Before digital, film dubbing was done from magnetic tape and the film was projected from a work print. In order to save time, mixing was done both forwards and backwards. In other words, when working on a particular scene, they would mix while running it and then run it at the same speed backwards while continuing to mix. Good times. I've worked in recording studios with huge recording consoles(up to 112 channels at Oceanway/Record One in the late 1980s), but the mixing desks for dubbing are insanely huge. It is quite probably the most technically challenging task in film-making. Cheers, Alan Tomlinson
Dear Anne, While exporting Cues from Cubase Pro with the help of cycle markers, does Cubase export the stems with SMPTE TC information also, so that one can easily drag and drop the stems using the spot mode on ProTools? Thank you
@@AnneKathrinDernComposer Wonderful! :-) I think it could also be a nice idea to have a small setup video. Because you use not too much of software and fancy hardware (affordable interface, headphones...) to show what is possible with a normal setup and that you don't need tons of expensive stuff (you kinda mentioned it while showing the mixing part of your JP mockup) :-)
@@AnneKathrinDernComposer Oh, another good idea maybe sharing a few tips of how to use Kontakt for oneself. For example what you did with Cinematic Strings 2 and how to make (low) percussion more usable (shortening the "ring out" ;-) ). This helped me actually a lot cleaning my mixes!
Yes, absolutely! Kontakt has actually been one of the main requests from audience members and the percussion trick will be part of my Quicktips series :-) Keep the ideas coming!
Hello Anne! Thanks for your wonderful videos! I would like to ask you something. What happens if the music needs to be composed before the picture editing? For exemple, a Streaming Show that will do the picture editing on top of what you are already composing. So in this case I´m delivering the Stems to the picture editing staff first and then they will cut to picture and then send to Dub stage. So I kinda have no control of how they are editing the music to picture. In some cases, if I know the dubbing staff I ask them to send me the Pro Tools session so I can fix possible editing issues coming from the picture editing staff, but if I don´t have any access to the dubbing stage, I´ll freak out! Thanks! I hope i made myself clear :)
I've never really heard of this type of approach unless there are a ton of music editors involved. Or I guess in library music / licensed music it can happen this way. But in general, for scripted movies and TV, the music needs to be adapted to the picture edit by the composer, even if some of it was written in advance before there was an edit. This is the composer's job, not the dub mixer's job. They can make changes on occasion - it's not uncommon for them to re-edit a couple of cues or move things around here and there. But they shouldn't be editing the entire score (even though contractually they have the right to do so of course). If they have to do that, then I've failed as a composer. Sounds to me like the workflow on that project went wrong in all kinds of places.
Thanks for these tutorials, super useful tips. I just wondering is the 'v0510' at the end of your file names the date which you delivered this version to the dub? I've always wondered what was the best way to signal that a file is the MASTER in the name?
Thanks for watching! Glad this was helpful. To answer your question: No, you never put the delivery date on a file. The 0510 number is referring to the picture version this cue was written and recorded to. If you look at the movie it says 2016 / 05 / 10 at the bottom. We had several edit versions of this movie (different ones for each reel) so it was important to know which cue was written to what edit. We were still getting new edits right before and after the sessions as well. At that point - when everything was already orchestrated, copied and partially recorded - we didn't conform the cues to the new edit in MIDI anymore. Then it was important for the music editor to know if a cue had been recorded to an older edit so that he could check if he needed to make an audio conform with the final mixes to fit the latest picture version at the dub stage. The number before that btw. is the time code indicator to show where that cue belongs exactly in that reel. As for the final master file: It's always the one with the highest version number (the number right after the cue number, e.g. 2M17 v3). Only the approved final version will go to the orchestrator, the scoring stage and the mixer so by the time you deliver to the dub, there will only be one version. They will never see previous versions of your cues. There is also always a Google Sheet on every production (or something similar) that will be updated on a daily basis and contains all cue numbers, titles, picture versions, approvals, etc.. The doc and file names should always match - if they don't, someone made a mistake and it needs to be checked (e.g. the production went back and approved a previous cue version but someone forgot to put that on the doc).
Awesome.. Thank you. Cool collection of info! I mix for TV and film full time and it's fun to see this from your side of things. Ps, just thought you'd want to know your dialogue is a bit sibilant. If you have a dynamic (or ribbon) mic kicking around that could be a simple fix to tame the sibilance without having to do any EQ'ing in your capture process and would be more pleasant for us to listen to. Not a HUGE issue and not trying to offend at all. I like your channel and would love to watch your content without having to make adjustments on my end to compensate. I know others (even unknowingly) would appreciate it also.
Before digital, film dubbing was done from magnetic tape and the film was projected from a work print. In order to save time, mixing was done both forwards and backwards. In other words, when working on a particular scene, they would mix while running it and then run it at the same speed backwards while continuing to mix. Good times. I've worked in recording studios with huge recording consoles(up to 112 channels at Oceanway/Record One in the late 1980s), but the mixing desks for dubbing are insanely huge. It is quite probably the most technically challenging task in film-making.
