version here if you want to take a look at mine vs specifically the speed PoB he linked. I will be using this in SC trade league start so it is built for that. One thing to note is I have removed EVERY conditional buff in both my PoB and his PoB that I will link with what I believe to be the same configs as mine.
THIS INCLUDES the FAT damage increase from War Banner which at 50 stacks is ~100 more DPS because the PoB's actually DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH ACCURACY TO USE PRECISE TECHNIQUE which I just noticed right before posting this so that HAS TO BE SOLVED. Molten Shell isn't checked, Enduring Cry isn't checked. The one thing I am unsure on is Haste + Guardian Blessing + Herald of Purity since I haven't used it, so I left it there on both PoB's but may be conditional idk.
My DPS increase WILL be even bigger than the PoB initially says at the start, both because my max rage is 41 but i have set it to 35 for just in case I can't hit that consistently and to show that even without the extra max rage my DPS is still significantly better. AND because I THINK PoB calculates his Momentum support as the average of the attack speed increase if he uses it perfectly. As in he sits there and gets max stacks of momentum with 5 attacks and then moves, which also means this will lower his max trauma charges and thus DPS if you aren't doing the 5 attacks perfectly standing still. But whether all that matters is up to you or depends on if I am right about PoB momentum calculation.
My PoB is changed to just put faster attacks as a substitute because I 100% know I will NOT bother to keep track of my momentum stacks and I want basically 0 padding in the PoB's I look at as much as possible, but also keeps the attack speed somewhat similiar. Note that I removed the 20% quality from all gems except Zenith so faster attacks would be even more damage comparatively since it increases attack speed with quality which would also double dip with max trauma stacks, whereas Momentum quality only increases the movespeed duration.
Last is my PoB has a config for +20% elemental resistance to show max hit, which would be cheating but my belt is literally just a life roll and that's it, so getting those resists would be incredibly easy. Especially if you use a Stygian Vise with a jewel instead of a Leather belt like I have put in the PoB, so I feel while it's technically cheating, it's just for convenience because you could get those in many places. This would also let you get chaos res easily too on the belt which you wouldn't with Deceiver belt.
Edit: realized I linked his PoB twice. This should be my actual one.
My PoB: pobb.in/Epq-_eDRLXRU
His Speed PoB: pobb.in/SZN0SSGDQiR7
AGAIN, THE ACCURACY WITHOUT WAR BANNER NEEDS TO BE SOLVED TO PROC PRECISE TECHNIQUE WITH THESE PoB's!!!!! I would take the "Eagle Eye" wheel which solves that problem completely, but I dont wanna go through and change the tree more, but just know for 4 points taken from anywhere on the tree that would fix the issue completely forever. Whether you wanna drop Some of the defense/life nodes or some damage nodes is up to you. With the exact PoB I linked, You could just drop a couple life nodes and take Versatility for 2 points as well, but it feels like cheating to do that in PoB as it's only llke 100 accuracy over the life so any extra life rolls or leveling up could ruin it so I will leave the choice up to whoever wants the PoB to make that choice for themselves.
If we start nickpicking T2 or what ever uniques, molten strike of zenith is not in the shop so... it's not a league starter anyway . Dunno why u even flexing with one atnother to be honest. It's not like people will build this to play early game for 2 weeks, connors build is mostly for not mortal players and for endgame so ... i guess he said it himself that he don;t make leveling guides or builds in his latest video
You can just run a few labs and to get zenith. It's a lot easier than finding an iron fortress on ssf
Have you played the game? It takes so little time to get a gem that has no other to roll.
I recommend starting with grand slam, then MS, and then run Merc lab until you get a gem reroll option. MS has no other gem to roll to, so it is easy.
Look at the comments you got. People just are not in the clear what conners build is about. They don't seem to comprehend that its not about how difficult it is to get the gem, its about a build that gets exponentially stronger, where it does not feel good until you sink in your first 100 divs.
There is a version without a single unique still doing 6mill dps @@pewpin1039