Cheers,
Alan Tomlinson
Thank you for your channel, Anne-Kathrin.
That is why I watch this channel: You are real...
Thank you!
This is so cool! I love these videos; they're clear, thorough, and to the point.
So happy to hear that!
Dear Anne, While exporting Cues from Cubase Pro with the help of cycle markers, does Cubase export the stems with SMPTE TC information also, so that one can easily drag and drop the stems using the spot mode on ProTools?
Thank you
super helpful insight!
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching!
Wonderful! Thanks again for these easy to understand lesson. Excited for the (hopefully) upcoming tutorials! :-))
Thanks for watching! And yes, I'm trying to figure out a schedule to create these types of videos on a regular basis. :-)
@@AnneKathrinDernComposer Wonderful! :-) I think it could also be a nice idea to have a small setup video. Because you use not too much of software and fancy hardware (affordable interface, headphones...) to show what is possible with a normal setup and that you don't need tons of expensive stuff (you kinda mentioned it while showing the mixing part of your JP mockup) :-)
Michael Firmont That’s a good idea! I’ll add a setup video to my list of requests :-)
@@AnneKathrinDernComposer Oh, another good idea maybe sharing a few tips of how to use Kontakt for oneself. For example what you did with Cinematic Strings 2 and how to make (low) percussion more usable (shortening the "ring out" ;-) ). This helped me actually a lot cleaning my mixes!
Yes, absolutely! Kontakt has actually been one of the main requests from audience members and the percussion trick will be part of my Quicktips series :-) Keep the ideas coming!
Hello Anne! Thanks for your wonderful videos! I would like to ask you something. What happens if the music needs to be composed before the picture editing? For exemple, a Streaming Show that will do the picture editing on top of what you are already composing. So in this case I´m delivering the Stems to the picture editing staff first and then they will cut to picture and then send to Dub stage. So I kinda have no control of how they are editing the music to picture. In some cases, if I know the dubbing staff I ask them to send me the Pro Tools session so I can fix possible editing issues coming from the picture editing staff, but if I don´t have any access to the dubbing stage, I´ll freak out! Thanks! I hope i made myself clear :)
I've never really heard of this type of approach unless there are a ton of music editors involved. Or I guess in library music / licensed music it can happen this way. But in general, for scripted movies and TV, the music needs to be adapted to the picture edit by the composer, even if some of it was written in advance before there was an edit. This is the composer's job, not the dub mixer's job. They can make changes on occasion - it's not uncommon for them to re-edit a couple of cues or move things around here and there. But they shouldn't be editing the entire score (even though contractually they have the right to do so of course). If they have to do that, then I've failed as a composer. Sounds to me like the workflow on that project went wrong in all kinds of places.
Thanks for these tutorials, super useful tips. I just wondering is the 'v0510' at the end of your file names the date which you delivered this version to the dub? I've always wondered what was the best way to signal that a file is the MASTER in the name?
Thanks for watching! Glad this was helpful. To answer your question: No, you never put the delivery date on a file. The 0510 number is referring to the picture version this cue was written and recorded to. If you look at the movie it says 2016 / 05 / 10 at the bottom. We had several edit versions of this movie (different ones for each reel) so it was important to know which cue was written to what edit. We were still getting new edits right before and after the sessions as well. At that point - when everything was already orchestrated, copied and partially recorded - we didn't conform the cues to the new edit in MIDI anymore. Then it was important for the music editor to know if a cue had been recorded to an older edit so that he could check if he needed to make an audio conform with the final mixes to fit the latest picture version at the dub stage. The number before that btw. is the time code indicator to show where that cue belongs exactly in that reel. As for the final master file: It's always the one with the highest version number (the number right after the cue number, e.g. 2M17 v3). Only the approved final version will go to the orchestrator, the scoring stage and the mixer so by the time you deliver to the dub, there will only be one version. They will never see previous versions of your cues. There is also always a Google Sheet on every production (or something similar) that will be updated on a daily basis and contains all cue numbers, titles, picture versions, approvals, etc.. The doc and file names should always match - if they don't, someone made a mistake and it needs to be checked (e.g. the production went back and approved a previous cue version but someone forgot to put that on the doc).
@@AnneKathrinDernComposer Ah thanks a lot for the detailed reply!
I doubt we Do this in My Country 🙁 Or maybe not at That Level Where it’s mixed in a theatre 🎭
I love you Anne but I’m in cubase/nuendo do I export my wav files to protools on another laptop and go from there? What is the best route for me?
Awesome.. Thank you. Cool collection of info!
I mix for TV and film full time and it's fun to see this from your side of things.
Ps, just thought you'd want to know your dialogue is a bit sibilant. If you have a dynamic (or ribbon) mic kicking around that could be a simple fix to tame the sibilance without having to do any EQ'ing in your capture process and would be more pleasant for us to listen to. Not a HUGE issue and not trying to offend at all. I like your channel and would love to watch your content without having to make adjustments on my end to compensate. I know others (even unknowingly) would appreciate it also.